{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2.19,"endTime":3.96,"body":"You might"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2.19,"endTime":3.96,"body":"have heard that saying that dog"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3.96,"endTime":7.65,"body":"training is both an art and a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3.96,"endTime":7.65,"body":"science. And I kind of agree"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":7.65,"endTime":10.62,"body":"with that statement because"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":7.65,"endTime":10.62,"body":"training plans, even when"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":10.62,"endTime":14.31,"body":"rigorously based in science can"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":10.62,"endTime":14.31,"body":"often benefit from creative"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":14.31,"endTime":17.34,"body":"thinking. I can't think of any"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":14.31,"endTime":17.34,"body":"other trainer that thinks more"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":17.34,"endTime":20.58,"body":"creatively in the work she has"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":17.34,"endTime":20.58,"body":"done with dogs, especially the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":20.58,"endTime":24.99,"body":"dogs who have issues on leash,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":20.58,"endTime":24.99,"body":"Leslie McDevitt look at that,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":25.23,"endTime":28.83,"body":"from her seminal work with the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":25.23,"endTime":28.83,"body":"control unleashed series is just"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":28.83,"endTime":31.8,"body":"one example of the outside of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":28.83,"endTime":31.8,"body":"the box thinking that goes on in"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":31.8,"endTime":35.34,"body":"her brain. And in this episode,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":31.8,"endTime":35.34,"body":"we chat about an awesome variety"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":35.34,"endTime":38.13,"body":"of ideas, where Leslie's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":35.34,"endTime":38.13,"body":"creativity shines through,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":38.28,"endTime":41.58,"body":"including things like latte,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":38.28,"endTime":41.58,"body":"cooperative counter"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":41.58,"endTime":45.51,"body":"conditioning, and pattern games,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":41.58,"endTime":45.51,"body":"all used to help dogs with"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":45.51,"endTime":48.63,"body":"aggression. And if you are"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":45.51,"endTime":48.63,"body":"working with aggression cases,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":48.66,"endTime":52.14,"body":"or plan on taking aggression"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":48.66,"endTime":52.14,"body":"cases as a trainer, or maybe"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":52.14,"endTime":54.69,"body":"you're even struggling with your"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":52.14,"endTime":54.69,"body":"own dog, we have a variety of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":54.69,"endTime":58.29,"body":"educational opportunities just"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":54.69,"endTime":58.29,"body":"for you, including the upcoming"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":58.32,"endTime":61.38,"body":"aggression in dogs conference"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":58.32,"endTime":61.38,"body":"happening from September 30"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":61.38,"endTime":64.68,"body":"Through October 2 2022. in"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":61.38,"endTime":64.68,"body":"Providence, Rhode Island, with"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":64.68,"endTime":68.13,"body":"both in person and online"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":64.68,"endTime":68.13,"body":"options. You can also learn more"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":68.13,"endTime":71.16,"body":"about the aggression in dogs"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":68.13,"endTime":71.16,"body":"master course, which is the most"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":71.16,"endTime":73.53,"body":"comprehensive course available"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":71.16,"endTime":73.53,"body":"anywhere in the world for"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":73.53,"endTime":76.38,"body":"learning how to work with and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":73.53,"endTime":76.38,"body":"help dogs with aggression issues"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":76.38,"endTime":80.49,"body":"by going to aggressive dog.com."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":76.38,"endTime":80.49,"body":"And special thanks to John"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":80.49,"endTime":83.58,"body":"masala for editing the podcast"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":80.49,"endTime":83.58,"body":"this season, and bringing the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":83.58,"endTime":89.34,"body":"production to the next level."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":83.58,"endTime":89.34,"body":"Welcome back to the by the end"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":89.34,"endTime":92.76,"body":"of the dog, I'm here with the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":89.34,"endTime":92.76,"body":"one and only Leslie McDevitt who"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":92.76,"endTime":95.67,"body":"is the author of the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":92.76,"endTime":95.67,"body":"internationally popular control"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":95.67,"endTime":98.43,"body":"unleashed series of books and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":95.67,"endTime":98.43,"body":"DVDs. Her books have been"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":98.43,"endTime":101.49,"body":"translated into many languages,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":98.43,"endTime":101.49,"body":"and people all over the world"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":101.49,"endTime":103.92,"body":"have learned how to use her"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":101.49,"endTime":103.92,"body":"science based and empowering"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":103.92,"endTime":106.77,"body":"methods to help companion"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":103.92,"endTime":106.77,"body":"performance and working dogs"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":106.77,"endTime":109.98,"body":"learn how to function optimally"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":106.77,"endTime":109.98,"body":"without stress and very"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":109.98,"endTime":112.86,"body":"challenging environments. If you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":109.98,"endTime":112.86,"body":"have a dog that worries about"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":112.86,"endTime":116.34,"body":"stuff, other dogs, people"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":112.86,"endTime":116.34,"body":"noises, the unexpected. Leslie"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":116.34,"endTime":119.85,"body":"has many fun counterconditioning"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":116.34,"endTime":119.85,"body":"games just for you. Leslie is a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":119.85,"endTime":122.91,"body":"popular conference speaker, and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":119.85,"endTime":122.91,"body":"is especially proud to be a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":122.91,"endTime":126.24,"body":"presenter at clicker Expo and a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":122.91,"endTime":126.24,"body":"consultant for the Penn vet"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":126.24,"endTime":129.57,"body":"working dog Center. She also has"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":126.24,"endTime":129.57,"body":"runs an awesome Facebook group"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":129.57,"endTime":132.12,"body":"called Friends of control"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":129.57,"endTime":132.12,"body":"unleashed if you guys want to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":132.12,"endTime":135.33,"body":"check that out as well. I'm"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":132.12,"endTime":135.33,"body":"super excited to get to this"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":135.33,"endTime":138.33,"body":"podcast because there's a lot of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":135.33,"endTime":138.33,"body":"things we get to talk about. So"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":138.33,"endTime":141.21,"body":"welcome to the show, Leslie."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":138.33,"endTime":141.21,"body":"Hello. It's great to have you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":141.21,"endTime":144.03,"body":"here. You know, I was thinking"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":141.21,"endTime":144.03,"body":"this morning about when you were"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":144.03,"endTime":148.2,"body":"writing control unleashed, and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":144.03,"endTime":148.2,"body":"you had the section on look at"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":148.2,"endTime":151.5,"body":"that. I thought to myself, I"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":148.2,"endTime":151.5,"body":"wonder what Lesley thought when"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":151.5,"endTime":154.92,"body":"she was writing that section"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":151.5,"endTime":154.92,"body":"about just how many dogs and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":154.92,"endTime":157.5,"body":"people she's going to help with"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":154.92,"endTime":157.5,"body":"that little section of her book,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":157.62,"endTime":160.5,"body":"and how it's going to balloon to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":157.62,"endTime":160.5,"body":"this huge thing where"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":160.68,"endTime":163.8,"body":"everybody's using and then"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":160.68,"endTime":163.8,"body":"making different iterations of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":163.8,"endTime":168.48,"body":"it and things and, and you're"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":163.8,"endTime":168.48,"body":"really in the top list of like"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":168.48,"endTime":172.08,"body":"most influential people for dogs"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":168.48,"endTime":172.08,"body":"and have issues out on walks"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":172.11,"endTime":175.5,"body":"really, when you think about it"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":172.11,"endTime":175.5,"body":"like that, look at that concept."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":175.56,"endTime":179.07,"body":"It's been shared and used in and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":175.56,"endTime":179.07,"body":"now it's worldwide. So how do"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":179.07,"endTime":179.82,"body":"you feel about that?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":180.57,"endTime":184.68,"body":"It's I mean, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":180.57,"endTime":184.68,"body":"crazy. Because when I wrote the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":184.68,"endTime":188.37,"body":"book, I didn't know that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":184.68,"endTime":188.37,"body":"anybody. I mean, I had people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":188.37,"endTime":192.75,"body":"that were reading my articles."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":188.37,"endTime":192.75,"body":"And that's how the book started."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":193.32,"endTime":196.17,"body":"And obviously my own students"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":193.32,"endTime":196.17,"body":"and everything using look at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":196.17,"endTime":198.81,"body":"that and the other stuff, but I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":196.17,"endTime":198.81,"body":"mean, I, I didn't know what was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":198.81,"endTime":201.42,"body":"gonna happen for sure. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":201.72,"endTime":204.57,"body":"And it's, you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":201.72,"endTime":204.57,"body":"know, let's face it, you have"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":204.57,"endTime":207.51,"body":"this incredibly creative mind,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":204.57,"endTime":207.51,"body":"especially when it comes to dog"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":207.51,"endTime":210.66,"body":"training and behavior. And you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":207.51,"endTime":210.66,"body":"know, you have these awesome"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":210.66,"endTime":212.61,"body":"concepts. We're going to talk"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":210.66,"endTime":212.61,"body":"about all them throughout the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":212.64,"endTime":216.54,"body":"episode, but it's the, you know,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":212.64,"endTime":216.54,"body":"what in your mind said, Alright,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":216.54,"endTime":218.88,"body":"I'm gonna actually teach my dog"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":216.54,"endTime":218.88,"body":"to look at things in the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":218.88,"endTime":221.22,"body":"Vironment because the old way of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":218.88,"endTime":221.22,"body":"doing things were like, we want"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":221.22,"endTime":223.86,"body":"the dog to ignore everything, or"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":221.22,"endTime":223.86,"body":"watch me or forget about"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":223.86,"endTime":226.29,"body":"everything else in the world and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":223.86,"endTime":226.29,"body":"just focus on the handler or the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":226.29,"endTime":229.65,"body":"owner, but what made it go let's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":226.29,"endTime":229.65,"body":"do the opposite. 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So now that my kids have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":243.75,"endTime":249.12,"body":"that same temperament at least I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":243.75,"endTime":249.12,"body":"understand that Yeah, but you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":249.12,"endTime":253.41,"body":"know, I did come from the place"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":249.12,"endTime":253.41,"body":"of like conditioning, a lot of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":253.41,"endTime":259.86,"body":"eye contact around other stuff."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":253.41,"endTime":259.86,"body":"But I was always aware of a kind"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":259.86,"endTime":263.1,"body":"of behavior chain emerging where"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":259.86,"endTime":263.1,"body":"when they see things they know"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":263.1,"endTime":266.55,"body":"to then turn back and look at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":263.1,"endTime":266.55,"body":"you so you're turning something"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":266.55,"endTime":270.96,"body":"in the environment into a cue to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":266.55,"endTime":270.96,"body":"pay attention to you and so it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":270.96,"endTime":273.87,"body":"doesn't have to be like a fight"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":270.96,"endTime":273.87,"body":"like it's either you see this"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":273.87,"endTime":278.52,"body":"thing or you see me because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":273.87,"endTime":278.52,"body":"stuff out in the world can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":278.52,"endTime":284.58,"body":"remind you to turn and look at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":278.52,"endTime":284.58,"body":"me, right and then I watched a,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":285.66,"endTime":289.89,"body":"you know, TV, commercial movie,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":285.66,"endTime":289.89,"body":"trainer thing, and they were"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":289.89,"endTime":293.01,"body":"talking about teaching the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":289.89,"endTime":293.01,"body":"animal to visually find their a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":293.01,"endTime":297.06,"body":"mark and look at it. 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So you get this very,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":415.47,"endTime":419.19,"body":"these very sort of small"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":415.47,"endTime":419.19,"body":"indicating behaviors. And you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":419.19,"endTime":423.03,"body":"can do it for sounds or smells,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":419.19,"endTime":423.03,"body":"because they can just, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":423.06,"endTime":428.43,"body":"orient in some way with their"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":423.06,"endTime":428.43,"body":"eyes, ears, nose, not forward"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":428.43,"endTime":431.88,"body":"movement, just something with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":428.43,"endTime":431.88,"body":"their head, and tell you the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":431.88,"endTime":435.6,"body":"direction that some stimulus is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":431.88,"endTime":435.6,"body":"coming from. So it really didn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":435.6,"endTime":440.67,"body":"have to be about looking. And I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":435.6,"endTime":440.67,"body":"think people have taken it to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":440.67,"endTime":444.48,"body":"like, if they're seeing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":440.67,"endTime":444.48,"body":"something calmly or something"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":444.48,"endTime":449.82,"body":"like that, and it's really much"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":444.48,"endTime":449.82,"body":"more about having a conversation"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":449.82,"endTime":454.26,"body":"with you about what's out there."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":449.82,"endTime":454.26,"body":"And the sensitization is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":454.26,"endTime":458.46,"body":"happening, because it does, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":454.26,"endTime":458.46,"body":"I'm really more focused on sort"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":458.46,"endTime":462.75,"body":"of a rate relational operant"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":458.46,"endTime":462.75,"body":"training that they can use the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":462.75,"endTime":466.32,"body":"environment to get paid to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":462.75,"endTime":466.32,"body":"report something to you. That's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":466.32,"endTime":469.62,"body":"another one, I like to say, now"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":466.32,"endTime":469.62,"body":"be a reporter, not a reactor."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":470.07,"endTime":473.85,"body":"You know, so if another dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":470.07,"endTime":473.85,"body":"shows up on your walk, they can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":473.85,"endTime":478.68,"body":"be like this just in, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":473.85,"endTime":478.68,"body":"and they can tell you, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":478.74,"endTime":481.8,"body":"so it's not really about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":478.74,"endTime":481.8,"body":"watching the other things so"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":481.8,"endTime":482.34,"body":"much."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":482.88,"endTime":484.95,"body":"Yeah, it's,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":482.88,"endTime":484.95,"body":"it's kind of hard to come up"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":484.95,"endTime":489.12,"body":"with a good acronym with"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":484.95,"endTime":489.12,"body":"reporting in it. Yeah, look at"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":489.12,"endTime":493.83,"body":"that as a as an easier acronym"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":489.12,"endTime":493.83,"body":"to remember. Right? When you are"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":493.83,"endTime":496.89,"body":"developing it, were you thinking"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":493.83,"endTime":496.89,"body":"about the classical conditioning"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":496.89,"endTime":500.46,"body":"aspect of it. So like, the whole"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":496.89,"endTime":500.46,"body":"Pavlov was on your shoulder"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":500.46,"endTime":502.98,"body":"saying, where there's elements"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":500.46,"endTime":502.98,"body":"of classical conditioning,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":502.98,"endTime":506.61,"body":"classical counter conditioning"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":502.98,"endTime":506.61,"body":"that can kind of seep into our"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":507.3,"endTime":510.24,"body":"procedure there. Was that on"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":507.3,"endTime":510.24,"body":"your mind in the forefront? Are"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":510.24,"endTime":512.49,"body":"we just kind of concentrating on"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":510.24,"endTime":512.49,"body":"let's do that apparently,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":512.61,"endTime":515.28,"body":"that issue was always"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":512.61,"endTime":515.28,"body":"on my mind the way that Pavlov"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":515.28,"endTime":518.4,"body":"is always on your shoulder,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":515.28,"endTime":518.4,"body":"whatever, like a, like an old"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":518.4,"endTime":522.9,"body":"wise parrot. It just happens. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":518.4,"endTime":522.9,"body":"don't spend a lot of time"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":522.9,"endTime":526.11,"body":"planning for it to happen"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":522.9,"endTime":526.11,"body":"because it's there, as long as"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":526.11,"endTime":528.69,"body":"I'm working with my operant"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":526.11,"endTime":528.69,"body":"counter conditioning stuff,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":528.69,"endTime":532.23,"body":"which is what I like to do. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":528.69,"endTime":532.23,"body":"you know, sub threshold below a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":532.23,"endTime":535.17,"body":"point where dog is going to have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":532.23,"endTime":535.17,"body":"any feelings of concern or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":535.2,"endTime":538.5,"body":"discomfort, that desensitization"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":535.2,"endTime":538.5,"body":"is going to happen as well."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":539.309,"endTime":542.069,"body":"And you've"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":539.309,"endTime":542.069,"body":"added in now, more letters to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":542.069,"endTime":547.469,"body":"that acronym. So instead of La"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":542.069,"endTime":547.469,"body":"Tea, tea tea, I've seen that as"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":547.469,"endTime":549.239,"body":"well. So what is that? Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":550.14,"endTime":553.41,"body":"I'm, I'm not taking the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":550.14,"endTime":553.41,"body":"blame for adding those letters."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":554.55,"endTime":558.57,"body":"No, so I have a kind of new"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":554.55,"endTime":558.57,"body":"game, if you want to call it a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":558.57,"endTime":561.84,"body":"procedure, we're calling it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":558.57,"endTime":561.84,"body":"latte which was a joke, it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":561.84,"endTime":565.98,"body":"stands for look at that then"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":561.84,"endTime":565.98,"body":"enrichment. So I wanted to do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":565.98,"endTime":570.54,"body":"something that changed the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":565.98,"endTime":570.54,"body":"feeding strategy for look at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":570.54,"endTime":575.79,"body":"that, so that you could use it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":570.54,"endTime":575.79,"body":"in more contexts. So with look"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":575.79,"endTime":580.59,"body":"at that, it creates a real like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":575.79,"endTime":580.59,"body":"working type relationship where"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":580.98,"endTime":585.12,"body":"the dog is really focused on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":580.98,"endTime":585.12,"body":"you. And you know, a high rate"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":585.12,"endTime":592.62,"body":"of reinforcement. I wondered if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":585.12,"endTime":592.62,"body":"like, you were at a park or out"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":592.62,"endTime":596.82,"body":"in the world somewhere and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":592.62,"endTime":596.82,"body":"something was happening, and you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":596.82,"endTime":599.97,"body":"didn't and you wanted to the dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":596.82,"endTime":599.97,"body":"to just be able to stay there."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":600.0,"endTime":604.68,"body":"AR and chill out. Whereas look"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":600.0,"endTime":604.68,"body":"at that would be, you're moving"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":604.71,"endTime":608.16,"body":"past something, you know, you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":604.71,"endTime":608.16,"body":"watching something, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":608.16,"endTime":610.83,"body":"started out with a lot of sport"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":608.16,"endTime":610.83,"body":"dogs, you know, you're watching"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":610.83,"endTime":613.62,"body":"another dog do agility, you need"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":610.83,"endTime":613.62,"body":"to be able to turn and report it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":613.62,"endTime":618.0,"body":"to me instead of bark at that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":613.62,"endTime":618.0,"body":"dog, you know. And so it wasn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":618.0,"endTime":620.46,"body":"something where you're just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":618.0,"endTime":620.46,"body":"relaxing as something's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":620.46,"endTime":625.53,"body":"happening, the person doesn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":620.46,"endTime":625.53,"body":"need so much hand or focus. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":625.56,"endTime":628.35,"body":"what I did was change the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":625.56,"endTime":628.35,"body":"feeding strategy. So rather"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":628.35,"endTime":632.97,"body":"than, like, the behavior chain,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":628.35,"endTime":632.97,"body":"where they turn, orient towards"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":632.97,"endTime":636.48,"body":"something and turn it back to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":632.97,"endTime":636.48,"body":"you eats, I started putting out"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":636.54,"endTime":640.71,"body":"all kinds of like enrichment"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":636.54,"endTime":640.71,"body":"toys. When I had the first"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":640.74,"endTime":644.31,"body":"virtual controlling leash"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":640.74,"endTime":644.31,"body":"conference, the looking at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":644.31,"endTime":648.18,"body":"people sponsored us, and they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":644.31,"endTime":648.18,"body":"sent me like 50 Looking mats."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":648.18,"endTime":651.93,"body":"And so that's probably also part"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":648.18,"endTime":651.93,"body":"of why I created this because I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":651.93,"endTime":655.62,"body":"suddenly had all this stuff. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":651.93,"endTime":655.62,"body":"so you know, what I do with lots"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":655.62,"endTime":659.64,"body":"I put out a loop, I like moving"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":655.62,"endTime":659.64,"body":"things in circles. So you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":659.64,"endTime":663.54,"body":"big circle of looka mats. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":659.64,"endTime":663.54,"body":"that way, you know, you could"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":663.54,"endTime":666.27,"body":"play look at that they see"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":663.54,"endTime":666.27,"body":"something they turn back to you,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":666.45,"endTime":670.44,"body":"instead of just a treat. It's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":666.45,"endTime":670.44,"body":"bunch of stuff, you know, that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":670.44,"endTime":675.78,"body":"they can lick to smell explore."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":670.44,"endTime":675.78,"body":"So they have more time in place."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":675.93,"endTime":680.94,"body":"And so for something like, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":675.93,"endTime":680.94,"body":"know, I was at the park with my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":680.94,"endTime":685.02,"body":"young Belgian Shepherd, and I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":680.94,"endTime":685.02,"body":"was taking him to this area"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":685.02,"endTime":687.39,"body":"where he lives and they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":685.02,"endTime":687.39,"body":"having a bird watchers meeting"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":687.39,"endTime":690.81,"body":"there. And there was like 50"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":687.39,"endTime":690.81,"body":"people, and I wanted to stay in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":690.81,"endTime":695.85,"body":"that general area, I wanted him"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":690.81,"endTime":695.85,"body":"to not just keep reporting to me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":695.85,"endTime":699.57,"body":"about the people or in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":695.85,"endTime":699.57,"body":"birdwatching place, but I wanted"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":699.57,"endTime":703.59,"body":"him to just actually like sniff"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":699.57,"endTime":703.59,"body":"grass and pee on things and do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":703.59,"endTime":706.56,"body":"that. So I used this feeding"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":703.59,"endTime":706.56,"body":"strategy instead, because it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":706.56,"endTime":711.96,"body":"gives them a longer time to not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":706.56,"endTime":711.96,"body":"be like working mode actively"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":711.96,"endTime":717.42,"body":"engaged, right. And like another"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":711.96,"endTime":717.42,"body":"example is a student that had"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":717.42,"endTime":721.68,"body":"ponies on her property. And she"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":717.42,"endTime":721.68,"body":"didn't want the dog to bark. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":721.68,"endTime":726.21,"body":"she wanted the dog to be able to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":721.68,"endTime":726.21,"body":"just be out there. And look at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":726.21,"endTime":729.0,"body":"that is helpful for that too,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":726.21,"endTime":729.0,"body":"because it's desensitizing them"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":729.0,"endTime":731.7,"body":"while they're seeing things, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":729.0,"endTime":731.7,"body":"they've worked really nicely to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":731.7,"endTime":737.1,"body":"just put out a loop and the dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":731.7,"endTime":737.1,"body":"could work the way around, stay"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":737.1,"endTime":739.95,"body":"at each place for a period of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":737.1,"endTime":739.95,"body":"time. And it's encouraging like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":739.95,"endTime":743.1,"body":"those more like natural"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":739.95,"endTime":743.1,"body":"behaviors of like foraging"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":743.1,"endTime":747.24,"body":"exploring, which is good for the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":743.1,"endTime":747.24,"body":"brain. So they're, they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":747.24,"endTime":750.12,"body":"getting that piece of it while"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":747.24,"endTime":750.12,"body":"they're getting used to things"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":750.12,"endTime":751.41,"body":"being there. So yeah,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":751.41,"endTime":753.06,"body":"it's a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":751.41,"endTime":753.06,"body":"question I get a lot too. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":753.09,"endTime":757.02,"body":"it's about the benefits of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":753.09,"endTime":757.02,"body":"feeding on the ground. Or they"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":757.02,"endTime":759.6,"body":"said people ask me, like do toss"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":757.02,"endTime":759.6,"body":"treats on the ground? Or do you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":759.6,"endTime":763.02,"body":"do longer feeds or duration"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":759.6,"endTime":763.02,"body":"feeds or street scatters those"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":763.02,"endTime":765.66,"body":"kinds of things? And what are"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":763.02,"endTime":765.66,"body":"the benefits of it? And I think"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":765.66,"endTime":768.54,"body":"there's quite a bit of benefit"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":765.66,"endTime":768.54,"body":"for him, at least his stress"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":768.54,"endTime":770.91,"body":"reduction standpoint, as well as"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":768.54,"endTime":770.91,"body":"the enrichment standpoint,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":771.03,"endTime":773.43,"body":"because, as you mentioned, gives"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":771.03,"endTime":773.43,"body":"the dog time to kind of just"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":773.43,"endTime":776.67,"body":"right, alright, I can take a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":773.43,"endTime":776.67,"body":"break here, go sniff go, you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":776.67,"endTime":778.83,"body":"know, for those treats, got it"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":776.67,"endTime":778.83,"body":"versus just that one and done"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":778.83,"endTime":779.52,"body":"kind of treat."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":779.58,"endTime":782.25,"body":"Right. Exactly with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":779.58,"endTime":782.25,"body":"that. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":782.25,"endTime":785.91,"body":"think it depends, it depends on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":782.25,"endTime":785.91,"body":"the context on what's going on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":785.91,"endTime":790.11,"body":"around you, and what that dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":785.91,"endTime":790.11,"body":"needs. I think that there's room"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":790.11,"endTime":794.55,"body":"for both, like, have more tools"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":790.11,"endTime":794.55,"body":"have more feeding strategies,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":794.55,"endTime":797.85,"body":"you know, it's kind of funny,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":794.55,"endTime":797.85,"body":"but I actually have seen it the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":797.85,"endTime":802.32,"body":"most with the duration feeding,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":797.85,"endTime":802.32,"body":"like you said, I've seen the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":802.32,"endTime":807.27,"body":"most difference. Using that with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":802.32,"endTime":807.27,"body":"my horse, not with dogs, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":807.27,"endTime":810.36,"body":"know, that it just automatically"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":807.27,"endTime":810.36,"body":"activates that whole Oh, I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":810.36,"endTime":815.52,"body":"grazing is a little bit"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":810.36,"endTime":815.52,"body":"different. It's interesting, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":815.52,"endTime":817.95,"body":"know, a lot of clicker trained"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":815.52,"endTime":817.95,"body":"horses, they get conditioned to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":817.95,"endTime":822.69,"body":"do a head a head lower behavior,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":817.95,"endTime":822.69,"body":"so that plus feeding on the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":822.75,"endTime":828.0,"body":"ground, you know, it's like, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":822.75,"endTime":828.0,"body":"just see her calm, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":828.03,"endTime":831.39,"body":"kulturecity Well, I'd say for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":828.03,"endTime":831.39,"body":"horses, like the other day,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":831.39,"endTime":834.6,"body":"somebody was, you know, mowing,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":831.39,"endTime":834.6,"body":"and they were like riding the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":834.78,"endTime":839.52,"body":"thing, you know, next to her pan"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":834.78,"endTime":839.52,"body":"and all that that was a great, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":839.52,"endTime":841.26,"body":"have, I have a little video of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":839.52,"endTime":841.26,"body":"it, too."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":841.409,"endTime":844.799,"body":"That's the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":841.409,"endTime":844.799,"body":"power of video, too. I love that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":844.799,"endTime":848.159,"body":"you capture so much on video to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":844.799,"endTime":848.159,"body":"share with the rest of us. The"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":848.159,"endTime":851.909,"body":"question that was coming to mind"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":848.159,"endTime":851.909,"body":"was the adjustments you make"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":851.909,"endTime":854.669,"body":"based on and this is this"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":851.909,"endTime":854.669,"body":"podcast is being recorded right"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":854.669,"endTime":858.089,"body":"about the time that social media"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":854.669,"endTime":858.089,"body":"is exploding with that recent"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":858.089,"endTime":862.859,"body":"study. All the articles coming"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":858.089,"endTime":862.859,"body":"out about it will quote diving"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":862.859,"endTime":866.699,"body":"into that but do you make"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":862.859,"endTime":866.699,"body":"adjustments for when somebody's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":866.759,"endTime":871.709,"body":"using look at that for certain"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":866.759,"endTime":871.709,"body":"characteristics or breed traits?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":873.569,"endTime":876.719,"body":"So let's let's use an example."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":873.569,"endTime":876.719,"body":"Like, you know, if you've got a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":876.749,"endTime":879.599,"body":"dog, oftentimes we're using it"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":876.749,"endTime":879.599,"body":"for dogs that are, you know,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":879.599,"endTime":881.939,"body":"nervous or fearful of the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":879.599,"endTime":881.939,"body":"environment or having a tough"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":881.939,"endTime":884.069,"body":"time in the environment. But"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":881.939,"endTime":884.069,"body":"what if you're looking at some"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":884.069,"endTime":887.309,"body":"of the more breed specific"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":884.069,"endTime":887.309,"body":"entities like a maybe a Belgian"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":887.309,"endTime":891.899,"body":"Malinois, that's how dare you to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":887.309,"endTime":891.899,"body":"protect their honor or livestock"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":891.899,"endTime":898.349,"body":"Guardian dog and we actually, we"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":891.899,"endTime":898.349,"body":"sometimes run a risk of shaping"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":898.349,"endTime":901.769,"body":"that behavior maybe in the wrong"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":898.349,"endTime":901.769,"body":"direction. And do you make"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":901.799,"endTime":903.449,"body":"adjustments or see that happen?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":903.48,"endTime":908.01,"body":"No, I haven't, because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":903.48,"endTime":908.01,"body":"the behavior is not watching"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":908.01,"endTime":910.47,"body":"something, the behavior is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":908.01,"endTime":910.47,"body":"turning away and showing you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":910.47,"endTime":915.66,"body":"where it is. And so it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":910.47,"endTime":915.66,"body":"framing, seeing something into a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":915.66,"endTime":919.56,"body":"structure that that is helping"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":915.66,"endTime":919.56,"body":"the dog stay in this sort of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":919.59,"endTime":924.6,"body":"operant, I'm working in eating"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":919.59,"endTime":924.6,"body":"cookies, state of mind, which is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":924.6,"endTime":929.73,"body":"the opposite of, oh, I'm now in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":924.6,"endTime":929.73,"body":"the part of my brain where i,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":930.12,"endTime":933.69,"body":"where i use a strong eye or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":930.12,"endTime":933.69,"body":"stalk, you know, or those those"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":933.69,"endTime":937.38,"body":"types of predatory behaviors,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":933.69,"endTime":937.38,"body":"because it's a different part of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":937.38,"endTime":940.44,"body":"the brain that we're accessing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":937.38,"endTime":940.44,"body":"when we're doing counter"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":940.44,"endTime":944.19,"body":"conditioning work. So it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":940.44,"endTime":944.19,"body":"actually quite good for dogs"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":944.4,"endTime":945.36,"body":"that do that."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":946.11,"endTime":948.36,"body":"Let me dig a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":946.11,"endTime":948.36,"body":"little deeper then. So let's say"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":948.36,"endTime":951.12,"body":"we have a dog without any fear"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":948.36,"endTime":951.12,"body":"issues or any you're not"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":951.12,"endTime":953.91,"body":"noticing any anxiety. So if we"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":951.12,"endTime":953.91,"body":"were to replace, you know,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":953.91,"endTime":957.36,"body":"guarding the owner with a lab"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":953.91,"endTime":957.36,"body":"chasing down a tennis ball or"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":957.39,"endTime":960.45,"body":"retriever, or a pointer pointing"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":957.39,"endTime":960.45,"body":"at something, we can argue that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":960.45,"endTime":963.93,"body":"there's no, that is a different"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":960.45,"endTime":963.93,"body":"part of the brain in play,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":963.93,"endTime":966.99,"body":"right? So it's not fear based."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":963.93,"endTime":966.99,"body":"Yeah. And at the dose kind of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":966.99,"endTime":969.06,"body":"just doing what they're doing."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":966.99,"endTime":969.06,"body":"So if we go back to that Belgian"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":969.06,"endTime":972.69,"body":"Malinois or livestock Guardian"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":969.06,"endTime":972.69,"body":"dog on their property, and we"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":972.69,"endTime":977.37,"body":"start marking for looking or, or"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":972.69,"endTime":977.37,"body":"reinforcing for looking and then"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":977.37,"endTime":979.71,"body":"looking back at the handler, do"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":977.37,"endTime":979.71,"body":"you see any risks in those"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":979.71,"endTime":981.0,"body":"cases? Or we're not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":981.0,"endTime":984.18,"body":"reinforcing for looking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":981.0,"endTime":984.18,"body":"right, we're reinforced for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":984.36,"endTime":987.36,"body":"indicating? Yes. So you can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":984.36,"endTime":987.36,"body":"think of it as like a visual"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":987.36,"endTime":990.93,"body":"noise work, I found something"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":987.36,"endTime":990.93,"body":"and I turned around, and it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":990.93,"endTime":995.31,"body":"that part that's getting"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":990.93,"endTime":995.31,"body":"reinforced, if we were"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":995.37,"endTime":1000.38,"body":"accidentally reinforcing for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":995.37,"endTime":1000.38,"body":"look egg, which in this context"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1000.38,"endTime":1003.5,"body":"is related to like the motor"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1000.38,"endTime":1003.5,"body":"pattern i with a capital E,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1004.01,"endTime":1007.97,"body":"slash stock, right? Just what I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1004.01,"endTime":1007.97,"body":"don't want, then you'd be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1007.97,"endTime":1012.08,"body":"getting more of that. So if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1007.97,"endTime":1012.08,"body":"you're playing look at that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1012.08,"endTime":1014.18,"body":"you're getting a dog that is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1012.08,"endTime":1014.18,"body":"looking at you and really not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1014.18,"endTime":1017.06,"body":"the other thing at all, or maybe"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1014.18,"endTime":1017.06,"body":"to being an ear. That's the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1017.06,"endTime":1020.09,"body":"irony, right? They're not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1017.06,"endTime":1020.09,"body":"looking at that, if you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1020.09,"endTime":1023.93,"body":"getting a dog that was moving"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1020.09,"endTime":1023.93,"body":"into the those motor patterns,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1023.93,"endTime":1026.78,"body":"and really watching something,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1023.93,"endTime":1026.78,"body":"yeah, that I would call that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1026.78,"endTime":1029.51,"body":"first of all, quote, unquote,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1026.78,"endTime":1029.51,"body":"over threshold for playing this"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1029.51,"endTime":1033.98,"body":"game, you know, if the dog isn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1029.51,"endTime":1033.98,"body":"quickly turning back to you, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1033.98,"endTime":1037.19,"body":"able to eat and able to offer"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1033.98,"endTime":1037.19,"body":"operant behavior, they're quote,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1037.19,"endTime":1040.79,"body":"unquote, over the threshold for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1037.19,"endTime":1040.79,"body":"that game. So that means they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1040.79,"endTime":1044.48,"body":"need distance or cut down on the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1040.79,"endTime":1044.48,"body":"visual stimulus, like, for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1044.48,"endTime":1048.14,"body":"example, they're looking at a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1044.48,"endTime":1048.14,"body":"helper and the helpers moving"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1048.14,"endTime":1051.35,"body":"around, it's too much, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1048.14,"endTime":1051.35,"body":"they're not turning back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1051.35,"endTime":1054.35,"body":"quickly, they're starting to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1051.35,"endTime":1054.35,"body":"look, I talk about going from"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1054.35,"endTime":1058.94,"body":"the Orient behavior, just notice"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1054.35,"endTime":1058.94,"body":"to i with a capital H, which is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1058.97,"endTime":1061.76,"body":"a little bit more intensity a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1058.97,"endTime":1061.76,"body":"little different. And that's the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1061.76,"endTime":1065.93,"body":"start of like, a motor pattern"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1061.76,"endTime":1065.93,"body":"we don't want, right? So as long"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1065.93,"endTime":1068.48,"body":"as they're kind of glancing at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1065.93,"endTime":1068.48,"body":"things turning around eating,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1068.51,"endTime":1071.69,"body":"it's not an issue. If they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1068.51,"endTime":1071.69,"body":"going from that space to that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1071.69,"endTime":1076.76,"body":"eye space, the eye stock space,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1071.69,"endTime":1076.76,"body":"then you need to change some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1076.76,"endTime":1082.16,"body":"conditions. Right? So again, if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1076.76,"endTime":1082.16,"body":"the helpers moving around, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1082.16,"endTime":1086.06,"body":"first thing you could do is have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1082.16,"endTime":1086.06,"body":"the helper stop moving, and then"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1086.21,"endTime":1089.54,"body":"see how much with the latency is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1086.21,"endTime":1089.54,"body":"there if the dog is turning back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1089.54,"endTime":1093.38,"body":"faster or not? If the dog is the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1089.54,"endTime":1093.38,"body":"dog eating right away, like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1093.41,"endTime":1097.7,"body":"because that's what you need,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1093.41,"endTime":1097.7,"body":"right? You know, you can change"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1097.7,"endTime":1102.17,"body":"distance, you can do a number of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1097.7,"endTime":1102.17,"body":"things. If the dog is doing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1102.17,"endTime":1105.23,"body":"those things, then that is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1102.17,"endTime":1105.23,"body":"giving you information about you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1105.23,"endTime":1107.63,"body":"to play with these conditions"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1105.23,"endTime":1107.63,"body":"and fix something something's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1107.63,"endTime":1108.41,"body":"not working."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1108.77,"endTime":1111.71,"body":"So a good or"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1108.77,"endTime":1111.71,"body":"having good observation skills,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1111.71,"endTime":1114.98,"body":"I should say is important part"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1111.71,"endTime":1114.98,"body":"of it. But the nice thing about"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1114.98,"endTime":1117.71,"body":"it, though, I also find is that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1114.98,"endTime":1117.71,"body":"it's hard to screw it up. Right?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1117.77,"endTime":1120.5,"body":"You look at that, and it's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1117.77,"endTime":1120.5,"body":"really it's it's one of the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1120.59,"endTime":1123.95,"body":"types of and I love the choice"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1120.59,"endTime":1123.95,"body":"of words, using game instead of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1123.95,"endTime":1125.93,"body":"procedure, right behavior plans,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1126.26,"endTime":1129.74,"body":"that comes from being"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1126.26,"endTime":1129.74,"body":"an agility, former agility"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1129.74,"endTime":1130.91,"body":"person, everything works"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1130.91,"endTime":1132.44,"body":"better,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1130.91,"endTime":1132.44,"body":"though, you know, game makes it"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1132.47,"endTime":1136.16,"body":"much more, you know, you we move"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1132.47,"endTime":1136.16,"body":"away from all the stuff I was"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1136.16,"endTime":1138.5,"body":"just talking about where we"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1136.16,"endTime":1138.5,"body":"actually were looking, we wanted"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1138.5,"endTime":1140.39,"body":"to make sure that that dog is"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1138.5,"endTime":1140.39,"body":"actually comfortable in their"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1140.39,"endTime":1141.92,"body":"environment to do that game."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1142.099,"endTime":1145.429,"body":"It's an observation"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1142.099,"endTime":1145.429,"body":"game, like, just playing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1145.429,"endTime":1148.039,"body":"observation games, there's no"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1145.429,"endTime":1148.039,"body":"pressure on us as trainers."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1148.07,"endTime":1149.63,"body":"Alright, I"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1148.07,"endTime":1149.63,"body":"can't think of a good acronym"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1149.63,"endTime":1156.17,"body":"for that one, either. So. So the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1149.63,"endTime":1156.17,"body":"Speaking of games, let's jump"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1156.17,"endTime":1160.55,"body":"into pattern games and how you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1156.17,"endTime":1160.55,"body":"came up with that. So real"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1160.55,"endTime":1162.65,"body":"quick, what what is pattern"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1160.55,"endTime":1162.65,"body":"games for those that may not"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1162.65,"endTime":1163.28,"body":"have heard of it?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1163.43,"endTime":1167.09,"body":"So I tend to see things"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1163.43,"endTime":1167.09,"body":"in patterns, because I may be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1167.12,"endTime":1172.13,"body":"crazy, but um, it helps animals"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1167.12,"endTime":1172.13,"body":"feel better to know that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1172.13,"endTime":1175.88,"body":"something is predictable that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1172.13,"endTime":1175.88,"body":"there's a structure or a set of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1175.88,"endTime":1181.73,"body":"rules or a script associated"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1175.88,"endTime":1181.73,"body":"with certain contexts. So they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1181.73,"endTime":1187.31,"body":"go, Oh, the clown is arrived."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1181.73,"endTime":1187.31,"body":"Well, that means I'm going to do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1187.31,"endTime":1189.44,"body":"this and then that's going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1187.31,"endTime":1189.44,"body":"happen and then that's gonna"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1189.44,"endTime":1193.1,"body":"happen. So you know, a pattern"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1189.44,"endTime":1193.1,"body":"is just kind of like several"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1193.1,"endTime":1197.75,"body":"things that just keep repeating."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1193.1,"endTime":1197.75,"body":"So that's one aspect of it. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1197.75,"endTime":1201.98,"body":"then you can start kind of Doing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1197.75,"endTime":1201.98,"body":"some environmental exposure to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1201.98,"endTime":1204.86,"body":"various things. But while the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1201.98,"endTime":1204.86,"body":"dog is already operating within"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1204.86,"endTime":1209.39,"body":"a pattern framework, so they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1204.86,"endTime":1209.39,"body":"like, oh my god, I just saw that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1209.39,"endTime":1214.4,"body":"clown. I'm not anti clown"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1209.39,"endTime":1214.4,"body":"really. And now, and but now I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1214.4,"endTime":1217.52,"body":"back to doing these same"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1214.4,"endTime":1217.52,"body":"repetitive three things. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1217.79,"endTime":1220.52,"body":"rather than just walking down"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1217.79,"endTime":1220.52,"body":"the street and seeing another"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1220.52,"endTime":1223.46,"body":"dog and being surprised by that,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1220.52,"endTime":1223.46,"body":"if they're walking down the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1223.46,"endTime":1227.78,"body":"street, within one of these"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1223.46,"endTime":1227.78,"body":"pattern games, okay, they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1227.78,"endTime":1230.93,"body":"already sort of working within a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1227.78,"endTime":1230.93,"body":"framework where they can see"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1230.93,"endTime":1235.76,"body":"something and go, Oh, well, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1230.93,"endTime":1235.76,"body":"that's just part of my pattern."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1235.76,"endTime":1238.43,"body":"During this pattern, I see"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1235.76,"endTime":1238.43,"body":"things and then I turn back and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1238.43,"endTime":1242.06,"body":"I eat and then this happens. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1238.43,"endTime":1242.06,"body":"so it's the way I've given you a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1242.06,"endTime":1244.64,"body":"structure. And I have ones for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1242.06,"endTime":1244.64,"body":"one year moving ones for one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1244.64,"endTime":1248.36,"body":"year, not moving different"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1244.64,"endTime":1248.36,"body":"things you can fit to your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1248.72,"endTime":1249.62,"body":"situation."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1250.339,"endTime":1254.299,"body":"So what and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1250.339,"endTime":1254.299,"body":"Lesley MC debits brain made you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1254.299,"endTime":1258.529,"body":"think of, I'm going to teach"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1254.299,"endTime":1258.529,"body":"patterns to dogs to really help"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1258.529,"endTime":1260.269,"body":"them out, like what was Was"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1258.529,"endTime":1260.269,"body":"there a moment where you're"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1260.269,"endTime":1263.029,"body":"like, This is something I can"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1260.269,"endTime":1263.029,"body":"really incorporate in lots of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1263.029,"endTime":1266.899,"body":"different activities or games,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1263.029,"endTime":1266.899,"body":"or that's going to help dogs"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1266.899,"endTime":1267.259,"body":"out."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1267.32,"endTime":1273.8,"body":"So I think it's about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1267.32,"endTime":1273.8,"body":"that idea of like a portable"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1273.83,"endTime":1280.01,"body":"rule structure. So, you know, my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1273.83,"endTime":1280.01,"body":"mentor was at the behavior"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1280.01,"endTime":1282.26,"body":"department at the University of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1280.01,"endTime":1282.26,"body":"Pennsylvania. Right. And she"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1282.26,"endTime":1286.04,"body":"talked to Dr. Karen, overall,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1282.26,"endTime":1286.04,"body":"veterinary behaviorist, some of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1286.04,"endTime":1290.84,"body":"you know, and she talks a lot"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1286.04,"endTime":1290.84,"body":"about the idea of a rule"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1290.84,"endTime":1294.2,"body":"structure that dogs that are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1290.84,"endTime":1294.2,"body":"anxious, feel better, obviously,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1294.2,"endTime":1298.97,"body":"just like we do, when they know"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1294.2,"endTime":1298.97,"body":"what to expect, her relaxation"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1298.97,"endTime":1303.53,"body":"protocol has a lot to do with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1298.97,"endTime":1303.53,"body":"that, you know, I have a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1303.53,"endTime":1307.67,"body":"lifetime of, of therapy,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1303.53,"endTime":1307.67,"body":"meditation, different things for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1308.12,"endTime":1312.29,"body":"my anxiety, as well as working"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1308.12,"endTime":1312.29,"body":"with anxious dogs, and that idea"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1312.29,"endTime":1314.78,"body":"of a structure. So you see"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1312.29,"endTime":1314.78,"body":"things but you're within a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1314.78,"endTime":1319.04,"body":"framework that is predictable"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1314.78,"endTime":1319.04,"body":"and safe. I just immediately was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1319.04,"endTime":1325.07,"body":"like, oh, and so this idea of,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1319.04,"endTime":1325.07,"body":"of different patterns you can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1325.07,"endTime":1328.28,"body":"use for different contexts is a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1325.07,"endTime":1328.28,"body":"related to that, you know."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1329.0,"endTime":1331.79,"body":"So what I've"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1329.0,"endTime":1331.79,"body":"seen from the pattern games is"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1331.79,"endTime":1335.12,"body":"oftentimes, and I've used it in"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1331.79,"endTime":1335.12,"body":"my own with my own clients, and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1335.12,"endTime":1338.84,"body":"they love it. It's especially"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1335.12,"endTime":1338.84,"body":"useful for when you're out on"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1338.84,"endTime":1341.99,"body":"walks, and you're trying to get"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1338.84,"endTime":1341.99,"body":"a dog by something in the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1341.99,"endTime":1346.19,"body":"standard I've seen is, you know,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1341.99,"endTime":1346.19,"body":"counting 23123, then Treat 123"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1346.19,"endTime":1351.17,"body":"Treat. And so is there any"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1346.19,"endTime":1351.17,"body":"particular framework or rule for"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1351.17,"endTime":1354.77,"body":"like, how many times you count"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1351.17,"endTime":1354.77,"body":"or what words you use, or So"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1354.89,"endTime":1356.18,"body":"walk us through that a little"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1354.89,"endTime":1356.18,"body":"bit more."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1356.81,"endTime":1359.33,"body":"So in terms of a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1356.81,"endTime":1359.33,"body":"pattern, what matters is that it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1359.33,"endTime":1362.78,"body":"is a pattern that both you and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1359.33,"endTime":1362.78,"body":"the animal because it's not just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1362.78,"endTime":1366.35,"body":"dogs, but the both you and the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1362.78,"endTime":1366.35,"body":"animal recognize that it's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1366.35,"endTime":1369.77,"body":"pattern. And from that point on,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1366.35,"endTime":1369.77,"body":"you can make up your own thing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1370.01,"endTime":1374.87,"body":"with the one that you mentioned"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1370.01,"endTime":1374.87,"body":"123. So I just teach dogs that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1374.9,"endTime":1378.5,"body":"if they hear three, it means a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1374.9,"endTime":1378.5,"body":"treats coming. So they're kind"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1378.5,"endTime":1381.56,"body":"of three suddenly has a meaning"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1378.5,"endTime":1381.56,"body":"and a value. And no, it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1381.56,"endTime":1386.42,"body":"have to be three, just three"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1381.56,"endTime":1386.42,"body":"sounds that happen in the same"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1386.93,"endTime":1389.45,"body":"order. That's, you know, I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1386.93,"endTime":1389.45,"body":"saying it doesn't have to be,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1389.78,"endTime":1393.08,"body":"doesn't have to be counting, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1389.78,"endTime":1393.08,"body":"whatever, right? And then I back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1393.08,"endTime":1397.31,"body":"chain it. So I say two, and then"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1393.08,"endTime":1397.31,"body":"I say three, so they're learning"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1397.31,"endTime":1401.33,"body":"and then one, two, so they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1397.31,"endTime":1401.33,"body":"learning if they hear one and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1401.57,"endTime":1404.0,"body":"twos coming. And if they hear"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1401.57,"endTime":1404.0,"body":"twos threes coming in, if they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1404.0,"endTime":1408.38,"body":"hear three, a trade is coming."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1404.0,"endTime":1408.38,"body":"Yeah, I use that one a lot for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1408.62,"endTime":1411.32,"body":"for movement, when you need to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1408.62,"endTime":1411.32,"body":"move from one point to another"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1411.32,"endTime":1416.36,"body":"past something. One thing is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1411.32,"endTime":1416.36,"body":"this idea of a set of rules that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1416.36,"endTime":1420.05,"body":"you can plug the environment"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1416.36,"endTime":1420.05,"body":"into that helps you feel like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1420.05,"endTime":1423.95,"body":"things are predictable. But this"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1420.05,"endTime":1423.95,"body":"is my other big thing. The idea"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1423.95,"endTime":1428.54,"body":"of dogs controlling the game,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1423.95,"endTime":1428.54,"body":"the idea of dogs using behavior"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1428.54,"endTime":1432.59,"body":"to say, I'm ready to do the next"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1428.54,"endTime":1432.59,"body":"wrap. Right? That's like my big"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1432.59,"endTime":1437.06,"body":"thing right now. So with the 123"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1432.59,"endTime":1437.06,"body":"pattern I just mentioned, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1437.06,"endTime":1440.03,"body":"dog is not controlling the next"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1437.06,"endTime":1440.03,"body":"rap. It's pure, like you said,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1440.03,"endTime":1443.75,"body":"Pavlov is on your shoulder, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1440.03,"endTime":1443.75,"body":"heard three, here's a treat. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1443.75,"endTime":1446.3,"body":"then there's another version of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1443.75,"endTime":1446.3,"body":"that pattern, where instead of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1446.3,"endTime":1448.94,"body":"feeding from my hand, I'm going"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1446.3,"endTime":1448.94,"body":"to put the treat on the ground."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1448.97,"endTime":1451.67,"body":"And the reason why is because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1448.97,"endTime":1451.67,"body":"that gives the dog an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1451.67,"endTime":1455.18,"body":"opportunity to look up at me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1451.67,"endTime":1455.18,"body":"like where's my next trait? And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1455.18,"endTime":1459.23,"body":"that's gonna make me start"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1455.18,"endTime":1459.23,"body":"counting 123 again. And so in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1459.23,"endTime":1461.81,"body":"that way, if I'm doing like a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1459.23,"endTime":1461.81,"body":"counter conditioning and say,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1462.38,"endTime":1466.19,"body":"about walking towards something"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1462.38,"endTime":1466.19,"body":"or walking past something, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1466.19,"endTime":1470.0,"body":"dog now has the control to tell"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1466.19,"endTime":1470.0,"body":"me if he wants me to to walk the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1470.0,"endTime":1473.39,"body":"next rep. That doesn't have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1470.0,"endTime":1473.39,"body":"be three steps. I could say one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1473.39,"endTime":1476.78,"body":"and walk five steps. You know"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1473.39,"endTime":1476.78,"body":"what I'm saying? I would start"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1476.78,"endTime":1479.51,"body":"out with three steps. And once"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1476.78,"endTime":1479.51,"body":"they get the idea, they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1479.51,"endTime":1482.27,"body":"trusting that they're hearing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1479.51,"endTime":1482.27,"body":"three, you can walk across the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1482.27,"endTime":1488.12,"body":"whole room and 1123 REP. Okay."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1482.27,"endTime":1488.12,"body":"But in looking up, they have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1488.12,"endTime":1491.24,"body":"signed the contracts with me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1488.12,"endTime":1491.24,"body":"saying like, Yes, I know if I do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1491.24,"endTime":1494.48,"body":"that in this context, you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1491.24,"endTime":1494.48,"body":"gonna move that way. And so"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1494.48,"endTime":1495.62,"body":"that's part of it, too."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1496.28,"endTime":1498.77,"body":"I have"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1496.28,"endTime":1498.77,"body":"additional questions. So the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1499.43,"endTime":1503.72,"body":"Have you ever Seeing there's a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1499.43,"endTime":1503.72,"body":"limit to how many steps are"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1504.11,"endTime":1506.96,"body":"pieces of that pattern? Can you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1504.11,"endTime":1506.96,"body":"count to like 100? For some"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1506.96,"endTime":1510.35,"body":"dogs? Or is there? Have you seen"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1506.96,"endTime":1510.35,"body":"a limitation to how long in that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1510.35,"endTime":1510.68,"body":"pattern?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1510.71,"endTime":1514.25,"body":"Well, it's just three"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1510.71,"endTime":1514.25,"body":"means the treat, see. And then"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1514.25,"endTime":1517.55,"body":"you start over, there's no limit"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1514.25,"endTime":1517.55,"body":"to how many steps you can end up"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1517.55,"endTime":1520.16,"body":"taking in between counting."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1520.76,"endTime":1522.05,"body":"Can you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1520.76,"endTime":1522.05,"body":"count? Well, let's, let's say"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1522.08,"endTime":1526.67,"body":"start with 20. And here's a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1522.08,"endTime":1526.67,"body":"treat 20 years 20? Do you think"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1526.67,"endTime":1528.74,"body":"some dogs will be able to pick"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1526.67,"endTime":1528.74,"body":"up that entire pattern of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1528.74,"endTime":1531.59,"body":"starting from counting from one?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1528.74,"endTime":1531.59,"body":"If you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1531.709,"endTime":1535.249,"body":"Yeah, I don't see why"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1531.709,"endTime":1535.249,"body":"not. I mean, the thing about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1535.249,"endTime":1539.869,"body":"patterns is that like, they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1535.249,"endTime":1539.869,"body":"in nature, like we survive by"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1539.869,"endTime":1543.529,"body":"understanding and predicting"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1539.869,"endTime":1543.529,"body":"them. It's there and animals"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1543.619,"endTime":1548.119,"body":"learn them. I mean, if someone"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1543.619,"endTime":1548.119,"body":"gave me 50 bucks every time they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1548.119,"endTime":1551.719,"body":"said 20, and I figured out that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1548.119,"endTime":1551.719,"body":"certain sounds come before that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1551.719,"endTime":1552.769,"body":"I'm going to notice,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1553.339,"endTime":1556.879,"body":"do you see an"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1553.339,"endTime":1556.879,"body":"issue with the duration between"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1556.909,"endTime":1559.759,"body":"each component of the pattern."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1556.909,"endTime":1559.759,"body":"So if I say, if I'm going across"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1559.759,"endTime":1562.519,"body":"the room, or going past, let's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1559.759,"endTime":1562.519,"body":"say, scary dog, and we're under"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1562.519,"endTime":1564.799,"body":"threshold where to God, we've"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1562.519,"endTime":1564.799,"body":"got enough distance, I'm like,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1564.799,"endTime":1569.509,"body":"right one, and then I pause for"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1564.799,"endTime":1569.509,"body":"a long time to like, take 10"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1569.509,"endTime":1572.569,"body":"steps and pause and then two,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1569.509,"endTime":1572.569,"body":"right and find the third step"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1572.569,"endTime":1575.869,"body":"happens at like, 30 meters in do"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1572.569,"endTime":1575.869,"body":"you see a problem with that?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1576.47,"endTime":1579.86,"body":"I don't, because if I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1576.47,"endTime":1579.86,"body":"gonna do that, the dog is like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1579.86,"endTime":1584.72,"body":"really, the dog is there, I only"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1579.86,"endTime":1584.72,"body":"actually do that when I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1584.72,"endTime":1588.56,"body":"teaching group classes. And dogs"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1584.72,"endTime":1588.56,"body":"have practiced so much that it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1588.56,"endTime":1590.78,"body":"just not a thing. And they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1588.56,"endTime":1590.78,"body":"all passing each other. And they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1590.78,"endTime":1593.84,"body":"no three happens at some point."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1590.78,"endTime":1593.84,"body":"You know, if I'm teaching a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1593.84,"endTime":1597.11,"body":"lesson, I'm not going to take a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1593.84,"endTime":1597.11,"body":"million steps in between things."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1597.56,"endTime":1601.52,"body":"The other day I was, I've been"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1597.56,"endTime":1601.52,"body":"working with a dog that my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1601.52,"endTime":1606.77,"body":"friends have been, they go to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1601.52,"endTime":1606.77,"body":"the Turks and Caicos, and they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1606.77,"endTime":1609.74,"body":"take some island dogs sometimes,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1606.77,"endTime":1609.74,"body":"and I've been working with one."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1610.49,"endTime":1613.31,"body":"The other day, I was always"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1610.49,"endTime":1613.31,"body":"teasing him. I was just saying"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1613.31,"endTime":1616.91,"body":"random stuff. And between"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1613.31,"endTime":1616.91,"body":"counting to make sure I was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1616.91,"endTime":1619.61,"body":"still listening, I was like, one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1616.91,"endTime":1619.61,"body":"and then I was like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1620.69,"endTime":1624.95,"body":"Supercalifragilistic, XBLA. And,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1620.69,"endTime":1624.95,"body":"you know, the owner was a little"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1624.95,"endTime":1629.15,"body":"bit stressful, you know, the dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1624.95,"endTime":1629.15,"body":"is barking and other dogs and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1629.15,"endTime":1631.91,"body":"this and that. But I can see him"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1629.15,"endTime":1631.91,"body":"like kind of smiling because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1631.91,"endTime":1636.47,"body":"he's making up stupid words, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1631.91,"endTime":1636.47,"body":"know? But yeah, if they're not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1636.47,"endTime":1639.11,"body":"listening and waiting for the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1636.47,"endTime":1639.11,"body":"next thing that makes sense, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1639.11,"endTime":1642.29,"body":"is predictable, then they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1639.11,"endTime":1642.29,"body":"over threshold, you have to fix"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1642.29,"endTime":1644.45,"body":"what you're doing. It's that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1642.29,"endTime":1644.45,"body":"simple."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1644.51,"endTime":1645.71,"body":"Either that,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1644.51,"endTime":1645.71,"body":"or they haven't really"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1645.71,"endTime":1649.07,"body":"established the pattern. Right?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1645.71,"endTime":1649.07,"body":"So you're, you're kind of really"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1649.07,"endTime":1653.75,"body":"looking for that. That attentive"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1649.07,"endTime":1653.75,"body":"response. Better description."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1653.87,"endTime":1657.26,"body":"Exactly. This was not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1653.87,"endTime":1657.26,"body":"this was not my intention. But a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1657.26,"endTime":1661.76,"body":"lot of people now are using the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1657.26,"endTime":1661.76,"body":"123 game as part of their recall"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1661.76,"endTime":1666.17,"body":"training. Because when you go,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1661.76,"endTime":1666.17,"body":"one, the dogs have been sniffing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1666.17,"endTime":1669.11,"body":"around or something they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1666.17,"endTime":1669.11,"body":"like, is to coming next."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1672.589,"endTime":1674.359,"body":"How does that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1672.589,"endTime":1674.359,"body":"make you feel that you know, so"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1674.359,"endTime":1678.859,"body":"many of your concepts, they're"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1674.359,"endTime":1678.859,"body":"often taken, borrowed, stolen?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1680.029,"endTime":1686.869,"body":"Credit. Frank and dined. And"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1680.029,"endTime":1686.869,"body":"then adapted to different"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1687.199,"endTime":1690.979,"body":"techniques, some really great"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1687.199,"endTime":1690.979,"body":"ones, some really creative ones,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1690.979,"endTime":1692.839,"body":"and then sometimes some that you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1690.979,"endTime":1692.839,"body":"probably"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1692.99,"endTime":1693.8,"body":"may not have met."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1694.94,"endTime":1697.28,"body":"And but it's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1694.94,"endTime":1697.28,"body":"sometimes you get credited,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1697.28,"endTime":1699.8,"body":"sometimes you don't like what"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1697.28,"endTime":1699.8,"body":"does that make you think in your"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1699.8,"endTime":1702.77,"body":"mind when you see like, maybe on"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1699.8,"endTime":1702.77,"body":"another part of the world you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1702.77,"endTime":1704.78,"body":"traveled to? And and suddenly"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1702.77,"endTime":1704.78,"body":"somebody's talking about your"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1704.78,"endTime":1707.21,"body":"work and controlling these"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1704.78,"endTime":1707.21,"body":"control nation? That is how you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1707.21,"endTime":1709.94,"body":"see it's completely different"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1707.21,"endTime":1709.94,"body":"iteration of what you mentor,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1709.97,"endTime":1712.94,"body":"right? And there's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1709.97,"endTime":1712.94,"body":"like, six translations of the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1712.94,"endTime":1721.43,"body":"original book that I can't read."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1712.94,"endTime":1721.43,"body":"All of you say, No, it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1721.43,"endTime":1726.5,"body":"weird. And I say often, this is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1721.43,"endTime":1726.5,"body":"not written in stone. Like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1726.5,"endTime":1729.5,"body":"what's important here is there's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1726.5,"endTime":1729.5,"body":"a rule structure that you both"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1729.5,"endTime":1735.11,"body":"have agreed to, or whatever. Now"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1729.5,"endTime":1735.11,"body":"do now go and make your thing,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1735.14,"endTime":1738.59,"body":"right. So I want to encourage"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1735.14,"endTime":1738.59,"body":"that being flexible, being"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1738.62,"endTime":1742.13,"body":"creative, right? On the other"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1738.62,"endTime":1742.13,"body":"hand, I don't want people to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1742.13,"endTime":1745.7,"body":"misunderstand it or misrepresent"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1742.13,"endTime":1745.7,"body":"it. So I try to put things out"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1745.7,"endTime":1750.92,"body":"there and be as clear as I can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1745.7,"endTime":1750.92,"body":"and, and all that stuff. So it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1750.95,"endTime":1756.35,"body":"it's a mixed bag. So John,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1750.95,"endTime":1756.35,"body":"giant, unexpected and mixed bag."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1756.44,"endTime":1759.98,"body":"Yeah, and like the recall thing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1756.44,"endTime":1759.98,"body":"with 123. If that's working,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1760.55,"endTime":1764.93,"body":"that's fine. I mean, I do say"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1760.55,"endTime":1764.93,"body":"like, you can use it as a test."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1764.93,"endTime":1768.26,"body":"Like, if you say one, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1764.93,"endTime":1768.26,"body":"they're not looking up."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1769.22,"endTime":1772.22,"body":"Sometimes you say to when they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1769.22,"endTime":1772.22,"body":"do look up, sometimes they don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1772.22,"endTime":1775.79,"body":"look up until you've said three,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1772.22,"endTime":1775.79,"body":"the contract. And that pattern"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1775.79,"endTime":1779.06,"body":"is just when you say three feed,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1775.79,"endTime":1779.06,"body":"that's it. They don't have to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1779.06,"endTime":1782.87,"body":"doing anything else. But if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1779.06,"endTime":1782.87,"body":"you're using it for a recall,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1782.87,"endTime":1787.1,"body":"and you want one to mean Come,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1782.87,"endTime":1787.1,"body":"something has to happen after"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1787.1,"endTime":1790.7,"body":"you've said why you know what I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1787.1,"endTime":1790.7,"body":"mean? So, yeah, use it but you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1790.7,"endTime":1794.27,"body":"have to, you have to know what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1790.7,"endTime":1794.27,"body":"you're doing and make it to make"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1794.27,"endTime":1796.1,"body":"it fair and to make it work."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1796.64,"endTime":1799.07,"body":"Yeah, one"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1796.64,"endTime":1799.07,"body":"really cool adaptation I've seen"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1799.07,"endTime":1804.59,"body":"is with Dr. Linlin cows, when"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1799.07,"endTime":1804.59,"body":"she's using it for care,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1804.619,"endTime":1811.219,"body":"yes, she is. She's one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1804.619,"endTime":1811.219,"body":"of my mentees. And I love when I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1811.309,"endTime":1814.249,"body":"mentor people, and then I shove"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1811.309,"endTime":1814.249,"body":"them out there and make them"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1814.249,"endTime":1815.779,"body":"present on their stuff."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1816.5,"endTime":1818.66,"body":"Yeah, she's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1816.5,"endTime":1818.66,"body":"doing a great job on social"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1818.66,"endTime":1822.47,"body":"media to posting our work with"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1818.66,"endTime":1822.47,"body":"that. So shout out to Linlin."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1822.5,"endTime":1826.91,"body":"Yes. Also, another one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1822.5,"endTime":1826.91,"body":"of my mentees, both of them are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1826.94,"endTime":1829.73,"body":"certified to be controlling"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1826.94,"endTime":1829.73,"body":"relation structures, Linlin and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1829.76,"endTime":1834.02,"body":"Amy, Gavin Glasgow was the other"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1829.76,"endTime":1834.02,"body":"one. She started doing a lot of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1834.05,"endTime":1837.92,"body":"muscle training with 123, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1834.05,"endTime":1837.92,"body":"know, and then three, and then"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1837.92,"endTime":1841.97,"body":"the muzzle goes on. And then a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1837.92,"endTime":1841.97,"body":"treat. And then Linlin has done"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1842.3,"endTime":1845.18,"body":"a tremendous amount of work on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1842.3,"endTime":1845.18,"body":"all the cooperative care stuff"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1845.18,"endTime":1849.92,"body":"using putting cooperative care"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1845.18,"endTime":1849.92,"body":"into the context of of a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1849.92,"endTime":1853.64,"body":"pattern. And so that's, that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1849.92,"endTime":1853.64,"body":"super cool. I love that."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1853.97,"endTime":1856.34,"body":"Yeah, it is."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1853.97,"endTime":1856.34,"body":"It's awesome to see, we're gonna"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1856.34,"endTime":1859.61,"body":"take a short break, and we're"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1856.34,"endTime":1859.61,"body":"gonna jump right back into some"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1859.61,"endTime":1863.87,"body":"other concepts like cooperative"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1859.61,"endTime":1863.87,"body":"counter conditioning. Take a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1863.87,"endTime":1871.31,"body":"break. We'll be right back. Hey,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1863.87,"endTime":1871.31,"body":"friends, it's me again. And I"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1871.31,"endTime":1873.98,"body":"hope you are enjoying this"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1871.31,"endTime":1873.98,"body":"episode, you may have figured"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1873.98,"endTime":1876.92,"body":"out that something I deeply care"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1873.98,"endTime":1876.92,"body":"about is helping dogs with"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1876.92,"endTime":1881.03,"body":"aggression issues live less"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1876.92,"endTime":1881.03,"body":"stressful, less confined, more"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1881.03,"endTime":1883.88,"body":"enriched, and overall happy"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1881.03,"endTime":1883.88,"body":"lives with their guardians."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1884.27,"endTime":1887.09,"body":"Aggression is so often"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1884.27,"endTime":1887.09,"body":"misunderstood. And we can change"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1887.09,"endTime":1889.67,"body":"that through continued"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1887.09,"endTime":1889.67,"body":"education, like we received from"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1889.67,"endTime":1893.0,"body":"so many of the wonderful guests"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1889.67,"endTime":1893.0,"body":"on this podcast. In addition to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1893.0,"endTime":1895.52,"body":"the podcast, I have two other"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1893.0,"endTime":1895.52,"body":"opportunities for anyone looking"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1895.52,"endTime":1898.31,"body":"to learn more about helping dogs"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1895.52,"endTime":1898.31,"body":"with aggression issues, which"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1898.31,"endTime":1900.8,"body":"include the aggression in dogs"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1898.31,"endTime":1900.8,"body":"master course, and the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1900.8,"endTime":1903.74,"body":"aggression in dogs conference."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1900.8,"endTime":1903.74,"body":"If you want to learn more about"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1903.74,"endTime":1906.26,"body":"the most comprehensive course on"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1903.74,"endTime":1906.26,"body":"aggression toward anywhere in"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1906.26,"endTime":1909.83,"body":"the world, head on over to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1906.26,"endTime":1909.83,"body":"aggressive dog.com and click on"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1909.83,"endTime":1913.88,"body":"the dog pros tab, and then the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1909.83,"endTime":1913.88,"body":"master course. The course gives"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1913.88,"endTime":1917.09,"body":"you access to 23 modules on"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1913.88,"endTime":1917.09,"body":"everything from assessment to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1917.09,"endTime":1921.29,"body":"safety to medical issues to the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1917.09,"endTime":1921.29,"body":"behavior change plans we often"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1921.29,"endTime":1924.35,"body":"use in a number of different"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1921.29,"endTime":1924.35,"body":"cases, including lessons taught"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1924.35,"endTime":1928.43,"body":"by Dr. Chris pockle. Kim Brophy"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1924.35,"endTime":1928.43,"body":"in Jessica Dolce. You'll also"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1928.43,"endTime":1931.49,"body":"receive access to a private"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1928.43,"endTime":1931.49,"body":"Facebook group with over 1000 of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1931.49,"endTime":1934.67,"body":"your fellow colleagues, and dog"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1931.49,"endTime":1934.67,"body":"pros all working with aggression"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1934.67,"endTime":1938.18,"body":"cases. After you finish the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1934.67,"endTime":1938.18,"body":"course you also gain access to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1938.18,"endTime":1941.54,"body":"private live group mentor"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1938.18,"endTime":1941.54,"body":"sessions with me where we work"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1941.54,"endTime":1944.51,"body":"through practicing many"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1941.54,"endTime":1944.51,"body":"different cases together. If you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1944.51,"endTime":1947.63,"body":"need see us, we've got you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1944.51,"endTime":1947.63,"body":"covered. We're approved for just"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1947.63,"endTime":1950.21,"body":"about every major training and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1947.63,"endTime":1950.21,"body":"behavior credential out there."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1950.54,"endTime":1953.45,"body":"This is truly the flagship"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1950.54,"endTime":1953.45,"body":"course offered on aggression in"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1953.45,"endTime":1956.45,"body":"dogs, and it's perfect for pet"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1953.45,"endTime":1956.45,"body":"pros that want to set themselves"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1956.45,"endTime":1959.57,"body":"apart and take their knowledge"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1956.45,"endTime":1959.57,"body":"and expertise to the next level"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1959.78,"endTime":1962.57,"body":"or even for pet owners who are"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1959.78,"endTime":1962.57,"body":"seeking information to help your"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1962.57,"endTime":1965.6,"body":"own dog. And don't forget to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1962.57,"endTime":1965.6,"body":"join me for the third annual"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1965.6,"endTime":1969.59,"body":"aggression in dogs conference"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1965.6,"endTime":1969.59,"body":"either in person or mine from"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1969.59,"endTime":1972.05,"body":"Providence, Rhode Island on"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1969.59,"endTime":1972.05,"body":"September 30 Through October"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":1972.05,"endTime":1976.07,"body":"2 2022. 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Wolf"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2009.01,"endTime":2012.55,"body":"culture is known for their"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2012.55,"endTime":2015.79,"body":"witty, nerdy, endo nonsense"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2012.55,"endTime":2015.79,"body":"apparel that was created in"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2015.79,"endTime":2019.9,"body":"2019. To spread more awareness"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2015.79,"endTime":2019.9,"body":"towards the use of humane"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2019.9,"endTime":2023.14,"body":"training methods. Their powerful"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2019.9,"endTime":2023.14,"body":"is here to help you start"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2023.14,"endTime":2027.22,"body":"conversations, advocate for your"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2023.14,"endTime":2027.22,"body":"animals and rep force retraining"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2027.25,"endTime":2030.4,"body":"in a different way. Don't forget"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2027.25,"endTime":2030.4,"body":"to get your conference gear, it"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2030.4,"endTime":2035.65,"body":"leaves the site after 1231 2022."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2030.4,"endTime":2035.65,"body":"If you want 10% off your order,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2035.68,"endTime":2041.71,"body":"use the code bitey 10, bi t y"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2035.68,"endTime":2041.71,"body":"one zero at checkout."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2048.099,"endTime":2050.829,"body":"All right, we're back here with"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2048.099,"endTime":2050.829,"body":"the one and only Leslie"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2050.829,"endTime":2054.369,"body":"McDevitt. And we are going to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2050.829,"endTime":2054.369,"body":"jump into some more concepts or"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2054.369,"endTime":2058.029,"body":"games that we've been calling"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2054.369,"endTime":2058.029,"body":"them. And one that we Lesley and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2058.029,"endTime":2061.359,"body":"I were chatting about probably a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2058.029,"endTime":2061.359,"body":"couple of years back was this"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2061.359,"endTime":2066.369,"body":"concept of cooperative counter"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2061.359,"endTime":2066.369,"body":"conditioning. And it's really an"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2066.369,"endTime":2069.099,"body":"awesome thing for especially for"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2066.369,"endTime":2069.099,"body":"intra household Dog Dog"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2069.099,"endTime":2072.219,"body":"aggression cases, dogs"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2069.099,"endTime":2072.219,"body":"interesting over resources,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2072.429,"endTime":2075.369,"body":"certainly something I've used."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2072.429,"endTime":2075.369,"body":"And I've seen some of your work"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2075.369,"endTime":2077.499,"body":"doing it. So let's talk more"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2075.369,"endTime":2077.499,"body":"about that. First. Again, the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2077.499,"endTime":2080.649,"body":"quick definition of what it is"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2077.499,"endTime":2080.649,"body":"and just in case anybody hasn't"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2080.649,"endTime":2081.339,"body":"heard about it."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2081.849,"endTime":2084.879,"body":"Okay, well, counter"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2081.849,"endTime":2084.879,"body":"conditioning just means you want"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2084.879,"endTime":2087.399,"body":"to change with how the dog is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2084.879,"endTime":2087.399,"body":"feeling about a certain thing."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2087.669,"endTime":2091.539,"body":"Right? So you want to change"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2087.669,"endTime":2091.539,"body":"their association with what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2091.539,"endTime":2096.459,"body":"happens when they experienced"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2091.539,"endTime":2096.459,"body":"that thing. And cooperative"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2096.489,"endTime":2100.509,"body":"meaning that you and the animal"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2096.489,"endTime":2100.509,"body":"have signed a con trying to like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2100.509,"endTime":2102.729,"body":"certain things are gonna happen"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2100.509,"endTime":2102.729,"body":"and they're okay with it, they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2102.729,"endTime":2106.719,"body":"can even direct it, they can do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2102.729,"endTime":2106.719,"body":"a certain behavior, like in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2106.749,"endTime":2110.529,"body":"context of animal husbandry,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2106.749,"endTime":2110.529,"body":"let's say nail trimming, right?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2110.679,"endTime":2114.759,"body":"Cooperative nail trimming. Or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2110.679,"endTime":2114.759,"body":"you can use the word voluntary"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2114.819,"endTime":2118.449,"body":"to mean the same thing, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2114.819,"endTime":2118.449,"body":"know, the dogs, sticks his paw"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2118.449,"endTime":2120.759,"body":"out. And that means you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2118.449,"endTime":2120.759,"body":"allowed to clip a nail, and then"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2120.759,"endTime":2124.149,"body":"you maybe put a tree on the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2120.759,"endTime":2124.149,"body":"ground. And each that sticks as"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2124.149,"endTime":2127.089,"body":"Paul back out, you're allowed to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2124.149,"endTime":2127.089,"body":"clip the second nail. So, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2127.089,"endTime":2129.909,"body":"know, which is is kind of a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2127.089,"endTime":2129.909,"body":"pattern, you know, things start"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2129.909,"endTime":2133.359,"body":"to feel like a pattern, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2129.909,"endTime":2133.359,"body":"predictable, and the dog can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2133.389,"endTime":2138.609,"body":"direct it with some some kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2133.389,"endTime":2138.609,"body":"behavior that has been agreed"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2138.609,"endTime":2141.609,"body":"on, it's going to start the next"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2138.609,"endTime":2141.609,"body":"loop. So cooperative counter"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2141.609,"endTime":2144.879,"body":"conditioning is just the dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2141.609,"endTime":2144.879,"body":"gets to say, yes, let's do the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2144.879,"endTime":2149.649,"body":"next counter conditioning piece"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2144.879,"endTime":2149.649,"body":"of this. So you know, in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2149.649,"endTime":2152.589,"body":"context of like, 123, pattern"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2149.649,"endTime":2152.589,"body":"game that we're talking about,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2152.619,"endTime":2155.949,"body":"the dog looks up at you that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2152.619,"endTime":2155.949,"body":"makes you do the next 123,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2156.219,"endTime":2159.129,"body":"that's gonna end in a treat, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2156.219,"endTime":2159.129,"body":"then that gives the dog the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2159.129,"endTime":2162.549,"body":"chance to look up at you again."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2159.129,"endTime":2162.549,"body":"And if they don't, they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2162.549,"endTime":2164.259,"body":"looking around, they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2162.549,"endTime":2164.259,"body":"sniffing, they're doing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2164.259,"endTime":2167.109,"body":"something else, you're not gonna"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2164.259,"endTime":2167.109,"body":"go in that direction, you can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2167.109,"endTime":2170.289,"body":"wait for them, you could turn"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2167.109,"endTime":2170.289,"body":"around and walk in a different"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2170.469,"endTime":2174.219,"body":"direction to see if they needed"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2170.469,"endTime":2174.219,"body":"more distance, or whatever. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2174.219,"endTime":2178.119,"body":"the contract was, if you look at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2174.219,"endTime":2178.119,"body":"me, after I put a treat on the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2178.119,"endTime":2181.449,"body":"ground, then I'm going to start"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2178.119,"endTime":2181.449,"body":"counting. And I'm going to go in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2181.449,"endTime":2183.879,"body":"this direction, because it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2181.449,"endTime":2183.879,"body":"thrash and we're facing. And if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2183.879,"endTime":2187.929,"body":"you don't, I'm not. And so"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2183.879,"endTime":2187.929,"body":"that's what I mean, when I say"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2187.929,"endTime":2192.309,"body":"cooperative counter conditioning"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2187.929,"endTime":2192.309,"body":"is that it's easy to set the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2192.309,"endTime":2196.389,"body":"pattern games so that the dogs"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2192.309,"endTime":2196.389,"body":"can direct it. And I like to use"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2196.389,"endTime":2201.159,"body":"attention, as you know, a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2196.389,"endTime":2201.159,"body":"behavior, it doesn't have to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2201.159,"endTime":2204.459,"body":"eye contact, but just kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2201.159,"endTime":2204.459,"body":"like looking up just being"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2204.489,"endTime":2207.519,"body":"oriented towards you being"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2204.489,"endTime":2207.519,"body":"relational with you. If the dogs"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2207.519,"endTime":2211.749,"body":"not doing that, they're, they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2207.519,"endTime":2211.749,"body":"not, they're not in the game. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2211.779,"endTime":2215.499,"body":"I'm not going to continue the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2211.779,"endTime":2215.499,"body":"pattern. So that's what I mean,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2215.529,"endTime":2218.799,"body":"that's what I'm using it for."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2215.529,"endTime":2218.799,"body":"And I stole it from the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2218.799,"endTime":2222.759,"body":"husbandry people, the idea of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2218.799,"endTime":2222.759,"body":"cooperative care, right, because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2222.759,"endTime":2227.499,"body":"I love that stuff. But um, my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2222.759,"endTime":2227.499,"body":"focus is on like anxiety about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2227.559,"endTime":2230.199,"body":"like, social anxiety, not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2227.559,"endTime":2230.199,"body":"anxiety about getting your nails"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2230.229,"endTime":2233.589,"body":"trimmed, or whatever. So I took"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2230.229,"endTime":2233.589,"body":"it and said, How am I going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2233.949,"endTime":2236.799,"body":"explain this to people that the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2233.949,"endTime":2236.799,"body":"dogs can be in control?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2236.89,"endTime":2239.2,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2236.89,"endTime":2239.2,"body":"exactly. So sort of also may be"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2239.2,"endTime":2242.26,"body":"referred to as Start Button"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2239.2,"endTime":2242.26,"body":"behavior, or basically the dog"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2242.26,"endTime":2244.45,"body":"communicating I'm, as you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2242.26,"endTime":2244.45,"body":"mentioned, ready to go to the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2244.45,"endTime":2248.44,"body":"next step or ready for this next"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2244.45,"endTime":2248.44,"body":"thing to happen in this world."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2248.65,"endTime":2251.68,"body":"And, you know, we were talking"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2248.65,"endTime":2251.68,"body":"also about how we can use that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2251.68,"endTime":2254.77,"body":"for dogs that are competing for"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2251.68,"endTime":2254.77,"body":"resources. So, you know, if we"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2254.77,"endTime":2257.38,"body":"think about the sort of the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2254.77,"endTime":2257.38,"body":"history or the timeline of how"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2257.38,"endTime":2259.9,"body":"we used to approach this, you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2257.38,"endTime":2259.9,"body":"know, way back in the day be"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2259.9,"endTime":2262.0,"body":"like, alright, two dogs are"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2259.9,"endTime":2262.0,"body":"fighting over bones or something"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2262.0,"endTime":2269.65,"body":"like that. So that's going way"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2262.0,"endTime":2269.65,"body":"back, or maybe, maybe not so"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2269.65,"endTime":2274.18,"body":"much. cases, but the, you know,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2269.65,"endTime":2274.18,"body":"we, we would say, Okay, you guys"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2274.21,"endTime":2276.31,"body":"just want to separate you guys"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2274.21,"endTime":2276.31,"body":"while you're eating your bones,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2276.31,"endTime":2279.22,"body":"problem solved. And then we got"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2276.31,"endTime":2279.22,"body":"to let's teach you guys to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2279.22,"endTime":2281.68,"body":"station aren't going just you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2279.22,"endTime":2281.68,"body":"know, you can be near each"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2281.68,"endTime":2283.75,"body":"other, we're just gonna make"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2281.68,"endTime":2283.75,"body":"sure you guys stay in your own"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2283.75,"endTime":2287.53,"body":"places, then we maybe start to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2283.75,"endTime":2287.53,"body":"add an element of classical"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2287.56,"endTime":2290.53,"body":"conditioning, classical"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2287.56,"endTime":2290.53,"body":"conditioning, where you're"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2290.53,"endTime":2292.81,"body":"chewing on your bone, the other"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2290.53,"endTime":2292.81,"body":"dog enters his room and good"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2292.81,"endTime":2296.14,"body":"stuff happens, you know. So Mark"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2292.81,"endTime":2296.14,"body":"treats happen when you see dog B"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2296.14,"endTime":2298.81,"body":"in the room, and then dog B"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2296.14,"endTime":2298.81,"body":"leaves into the treat. Stop. So"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2299.08,"endTime":2302.86,"body":"and then you came in with all"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2299.08,"endTime":2302.86,"body":"right, I'm going to teach you to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2302.86,"endTime":2306.55,"body":"meaning dog a right Give me some"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2302.86,"endTime":2306.55,"body":"stuff on behavior that says you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2306.55,"endTime":2309.37,"body":"want dog B to approach Yes,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2306.55,"endTime":2309.37,"body":"that's going to produce a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2309.37,"endTime":2313.36,"body":"reinforcer for, again, your"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2309.37,"endTime":2313.36,"body":"brilliant mind. Always thinking"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2313.36,"endTime":2317.86,"body":"outside the box. Like you come"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2313.36,"endTime":2317.86,"body":"up with so much stuff, I don't"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2317.86,"endTime":2321.82,"body":"think you even remember"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2317.86,"endTime":2321.82,"body":"sometimes. We talk about we"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2321.82,"endTime":2327.25,"body":"shoot a lot of ideas back and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2321.82,"endTime":2327.25,"body":"forth. But you, you you had we"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2327.25,"endTime":2329.11,"body":"talked about this last year"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2327.25,"endTime":2329.11,"body":"again, or maybe it was even"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2329.11,"endTime":2332.68,"body":"before that, but so let's talk"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2329.11,"endTime":2332.68,"body":"more about that. I pulled that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2332.68,"endTime":2335.62,"body":"voluntary sharing, voluntary"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2332.68,"endTime":2335.62,"body":"sharing. Yeah, so I've messed up"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2335.62,"endTime":2343.21,"body":"my acronyms, but there's no"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2335.62,"endTime":2343.21,"body":"acronym for that. vs. Yeah. So,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2343.66,"endTime":2346.6,"body":"yeah, voluntary sharing where so"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2343.66,"endTime":2346.6,"body":"let's talk more about that,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2346.63,"endTime":2348.01,"body":"where it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2348.13,"endTime":2352.42,"body":"like the dog dog, as a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2348.13,"endTime":2352.42,"body":"working dog tell you to give a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2352.42,"endTime":2356.65,"body":"resource to the helper dog."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2352.42,"endTime":2356.65,"body":"Because if you're in control,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2356.68,"endTime":2360.85,"body":"you feel better. And also, once"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2356.68,"endTime":2360.85,"body":"that the helper dog has the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2360.85,"endTime":2365.17,"body":"resource, then the working dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2360.85,"endTime":2365.17,"body":"will also get one. That's how he"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2365.17,"endTime":2368.71,"body":"gets one, right by telling you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2365.17,"endTime":2368.71,"body":"to go ahead and give one to the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2368.71,"endTime":2372.91,"body":"other one. Yeah, so yeah, works"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2368.71,"endTime":2372.91,"body":"great. Also, it's funny."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2374.2,"endTime":2377.59,"body":"Basically, I come up with things"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2374.2,"endTime":2377.59,"body":"that are going to make me laugh,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2377.89,"endTime":2381.52,"body":"like telling me to give treats"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2377.89,"endTime":2381.52,"body":"to another dog."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2383.59,"endTime":2385.87,"body":"Or we pick"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2383.59,"endTime":2385.87,"body":"about dogs actually sharing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2386.23,"endTime":2389.89,"body":"Yes, it's very cute and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2386.23,"endTime":2389.89,"body":"or like a dog telling you to pet"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2389.89,"endTime":2393.4,"body":"the cat that used to chase the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2389.89,"endTime":2393.4,"body":"cat. Now, you know, does a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2393.4,"endTime":2396.04,"body":"voluntary behavior tells you you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2393.4,"endTime":2396.04,"body":"can pet the cat you know just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2396.07,"endTime":2398.11,"body":"stuff like that and you're like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2396.07,"endTime":2398.11,"body":"what?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2398.38,"endTime":2400.0,"body":"Alright, so"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2398.38,"endTime":2400.0,"body":"some of the listeners are proud"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2400.0,"endTime":2402.46,"body":"Are we thinking alright, so what"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2400.0,"endTime":2402.46,"body":"does this look like when you do"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2402.46,"endTime":2405.4,"body":"it or you start training this."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2402.46,"endTime":2405.4,"body":"So describe that let's use the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2405.4,"endTime":2407.86,"body":"cat as the example. And you've"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2405.4,"endTime":2407.86,"body":"got a dog that formerly was"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2407.86,"endTime":2410.26,"body":"jealous about the cat being pet,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2407.86,"endTime":2410.26,"body":"so would come over and maybe"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2410.53,"endTime":2414.64,"body":"push their nose in or worse, and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2410.53,"endTime":2414.64,"body":"try to get you away from the cat"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2414.64,"endTime":2417.37,"body":"when they see you petting the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2414.64,"endTime":2417.37,"body":"cat. So what do you do for that?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2417.37,"endTime":2418.54,"body":"What does the setup look like?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2418.99,"endTime":2423.16,"body":"So, especially if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2418.99,"endTime":2423.16,"body":"you've already trained a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2423.16,"endTime":2428.59,"body":"behavior for like cooperative"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2423.16,"endTime":2428.59,"body":"husbandry type work, a big one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2428.59,"endTime":2432.19,"body":"that people trained for that is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2428.59,"endTime":2432.19,"body":"a chin rest. So the animal puts"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2432.19,"endTime":2435.49,"body":"their head down on something,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2432.19,"endTime":2435.49,"body":"whether it's your hand, I'll"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2435.49,"endTime":2439.69,"body":"train it to a hand or a target"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2435.49,"endTime":2439.69,"body":"object, because for voluntary"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2439.69,"endTime":2445.0,"body":"sharing, you want the animal to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2439.69,"endTime":2445.0,"body":"cue you. And so if you're using"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2445.0,"endTime":2448.78,"body":"your hand as a chin rest, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2445.0,"endTime":2448.78,"body":"you take your hand away, because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2448.78,"endTime":2451.51,"body":"you're feeding them, and you put"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2448.78,"endTime":2451.51,"body":"your hand back out, you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2451.51,"endTime":2454.12,"body":"telling the dog, I've stuck my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2451.51,"endTime":2454.12,"body":"hand out, you can, you should"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2454.12,"endTime":2458.14,"body":"put your chin on it. So you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2454.12,"endTime":2458.14,"body":"know, I don't want that I want"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2458.14,"endTime":2461.98,"body":"something as a target to be out"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2458.14,"endTime":2461.98,"body":"the whole time. So you know, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2461.98,"endTime":2464.89,"body":"dog puts their chin on it. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2461.98,"endTime":2464.89,"body":"what I'll do is feed the dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2464.92,"endTime":2467.47,"body":"away from the target, so they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2464.92,"endTime":2467.47,"body":"have to go back there put their"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2467.47,"endTime":2470.53,"body":"chin on. And again, it's like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2467.47,"endTime":2470.53,"body":"pressing a button to say, do it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2470.53,"endTime":2473.92,"body":"again. And so you know, I'll"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2470.53,"endTime":2473.92,"body":"train duration of that, they'll"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2473.92,"endTime":2477.16,"body":"learn to stay for a certain"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2473.92,"endTime":2477.16,"body":"amount of seconds with their"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2477.16,"endTime":2480.91,"body":"chin resting on something. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2477.16,"endTime":2480.91,"body":"also really liked that behavior"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2480.91,"endTime":2484.87,"body":"because their mouth is closed,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2480.91,"endTime":2484.87,"body":"that could be lying down while"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2484.87,"endTime":2489.1,"body":"they're doing it's calm. They"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2484.87,"endTime":2489.1,"body":"learn to wait. So they hear a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2489.1,"endTime":2492.97,"body":"click, and then put a trade out,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2489.1,"endTime":2492.97,"body":"right. And so that's how a lot"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2492.97,"endTime":2496.03,"body":"of people would start with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2492.97,"endTime":2496.03,"body":"Cooperative husbandry, the dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2496.03,"endTime":2499.27,"body":"puts their chin down, and maybe"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2496.03,"endTime":2499.27,"body":"you pet them, and give them a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2499.27,"endTime":2502.06,"body":"tray. And then the padding,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2499.27,"endTime":2502.06,"body":"you're going to turn it into"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2502.06,"endTime":2507.1,"body":"like some light brushing and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2502.06,"endTime":2507.1,"body":"whatever else, right. And if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2507.1,"endTime":2511.09,"body":"they move out of position, they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2507.1,"endTime":2511.09,"body":"break their chin rice before you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2511.09,"endTime":2516.58,"body":"were done and you stop. So So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2511.09,"endTime":2516.58,"body":"that's one way you could do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2516.58,"endTime":2520.51,"body":"voluntary sharing is you you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2516.58,"endTime":2520.51,"body":"teach a behavior like like a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2520.51,"endTime":2524.5,"body":"chin rest, it doesn't have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2520.51,"endTime":2524.5,"body":"be. And then I teach them, I'll"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2524.5,"endTime":2528.34,"body":"get two bowls out. Now, I don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2524.5,"endTime":2528.34,"body":"even know that I had that idea"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2528.34,"endTime":2530.53,"body":"back when I presented it for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2528.34,"endTime":2530.53,"body":"aggression in dogs. Like at the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2530.53,"endTime":2534.25,"body":"first conference, I talked about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2530.53,"endTime":2534.25,"body":"this. But now what I'm doing is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2534.25,"endTime":2538.12,"body":"I'm putting, I'm putting one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2534.25,"endTime":2538.12,"body":"bowl out. So the dog does their"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2538.45,"endTime":2543.49,"body":"voluntary behavior, and I put a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2538.45,"endTime":2543.49,"body":"kibble in their bowl. And then"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2543.49,"endTime":2546.91,"body":"after a bunch of reps of that I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2543.49,"endTime":2546.91,"body":"take a second bowl, there's no"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2546.91,"endTime":2549.7,"body":"helper animal yet or anything."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2546.91,"endTime":2549.7,"body":"But I have a second bowl, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2549.7,"endTime":2553.06,"body":"dog does the voluntary behavior."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2549.7,"endTime":2553.06,"body":"And I put a kibble in the second"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2553.06,"endTime":2556.57,"body":"bowl, and then I put one in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2553.06,"endTime":2556.57,"body":"their bowl, since then the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2556.57,"endTime":2560.59,"body":"behavior is starting to say, put"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2556.57,"endTime":2560.59,"body":"one in this other bowl, that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2560.59,"endTime":2565.84,"body":"not mine. And then I know that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2560.59,"endTime":2565.84,"body":"mine's next. So now I've added"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2565.84,"endTime":2570.07,"body":"that element in. And then from"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2565.84,"endTime":2570.07,"body":"that point, you could add in a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2570.07,"endTime":2575.23,"body":"helper animal at whatever"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2570.07,"endTime":2575.23,"body":"distance it is. And I might have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2575.23,"endTime":2579.04,"body":"them for example, not even"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2575.23,"endTime":2579.04,"body":"taking the treat, but just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2579.04,"endTime":2582.61,"body":"sitting at a distance, and I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2579.04,"endTime":2582.61,"body":"still putting a treat in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2582.61,"endTime":2586.27,"body":"other bowl, and then the working"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2582.61,"endTime":2586.27,"body":"dog bowl, you know, and then"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2586.27,"endTime":2590.62,"body":"maybe I'll put the bowl closer"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2586.27,"endTime":2590.62,"body":"to the helper dog, you can have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2590.62,"endTime":2592.84,"body":"steps, it doesn't have to be you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2590.62,"endTime":2592.84,"body":"do this and I'm immediately"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2592.84,"endTime":2595.33,"body":"going to feed this dog, it could"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2592.84,"endTime":2595.33,"body":"be on a put a bowl of this dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2595.33,"endTime":2598.09,"body":"is across the room, it depends"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2595.33,"endTime":2598.09,"body":"on the dogs that you have in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2598.09,"endTime":2601.33,"body":"front of you. But yeah,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2598.09,"endTime":2601.33,"body":"ultimately it's the working dog"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2601.33,"endTime":2605.2,"body":"is going to put their chin down"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2601.33,"endTime":2605.2,"body":"or do some other behavior. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2605.2,"endTime":2609.34,"body":"you're going to put treats and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2605.2,"endTime":2609.34,"body":"the other dogs thing, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2609.52,"endTime":2612.43,"body":"if guarding bowls is its own"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2609.52,"endTime":2612.43,"body":"thing that needs to be treated"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2612.43,"endTime":2615.4,"body":"separately, you don't have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2612.43,"endTime":2615.4,"body":"put it in a bowl, but it's just,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2615.58,"endTime":2618.13,"body":"I like to have these kinds of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2615.58,"endTime":2618.13,"body":"like visual, I'm going to put a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2618.13,"endTime":2621.25,"body":"treat here. And then I'm going"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2618.13,"endTime":2621.25,"body":"to put one here that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2621.25,"endTime":2623.77,"body":"predictable. And this one's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2621.25,"endTime":2623.77,"body":"going to be yours, you know what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2623.77,"endTime":2627.1,"body":"I mean? Could be a cardboard"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2623.77,"endTime":2627.1,"body":"box, you know, something that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2627.1,"endTime":2631.51,"body":"there's no obvious problematic"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2627.1,"endTime":2631.51,"body":"history with. So that's one way"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2631.51,"endTime":2634.72,"body":"you could do this. That's not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2631.51,"endTime":2634.72,"body":"the only way. That's a way that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2634.72,"endTime":2637.6,"body":"you could do this with what's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2634.72,"endTime":2637.6,"body":"called a duration, duration,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2637.6,"endTime":2640.51,"body":"start button behavior, where the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2637.6,"endTime":2640.51,"body":"dog is doing something like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2640.51,"endTime":2644.2,"body":"resting their chin for sort of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2640.51,"endTime":2644.2,"body":"the whole rap. And it depends on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2644.2,"endTime":2649.24,"body":"what you want. So you could also"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2644.2,"endTime":2649.24,"body":"do a quick behavior, like the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2649.24,"endTime":2652.06,"body":"dog makes eye contact with you."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2649.24,"endTime":2652.06,"body":"And that causes you to put a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2652.06,"endTime":2654.31,"body":"treat in the other bowl. So it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2652.06,"endTime":2654.31,"body":"can be something that happens"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2654.31,"endTime":2657.31,"body":"quickly and it's over. Or it can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2654.31,"endTime":2657.31,"body":"be something that they're really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2657.31,"endTime":2661.78,"body":"kind of doing for duration. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2657.31,"endTime":2661.78,"body":"it's it's kind of depends on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2662.02,"endTime":2665.47,"body":"your skill level, or if you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2662.02,"endTime":2665.47,"body":"working with clients and their"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2665.47,"endTime":2667.63,"body":"skill level, you know, all that."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2667.84,"endTime":2670.75,"body":"So just to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2667.84,"endTime":2670.75,"body":"clarify the chin rest, you want"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2670.75,"endTime":2673.72,"body":"them to remain on the chin rest"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2670.75,"endTime":2673.72,"body":"as that cable goes into the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2673.72,"endTime":2674.71,"body":"second bowl."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2674.92,"endTime":2678.16,"body":"So that's the thing,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2674.92,"endTime":2678.16,"body":"right? Like, you just have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2678.16,"endTime":2683.56,"body":"know how you want things and be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2678.16,"endTime":2683.56,"body":"consistent. So you could have it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2683.56,"endTime":2686.29,"body":"as the dog puts their chin down"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2683.56,"endTime":2686.29,"body":"and then they lifted up as"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2686.29,"endTime":2691.81,"body":"you're feeding the other dog. To"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2686.29,"endTime":2691.81,"body":"me the cleanest, purest. Best"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2691.81,"endTime":2694.75,"body":"way to do it is to teach a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2691.81,"endTime":2694.75,"body":"duration behavior that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2694.75,"endTime":2699.22,"body":"happening the whole time until"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2694.75,"endTime":2699.22,"body":"you put a treat for them and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2699.4,"endTime":2703.24,"body":"they get it It gets, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2699.4,"endTime":2703.24,"body":"that's the cleanest thing. So I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2703.24,"endTime":2706.87,"body":"like to teach my dogs key, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2703.24,"endTime":2706.87,"body":"know, it's a duration behavior."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2707.08,"endTime":2710.65,"body":"So while I'm doing this other"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2707.08,"endTime":2710.65,"body":"thing, I like it, if they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2710.65,"endTime":2714.55,"body":"doing it until they hear some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2710.65,"endTime":2714.55,"body":"cue, that means have this treat."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2714.64,"endTime":2718.09,"body":"But it doesn't have to be that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2714.64,"endTime":2718.09,"body":"you just have to be clean, it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2718.09,"endTime":2720.94,"body":"has to be the same every time."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2718.09,"endTime":2720.94,"body":"You know, it has to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2720.94,"endTime":2724.57,"body":"consistent. It has to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2720.94,"endTime":2724.57,"body":"predictable. That's all. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2724.57,"endTime":2730.15,"body":"then if they move out of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2724.57,"endTime":2730.15,"body":"position before the next loop"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2730.15,"endTime":2734.95,"body":"starts, I'm going to feed that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2730.15,"endTime":2734.95,"body":"to, because otherwise it's not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2734.98,"endTime":2737.59,"body":"like they're, they're able to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2734.98,"endTime":2737.59,"body":"say yes or no, if they're only"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2737.59,"endTime":2741.64,"body":"getting fed for Yes, right. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2737.59,"endTime":2741.64,"body":"what I'm going to do is I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2741.64,"endTime":2744.52,"body":"going to, I'm going to feed it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2741.64,"endTime":2744.52,"body":"as a reset trait. So I'm going"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2744.52,"endTime":2748.21,"body":"to put the treat where I would"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2744.52,"endTime":2748.21,"body":"put the treat to move them off"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2748.21,"endTime":2751.72,"body":"the chin rest behavior, they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2748.21,"endTime":2751.72,"body":"going to eat it, and then they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2751.72,"endTime":2755.29,"body":"can decide if they want to put"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2751.72,"endTime":2755.29,"body":"it back or not. And if they do,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2755.35,"endTime":2758.95,"body":"they say, Okay, I'm gonna go"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2755.35,"endTime":2758.95,"body":"again, I need to make sure that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2758.95,"endTime":2763.18,"body":"I've changed the conditions a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2758.95,"endTime":2763.18,"body":"little bit. If I think I know"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2763.21,"endTime":2765.97,"body":"why they stopped doing it, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2763.21,"endTime":2765.97,"body":"know?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2766.87,"endTime":2769.45,"body":"So let me"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2766.87,"endTime":2769.45,"body":"just recap the whole loop then."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2769.45,"endTime":2772.0,"body":"So if we were dealing with a"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2769.45,"endTime":2772.0,"body":"cat, right, and our dog was"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2772.0,"endTime":2775.39,"body":"jealous about the cat being pet,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2772.0,"endTime":2775.39,"body":"we want the dog to offer the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2775.39,"endTime":2778.18,"body":"chin rest, not us cueing it with"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2775.39,"endTime":2778.18,"body":"our hands, right? So the dogs"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2778.18,"endTime":2781.72,"body":"can come over chin rest, which"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2778.18,"endTime":2781.72,"body":"says go pet the cat, right? We"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2781.72,"endTime":2785.26,"body":"pet the cat and then we reduce"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2781.72,"endTime":2785.26,"body":"the reinforcer for the dog. Yes."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2785.62,"endTime":2789.34,"body":"And let's say it's something not"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2785.62,"endTime":2789.34,"body":"like in a football, let's say"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2789.34,"endTime":2794.2,"body":"where we want to work towards"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2789.34,"endTime":2794.2,"body":"those steps of petting the cat."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2794.95,"endTime":2797.86,"body":"That's a little trickier, right?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2794.95,"endTime":2797.86,"body":"Yeah, I wouldn't expect that. Do"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2797.86,"endTime":2800.08,"body":"you make gradual approximations"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2797.86,"endTime":2800.08,"body":"to be like, you can be like"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2800.08,"endTime":2803.62,"body":"Hello Cat or like a cat. And"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2800.08,"endTime":2803.62,"body":"then eventually with the full"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2803.62,"endTime":2805.51,"body":"goal of petting, okay, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2805.51,"endTime":2809.47,"body":"can absolutely do with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2805.51,"endTime":2809.47,"body":"that. And, you know, for some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2809.47,"endTime":2813.07,"body":"dogs, petting them or attention"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2809.47,"endTime":2813.07,"body":"to them can be the reinforcer."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2813.1,"endTime":2816.52,"body":"So it's like, you tell me to pet"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2813.1,"endTime":2816.52,"body":"the cat. And then I'm going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2816.52,"endTime":2820.69,"body":"say hi to you, you know, it can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2816.52,"endTime":2820.69,"body":"be that. And for others, it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2820.69,"endTime":2821.95,"body":"might be a treat, or whatever."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2822.43,"endTime":2825.61,"body":"Do you see"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2822.43,"endTime":2825.61,"body":"situations over resources that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2825.61,"endTime":2828.25,"body":"this wouldn't be appropriate."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2825.61,"endTime":2828.25,"body":"Like, if it's a certain type of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2828.25,"endTime":2831.94,"body":"resource, maybe if it's the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2828.25,"endTime":2831.94,"body":"owner, maybe it's something that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2831.94,"endTime":2834.55,"body":"is not as easy to control on the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2831.94,"endTime":2834.55,"body":"environment."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2834.969,"endTime":2839.049,"body":"Um, I haven't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2834.969,"endTime":2839.049,"body":"personally seen it, but it's not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2839.049,"endTime":2843.399,"body":"like I've been going out, like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2839.049,"endTime":2843.399,"body":"collecting data on everyone"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2843.399,"endTime":2847.299,"body":"that's used this for everything."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2843.399,"endTime":2847.299,"body":"I have worked with a few dogs"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2847.299,"endTime":2850.899,"body":"that guarded their owner, if the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2847.299,"endTime":2850.899,"body":"owner was sitting down, and the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2850.899,"endTime":2854.079,"body":"other dogs in the household came"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2850.899,"endTime":2854.079,"body":"up to see them. And we've used"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2854.079,"endTime":2857.349,"body":"it with that, that the dogs can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2854.079,"endTime":2857.349,"body":"learn to tell you to say hi to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2857.349,"endTime":2862.119,"body":"the other dogs, and then and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2857.349,"endTime":2862.119,"body":"then them. But you know, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2862.119,"endTime":2867.579,"body":"like each case is its own"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2862.119,"endTime":2867.579,"body":"individual thing with its own"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2867.579,"endTime":2873.099,"body":"conditions and what people are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2867.579,"endTime":2873.099,"body":"able to do so you know, never do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2873.099,"endTime":2875.949,"body":"anything that you're not, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2873.099,"endTime":2875.949,"body":"don't feel totally 100%"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2875.949,"endTime":2878.049,"body":"comfortable that you know how to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2875.949,"endTime":2878.049,"body":"set it"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2878.05,"endTime":2880.09,"body":"up,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2878.05,"endTime":2880.09,"body":"especially in aggression cases,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2880.09,"endTime":2884.56,"body":"right? Yeah. I'm picturing. I"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2880.09,"endTime":2884.56,"body":"just had this kind of strange"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2884.56,"endTime":2887.14,"body":"thought in my mind about two"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2884.56,"endTime":2887.14,"body":"dogs if you taught the same"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2887.14,"endTime":2890.92,"body":"thing. And let's say that the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2887.14,"endTime":2890.92,"body":"owner petting them, and they"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2890.92,"endTime":2893.47,"body":"both come over and they just"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2890.92,"endTime":2893.47,"body":"start like rapidfire chin"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2893.47,"endTime":2896.86,"body":"resting. Say, all right, go pet"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2893.47,"endTime":2896.86,"body":"the other dog. No, you bought"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2896.86,"endTime":2897.52,"body":"the other dog."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2898.719,"endTime":2904.869,"body":"It's like, third number"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2898.719,"endTime":2904.869,"body":"that is? Yeah, I mean, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2904.869,"endTime":2908.439,"body":"true, my stuff can put you in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2904.869,"endTime":2908.439,"body":"wacky places like that. So you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2908.439,"endTime":2912.699,"body":"may, you may only want to have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2908.439,"endTime":2912.699,"body":"one dog, my dogs do do a little"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2912.699,"endTime":2916.869,"body":"behaviors to say give it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2912.699,"endTime":2916.869,"body":"straight to the other dog. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2916.869,"endTime":2920.139,"body":"it doesn't like affect our"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2916.869,"endTime":2920.139,"body":"lives. Like my one Border Collie"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2920.379,"endTime":2924.339,"body":"lowers her head slightly,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2920.379,"endTime":2924.339,"body":"because that's her behavior that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2924.339,"endTime":2928.719,"body":"she came up with. That makes me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2924.339,"endTime":2928.719,"body":"do things. But yeah, if it was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2928.719,"endTime":2936.489,"body":"like dangerous, then like, I can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2928.719,"endTime":2936.489,"body":"be maybe Messier in terms of my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2936.489,"endTime":2941.619,"body":"dogs can can offer behavior, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2936.489,"endTime":2941.619,"body":"I can dole out things. And if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2941.619,"endTime":2945.099,"body":"you can't be, then you have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2941.619,"endTime":2945.099,"body":"figure that out. And it may be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2945.099,"endTime":2949.749,"body":"that there's a specific target."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2945.099,"endTime":2949.749,"body":"And if it's not out, they don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2949.749,"endTime":2953.709,"body":"have access to it for a specific"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2949.749,"endTime":2953.709,"body":"thing. But you just have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2953.709,"endTime":2957.249,"body":"figure that out. You know, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2953.709,"endTime":2957.249,"body":"first time I worked with someone"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2957.249,"endTime":2959.739,"body":"that whose dog didn't want the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2957.249,"endTime":2959.739,"body":"other dogs coming up when she"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2959.739,"endTime":2962.589,"body":"was sitting down for attention."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2959.739,"endTime":2962.589,"body":"I had a whole set up with like a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2962.589,"endTime":2966.789,"body":"baby gate and like a red cone"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2962.589,"endTime":2966.789,"body":"and if one dog went to the red"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2966.789,"endTime":2969.489,"body":"cone, the other dog put his head"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2966.789,"endTime":2969.489,"body":"down. You could touch that. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2969.489,"endTime":2972.729,"body":"mean, you know you have to set"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2969.489,"endTime":2972.729,"body":"up. I like to use visual"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2972.729,"endTime":2976.299,"body":"stations, right? See. So you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2972.729,"endTime":2976.299,"body":"know, this dog is going to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2976.299,"endTime":2979.779,"body":"here this dog is going to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2976.299,"endTime":2979.779,"body":"doing that. And I like to have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2980.109,"endTime":2984.159,"body":"gates and whatever management"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2980.109,"endTime":2984.159,"body":"management's fun it's like part"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2984.159,"endTime":2986.799,"body":"of the soul. How you can be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2984.159,"endTime":2986.799,"body":"creative."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2987.4,"endTime":2989.5,"body":"Yeah, and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2987.4,"endTime":2989.5,"body":"that's the fun of training the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2989.5,"endTime":2991.72,"body":"art of training right is setting"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":2989.5,"endTime":2991.72,"body":"the environment is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2991.749,"endTime":2994.449,"body":"that is the art and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2991.749,"endTime":2994.449,"body":"that's also the scary part"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2994.449,"endTime":2998.109,"body":"because I can tell you something"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2994.449,"endTime":2998.109,"body":"on a podcast, but people can't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2998.109,"endTime":3001.829,"body":"see like with their Our"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2998.109,"endTime":3001.829,"body":"individual dog, maybe I would"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3001.829,"endTime":3006.389,"body":"say this and try that. And, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3001.829,"endTime":3006.389,"body":"know, so it's like you have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3006.389,"endTime":3009.179,"body":"take this and then you have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3006.389,"endTime":3009.179,"body":"figure out how this is going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3009.179,"endTime":3012.389,"body":"work for your situation. How are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3009.179,"endTime":3012.389,"body":"you going to set this up?"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3012.51,"endTime":3015.36,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3012.51,"endTime":3015.36,"body":"totally, totally. So I want to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3015.36,"endTime":3021.39,"body":"pick your brain about what you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3015.36,"endTime":3021.39,"body":"have going on for something"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3021.39,"endTime":3023.94,"body":"that's exciting you now some of"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3021.39,"endTime":3023.94,"body":"these new concepts and maybe"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3023.97,"endTime":3029.16,"body":"give us a sneak peek at"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3023.97,"endTime":3029.16,"body":"something. I know you're"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3029.25,"endTime":3032.01,"body":"brainstorming some new games, or"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3029.25,"endTime":3032.01,"body":"maybe you have something that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3032.01,"endTime":3034.74,"body":"you're excited about that you're"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3032.01,"endTime":3034.74,"body":"seeing happening in the dog"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3034.74,"endTime":3037.32,"body":"training community, and putting"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3034.74,"endTime":3037.32,"body":"you on the spot because I know"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3037.32,"endTime":3038.4,"body":"we didn't talk about this at"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3037.32,"endTime":3038.4,"body":"all."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3040.08,"endTime":3042.54,"body":"I mean, frankly, right"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3040.08,"endTime":3042.54,"body":"now I have ducklings. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3042.54,"endTime":3047.52,"body":"looking at ducklings, not the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3042.54,"endTime":3047.52,"body":"dog training community. No, I do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3047.52,"endTime":3050.4,"body":"like looking at, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3047.52,"endTime":3050.4,"body":"working with other species and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3050.4,"endTime":3054.48,"body":"looking at what's happening with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3050.4,"endTime":3054.48,"body":"other things going on. And also"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3054.48,"endTime":3060.42,"body":"like with kids, as far as the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3054.48,"endTime":3060.42,"body":"dog stuff, goes, I'm still just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3060.54,"endTime":3064.71,"body":"really focused on how to make"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3060.54,"endTime":3064.71,"body":"counterconditioning as voluntary"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3064.71,"endTime":3067.38,"body":"as possible and different in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3064.71,"endTime":3067.38,"body":"different ways we can set that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3067.38,"endTime":3072.03,"body":"up, the latte stuff is still"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3067.38,"endTime":3072.03,"body":"pretty new, we've been using it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3072.03,"endTime":3075.93,"body":"at shelters, it's been excellent"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3072.03,"endTime":3075.93,"body":"using it for some socialization"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3075.93,"endTime":3080.73,"body":"that the dogs not sure about a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3075.93,"endTime":3080.73,"body":"new person, or, or whatever. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3080.73,"endTime":3084.96,"body":"so we're having a person kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3080.73,"endTime":3084.96,"body":"shadow, the main handler, so the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3084.96,"endTime":3088.38,"body":"dog looks up, put treats at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3084.96,"endTime":3088.38,"body":"their station goes to the next"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3088.38,"endTime":3091.68,"body":"one, you know. And then the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3088.38,"endTime":3091.68,"body":"other volunteer, the dog isn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3091.68,"endTime":3094.02,"body":"sure about yet is just kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3091.68,"endTime":3094.02,"body":"walking around with them. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3094.02,"endTime":3097.35,"body":"then at some point, they switch"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3094.02,"endTime":3097.35,"body":"places. And so it's a way to let"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3097.35,"endTime":3102.27,"body":"dogs that don't have any prior"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3097.35,"endTime":3102.27,"body":"training or relationship, kind"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3102.27,"endTime":3104.52,"body":"of start building a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3102.27,"endTime":3104.52,"body":"relationship, you know, an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3104.52,"endTime":3106.71,"body":"operant, one where they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3104.52,"endTime":3106.71,"body":"starting to look at the person"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3106.71,"endTime":3109.8,"body":"and getting more confident that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3106.71,"endTime":3109.8,"body":"they can communicate with the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3109.8,"endTime":3112.23,"body":"different volunteers. And that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3109.8,"endTime":3112.23,"body":"going to make them go somewhere"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3112.23,"endTime":3115.74,"body":"else and they get socialized."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3112.23,"endTime":3115.74,"body":"During it, you can add talking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3115.74,"endTime":3120.15,"body":"and touching into once you have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3115.74,"endTime":3120.15,"body":"the general pattern going,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3120.569,"endTime":3122.489,"body":"Yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3120.569,"endTime":3122.489,"body":"exciting to see just how much"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3122.519,"endTime":3126.149,"body":"that concept or it's not a new"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3122.519,"endTime":3126.149,"body":"concept, but just recognizing"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3126.179,"endTime":3129.719,"body":"giving the dogs much more choice"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3126.179,"endTime":3129.719,"body":"and agency in their environment,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3129.719,"endTime":3132.449,"body":"and to be able to make those"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3129.719,"endTime":3132.449,"body":"choices operate. Because the old"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3132.449,"endTime":3135.809,"body":"it's a complete shift from the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3132.449,"endTime":3135.809,"body":"old way of training shift, you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3135.809,"endTime":3138.719,"body":"know, instead of stopped doing"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3135.809,"endTime":3138.719,"body":"this or do this or do that it's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3138.719,"endTime":3141.089,"body":"more like, I'm going to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3138.719,"endTime":3141.089,"body":"reinforce you for what I like,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3141.089,"endTime":3143.729,"body":"and I'm seeing it give you many"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3141.089,"endTime":3143.729,"body":"more choices. So you're not"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3143.729,"endTime":3146.579,"body":"feeling restricted in making"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3143.729,"endTime":3146.579,"body":"those trades, obviously, done"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3146.579,"endTime":3148.289,"body":"safely for our aggression cases,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3148.59,"endTime":3150.72,"body":"obviously done safely."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3148.59,"endTime":3150.72,"body":"And you know what I'm gonna say"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3150.72,"endTime":3154.35,"body":"the opposite side of that coin,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3150.72,"endTime":3154.35,"body":"which is that we can't be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3154.35,"endTime":3158.37,"body":"extreme about anything. Or at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3154.35,"endTime":3158.37,"body":"least I can't, okay, I don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3158.37,"endTime":3162.21,"body":"recommend it. So you don't want"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3158.37,"endTime":3162.21,"body":"to be like, everything is choice"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3162.21,"endTime":3165.12,"body":"for all dogs all the time"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3162.21,"endTime":3165.12,"body":"because some dogs don't. That's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3165.12,"endTime":3167.94,"body":"not what they're gonna do well,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3165.12,"endTime":3167.94,"body":"with. All right, it's if you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3167.94,"endTime":3171.93,"body":"have some, some underlying"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3167.94,"endTime":3171.93,"body":"pathology, some neurochemical"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3172.29,"endTime":3176.43,"body":"stuff, you know, anxiety"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3172.29,"endTime":3176.43,"body":"disorder, obsessive compulsive"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3176.43,"endTime":3181.77,"body":"disorder, you can't be like, I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3176.43,"endTime":3181.77,"body":"gonna let you choose to engage"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3181.77,"endTime":3186.75,"body":"in this behavior or not, because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3181.77,"endTime":3186.75,"body":"the dog might actually need"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3186.78,"endTime":3191.25,"body":"medication before they can even"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3186.78,"endTime":3191.25,"body":"make make a choice. If it's not,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3191.25,"endTime":3195.36,"body":"you know, so you can't assume"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3191.25,"endTime":3195.36,"body":"all dogs are on that page. You"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3195.36,"endTime":3198.99,"body":"know, there's some dogs that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3195.36,"endTime":3198.99,"body":"need behavioral medicine to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3198.99,"endTime":3202.14,"body":"on that page. You know, there's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3198.99,"endTime":3202.14,"body":"some dogs that are having"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3202.14,"endTime":3205.98,"body":"anxiety disorder and being like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3202.14,"endTime":3205.98,"body":"now you have all the freedom,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3206.01,"endTime":3210.63,"body":"they don't want it. Because they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3206.01,"endTime":3210.63,"body":"need to be told, like, they need"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3210.63,"endTime":3213.81,"body":"a script that is feel safe. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3210.63,"endTime":3213.81,"body":"now in this situation, you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3213.81,"endTime":3218.22,"body":"going to do this. And so really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3213.81,"endTime":3218.22,"body":"need to just keep going back to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3218.31,"endTime":3219.99,"body":"the case you have in front of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3218.31,"endTime":3219.99,"body":"you."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3221.28,"endTime":3223.44,"body":"The really"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3221.28,"endTime":3223.44,"body":"salient point and a very"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3223.44,"endTime":3227.34,"body":"important one. Yeah, we don't"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3223.44,"endTime":3227.34,"body":"want to, you know, this whole"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3227.34,"endTime":3230.82,"body":"this whole choice part of thing"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3227.34,"endTime":3230.82,"body":"is, it's important, but you make"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3230.82,"endTime":3234.48,"body":"a very good point about not just"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3230.82,"endTime":3234.48,"body":"letting all dogs just go at it."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3234.48,"endTime":3237.27,"body":"And just there you go, you know,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3234.48,"endTime":3237.27,"body":"operate on your input. That's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3237.27,"endTime":3238.95,"body":"not what we're talking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3237.27,"endTime":3238.95,"body":"about. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3238.98,"endTime":3243.15,"body":"yeah. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3238.98,"endTime":3243.15,"body":"So what are you up to next? And"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3243.15,"endTime":3244.29,"body":"where can people find you?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3244.8,"endTime":3249.24,"body":"So a lot of my time"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3244.8,"endTime":3249.24,"body":"these days is with my mentorship"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3249.24,"endTime":3252.51,"body":"group, I certify people to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3249.24,"endTime":3252.51,"body":"well, they're already working"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3252.51,"endTime":3255.0,"body":"trainers. So I'm not certifying"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3252.51,"endTime":3255.0,"body":"them to be trainers. I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3255.0,"endTime":3257.31,"body":"certifying trainers to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3255.0,"endTime":3257.31,"body":"controlling least trainers."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3258.21,"endTime":3263.16,"body":"Yeah, I mean, I'm working a lot"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3258.21,"endTime":3263.16,"body":"with my mentorship group. Just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3263.16,"endTime":3268.08,"body":"have have a few firsts have my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3263.16,"endTime":3268.08,"body":"first guy in South Korea. He"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3268.08,"endTime":3270.81,"body":"just finished and wow, just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3268.08,"endTime":3270.81,"body":"different, you know, different"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3270.81,"endTime":3272.31,"body":"countries is pretty cool."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3272.79,"endTime":3275.22,"body":"It's very"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3272.79,"endTime":3275.22,"body":"like that. Yeah, it's very cool"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3275.22,"endTime":3276.3,"body":"to see the ripples that you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3276.449,"endTime":3279.209,"body":"actually he's coming in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3276.449,"endTime":3279.209,"body":"New York for some other reason."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3279.209,"endTime":3283.529,"body":"And he's going to drive down"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3279.209,"endTime":3283.529,"body":"visit me. Wow. So I'm, I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3283.529,"endTime":3284.699,"body":"really psyched about that."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3284.79,"endTime":3287.01,"body":"That's"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3284.79,"endTime":3287.01,"body":"amazing. That's amazing. And"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3287.01,"endTime":3289.5,"body":"don't forget about the Friends"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3287.01,"endTime":3289.5,"body":"of control and leash Facebook"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3289.5,"endTime":3290.1,"body":"group. Yes,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3290.219,"endTime":3294.509,"body":"that's for anybody."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3290.219,"endTime":3294.509,"body":"Hopefully, you guys have at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3294.509,"endTime":3297.749,"body":"least like one of the books or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3294.509,"endTime":3297.749,"body":"have watched the conference"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3297.749,"endTime":3300.869,"body":"recordings which you can get on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3297.749,"endTime":3300.869,"body":"my pub Was yours which is clean"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3300.869,"endTime":3305.309,"body":"run, or something so that you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3300.869,"endTime":3305.309,"body":"not going in there, just totally"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3305.729,"endTime":3311.309,"body":"cold. But even if you are, we're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3305.729,"endTime":3311.309,"body":"there I force the people in my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3311.309,"endTime":3314.699,"body":"mentorship program to show up"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3311.309,"endTime":3314.699,"body":"and occasionally answer"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3314.699,"endTime":3318.329,"body":"questions. You know, it's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3314.699,"endTime":3318.329,"body":"community. So you know, we're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3318.329,"endTime":3321.059,"body":"there to discuss things. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3318.329,"endTime":3321.059,"body":"it's, it's always helpful if you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3321.419,"endTime":3325.319,"body":"have heard some of the material"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3321.419,"endTime":3325.319,"body":"first suit, because it's like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3325.859,"endTime":3328.859,"body":"1000s of people in there and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3325.859,"endTime":3328.859,"body":"someone shows up and it's like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3328.889,"endTime":3332.279,"body":"what's, look at that or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3328.889,"endTime":3332.279,"body":"something, it'll get explains,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3332.279,"endTime":3335.969,"body":"but it's a lot easier if you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3332.279,"endTime":3335.969,"body":"have been exposed to it in some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3335.969,"endTime":3338.369,"body":"way. And then you can have more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3335.969,"endTime":3338.369,"body":"questions about your particular"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3338.369,"endTime":3339.479,"body":"case or whatever."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3339.87,"endTime":3342.3,"body":"Excellent."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3339.87,"endTime":3342.3,"body":"Excellent. Leslie, thank you so"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3342.3,"endTime":3345.33,"body":"much. I appreciate your wisdom"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3342.3,"endTime":3345.33,"body":"and insight as always, and I"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3345.33,"endTime":3346.86,"body":"appreciate you coming on the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3345.33,"endTime":3346.86,"body":"show."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3347.25,"endTime":3353.19,"body":"Thank you. It's always"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3347.25,"endTime":3353.19,"body":"good to talk to you. My mind is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3353.19,"endTime":3356.01,"body":"going with this this that in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3353.19,"endTime":3356.01,"body":"that"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3358.949,"endTime":3360.389,"body":"I hope you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3358.949,"endTime":3360.389,"body":"enjoyed this amazing"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3360.389,"endTime":3363.749,"body":"conversation with the always"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3360.389,"endTime":3363.749,"body":"creative Lesley McDevitt. If you"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3363.749,"endTime":3366.479,"body":"liked the show, please don't"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3363.749,"endTime":3366.479,"body":"forget to subscribe, share and"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3366.479,"endTime":3370.049,"body":"give a rating and hop on over to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3366.479,"endTime":3370.049,"body":"aggressive dog.com For more"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3370.049,"endTime":3372.749,"body":"information about helping dogs"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3370.049,"endTime":3372.749,"body":"with aggression. From the"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3372.749,"endTime":3376.109,"body":"aggression in dogs master course"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3372.749,"endTime":3376.109,"body":"to webinars from world renowned"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3376.109,"endTime":3379.289,"body":"experts, and even an annual"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3376.109,"endTime":3379.289,"body":"conference. We have options for"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3379.289,"endTime":3382.769,"body":"both pet pros and pet owners to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3379.289,"endTime":3382.769,"body":"learn more about aggression in"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3382.769,"endTime":3383.339,"body":"dogs."},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3405.6,"endTime":3408.54,"body":"But what if you're looking at"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3405.6,"endTime":3408.54,"body":"some of the more breed specific"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3408.54,"endTime":3412.11,"body":"fantasies like a maybe a Belgian"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3408.54,"endTime":3412.11,"body":"Malinois that's how dare you to"},{"speaker":"Michael Shikashio","startTime":3413.73,"endTime":3414.36,"body":"Denton"}]}