2x Olympic Gold Medalist in Bobsleigh and World Rugby Hall of Famer Shares How to Live Beyond Definition, with Heather Moyse

Heather Moyse is a 2x Olympic gold medalist (who competed in 4 Olympics games), a three-sport national athlete, a World Rugby Hall of Famer, a motivational speaker, an author, and a coach.

Heather started training just five months before her first Olympics at the age of 27 in 2-person bobsleigh, with her last Olympic competition at the age of 39.

In this episode, she shares specific techniques and mindset work that she uses to achieve her goals and that we all can use to help us live up to our potential.

Heather won gold at the 2010 Winter Games in Vancouver, and again at the 2014 Games in Sochi. Before she was an Olympic champion, Heather was a mainstay on Canada’s Senior Women’s Rugby Team. Heather led Canada to silver in the 2013 Rugby Sevens World Cup, and was the top try scorer in the 2006 and 2010 Women’s Rugby World Cups. In 2016, Heather became only the second Canadian, and first Canadian female, to be inducted into the World Rugby Hall of Fame. Heather represented Canada in a third international sport in 2012, when she placed Top Five in two events at the Pan-Am Track Cycling Championships in Argentina.

 Contact Info:
Heather Moyse - Guest
Heather's Instagram account
Heather's website
Weekly video series ( It's a little combo of pep talk + motivation + perspective shift.)

Julie Berman - Host
www.womenwithcooljobs.com
@womencooljobs (Instagram)
Julie Berman's LinkedIn Profile 

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Transcript

Heather Moyse: 0:00

All of a sudden, I broke this record of the sled pole like pulling a weighted sled through these timing lights, which is probably the closest test to simulate bobsledding, and all of a sudden I was just like, what? might like, I just broke the record a record amongst all of these athletes who've been training for years, and who were supposed to be representing us at the next Olympics in five months. And then it was like, Huh, I wonder if I can do it? Can I actually learn a new sport? Can I learn to do it well, and can I learn to do it well in time to represent my country at the next games. And so I hadn't even seen a bobsled yet. Like, hadn't been in a bobsled hadn't been down on track, because there was no ice on the track, you know, at the end of August. So I didn't fall in love with the sport. I fell in love with the challenge of seeing if I could do this.

Julie- Host: 0:52

Hey, everybody. I'm Julie and welcome to Women with cool jobs. Each episode will feature women with unique trailblazing and innovative careers. We'll talk about how she got here, what life is like now, and actionable steps that you can take to go on a similar path, or one that's all your own. This podcast is about empowering you. It's about empowering you to dream big and to be inspired. You'll hear from incredible women in a wide variety of fields, and hopefully some that you've never heard of before. Women who filled robots and roadways, firefighters, see sweet professional surrounded by men, social media mavens, entrepreneurs, and more. I'm so glad we get to go on this journey together. Hello, everybody. This is Julie Berman, and welcome to another episode of women with cool jobs. So today is the first episode of 2024. And I am so so excited to be here with you. I already have so many incredible guests lined up for this year. And today's guest is no exception. Before we get to her, I want to wish you happy, happy holidays, I hope you had such a beautiful time with your loved ones, with people who you maybe haven't seen in a while, I hope you had some moments of joy and excitement and fun and some rest as well. I know for me, I had some time with some friends that we hadn't seen in a while with my family who I love. And I'm so lucky that we have so many family members here. We took some time to go play at the parks because it's gorgeous here in the Phoenix area at this time of year, we took some time to go walk around some neighborhoods and see lights and displays. And it's particularly entertaining because now all three of my boys can walk my littlest is just the point where he's like, barely, almost running like or very fast walking. And so he was just so excited. And it was just such a joy. And yeah, so I hope you've had some really special special moments. And now here we are in 2024. It is a brand new year. And I want to mention that I was planning on having my first women with cool jobs live event here in the Phoenix area on Saturday, January 27. And that is going to be postponed. Unfortunately, I have a family member who's going to be having surgery right before that. And I am a little heartbroken to cancel it. But I also want to make sure I am doing the best that I can for myself for my family and for you all and I want to make sure that when I'm at that event with you that I'm 100% 110% and I don't want to be distracted or thinking about other things. And it's such a special event we had our first one in October of last year. And it's such a special event with so many incredible women coming who are from diverse fields. We have a special guest who's a transportation engineer who we're gonna plan it for February or March. So stay tuned because you're not gonna want to miss it. If you're here in the valley. If you know someone here in the valley, please share it with them. If you want to be on the initial list to get that information about the event right and invitation as soon as possible. Please make sure that you message me either on LinkedIn at Julie Berman on Instagram at women cold jobs or you can always go to my website and connect with me there. It's at www.womenwithcooljobs.com So I'm just like so excited to be doing these live events. I'm really thrilled to be building a community in person supporting women who have big dreams big goals and who you know are are wanting maybe a cool job for themselves or they want to hear about women with cool jobs and just learn from other other women. And also, this room is so special because very diverse women. end up coming Being to this event. And it creates this, this beautiful thing that we don't always get other places. Sometimes we end up in our particular trade or a particular niche. And we're like in a silo, if you're in marketing, you know, maybe you go and you meet people, all marketing, if you're an HR you meet, people are all in HR. If you're an engineering, you meet people all in engineering, and you don't meet other people, a lot of times from other trades. This is one of those places that's like a true melting pot where you're going to meet so many cool women from diverse places. So I hope that you will come. And if you aren't here, please do share it with someone who you know in this area, or just out in general, because you will have such great networks that you never know. Alright, so this next guest you are going to love her. This was such an amazing way to start 2024 Because she has such incredible insights, such incredible mindset shifts that we can all use to start a new year. This is the time when we're all thinking about our resolutions are the things that we want to be do and have for this next year. And this guest is going to set us up in a really good place to think of things a little bit differently, to get to where we want to go. And to find that fulfillment to find that joy and to find those things that really truly aligned with us. So without further ado, I want to introduce you to Heather Moyse. She is a two time Olympic gold medalist she competed four different times in the Olympics, she won her medals in the two man Bob's lay, her first gold was at the 2010 Winter Games in Vancouver. Then she won again, she won again. And that was at the 2014 Games in Sochi. She also is a World Rugby Hall of Famer, she's an author. She is a motivational speaker, she is a coach, she has just done so many cool things. And she is someone also who started her career in the Olympics at the age of 27. And her story is you're gonna hear it in this podcast is so so good. It's so interesting. And she ended her career in the Olympics at 39. I'm 39 now and I just Oh my gosh, I feel like that is so incredible. And she explains so much of the mindset work, how she's gone about setting these really epic goals for herself, how she's made them happen, and she shares her tips with us. So some of the things we talk about our solution minded thinking. So really asking how, how can I do this? We also talked about setting a goal as a spectrum. And seeing how close can I get? So again, that how comes up? Instead of sometimes we do this binary thinking of like, Can I do this yes or no. Also, we talk about a lot of times in sports, that the higher you go, the more important rest and recovery are. And she really also thinks this is so key for people who are outside of the sporting world and just being an everyday life and thinking about how can rest and recovery really help aid us and be part of the strategy, part of the strategy and part of the plan to taking things to the next level. So I just thought this was so great. And these were like the tip of the iceberg. There are so many incredible, just little things and wisdom that she shares with us. And it was such a wonderful way to start 2024 I just on a personal note, I was so grateful to be able to have this conversation because this is the fourth year that I have been doing this podcast as of 2020 in February of 2020. That's when I started doing all the research. And I released my first few episodes in October of 2020. And so I've been doing this almost four years, and it's just felt like this was such a milestone moment for me personally, and something that I could I could have never imagined for myself that it would have happened. And yet it did like here I am a few years later, I didn't even know whether I would like podcasting. I wouldn't. I didn't know how it would go I have never done anything like this. And the fact that I am here today, starting a whole new year and interviewing such an epic accomplished smart guest. I it's just really truly an honor. And it was just it was something really special for me personally. And yeah, and like a big milestone. And I wanted to share that because sometimes I think when we start something, it can be so overwhelming because we're figuring out all these little pieces. We haven't done it before and the older We get to, I think it's harder to start things because it feels almost scarier because we're starting as, as a novice as a newbie, when oftentimes, we really are an expert in other areas, and to start, start something new and be a beginner, it really takes courage and vulnerability, and a lot of other things. And I just could never have imagined that I got here. And I'm so grateful that I started. And so this is to encourage you, if you have something on your heart, that you have had like a whisper, or a reoccurring thought, or you feel like it's in you like a gut instinct, or like a two by four over the head. To start, I definitely recommend that you start because you never know you never know where it's going to lead you and the path that you're going to take and the beautiful opportunities and outcomes that are going to arise. So thank you so much for being here with me, and enjoy this amazing conversation with Heather Moyse. All right. So today on women with cool jobs, we have such a fantastic way to start the new year. I am here with Heather Moyse, who is like she has accomplished so many things, I have to read this long, long list off. But amongst the incredible things is you're a two time Olympic gold Olympic gold medalist, a three sport national athlete, a World Rugby Hall of Famer, you got a master's in occupational therapy or motivational speaker and author and a coach. And I'm sure there's more in there that I actually didn't mention, because you've just done so many cool things you had so many accomplishments in your life. And I am really honored to be here with you today. Like I feel like we had this, we had two other times that we were supposed to do this interview. And you're my first episode of the year. And I feel like this is such a perfect way to start the year with you, Heather, because you talk all about like possibilities and people really believing in themselves and and learning to understand that they have so much potential in them. So I'm just so excited. So thank you for being here and happy new year.

Unknown: 12:10

Thank you. I appreciate this very much. It's great to be here.

Julie- Host: 12:14

So I want to start out because you like you have such an interesting way that you even got into like being an Olympian. And I want to touch on this because I feel like one of the fascinating things about you is that you did get into the Olympics like later and you didn't have this dream since you were tiny, of being an Olympian, and yet you won gold medals, like you've been in multiple sports in different ways. And you're just so you've achieved so much. And I'm curious, like, how, like, what is your mindset that you have? And I know, you talk to a lot of people about their potential, but like, how did you, I guess, like, really learn for yourself starting from a place of like, oh, maybe I could do this, like this huge place of possibility. And being like, let's just try it out. Because I think that is such a brave thing to do to actually take action, and especially later on, right when people may not typically believe like, Oh, this is something I can do at this stage in my life. Yeah, I

Unknown: 13:21

think that like right now I work with some of my clients, or are some of the outside very highly successful people who own multimillion dollar businesses and that sort of thing. But they come to me because there's something missing or there's, they don't know how they got there. Like outwardly looks fine, but there's something missing in their life or they feel like they're not where they're supposed to be or, or because they've been so successful. They're actually nervous to make a change because of probably more so than anything, the judgment of other people like Why on earth would you leave such a successful thing, and while some people just aren't happy, but 27 is when I started bobsledding, and I was recruited into it. So I was kind of pulled in by someone who saw that potential. But I'm still very resistant to try to do it four years earlier. And I said, No, I wasn't interested. And it's not that I didn't think that I could it is that it never occurred to me as really being an option. So I grew up in a small town and Olympians were TV people. You know, they weren't everyday normal people like I considered myself to be so it's not that I sat there thinking, Oh, I would love to go do that. But I can't like I'm physically not capable. It just didn't cross my mind that that was a thing. And maybe it was, you know, we talked today about representation. We talked today about all these different things. And maybe it's because I didn't really see anyone around me training for the Olympics, or I didn't see women in sports on TV or I didn't see these different things. And so it just kind of wasn't the thing and went for the sports that I was mainly doing. The Olympics wasn't At the end of those anyway, so it was you're asking a question about when did I what turn so that I could see, so that I could believe that I was capable for such things. While I was very fortunate to have been raised in a family where it was about possibilities, it wasn't that it wasn't possible. For me, it was, like I said, I just never considered it an option. So for me, I feel like with now with my job with what I do, as a speaker, as a coach, through my books, whatever, I feel like it's almost my responsibility to be that person, to other people, the person that my parents were to me, but I've realized that a lot of people don't have that, that voice of possibility in their minds, because it's been squashed and stepped on and, and dampened and whatever so many times, you know, realistic, my book is called redefining realistic and realistic is just so minimized and put into this small little box ever since we're kids. And we just have to get out of that box. You know, we have to break free from what those limitations are.

Julie- Host: 16:07

I love that. And I think that's actually such an interesting distinction that you made is like, not having seen those people before in your life, like in the fact that you kind of the question that I asked was probably the wrong question, then. Because it really seemed like for you to get to that place of, of getting to the Olympics, it was like, being like, oh, maybe this is possible, seeing that other people were doing it. And what what was it that like, I guess that final ask that allowed you to be like, Oh, maybe maybe this is possible, like, I can do this early, I

Unknown: 16:48

was stubborn. I was just so it was it was just a testing camp, this guy wanted me to this recruiter wanted me to go to this testing camp, and I, I said, Oh my gosh, okay, well just send me the dates. I'll see if I'm available. And so he sent me the dates. And I sent him an email back and I said, it was really great to see you. I'm glad we ran into each other. I took a look at the dates. But unfortunately, I'm actually away with the national rugby team at the time. So So I guess it's not going to work out. But it was really nice seeing you hope you have a great summer, dismiss, dismiss, dismiss, like, I just thought that was kind of the end of it. And then all of a sudden, a few days later, I got a coach from a development, a call from a development coach in Calgary. And he was saying, you know, he said, normally we don't invite people to the development camp without having testing results. But Dennis seems to think that we should, you know, have you out here anyway. So I guess we can do your testing here if you can come to this camp. And I was like, Oh, my gosh, what are the dates? You know? So they sent me these dates. And I said, well, it overlaps with rugby nationals. So I I'm sorry. And they're like, Well, how much does it overlap? I said, Well, I had missed the whole first day. And the first day was the first of two days of straight testing, like full just physical testing. And they said, Oh, well, if you're only going to miss that first day, then that's, that's fine. You can come anyway. And I'm like, okay, okay, I guess we'll just go straight from rugby nationals, which were in British Columbia, and then I flew to Calgary and, and fortunately, I missed that first day of testing, because it was all weightlifting. And I had never lifted any weights before. Wow. So I was very lucky with that, because I probably wouldn't have told anyone like, I probably would have just tried to copy what other people were doing. Tried to get into good tech, like, I don't know, I wouldn't know I would have probably crushed myself with the bar. The second day, though, the day that I got there, it was all speed testing pliers, power, like leg power, strength, like speed, strength in terms of speed and power, sprinting through timing lights, sprinting through timing lights, pulling a weighted sled behind me, like jumping tests and stuff to test the power in your legs. And still, I've never done any of those those tests. But I at least knew that I wasn't going to, like injure myself by getting crushed by a bar or something. So I did them. And then I ended up breaking one of their testing records. Wow. So all of a sudden, I broke this record of the sled pole, like pulling a weighted sled through these timing lights, which is probably the closest test to simulate bobsledding, and all of a sudden I was just like, What? What? Like, I just broke the record record amongst all of these athletes who've been training for years, and who were supposed to be representing us at the next Olympics in five months. And then it was like, Huh, I wonder if I can do it? Can I actually learn a new sport? Can I learn to do it well, and can I learn to do it well in time to represent my country at the next games? And so I hadn't even seen a bobsled yet. Like, I hadn't been in a bobsled hadn't been down a track. There was no ice on the track, you know, at the end of August. So I didn't fall in love with the sport I fell in love with the challenge of seeing If I could do this, and I think it was easier for me to accept that challenge, because it was such a short term goal. You know, it wasn't a four year goal, it was a five month goal. And so I went back to Toronto, talked to my faculty advisor, I put my master's degree just on hold for one year. And then I proceeded to see if I could, like how close I could get to, to qualifying and making those Olympic Games that heard it, it was, it was kind of like being pulled into something. And then when you see that glimmer, wait a second, like one people do this, like people are here, because they actually do this and, and to you just kind of it becomes this question. Like, I wonder if I can? Or how, how could I like, How can I do this. And so a lot of a lot of it is has a lot of that experience, has helped me develop these philosophies and strategies in terms of how we set our goals, how we look at goals, like a spectrum instead of just this finite binary success or failure kind of endpoint. And it's been a really cool, it's been a very, very cool experience for me, because my experience was so different. Because I was older, I was able to make value based decisions. I wasn't kind of pulled into this out like this outward pressure, this external pressure of societal validation of what success means and what I should do what I shouldn't do, and, and stuff. So it was a little bit I won't say easier, but it was a definitely gave me a lot of, of experience in the mindset piece, the decision making piece, the perspective piece, all of these pieces that I've been so lucky to get, and to live through in order to help me with my clients and my audiences from the stage. So it's been really great.

Julie- Host: 21:59

Yeah, wow, thank you for explaining that. I mean, that's, it's a fascinating story. And I, I love, I love the questions that you ask yourself, like those three questions, just starting with like, Is this possible? Hey, can I can I do that? I think that's is it possible

Unknown: 22:17

is actually a pretty dangerous question. Because sometimes, so this is what I talked about with my clients, okay. Sometimes when we have these really big goals that we have, or we don't even set them as goals. They're kind of these big dreams we've kept in the back of our minds, because we think they're so big. So because these goals because we want them, they seem so insurmountable, like these just big things, they've lost these. So if we ask, is it possible? Or can I do this? Then it gives us a yes or no answer. It's a binary answer, yes or no? And because it seems so big to us, our minds automatically go to No, probably not. Right? So the difference is, this is where I want people to start living in the house. Okay, I want them to add the how peace to live in the house by saying it's not it's not can you do it? It's how can you do it? How can you do it? How can you do it? How could I do this? And as soon as you say how can I automatically flip into solution minded thinking, we automatically start saying, Well, if I were to do this, I would do it like this? Or someone would like how would someone do this. So as soon as you kind of get that whole piece in there, you start planning, you start strategizing, you start looking for solutions. And that's the same thing. Even when we're on our pursuits to our goals. None of those goals are achieved without facing some kind of challenge or obstacle or something along the way. And that's the same thing like you, we get confronted with a challenge. And it's not, can I overcome this broken leg? Or in time? can I overcome this? Can I get past this? Can I do whatever? It's how could I? How can I? How can I do this? And then that's where your solutions come into play? Yeah,

Julie- Host: 23:56

wow. That's an amazing, like, shift with just with just a few words like the How I love that. That's, yeah, I think that's really a remarkable and simple thing that we can start asking yourself in a different way. I'm curious for you, like, do you feel like and I I want to ask like a little bit about how you grew up in your childhood, because I know you mentioned you grew up in this smaller place. And you know, but your parents sounded like just so incredible, and so supportive and, and really set a really, like foundational and an important mindset, and you have like, you can do so many cool things. And how did you grow up? And how does that affect what you do today? Because now I know you're speaking on so many stages, you've written a book, and how did that inform not only your time doing sports, but also your time? Now helping other people and doing these like little mindset shifts and sharing out like, what was that like for you growing up and

Unknown: 25:00

Yeah, so when I was writing my book, I actually probably analyzed how I was raised a little bit more and included some of that stuff in my book. And it's interesting, some of the things I realized when I actually started thinking about it. And it's the same way, in some instances, how some people have to kind of look back in their childhood and find out why they have self limiting beliefs, or why they have, why they've shut the door on so many things. It's, it's something from their childhood, whether it's from their parents, or from a teacher, or from a neighbor, like friend or something, something that happened or was said that we've held on to right, so. So I started thinking about with my parents now, I am very fortunate, in my opinion, that my parents weren't really sports people. So I am really lucky that they could care less if I played sports or not, that they supported us in what we wanted to do, but wanted to make sure that if we were doing sports, we were also doing music, kind of keeping things well, like well rounded. And they it was very, very clear to my coaches to my to a lot of people that they weren't trying to raise an athlete, they were trying to raise someone with character and a contributing member of society. So, you know, someone's like, did they ever get after you about, you know, something you did bad and practice or, you know, missing shots? Or did they ever talk like anything like that. And I said, well, they sometimes got out in the after practice and kept they pulled up into the parking lot waiting while we were finishing a rugby practice or soccer practice or whatever it was. Sometimes I would get to talking to in the car on the way home, but it had nothing to do with me my technique, or my skill or missing a shot, it probably had to do with me talking to one of my friends while the coach was trying to explain the next drill. So it had everything to do with respect or you know, how treating other people and all of that stuff. That's what my parents were correcting. Not techniques or skills or, or anything like that. And my when I very soon as I made the bobsled team, we found out that the rugby that not the rugby the bobsledding World Cup, the very first one of that season was actually going to be held in Calgary. And so my parents said, Oh, my gosh, we're gonna fly out. Well, we'll go to your first race. That's amazing. And I said, Oh my gosh, like, I don't want you to pay to come to Calgary. I don't even know if I'm racing. I won't even know until literally probably the day or two days before, whether I'm racing or not like, what are the chances of me actually racing in the first like, I don't want you to waste that money and blah, blah, blah. And my mom said very clearly, she said, Heather, you should know by now. We're not coming to. We're not coming to watch you. We're coming to support you. Oh, wow. So when that sinks in, and you actually think about what that means? Yeah, it's not based on performance for them. And I think that's a really big thing that kids struggle with now, is thinking that they have to perform in order to get love support validation.

Julie- Host: 28:09

Yeah, I mean, that's beautiful. It's like, for people who can't see it, I'm like, tearing up, you know, is like tears coming down my face, because that's so powerful. Like, as I'm a mom of three. And that's just like, what I hope for my children, you know, it's like, that's such a

Unknown: 28:22

child, if your child is on a team, because they feel socially accepted on that team, they might not care about reaching another level, they might just care that they have a group to, to have fun with and to hang out with. And if if they find out that you are only going to watch if they're going to be playing on the field, right? Then it's then that says, more words than anything.

Julie- Host: 28:47

Yeah. Wow. That's powerful. If you're

Unknown: 28:49

just as supportive of going if they're the water girl, or it makes a huge, huge difference.

Julie- Host: 28:55

Yeah. And then

Unknown: 28:57

when I was a child, so if we said, you know, the whole all these questions, what do you want to be when you grow up? What do you want if all of these different things? Well, I could say anything. And my parents, the response would be, oh, wow, what is the first thing that you would do if you were an astronaut? Or what are the oh my gosh, what do you think? What do you think it would take for you to do that? Like, what do you think so without even making it crazy, and like in depth or whatever, they're already in these very casual, they probably didn't even know what they were doing, to be honest. But they were teaching you visualization of what it would be like at the endpoint, so visualizing success and what you want to do. They're like, what, what's the first thing that you would do if you were that's the same thing my my parents told, like my sister wanted to be Monica grow up to be a chickadee. Like, no, when they're young, it's everything. They weren't going to say, oh, that's impossible. You could like let me explain to you the difference between a human and a bird right like she was Probably for, there's no need to do that my parents are very well aware that she's not going to grow up to become a chickity. And so what is the harm in letting people dream and letting kids dream and think about the possibilities? And what what, where's the first place you would lie to? If you were to become a chickity. And then you can just let your brain do the work. It's just It's remarkable. They're teaching a visualization, they were teaching us like even breaking down and figuring out the process, the steps, the milestones, the goals, the little steps that you'd have to do in order to achieve a certain goal, whether you're going to pursue that or not. I mean, my my sister is a doctor now like, she's, she's made it she's not a chickity. But like, it's, it's the same, it would be the same thing with any response that a child gives. There's no, there's no need to say that something is impossible. And that's where reality gets squashed with kids is, it's just, it's not necessary to squash those. So, you know, who knows, maybe maybe my sister would have become a Czech chickity mascot somewhere, right? Like, we just our vision of these things get so limited? Yeah. And we have to be careful not to squash those for the kids around us. Yeah, I

Julie- Host: 31:10

appreciate that. I, I mean, I have little kids now. And so they come up with the most unusual, interesting answers for things. But right. Like, I love that how you're saying your parents sound incredible. So thank you for sharing that story. I, I want to ask you now, like, there's so much we could go into, but for sake of time, like you have this really cool quote that I pulled from your Instagram, but I just really loved it. And you said, pursuing any dream or goal, it's not about the guarantees. It's about the possibilities. And I just, I would love you to speak on that. Because I thought that was really cool. Like, it's such an interesting mindset shift. Also.

Unknown: 31:55

It totally is, you're not the first person to pull that out. It's basically, it one acknowledges that there really are no guarantees. There are no guarantees in business, in sports or in life. We get thrown curveballs all the time that are unexpected. And we have to deal with those. And so if you are setting a goal where there is a guarantee, then it's probably not a very big goal, you're not taking a very big leap. And it's probably not very magical. So when I'm working with clients, this is another kind of shift, like a little mind shift that I help them with. And it's like I, I mentioned earlier today about goals being not wanting to set goals as binary outcomes, like right now we look at a goal, we set a goal. And then people are like, did you make it? Did you don't make it? Did you succeed? Or did you fail, but in order to discover what you're actually truly capable of, it's about setting that goal and maybe even setting it higher than what you really think is possible. And then setting it as a spectrum. And challenging yourself. Again, here's living in the house, again, it's to see how close you can get. It's not to see if you can get there or not. Because then again, it's binary, whatever. It's you know what I want to I just want to see how close I can get. And the power in that sentence is remarkable, because it also makes you more creative minded and thinking because it's challenged you it's kind of like how can I not can I but how can I? So how close can I get? It's like challenging you to see how close can you get even when something comes up? You're like, oh, no, I want to see how far I can get like, I want to see up close. How can I overcome this to seek to get closer and closer. But the other thing that sentence does, is it that it disempowers the naysayers and it really empowers you in that same sentence. So when someone when you tell someone that you want to become the president, or the prime minister or wherever, the leader of your country, and someone's like, oh, yeah, right. Like, as if you're gonna get that? Or do you really think you're gonna do that? Like, are you serious? You'll be like, well, you know what, I have no idea. Like, yeah, I might not. But I just, I just want to see how close I can get. Great. So maybe you don't become the president, but you become like a senator or you become a governor or you become a but you won't even get to that level. If you don't even you don't even try. Like you don't even try and challenge yourself to see how close you can get. It's It's really remarkable how we limit we limit the things that we do, or limit discovering what we're capable of doing just by by shutting down a seemingly insurmountable goal, instead of challenging us to see how close we can get there. And finding these different things along the way that that are still beyond what anyone else round you would have thought was possible. So it's, in my opinion, it's all about taking on this like this challenge. mind shift, this mind shift about challenges whether it's facing an overcoming an obstacle in front of you, for example, I had hip surgery, seven months before I had to be in the Rugby Sevens World Cup in Russia. And that surgery that hip surgery was nine months before I'd qualify for the national team for the Olympics for Sochi in 2014. So, the day after my surgery, a press release went out across across the country, announcing my intentions of representing Canada in two sports in both of those sports within the next year, on the international stage, and I had seven, I had seven interviews within a day. And, you know, they weren't saying lightly to my face, that it was impossible to do that, but a lot of them are questioning it. And it's easy for some of those people, you know, as well intentioned as they might be, or whatever to put seeds of doubt in your brain like to make you start thinking, Oh, well, maybe they're right, maybe I can't do this. But if you can shift it and say, yeah, maybe I can't, but I sure as hell want to see how close I can get, then it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter what they think. And whether that naysayer is an external person, or whether it's actually the little voice that sometimes gets that is in our own brain. That sentence can bring back our power can shut out that voice and can actually bring back Yeah, you know what, I might not make it. I just had hip surgery. Yeah, like, that's probably a very realistic possibility. But I just I, it doesn't matter. I want to I want to see how close I can get like, can I actually make the national scene but not get back on the Olympic team again? Can I? How close can I get to my fastest time that I did before surgery? How, you know, how can I do this? And how can I and then you're back into creative thinking and seeing just embracing that challenge of seeing how close I can get, like being a podcaster? Like, how like, can I make Yeah, number one podcast in the world? Yeah, well, if you don't even you're like, Yeah, okay, well, there a lot out there. So it's, maybe it's unlikely, but unlikely, does not mean impossible. Right? By embracing this challenge, like Yeah, okay, maybe I won't get there. But kind of be cool to just see how close I can get like, what can I do to maneuver myself to put myself in the best positioning in order to make that happen? Yeah. Like, it's just a very cool mindset. When you adopt that, then? Yeah,

Julie- Host: 37:28

I mean, for you, do you feel like you are? Would you call that solution oriented? Or do you feel like it's like curiosity driving? I'm like, curious, how would you explain that? Because I think that's so powerful. I mean, and I'm curious if that comes from your experience, just being in sports for a lot of your life and being part of a team? Or if that does come from partially like being in the Olympics and doing these incredible things? Or if it's just kind of who you are? Because I think that's, I think it's so amazing that you are teaching this because I think it is a learned thing for a lot of people like it's, I know, for me, like one of the things that I've been working really hard on the last few years is to have this this mindset of like, wow, there are so many more possibilities. And I've seen that right? I've seen it literally with this podcast. So I'm getting my own proof, right, like, but I didn't have that I was like, on the flip side of like, probably that binary thinking of like, Can I do this? I would automatically probably go to No, because it seems so it seems so hard. And then there's some pretty amazing things that I feel like I did, but you know, still like, it's like, it feels harder to surmount the obstacles. So I'm curious for you, like, what what would you call that? Like, what would you call this thinking or like this process,

Unknown: 38:52

I've started calling kind of these little like, the accumulation of these little mind shifts, like champion mindset, and, but not just in terms of being like a sports champion. But I think that everyone had the ability to either Hone what they have or develop that mindset within them, regardless of whatever industry it is. And so it's easy to use sports analogies, and sport metaphors, and all of these different things to kind of demonstrate that because everyone, whether they played sports or not, they understand them, they can relate to them, they get them, but these mind shifts are they just, they transcend sport, it's not just about sport. It's it's literally about life in any in any industry. And it's believing in the possibilities, not the guarantees, and the pursuing possibilities. Because I mean, you could do anything and then you could come down with you could be on track and then come down with an illness that the world has never heard of before. Or to be a pandemic that shuts down the world over there could be through these things that are literally we have to acknowledge that there are so many things that are out of our control. So no matter how much we plan, there is a are often are sometimes these things that come up. So it is about challenging yourself to see how Cushing get despite all of these things that are not in our control, and focusing on the things that are, are in our control. But I just have to tell you that like this mindset, I, I mean, I believe that my parents helped with like we talked about earlier about that kind of, I guess, believing anything's possible. But it wasn't until this whole Olympic experience, like when I was 27, kind of being, like, literally kind of pulled into the world, this world. It wasn't until then, when I realized how much I would save the majority of humans on this earth, myself included until that time, are living on autopilot, we think we are making autonomous choices, and in a way we are, but we are making our choices, and setting our goals within the boundaries of our direct exposures and environments. And so I knew that I would be, I would be fine, I would be successful as an occupational therapist in that role in that job. And, you know, I there wasn't any question, you know, with my background with my family, that I would be going to university, you know, it was just kind of the, the, the autopilot for my path, it was just the path that was kind of laid out in front of me, and I didn't question it. I didn't ask for what are the what are the opportunities outside of that, that I'm not considering? Like, what are those things beyond these boundaries that I've been exposed like, that have limited what I've been exposed to in terms of the possibilities, and we base those, we base the things that we want to be when we grow up, you know, in air quotes, we base those on our direct exposures, or what we see what we see as being actually possible for someone like us, how we, how we, how we identify ourselves, where we put ourselves in the world, how we compartmentalize ourselves, and someone like me, would go to university would get a, you know, a decent job working in a clinic or in a you know, whatever that was someone like me, because that's what people in my family did. That's whatever. And so when we compartmentalize that, that dictates our path that dictates where we're going. And which is fun, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that path. If, if it's intentional, if we're if our intention, attention is drawn to that, and it's, they become intentional choices. We're not not saying that there are better options outside those boundaries. But there are options and possibilities outside of those boundaries. So it's just, I think, because of this whole Olympic thing, like, I can now look back, I mean, I have had therapists who want to biopsy my muscles they don't like in terms of the genetic kind of phenomenon they were seeing in front of them. Like, it's been kind of weird, actually. But growing up, I didn't realize that, but now in hindsight, I can see that. But it's still never occurred to me, because I wasn't, it just never, that that wasn't in my boundary that wasn't in my lane of what I was going to do for a living, how I was going to live my life, you know, it's the same. It's the same reason why we talked about the white picket fence and two and a half kids and one dog and whatever, but it's a lot of that is autopilot, a lot of that is what's happening around to what your, your friends and your colleagues are doing at the time. And that momentum that we kind of get swept up in and it people think of those decisions, but they don't really think through those decisions and what that means for for their life and the rest of their life, and how that how that looks in the big picture. So really, I just want people to not sell themselves short, in terms of what they are truly capable of, and what their life can look like, for themselves. And, and so their families and yeah, how

Julie- Host: 43:57

do you? How do you encourage people or like, how do you suggest for people to start taking those initial steps? Like I think so many times, whether I've heard it through people on the podcast, or I've heard it through work I've been doing, like people sort of have this intuitive knowing of like curiosity, right? That happens or like, I really love doing this, I really have this passion about this. I really have this interest in this. But it's like taking that that initial step towards it. And especially when it's something that maybe they haven't seen someone else do who looks like them or seems like they have a similar lifestyle, or they just don't know how to go about it. Like do you have tips for for like actually starting down a new path that feels really uncomfortable or really unknown?

Unknown: 44:47

Yeah, well, part of that is, is you have to know what that endpoint what that you want. You want that to look like. And so some people are just not clear. They're just, they're like, Oh, I just want to be successful. Well, success means very different things to different people. It's the same thing as someone saying, Oh, I'd like to lose weight well, how much and by when and why? And like, all these different things, or I want to be healthy? Well, what does that mean? Like, there are all these things that are just very abstract concepts, and not specific. So you have to get very specific about what that angle looks like. And then what you need to do. And so this is, some people are great at this naturally, just being able to break those things down. And sometimes that's why other people get coaches to help them break that down to figure out the path to get there, because they don't know what that path is. But what it is, is breaking down those things, what does it take all of that stuff. And when you break all of it down, when you set a timeline on it, put like milestones in there, have it all, whatever souped up to the point where it's broken down into tasks, like actual, the steps that you could check off, like, I need to get this done, I need to get this done, I need to do this, or the things that you need to do daily, like I need to do this daily. And then you check those off, like everything is a check, everything gets down to a check box. And when it gets down to there, you can see very clearly the things that need to get done. And it's, it's easier to check off those boxes, when they're boxes to check off. Also, though, when you do that work, when you actually look at what it takes, there are two steps, first of all, is figuring out what it is that looks like where you want to end up. But also evaluating or kind of assessing how you think that will change your life, both for the positive and the negative, because some people are only thinking about the positive things of happening when you achieve this level or get to this point or do whatever. And they don't always think about the whole picture. They're just thinking about the good parts. And then when you have that whole list of all the steps that it takes to get to where you want to go. Is that worth it? And when you look at that, it's what toll is that going to take? So there was a I wrote about this book, too, I quoted I got Mark Manson wrote an article. And he said it's not questions shouldn't be. How badly do you want it? The question should be what are you willing to sacrifice to get there? What are you willing to do to get there? So John Maxwell, the author in the States leadership author, he also says that so many people want to do what I do, but they they're not willing to do what I did to get here. And all we're doing is we're comparing our like, these people, their highlight reels and their their success stories, their chapter 22, our chapter two, and it's like, they just want to jump there and forget that there are 18 other chapters before getting there. Yeah, so it's an AR, is that what you're willing to do? And so what Mark talks about in his article, and his book is, like people who want to be like, millionaire CEOs or whatever, in a corner glass office, well, are you willing to spend two years of your life with no social life? Basically sleeping under your desk at work, and having no weekend's no holidays? Or whatever? Are you willing to do that? Some people? Yes, some people might say yes, but really not. Everyone wants to be an Olympic champion. Are you willing to miss birthdays and weddings and family events and be on tour and kind of live out of a suitcase for years to in order to do that? Some people? Yes, some people? No. Everyone says, oh, I want to have a great sex life. Well, are you willing to have the awkward conversations that it will take in order to get there? Some people? Yes, some people No. So it's all of these things that we really want, like, oh, the best life ever would be to be a millionaire, and to be an Olympic champion, and to have great sex life. But, but yet, our people are not willing to do the things that it takes to get to that point. So when everything is laid out in front of them, they can see if it's worth it or not. And if you're like, you know what, I don't know if it's worth it, but I can I at least know the steps I can take and along the way I can keep evaluating whether it's worth it or not. The only catch here is that sometimes when people tell others their goals, and they start taking steps, then they feel like they can't quit, when in fact, it's not quitting if it's an intentional choice that acknowledges that it's not right for you anymore. So we get in our heads on a lot of things. And we just kind of need to rein ourselves back and kind of be that little pep talk for ourselves. And I think what, that's what some of those little mind shifts can be. Yeah,

Julie- Host: 49:25

I love that. I think that's a really interesting point about the idea of stopping something and being intentional about it, too. Like, I think, yeah, that I had that like very briefly. I had that in my own life. Long time ago, I decided I was gonna do an MBA. And I was like, I don't know why, but I just decided that was the thing for me that I should do like how you talk about like, this is typical of someone in my position, and that's me. Yeah, yeah. And I don't know I got it in my mind that I should do this MBA and then I got in I had taken a class. And the second class I, I finished the first class and I was not happy about it. And I'm a good, I'm a really good student, I have been a good student my whole life. And I like school. And the second class I got to, I was crying and crying and crying before I was supposed to, like, go to the first day of class. And then I got there, and I couldn't get myself to do the assignments. And I'm like, why can't I do this? I'm a great student. I just, and so I just ended up stopping. And then luckily, I found another degree program that worked out much better and was much more aligned to who I was. And what I like to do. Man, it was hard to quit. I mean, because it felt like choosing the right yeah, yeah. And that was I wish that I would have had that, that it was choosing intentionally? Because that's such an important point. Yeah, so I really love that view. Because it is especially a thing for people who are high achievers and who have done a lot of incredible things, and who want to do a lot of incredible things. We have these certain things in mind for ourselves. Yeah, yeah.

Unknown: 51:07

Now one thing about that, oh, my gosh, I think I lost my brain. Oh, no. Oh, one thing you were talking about that quitting point or that that opting out point that choosing to deviate and choose a different path? Yeah, one thing about that is that we all have a breaking point within this boat, like on the pursuit of this goal. And that's the point when you're dealing with obstacles and challenges and you're fatigued, you're tired, you're worn out, you're whatever you're dealing with small politics, in, in the workforce, or on the sports team, or whatever, all of these things. And there is a point where it'll just be like, you know, what, I'm done. This is not worth, like getting that is not worth dealing with all of this right now. And that might be absolutely 100% the right decision for you to leave at that moment, because of all of these different things. But you want to make sure that you've kind of done the root why exercise like, you know, Simon Sinek talks about your why your reason for doing something? Well, in my book, I talked about your root why which is asking that question, like five layers down, like five or six or whatever, asking that okay, well, why is that important? Okay, well, yeah, but why is that important to you? Why do you need that? Or why? Whatever, blah, blah, and it usually comes down to a feeling. And it's often a feeling of validation, feeling of being loved, or respected? Or like, what are you internally and emotionally getting out of this? It's not just a paycheck. It's not just a raise or a bonus. It's not just like that could be you want that? Because you want to get your kids into high school. What is why is that important? Well, so that I can appear to have my stuff together, you know, so that it appears that I'm a good parent, or that's important to me or validating that I've that I've done a good job, or, like whatever that is, that is the root why. And if you can get down to the root, why, then often that moves your breaking point further along the spectrum. A few I think every layer down you go moves that a little bit more, for example, I almost stopped bobsledding the year year and a half before the Vancouver Olympics when we won. And that was because of small politics, mind games on the team. Like lots of stress, kind of trying to juggle different personalities and not rock the boat between other people. And it was just not great. And I remember my father had meetings in Toronto, when he came to pick me up, you're going for dinner, and I just had had this email. And I had been crying because I'm like this is so I don't want Why am I being put in the middle of these other two people when I don't have when i This doesn't even involve me. And it was just ongoing and ongoing and ongoing. And I was just like, You know what? Winning a medal at the Olympics is not worth this mental health stuff. Like it's not worth this emotional stuff that's going on. I just I don't want to deal with this anymore. I don't want to deal with the small politics, the bits of bullshit. Like I don't want to deal with that. And it's just not fun to do that. So I don't I'm out. Anyway, when I mentioned this to my dad, when I got in the car, he just he would have supported anything that I chose to do. He didn't care about whatever. But he just said, Oh, that's interesting. I said, What do you mean? He goes, Well, I just, I guess I never really thought about it as being about winning a medal. And I said, Oh, but what did you think it was about? And he said, I don't know. I guess I just thought like, how great it was that or how great it would be that people from our hometown and people from small communities and people from just how inspired and motivated like inspired they would be just from your journey just from your story of going there. And I was like ah And I realized that the impact I could make on people, whether we won or not, you know, the impact of just pursuing that move the needle for me. And so that moved way ahead. Now, I'm not saying I was thinking about impact when I was squatting in a workout. Like, I was like, Okay, gotta win gold. Got it, like, Whatever, whatever I was thinking. I'm not saying it was at the forefront of my mind all the time. But certainly, anytime I reached a point where I was really frustrated, and it was a potential breaking point time, then pulling on that route, why, like pulling on that deeper purpose? For doing something helps me get through any of that stuff. So. So that's a, that's also part of that decision making process?

Julie- Host: 55:45

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's really good food for thought, too. And I think also, it helps. Like, by removing some of those layers, it also, yeah, makes it probably very clear one way or the other, like, is this really for you right now? Or is it not? And is it okay to like, show my attention.

Unknown: 56:08

And sometimes when you get down to that feeling is then the feeling itself is whatever that is, there's no wrong one, like, that's just what it is. But that doesn't mean that you have to do that same activity to get that same feeling. So it's almost very awakening being like, okay, now I now I know why I was going after this. But it doesn't have to be this. Like, I can get that feeling or that sense of validation, or understanding what that means. You can get that in a different way and sometimes in a healthier way, or, or whatever. So, it's, it's a really great exercise to do. Yeah,

Julie- Host: 56:45

I like that. I'm gonna do that in my own life. I feel like it could be so useful right now. So I'm in a time of transition. So it's perfect. Okay, so I, I, because I have so many questions, but we're, we're running out of time. And so I want to, I want to talk a little bit about for people who are listening, and they're like, I'm not a sports person, but they are sports people. Do you have any advice for them? Like, because you have achieved so many incredible milestones in in your different careers? Like it in different sports? Do you have any advice like, on how you've done that? Or how you've accomplished that, whether it's mindset, or like, the physical aspects, or anything else that I wouldn't know of as someone who's not very sporty myself? Yeah,

Unknown: 57:39

I think that the like, the physical part is kind of the most, the obvious piece for for athletes. And I'm, but I'm gonna say this, that right now, I've started pulling this this point into my keynotes for entrepreneurs, for industry leaders, for whatever, because it is a point that I think the higher you go in sports, it's naturally, it naturally gives you more of an emphasis and places more importance on rest and recovery, in order to be able to not just perform at a high level. But to be able to sustain that without burnout without injury is mostly what we're talking about. But when we talk about other industries, the higher you go, and the higher demands you have for your brain for your emotional ability to handle stress, and all that stuff. The emphasis on rest and recovery is not the same. So in sports, it's easy, because we're thinking overuse injuries, right? Like, we're you need to rest and recover that so that you don't get an injury. Well, the same goes over to the workforce. And so when I talk about rest and recovery, I'm not talking about that as one thing, rest and recovery are two very different things. Rest is passive, it is sleeping, it is watching Netflix, or whatever it is lying, listening to music, whatever that is for you, whatever kind of relaxation is for you, that's rest. But recovery, is doing the things that actually feed your soul, doing the things that light you up doing the things that where you lose track of time. And you just are like, what, what do you mean that mountain, like gardening for some people, puzzling for some people. Like for some people, it's just going for a walk and getting lost in the woods, like whatever it is. That is, those are the things that you need to talk about to bring into your life. And not think of it as a luxury I'm taking time out for like, you know, I'm doing all these fancy things, or these, you know, I'm taking all this rest and relaxation as being a negative or a luxury thing. But actually bringing it in as being part of the strategy to take things to the next level. Like actually, this is part of my plan. Because this then means I will not burn out and I will be able to sustain a high level of performance and whatever I'm doing and not make mistakes when it really counts, and not do all those things. So the things that that rest and help you rejuvenate, but also the things that bring you back energy, and that actually fill you up with energy and joy and light. And the same goes with sports. So you need an outlet, you need something that's kind of different than sports, that it's not all encompassing, because sports is not the only thing that matters, it's hard to believe sometimes in it. But with with athletes, especially high performing athletes, those rest and recovery days are just as important as your training days, the higher you go. And sometimes for athletes, especially type A athletes, it's harder to take a day off than it is to do the squatting over 400 pound lifting days. So it's that part is about recognizing that you need those days now, I never had to have those days in a row. Right. And I was an athlete, like I had my recovery days were like offset, I always took a Thursday and a Sunday off. It's not like I'm giving myself this luxury long weekend. It's their strategic, right. And so part of that for me was and following that to a tee was also knowing that I like my goal, because there's so many things like we talked about earlier that are out of our control. I can't my goal can't be a finish. They can't be like I want to win gold medal, or I want to win because one, there's another teammate and my sled. There are other teams with other equipment with other trainers and therapists and dietitians and whatever they have like, it's different, so I can't control that stuff. And I can only control part of our performance, I can control mine. But my goal was to basically to be able to stand at the start of that bobsled track at the top of the Olympic Games, just knowing that I had done everything I could to be the best that I could be at that moment. And so it didn't, so that I wasn't you know sloughing off a workout or sloughing off or recovery or something because I wanted to have no regrets. And the only way you can have no regrets with a fourth place finish, or with just not making the team or with not getting the job or not getting the promotion or whatever is at least knowing that there's nothing more you could have done to have presented yourself better or be better in that moment. So that comes down to not missing training sessions and doing all of it. And, and only taking one off, because it either it's either scheduled to do so or you can or you're doing it because you know your body is in need of rest and recovery. And you're taking it off because it's moving the needle forward. So that you can stand still at that starting line. Like if I took a day out a day off because you know, my friends are visiting from out of town and you know, whatever, I'm gonna Oh, it's just one workout. Well, if I just missed winning that gold medal, or if I just missed that workout, is that day going to come on me am I going to wonder if that is the thing that made a difference is that going to, I didn't want any of that I didn't want any haunting thoughts or any regrets or any wonderings, I can now say that I did everything that I could to be the best that I could be in that moment. And every teammate is also doing that. And if we are equipping ourselves the best we can with what we have and the things that are in our control, then that's all we can leave on the table. So I think that's probably the best mindset that most people shouldn't have for any goals, because there are so many things that we cannot control that are not in our control. And so I'm sure the pandemic, for example, shutdown many goals, and some people are gonna say, Oh, I was a failure. Well, maybe your goal instead of doing this thing should have been to be at the cusp of that and just knowing that you were going to pursue this with no regrets with no excuses with nothing left on the table. Because like I said, there are no guarantees we have so there's so many things in this world that are out of our control. So that is the healthiest mindset that I can provide for people. Yeah,

Julie- Host: 1:04:11

I really love that. I think it definitely applies to people outside of sports and in Oh, yeah, yeah, I mean, just that intentionality and knowing that you did everything you could you showed up, you know in the best way you could for yourself or others. Yeah, that's

Unknown: 1:04:27

powerful. And sports is like you know how we say high school is like a microcosm of society as a whole. So sports and the analogies in that are the same like whether you're taking a high school analogy or a sports and like all these things. When it comes to what it takes to be successful like the qualities it takes to be successful as an athlete or the same qualities it takes to be successful in any occupation or industry skills are different. The skills required are different, but the actual qualities and characteristics that it takes are usually the ones it takes to successfully manage change. and face challenges and overcome the obstacles that will inevitably inevitably pop up along the way. And those are the things that it will take to achieve and to discover what you're truly capable of in any industry. Yeah.

Julie- Host: 1:05:13

Yeah, that makes complete sense. So I, I love that way to, like, end the conversation to I'm curious like we normally because I talk to someone about like, very specific career and like, if there's any associations or organizations or just resources that you might share, and I know we we kind of open it up here to like a really great broad conversation based on all your your experience speaking in the house as an athlete, I'm curious if you have any resources that you love that may not necessarily be like specific trade based or specific association, but just things that you love that might be helpful for people? Well, I

Unknown: 1:05:52

would say my book for sure, of

Julie- Host: 1:05:54

course, right.

Unknown: 1:05:56

So there are like, I'm terrible at remembering names and titles. So this is really this is really challenging for me to do. But there is a book that I that I read once this I remember it's my Genesis sincero Cicero Sentra chin, okay, yes. And and it's, you're a badass. And there might be I think she has a few different variations of that. But I loved I love that book. It's a very easy read. It was interesting, because she's a little rough around the edges. But it, it sounded so much like everything that I talked about, but in a different tone in a different tone and a different, like, slightly different emphasis on things. It was it was really great, actually, like, I really liked that book. Oh, gosh, what's another one? Mark Manson's book. I can't remember the title. It is the one that has the F word in it. That's blacked blanked out on the cover.

Julie- Host: 1:06:49

Okay. Look it up. Yeah.

Unknown: 1:06:52

So that one though, if people are, are not liking swearing, it is he swears throughout the whole book. So it might not be the best one for for them. But if you take that part with a grain of salt, if you take that out of there, it's it is interesting, because it's, it's, again, an interesting concept and an interesting way of looking at things, different perspective that I really appreciate it. It's just, it's just in a harsh Dilip, like in a in your face parts delivery. So for some people that really, really resonates. And so for other people, it would be, it would be a little too, like, he's yelling at me through these pages kind of thing. But I enjoyed that perspective, I enjoyed the perspectives that he had tone was a little, it was a little rough, but I really enjoyed his perspectives in it. Like he was the one I quoted earlier about the one that said, you know, it's not about how badly do you want it? It's what are you willing to sacrifice? So it's, he's kind of very much in your face, like making you question things and you're like, oh, oh, I never thought about it that way. And that's what I love, I love good. That's what I do with my clients and with my audiences. And it's helping them shift their perspective, so that they can see the possibilities that still exist in their situation, regardless of whatever they're facing. And so anytime I can get my perspective shifted by someone like that, or by something that I'm like, Ah, okay, that's interesting, like different food for thought for bringing things and so I really, I enjoyed that, that part of it. So Dr. Robin Hanley Defoe, she just released a new book called stress wisely. And there's another part of the title oh, gosh, it's stress wise, the Anna something world in an in a stressful world or whatever. Anyway, I've heard her speak before she's become a friend of mine. Sure book is. She's remarkable at being able to break down, especially today's society, the frenetic pace of today's society, the craziness that the expectations that we're all living under, in terms of email responses, and texting responses, and social media and all of these things that are being thrown at us. And she is remarkable at breaking up breaking that down in a very in, in a research like science based, researched way to help people kind of like stress is not a bad thing, right? If it's harnessed in the right way, but we can let stress kind of take control of us. So that's where she's getting, we're not gonna get rid of the stress that we have on us. But can we harness it? Can we? Can we make it better? Can we learn to take those moments to kind of just regulate it and kind of make it helpful instead of instead of hindering? Anyway, those are off the top of my head. I'm actually proud of myself like that. That wasn't good for me to come up with the names of books.

Julie- Host: 1:09:48

Thank you. Yeah, sorry.

Unknown: 1:09:50

I think I just pulled I think some of the Yeah, I like there's some podcasts that I cannot remember right now. But like, I there's not one or two setups. on capitalism, two, I might just have an episode of one and find someone else and listen to an episode of another and then another. And so there are some people where I listen, and I'm like, Oh, I love that. Like, the way they said that was so cool. Like, it just kind of just triggered something. So sometimes it's just about finding that you've heard it before, but the way someone says it can just make or break your aha moment. And that's, that's what I hope to give people as aha moments being like, Oh, I never would have thought about that. And that's what I can do for people. Yeah,

Julie- Host: 1:10:32

well, I mean, definitely, for me, even just with this time with you, it's been so interesting to, yeah, to, like, hear your thoughts on things and like, how you look at things just based on all your incredible experiences. And I know even Yeah, like the idea of going five layers deeper into the why, like, I like not just the initial layer, but like really digging. And keep asking is, is really interesting. So I really appreciate you so much for being on. It's been, you know, it's such a, like a perfect way to start the new year. Like, I feel like it worked out so well, that, you know, we ended up having all these, like near misses. And here you are, you know, it's the start to a brand new year. And what a wonderful way to start like with with possibilities, right and, and it's just yeah, I feel like it was meant to be. So one tip for

Unknown: 1:11:24

some years resolutions, okay, for New Year's resolutions, because I'm sure people are kind of in them now. And but but listen, you can change them, you can adjust this and pivot and do what you need to do. Because as we all know, there are a lot of new year's resolutions, probably the majority of them, I don't have the statistic off the top of my head, but most of them do not last beyond two weeks. So part of that is what we're talking about your why your route while doing something. And a lot of times New Year's resolutions are set, because they feel like their goals were supposed to have. And they're not actually goals we really truly care about. So usually those resolutions are something something health related, like Oh, I'm gonna go to the gym, four days a week, or three days a week or whatever, well, do you want to go to the gym? Like do you like, Are you sure that's something you want to do, because if you don't want to anytime there's that fork in the road, you will always choose the other easier path to go to the thing that draws you the thing that's drawing your attention. So really, truly just think about what you want, like what you actually like a goal that you really want. And if it's some kind of health lifestyle goal, just make it something and know why you're doing it. Because if you do not know why you're doing it, and if it's important to everyone else around you doesn't necessarily mean that it's the same holds the same value to you. So if it doesn't hold any value or enough value, then you will eventually without a doubt, you will eventually fall off that path. So really dig deep and figure out what it is you want or why you set the goal that you did. And at least if you know why, and it is really important to you, then you'll stay strong. Yeah,

Julie- Host: 1:12:58

very good recommendation. I love that. I want to ask also the very last question before we go. And I asked to all the guests. So will you share a sentence that uses verbiage or jargon from your field and then translate it so it's understandable to us?

Unknown: 1:13:15

Oh, wow, okay. Okay, which field? So

Julie- Host: 1:13:20

many choices? Okay, well,

Unknown: 1:13:22

if I were, if I were talking about my speaking my the industry I work in now speaking or coaching, I would probably say just the word gig. Like if you get a gig or it's kind of like an event, or a booking or whatever, then I would say okay, but that's not a fun one, let's think. Okay, so with bobsledding. I've used terms before and people are like, Oh my gosh, we got the lingo now so I would have to say that's probably the best one. So sentence using jargon. Which runners are you using for sliding today?

Julie- Host: 1:13:57

Okay, and that's perfect. And what does that mean?

Unknown: 1:14:01

So there are two words in there that are probably unknown or not unknown, but different for people. So runners for us does not mean running shoes. It means the blades on the bottom of our bobsled. Okay, they come in sets of four and you can you know use two fronts the same and two backs from a different set or whatever depending on temperature depending on ice temperature depending on whether all of that stuff. So which runners are we using for sliding today? And sliding is just the lingo for training for practicing when you're actually going from the top of the track to the bottom. Okay, so yeah, which runners which runners are we using for sliding today?

Julie- Host: 1:14:42

Wow.

Unknown: 1:14:44

A full lingo jargon sentence for the sport about sledding. I

Julie- Host: 1:14:48

love it. Yeah, I had no idea that you could switch out like the Yeah, like the lights on the other plates. That's cool to know. And yeah, and I wouldn't have never known that other that other way to say I think. Yeah, I think I would have just call it bobsledding. So I didn't know that you call it sliding. Yeah, there you go. Oh my god. I

Unknown: 1:15:10

just, yeah. Well, thank

Julie- Host: 1:15:13

you. That was a wonderful example. They're both great examples. I think for those of us who loves, you know, like the idea of, of sports, and especially like bobsledding just looks so rad, right like that. It's just seems very cool that to know that extra insight into into that world. So

Unknown: 1:15:30

if you go watch one, you'll be like, Oh, I wonder what runners are using for sliding today? Exactly.

Julie- Host: 1:15:35

Yeah. We have the inside scoop. All right. Well, thank you so much for being here with such a pleasure. If people if they want to reach out to you if they want to learn more about you know, your book, or you how, how can they find you? How can they reach you? Yeah,

Unknown: 1:15:53

it's pretty easy. Either under LinkedIn, Heather Moyse is pretty easy to find, or Instagram, same thing otherwise, or Facebook kind of voice, it's very easy. And if you forget that, then it's just if you Googled Heather, Bob slay, or rugby Canada, then you would, it would pop up somehow, my book is pretty easy to find. It's either on the softcover, or Kindle version, or audio book that I narrated. Those are all those all can be found on Amazon, or an audible or on kind of wherever you listen. But you can also get them through my website and a few hardcover books can be ordered through my website as well. And if they get ordered through my website, then I can actually sign them and personalize them before they get sent out. Which is why so so any of those things, if you forget where to find things, you can always just go to my website. And that's just how their minds.com And yeah, that's pretty much it.

Julie- Host: 1:16:48

Thank you. Well, it's such a pleasure. What a fun way to start this year. Thank you.

Unknown: 1:16:53

Oh, you're so welcome.

Julie- Host: 1:16:58

Hey, everybody, thank you so much for listening to women with cool jobs. I'll be releasing a new episode every two weeks. So make sure you hit that subscribe button. And if you loved the show, please give me a five star rating. Also, it would mean so much if you share this episode with someone you think would love it? Or would find it inspirational. And lastly, do you have ideas for future shows? Or do you know any Rockstar women with cool jobs, I would love to hear from you. You can email me at Julie at women with cool jobs.com. Or you can find me on Instagram at women cool jobs. Again, that's women cool jobs. Thank you so much for listening and have an incredible day.

Unknown: 1:17:50

I've started calling kind of these little like the accumulation of these little mind shifts like the champion mindset, and, but not just in terms of being like a sports champion. But I think that everyone had the ability to either Hone what they have or develop that mindset within them, regardless of whatever industry it is. And so it's easy to use sport analogies, and sport metaphors, and all of these different things to kind of demonstrate that because everyone, whether they played sports or not, they understand them, they can relate to them, they they get them, but these mind shifts are they just, they transcend sport, it's not just about sports. It's literally about life in any in any industry. And it's believing in the possibilities, not the guarantees, and the pursuing possibilities. Because I mean, you could do anything and then you could come down with you could be on track and then come down with an illness that the world has never heard of before. Or that could be a pandemic that shuts down the world over there could be through these things that are literally we have to acknowledge that there are so many things that are out of our control. So no matter how much we plan, there is often or sometimes these things that come up. So it is about challenging yourself to see how Cushing get despite all of these things that are not in our control, and focusing on the things that are are in our control. But I just have to tell you that like this mindset I I mean, I believe that my parents helped with like we talked about earlier about that kind of, I guess believing anything's possible. But it wasn't until this whole Olympic experience like when I was 27 kind of being like literally kind of pulled into the world this world. It wasn't until then when I realized how much I would save the majority of humans on this earth, myself included until that time, are living on autopilot. We think we are making autonomous choices, and in a way we are but we are making our choices and setting our goals within the boundaries of our direct exposures and environments. And So I knew that I would be, I would be fine, I would be successful as an occupational therapist in that role in that job. And, you know, I, there wasn't any question, you know, with my background with my family, that I would be going to university, you know, it was just kind of the, the, the autopilot for my path, it was just the path that was kind of laid out in front of me, and I didn't question it. I didn't ask for what are the what are the opportunities outside of that, that I'm not considering? Like, what are those things beyond these boundaries that I've been exposed like, that have limited what I've been exposed to, in terms being possibilities, and we base those, we base the things that we want to be when we grow up, you know, in air quotes, we base those on our direct exposures, or what we seem what we see as being actually possible for someone like us, how we, how we, how we identify ourselves, where we put ourselves in the world, how we compartmentalize ourselves, and someone like me, would go to university would get a, you know, a decent job working in a clinic or in a you know, whatever that was someone like me, because that's what people in my family did. That's whatever. And so when we compartmentalize that, that dictates our path that dictates where we're going. And which is fun, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that path. If, if it's intentional, if we're if our intention, attention is drawn to that, and it's, they become intentional choices. We're not not saying that there are better options outside those boundaries. But there are options and possibilities outside of those boundaries. So it's just I think, because of this whole Olympic thing, like, I can now look back, I mean, I have had therapists who, you know, want to biopsy my muscles, they don't under like, in terms of the genetic kind of phenomenon they were seeing in front of them, like, it's been kind of weird, actually. But growing up, I didn't realize that, but now in hindsight, I can see that. But it still never occurred to me, because I wasn't, it just never, that that wasn't in my boundary that wasn't in my lane of what I was going to do for a living, how I was going to live my life, you know, it's the same. It's the same reason why we talked about the white picket fence and two and a half kids and one dog and whatever, but it's a lot of that is autopilot, a lot of that is what's happening around to what your, your friends and your colleagues are doing at the time. And that momentum that we kind of get swept up in and it people think of those decisions, but they don't really think through those decisions and what that means for for their life and the rest of their life, and how that how that looks in the big picture. So really, I just want people to not sell themselves short, in terms of what they're truly capable of, and what their life can look like, for themselves and, and for their families. And, yeah,

Julie- Host: 1:22:55

how do you? How do you encourage people? Or like, how do you suggest for people to start taking those initial steps? Like I think so many times, whether I've heard it through people on the podcast, or I've heard it through work I've been doing, like people sort of have this intuitive knowing of like curiosity, right? That happens or like, I really love doing this, I really have this passion about this, I really have this interest in this. But it's like taking that that initial step towards it. And especially when it's something that maybe they haven't seen someone else do who looks like them? Or seems like they have a similar lifestyle, or they just don't know how to go about it. Like do you have tips for for like actually starting down a new path that feels really uncomfortable or really unknown? Yeah,

Unknown: 1:23:46

well, part of that is, is you have to know what that endpoint what that you what you want that to look like. And so some people are just not clear. They're just, they're like, Oh, I just want to be successful. Well, success means very different things to different people. It's the same thing as someone saying, Oh, I'd like to lose weight. Well, how much and by when and why? And like, all these different things, or I want to be healthy? Well, what does that mean? Like, there are all these things that are just very abstract concepts, and not specific. So you have to get very specific about what that angle looks like. And then what you need to do. And so this is, some people are great at this naturally, just being able to break those things down. And sometimes that's why other people get coaches to help them break that down to figure out the path to get there because they don't know what that path is. But what it is, is breaking down those things. What does it take all of that stuff and when you break all of it down, when you set a timeline on it put like milestones in there, have it all whatever souped up to the point where it's broken down into tasks, like actual the steps that you could check off like I need to get this done. I need to get this done. I need to do this, or the things that you need to do daily like I need to do this daily. And then you check those off like everything is a check everything gets down to Have a checkbox and when it gets down to there, you can see very clearly the things that need to get done. And it's, it's easier to check off those boxes when there are boxes to check off. Also, though, when you do that work, when you actually look at what it takes, there are two steps, first of all, is figuring out what it is that looks like where you want to end up. But also evaluating or kind of assessing how you think that will change your life, both for the positive and the negative, because some people are only thinking about the positive things of happening when you achieve this level, or get to this point, or do whatever. And they don't always think about the whole picture. They're just thinking about the good parts. And then when you have that whole list of all the steps that it takes to get to where you want to go. Is that worth it? And when you look at that, it's what toll is that gonna take? So there was a I wrote about this book, too, I quoted I got Mark Manson wrote an article. And he said, It's not questions shouldn't be. How badly do you want it? The question should be what are you willing to sacrifice to get there? What are you willing to do to get there? So John Maxwell, the author in the States leadership author, he also says that so many people want to do what I do, but they they're not willing to do what I did to get here. And all we're doing is we're comparing our like, these people, their highlight reels and their their success stories there, chapter 22. Hour chapter two. And it's like, they just want to jump there and forget that there are 18 other chapters before getting there. Yeah, so it's an AR, is that what you're willing to do? And so what Mark talks about in his article in his book is, like people who want to be like, millionaire CEOs or whatever, in a corner glass office, well, are you willing to spend two years of your life with no social life? Basically sleeping on your desk at work, and having no weekend's no holidays? Or whatever? Are you willing to do that? Some people? Yes, some people might say yes, but really not. Everyone wants to be an Olympic champion. Are you willing to miss birthdays and weddings and family events and be on tour and kind of live out of a suitcase for years to in order to do that? Some people? Yes, some people? No. Everyone says, oh, I want to have a great sex life. Well, are you willing to have the awkward conversations that it will take in order to get there? Some people? Yes, some people No. So it's all of these things that we really want, like, oh, the best life ever would be to be a millionaire, and to be an Olympic champion, and to have great sex life. But, but yet, our people are not willing to do the things that it takes to get to that point. So when everything is laid out in front of them, they can see if it's worth it or not. And if you're like, you know what, I don't know if it's worth it, but I can I at least know the steps I can take and along the way, I can keep evaluating whether it's worth it or not. The only catch errors that sometimes when people tell others their goals, and they start taking steps, then they feel like they can't quit, when in fact, it's not quitting if it's an intentional choice that acknowledges that it's not right for you anymore. So we get in our heads and a lot of things and we just kind of need to rein ourselves back and kind of be that little pep talk for ourselves. And I think what, that's what some of those little mind shifts can be. Yeah,

Julie- Host: 1:28:24

I love that. I think that's an really interesting point about the idea of stopping something. And being intentional about it, too. Like, I think, yeah, that that's, I had that like, very briefly, I had that in my own life. Long time ago, I decided I was gonna do an MBA. And I was like, I don't know why. But I just decided that was the thing for me that I should do like how you talk about like, this is typical of someone in my position, and that's me. Yeah. And I don't know, I got it in my mind that I should do this MBA. And then I got in and I had taken a class. And the second class, I, I finished the first class and I was not happy about it. And I'm a good I'm a really good student. I have been a good student my whole life. And I liked school. And the second class I got to, I was crying and crying and crying before I was supposed to, like, go to the first day of class. And then I got there and I couldn't get myself to do the assignments. And I'm like, why can't I do this? I'm a great student. I just, and so I just ended up stopping. And then luckily, I found another degree program that worked out much better and was much more aligned to who I was. And what I like to do. Man, it was hard to quit. I mean, because it felt like choosing the right yeah, yeah. And that was I wish that I would have had that, that it was choosing intentionally, because that's such an important point. Yeah, so I really love that view. Because it is especially I think, for people who are high achievers and who have done a lot of incredible things and who want to do a lot Out of incredible things, we have the certain things in mind for ourselves. Yeah, yeah.

Unknown: 1:30:06

Now one thing about that, oh my gosh, I think I lost my brain. Oh, no. Oh, one thing you were talking about that quitting point or that that opting out point that choosing to deviate and choose a different path. One thing about that is that we all have a breaking point within this boat like on the pursuit of this goal. And that's the point when you're dealing with obstacles and challenges and you're fatigued, you're tired, you're worn out, you're whatever you're dealing with small politics, in, in the workforce, or on the sports team, or whatever, all of these things. And there is a point where it'll just be like, You know what, I'm done. This is not worth like getting that is not worth dealing with all of this right now. And that might be absolutely 100% the right decision for you to leave at that moment because of all of these different things. But you want to make sure that you've kind of done the root why exercise like, you know, Simon Sinek talks about your why your reason for doing something? Well, in my book, I talked about your root y, which is asking that question, like five layers down, like five or six or whatever, asking that okay, well, why is that important? Okay, well, yeah, but why is that important to you? Well, why do you need that? Or why? Whatever bla bla bla, and it usually comes down to a feeling. And it's often a feeling of validation, feeling of being loved, or respected, or like, what are you internally and emotionally getting out of this? It's not just a paycheck. It's not just a raise or a bonus. It's not just like that could be you want that because you want to get your kids into high school. What is why is that important? Well, so that I can appear to have my stuff together, you know, so that it appears that I'm a good parent, or that's important to me or validating that I've that I've done a good job, or, like whatever that is, that is the root why. And if you can get down to the root, why, then often that moves your breaking point further along the spectrum. The few I think every layer down you go moves that a little bit more, for example, I almost stopped bobsledding the year year and a half before the Vancouver Olympics when we want. And that was because of small politics, mind games on the team, like lots of stress, kind of trying to juggle different personalities and not rock the boat between other people. And it was just not great. And I remember my father had meetings in Toronto, when he came to pick me up, you're going for dinner, and I just had had this email. And I had been crying because I'm like this is so I don't want Why am I being put in the middle of these other two people when I don't have when i This doesn't even involve me. And it was just ongoing, an ongoing an ongoing, and I was just like, You know what? Winning a medal at the Olympics is not worth this mental health state. Like it's not worth this emotional stuff that's going on. I just I don't want to deal with this anymore. I don't want to deal with the small politics, the bits of bullshit, like I don't want to deal with that. And it's just not fun to do that. So I don't I'm out. Anyway, when I mentioned this to my dad, when I got in the car, he just he would have supported anything that I chose to do. He didn't care about whatever. But he just said, Oh, that's interesting. I said, What do you mean, he goes, Well, I just, I guess I never really thought about it as being about winning a medal. And I said, Oh, but what did you think it was about? And he said, I don't know, I guess I just thought, like, how great it was that or how great it would be that people from our hometown and people from small communities and people from just how inspired and motivated like inspired they would be just from your journey, just from your story of going there. And I was like, and I realized that the impact I could make on people, whether we won or not, you know, the impact of just pursuing that move the needle for me. And so that move way ahead. Now, I'm not saying I was thinking about impact when I was squatting in a workout. Like, I was like, Okay, gotta win gold. Got it. Like, whatever, whatever I was thinking. I'm not saying it was at the forefront of my mind all the time. But certainly anytime I reached a point where I was really frustrated, and it was a potential breaking point time, then pulling on that route, why like pulling on that deeper purpose for doing something helps me get through any of that stuff. So so that's a that's also part of that decision making process. Yeah. Yeah.

Julie- Host: 1:34:46

I mean, that's really good food for thought. And I think also, it helps. Like by removing some of those layers, it also Yeah, makes it probably very clear one way or the other. Like, is this really for you right now, or is it not? Is it okay to like, show my attention.

Unknown: 1:35:06

And sometimes when you get down to it, that feeling is then the feeling itself is whatever that is, there's no wrong one, like, that's just what it is. But that doesn't mean that you have to do that same activity to get that same feeling. So it's almost very awakening being like, okay, now I now I know why I was going after this. But it doesn't have to be this. Like, I can get that feeling or that sense of validation or understanding what that means. You can get that in a different way and sometimes in a healthier way, or, or whatever. So, it's, it's a really great exercise to do. Yeah,

Julie- Host: 1:35:44

I like that. I'm gonna do that in my own life. I feel like it could be so useful right now. So I'm in a time of transition. So yeah, so that's, it's perfect. Okay, so I, I, because I have so many questions that we're, we're running out of time. And so I want to, I want to talk a little bit about for people who are listening, and they're like, I'm not a sports person, but they are sports people. Do you have any advice for them? Like, because you have achieved so many incredible milestones in in your different careers, like in different sports? Do you have any advice like, on how you've done that, or how you've accomplished that, whether it's mindset, or like, the physical aspect or anything else that I wouldn't know of as someone who's not very sporty myself?

Unknown: 1:36:37

Yeah, I think that the like, the physical part is kind of the most, the obvious piece for for athletes. And I'm, but I'm gonna say this, that right now, I've started pulling this this point into my keynotes for entrepreneurs, for industry leaders, for whatever, because it is a point that I think the higher you go in sports, it's naturally, it naturally gives you more of an emphasis and places more importance on rest and recovery, in order to be able to not just perform at a high level, but to be able to sustain that without burnout without injury is mostly what we're talking about. But when we talk about other industries, the higher you go, and the higher demands you have for your brain for your emotional ability to to handle stress and all that stuff. The emphasis on rest and recovery is not the same. So in sports, it's easy, because we're thinking overuse injuries, right? Like, we're you need to rest and recover that so that you don't get an injury. Well, the same goes over to the workforce. And so when I talk about rest and recovery, I'm not talking about that as one thing, rest and recovery are two very different things. Rest is passive, it is sleeping, it is watching Netflix, or whatever it is lying, listening to music, whatever that is for you, whatever kind of relaxation is for you, that's rest. But recovery, is doing the things that actually feed your soul, doing the things that light you up doing the things that where you lose track of time. And you just are like, what, what do you mean, that sounds like gardening for some people puzzling for some people. Like for some people, it's just going for walking, getting lost in the woods, like whatever it is. That is, those are the things that you need to talk about to bring into your life. And not think of it as a luxury I'm taking time out for like, you know, I'm doing all these fancy things, or these, you know, I'm taking all this rest and relaxation as being a negative or a luxury thing. But actually bringing it in as being part of the strategy to take things to the next level. Like actually, this is part of my plan. Because this then means I will not burnout and I will be able to sustain a high level of performance, and whatever I'm doing, and not make mistakes when it really counts, and not do all those things. So the things that that rest and help you rejuvenate, but also the things that bring you back energy, and that actually fill you up with energy and joy and light. And then the same goes with sports. So you need an outlet. You need something that's kind of different than sports, that it's not all encompassing, because sports is not the only thing that matters. It's hard to believe sometimes when you're in it. But with with athletes, especially high performing athletes, those rest and recovery days are just as important as your training days The higher you go. And sometimes for athletes, especially type athletes, it's harder to take a day off than it is to do the squatting over 400 pound lifting days. So it's that part is about recognizing that you need those days now. I never had to have those days in a row. Right? And I was an athlete like I had my recovery days were like offset I always took Thursday on a Sunday off. It's not like I'm giving myself this luxury long weekend. It's their strategic, right. And so part of that for me was, and following that to a tee was also knowing that I like my goal, because there's so many things like we talked about earlier that are out of our control. I can't, my goal can't be a finish. They can't be like, I want to win gold medal, or I want to win because one, there's another teammate in my sled. There are other teams with other equipment with other trainers and therapists and dietitians, whatever they have, like, it's different, so I can't control that stuff. And I can only control part of our performance, I can control mine. But my goal was to basically to be able to stand at the start of that bobsled track at the top of the Olympic Games, just knowing that I had done everything I could to be the best that I could be at that moment. And so it didn't, so that I wasn't, you know, sloughing off a workout or sloughing off a recovery or something because I wanted to have no regrets. And the only way you can have no regrets with a fourth place finish, or with just not making the team or with not getting the job or not getting the promotion or whatever is at least knowing that there's nothing more you could have done to have presented yourself better or be better in that moment. So that comes down to not missing training sessions and doing all of it. And, and only taking ones off. Because it either it's either scheduled to do so or you can or you're doing it because you know, your body is in need of rest and recovery. And you're taking it off, because it's moving the needle forward. So that you can stand still at that starting line. Like if I took a day out a day off, because, you know, my friends were visiting from out of town and you know, whatever, I'm gonna Oh, it's just one workout. Well, if I just missed winning that gold medal, or if I just missed that work, it is that day going to come on at me am I going to wonder if that is the thing that made the difference is that going to, I didn't want any of that I didn't want any haunting thoughts or any regrets or any wonderings, I can now say that I did everything that I could to be the best that I could be in that moment. And every teammate is also doing that. And if we're equipping ourselves, the best we can with what we have, and the things are, that are in our control, then that's all we can leave on the table. So I think that's probably the best mindset that most people should have for any goals, because there are so many things that we cannot control that are not in our control. And so I'm sure the pandemic, for example, shutdown many goals, and some people are gonna say, Oh, I was a failure. Well, maybe your goal, instead of doing this thing should have been to be at the cusp of that. And just knowing that you were going to pursue this, with no regrets with no excuses, with nothing left on the table. Because like I said, there are no guarantees we have. So there's so many things in this world that are out of our control. So that is the healthiest mindset that I can provide for people. Yeah,

Julie- Host: 1:43:10

I really love that. I and I think it definitely applies to people outside of sports. And in Oh, yeah, yeah, I mean, just that intentionality and knowing that you did everything you could you showed up, you know, in the best way you could for yourself, or others. Yeah, that's powerful. And

Unknown: 1:43:27

sports is like you know, how we say high school is like a microcosm of society as a whole. So sports and the analogies in that are the same, like whether you're taking a high school analogy or a sports and like all these things, when it comes to what it takes to be successful, like the qualities it takes to be successful as an athlete, or the same qualities it takes to be successful in any occupation or industry, the skills are different, the skills required are different, but the actual qualities and characteristics that it takes are usually the ones it takes to successfully manage change and face challenges and overcome the obstacles that will inevitably inevitably pop up along the way. And those are the things that it will take to achieve and to discover what you're truly capable of in any industry.

Julie- Host: 1:44:10

Yeah. Yeah, that makes complete sense. So I, I love that way to like, end the conversation to i I'm curious like we normally because I talk to someone about like very specific career and like if there's any associations or organizations or just resources that you might share and I know we kind of open it up here to like a really great broad conversation based on all your your experience. Speaking of asset as an athlete, I'm curious if you have any resources that you love that may not necessarily be like specific trade based or specific association but just things that you love that might be helpful for people? Well, I

Unknown: 1:44:51

would say my book for sure, of course, right. So there are like I'm terrible at remembering names and titles. So this is really this is really challenging for me to do. But there is a book that I that I read once this I remember it's by Genesis sincero, Cicero's Sentra, Jen, okay, yes. And it's, you're a badass. And there might be I think she has a few different variations of that. But I loved I love that book. It's a very easy read. It was interesting because she's a little rough around the edges. But it, it sounded so much like everything that I talked about, but in a different tone in a different tone and a different, like, slightly different emphasis on things. It was, it was really great. Actually, like, I really liked that book.

Julie- Host: 1:45:36

Oh, gosh,

Unknown: 1:45:37

what's another one? Mark Manson's book. I can't remember the title. It is the one that has the F word in it. That's blacked blanked out on the cover.

Julie- Host: 1:45:48

Okay. I'll look it up. Yeah.

Unknown: 1:45:51

So that one though, if people are, are not liking swearing, it is he swears throughout the whole book. So it might not be the best one for for them. But if you take that part with a grain of salt, if you take that out of there, it's, it is interesting, because it's, it's, again, an interesting concept and an interesting way of looking at things, different perspective that I really appreciate it. It's just, it's just in a harsh delivered, like in a in your face, purse delivery. So for some people that really, really resonates. And so for other people, it would be, it would be a little too, like, he's yelling at me through these pages kind of thing. But I enjoyed that perspective, I enjoyed the perspectives that he had tone was a little, it was a little rough, but I really enjoyed his perspectives on it. Like he was the one I quoted earlier about the one that said, you know, it's not about how badly do you want it? It's what are you willing to sacrifice? So it's, he's kind of very much in your face, like making you question things. And you're like, oh, oh, I never thought about it that way. And that's what I love, I love because that's what I do with my clients and with my audiences. And it's helping them shift their perspective, so that they can see the possibilities that still exist in their situation, regardless of whatever they're facing. And so anytime I can get my perspective shifted by someone like that, or by something that I'm like, oh, okay, that's interesting, like, different food for thought for bringing things in. So I really, I enjoyed that, that part of it. So Dr. Robin Handley, Defoe, she just released a new book called stress wisely. And there's another part of the title, oh, gosh, it's stress wise, the Anna, something world in it in a stressful world or whatever. Anyway, I've heard her speak before she's become a friend of mine. She her book is, she's remarkable at being able to break down, especially today's society, the frenetic pace of today's society, the craziness that the expectations that we're all living under, in terms of email responses, and texting responses, and social media, and all of these things that are being thrown at us. And she is remarkable at breaking up breaking that down in a very in, in a research like science based, researched way to help people kind of like stress is not a bad thing, right? If it's harnessed in the right way, but we can let stress kind of take control of us. So that's where she's getting, we're not going to get rid of the stress that we have on us. But can we harness it? Can we? Can we make it better? Can we learn to take those moments to kind of just regulate it, and kind of make it helpful instead of instead of hindering? Anyway, those are off the top of my head. I'm actually proud of myself like that.

Julie- Host: 1:48:41

That wasn't good for me

Unknown: 1:48:44

to come up with the names of books.

Julie- Host: 1:48:47

Thank you. Yes. Sorry.

Unknown: 1:48:49

I think I just pulled I think some of the Yeah, I like there's some podcasts that I cannot remember right now. But like, I there's not one or two set podcasts that I listen to, I might just have an episode of one and find someone else and listen to an episode of another and then another. And so there are some people where I listen, and I'm like, Oh, I love that. Like, the way they said that was so cool. Like it just kind of just triggered something. So sometimes it's just about finding that you've heard it before. But the way someone says it can just make or break your aha moment. And that's, that's what I hope to give people is aha moments being like, Oh, I never would have thought of it that and that's what I can do for people. Yeah,

Julie- Host: 1:49:31

well, I mean, definitely, for me even just with this time with you, it's been so interesting to Yeah, to like, hear your thoughts on things and like how you look at things just based on all your incredible experiences. And I know even Yeah, like the idea of going five layers deeper into the why like, I like not just the initial layer but like really digging and keep asking is really interesting. So I really Really appreciate you so much for being on. It's been, you know, it's such a, like a perfect way to start the new year. Like, I feel like it worked out so well. You know, we ended up having all these, like near misses and here you are, you know, it's the start to a brand new year. And what a wonderful way to start like with with possibilities, right and, and it's just yeah, I feel like it was meant to be. So let me one tip for some

Unknown: 1:50:23

resolutions, okay, for New Year's resolutions, cuz I'm sure people are kind of in them now. And but but listen, you can change them, you can adjust this and pivot and do what you need to do. Because as we all know, there are a lot of new year's resolutions, probably the majority of them, I don't have this statistic off the top of my head, but most of them do not laugh beyond two weeks. So part of that is what we're talking about your why your route why of doing something, and a lot of times New Year's resolutions are set, because they feel like their goals we're supposed to have. And they're not actually goals we really truly care about. So usually those resolutions are something something health related, like Oh, I'm gonna go to the gym, four days a week, or three days a week or whatever. Well, do you want to go to the gym? Like do you like, are you sure that something you want to do, because if you don't want to anytime there's that fork in the road, you will always choose the other easier path to go to the thing that draws you the thing that's drawing your attention. So really, truly just think about what you want, like what you actually like a goal that you really want. And if it's some kind of health lifestyle goal, just make it something and know why you're doing it. Because if you do not know why you're doing it, and if it's important to everyone else around you doesn't necessarily mean that it's the same holds the same value to you. So if it doesn't hold any value or enough value, then you will eventually without a doubt you will eventually fall off that path. So really dig deep and figure out what it is you want or why you set the goal that you did. And at least if you know why, and it is really important to you, then you'll stay strong.

Julie- Host: 1:51:56

Yeah, very good recommendation. I love that. I want to ask also the very last question before we go. And I asked to all the guests. So will you share a sentence that uses verbiage or jargon from your field and then translate it so it's understandable to us?

Unknown: 1:52:14

Oh, wow, okay.

Julie- Host: 1:52:17

Okay, which field? So many choices?

Unknown: 1:52:21

Okay, well, if I were, if I were talking about my speaking my the industry I work in now speaking or coaching, I would probably say just the word gig. Like if you get a gig or it's kind of like an event, or a booking or whatever, then I would say okay, but that's not a fun one, let's say. Okay, so with bobsledding. I've used terms before and people are like, Oh my gosh, we got the lingo now. So I would have to say that's probably the best one. So sentence using jargon. Which runners are you using for sliding today?

Julie- Host: 1:52:56

Okay, and that's perfect. And what does that mean?

Unknown: 1:53:00

So there are two words in there that are probably unknown or not unknown, but different for people. So runners for us does not mean running shoes. It means the blades on the bottom of our bobsled, okay, they come in sets of four. And you can you know, use two fronts the same and two bags from a different set or whatever, depending on temperature, depending on ice temperature, depending on weather, all of that stuff. So which runners are we using for sliding today? And sliding is just the lingo for training for practicing when you're actually going from the top of the truck to the bottom. Okay, so yeah, which runners which runners are we using for sliding today?

Julie- Host: 1:53:41

Wow.

Unknown: 1:53:42

The full lingo jargon sentence for the sport of bobsledding. I

Julie- Host: 1:53:47

love it. Yeah, I had no idea that you could switch out like the Yeah, like the lace on the bottom or the other plates. That's cool to know. And yeah, and I wouldn't have never known that other that other way to say I think. Yeah, I think I would have just called it bobsledding. So I didn't know that you call it sliding. Fine. i Yeah. There you go. Oh, my God. It's just Yeah. Well, thank you. That was a wonderful example. They're both great examples. I think for those of us who love you know, like the idea of of sports, and especially like bobsledding just looks so rad, right like that. It's just seems very cool that to know that extra insight into into that world. So if

Unknown: 1:54:29

you go watch one, you'll be like, Oh, I wonder what runners they're using for sliding today.

Julie- Host: 1:54:33

Exactly. Yeah. We have the inside scoop. All right. Well, thank you so much for being here was such a pleasure. If people if they want to reach out to you if they want to learn more about you know your book, or you how can they find you? How can they reach you? Yeah, it's

Unknown: 1:54:52

pretty easy, either under LinkedIn, Heather Moyse is pretty easy to find or Instagram st think otherwise or Facebook kind of voice, it's very easy. And if you forget that, then it's just if you Googled Heather, Bob's play or rugby Canada, then you would, it would pop up somehow, my book is pretty easy to find. It's either on the softcover, or Kindle version or audio book that I narrated. Those are all those all can be found on Amazon, or an audible or on kind of wherever you listen, but you can also get them through my website. And if you hardcover books can be ordered through my website as well. And if they get ordered through my website, then I can actually sign them and personalize them before they get sent out. Which is fine. So so any of those things, if you forget where to find things, you can always just go to my website. And that's just how they're moist.com. And yeah, that's pretty much it.

Julie- Host: 1:55:47

Thank you. Well, it's such a pleasure. What a fun way to start this year. Thank you.

Unknown: 1:55:52

Oh, you're so welcome.

Julie- Host: 1:55:57

Hey, everybody, thank you so much for listening to women with cool jobs. I'll be releasing a new episode every two weeks. So make sure you hit that subscribe button. And if you love the show, please give me a five star rating. Also, it would mean so much if you share this episode with someone you think would love it or would find it inspirational. And lastly, do you have ideas for future shows? Or do you know any Rockstar women with cool jobs? I would love to hear from you. You can email me at Julie at women with cool jobs.com Or you can find me on Instagram at women who will jobs again that women will jobs. Thank you so much for listening and have an incredible day