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The Titanium Vault hosted by RJ Bates III
RJ Bates III, affectionately referred to as the Viking Wizard by his students, started his real estate investing career in 2014 after attending a real estate education program that put him $65,000 in debt. RJ contracted his first deal he found on the MLS and wholesaled it for a $7,500 assignment fee. That was the end of his former life and the beginning of his venture into becoming a real estate investor. Since that moment, RJ has become an influential figurehead in the real estate investing industry. He has successfully purchased and sold over 2,000 properties all across the USA including wholesale deals, rehabs, rentals, owner finances and short term rentals. One of his passions is being the host of The Titanium Vault Podcast where he interviews the top real estate investors. He has won back to back Closers Olympics earning him the reputation as the King Closer! Finally, RJ and Cassi DeHaas, his partner, have started their education platform called Titanium University.
The Titanium Vault hosted by RJ Bates III
What Made Her Lose The Deal? | TU In Review
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Why We Review Missed Deals
SPEAKER_00Welcome back to TU and Review, the series where I am going to review a live seller call submitted by a titanium university member. And today is gonna be Miss Stephanie Bain, who you might recognize from last week's Tuesday Live, where she came on and she did a fantastic job. She's actually been a regular on the Tuesday Live. She's been on there a couple of times. Stephanie's been going live with Angela every single day. I love it. Today, she this call that I'm reviewing, she's on there with Angela and TU legendary Tyler Osborne and Hyra Rodriguez are on there with her as well. She submitted this. She wasn't able to close it. Remember, this is a series where we don't want to close deals. We want the deals, the seller calls where maybe it didn't go fantastic. You want to be coached up on it. So I'm curious to see why Stephanie picked this call because she is improving every single day. And so I'm curious to see why she chose this one because she has so many calls to choose from. But let's get into it right now with Miss Stephanie Bain.
Live Transfer And Quick Reset
SPEAKER_02Hello. Hi, Robert. Hi, Robert. This is Stephanie. Hi, we were you were just transferred over to me. Looks like you're filled out of former speaking to somebody about your property in Aquarius Court in Fort Myers.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I I just got a um something just came. Another call said this application was an error. So that was I don't know.
SPEAKER_02Okay. So are you looking to sell?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah, I am.
SPEAKER_00All right. So I believe this was a live transfer. Um, maybe property leads. Hyro's kind of pointing at himself, that was me. So I don't know what's what kind of took place there, but I do like how she kind of navigated that, just moving right to hey, let's just move aside from the tech issues. Are you still looking to sell the property? Just get into the closer's formula. You always want to do that when there's any sort of awkwardness at the beginning of the call.
SPEAKER_02Okay. All right. Well, how much do you want?
SPEAKER_04Uh well, I'm asking 162.
SPEAKER_02162,000. Okay.
Grief And The Real Reason To Move
SPEAKER_02Tell me what you have going on.
SPEAKER_04Um, nothing really. My mom passed away. I'm, you know, I'm not happy, so I'm I'm, you know, I'm just ready to leave, relocate, find my happiness.
SPEAKER_02Well, I'm sorry to hear about your mom.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, it's it's it's been, you know, three years now, but you know, just me and her in the house, so that kind of, you know, did something to me. You know, uh when she passed, I was here by myself all the time. I'm still by myself. So I just want to move from Fort Myers and find my happiness.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_04You know, a lot of people don't understand that.
SPEAKER_02How so how is that a I mean, she passed away three years ago. How's that how have you been holding up since then?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I I've I've been, that's the thing. I've just been, I grace of God, you know, just maintaining, you know, just peace of mind, you know, when stuff like this happens, you you really find out about your family and friends, you know, who's gonna be there for you when you really need them. And right now, nobody is here for me. So I'm just ready to move on and just get away and find my happiness. You know, at this point in my life, I'm not worried about nobody else. It's all about me now.
SPEAKER_02What do you mean by nobody's there for you?
SPEAKER_04I mean, you know, nobody comes around, kick on me, see how I'm doing, do I need anything? Nobody do none of that at the same time, family and friends. So if it's gonna be like that, I might as well just move on somewhere else and find my happiness. And besides, I grew up here, so it's time to go.
SPEAKER_02What does your happiness look like?
SPEAKER_04I I I don't know. That's the thing, I don't know, but it's it's not it. I mean, money don't bring you happiness. You can have all the money in the world, still not be happy.
SPEAKER_02So true. So true.
SPEAKER_00So Stephanie's doing a really good job of allowing him to speak about his situation. Obviously, it's a highly emotional um situation with his mom passing away three years ago. Thought she did a really good job of making sure we we have a tendency sometimes to do the um verbal agreements. I understand. I gotcha. She's doing a really good job of avoiding those, taking her time, picking the next question. She's sitting in the pocket, you know, really trying to understand his situation, what he's going through, what he's trying to accomplish. Really solid start here by Stephanie. And she has uh so many different options that she can take this early on in the conversation. So I think she's done a really good job of kind of just making sure that she allows him to explain what it is that he wants to accomplish by selling this piece of real estate and what his situation has been like so far. So really strong start by Stephanie here.
SPEAKER_04So money is not gonna make you happy, you know, it's just find a peace of mind, somebody, somebody that's gonna, you know, blend with you, float with you, you know, coat with you, you know, understand you without you even saying anything. They understand that's hard to find. So, you know, at this point, I just I just want to travel and and and you know, find my happiness. No matter where I go, whether I feel happy at comfortable, that's where I'll be.
SPEAKER_02If you're not sure what happiness looks like to you, how will you know when you find it?
SPEAKER_04See, that that's the thing. Right now I'm not happy, you know, and got a house, got a car, but still ain't happy. If I had, you know, let's say a female companionship, I still wouldn't be happy because this is not where I want to be. So that's that, you know, that's not uh that's that's not the issue right there to find somebody. I got to find myself, find happiness for me so I can make anybody else happy.
SPEAKER_02Okay. If you can start over, what would you do?
SPEAKER_04Oh man, if I can start over, I definitely wouldn't be in Four Mob. I'd be somewhere countryside. I like the country. Be, you know, I I like the city, but I want to stay outside of the city, in the country, fresh out, peace of mind. I I I'd be more happier that way, don't know nobody, new friends, this and that. But right here, when you when you live in the town, everybody is always down in you, it's time to go. You know, everybody is looking for you to fail. You don't want to be in no town or no situation like that.
SPEAKER_02What is it about sorry, Robert?
SPEAKER_04Go ahead.
SPEAKER_02Oh, what is it about Fort Myers that's bothering you? You've mentioned it a couple of times.
SPEAKER_04Nothing to do. Uh I mean, I don't like I don't my that club life, that's I don't do that no more. But if I want to ride somewhere and hang out, that's none of that. So everybody that I know stay home and this and that. I'm not a person that go to people's house and hang out with them all the time. I'm not like that. I'm I'm very proud. I stay to myself.
SPEAKER_02And tell me a little bit about what the country looks like for you. Where would that be?
SPEAKER_04Somewhere like Georgia, uh some part of uh Tennessee, Texas. You know, I I even thought about moving abroad.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
SPEAKER_04You know, like I say, my kids grown, it's just me. So, you know, why would I want to, like my mom said before she passed away, stay at the house and move on, find you happiness?
SPEAKER_00Okay, so we've uncovered quite a bit of
Turning Motivation Into A Plan
SPEAKER_00the motivation here. I would like to see Stephanie start like taking progressive steps towards like, okay, how does this fit in with the selling of the real estate? Um, if we were to come to an agreement today, um, how long would you need? Where would you go? Um, I would like to see kind of his thought process in regards to that because he definitely wants to sell. We know he's highly motivated, we know it's a situation where this could be a really good fit for us. So I would like to kind of understand his thought process as to why he was reaching out to us, why now? And does he have a plan? Does he know where he's gonna go? Um, start trying to transition the conversation a little bit from the discovery to now we need to understand what the full solution looks like that we can present later on in the conversation.
SPEAKER_04You know, so at this point, I'm not happy. Like I said, you can have all the money in the world and still not be happy, you know. So I'm just gonna get somewhere why I feel complete. Right now I'm not complete.
SPEAKER_02Okay. So what's next for you? Let's talk about that.
SPEAKER_04Well, what's next? Take me on a trip somewhere where I want to stay, and then make that my my my home wherever I go, you know. My next step is finding me. Stop move somewhere, start real business, you know, and and go from there. One day at a time.
SPEAKER_02How much will that mean to you to find yourself?
SPEAKER_04A whole lot. It'll mean a whole whole lot. I can if if I can find a place I can go, wake up in the morning, have no word, no doubt, I think that's that I'll be peaceful. You know, because right now, since I'm here, since my mom been gone, I don't really sleep. I take nap during the night. I don't I don't sleep, sleep, like everybody sleep good. I I I don't. I'm always wondering. My mind always gone, always thinking.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
Timing Questions That Unlock Urgency
SPEAKER_02How long have you been thinking about making this change?
SPEAKER_04Oh three, four years ever since my mom passed.
SPEAKER_02It's a long time. Why now?
SPEAKER_04I'm just it it's time. I you know, when you're ready to go, you can you can think all you want to, but when you really set up and ready to go, your mind I'll let you know it's it's time to go because whatever you do, you're not gonna be happy or satisfied. So that's it's time to go somewhere else.
SPEAKER_00Really solid transitions there by Stephanie. Fantastic call so far. Um, exactly what I wanted her to do, you know. Kind of what's next for you? He's gonna take a trip, he's gonna go to some of these places that he talked about. Why now? Um it's time. I've been thinking about this for three to four years, ever since my mom passed away. So, really doing a great job, Stephanie, by gathering all the information. I I would the $162,000 ASCII price was a very specific amount. And he's but he's also brought up that money doesn't make you happy. And so I would like to get an understanding as to why was that such a specific number that was given, and and what was the dot process behind that? That would probably be depending upon how he finishes his dot here, uh, probably the the next area that I would I would transition to.
SPEAKER_04A lot of new lights from well been here and done that in four mobs. So it just kind of it it just kind of be like an eagle, fly away.
SPEAKER_02Okay. And when you find that, and when you find that, are you gonna stay there? Are you gonna you kind of mentioned traveling? Are you gonna continue to travel?
SPEAKER_04I I I I I see that's the thing. I don't know. If I find a good place that I'm comfortable and I like and it's peaceful, yeah, I'll stay there. But before I before I plant roots where I visit, I want to make sure that's where I want to go before I start planting roots.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_04You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_00I do. One side note that I would really like to point out to everybody is is how focused Stephanie is on the seller and what the seller is speaking about, how she's not comping and underwriting, how she's not getting lost into looking this property up on prop stream or Zillow or anything like that. She is solely focused on what the seller's talking about. Now, she might be getting a little bit of help here from Hyro in the background. I can see that they're they're communicating with each other, probably in the private chat, and maybe even Hyro is is looking up the numbers on the deal. But even if that's the case, benefit of working alongside another TU member, right? She is solely focused and locked in on the seller and the seller's conversation.
SPEAKER_02I do.
Cash Needed In Pocket
SPEAKER_02So let me ask you this: how much do you need in your pocket to get out of Fort Myers and get you starting to travel?
SPEAKER_00All right. So I don't mind the question. Two little edits that I would make there. Um, Stephanie, you have kind of multiple times felt like you said, um, let me ask you a question. Steer away from that. Let's just ask the question. And then also um, I would have liked to have dove into the specific reasoning why he's asking 162,000 before asking how much money he wants in his pocket. Um, sometimes when you go to the $162,000, you'll get your your answer um out of that. There is a roundabout way that we could get the the answer with what you asked on the $162,000, but I would have liked to. That's a very specific number. If it was $160, maybe it would have been a little bit different, but $162, there's a reason why behind that very specific number.
SPEAKER_04Well, I'm gonna say by $20, $25,000.
SPEAKER_02Okay. And how did you come up with that amount?
SPEAKER_04Well,
Reverse Mortgage Payoff Comes Out
SPEAKER_04I come up with it after see my mom got a uh reverse mortgage on this house that I'm that I'm taking care of now. See, I I don't you know, I like the house that blew up. This house address got my birth certificate. My birth certificate got this house address on it. So and I'm fixing stuff. So it it's time to it's time to go. So if if I can find somebody that like a with appraisal, I got it.
SPEAKER_00So it's very important for Stephanie to ask specifically what is the payoff of the reverse mortgage today and get that number. And then that's where we reverse engineer that $20,000 to $25,000 in the seller pocket.
SPEAKER_04That's gonna praise this house. It'll hold me up until I find their job because I'm a chef. So you know, I can go anywhere and find me a cooking job because I got skills or start my own business.
SPEAKER_02What what kind of food do you cook?
SPEAKER_04Everything, uh, but I specialize in seafood.
SPEAKER_02Wow, that's awesome. So you mentioned this is this is the home you grew up in?
SPEAKER_04Yes. My birth certificate got his address on, and his house was built in his bed.
SPEAKER_00Okay. So while we were we were right where we need to be, where we're straying a little bit. I I really want to understand the payoff of the reverse mortgage. We need to get that so then we can understand where we're looking at and seeing how that works. Because again, when you're looking at the four-steller buckets, we need to understand if the price is incorrect or correct, and then if we can immediately be the solution or if we have to need to go into education, and it it feels like we're right there on the the tipping point if we don't find out what's going on with that reverse mortgage.
SPEAKER_04So it's a long time. I you know, I done got married and moved to George and came back home, but it's just home. The only reason why I came back because I got a divorce and my mom was dead. So now I don't have that to worry about. So there's no reason for me to stay or go somewhere and come back.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. So if I can get you out of there, out of Fort Myers, away from those memories, onto a more peaceful, stress-free travel, is that what's most important to you?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, my my peace and happiness is more important than anything. I'm sure everybody in my situation probably feels the same way. Some people stay right there and try to make it work. But when you fed up, you just fed up, you know. Yeah, no happiness. Life is more than just going home and going to work. Life is way more than that.
SPEAKER_02You're so right. So, you know, let's try to
Condition Walkthrough And Debt Clarity
SPEAKER_02get you to your happiness. Uh, if we buy, you know, would the house need any work?
SPEAKER_04Don't it? Well, I got the roof is like 10 years old. I got like 22, 21 solar panels on the top. So that's that's kind of that's kind of new, no leak. Um it's an old house, so you're gonna need you're gonna have to paint on the inside, but it's no holes in the wall. So mama didn't play that with kids. Uh it's just a little work done on the inside, you know. The bathroom probably needs to upgrade both of the bathrooms in the kitchen. And then she got uh me and her put down peeling stick towel on the floor, but it's the the original floor is a terrazzle floor, okay? So it's I'm I mean it's not that much work, but it depends on how somebody else wants to come in and design it all. All right, how much backyard and you know it's just mango tree or fruit trees in the bike.
SPEAKER_01Just ask him how much you owe.
SPEAKER_02How much do you owe on the house and the solar panels?
SPEAKER_04Solar panels paid off.
SPEAKER_02Solar panels are paid off. Okay, how much do you owe on the house?
SPEAKER_04Well, they're asking for 148.
SPEAKER_02You owe 148?
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_00I would clarify that a young Understands that that is the actual payoff for the reverse mortgage. Just to make sure that we're we're talking the same same thing here.
SPEAKER_04But I like I said, another day son means they they want 95% of the praiser call.
SPEAKER_02What do you mean by that?
SPEAKER_04If I say if I want 162 for and they and appraiser come in and say the house, let's just say they say the house is appraised at 130. Okay, out of that 130, they want 95% up of that 130.
SPEAKER_00What? So basically the reverse mortgage is saying that they want an appraisal done and then they get 95% of uh whatever the appraised value is. So that's why he's looking for an appraiser.
SPEAKER_02Who who's saying this to you? Okay, the reverse mortgage is saying, so you have a revert, so your mother got a reverse mortgage on the property, and they're saying that you owe 148,000. Right. Is that the minimum that you need to pay them back?
SPEAKER_00Hold on. Let's do the math here. What is 162 times 95%? It's 153,900. 160. It's 152. I don't know. I thought that 148 might be coming for that 95% of appraised value. Interesting.
SPEAKER_02Or is it whatever the house is appraised at?
SPEAKER_04What well what if well I don't get it praised, they want 148. If I get it appraised, they want 95% of the praiser call.
SPEAKER_02Okay. I gotcha.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_02So if it's not appraised, they only want 148,000. If it's appraised, they want 95% of that.
SPEAKER_04Right.
SPEAKER_02Okay. So is that why you want to go with an investor and get a cash offer so that you don't have to get it appraised?
SPEAKER_04I mean, either way it goes, um how to get it. Um this one I'm saying, either way it goes, you figure how to get it appraised because I don't want nobody to try to rip me off and I don't want to rip nobody else off.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_02Okay. So what if it gets appraised for a hundred dollars? What do you make?
SPEAKER_04Well, I'm not gonna make nothing out of that. That's that's what I'm saying. What I want is what I take to do. Like I was saying, I've been here too long to sell it and don't have nothing in my pocket when I said it's not gonna work like that. Not for me. I got too many memories in here to get sell it and walk away with nothing. Okay. If I if I took one sixty-two and pay them one forty eight, I should have some money in my pocket.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm not seeing it. Let me just run the numbers.
SPEAKER_00So if he does get an appraise though, and it appraises for less, he does walk away with five percent. So let's let's just run a scenario in which he does appraise for a hundred and thirty thousand. He would walk away with sixty five hundred. Is that enough? I don't know.
SPEAKER_02As a cash offer, yeah, so that's it's not really how a cash offer works. Let me just run the numbers here really quick and then I'll I'll talk through my numbers. I I see how you're running your numbers, and I see that you want to walk away with somebody. I totally get that. Um but let me run my my numbers and then I'll t I'll explain those.
Offer Breakdown And The Abrupt Exit
SPEAKER_02Yeah, he's definitely higher. Okay, so just quick math, just to let you know, I'm not gonna be able to give you a hundred and sixty-two thousand.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_00I mean, Tyler and Iro are kind of chuckling. I'm kind of chuckling too. Uh, I would have liked a little bit of an explanation there, Stephanie. Um, you you said that very stone cold. I'm not gonna give you 162. I don't know if the solution is is not there, though. I mean, because there is a scenario in which we could get this appraised at the price that we need it at. Um I I don't know what number you needed at, so I don't know how far off we are. So I'm hoping that we get an explanation from you here.
SPEAKER_04I mean, I understand what you're trying to. You're trying to buy low, redo it, and sell it for more, get y'all profit, investment property. Yeah, I understand that. I get that.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
SPEAKER_04But like I say, I I I'm not selling it and walk away with two thousand dollars. No, I'm not doing that.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_04Anything, if if if anything, I I would deal with reverse mortgage, fixing myself, move, and rent it out myself.
SPEAKER_02Okay. Well, that's sounds like a good plan. I don't think I don't think I'm gonna be your best solution because I mean, I think the reverse mortgage is what's standing in the way here.
SPEAKER_04Well, a lot of people say that, but it's a loophole in everything. Just got to find.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And see, see, my thing is I don't buy got the loophole. See, so everything got loophole and just got defined.
SPEAKER_00What's the loophole? You did so you've done such a really good job of asking questions like this throughout. I would have loved for you to ask what is the loophole. To me, the appraisal and the 95% of the appraised value is the loophole, unless we need this at like 80,000 or something. The way that you're acting makes it seem like we are significantly off on numbers. And like 160 is close to ARV. And if that's the case, I understand the reason why you're acting the way that you're acting. But if this is remotely close, um, I would have liked to have seen a little bit more aggression towards coming up with some sort of solution there. Okay.
SPEAKER_04But I, you know, I appreciate you calling and you know, inquiring about it.
SPEAKER_02All right. Well, no problem. You have a great rest of your day. Okay.
SPEAKER_00Okay, so we we essentially got off without ever telling him where we need to be. I'm gonna let this play here for a second. I want to see if there's any conversation between you guys on what number actually needed to happen for this to take place.
SPEAKER_02Bye. Bye.
Coaching On Tone Numbers And Trust
SPEAKER_02He didn't want to get off the phone with you.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's that's that's what you're supposed to do. You get to transaction at the end, Stephanie.
SPEAKER_02I got two questions.
SPEAKER_01You you go straight into I can't be your solution, I'm not your buyer. Instead of like, I'm trying to help you, I just can't. Okay, so you never know when that look, that guy up to the end. And look, he didn't want to hang up. Hey, but revo reverse mortgage that I could only pay them 50k. Would you buy it now? Because you told him, hey, I can't do 162. He didn't say fuck you. Right. He stood there because you built the trust, but don't push the trust away. Okay, it's like I'm I'm here for you. I'm trying to make it work, I just can't. Let's blame the reverse mortgage. Just blame them. It's not it's not my fault, it's not your fault, it's the reverse mortgage.
SPEAKER_02Right. Hold on one second.
SPEAKER_01And then he said there's always a way. I mean, there is a way. If you can find a way, I can take this off your head.
SPEAKER_02Life, what is this?
SPEAKER_00All right, so Hyro mentioned 50k. That would make a lot of sense if that's where we really need to be. Although I do agree with everything that Hyro just said right there. Um, it did feel um awkward how understanding and empathetic you were during the entire conversation until it came out that there was a reverse mortgage that was 148, and he's won 162, and you're just like, I'm not gonna be your solution. You kind of shifted into becoming a whole different person with your tone and everything. Um, would have loved for you to be like, well, let me explain from an investor standpoint, we feel like this property could be worth X, and it's gonna take some repairs. You just told me that. So we need to be purchasing down at this price point, but then really exploring the possibility of an appraisal coming in at a much lower number, and would he be okay with walking away with the 5%? I don't know why we didn't explore that at all as a possible solution. And and the seller was even saying it, hey, there's loopholes to everything. Why didn't we explore that potential loophole as the solution? Because the reverse mortgage is offering that. So I would have loved to have seen a little bit of an explanation as to what the numbers really truly look like. Um he said it there at the end, Stephanie, and it's the one thing that you really want to avoid, which is everyone is saying that. Okay, so everyone is saying that. How are we going to stand out from that? Is there a solution that was potentially there that we did not explore? I felt like the appraisal of the 95% was that solution. That being said, he said, I'm not gonna walk away from this property with $2,000 in my pocket. Maybe you knew that, and that's the decision. Outside of that, though, prior to the end, maybe the last like three or four sentences that you had, uh, fantastic call. Great job on early on, discovering the pain and the motivation, the questions. I think you were being coached a little bit there by Hyro in the chat. Uh, but that's what makes Hyro special as a closer. Um, and and you working alongside him every single day, it's only going to improve your skill set, Stephanie. So I thought you did a fantastic job all the way up until the end there. And then just when you watch this again, look at your body language and and your facial expression and how that changed, right? I would have loved for you to stay the exact same person that you were earlier on in the call with the delivery that hey, 162 can't work for an investor, and here's the reason why. Uh, we we can explore those loopholes. We can try to be a solution for you. Maybe just another seven, eight, ten minutes into this conversation, we could be exploring uh being that that answer for this man because inevitably he is going to keep seeking that out until someone comes along and probably pitches that idea. So outside of that, Stephanie, great job, Hyro Tyler. Thank you, boys, for always working with these TU members. Uh, fantastic feedback there, Hyro, and then all the coaching there. You that you probably gave Stephanie
Final Feedback And Community Shoutouts
SPEAKER_00in the chat. Awesome stuff, man. Everybody that's watching, make sure to show Stephanie Bain some love in the comments, not only for this call review, but for going out and going live every single day on YouTube. Uh, to hopping on with me and Jerry. And and prior to that, hopping on another live where she talked to one of the rudest sellers of all time. Stephanie is putting in that work to improve her skill sets. I love to see it. So show Stephanie some love. Show me some love by liking today's video. We'll see you guys tomorrow.