Paleontologist Puts Dinosaur Fossil Puzzle Pieces Together, with Myria Perez

Myria Perez is a Fossil Preparator (aka paleontologist) at the Perot Museum of Nature and Science in Dallas, Texas. She reconstructs the Earth’s history by carefully unearthing each new fossil and then puts these prehistoric dinosaur puzzle pieces back together.

Myria fell in love with dinosaurs as a little girl and started volunteering at 12 years old. She has worked with and been mentored by some of the most well-renowned pioneers of paleontology, including Robert T. Bakker and Dr. Kay Behrensmeyer. Notably, she cleaned fossils and created content for an exhibit at the Smithsonian National Museum of Natural History in Washington, D.C.

There is a lot of variation with her job. She uses all sorts of tools as a fossil preparator, including: a hand saw, toothbrush, and an air scribe. She has even used a porcupine quill! She works in a lab environment, which takes some intense focus. She teaches and collaborates with volunteers at the museum. Plus, she gets to go out on digs to look for fossils in the field. 

Resources

• IfThenExhibit.org - Myria's bio
• Society of Vertebrate Paleontology
• The Association for Materials and Methods in Paleontology
• Dallas Paleontological Society

Contact Info:
Myria Perez
@paleontologica
Myria's YouTube channel

Julie Berman - Host
www.womenwithcooljobs.com
@womencooljobs (Instagram)

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Transcript

Myria Perez: 0:00

The coolest fossil tool that I've used is like a porcupine quill (Wow!) because it's soft enough that it'll take off like really soft dirt but it won't scratch like a really delicate fossil. We use that, and toothpicks sometimes toothbrushes you get to scrub and be kind of a dinosaur dentist sometimes. (That's so cool.) Yeah. Lots of interesting things that you could probably find in your kitchen we might use in the lab.

Julie Berman - Host: 0:32

Hey, everybody. I'm Julie and welcome to women with cool jobs. Each episode will feature women with unique trailblazing and innovative crews. We'll talk about how she got here, what life is like now, and actionable steps that you can take to go on a similar path or one that's all your own. This podcast is about empowering you. It's about empowering you to dream big and to be inspired. You'll hear from incredible women in a wide variety of fields, and hopefully some that you've never heard of before. Women who build robots and roadways, firefighters, C suite professionals surrounded by men, social media mavens, entrepreneurs, and more. I am so glad we get to go on this journey together. Hello, everybody. This is Julie and welcome to another episode of women with cool jobs. today. I'm so excited to introduce Marissa Perez. She is a fossil prepared her at the perot Museum of Nature and Science in Dallas, Texas. And so she is a paleontologist, a type of paleontologist, and she is the type of paleontologists that gets to unearth the puzzle pieces of the past here on earth. And so I think it is so fascinating to think about her job as basically someone who is incredibly talented at putting together some of the world's hardest puzzles, because oftentimes, she is working with fragments of fossils that she is then gluing back together. And then she is taking different fossil pieces and trying to recreate what was this creature? What was this dinosaur that was roaming the earth in prehistoric times? And what kind of environment? Were they in all kinds of foods that they eat? What did they do? You know, did they fly did they walk they swim. And so I think that she has one of the coolest jobs. And I loved hearing about it from her. She's so passionate about this area, she fell in love with Dinosaurs when she was a little girl. And she followed her dreams. And she was able to find really, really incredibly wonderful mentors, really incredible people who supported her and helped guide her, and who she could ask questions to, and who really helped show her the possibilities for what she could do in this field. And also now she's able to actually start mentoring people herself because of these incredible people who've mentored her. And so just the whole cycle of mentorship is so important. It's a topic that comes up again and again on this podcast, how having such incredible people in your life to really support you and believe in you and show you opportunities is one of the most important things about I think about following something that you love. And something that you're passionate is finding those people who believe in you 110%. And so she found some really wonderful people. And she's loving her job right now, she gets to do all sorts of different things in different environments. So she's in a lab, where she's actually unearthing the fossils, and using all these very precise tools and very doing very delicate work to do that part of her job. She also works with volunteers and teachers, she also gets to go out in the field, and she actually gets to dig, you know, and unearth things right there, where they've been for however long. And so I loved learning about the different facets and everything that she does. And I hope that you enjoy listening to her and how passionate she is about this field and about paleontology and all the options that exist within it. And another thing that I wanted to share that just really lit me up. And really it was like the silver lining of my day is that I got a new review. And I definitely needed a little bit of like a you know, rah rah moment because I was having some tech issues. And so this is perfect timing. And so I wanted to read this on air, so to speak, and share it with you because it was so meaningful to me. So, Emily Rose Benson, thank you so much for your five star review. I really applaud It made my morning and she said, You go girl love hearing these episodes and how passionate Julia is about sharing the stories of amazing women. Thank you so, so much for taking the time to do that Emily Rose means so much. And if you leave me a review, I may just read it on my next episode. So thank you, as always for listening, I'm so glad you're here. I really appreciate you taking your time to listen because I know things are getting busier, it's summer, it's you know, things are opening up a little bit. We're all kind of like recalibrating, reorganizing our lives. And it means so much that you're here to support me and also to support incredible women who are doing such inspiring work.

Unknown: 5:45

Marissa, thank you so much for joining me today. It's such an honor to have you on the show.

Myria Perez: 5:50

Hey, thanks for having me. I'm excited to share more about what I do as a possible preparer.

Julie Berman - Host: 5:55

Yes. So I have so many questions. You have such an incredible Instagram account, where you share all sorts of really amazing information. And I want to learn all about what you do. So your name is for everyone who doesn't know you is Marissa Flores, and you are a fossil procurator. And you work as a paleontologist at the pro Museum of Nature and Science in Dallas, Texas. And so I think your job is just like, so cool. I know that you're about to go out in the field. And so I really, I really want to know, like all the different facets of your job, what you do what it involves, and just like, what are your favorite things about it? What makes you get up every day?

Myria Perez: 6:50

Yes. So I started out as a volunteer at the Houston Museum of Natural Science. And that's where I started learning how to prepare fossils, do exhibits, and even go out in the field with them. And so it was actually not until college that I realized that being apostle prepared is a career path that you can take, most paleontologists will do academics. And they will do pursue research opportunities and do research as a curator or a professor somewhere out of university. But for me, I really liked the hands on aspect. I love the combination, it has kind of art and science. And there's a ton of variety in what you get to do as a fossil prepared. And what do I do all day, I clean fossils, and I make three dimensional copies of them. And I make sure that fossils that are in collections, which are stored, you know, archivally, so they can be stored for long periods of time for generations to come study them. So making sure all of those specimens are pretty much like healthy. So they're not falling apart, they're us with the right glues and made sure that they're not, you know, they're staying pretty good. I also get to train volunteers, which is a lot of fun. So there's this kind of opportunity to be a mentor and to guide people and teach people about what you're super excited about. And field work is a lot of fun. So I'm actually going to go out in the field I'm going to be about I'm a volunteer at the white side Museum of Natural History. And they are going on a trip to Wyoming. So I'm going to go help them dig up dinosaurs and mammal fossils. I'm very excited to be a part of field, the field research that's happening.

Julie Berman - Host: 8:41

That sounds so incredible, and just all the facets to what you do. I think it's really cool that there's so much to your job. I think, you know, if I would have just thought of a paleontologist, I usually would picture people who mainly were out in the field. And like, you know, digging or actually like in dirt, but I don't know that I would have thought of what you do especially like putting everything together or making the 3d like models, and then all the work that you do with volunteers. I think that's really fascinating that there are so many different options, even as part of your job, that you get to interact and do so many different things.

Myria Perez: 9:27

Yes, I basically do that gap between and sometimes I mean the field work and the display, but everything in the middle. It's, you know, hundreds of hours of my time and volunteers Time goes into cleaning these fossils properly using the right kinds of glue for each specimen because every specimen has a personality. So everything that happens in between the field to Museum, unlike Jurassic Park where you can see them kind of uncover the fossils and it's all nice and laid out and they're just crushing it. With just I don't know, a chip brush or something, I would normally be done in a lab setting. So if you find something out in the field that is very important and hasn't eroded out, you're going to take a lot of matrix or Rock Around the fossil, you're going to take a lot of that rock back with you. So you can work under magnification and work in a controlled environment. There's a sea, which is mine, yay, that require, you know, air like you need a compressed air system and

Julie Berman - Host: 10:30

stuff like that. Okay, yeah, that's so fascinating. And so if you had to just describe your job in the most basic way, how would you describe it?

Myria Perez: 10:41

And I would say, our main duty is to reveal fossils, and keep them in a way that researchers can come back and see them for generations. So we're preserving we are preserving our Earth's lights, history, Earth life's history.

Julie Berman - Host: 11:02

And you know, it's interesting, because as I was doing more and more research about you and what you do, it dawned on me that you're actually literally like a master puzzle, like puzzle maker, like puzzle creator, I don't know what you'd call it. But like, you're not only working with these pieces. And it looks like sometimes there's even fragments of pieces, you don't even necessarily have all the pieces, and you don't have the picture of what it's supposed to look like, either. And so it's so fascinating to me, because it's like, a really interesting set of skills that you have to do your job. And to do it well. And to also do it while sort of respecting the Earth's history. And respecting what, you know, each piece, as you've mentioned, like putting it with certain types of glues, in a very certain process, so that people in the future can enjoy and learn from these things that you do as well.

Myria Perez: 12:07

Yeah, exactly. It's, you actually got the analogy I was about to say is the pot, sometimes we have to puzzle things back together. And that is, it's very hard at first. But once you start reading the rocks and reading the fossils, it becomes a little easier to like, oh, the color changes on this part, I'm gonna look for another piece that has a little bit of orange on this side, or you're looking at the striations the stripes and like textures of the bone to kind of piece them together as well. But yeah, the puzzle analogies, like I always tell people, so you have a train puzzle, and you don't have the picture, like you just said, but you're also going to cut up and take half of them and just throw them away. So you have like half, cut some of the pieces up, then add another puzzle, like puppies or something different. Or cars, because it's similar, it's like a little bit similar. And you're cut that up, and you're just gonna jump a little up. And you're gonna try and puzzle back together. And sometimes stuff goes back together. And it's great. And it's so satisfying. When you find a fit.

Julie Berman - Host: 13:15

I can imagine I mean, that is like, yeah, it's like a professional puzzle person. But to the nth degree, like, I don't know, if there's someone who does puzzles as a profession, but I feel like, I know, maybe I should look into that. But like, you know, I feel like that's what you what you're doing on such a cool scale, except with the things that you know, lived so long ago, which is, which is a whole other thing. So I want to I want to dive back a little bit into your history. Before we talk about, like, what you're doing and some of the details about what you're doing now and talk about, I know you mentioned that you started at a very young age. But can you kind of like give us a picture of how did you know that you loved dinosaurs? And then how did you learn that this

Myria Perez: 14:06

was a career option for you? And so I've always been the dinosaur kid. I wanted to be a paleontologist since my parents claim I was two. So it just there wasn't anything specific. Like I just always loved going to the museum, seeing the fossils and pretending to be a dinosaur wearing dinosaur clothes. And I just, I just loved it. I mean, I still love it. And when I turned when I was 12 I had gone to this event called dyno days with Dr. Bacher, Dr. Robert Barker, a paleontologist and the associate curator there was to David temple. And I had asked them you know, I took a book of my drawings, my dinosaur drawings to go show them and like as I was showing them, asking, What can I do to be involved in this, like I really want to pursue this and something that I really want to do. They let me volunteer as a junior volunteer. And through that I learned to prep, I think that was probably the first thing I learned, we had a traveling exhibit at the museum there. And I got to join and learn how to pack fossils properly and prep some fossils as well. So, I've always liked I've done prep for over 10 years, which is kind of weird. And I didn't, I always thought I saw David and he, he had, he basically does, he's a lab manager, too, as well as a curator. So in my head, I was like, that's, that's what I want to do, I want to have David's job, I want to work with the fossils, I want to go on field trips, and show you know, groups, classrooms, and teachers how to do this, and what the importance is of paleontology. And so when I was in college, I started to learn a little bit more, I started looking at or doing undergraduate research, which was really cool, it was very hard for me, but it was a great learning opportunity. And you really get to see how science works, what hypothesis truly is, and how you test all of that. And all the holes that are in paleontology, because we don't have a complete fossil record. And, um, it's pretty cool. It's pretty wild. Again, you're puzzling, but with your brain with this. And I, I, at the very end college, I was also fossil prepping in college as well. I just was like, man, I just I think the part about paleontology that I really like is I like interacting with the people. And I like I really like working with the specimens. Like I really like being you know, somebody who just sees the fossil all the time and works with that and learns how to read the fossil. And that's fossil prep. And so I didn't realize that that was a career until in college. Okay. And I had a lot of a hard time accepting that because I thought I was going to go do research. So I'm glad that I pursued, like truly what I wanted to do. So I'm really glad that I could find a prepared job and do what I like.

Julie Berman - Host: 17:17

Yeah, I think it's so interesting, first of all, that you started at such a young age. But I also think that the fact that you were in, I guess like such a brave perspective, when you were so young to be like, how can I get involved? And to sort of take that initiative at such a young age is so cool, because I don't, I don't know that it would have ever ever dawned on me at 12 to be like, Oh, can I be a volunteer? Or is there some way I can be involved if I was really in love with a certain area or certain field. And so that is so cool. And I think that's a really important message to almost share is to ask, like, just to simply ask if, if you're interested in Korea, and see. Yeah, right. It's like, and I always, I always say to myself, I remind myself of this too, but it's like I one of the things I always say, especially now because I've been trying new things and doing new things. It's like, I already have the No, but I could have a yes. And so having that, you know, having that opportunity to just ask, is really amazing. And the fact that it led you here, so cool.

Myria Perez: 18:36

I think for me, it was just like, I still like I just always wanted it like I've always wanted it. So it wasn't really a choice for me like, yeah, I'm going to ask like, absolutely. Like, I'm going to ask and see what I can do. If I don't, I can't do that, then I'm going to do this. And I don't know, I think it's I'm just like I can't let stuff go, especially when I really want it. And I think that's what happened at 12 was I really want to do this, like, I feel at home. And then when I started volunteering, I had amazing people around and I think people are also so important. And why I love paleontology to is the people because you have people that are there because they want to be and they truly do like and enjoy the subject. And they care about it to you know, share it with others and make sure that the science is good. Most of the time and yeah, that's the that's where I belong. I feel wonderful in a museum because no,

Julie Berman - Host: 19:36

it's science. Well, and you are in a cool museum with all these dinosaur bones. So it's pretty awesome. I so when when it comes to mentors, because I know I've seen you post a lot about mentorship and the importance of mentorship and I found this really great quote of yours that you actually put on on Instagram. And I just wanted to read it and then get your thoughts on it cuz I thought it was so important. So you said, when people ask me what my biggest piece of advice is mine is to find a good mentor. They see your successes as theirs, and lead you to opportunities you never dreamed of. These are the people that kept me going. And the reason why I love this field dearly. Yeah. And so do you feel like mentors are? are really the reason you're doing things today? Or did they help sort of create your vision for what was possible? Like, what was the importance of mentors to you?

Myria Perez: 20:33

I mean, everything from the encouragement, I mean, I don't know, I don't know, if I would still be doing this. They didn't care or didn't want me that, you know, or it was a discouraging thing. They've always been so encouraging everyone that I've had, and, you know, they kind of took me under their wing, and showed me the ropes, they taught me everything. And, you know, they, they don't push you to failure, but they push you in a way where you can grow. And so having somebody like that is, I feel so like, so grateful for that, and to have so many of them. And I think you know, even if you don't have it, even if it's not career related, having a mentor is great, because then they can advice. You know, you have somebody who is in something that you want to do all the advice that you can learn from them. And it's really cool now, because what if then I'm able to kind of give back like I was the apprentice for so long. And it's weird that I'm like, able to give advice and encouragement to others.

Unknown: 21:39

Yeah, it will you explain a little bit about if then,

Myria Perez: 21:43

yes, I am. So I am part of what's the triple A s ambassador. And it's 125 women stem from all different careers and stages of career in these STEM careers. And our mission is to inspire our target audience as young girls, especially middle school girls to pursue a path in STEM by being a role model, and you know, somebody who's contemporary and professional and doing it right now. And it's really cool, because it just kind of sums up what I'm so grateful to do. Like I want to share with I already want to share with others what I've learned and give back and if then has been the outlet for that, which is great. And it's really cool, too, because I think, I think it's working, I'll get comments from you know, parents, like oh, my gosh, my, my niece or my daughter saw you on TV or whatever. And they really want to be a paleontologist and really happy. And it's just so cool to see that actually, like it's working. And I'm so glad that I can like get back

Julie Berman - Host: 22:46

in that way. That's so cool. Yeah, it's a such a neat organization. And I'll put, I'll put the link in this episode, so people can find it. And I think that the fact that you have had such incredible mentors, and now it's like you're able to then mentor people yourself, is really, really neat and speaks to just the power of having someone to help you along in the journey and, and to ask questions and to not feel judged, you know, but, but yet feel like you can grow and learn as you're going.

Myria Perez: 23:21

And that was something to like all of my mentors, they were so enthusiastic and kind whenever I had questions, which is the way it should be, you know, nobody should be, you know, ashamed for asking your question or because that's how you learn. And if you don't know, it's better to know than to make stuff up in science, especially Yeah,

Julie Berman - Host: 23:43

I can see that for sure. I want to jump to when you went to college, and then you made the transition. Because I know you've you volunteered for quite a long time, you got to learn all about preparing fossils, and volunteer, and what was it like then I know you have an undergraduate degree. So could you talk a little bit about what your degree was? or degrees? I think maybe, and also, how you then transitioned into the prepared to her position? Sure.

Myria Perez: 24:16

So um, I actually going back to kind of the mentors thing, because I had mentors at the Houston Museum, you know, through high school. My, like, biggest thing for college was to have a mentor. So I looked at colleges that had fossil labs accessible to undergraduates, because not all of them do. It's mostly graduate students that were in there. And I reached out to paleontologists that were at a couple of universities and I went and I went and visited with them. I talked with them to see if it was gonna be, you know, a good fit. And Dr. Lewis Jacobs at Southern Methodist University was doing amazing paleontology work and had a lab there. I actually got to show him around the Houston museum when he came down to Houston. So you Yeah, it was really cool. So I went to school for Dr. Jacobs to have him as a mentor. And I ended up doing so for paleontology. There's not really an undergraduate degree for that. Okay, those people do biology or geology. And so I pursued geology because I liked being outside. And I don't know, geology is really interesting. It's like, it's Earth biology, you know. And I ended up majoring in anthropology as well. There were some really cool anatomy courses. And I just, I loved the major. So I ended up just getting that as well. And while I was there, I was working in the prep labs, doing fossils from Marine fossils from Angola, which is really cool. And that became an exhibit and it's at the Smithsonian National National Museum of Natural History right now. Which is really, it's, it's so cool. And it shows and goal is beautiful Cretaceous sees.

Julie Berman - Host: 26:03

Wow, that's so cool. That sounds like an amazing opportunity. I mean, that's a world renowned institutions. How was that? Like? How did you feel getting to work on that?

Myria Perez: 26:13

Oh, my gosh, it was so cool. Because not only was I prepping the fossils there. And the reason I got to be a part of that team was because Dr. Jacobs, he invited me He's like, hey, like, I know you're doing all this stuff in the lab. Do you want to be a part of this exhibit? And I joined in all the meetings that they had weekly with the with content creators at the Smithsonian's quirinal on on a call with them, trying to figure out what things we're going to put in how we're going to say science to the public. And I learned a lot about how exhibits are made, how crew. So that was super cool, because you I like, I think what's great about fossil prep, and just the project that I was a part of is that you have this creativity and science like this, this kind of mix of like science, but creative ways to share it with people.

Julie Berman - Host: 27:06

And I think that must be so interesting to to have gotten to see how they've prepared what you were working on, for such a big audience in Washington, DC, because I mean, that's like an international destination. So that must have been so cool. It's really cool. And I'm very excited that some of my fossils, oh, I'm almost touched everything in there. It's really cool. People are cool. What was that transition? Like, from college to when you got your job? And like, what is it like, what's your day to day? Like, you know, I know you do different things. So maybe like, what's a month in the life of you like, that's better?

Myria Perez: 27:50

Yeah, um, it was actually pretty heat well, easy in terms of moving because SMU is in Dallas, and then the pro museum is in Dallas. So I really didn't have to worry about, you know, traveling anywhere when I first got it. And it was nice to because I already have an idea of what the lab looked like. So there's some familiarity, when I go in for the day, what what I start with is I just go in, and I see who is volunteering that day, because we have daily volunteers that rotate. And I get some fossils set out. And everybody is at a different stage of learning. So I tried to make sure that whatever fossil they are prepping for that date is, you know, suited to their skills. And also, you know, if somebody is doing really well, I'll set out a challenge for them. And so it's a little bit of kind of getting to know your volunteers and having a friendly relationship with them and showing them how to do this stuff. So I'll have them come in, we'll talk about what the project they need to work on is and I'll show them how to do it. And then I will also sit down and prep. And it's really fun because it's like this, when I was like a coloring book. It's just like really therapeutic. And so when you're going through and you're removing the rock, so you're you're using tools, either Eric scrubs, which have a little vibrating tip that just blows away the rock and like chips it off, or handpicks and like q tips or toothpicks, routers, you know, taking off the dirt and following the fossil and it's like you're you're making discoveries every day.

Julie Berman - Host: 29:27

That sounds so incredible. And I was thinking while you're describing some of the tools like you must be so incredibly patient and detail oriented, and get dedicated to making sure that like you're keeping everything intact. That is

Myria Perez: 29:42

all my patients like that goes to all of my patients goes. I joke about it, but like I'm serious, like I don't have patience for anything else.

Julie Berman - Host: 29:51

So funny. Well, I could see how it would it would take a lot of dedication and patience to do that. But yet like it's like you said I'd like it. I haven't ever done it. But I just like from seeing the stuff that you've posted and hearing you talk about it. It just must be so cool. Like, once you do have a big discovery, like, how does that feel when you discover something that maybe no one has ever seen before?

Myria Perez: 30:16

Oh, it feels really good, especially when the curator goes in what oh, my gosh, wait, that's actually this eerie, like, you don't know, you're like, Oh, this is really interesting. I'm not sure what this is. And then, you know, somebody who's a little more well versed, and that comes in and goes, Oh, this is from a whatever, this is a toe bone or, you know, with arthritis or whatever, you know, something really weird and interesting. I'm, like, man, I was the first one to see that, like, I uncovered that that fossil hasn't seen the light of day or millions of years. Oh, it's pretty close. Yeah,

Julie Berman - Host: 30:47

I can't imagine that. It just sounds so cool. Like, we were talking a little bit before. And I mentioned that when I was an undergrad, I took a geology class, because I actually thought it was gonna be easy, and end up being so hard. But I also ended up loving it, I thought it was so fascinating. And so I always thought like, oh, if I would have followed that track, you know, like, what would I be doing? So it's so cool to hear about this. And the fact that like, you see things that haven't seen the light of day and just millions and millions and millions of years, it's, it's pretty cool. You make a discovery every day, what are the other tools that you use to do your job and like the the tasks that are involved when you are in the lab.

Myria Perez: 31:32

So right now, we've been using a lot of what are called air scribes. And they're a pen that operates with pressurized air, compressed air, and has a little chip on it that vibrates, and it makes some buzzing noise, kind of like at the dentist, okay, you go through and you just use or describe and it takes the matrix or the rocker on the fossil off. So we use a lot of those. And the coolest fossil tool that I've used is like a porcupine quill was soft enough that it'll take off like really softer, but it won't scratch like a really delicate muscle. Okay, that toothpicks, sometimes toothbrushes, you get to scrub and being kind of a dinosaur dentist sometimes. But so cool. Yeah. Lots of interesting things that you could probably find in your kitchen we might use in the lab. Okay.

Julie Berman - Host: 32:29

Wow. And I saw a picture. And so I wanted to ask about this. So you were talking about like you were using some sort of handsaw. And it was like this big chunk of, I think you you mentioned plaster that it was like, yeah, through plaster with the handsaw. And then like, you know, getting into the actual matrix, like the material that's around the fossils. So I was wondering, because I have so many questions about this. I wanted to know, first of all, like, how do you get if you have this big chunk of something that you're wrapping? Like how do you decide what chunk you want to wrap? And then take to the lab? And then yeah, like how do you use the saw to not then destroy What's inside? So

Myria Perez: 33:17

So I will hear about this. All good questions. So like, in order to take back what we call our jackets, which is this plaster burlap, with protective case that we make around a fossil that we have in the field, a lot of it can be luck, sometimes because you you see an exposed fossil, maybe you're digging it up, and you're trying to figure out as much as you can, and then you can round it out, and then take that back to the lab for further prep. Sometimes, like you see pieces of fossil and you're like, Well, I know it goes this far. So we're going to make sure and take this much matrix out or this much rock out to hopefully still have fossils with it. So sometimes it can be you're making a guesstimate, in a way and taking that chunk back and you can't you got to be careful about how you're mindful how big you're making it. And sometimes out in the field, you have to break a bit of a bone or so if you want to take chunks that you can physically bring back. So like there are definitely thought out sacrifices that happened prep sometimes because you know, we have bones that sit on top but you have to kind of go through and think Well, what's more scientifically important this skull piece or this read that we have like you know a couple of them and you can always go back later. But we take those things back to the lab and then for the saws but you got to cut the plaster out and so there's a layer of toilet paper in between the fossil and our plaster or burlap and plaster that's made. So when you use the saw up very careful and make sure you have some sort of vacuum because it'll get stuck everywhere and set off the fire alarm. You have To Be very careful, and when you feel this all kind of give a little bit, that's when you stop, because that's when you hit the toilet paper. And so you just, you just have to go really slow and like, make sure whenever you feel that kind of give, you just let go.

Julie Berman - Host: 35:14

That's fascinating. And it's really interesting what you're talking about as far as making those hard decisions about what's sort of scientifically more meaningful or valuable, when you are trying to figure out how to, I guess, preserve things or like wrap things and then take it in,

Myria Perez: 35:35

not always and most of the time, we really try to avoid any sort of breaking, but it does happen and things break all the time in the lab, it's part of fossil prep stuff comes broken, you know, from the lab or from the field. But we have special reversible glues call we personally use b 76. b bar 76 is like the name of the glue. But if you can dissolve it in acetone in like nail polish remover, so you can make it really thick, kind of like a glue or two sticks. Or you can make it really thin where you can use it to consolidate or pour, it's more of a liquidity kind of consistency, you can pour it over something that's really crumbly, and let it dry, and it kind of keeps everything together. Wow. Yeah, it's, it's interesting. And it's good that we have glue failed to do our job if it wasn't for good glue. So it's so

Julie Berman - Host: 36:30

cool. And it's really fascinating to hear. I've never heard of reversible glue. And so when you talk about kind of, after you've taken something out of the matrix, and you have like a piece either that you've glued together, let's say or that you have a big chunk of something, how does it become what we see in the museum? You know, where you figured out the pieces of the puzzle to then create this large dinosaur? And, you know, and then whose job? Is it? Like? Do you get to help research what it is? Or do you collaborate with people to find out about the history of it, because I think that part is so cool, too.

Myria Perez: 37:11

Yeah, um, so for display, a lot of the stuff basically everything that I work on right now, you can see it through the visible prep lab, but it will all go into what's called collections. And that's what we have is a very big, like, huge warehouse full of organized drawers, it's so cool. And it's like a candy store, because you just have stuff from all over the world fossils from all over the world, you know, taxidermy rocks and stuff like that natural science specimens. But with that all goes into collections, and then collections as these specimens are kept, to last for, hopefully forever. So when scientists come through, and they have, you know, there's a new technology that happens, where you have a scientist that's trying to study those animals or specimens, you can go in there and access that data. So in a museum, you will definitely find you'll find real fossils, and you'll also find what are called casts, there, they're three dimensional copies of the real fossils. So if you have, you know, this amazing dinosaur fossil, that's one of a kind, you only have one, how do you want to display it everywhere, and you want researchers to be able to get access to this, how do you replicate it, we do a process called molding and casting. So we take we create a mold, you know, out of rubber most of the time, and then we put resin in those molds, which will make a copy a three dimensional copy all of the three dimensional detail will be preserved depending on the quality of molds and cast casting materials, you use it, you know, you can still research it and still study it. So a lot of museum displays will have those casts, because that's just you know how it is and if you want a copy of what one animal then there you go, you got one, some are kind of a mix. So loving composite specimen, so if you have cast and real fossils or reconstructions, you have reconstructions which are our scientific best guess. And that's, you know, through a lot of research, so it's not just something made me made up, it's always gonna be, you know, as best we can to fit those animals. So, like, right now we have this Allosaurus fossil. It's a very, very big long back dinosaur. And it's not it's not technically 3d printed, but it's something like that and I can't remember what method they used. Okay, they are there are three specimens of Allosaurus. There's one at the Smithsonian, Austin and then the pro museum has some They're all different parts of the ant, the same kind of animal. But they're different sizes, because they're different individuals. So what do you do, you scan all of those fossils. And to make it, like our fossils, we have the neck, the neck bones of Allosaurus, we'll scale all of those other fossils to match our scale of the neck. And so then they printed it, or I can't remember what they did. But they created that. So you have like, basically their real fossils, just, you know, as a purple cow, or

Julie Berman - Host: 40:32

not quite. That's, yeah, that's so amazing, I would have never thought that, you know, you'd maybe find three of the same type of dinosaur fossil. But if it was from three different dinosaurs, then they might not all go together. But yet, you can still like extrapolate and pull out the information that you'd need to then create one full dinosaur is that kind of what happened?

Myria Perez: 41:00

Yeah. And then after that, it's not, we're not making up the pieces, we're just scaling it to be like our individuals, we can have our display, we have the display of the real fossils that we have, and then the full full skeleton. And it's also great casts are so wonderful, and replicas are so wonderful, because you can put them in poses that you probably can't with real fossils, because real fossil is extremely heavy sometimes. And you have to have good armatures, like all of the cradling around the bone from the metal. And with cast, you know, you can hang it from the ceiling, you can make them do poses. And it's really great, you can do a lot with those

Julie Berman - Host: 41:39

that is so fascinating to think about. Because you have worked in this field for so long. And you've done so many different types of things like volunteering, but then also now working like what is your favorite aspect of your job, and why

Myria Perez: 41:57

I really like how, how there's a variety of things. Like it's not one thing all the time. I really, really like fieldwork because I like being outside. And like there's the discovery aspect and the hiking, and I really do like field work. But I also really like science education and training volunteers, like I think the variety and the job, and that you're kind of on your feet. Like you're not just stuck. I mean, yeah, I mean, when you're prepping, you're, you're sitting down most of the time, but you know, taking breaks, check on volunteers and do all those things. I like the variety.

Julie Berman - Host: 42:35

That makes a lot of sense. And I think it's so neat that you get to do so much variety, in your job. I know you're about to go into the field. And so what is that like? And how do you know where you're going? How do people know that there's fossils to find there? And then what's the process? Like when you get there? Who are you working with? And what do you do?

Myria Perez: 43:00

Yes, so a geologic map comes in very handy when you're looking for fossils, and you're trying to find places where fossils are being exposed, or this rock specific rock layer. So say you're trying to find Jurassic fossils, you're going to look on the geologic map, it's very colorful, and each color designates a certain time period where the rocks are exposed. So you look for the I don't remember what color Jurassic is usually, but let's say green. So you look for the dark green spot for Jurassic on your map. And you go there and look for outcrops basically where that stuff can be seen. Okay, so there's no pop soil or grass over it, we if you can't see the rock, when you get out in the field, it's just great. And each field or each kind of locality is going to be different. So you kind of have to train your eye. fossils can be so many different colors. And, you know, if you find a fossil, you just train your eye for it. And you're like, Oh, no, I can see all of them. No, because like fossils down here.

Julie Berman - Host: 44:07

I love that you're showing. Oh, cool, okay, you

Myria Perez: 44:09

just got a fossil, or you have a rock here. And yet there's tons of them everywhere. Okay, that's cool. But then if you look really carefully, all of these like little kind of pinkish areas and white. Those are all tiny little bones. And now you see, now when you pick up a rock, you see them. Yes.

Julie Berman - Host: 44:25

Yeah. And that's so interesting, because I definitely think, you know, when you're holding up that rock, I was like, Oh, well, it's kind of interesting looking. But I don't know that I would have associated fossils with that. But now that you showed me, I would have seen thing like I wouldn't be able to be like, Oh, I see all these little things are actually like they were living creatures, which is really cool. Geology is so fascinating to me. Do you have a favorite dinosaur or a type of dinosaur? I know this is probably the most impossible question to answer. Um, I mean,

Myria Perez: 45:01

I as a kid, I really liked parasaurolophus the length the long crust. That was my favorite for a very long time. And now like it, honestly just like changes because like the more you know, or the more you find out or learn about something becomes your favorite. So I don't know. I mean, I do have a favorite. I do love atheist orders and pleasing sores. A lot. Like what are those? What's that look

Julie Berman - Host: 45:27

like? What does that dinosaur look

Myria Perez: 45:29

like? These are marine reptiles that lived at the same time during dinosaurs. And so okay, aka sores look very dolphin like name is very large eye and they have the dorsal tail and the tail fluke. And then please you sores are what you kind of think of the Loch Ness Monster they belong that kind of like the very long necks and some of them have kind of bigger skulls and they swim in the swimming the ocean.

Julie Berman - Host: 45:55

Okay. And those were marine mammals, reptiles, marine reptiles, okay. marine reptiles. Yes. Now, because you are working with all different types of sounds like fossils at different points in your career. Like, what is your favorite type of fossil to actually work with? Do you have a favorite in that sense?

Myria Perez: 46:18

Um, honestly, that's tough, because when I work on something for a very long time, it's great to have a break and do like some handcraft. I do really like there's this dinosaur called Papyrus or as crow Oram, which is a lot of stuff that we work on in the lab, pro Museum, and it's tracer top counts, picture a triceratops with Okay, instead of the three horns, put like a really weird like ugly chunk of like, skull piece can call it nasal boss, it's like a really thick skin that goes over it. Okay, that part called the nasal boss is really fun to prep, because you get really, really close on the textures. And it's got all these like little nooks and crannies. It's It was challenging to figure out how to prep but once I figured out how to prep, it was very satisfying. See, like, take your air scribe and you just go straight down, you carefully take away the rock, and then you wait till you get this texture, this like peppered, like chocolate brown texture, and you like looked up and then you keep going. And it's just got all these really intricate kind of holes and stuff. That would be where the blood vessels and the nerves would be in real life or when this animal is alive. Um, so I really like that a lot.

Julie Berman - Host: 47:41

Yeah, that's, Oh, my gosh, yeah, I would have to go look this one up, because I was trying to picture and I don't know if my picture in my head is accurate to what you were describing. And as a side note, I do love like, you have some of the cutest dinosaur shirts. And I know I was telling you, I love your dinosaur purse. Yeah. We were talking about how now you can get a little bit more dinosaur gear for anyone who's listening. This stuff is out there now more and more. Okay, thank you. And she's showing me a little replica. Man that is kind of an ugly creature. I know. I know. Yeah. Yeah, it almost looks like it has Yes, like the Triceratops. But then it has like a weird, funky, almost like rhinoceros see, like piece but it's just like a big chunk of like flesh. I don't know, on top of the nose. And so I want to I want to make sure we talk about to like for people who are interested in a career, what would you suggest? How should someone get started learning about the options and finding mentors, things like that.

Myria Perez: 48:56

Oh, my gosh, I just started a YouTube channel. And my first episode is all about this. So I like got it down. So what you want to do, I guess the perils do, which is the biggest piece, I would continue to ask questions. Don't be afraid to ask questions, kind of seek out these resources online as well now that the pandemic because I think maybe there are places to volunteer, I would suggest volunteering, okay, because that's how you get experience or doing an internship. And really any job honestly, if you can get an internship or just get a taste, without committing, that's great, because you can find out what you like what you don't like about a specific job. Or maybe you find out another path through that internship.

Julie Berman - Host: 49:39

And as far as like, Are there associations or other even like other places like Facebook groups or things on Instagram that people might be able to look for and just like Google to start

Myria Perez: 49:52

Yeah, so you can look on Facebook for fossil groups or paleontology related things. Those are great. You can also find paleontologists through social media. YouTube is a great outlet. Twitter sometimes, yeah, if you just search paleontology, if you search hashtags, a lot of things will come up as well. So if you start just kind of exploring that area, like looking at paleo art or muscle prep or research,

Julie Berman - Host: 50:23

okay, yeah. And it's so helpful to have sometimes the terminology as well, because it's like a starting point. Yeah. And so I think those are like the practical things that if you're not in the field, you may not know. And so besides, besides those, are there any other professional organizations or other places that you go to, for sort of like industry knowledge, or, as far as even, like informal places?

Myria Perez: 50:51

I know we mentioned if then, which I'll link to Is there anywhere else that you would recommend where people can start for? I'm trying to think so there are annual meetings, like conferences for paleontologists that I have attended and plan on attending in the future. So there's Society of Vertebrate Paleontology, which is annual, and then there is amp, which is Association for materials and methods and paleontology, which is prep oriented. And then around Dallas, there is the Dallas paleontological society. So if you are somebody who pursues it as a hobby, or is just generally interested, DPS is a great resource for those in Dallas, Fort Worth area.

Julie Berman - Host: 51:36

Okay, yeah. Those are some great resources. And I guess, I was wondering, because I was curious about this. This is somewhat related to, I think, to what we're talking about, really with mentorship? The best way to find a mentor, like, do you think it would be to go somewhere, you know, like a museum? or what have you and asked to volunteer? Or what is the best way to find a mentor in this field? Or like, would it be to find someone on Instagram like you are? What do you have all of the above?

Myria Perez: 52:10

Like, wherever you can have an interaction with somebody? I mean, if that's through Instagram, or for meeting them at the museum or emailing, like, if you can contact somebody, I'm sure that's, that's another way that you can find a mentor.

Julie Berman - Host: 52:24

Yeah, I think it's so incredible. Just like the, I think the path that you've taken, and it sounds like you just have the most incredible mentors in your life. And the more women I talked to, the more and more I see how important that is, in really helping to elevate each woman, you know, to where she where she is, and the opportunities that exist. Absolutely. So I want to ask first, like, what is the biggest myth or misconception about dinosaurs? Do you think,

Myria Perez: 53:02

oh, that they're extinct? Because there's still dinosaurs living birds are technically part of the group of dinosaurs called theropods. So they are still around and they aren't technically dinosaurs. Wow,

Julie Berman - Host: 53:18

that is easy. I yeah. Okay. I did not know that. So there we are live a month dinosaurs. Luckily, they're small. Yeah.

Myria Perez: 53:29

I mean, if you look at a T Rex, they have a circle, which is called a wishbone. So they have a wishbone just like your turkey. If you look at their feet, they are very similar. If you Oh,

Julie Berman - Host: 53:39

my gosh, yeah. So a T rex had a giant wishbone? Yeah, it's pretty, pretty sizable. Yeah. That is crazy. Oh, my gosh, okay. Well, good to know. I asked this question. I feel so much smarter. Now. I'm gonna have to, like tell people all about this. I feel like each industry has its own special language and verbiage. And so I love to ask each woman I interview about a special sentence that she can share with us that has this unique verbiage or jargon in your field, and then to have you translate it for us so that we can basically understand what you're talking about. So I would love to hear if you have an example,

Myria Perez: 54:25

I guess. So if I had a volunteer come to me and they had something break. So maybe I come up and go, okay, you show me where where this is broken, and maybe they would say, trying to think, oh, the back here it soars parietal horn needs boop are 72 so we can consolidate it. So that would pretty much mean the parietal horn is part of the skull and the horn is at the very top so I think I showed you on here like the very top of the of the thrill is a primal horn this couple of them and then before said Many are 76 or 72 is glue. And then consolidate would be to keep everything that's crumbly, and glue it in a way where it doesn't crumble anymore. And then Paki read it Saurus means thick nosed lizard. So every time you see the word Soares that means lizard. So like Tyrannosaurus rex is tyrant Lizard King. A lot of them are Greek and Latin. So once you know a couple and soukous means crop Now, does that mean that thing is a lizard or whatever, but that's just kind of what that main means. And that story, whatever the discovery was, yeah. Wow. Okay. Well,

Julie Berman - Host: 55:36

thank you for translating that, because it's always so interesting to hear. Like, yeah, like a typical sentence that you just might hear when you're working. And yet, I would have no idea what you're talking. So within, thank you for explaining it to because now it makes complete sense. And I think that, you know, your field and what you're doing is just like, not only is it really important, because you're helping to make a more complete puzzle, out of the Earth's history and kind of fill in some of those blanks that we're still learning about year after year, and what life was like back then. And it's just really interesting to think about how you know, it's not just the the creature that you're discovering, but it's, you know, things like the, yeah, the world and the environment, what that was like, and like the potential plants that were living and the atmosphere, just like so many things that went on as well. It's really neat to think about, and just all the varied aspects of what you get to do. And your job is so fun to hear about, because it's just neat that you, you know, get to do something that's so detail oriented, and does require a lot of patience. But then you also get to work with people so much, and you get to go outside into the field. And just like this huge variety of, of skills that you have to do it and the people you work with. Yes. I love it all. Yeah, I can totally see why. So thank you so much for being a guest, Marissa, and I want to ask you, if people would like to connect with you to find you on Instagram to find your new YouTube channel. How can they do that? Where can they find you?

Myria Perez: 57:26

Oh, that's awesome. You can find both my YouTube channel and Instagram. It's paleontological. That's my username. And if you want to find anything, I haven't link tree with all the links in it. If then, if you're interested, or other podcasts that I've done, it's all on my Instagram.

Julie Berman - Host: 57:44

Awesome. Thank you so much. It has been a true pleasure to get to hear all about what you do.

Myria Perez: 57:50

Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. And I'm glad I could share everything about my job with you.

Julie Berman - Host: 57:58

Hey, everybody, thank you so much for listening to women with cool jobs. I'll be releasing a new episode every two weeks. So make sure you hit that subscribe button. And if you love the show, please give me a five star rating. Also, it would mean so much if you share this episode was someone you think would love it or would find it inspirational. And lastly, do you have ideas for future shows? Or do you know any Rockstar women with cool jobs? I would love to hear from you. You can email me at Julie at women with cool jobs calm or you can find me on Instagram at women who will jobs again that's women will jobs. Thank you so much for listening and have an incredible day.