Nonprofit Founder Helps Fund Pediatric Cancer Treatments with Cookies, with Gretchen Witt of Cookies for Kids' Cancer

Gretchen (Holt) Witt paired cookies with cancer and created one of the most powerful, clever combinations to raise awareness and much-needed funding for pediatric cancer.

Gretchen unexpectedly formed what would become Cookies for Kids' Cancer in 2007, after her 2-year-old son Liam was diagnosed with pediatric cancer. Due to her background in PR and communications , she understood how challenging it was to talk about cancer, let alone pediatric cancer. She also knew that it would take a lot more awareness, advocacy, and funding to help children diagnosed with cancer to live longer, healthier lives.

By allowing people to connect cookies with learning about kids cancer, Cookies for Kids’ Cancer is now a well-respected nonprofit that has had more than 16,000 grassroots fundraising events in all 50 states and 26 countries and has granted more than $21 million to the leading pediatric cancer research centers across the country.

Until recently, Gretchen worked full time in PR & communications and part time to help drive the nonprofit forward.

Contact Info:
Gretchen (Holt) Witt - Guest
Gretchen's LinkedIn account
Cookies for Kids' Cancer website

Julie Berman - Host
www.womenwithcooljobs.com
@womencooljobs (Instagram)
Julie Berman's LinkedIn Profile 


   

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Transcript

Gretchen (Holt) Witt: 0:00

The holidays were coming up, it was early October. And at the holidays, everybody is kind of on a rush to find the gift that has meaning and a gift that gives back and a gift that you feel good not only about giving your money towards but you know, the recipient will also enjoy. And that's where I had the idea to bake cookies. And to me the whole concept of good cookies is the exact antithesis of pediatric cancer. Nobody wants to think about pediatric cancer, but who doesn't like to think about a good cookie, whether it is an actual cookie, or a person who's a good cookie. And it also something that just elicits good thoughts and smiles and makes you feel good. Okay, so I was going to bake some cookies, I decided so then the next question was, well, how many cookies and at that point in time, I knew about 80 families who had a child that was going through cancer treatment. Hey, everybody, I'm Julie and welcome to Women with cool jobs. Each episode will feature women with unique, trailblazing and innovative cruise. We'll talk about how she got here, what life is like now, and actionable steps that you can take to go on a similar path or one that's all your own. This podcast is about empowering you. It's about empowering you to dream big and to be inspired. You'll hear from incredible women in a wide variety of fields, and hopefully some that you've never heard of before. Women who filled robots and roadways, firefighters, C suite professionals surrounded by men, social media mavens, entrepreneurs, and I'm so glad we get to go on this journey together. Hello, everybody. This is Julie Berman, and welcome to another episode of women with cool jobs. So today I have the most incredible guest Gretchen Witt. And I have recorded this introduction for her so many times because I want to make sure that I do her justice. And hopefully I will. I had such an incredible and inspiring conversation because she developed a nonprofit after her son who's two years old at the time, Liam wet was diagnosed with childhood cancer in 2007. And so of course, as a parent, her world was completely turned upside down. She had another young child at the time. And she and her husband and her family were just trying to navigate how to help him. Also, she was someone who has a background in PR and communications. And as she was going through, and she was learning not only about her son's specific type of cancer, but pediatric cancer in general. She was learning like all these crazy and surprising facts. And she just was not able to reconcile the fact that like she felt like she was pretty well educated and had a background in PR and communication. And yet she or she just knew so little about pediatric cancer. And she was trying to figure out during this this, you know, process what ended up being, you know, a few years of navigating this pediatric cancer with her son, Liam, like, how could she bring more awareness? How could she help to raise more funds for research and to develop new and improved and less toxic treatments for pediatric cancer, because some of the treatments that are out there have some really, really awful and long lasting side effects for kids. And I had no idea about any of this until I started doing all the research for this episode. So I'm curious if you know any of this as well. And so like some of the most startling facts are that pediatric cancer is the number one disease killer of children in the United States. And also that 4% of the National Cancer Institute's budget goes towards kids cancers, only 4%. And also that pediatric cancers are very different than adult cancers. So she learned all these facts. And she wanted to figure out like, How can I help like, How can I do something more and so she used her background in PR and communications, and very uniquely tied it to a way that's like a lot more easily digestible, and way more fun to talk about, which was basically cookies, and bake sales, and allowing people to help raise money through having bake sales through selling cookies. And through this idea of just sharing more information about pediatric cancer and allowing everybody to be creative and to participate at any and every level. So she was telling Like a story in this interview about how one girl raised over$100,000. Also, like, you know, some people just donate $2 If they're walking by, and someone's having this bake sale that goes towards cookies for kids cancer. So there are so many ways that that they have allowed people to have a real impact, and to make every dollar count, for allowing kids to hopefully live longer and healthier lives. So this conversation, you're going to probably need tissues. And I just was so honored to be able to speak to Gretchen, and to be able to share in her journey of her cool job and how she is making an impact in the world. All in honor of her beautiful young son, me and wit. So if you hear this in, you're inspired. If you hear this and feel like you've learned something, or someone you know can learn something from this, please share this out because it not only helps her organization, and allows more people to learn about pediatric cancer and how they can help how they can help find treatments that are less toxic for kids. It also helps the podcast and it helps people to realize that there are so many possibilities for cool jobs. All right. So hello, I am here with everyone. I am so glad you guys are listening to women with cool jobs. I am here with Gretchen wit, who is someone who is a nonprofit founder. She started cookies for kids cancer and she also was in PR and communications. And she has been doing such incredible work in this field. Today, you have been part of this organization that you co founded, you have granted more than $21 million to leading pediatric cancer research centers across the United States. There have been more than 16,000 grassroots fundraising events in all 50 states and in additional countries. And I just am so honored to talk to you and have you here today on the show. So thank you for being here. Gretchen. Oh, my gosh, thank you. This is I I love a good conversation. And I can't wait to get into it. And thank you so much. Yes, of course. It's such a such a pleasure. So I am going to introduce you a little bit. But I would love to hear your story from you. Because I you know, I looked at your website, I've looked at your LinkedIn, you are a fantastic storyteller. And you have this this big story to tell and how you got into this place where you are raising so much money for pediatric cancer and a big why behind that. So I would love if you could share a little bit about your cool job, and how you would describe it and also a little bit about how you got here today. Oh goodness, well, my career journey started in the world of PR. And I didn't know what PR was what it was about. I knew nothing about it. When I fell into it just by sheer luck after I graduated from college. And the interesting thing was I wound up my first job was working in crisis PR at a big New York City PR firm where I just soaked it all in, in and I felt like a sponge every day. So it was just fascinating to me. Like it just found the whole concept of crisis PR just completely fascinating. And fast forward. I moved around to different areas within the world of PR was working with lots of different consumer products, companies. I got married, became a mom had one child had a second child. When my older child oldest child was two and a half I took him to the doctor for a well visit because I felt like things were just off a little bit but I couldn't really put my finger on one thing that fell off just like this gut instinct. And by the end of that day, I knew that he had a large tumor in his abdomen. And by the next day, I found out that he had cancer. And that's what started my whole journey into the world. Eventually into the world of nonprofit work. Liam was diagnosed with stage four cancer. He was the healthiest kid I ever knew. I didn't know that kids got cancer. I thought it had been taken care of. I also wasn't aware at the time that pediatric cancers are different than adult cancers and that pediatric Cancer is the number one disease killer of kids in the US. And so with my communications background, I really thought to myself like, this is a communications challenge. The fact that I don't know this is shocking to me, because I'd liked I thought of myself as somebody who was fairly well read about the ins and outs of the world of parenting and current events and that kind of thing. But I had never heard that the cancers kids get are totally different than the cancers adults gets. And then it's the number one disease killer. I mean, had you ever like Did you know, I honestly didn't know until I started doing research for this interview. Ray, it is it is shocking. It's completely shocking. And I really believe that it is a communications challenge, because who wants to talk about cancer? You know, but but then when it comes to cancer with kids, really, it's like a hot potato that nobody wants to talk about? Yeah. Ever want to open up Pandora's box, right? Think about kids who get cancer. I mean, it's just it's not something that anybody wants to think about. Right? Yeah. That's incredible. And I know that you started out, you know, when I mean, now, it's, it's been years ago that you you started out doing this, and you've continued to do this work. So I have here you started in 2007, to start your your nonprofit work. So I would love to hear about that beginning because I, I think I'm a mom of three, I have three boys. And as a mom, I think like, it's really interesting what you just said also the fact that like we why would we want to talk about this and open this Pandora's box, but from the perspective of the fact that you are coming from this communications, background in this PR background? And the idea that wow, like, why don't we know about all this? And you You started this for such an like incredible reason to help your son and have now benefited? I'm sure not only so many children, but also their families. Right. And the impact that that's had Right? Like it's I'm sure these incredible ripple effects, right, that will hopefully continuously go out. Exhibit, I guess I would love to go back to that point that started it all for the cookies for kids. And just if you could share that, like the beginning because it's such a beautiful story. Sure, absolutely. So Liam was diagnosed in February of 2007. He went to preschool on the day that he was diagnosed, he had just started preschool. So he had to be a certain age to start preschool. And I like I said, I just had the sense that something was off. So I took them to the doctor for a well visit, the doctor handed me three prescriptions at the end of the visit. He said, You know, like, you should get these tests done soon, but you don't have to get them done today. And the three tests for for a chest X ray and abdominal ultrasound, and a CBC a complete blood count of his blood to see what was going on. Liam was an early adopter of being a meat free either, so I couldn't get him to eat meat. And so I thought, like maybe he was anemic, or something like that. Certainly was not thinking cancer. But I, regardless, I took those three prescriptions, and I drove to the closest hospital and walked in and was just like, no, like, I need to know right now. Like, let's just get this done right now. Needless to say, I found out that he had cancer, it was completely shocking. within 24 hours, we were being transported via ambulance to another hospital that specialized in the kind of cancer that he was battling. And then I really, it was it was such an interesting time for me, because I remember so distinctly, thinking to myself, Why do I not know about this? This is a communications challenge. People need to know because if they knew it would not be the number one disease killer. And what can I do to help and I made this deal with whoever it is who was up there to take care of my son. And once he was okay that I was going to do whatever it was that I could do to try to help raise awareness of the needs surrounding pediatric cancer. So fast for Liam becomes cancer free. I was so grateful that I wanted to help by raising money for treatment that was in development that Liam didn't need because he was cancer free. He was going to be one of the the ones to be a success story. But there are other kids who needed it. And what's interesting to me is about Liam specific kind of cancer, but it's like this with a lot of other pediatric cancers. They never go into remission. They're either there's either no evidence of disease, which stands for Ned, or there's evidence of disease. And so he was at a stage of having no evidence of disease. But there were so many kids who would never reach that stage. And I knew that we needed more treatment options. So I dropped him off at preschool. Like literally, you know, how parents are kind of, they do the slow walk sometimes to preschool, you know, it's like, there's all these things you have to do, you have to make sure that your kids hairs brush, and they've breakfast and the shirts are buttoned and all that I would skip down the street with him because I was just so grateful to be doing something so mundane and normal as going to preschool, preschool. So I dropped her off at preschool and I was sitting on the stairs of his preschool and I, I knew that I wanted to do something to give back. And I was sitting on the stairs. And I was thinking, I was thinking and I just read a story in Oprah Magazine of all places, that said, essentially do it, you know, and do what you love. And Liam really loved to bake. I knew a lot of people in the industry who knew a lot about baking, I certainly didn't, but I knew people to call. And the holidays were coming up, there was early October. And at the holidays, everybody is kind of on a rush to find the gift that has meaning and a gift that gives back and a gift that you feel good not only about giving your money towards but you know, the recipient will also enjoy. And that's where I had the idea to bake cookies. And to me, the whole concept of good cookies is the exact antithesis of pediatric cancer. Nobody wants to think about pediatric cancer, but who doesn't like to think about a good cookie, whether it is an actual cookie, or a person who's a good cookie. And it also something that just elicits good thoughts and smiles and makes you feel good. Okay, so I was going to bake some cookies, I decided. So then the next question was, well, how many cookies. And at that point in time, I knew about 80 families who had a child that was going through cancer treatment. And I also read somewhere else, that the average girl scout sells about 100 boxes of cookies. So I did the math, and at times 100 was 8000 boxes of cookies. I decided it was going to be a dozen cookies. So that was 96,000 cookies. Wow. That's amazing. So that's what started the journey. Okay. So we went about it, it was a lot harder than I thought it was going to be another mom, friend of mine whose children are also in the same class as Liam joined me in my in my crazy harebrained efforts to do this, because she is just as crazy as I am. And we were like, Let's do it. How hard can this be? It was a lot harder than we thought. But there is just no way that we were going to back down, there was absolutely no way that we weren't going to give it our all. And at the end of the day, what was going to happen if we fail, people were gonna get mad at us for trying. Like, what what was the worst that was gonna happen? Right? Well, to make a long story short, we did sell out of all the cookies. And we raised more than $420,000, which if you do the math meant that about half of the people who got the cookies actually didn't get any cookies. And what they would do is they would say, You know what, I don't need the cookies, I just want to get involved for what you're doing. So keep the cookies and give them to somebody else who wants them. And that's why we were able to raise almost double the amount that we had set out to wow. And in the process, what I realized is that we had hit a nerve with people and we had come up with a way to get people involved without scaring them off and to invite them into the conversation without frightening them away. And I think that that's one of the really important key message points that I learned it which I inherently knew being communications is that you have to be able to bring people in and you have to invite people underneath the tent to get them part of part of the community. Yeah, I just like I had this thought and I feel like I should share it with you and I people who are listening may or may not know depending how long they've been listening like I started out and that PR communications were like a fizzling ages ago. But I feel like because your experience how you started out in your career. We're, and then because of this experience with your son and like leading into pediatric cancer and trying to figure out what what can I do as an everyday, you know, one person, like, what can I do to help? Because I realized there's this, this issue that's not being addressed that people don't really know about the fact that you were able to read that article, decide, wow, my son really loves to bake, can I make this into something and like, strategize around it, which I feel like is such a PR thing to do. And then the fact that as you were doing it, you realize, whoa, this is a way to engage with people in a really hard issue that people want to probably avoid talking about and hearing about, but that we need to acknowledge and do something in order to, like improve the science and everything that exists to support families and support kids. Right. Like, it's so connected, I think to like You're like who you are, and your understanding of like how communications works. And I think there's something so incredibly magical about that connection of like, your skill set. And I, we haven't talked about your son. And I know, there's a whole other part of his story. And I, I don't want to like, rush over that lately. Because as a mom, that's such a key part of your story. But I just wanted to share that. I think it's it's because of who you are. And the skill set, you had you realized, this is a way to connect with people on such a different level. And now the impact that you've had, because of that is only something like you could do so I just wanted to share that, I think is that as you're talking, I just thought like how incredibly special that you have this skill set that you're putting to use in such an important way. Now. There's a couple of thoughts related to that. And thank you, he really you hit the nail on the head one was it right after he was diagnosed? I instantly felt this almost, if I want to call it an epiphany, but it was this feeling. Oh, my gosh, my entire life has been a dress rehearsal for this moment. And all of the things that I've done in the past, whether it was crisis communications, whether it was helping companies launch new products, new brands, whatever it is, everything. I was at a point in my life that I felt like I had learned so many lessons that I could apply to my current situation, which might sound odd. But it I mean, it definitely felt like my life had been a dress rehearsal for that moment. And the other odd thing that happened for me was that there was an interview that was happening right after Liam was diagnosed. And it was, it was on CNN, and there was a TV that was playing behind in my son's oncologist. As he was talking to me about the treatment plan. And the interview on TV was a briefing that was happening in the White House talking about how the current White House spokesperson was taking a leave of absence because he had just been diagnosed with cancer. And I thought to myself, like were headlines for kids. Why is it that we don't hear about kids when they're first diagnosed, like we tend to hear about kids, when there's a Hail Mary pass, like, oh, you know, I please get involved in helping this way or that way or whatever. But we don't hear about them when they're first diagnosed. But we hear a lot about adults when they're first diagnosed. And that's because kids haven't had the chance to live their life so that when there is something like cancer diagnosis, there's attention that's given to it. And, you know, it's it's, I understand, but it really, it was, it was quite an epiphany for me at that moment, just to be sitting in a cancer hospital, talking to my two and a half year old oncologist and to see this press conference about a White House spokesperson being diagnosed with cancer. Yeah, I say it's like a very interesting contrast of events like happening at the same time. Yeah, and I can't imagine like what that would feel like. So I got a whole bunch of research that I that I found and I wanted to read some of it because it's I don't want to get it incorrect. One. So one thing that I thought was so interesting that you have on your website is 4% of the National Cancer Institute's budget is towards kids cancer. And what I also really loved that you guys specifically focus on for cookies for kids cancer, and it's a national 501 C three nonprofit it. So your organization is a nonprofit that is committed to raising funds for research to develop new improved and less toxic treatments for pediatric cancer, because it's the number one disease killer of children in the United States. And I loved the particular focus. And you explain this in several places, have the fact that it's on less toxic treatments, specifically, so important so. And I, I would love for you, to give us like a little bit of insight into actually like, what your role is it as someone who runs this type of organization, because I only worked at the very beginning of my PR and communications career, I worked at a nonprofit for just an internship. So right like a very short amount of time. But I through that just even very short time. And I was in the communications part of it, the organization. And I recognize, like how important the work was that they were doing there as a Boys and Girls Club, but also like, the fact that it isn't a great organization. Yeah. And it was so apparent how important like raising funds were and how, like how much weight on some individuals, their shoulders, like how how important the mission was. And so I would love for you to talk about what your job is like, as someone who is running this 501 C three organization. And also, because of your why right because of your son and your commitment, right to helping this mission. Like I imagine that it is different from someone like me who's just coming in, who doesn't have that same why he doesn't have that foundational experience of why you started in the first place. So if you think about it, kids have hopefully the rest of their lives to live. They're not 50 6070 years old and getting a cancer diagnosis, they have more time in front of them than that then somebody who is older when they're diagnosed. And the cost of treatment these days on a child is just, I mean, oh my gosh, if you knew what it was like you would be shocked and appalled. But with that said, it's just this is the nature of cancer treatment. I mean, cancer treatment is tough. Radiation is tough on a body chemotherapy. I mean, it's chemo stands for chemicals, it is tough, it is really, really hard. And our if, if if I always felt like if people knew there would be so there would be such an outcry into developing treatments that have less toxicity for kids. Because kids bodies don't have that they can't, they will not function the same way, when after they imparted with the toxic treatments that kids received. And I'm not like I'm not here to say that we like it's just the nature of the way that cancer treatment is. So is very important for us to make it our mission that we are here to fund research into new and improved, but most importantly, less toxic treatments, they have to be less toxic. Because if the cost of the treatment is one that leaves a kid with debilitating side effects, and two thirds, two thirds of all kids who go through cancer treatment are suffering from just pretty pretty, pretty difficult long term side effects that in some cases lead to secondary cancers that are then untreatable. So just using my son as an example, Liam had fairly significant hearing loss from chemotherapy, he probably was going to have cognitive issues. He was definitely going to have issues with his growth plates developing because of radiation. He was going to be sterile. He had patches on his head where there was like hair would never ever ever grow back. He had damage to his teeth because of chemotherapy. I mean, like the list just goes on and on and on out. Oh, here's the here's the here's another one. Liam never would have been able to lift something more than 20 pounds because of the damage that chemotherapy had done to his heart. And this is normal like that. He didn't go through something that other kids don't go through. Like this is just the The cost of treatment of your child survive. So again, for us finding research that is less toxic, is, is so important. The other thing that I wanted to point out is that there are dozens of kinds of pediatric cancers, there's not one, you know, it's just like adult cancers, but not like adult cancers in the sense that there's a lot of different kinds of them. But the cancers kids get are specific to children, we fund the strongest research, regardless of what type of pediatric cancer it is. So for example, if it's for brain tumors, we will fund it, if it's for soft tissue, we will fund it, if it's for blood cancers, we will fund it based on the recommendations of our Medical Advisory Board, which meets separately from the organization to review all of the grant requests. And then they use the same criteria that the National Cancer Institute uses to evaluate proposals and give us their recommendations. And the reason why we fund all types of pediatric cancers is because I believe that the heartache that I feel, having lost my son, and yes, we should share with your listeners that Liam eventually relapsed, and eventually lost his battle is the same Herdade that a parent feels who have lost their child to a different type of pediatric cancer. And at the end of the day, aren't we all in this together? And don't we all want to help each other? And so therefore, if it's the strongest science, that has the best chance of helping a child, we should fund it? Yeah. 100% Or like, 1,000%? I mean, I think like, there's so much, there's so many questions for what you explained that I have. But I think the the one that rises to the top is like, the fact that you have all these systems in place that you've developed through your nonprofit. I mean, like, I'm taking a step back here, because when I was reading through and the fact that like, you've been doing this now, for some time, I mean, fortunately, and unfortunately, and I think it's really incredible, the fact that you've built in certain parts of this organization, and part a certain people in place to help really ensure that like, you guys are aligning with these that with this mission that you have. And I'm curious, like on the on sort of like the back end, like the side that we don't hear about, of like, how did this come to be because so much thought has clearly gone into not only how you communicate this message, and how you are able to do that through your your background, but also the things that you've put in place as a nonprofit, to not only be able to raise all this money, and then give these grants out and do so in such a purposeful manner with having like these people have science minds in place, who who understand like it are aligned with, you know, sort of national, I'm guessing, like these national guidelines standards. But then also, I know just from my very brief experience, in the nonprofit world, like actually running a nonprofit as well is like a whole undertake, like, I mean, a lot of undertaking, in addition to raising the funds aligning with science and today's standards, and like having a board all these things. So from that standpoint, I would love to hear about what your experience is like, like now having been in this, like, how do you manage some of the day to day or month to month aspects? Like, do you have a team? And how did you figure out like, what you wanted your priorities to be? How did you find those people and set into place like how you were going to align and find these least toxic options and help fund those. I would love to hear a bit more about that very large. I know, it's a large question I asked you, but just if you could give us some insight into that aspect. Yeah, I mean, gosh, like you're peeling back the layers of the onion. So let's take it back a little. I think one of the greatest things that I I have learned one of the greatest lessons that I've learned in my career, my professional career is the importance of storytelling and the importance of making something understandable to any audience so that they care whether you're talking about a concept or a product. I mean, that's like one of the things that you do in committee. indications is that you are communicating and, and one of the, and you need to do that by breaking down the pieces of whatever it is that you're trying to communicate, so that people can understand and put them, like applied their own feelings, belief, ethics into the story. And yeah, that's kind of like we're going out there a little bit. But that's what you do and communication. So the other very important lesson that I learned when I became a mom of a child battling cancer is how important it is to, to look at to take one step at a time. And I think that as adults, we tend to try to go 10 and 20 and 30 and 40 steps. It's funny, I saw this ad on Instagram yesterday for a one year calendar that that is this piece of write on wipe off, it's right on wipe off calendar that has every single day of the year blocked out. And I was thinking to myself, one, it's such a lovely concept to think about. But you actually don't know what's going to happen one minute from now, let alone one day from now, let alone one month from now or a year from now. And so when I was battling, when I was in the thick of the battle with Liam, there were times that things were so scary that I would just try to get through the next five minutes. Like if I can live for five minutes and survive the next five minutes, I have a chance of being able to make it through the five minutes after that. So that's how tenuous sometimes a cancer battle is. So to back it up a little bit. I think that when you start to, when you start to plan out what you want to do, if you think too big, it can seem overwhelming. And you might not want to do it. You know, if you think about one day, I want to grant more than$21 million. It can sound like such a daunting task that you might not do it. Yeah. But if you can just break it down to little baby steps, you probably have a better chance of making it happen. With that said, you brought up another really good point about the systems that we have in place and the checks and balances. If you go into something and I'm going to get a little bit philosophical, if you go into something with a with a pure heart. And with the with the best of intentions behind you. I think that I've always felt like people can tell. They can smell sincerity, and they can tell if someone's heart is in the right place. And so it was really important to us to set things up with the strongest foundation possible, which would then give people a sense of comfort that we had thought through as many things that we could think through so that they could then trust that what we were doing was the right thing. If that makes sense. Yeah. No, it makes total sense. Yeah, that is like intentionality right at its best. Like it's like you did all the work that you could do in order to put the pieces of the foundation in place. Exactly, exactly. With that said, when the when the foundation was starting, I was still working full time as the director of communications for a company called OXO Good Grips. They make those kitchen tools. Yeah. I was very busy. There were other people who stepped up people who heard the story and wanted to get involved and ran the organization for the first 10 plus years. And then yeah, so I wasn't doing the day to day operations of the organization at all. I was on the sidelines, cheering doing the stuff that I needed to do. I mean, I've been working two jobs longer than I can remember. But then a couple of years ago, I left the for profit world and went to the nonprofit world 100%. And that's when I really stepped in full time to the role of not only being the founder, but also running the day to day operations. Wow. So you almost had to, like were you so you hired basically people to help you during that time to like, carry out this vision. And I imagined do some like PR and communications work that you're still doing for Oregon. as Asian, but then you're also like at the time of transition, then like almost having them teach you, I'm imagining the day to day and like week to week, month to month work area of carrying everything around. Yeah, like it had to have the best database. When I started dealing with last week, I mean, there's always like, last week I was I sent to one of my colleagues, it was like, it's ever going to be a year that we don't start off the year with some kind of surprise of something that we are figuring out for the first time. And so like the latest one is what you need, which states you have to register in for and what kind of registrations you have to have. It's just like, fascinating some of the stuff that you learn. And because of nonprofit status, the 501 Yeah, but in some states, you have to have a business filing. And some states, you only have to have a general filing some states like Arizona, which I know is where you're located. You don't have to file either, but like you have to then know what the requirements are for all 50 states and wow. Yeah, is yeah, we just made a switch. And we didn't realize some of these other things that you had. Yeah. Yeah. So like my, I believe that my soul, my strength and my, the thing that I can give the world a pediatric cancer is helping to be the storyteller and helping to bring people into the stories that they understand what what the issues are, and how, how they can get involved. And that's one of the other things about our nonprofit and people who get involved in nonprofits, especially ones that have to do with cancer. I think that we inherently believe that something so big and scary as cancer is impossible to make an impact on. And we have now granted more than 115 research grants. Of those research grants that we have made more than two dozen of them have led to treatments that are now available for kids. The very first one that we helped to fund with the baking of the 96,000 Cookies became a treatment that kids today receive seven months after Liam lost his battle. So think you can't make a difference. Think again. And that at the end of the day is what I hope that people take away from getting involved in our organization is that anybody anywhere of any age of any socio economic background of any educational background, can make a difference because every dollar literally counts. And that's what I think people gravitate towards when they get involved with us is they feel like they are part of the solution. They feel like they can make a difference. We had a group last year a group of friends and family in merican New York, come together in support of a husband and father who lost a battle with cancer and they committed to raising$100,000 They were scared to death. They didn't think they could do it. Within three months. They had done it and they felt like rock stars. Wow. That's amazing. I mean, in three months, that's yeah, they should feel like rock stars. That's incredible. Wow. I, I think one of the most powerful things about not only the fact that you are such a good storyteller, and that you have learned how to kind of break this really huge, huge issue down like in a way that people can understand is that you've also offered a way that people can help in a way that feels really doable and accessible, like you mentioned that anyone at any educational level, anywhere can contribute. And I'd love for you to share, like what are what are some of the examples of projects people can participate in, or things that they can do at their school or in their community or with their family or their friends, and just kind of those everyday ways of participating in your organization cookies for kids cancer, and also be part of what you guys are doing. One of my favorite things about the organization is how you can see somebody as young as four and as old as 104 Get involved and literally literally, so we have supporters that range in age from preschoolers to people who are living in a assisted living facility that decide to have a bake sale and at a free person who participates, whether there are four or 104, they all have the same feeling at the end of it, they all are saying thank you, to us for having an opportunity to get involved. And they all feel like they are part of a community and the greater good. Okay, so what does that mean practically, because that sounds lovely, but I need to know exactly how you want me to get involved. So what we tell people is that as good cookies, you can choose however you want to get involved, whether you want to have organized a soccer tournament, or lacrosse tournament, or a Bowling Tournament, to a bake sale to a poker tournament to address down day, a dress up day at school or at work, it really doesn't matter. With that said, the most popular kind of fundraising event that people tend to have. And it's not a surprise is a bake sale, there have been more bake sales than you can imagine. And every year, there are there is some kind of event for us in all 50 states and so far 26 countries around the world. So what's interesting, though, about our events, especially our bake sales, is that what we tell people is to never price anything, because you're not selling, you're making people aware of an issue, and you are letting them know about this issue. And then you're asking them to make a donation. And the minute that you price something at let's say a bake sale, and you say this muffin is has a $3 donation, what if somebody is walking by, and they're taking their dog for a walk, and they see this bake sale, and they only have $2 in their pocket, but you've priced it three, I'd much prefer to get those $2 than to have that person walked by because they think they can't participate because something is priced at a level that they don't have right then. So we always tell people do not price anything at your bake sale. And instead what you do is you say, Take what you want, and give what you can. I love that. That's a magical phrase. I yeah, I I think that is such a cool thing, too, that you have people of so many ages and stages in life, who can participate? And I can also see how people could get really creative. Oh, yeah, doing this. Think of all sorts of fun, fun things to do at work in their community at schools. And do you have an example of like one of the most either things that you've taken part of like one of the most epic sort of big sales are like experiences or something that you have heard about, that someone did, as part of raising funds for your organization? You know, there are so many stories that are just so many stories. And in fact, we're lucky enough a couple of years ago there to publish two books. And they were great books published by an amazing publisher. And the funny thing is that the books are our cookbooks. But my editor and I used to get in battles over the fact that all I wanted to do was to write profiles, the people who had hosted events over the years, and he would say, okay, okay, but you do need to have recipes in here. And I was like, okay, okay, but we have to tell this story. And we have to tell that story. So when the book when the book came out, it was 5050 50% recipe and 50% stories about people who have events across the country, but in terms of its motivating, motivating and compelling stories. There is a girl named Daniela Ortiz, who lives in Colorado, who has been involved for She's now in 10th grade and she has been involved for years, holding bake sales in front of her home in a community where she lives. She she holds these events every September. And a couple of years ago, she and I met and I said to her, I think you can raise $100,000 I just really feel like you can. She's a budding NASA scientist. And she just that's that's her dream job in the world. And so she calls her event Galaxy cookie events. She took that challenge and within two years, she has raised over $100,000 Total in her school career. And she still has two more years of school left. And what's amazing is that her mother, since the time that she started raising funds for us was diagnosed with cancer. And instead of shifting gears and focusing on the kind of cancer her mother has she and her mother made a very clear and conscious decision that no they were going to continue to support pediatric cancer research. And to see Danielle is goal happen of raising enough money to fund a research project. And she's done it. She's amazing. Wow. That's incredible. And I love that she wants to be at NASA that is, so I definitely see that happening for her even though I've never met her based on what you've just said. Like she literally has some smarts, some tenacity, creativity, all those wonderful things going for her. Amazing what there are just like, there's 1000s of those stories. And every time it just, I mean, honestly, after losing my son after a four year battle, that's what keeps me going is people like Daniela Ortiz's people like you who want to share this story with your listeners. I mean, in on the the tough days, and being at a nonprofit is certainly not for the faint of heart. It's hard. It is really hard work. But it's it's the people who step up and say, You know what, let me help you. Let me be a part of the story. That's what eases the burden. And that's what gives me the energy to keep going. Yeah, I can't imagine like, you know, what it would be like for you to start the nonprofit to be working the two jobs, then to step into it, and like, almost have a whole new job to learn. And then the work to keep it going. And then you learn, of course, all these new things that as you go along that you have to you have to do registering or not registering, or whatever it may be for that. There's always something new Oh, yeah. So for you, I'm curious, like, how big is your team that you have? And like, Who do you work with just to kind of like, understand some of the nitty gritty details like who? Who do you work with every day or every week or every month? I like to share myself with people who are infinitely smarter than I am. That's the best thing that you can do. Yeah, we have a team of five full time employees, we have two part time employees. And then we rely on experts. So for example, all of our accounting needs are done by one of a fairly big CPA firm, okay, that is experts in the nonprofit world and can advise us on the ins and outs and the things that we need to know and do in order to have the best financial practices. Our board is just we have an amazing board that we can rely on for ever it is from legal questions to questions about financial planning. And so I What was it that Mr. Rogers said, look for the look for the experts or like, look for the topic, I know that quote, there's something that he said, like, look, look for the like, I can't remember. But basically, at the end of the day, what I knew was my limitations and how important it was to find people who knew infinitely more than I did and could help. Yeah, I love that. And I feel like that actually speaks to people who are really not only fantastic leaders, but also are fantastic at what they do. Because like, it's like you're living in your area of expertise, and really owning that and then allowing other people to really live in and own their area of expertise. And that's like, what creates all these beautiful overlaps of like having the best outcomes. There is nothing I like more than when somebody says to me, Oh, I have it. I got it. Right. That sounds magical for sure. Yes, well, they, I think like they found like amazing people you work with First of all, and they are the were such that we're so lucky to have a team of people who are so passionate about the work they're doing. I mean, look, I know what my motivation is. It's my son. Obviously. I obviously I've I've skin in this game. Yeah, but for somebody else to feel it as strongly as I do. Who doesn't have a childhood cancer is just absolutely amazing to me. It's just absolutely amazing. Yeah, I, I think it's probably because they feel so much of like your passion and, like excitement for the impact that you guys are having and can have. And that like trickles down, right? It's like, you know, I mean, to get a little woowoo, but like people talk about energy, right, and like an energy exchange and whether or not it's like people believe in various degrees of of that, there is I think that that still like human ability to send someone else's, like passion. And just like, gusto for a particular area. And it's like, such a cool thing when we can identify that and like latch on. And I think you so eloquently can talk about it. And, and that's also, I, I'm sure why you're still able to do this today and have raised such a really incredible amount for these causes to help in these different areas funding. I, I would love to wrap up for the sake of time, and just ask you, you know, like if people want to get more information about, like, if someone's listening to this, and they do have someone and I don't normally ask questions like this, but they do have someone who has pediatric cancer, like, Can you list off some of the best places that you know of, because of your experience? Like, where can people find resources help information that's really reliable? Or can they do that on your website? Just like, if you have some suggestions, I would love to hear that. Because I know we had a little friend who's at my son's daycare who who has pediatric cancer, and she's still going through the end stages of her treatment. So just if there's someone listening, who happens to be hearing this and is like off, I would love those reputable sources for them to have suggestions. Yeah, it's, it's a really, really, really good and important question. And I think that, here's what typically happens. And it's not just if you have a child who's diagnosed with cancer, what I'm going to share with you is something that anybody who hears of a tough diagnosis for pretty much any any disease or illness should think about, but here's the way that it normally goes, you find out that your child has cancer, you are blown away, you don't understand what just happened, because your world just imploded and turned upside down. And you all you can think of is fix my child, fix my child, make my child healthy, get my child back to the state of good health. And so I think that we are our natural reaction is to look at the doctor who has just shared with the news with you, and to say, Well, can you fix this? And then doctors natural reaction is to most often say, Yes, I can fix this. But I what we learned is to take a step back and not say, Can you fix this? But have you dealt with this specific diagnosis before? Yes or no? And then how many times have you dealt with this diagnosis? What was the most recent time? And then this last question is probably the most important? What was the outcome? And if any of those questions, or any of those answers are not what you're looking for, then you should keep digging until you find answers to questions that are helpful. With that said, in our case, what we did was we looked for the hospital that treated the most number of cases of the kind of cancer that my son had. So I wanted to take him to a place where his diagnosis was not an oddity, but something that they dealt with all of the time, and that they would feel comfortable with. So going to a place that treats the greatest number of cases is a really important first step in terms of resources out there, honestly, and at any given week, there's probably I probably get anywhere from three to 10 text messages at various times of day or night from somebody who says Hi, you don't know me, but I got your number from so and so who knows so and so who knows so and so. And I have a friend whose child was just diagnosed or my child was just diagnosed and I'm not quite sure what to do. I wasn't doing I I was call it my side thing that I do, because I, I do talk to a lot of families who have a child who is just diagnosed. And, and it's interesting because everybody's journey is their own journey. And it's they have to go through it. But I think in those early days, you're just looking for information and you're looking for answers. And you're looking to find somebody who you can connect with, who knows what you're going through. Yeah. For sure that those questions are not only I think, so helpful for having a child like with who has that diagnosis or a different diagnosis, but also, I think, for adults, like those are some really important questions, though. And I, I know that it's like we can all learn so much by asking those key questions. And it's interesting, like, just in my own life long now, long time ago, decade ago, we had, I had, I had, like, someone very close to me end up passing away in a way that we didn't expect. And it's like, those types of questions, I think, could have been so helpful. Because sometimes, right, we don't even know what questions to start with. We don't even know how to get the answers we want. Like when, as you said, like, you're just in the state of shock, or disbelief and all of the above. And those are amazing places to start. So thank you for sharing that. Oh, sure. Yeah. And they're not easy, like, they are not easy questions to ask. And I can share with you and your listeners that when we asked those questions of the doctor who had diagnosed our son, and then when we let her know that we were looking at other places, she turned her back on me and walked away and said, Well, there's nothing left here for me to discuss with you. Which was a little bit of a shock. Yeah, it happens. It happens. And it Yeah, the question isn't, isn't Is this about you? It's about my son, that's powerful to know, to for people maybe to expect possibly, that the answers to the questions or like the, the process of like having to go out and look for other people to expect that some people may not have their their most favorable reaction to it. So yeah, but at the end of the day, right, like, we have to be our own advocates, we have to advocate for our family, especially our children. And that takes like a little bit of guts and courage and, and asking those hard questions. Oh, yeah, I, I really appreciate this questions, I'm definitely gonna write them down for myself. So I have them handy. If I ever need them. I want to end by asking also like for people who are interested in nonprofit work, specifically, who really are passionate about children's, you know, like being in the world of PDE, pediatric cancer, is there any suggestions that you would have for them as far as how to get started in this field, like if it is something that they're passionate about, just like your colleagues in ways that they can look to contributing, whether that's be at a nonprofit like yours, whether it's Are there different organizations or associations, but just I like to give people like, a somewhere to start, if they are interested in they're hearing this? And like, wow, this really speaks to me, this is somewhere that I fairly feel like I can contribute in the world, and that I would love to be part of Do you have suggestions for them of like, places they could go to look or ways they could investigate? What kind of jobs are out there? And what kind of opportunities? Boy, you know, that in a way, that's a really tough question to answer, because I bet there's not one of your listeners, she's like, Yeah, I've always thought about working in pediatric cancer. Like, who wants to do that? So I think, I think you have to, to some extent, especially in the nonprofit world, go with what your gut, and your heart is telling you that calls to you. versus looking for a specific cause. You need to I think you find organizations, whether they're local in your area, or whether they're national like ours, but look for organizations that you feel, have the right ethics and values and, and sense of community that align with what your ethics and values and sense of community are aligned with. There are so many there's like, I think it's to the 1.7 or 1.8 million 501 C threes in the US. There's a lot of nonprofits out there. But you have to I just I really think that if you're interested in getting involved with the nonprofit, first of all, you're an amazing person. So kudos for anybody who's like, yes, I want to get involved and help. But you have to find your people. Yeah. And you have to find your community. I mean, look, if I was in the world of pediatric cancer, there are so many causes out there that call to me, but you really, you can't do it on the periphery, you have to do it with your heart, and you got to go all in. So look for the organizations that maybe you see when you're driving around town, and you want to get some more information about and check out their websites and check out their social media, and see if they're aligned with who you are as a person. Or there might be a cause that there could be a specific cause that you're interested in. Because like you're the child and you're in your son's preschool, who who is dealing with a cancer diagnosis, like there might be a group of parents at that preschool? Who are now more aware of this need? And they're like, you know, what can we do to get involved? And how can we help support? So there could be specific causes, but my feeling is nonprofit work is really hard. It's not for the faint of heart. It's tough. It is, or, and so you've got to find your people who have your back? And who, who make you feel like you're welcome you under the tent? And who give you the community that you're looking for. Yeah, I love I love that idea of the 10 that having the community like becoming part of it? Yeah. All right. Well, thank you for that advice. I want to end so I asked, every time I do an interview, I always ask the same question at the end. And so I would love to ask you the same question. And so I always ask about, will you share a sentence that uses verbiage or jargon from your field, then translate it, so it's understandable to us, and this could be from the nonprofit world, it could be from an experience being in pediatric cancer environments, it could be anything you did with your previous career and communications and PR. But the idea that is essentially to understand some of what people are doing on like a day to day week to be week to week basis, to kind of like get in that world and get in that mindset of like, what do you do, and what's it like to walk in your shoes. I think for me, it this might sound terribly boring. But how nonprofits money is allocated and spent, is totally different than the for profit world like it is. It is 180 degree difference. And there are things in the nonprofit world that count against you, financially. And there's things in the nonprofit world that are positives. And I've had to, I've had to lean in hard on the people who know this so much better than I do, in order to make sure that we are being good stewards of donor dollars, and being smart with donor dollars and having the right balance of where the money goes and how and how the money is allocated. And so I for us, it's all about like, programs, program and expenses. And, and it is a whole nonprofit accounting is this whole other world. And I'm so grateful that I have had other people that I can lean in and who are the experts in these feel to make sure that we are being as smart and responsible with donor dollars as we possibly can be. And it blows my mind every day. Like Wait, wait, that's a that's a that's a good thing. Not a bad thing. And it's, it's it's counterintuitive to my entire career of being in the for profit world. But being up to snuff with those types of things and making sure that your organization is one that has a strong rating from Charity Navigator, which is really the gold star for evaluating nonprofits is one of the most important things to me possible and like I believe our rating this year is I think it's a 96 or 97 out of 100. And the only reason it's not. I think the thing that we got dinged on was that we don't have our latest tax returns posted on the website. Well we're in The process of making a website change. So that's why we don't. But you know, we better always be at the very top of that rating, or else. This is not an organization that I ever want to work for. So I would, yeah. Are there specific terms that like, you know, when you do talk to people that they throw that they throw around that as you are part of like coming from the for profit world, and they're like, Oh, like this term in particular is really important. Are there any things like that, that you can remember? There are so I think, probably the one is programming expenses, or programming allocation. And to me programming sounds like it's a negative thing. But actually, programming is the best thing possible for a nonprofit. But having somebody explain that to me over and over again, about, like, why programming, what programming? What the definition of programming is, and what is it that fall under it? So programming is basically how your money is helping to benefit the organization. So for example, in our case, our biggest programming expense, now expense sounds like a bad thing, right? Our grants, well, our grants are a good thing. So like it's called an expense. But it's counterintuitive to what you learn in the for profit world expenses, a negative thing, but for us programming, yeah, like our biggest programming expense are our grants. And our grants are obviously the most important thing that we do. So it Yeah, I can see how that is so counterintuitive. You hear it. So how interesting. Well, it sounds like you have the most amazing smart experts around you helping to understand those nuances. Thank God for them. I remember what the Fred Rogers thing, look for help. Look for the helpers. He always says look for the helpers. Yes. So yes, that's a beautiful quote. Well, you are an amazing helper for so many kids experiencing pediatric cancer. Further parents who are I just sure, trying to figure out whatever they can to help their sweet little munchkins and I so am honored to talk to you to learn about what you do your cool job, and just how you got here, how you, you came to this place. And I'm sure that you are such a tribute to your son. I know you talked about in your interviews, how you're going to see him again one day and I just can't imagine how proud and honored He will be with all the work that you're doing that that people around you are doing in the world. It's it's a beautiful thing. He was the most beautiful child, the most beautiful child and I'm I think people find it odd when I say that I feel like I'm the luckiest man mom on the face of this planet to have had Liam as my son. And I do know, I feel very confident that we will see each other again, and I know that the very first question he's going to ask me is Mommy, did you make it better for other kids? Because that would be his expectation? If there was something that you could do, then why wouldn't you do it? Wow, why not? Yeah, I love that. And what a cool kid, but a cool kid, right? He got just like even your stories of him like riding the bike and like zooming around corners. Sounds like such a special little guy. He was here is he was a daredevil and yet he was like a cat. He had the most amazing balance and every time you would be afraid he would just prove you wrong. Just lived life to its absolute fullest. Also had no reservations with loving with every ounce of his being and the very first the sorry, the very last words that he actually spoke before he couldn't speak anymore. were to say goodbye to his sister Ella and have a nice day at school and I love you. But just an amazing, amazing kid. It's I think that I think that his amazingness is what gives me the strength to keep trying to move forward however, I can because he should still be here, and he's in, and maybe he instilled a little bit more amazingness. So that it would help to inspire me so that I could keep keep trying to make it better for others. So, wow, what I mean, I yeah, you just totally made me cry because I just it's like, but in a good way, because how, how sweet is that like to say that to his sister, I mean, that, like, clearly is just so loving and so special. So I think that's, you know, and it's like having kids myself and seeing their interactions together. I think that's one of the most special, beautiful things right about having kids in general is just seeing not only like the parental bond that we get to have with them, but also the bond between the siblings and the relationship that they get for him. And it just sounds like he truly loved his sister as well. And like, I mean, that's beautiful. So that wow, yeah, that definitely, definitely got me in a good way. So well, it was such an honor. Gretchen, thank you so much for being here and sharing your story and just sharing your cool job with us. Absolutely. Tell any of your listeners call me. Yes, I will. I'm sure they will want to, but let's end on how can they connect to if you maybe in the social media world, or otherwise, like find out about your organization? What are the ways that they can connect? Sure, sure, sure. So on social, we're cookies, and then the number four, and then the word kids so cookies for kids our website is you can get to us two ways either cookies for FLR kids cancer, which is a really long URL to type but it's cookies for kids cancer.org. Or you can also get there a slightly shorter way with be a good cookie.org. So either one, you will be able to find us. We're very active on on all the social media channels, and we're always looking for good cookies who want to get involved and join us. I love that I love that feel good cookie, I think we can all be a good cookie and contribute. And you know, do some good for the world. So what a fun What a fun interview. And thanks again. No, thank you. Thank you.

Julie- Host: 1:17:33

Hey, everybody, thank you so much for listening to women with cool jobs. I'll be releasing a new episode every two weeks. So make sure you hit that subscribe button. And if you love the show, please give me a five star rating. Also, it would mean so much if you share this episode with someone you think would love it or would find it inspirational. And lastly, do you have ideas for future shows? Or do you know any Rockstar women with cool jobs? I would love to hear from you. You can email me at Julie at women with cool jobs.com Or you can find me on Instagram at women who will jobs again that women will jobs. Thank you so much for listening and have an incredible day