Today on the Evangelist Podcast, we're talking about our Christmas outreach. The Evangelist Podcast. Encouragement to speak life to a needy world. On the podcast today, we are going to be hearing two interviews from the writers of our Meet the Nativity videos. First of all, you'll be hearing my interview with Glenn Scrivener, who you'll be familiar with. And secondly, you'll be hearing Glenn's interview with James Carey. Glenn, can you tell us a bit about this year's Christmas video? We know you've kind of done one every year for a couple of years now. What's the kind of big idea behind this one? What's the idea?
SPEAKER_02What's the big idea? Yeah, so we've been doing Christmas videos for the last six Christmases. And it kind of started six years ago when I uh wrote the anti-santa ranty, um, also known as Jesus versus Santa. And uh I think I wrote that on the 21st of December for like a carol service, and then I asked uh Andy Brinkley to uh film me doing it on the 22nd. I think we uploaded it on the 23rd, and I think by Christmas Day we had 20 or 30,000 views, and we were like, oh, that's interesting. Um so we tried again the next year, and the next year, and the next year. We've always been trying to top ourselves and um top ourselves. That's that's no, that's a bad thing.
unknownIt wasn't that bad.
SPEAKER_02It hadn't been that bad. We've probably been trying to go one better than the year before, is what I'm trying to communicate. Um, and so that was a big challenge because last year was was huge. So we had uh he came down, the um the Down syndrome nativity in which all the actors had Down syndrome, and uh that was very widely shared, and it's a beautiful video, and it's it's definitely our best Christmas video to date, largely because I'm not in it. That's a hint. Get off camera, Glenn. And um, and so I've gotten right off camera this year, and uh, I guess ever since oh, ever since about Easter, I've been thinking about Christmas and what we can do. And the idea for this Christmas is basically um based on an old apocryphal tale of a shepherd. And in this old apocryphal tale, it's hundreds of years old, um the so the story goes, the shepherd turns up at the Nativity and everyone else has a presence. I mean, obviously, the three kings they've got some very impressive presents, but you know, even the shepherds have brought a little lamb for the Lord Jesus, and he turns up empty-handed, and he's feeling, you know, like yeah, a fish out of water, and he's sticking out, and one of the other, you know, shepherds is ribbing him and says, Why haven't you brought anything? And he's just about to leave when he notices that Joseph has received the gold and the frankincense. And Mary is holding Jesus, but in order to receive the myrrh, Mary needs to offload Jesus. So who does she give Jesus to? She gives Jesus to the empty-handed loser who hasn't brought anything. And it's just a wonderful little um communication of the truth that we bring nothing to Christmas and we receive everything when we receive Christ. Um, and that actually, yeah, Christmas is not about us giving a gift to Jesus, it's about the gift of God the Son Himself who's given to us even in our uh empty-handedness. So so that was the basic idea because I've I've wanted to um visually represent that because it's it's a very visual story, but then you sort of think, well, do you do it as a first century story? Um you could do that, um, or you could update it. So, how do you update it? And who would be the shepherd who is empty-handed in the modern day retelling? And so, you know, but together with James Carey, and you're about to hear an interview with James Carey that I did on set, he's my co-writer, and together with uh Nate Morgan Locke and Barry Cooper, who've been on the Evangelist podcast uh a number of times and who co-wrote um Life Explored Together, we kind of got together and we sort of dreamt up who our modern-day Shepherd would be. Who's going to be this empty-handed loser who feels like he hasn't brought anything to the equation at Christmas and feels like he's he's an outsider? And of course, lots of us have had experience of having Christmas at someone else's house and feeling to be, feeling like we are that outsider. And so at that stage, you know, it's Meet the Parents, isn't it? You know, Ben Stiller in Meet the Parents is a total outsider, he's a loser, he gets everything hilariously cringeworthily wrong. But could Ben Stiller from Meet the Parents could he meet the Nativity? Could he somehow encounter the first century nativity and receive the baby Jesus even in all his empty-handedness? And in about June of this year, we sort of thought, yes, that's the idea. Somehow we need to deposit a 21st century comedy character into the first century nativity. And in our heads that made sense. I don't know if that was foolhardy, but in our heads it's sort of it seemed possible to us that you could have a bit of a time-traveling magic realism through the wardrobe into Narnia kind of moment. But as soon as you have that idea, you've got to think, goodness, this is gonna cost a lot of money. Because to make that look believable, um, you can't just do it with a camcorder in the back garden. Um, you need a lot of smoke and mirrors. So at that stage, it became uh a very big deal and something that we'd need to raise money for and and um and get a lot of help with. But I think throughout we've just been convinced that this is such a good story, it needs telling. And so, you know, no price is too ridiculous to pay for this, is the is uh is the idea.
SPEAKER_01Great, and so this year as well, the format is a little bit different, yes, in that there are four videos coming out. So, how does that kind of work? Is it is it the case, you know, uh and they're being released throughout well kind of from the end of November into December.
SPEAKER_04Yes.
SPEAKER_01Is it the case that kind of at the end of each episode kind of kind of segues into the next one? Is the drums crash in like he send us on Tentahooks, or is it work?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. No, there's this it's so the original idea is Will, this boyfriend, ends up receiving Christ. Um, and that would be a lovely video, and we could just call it quits at that. But then in the shower one morning I had the idea, well, you know what? There's three other main characters um from the 21st century. There's Will the boyfriend, but what about Claire, his girlfriend? And what about her dad? And what about her stepmum? And those are the four um 21st century characters. Shouldn't we tell their stories as well? And uh this again was probably a foolhardy decision, but I kind of started to think, well, how can we tell their stories? So after after Will has his encounter, after he meets the Nativity, in episode two, we return to the house and we return to the 21st century to tell Claire's story, Will's girlfriend, and uh Claire discovers that she's pregnant and she's not ready to be pregnant. So um, what does she need from the nativity? How does she encounter something that will you know give her what she needs to get through her challenge? And so we have her encountering Mary, and I won't give away too much more about that, but um, so she has an encounter with the nativity that changes her and gives her strength and courage to face her life. And then we tell the story of Claire's stepmother, Ruth. And uh Ruth obviously has a lot of sadness in her life, and Ruth um she kind of hates Christmas, um, but you would never know it because she absolutely obsesses over Christmas and makes sure that everything is just so, and she's a neat Nick and a control freak, and um yeah, because Christmas has to be just right, um, because it's always hard for her. And so she ends up encountering the Nativity by by meeting a shepherd who's babysitting Jesus. And uh I won't give away too much about what happens there, but she she learns that even in all the mess Christ is given, um, and she learns to be still in the midst of all that mess. And then the fourth character is the potential father-in-law-in-law, so Claire's dad, Will's potential father-in-law, and of course, the father-in-law thinks that Will is a buffoon and his daughter can do so much better, and he's having difficulty letting go. Um, and so he needs to meet Joseph. Um, Joseph, who also you know needs to let go of Jesus into a very dangerous world, and they have a little conversation, and then by the end of the four episodes, kind of the 21st century family has been put together through encountering the first century family, and there's lots of hugs and you know, swelling music, and uh and we get to quite quite a nice resolution at the end of episode four. So, yeah, I mean I I think um John Lewis thought they were pushing the boat out by having two videos this year, but they are amateurs. Amateurs, I tell you. We've got four.
SPEAKER_01So it's the idea with each of those characters that in some way, hopefully, people who see these videos they may there'll be one or maybe more at least that they'll go, Yeah, I really identify with that person's story, you know, rather than just a will and people going, Well, that's not really me, or just uh, you know, was it Claire?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, Claire, the girlfriend, yeah, yeah, yeah.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_02So, you know, Will's Will's full of charm, but it doesn't work. And you know, Claire is full of plans, but they get torpedoed, and uh um, you know, Ruth wants to be full of control, but you know, she loses it, and and um and Ken, the the dad, is is full of status, but that gets threatened. And and so yeah, yeah, I hope it that it uh it resonates with lots of different people on lots of different levels, and we've tried to show how the gift of Christ at Christmas impacts those different people in different ways, and how different aspects of the gift of Christ actually meet us in our out of controlness or they meet us in our anxieties, they meet us in our feelings of being an outsider or whatever it is. Um, yeah, Christ, yeah, Christmas, Christmas has the answer. The actual real Christmas, not just the ones that Tesco's and you know Marks and Spencer's will will tell you about. The actual Christmas has good news as well.
SPEAKER_01And so they all they're all they they can be all just viewed by themselves, so they're in a sense all stand alone, but also part of a bigger thing as well.
SPEAKER_02Certainly episode one stands alone, and then two, three, and four sort of build on that. And then what we're going to do is on Christmas Day, cut them all together into a supercut. It'll be 12, 13 minutes. And uh and that will be like a short film that again will stand alone and we'll see who wants to take that short film. Um, yeah, we're gonna, you know, uh what's the word? We're going to enter it into um short film festivals and short film competitions and that sort of thing. And who knows? Let's you know, pray, pray that you know BBC 3 takes it, pray that Netflix takes it. Um it it really is very high production value. So from that point of view, um why wouldn't they? But uh yeah, let's let's pray that uh it gets out there, not only online. The first audience we're thinking of is Facebook and YouTube, and just wanting it to be shared and go viral online. But then we wonder whether there's a secondary audience at screenings, at film festivals, film competitions, Netflix, BBC, who knows? Who knows? But we'll uh we'll keep praying that God would open those doors.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so we just want it to go wider really, ultimately. You want it to reach people and people to hear the message in it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, totally. Totally. And on Facebook, we're we're then you know, wanting to offer the book Four Kinds of Christmas, which is my Christmas book from a couple of years ago. And um, yeah, we've got 500 free copies to give to people um who are interested, and uh and as we always have to do at these Christmas outreaches, we need to uh uh ward off the cheapskate Christians. Yeah, absolutely. If you go to ten of those.com, you can get it for like a pound, all right? Cheapskate Christians hold back. This is for those who uh perhaps don't go to church regularly. Um we're gonna offer 500 copies of of uh Four Kinds of Christmas to UK viewers anyway. And um, and off the back of the uh Facebook campaign, we're then going to show Life Explored, um, written by uh Nate and Barry and uh presented by them and by Rico Tice. And so yeah, between Christmas and New Year, we think it's a really interesting time where people are on Facebook, probably a lot more than they should be, because they should be with their families. That's why they're on Facebook. That's why they're on Facebook. Running away to their friends on Facebook. Um but yeah, I mean, usage of Facebook just just goes through the roof between Christmas and New Year. And isn't this a great time for discipleship? It's not it's not a great time to get people to a Life Explored live course. Um we'll have to wait till January for that, and we'll point them towards those courses in January. But um, is there an opportunity and how do we how do we make use of that opportunity between Christmas and New Year online to see if we can disciple people? We're gonna have a go.
SPEAKER_01Great. Well, I mean I'm really looking forward to it. Um I think it's uh from everything I've seen. If you're if you're you know if you're on Facebook and you've not seen the pictures yet, head over to the Speak Life page and check out all those kind of bits behind the scenes. And we've got a couple of behind-the-scenes bits that are gonna pop out before the actual video as well, haven't we? Some other stuff.
SPEAKER_02In fact, there might be there might even be a video that's out now, even before this face even before this podcast goes out. So um yeah, go on to go onto the Facebook page, Speak Life UK, and like us there. And you'll be the first to receive all the behind-the-scenes stuff, but also uh the four videos as they drop on the four Mondays before Christmas.
SPEAKER_01And I guess as well is to say to people you know who are who are on on the Facebook page, who like the videos, don't just like them and think that's great, be good to share them and yeah.
SPEAKER_02There's another button just next to the like button, yeah? It's called share. This is how the gospel goes out.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Sharing is caring. Sharing is caring. Yeah, yeah. So now uh we can hear my interview with James Carey, um, who has some fascinating things to say, not only about this Christmas outreach, but also about how Christians can engage in the media ongoingly. Enjoy my interview with James Carey.
SPEAKER_03Brilliant. And I'm here with James Carey in our million pound mansion here in North London. I keep saying million pound mansion, and then I think actually pretty much every house in London is probably million pound.
SPEAKER_00And this is this one's probably worth more than a million pounds. Oh, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, this is this is quite impressive. You'll have to you'll have to wait till November 27th to see just how impressive this place is. But uh, this is your first experience of the mansion. Are you are you impressed?
SPEAKER_00I am very impressed, yeah. Yeah. The only uh comfort is I look at the garden and think I wouldn't want to have to look after that. Yes. But of course, if you have a mansion like this, you have people to do that.
SPEAKER_02There are people, there is staff. Yeah, absolutely. Um so, James, you've just uh you're you're in the middle well, you're not in the middle of a tour, but a monk's tale has been touring around the country.
SPEAKER_00It is touring, I would say, relentlessly. Yes. Um but uh mercifully I don't have to be there for it. Yes. So uh and I have cunningly written it so that it only requires three actors and no technical support.
SPEAKER_02It must not be over the age of thirty, so write yourself out of it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely. So they have tons of energy and they're still although the tour will be over before they know it, and they're two-thirds of the way through at the time of recording this, before they know it, they'll be down to their last ten and then five, and then three, and then one, and then that's it, gone forever.
SPEAKER_03Yes, and then back to waiting tables, as actors uh want to do. Well, that is uh that's not for me to say, but but sure.
SPEAKER_02Um Yes, I I I went to Amongst Tale in Eastbourne on the 2nd of November. I found it joyous. I thought I thought it was just yes, joyous was the word that just yeah.
SPEAKER_00Happiness. Just yeah. Well, that's very kind of you to say. The thing that um the thing that I think that people like about it, because it's you know, it's a decent show, I'm really proud of it, but I think that people really respond to the fact that it's so rare for them to hear their faith represented on stage in a way that is uh fresh and contemporary, but also speaking their their language, the biblical truths, and all those sorts of things. So I think people really respond to that because it's a rare thing. I think that I've realized that also people, the previous production called The God Particle, people felt similarly, and I think it's because now our mainstream culture has drifted into secularism so much, and um you're just not gonna see anything like that on um on mainstream media at all, yeah, um, or even uh non-mainstream media, to be honest. So I think people really respond to that. Um, and that's something that I've thought that maybe I should probably do a bit more in that space.
SPEAKER_02It's almost like maybe at camp is like the only other time when you're sort of 15 years old, yeah and you get to do some sketches about the Christian subculture and you get to laugh at yourself a little bit.
SPEAKER_00But yeah, that's right, yeah. And that and so yeah, and it's a really nice thing, and then you sort of grow out of it, and then you sort of realise, oh well, the world's not like that, and um, you know, take your medicine. But actually uh the world could be like that. Right. And the fact that no and now it's now never been easier, as it were, to go straight to people. Um I mean that's one thing I for some somehow I've ended up on the general synod of the Church of England.
SPEAKER_03And being straight to the people.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Uh but I did say to them, and I don't think they really quite understood this when we had this sort of there was a fringe session about uh about the media and the the stuff that the Church of England are able to put out. I did say to them, well, you know, you could basically become a broadcaster.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_00Because up until now it feels like you've been waiting for the BBC to give you permission to do stuff.
SPEAKER_03Yes.
SPEAKER_00And the BBC have and have had for a long time a total tin ear for religion. Yeah. They really don't understand it. And not only do they not understand it, they don't want to understand it. They really they don't care. They don't think that anyone really cares about this stuff. They want to win awards for natural history and for comedy and for drama, they don't want to win awards for religious broadcasting. And I, you know, that's that's fair enough, that's just the way things are, and I I'm not particularly surprised by that. So um, so all things considered, they're just not gonna give Christians what they want. Right. And and if I want to hear Christianity, I'll I'll listen to a podcast, I'll listen to John Piper, or I'll listen to you know Doug Wilson, or I'll listen to just someone who's actually rather than an a s a sermon that is acceptable to the BBC. I mean what sort of sermon's that gonna be? Yeah, exactly. Um so I think now this is potentially a renaissance for uh for Christians to be able to do stuff. And just talking to you um earlier today, you know, you were telling me about various podcasts um that I was unaware of. And um and there's just a ton of stuff out there, so I think there's potential for for more of that because it's really important that we as Christians remind each other of our culture and tell each other our story because I think it's only gonna get harder.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, and to remind viewers if they don't know already about Cooper and Carey have words, uh the lights have just gone down in this room. I don't know.
SPEAKER_00Maybe we're we weren't moving enough to keep them on there's a Babylon B joke about that, isn't there? About um there's some kind of the automatic lights go off during a Presbyterian service because nobody's moving.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_00Um I think Yeah, yeah, yeah. They're equal opportunity offenders, the Babylon B. I'd like to take big swipes at everybody. I'd like to just come back on again. Oh, this is all wasted on the on a podcast.
SPEAKER_03Uh well, but but the the listener can imagine. The listener can imagine. Uh and I was gonna mention Cooper and Carrie have words. Oh yeah. You're on episode three or four at the moment.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, we are slowly we've committed to doing going weekly, I don't quite know what we were thinking, but myself and Barry Cooper, who I've known for a very long time actually. Um we ended up deciding to do a podcast in me in the UK and he in Florida, yeah, where he now lives with his new wife. Um, and um so that's all very exciting. So we're sort of just trying to knock things around from a reformed perspective with a few jokes and and trying to keep it light, but also you know, plenty of content as well. That's the idea. And so, yeah, we can go straight to so it's just trying to create the kind of show that I would like to listen to. Yes, that's all and that's all you can do, really.
SPEAKER_02Right. And this is I mean, I was I was teaching um a seminar at the uh Premier Digital Awards uh conference and ceremony on Saturday, and basically saying, Yeah, why why do we as Christians we almost from from the outset we think okay, we're a fringe thing and we're away in the shadows, and we'll just do our little bits and pieces on a you know on a shoestring um and we'll be naff, and that's okay. And but there's just who are the people who are out there who are thinking, well, let's let's actually tell our own story because for 2,000 years of Christendom, uh Christianity has shaped. This culture by telling our own story and telling it as boldly and brightly and beautifully as we possibly can. And I guess that's kind of what we're trying to do here with Meet That It's Hivity. Um, you know, we're we're in a this mansion and we're filming with a professional film um uh production company trying to kind of tell the old, old story, but why does it have to be on a shoestring?
SPEAKER_00Why can't we tell our stories with with a bit of I don't know, a bit of production value and a bit of Yeah, and actually quite often it doesn't cost that much more to make it look good. And just going back to what you were saying though, I think it's interesting how we we are gonna need to shake off the mindset that we have a subculture.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_00The church the church is the culture because Jesus is Lord. Right. The the culture may not uh the the Christian culture may not realize it's the culture, but it is. Yeah, and the all-powerful secular media may think it's the culture, which humanly speaking it is, it isn't.
SPEAKER_03No.
SPEAKER_00Jesus is Lord.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So I think we need to have a little bit more confidence uh in the gospel. Um I think we need to tell each other the story in interesting and innovative ways, you know, in the way that Tolkien used to, and the way that Lewis used to. Um one wonders where are the next Tolkien and Lewis coming from. I know you can argue that J.K. Rowling is doing that and some have, and yeah, I'm not sure I'm convinced, but it's a good story and all that kind of stuff. But um ultimately, you know, we we need to sort of rediscover, I think, the culture rather than seeing it as a means to an end. I think we sometimes think that we need to co-opt culture in order to do evangelism. Right. Which I think is fine. Yeah, but that that's not the reason to do it. We need to I mean they some people talk about gospeling each other and all that kind of stuff, but I think the way we do that is also through through culture and through um yeah, through plays and podcasts and uh TV and all these ways of building each other up.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. What I said in the conference on Saturday, I mean so often my conference my my seminar was on how to make evangelistic videos, and I said, you know, the what you don't want to do is to begin with fidget spinners, they're a thing.
SPEAKER_02Okay, now how do I, you know, how do I bridge from fidget spin? Oh, it's threefold. Maybe it's the Trinity. Let's do a you know it's not to build that bridge from the culture as though the culture is this given.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And the Christian thing needs to be crowbared in.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02It's like, you know, I I keep mentioning this this tweet that I read just a few weeks ago. Um someone went through the National Gallery and they said, I can boil down the history of Western art in you know 140 characters. It's a thousand years of crucifixions and then stripes, you know, and that and that's it. And and I think uh as reductionist as that is, there's a lot of truth to that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02That actually when Christians were just telling their own story, we absolutely shaped the culture. Yeah, and when we lost confidence to tell our story, all you're left with is stripes.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I wonder if that is in our Reformation year to some extent a uh possibly a legacy of the Reformation, where we have, you know, because since the Reformation, uh since the 17th century, evangelicals have not produced an awful lot of great art. Um, and that's one thing the medieval church did pretty well.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um, and thought it worthwhile spending you know a year's salary on altar pieces and all those sorts of things, and ultimately they prove to lead uh people astray over a very, very long period of time. Yeah. And I don't think that's you know, we're not gonna fall off the horse on that side anytime soon. No. So I just wonder whether this is something that we need to think that we need to spend a little bit of money uh doing this kind of thing, and we should not only, you know, we're not just talking in terms of as producers ourselves asking people to give us five and four or five figure sums to make stuff happen, but us as individuals and consumers need to expect to spend money.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_00Um so it wouldn't occur to you to get Netflix for free. Netflix costs money and the BBC costs money.
SPEAKER_03Yes.
SPEAKER_00So why would expect Christian culture to be free would seem But people do. But people do. And um so I think uh there's a lot of work to be done on that, but um in a way I think maybe the secular culture will become so secular and so difficult uh for um spirit-filled Christians that it may just be something that we have to kind of properly uh uh sort of not withdraw from but realize wow this is this is pretty serious and we're gonna have to do our own thing.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um but but who knows, we may already have been ostracized by society by that point and go off and set up chocolate factories uh like the Quakers did. Yeah, yeah. So, you know, who knows? It's it's very exciting. It is exciting.
SPEAKER_02I was I was talking to some Russian church planters uh last week, and uh they were saying, well, you know, Russia is sort of 70 years ahead of you guys, you know, in the in Western Europe. Um because we are we are post-post-Christian. Wow and the people are genuinely interested in hearing the gospel again. You know, when when it was just part of the culture it was sneered at, when that was post-uh, you know, Christendom, then it was just you know not on anyone's radar. But he said, you know, they're moving in Moscow into a into a time when people are again really interested to hear the gospel for the first time.
SPEAKER_03So, you know, press on, maybe.
SPEAKER_00Well, yeah, so I it it's we do we are often uh it strikes me that quite often we look at the world around us and we just think this is how it is, it always has been and always will be, yeah, and we very quickly forget. And actually it's culture that reminds you of how thing just just going back to watch watch a comedy from the 90s and it'll make you wince at times on stuff where you just think, wow, that's that seems pretty inappropriate now. Um and there's other stuff which um you know and there's stuff now which wouldn't have been um you know, just the whole transgender issue now is a is a hot potato, whereas um up until recently a man in a dress was meant to be funny.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um and now it's presumably some kind of some kind of appropriation or intersectionality or something. I don't quite know.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um maybe Mrs. Brown's boys will become the victim of that. Uh I don't think he's gonna listen to social justice warriors anytime soon. No, he's gonna do his thing and he's gonna get millions of viewers. Yes, that's right. Absolutely. And millions of pounds. Um so uh yeah, good for him. Yeah or her. Sorry. Good for no, I've I've not done my uh pronoun reading recently. I don't know which which one's. Before it's compelled, you need to brush on the. Yes, exactly. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02So uh so what's what's uh on your hat going forward, James, in in terms of producing Christian culture-making stuff.
SPEAKER_00Thank you. Um given the um given the the st the the way in which Mugstale's gone down, I I think I feel like that's uh well earlier this year I was thinking, oh man, I shouldn't have gone into this, this is too much work and um I don't that I don't see the point of it. But actually the way in which people have responded to it, the way in which there seems to be a need for this kind of thing, the more I've been encouraged to to think more about what else I could do in that space. And what that could also lead to in terms of creating other forms of um media that is sort of suitable uh and encouraging for Christians to listen to, not just new stuff, but also stuff from our our recent past, especially our our our our public domain recent past um that could be um refreshed and brought back uh back to now. And you know, reading and thinking about the people that that Tolkien and Lewis used to think about and read and what the stuff that inspired them, I think there may be some stuff there to look at too. So so that's kind of I'm kind of thinking about that, maybe stuff that I could do myself as a as a like a one-man show kind of thing. But also, you know, I'm writing a new series of Milton Jones's Radio 4 show, and I guess there'll be more of that kind of thing too, which I I'm keen to keep doing that um and look for opportunities there, but also I'm you know thinking well maybe there are other things that I could do.
SPEAKER_03So that's the idea. Going, keep going. Thank you very much. Telling the old old story. Yeah. And uh if people have not already subscribed to Cooper and Carrie Have Words, then uh that's what they should search for. Yeah, search for that and you'll find that.
SPEAKER_00iTunes Stitcher and SoundCloud, I think. Yeah, right. I think we're gonna do SoundCloud as well. Yeah, fantastic, fantastic. But uh I've given it a five-star review. Bless you. Thank you very much. You know that they really do help those reviews. They do, they absolutely do. They really do. As a podcaster yourself.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Thanks for having me on your podcast.
SPEAKER_03Pleasure anytime.
SPEAKER_02Thanks for joining us on the Evangelist Podcast. Do subscribe to the podcast. Do like us on Facebook, Speak Life UK, subscribe to our YouTube channel, Speak Life UK, there, and we'll see you next week. Bye-bye. Bye.