What Are You Still Carrying? A Leadership Lesson from a Zen Story

Sometimes the most powerful leadership lessons come from the simplest stories.

In this episode of the Leadership Vision Podcast, Brian and Linda share a short Zen parable that surfaced during a coaching conversation with a client. The story, originally from Zen Shorts by Jon J. Muth, is about two traveling monks, a frustrated young woman, and a moment that reveals how easily we hold on to things longer than we should.

As Nathan, Linda, and Brian unpack the story together, the conversation turns toward a deeper question for leaders and teams:

What are we still carrying that we should have set down hours ago?

The parable opens up a thoughtful discussion about perspective, emotional awareness, leadership mindset, and the subtle ways our interpretations of events shape the culture around us.

Along the way, the team explores how each character in the story reflects different leadership tendencies—and how recognizing those patterns can help leaders grow in awareness and compassion.

It’s a short story, but one that invites a powerful moment of reflection.

Reflection Questions for Leaders

As you listen, consider these questions:

• What situation am I still carrying that I could let go of?
 • Which character in the story do I relate to most right now?
 • Am I amplifying a challenge that may actually be smaller than I think?
 • Who is walking alongside me on my leadership journey?

Transcript

A Parable For Leaders

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Today on the Leadership Vision podcast, we're exploring a short story with a surprisingly powerful lesson. In this episode, Brian and Linda share a classic Zen parable that came up during a coaching conversation with a client. It's a simple story about two traveling monks, a difficult moment, and a question that lingers long after the moment has passed. What are we still carrying that we should have set down? Now, together, Linda, Brian, and I reflect on what the story reveals about leadership, relationships, and the habits of mind that shape how we respond to challenges. Along the way, we explore the different characters in the story and how we might see parts of ourselves in each one of them. Now, this is a short story with a link in the bio, but it opens the door to a deeper conversation about letting go, perspective, and the journeys that we share with others. My name is Nathan Freeberg. This is the Leadership Vision Podcast. Enjoy.

SPEAKER_01 1:07

And he simply ended with this story. He told me a story. I think what I asked him was, how would you summarize this hour-long conversation? And he said, I think the lesson that I learned about myself today comes from a story that I read to my children. And he then recited this story that he reads to his children over and over and over again. And for him, it was a statement of the challenge that he has as a senior level leader who really desires to grow. And it hit me so strongly that I not only had to buy the book, but I've not forgotten about this parable.

SPEAKER_00 1:52

Can you can can you read this, Linda? Can you tell us what this is?

Reading The Zen Parable

Who We Are In Each Character

SPEAKER_02 1:55

Oh, Nathan, I would love to read this. It's a version of a classic Zen story. It's about letting go, it is about transformation. It is a story that has has just stuck with Brian and me. It's from a children's book author named John J. Mouth, and it's from a book called Zen Shorts. Here's the story. Two traveling monks reached a town where there was a young woman waiting to step out of her sedan chair. The rains had made deep puddles, and she couldn't step across without spoiling her silken robes. She stood there looking very cross and impatient. She was scolding her attendants. They had nowhere to place the packages they held for her, so they couldn't help her across the puddle. The younger monk noticed the woman, said nothing, and walked by. The older monk quickly picked her up, put her on his back, transported her across the water, and put her down on the other side. She didn't thank the older monk. She just showed him out the way and departed. As they continued on their way, the young monk was brooding and preoccupied. After several hours, unable to hold his silence, he spoke out. Then she didn't even say thank you. I set the woman down hours ago, the older monk replied. Why are you still carrying her?

SPEAKER_00 3:40

My first thought is this idea of like you can only control yourself, right? It's kind of the stoic philosophy idea. And you need to do the right thing, no matter what, kind of. And if someone doesn't do the right thing back, you can't let that bother you. You can't let that, like apparently this younger monk, like ruin ruin your life, ruin a f a few hours. But man, is it hard to do that?

SPEAKER_01 4:04

What gets my attention in this story, number one, is the simplicity of it. It's a simple story, it is a very short story, and there's only a few characters in the story. And so when I first heard the story, I saw myself in several different characters. And so one of the first questions I often wonder is which character captures your attention and why? And allowing your mind to really be open to connect with any one of the characters there the wise monk, the young monk, the princess, maybe even the servants that are trying to figure out like what to do next. And I think that each of those characters has some type of attitude that is represented. And sometimes those attitudes are aspirational for ourselves, and we may think too lowly of ourselves that we may not be as wise as the old monk. Or maybe we have some type of experience that is influencing us to not believe that we may sound like the younger monk and how the younger monk is carrying things with him. And oftentimes, I must admit that I oftentimes hear myself sounding a lot like the princess. Where was that a lot? I'm afraid to get my shoes dirty and who's gonna carry my stuff and things like that. And so I would just like to maybe in invite us all to think about which of the characters represents us right now.

SPEAKER_02 5:37

And they're a mix of all. Listen, I just carried her for a hot second.

SPEAKER_00 6:11

Why are you what's the deal again?

Obstacles, Perspective, And Belief

SPEAKER_02 6:12

Why are you still carrying her hours later? And and for me, as I'm listening to people, sometimes story, sometimes allegory really helps me listen to people in new ways, have compassion on them, and invite them into both the reflection process as well as taking actions that are a little bit different.

SPEAKER_01 6:35

Nathan, what's interesting about this story is that the the wise monk and the young monk made their way around this body of water. Without getting what. They continued. And the princess saw it as some insurmountable, impassable obstacle, and her perspective influenced her servants and what they were tasked to do. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. So that like limiting belief or expansive belief that this challenge is actually larger than what is actually there in the parable, there's no indication that the two monks turned around. The the intonation is that they kept going forward. So there was a way around.

SPEAKER_00 7:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:21

And when I read this, there are so many people that I know that are that that princess where they are over-amplifying the issue and it creates a sense of impassability to everybody else when there actually is a way around. And right now I feel that I'm I there are many times I feel like I'm just sitting next to this puddle with my hand, with my chin in my hands, thinking, I don't even know how to get around this thing. I don't know what to let go, what to whatever.

SPEAKER_00 7:51

Sam must read it a little differently where she looked at it and she's like, I'm above walking through this. Like I'm I'm too fancy, I'm too high of my station to do this. Like, I don't know if it was a hard problem, but she just is like, Oh, we don't do that. We don't stoop to that level.

SPEAKER_02 8:05

And we just assume that that if I'm in a car, then someone will someone will just automatically get me to the other side.

SPEAKER_00 8:12

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 8:13

And so to live with that kind of entitlement and without gratitude.

Let Go Or Lean In

SPEAKER_00 8:18

Yeah. How do we ask this? How do we, how do all of us know maybe the difference between I just need to let that go versus no, I need to sit with this and kind of process it and possibly take action. Is there an easy why are you laughing so hard?

Journey, Companionship, And Practice

SPEAKER_01 8:33

Because that's just how that not just because you show up that way most of the time. Like I need to I gotta I need to wrestle with this even more. You know, like in this story, Nathan, you are the servants, guys to me. Like you're just like, Whoa, what's the depth of the puddle? Well, how many times do we have to get this? Can we just can we take apart the carriage? I overanalyze things. And can we like make a bridge? Do we take this apart? Like, do we really need to bring her with these are all important questions? I'm sorry, I lost complete track of what you were asking. Well, say more about that. Why are you laughing so hard? I think your response, Nathan, is typical of how I know you to respond. Meaning is I need to think with this, should I think even longer about this? Um and I and in my life, I I think why I'm laughing is I'm off I'm also laughing at myself because I'm trying to let as much go as possible. I'm just in that stage. Or I'm rusting through a lot of things, and in my mind, I keep saying, let it go, just let it go. And there are so many practices that I have in place right now that are helping me let go of and just fill in the blank. So that being said, what stands out to me is that there's a journey. This parable is about a journey, and I'm fascinated by the relationship between the wise monk and the young monk that even after this event happened, they still continued on their journey together. There's a companionship and a partnership to this story that I really like. Even with the princess and who's there supporting her, there's a relationship there as well. So in life, there are so many different ways that we can see our relationships with other people. And I believe that the invitation here is for us to really understand how we are in all the characters, what types of journeys that we're on, and to recognize that life continues to unfold before us, and our invitation is to continue to move forward in our journeys.

Final Takeaways And Thanks

SPEAKER_00 10:44

Yeah, I mean, I think my takeaway from that is that you're old. Okay. So are you going to do that? The older monk with that experience to be like that. So yeah. I think the final takeaway as I'm thinking about this is just thinking more again about what are those things to let go? What are those things to just be like, not worth it? Set it down. So thank you for that, Linda and Brian. But Linda for reading and Brian for sharing that after your client.

SPEAKER_02 11:17

So shout out to the lovely leader that we're working with that has helped us extend the message of having the courage. Look at our lives differently. Yeah, I know he's shaping his children. It's clear he's shaping his team and his organization. And I think we can all do a little more introspection and take a little more action.

SPEAKER_00 11:41

I'll put a link to this in the show notes. And thank you, listeners, for listening to the Leadership Vision Podcast, our show helping you build positive team culture. My name is Nathan Freeberg.

SPEAKER_02 11:50

I'm Linda Schubring. And I'm Brian Schubring.

SPEAKER_00 11:53

And on behalf of our entire team, thanks for listening.