Welcome to the live cast. My name is Glenn Scrivener and joining me as ever over in Crowborough, it's Paul Feasy. How are you doing, Paul?
SPEAKER_01Hello. Oh, yes, very good. Thank you. Doing well here. Lovely day. So feeling quite chipper.
SPEAKER_02Lovely day. We're recording actually on my birthday. My birthday. Yes. I am I am a meaningful 42 years old today and uh living in denial of that fact right now. Um we are joined today by Ed Drew of Faith in Kids, and we're going to be talking together about the place of children and children's ministry in the life of the church. Ed Drew, thank you so much for joining us. Uh tell us where you are and uh what lockdown has been like for you so far.
SPEAKER_00Uh I am in Southwest London. The sun is shining. Uh I am married to Mary. Uh we both have jobs. So I would say that has made lockdown very difficult. But we have three children aged between five and twelve. And I'd say they have I uh I think they'll remember lockdown as being a positive time of their life. Uh I keep saying that to parents because most parents are struggling to believe anything positive can come out of lockdown. Uh it's difficult, I think, lockdown. But I think for our children, it's our children, it's going quite well.
SPEAKER_02Why? What's what's been what's been so good about lockdown? Or what how has how has Jesus redeemed the the difficulty of lockdown for you?
SPEAKER_00I think uh firstly, we have been in our Bible as a family more than normal. Uh partly that's because I'm doing a daily family Bible time on YouTube and Facebook each morning. So my children have to get the one that's I'm doing in a week, so that when their faces go blank and say, and they say out loud, Dad, that is the worst question ever, I go, right, mental note, change that question. So partly I think we're in the Bible mall. Partly we we have uh once your children are at school, you generally only see them when they're tired and frustrated. So I think in lockdown means we're getting better time with our children without trying. A conversation where we want to actually tackle a subject might happen without tears, anger, and doors being slammed. Although there is a lot more shouting and tears in my household, by me included. So it's it's a whole it look it there is something for everyone in lockdown.
SPEAKER_01So, Ed, we can see your um your kind of branding behind you, faith in kids. Um a lot better than this background here. So what is faith in kids? Tell us a bit about it.
SPEAKER_00Faith in kids is supporting churches and parents in raising children to trust in Christ eternally. So we want to be helping where churches and parents meet. So uh we believe what the Bible I think believes is that when you teach children about Jesus Christ and they turn to him, that is the best life can ever be. So if we want children to truly flourish, arguably, if you want our nation to truly flourish, let's get telling our children about Jesus. I think the reason why we exist is that perhaps this is something that families and churches are finding quite difficult in our nation at the moment. I don't think it's it's coming easy for us to work out how as churches and families to show our children Jesus Christ. So, like all parachurch organizations, when that day comes that churches and families are saying, raising kids to know the Lord is the joy and priority of our lives. We'll shut up shop. I'll go back to making washing powder as an engineer, and it'll be a great day.
SPEAKER_01And so so how how kind of big is faith in kids? How many how many people are kind of in on this?
SPEAKER_00Uh the obvious answer to your question is absolutely tiny. Um we are about six, seven, eight people, depending on how you count volunteers and part-timers and people we pay by the hour. Uh we've been going three years. Uh, I think I can tell you a trade secret that it took us two and a half years to get to about 1,200 Facebook likes, and we doubled that during lockdown. Wow. So I want to be careful of saying, you know, lockdown has been good to us because no one wants to hear that. But I think it is true that when you sort of separate the gathered church and families, uh faith in kids sort of exists for a day like today. We, you know, that we are trying to bridge that gap that exists anyway. And in lockdown, that gap is more extreme than normal. So uh we have tried to very quickly work out how can we serve churches and parents when they're not meeting together.
SPEAKER_01And I was gonna I was gonna ask you um if you'd always done kids work, but you kind of mentioned a second ago about the engineer in you. Um I mean, so tell us a bit about I mean what you did before, but how long have you been doing what you're doing? Like kids' work. I said, you know, you've been doing this for three years, but have you always been doing kids' work before that for a long time?
SPEAKER_00Or yeah, I I used to be an engineer, and I think in God's rich plans, the best I can work out is that engineering did teach me to find the simple. So I naturally crave the simple. So um uh and I had some history of doing a bit of drama, so I think I understand a bit of storytelling. Uh, but when I started working for a church, I had never met a child except for my three nieces. Uh so I didn't come from a teaching background or even a children background. Uh, but I did discover I enjoyed working with children. Uh I was at a church, DunDonald Church in Southwest London. When I left, there were 200 under-elevens through the building each Sunday, and my role was to try and work out how to help those families make it the best it could be. So I I grew in my passion. I think it's partly just the story of doing ministry. The Lord gives you a love for those people you minister to, and in my case it was families, and I grew to love families. So three years ago, I thought I I wonder if we can help more families, or I wonder if we could help those churches who haven't quite worked it out.
SPEAKER_02So, what is what is good about children and families ministry? Why why has that become your passion?
SPEAKER_00Uh, I mean, there's a there is uh an answer, just which is simply all parents and all children are created in God's image, they are all eternal, so every child is an eternal being. Uh so we should be about the business of telling every human of Jesus Christ and asking them to repent and believe in him. So there is an answer, which is just simply children are one subcategory we should do ministry with, as students, the elderly, or any other group you could think of. So that's one answer. I think another answer is the Bible's consistent story is that God's people should start with their own children. Uh, and in books like Judges, we find out what happens when you don't start with your own children. We find out that a generation died out who neither knew the Lord or worshipped him, and the children grew up without a knowledge of God. And the Bible says that to for children, a generation of children to grow up without a knowledge of God is a crisis. I mean, that is that that should sadden us all. And it is arguable that we are we are in a nation in history, in geography at the moment, where a generation is growing up without a knowledge of the Lord. So that should grieve us. Uh, and we don't all have to be about it. But it's what I've decided to be about. So there's a theological reason. I think uh Proverbs 22, 6 says, start off a child in the way they should go, and when they're older, they won't depart from it. So the Bible got on to what child developmental people now tell us, which is you build your framework, your worldview, your understanding from when you're born. Uh and so a one-year-old, a two-year-old, there is no age at which they are learning language more. There is no age at which they are learning more. So uh, and we're told that by nine, a child's moral framework is built. They know right from wrong, they know when to lie, they know when to tell the truth, they know who to trust, who not to trust. That happens by nine. By 13, uh a child's spiritual framework is built. So by 13, broadly, they have decided: is there an invisible world? Is God real? Do angels exist? Is the devil dangerous? Is God good? Do I hate God? Do I trust God? Now, speak life is broadly in the business of saying to adults, please, can you try and, you know, with the Spirit's help, let's deconstruct your worldview, the assumptions you make, and let's build it from the ground up with Jesus Christ at the center. And faith in kids is saying, the Bible is saying, let's start with children, and the job is much, much easier. Uh, because you get to start with Christ at the center. Not all children raised in Christian homes are Christians, but we can make it so at least they understand the Christian framework and worldview, which must be a good thing by common grace.
SPEAKER_02That's a very good thing. Can I ask you about that Proverbs 26 verse? Because it's it's one of those verses that can hang around people's necks like a millstone. Um, you know, raise a child in the way they should go, and when they're old, they will not forget it. And so many good and godly parents who have done great work with their children, discipling them in the way of Jesus, and their grown-up children are not walking with the Lord, and they kind of they return to that verse in Proverbs 26, and they either think, Well, God wasn't faithful to that promise as I understood it, or I wasn't faithful as a parent. What would you what would you say to such a parent?
SPEAKER_00Okay. Uh the first thing I'd say is it's a proverb, and proverbs in any culture aren't the same as promises. So when you say the proverb, many hands make light work, it is broadly true that three chefs make a quicker meal than one. But if those chefs are seven-year-olds and you put 20 of them in a kitchen, you won't get a meal out quicker. So it's it's not it's not a promise, it's a proverb. So all things being equal, the spirits work, a child has more likelihood of coming out as a Christian than someone who isn't. Uh, that's the first thing to say is let's just read Proverbs, how they're meant to be read, which is in God's world, using God's wisdom, this is a good way to live. It is better to raise your child to know us than not to know Christ. The second thing is, is God is sovereign over our children as He is sovereign over us. So God is gracious with us as He is gracious with children, and we pray for Him to lead us closer to Christ as we should pray that He'd lead our children closer to Christ. So, as a church family, let's pray for all families. Let's not blame the parents whose children aren't Christians, and let's not ask those parents whose children are Christians to do all our parenting seminars. Uh, godly parents will be able to give us a great seminar, uh, whether their children are walking with the Lord or not. Uh, so uh that African proverb, it takes a village to raise a child, it does take a church to raise a child. So let's be supporting parents, praying with them, mourning with them, and celebrating with them.
SPEAKER_01How can we do that kind of stuff then, Ed? You know, you're saying talking takes a church to raise a child and things. How can we as churches kind of prioritize children and when the rubber hits the road, so to speak?
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um, they did a piece of research in America quite a while ago now, I think 15 years ago, called Sticky Faith, where they tried to understand what makes the difference that where faith sticks. And one conclusion that I find memorable is we think of children and adult ratios as like one to six, one to eight. And this report said think of them the opposite way. So instead of one adult to six children, try to think of it as six adults to one child, which is just as the same way with adults. You would surround, you want we want to surround every adult in our church with a support network, and we want to be surrounded by a support network. So let us do the same with children, which is, and you know, in good churches, this is, I think, one of the very greatest encouragements is a child knows who their grandparents in the Lord are, a child knows who their uncles and aunts are, a child even knows who their little brothers and sisters are. We did a podcast with a woman who said she's a single mum, two teenage kids. She says when she's angry, she goes into church and says to her kids, talk to someone. That image of, I don't care who you talk to, but these are my brothers and sisters. You can pick any of them and you'll get godly love from any of them. I did that is an image I think to walk into with church as a parent, not the English image of whispering in their ear, let's act normal. Remember, be well behaved. Otherwise, it reflects badly on me. The image of the of a healthy church is children, go chaotic with these brothers and sisters in the Lord. Pick a little brother, pick a big brother, pick an uncle, pick a grandparent. And realistically, because we're English, we have to do the opposite, which is we walk up to someone elderly and say, Would you be my parents' grandfather? Walk up to perhaps a single lady and say, Would you be my parents, my children's aunt? Can I invite, can I commit to invite you into my family once a month for lunch? You know, and and can I leave the room and leave you to say, Are your parents annoying you right now? Should we talk about, you know, that that I think that is an image. When you see a church doing that, your heart sings.
SPEAKER_01I remember being um come on. I was just gonna say, one of the things I I love about having our kids in church is it is at the end of church, you know, after after the service, and they I I honestly don't know where my children go. They just disappear off with other children and they're playing. And sometimes people say, Where are the kids? and I'm like, Oh, sure, they're fine somewhere, you know. And it's not because I don't care, but I just know that they're amongst people, you know, who who you know, they know adults, they know other children, they're absolutely fine and they're happy.
SPEAKER_02It's very Christ-like, Paul. You know, they they they left Jesus back in Jerusalem when they were walking back to Nazareth. It's it's like I I often think about that story. Like it took them a day, didn't it? Mary and Joseph, it took them a day before they realized, hang on, where's Jesus? Because the assumption was, oh, he's probably with the rest of the faith community somewhere. You know, so clear, clearly, I mean, and I don't think you know that story is in the scriptures in order to rebuke Mary and Joseph. I think it's just it's just an assumption. Well, of course, you you trust Jesus to be safe in the faith community.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And I I think probably by the if you're a parent of teenagers, this probably resonates more. And I think in my experience, parents of teenagers really have worked out that they need the church. Parenting is difficult with teenagers. But we we do want to say to those with babes in arms, you know, hand them, hand them around. Start that work early. Uh, work out who who who you're adopting into your family. They are they are actually brothers and sisters. You know, that's the biblical model. It's not it's not just nice friends. I and I I'm sure being English is a problem in this. You know, we our our home is our fortress, our children are our fortress. The shouting and the bad behavior happens behind closed doors. Let it all out.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Let everyone in. I can tell you, I think I agree with the whole, you know, when you're a teenager, particularly I can remember becoming always been to church, but really it was only kind of mid-teens, 14 or 15 or so that kind of really got switched on to church and plugged in. Um, but so much of it was around the the the groups, the people there, and we particularly where I was at church, there were students, so they're about you know maybe six or seven years older. But everyone kind of mixed together, and and you know, I remember feeling like you know, as a 14, 15-year-old boy, like, wow, like here I am hanging around with uh these guys who are like 20 and stuff, and and they and they love Jesus and and they seem to know what they're talking about. And um, I mean clearly none of us did because we were all so young, but like but having that that these people who are like family, like you know, I would have had conversations with those guys that I would never have sat down and had with my parents, you know, because I I just look to them for you know as kind of spiritual peers. And yeah, I mean it's just such an important thing for me.
SPEAKER_02So and I it it's kind of like you know, in basketball, there's two ways of having a defense. You can have a man-to-man marking or you can have zone defense. Man-to-man marking is you're always on the same guy. Zone defense is if anyone comes into your territory, you know, they're on they're on you. And I I in in churches that I think are healthy, you see zone defense. And you you just see, you know, if a kid comes into their sphere and they're having a fight, then you know those parents can kind of can kind of deal with it and you and you you share the load. And and and you know, the the 20-something English students um ends up disciplining the the five-year-old over there um because we're we are one big extended family, and we can we can have a zone defense.
SPEAKER_00And I um let's just keep going with that analogy for a minute. All I'd want to say to that is that the danger with that is you only rebuke discipline and get angry on a zonal system. You don't encourage comfort, cry with, laugh with on a zonal system. So a child is very clear who which adults should they behave better around? There's a reason why children behave better in school than at home. Children are very attuned to where can I behave, where can I have a polite conversation. I think a challenge with Christian discipling rather than just better behavior is where will our children let down their guard? Where will our children admit where they have doubts? Where will our children say, I don't actually, I don't believe Jesus rose from the dead? So for that to happen, you need man-to-man marking normally. Unless that child is, I don't know what you'd say, strangely confident, and they they say to the vicar, can I book a one-to-one with you? I've got some doubts about the Christian faith. Most kids need to feel very secure, have great relationships, to sit down and say, or be actually asked, assumed by someone who loves them. I'm gonna make the assumption you're not really convinced by Christianity. Can you tell me what you're struggling with?
SPEAKER_02Do you think, therefore, that we are um overly segregated in our in our churches? You know, right now we are thinking quite rightly about racial reconciliation and our tribes, nations, peoples, and tongues communing together? Do we have that kind of unity across those sorts of uh divides? Um, but there are age divides as well, and we've inherited this pattern of church in which the kids go out to Sunday school and the adults get separate teaching. Um, is is that a kind of segregation that needs to be overcome as well?
SPEAKER_00I I think the answer is yes. I'm clearly very nervous of comparing it to some some current huge issues. No, sure.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00But the the the Bible picture broadly is that we are all reticent, suspicious of anyone who isn't exactly like us. And and and the Bible picture of God's people is varied in every imaginable possible way, and perhaps we take more care of the most vulnerable, the weakest, the most likely to stray. So I think you could say, as adults, we are probably tempted to want to get difficult people out of the room. And in this conversation, that's probably children and teenagers. And we are probably less likely to put in the time when they they do require more effort than someone just like us. It is harder to teach a child of five about Jesus than it is to have a chat about Jesus with someone your own age and the same gender. So the the early church was thoroughly mixed beautifully in every way, and that's how discipleship happens, and that's the story of bigger brothers and bigger, bigger sisters and little brothers and little sisters uh that we see in 1 Timothy 5. So I I would say there is a problem perhaps that we have misunderstood what Sunday school is or youth group. Sunday school and youth group can be helpful for a period of our week where they get a peer group and they talk about issues that most concern that age group. But normally it's not the age where children or young people will learn to, sorry, it's not the place where they will learn to serve, where they will learn to worship, where they will learn to pray, where they will learn to care for the needy, where they, you know, that that normal business of discipleship that is all of life, you know, the way God has brilliantly designed it is that's what parents are for. How how would you raise a divine image bearer? Well, apparently you put them in a house with one or two. Forgiven sinners, and so learn how to do it from them. So, and then you and then those parents say, There's no way I can do this. So you say, quick, you should join a church. No one can do parenting without a church. So let's let's put them in a church, and then you have something wonderful that goes on, which every parent that I've met is feeling guilty, tired, and confused. I've never met the parent who says, I'm smashing it for the Lord, let me write that book. So I am convinced that when a neighbor has a child, say you should really join a church, you're totally stuffed without it. I, you know, it is the place to go to get questions answered and love and care. The alternative is you join your prenatal class, you go with one problem, you come back with eight, and you're way more worried. You go to church, you go with one problem, you come back with none, and they come and visit you and bake you cakes that that week.
SPEAKER_02Totally. Totally. It's a huge part. It's a huge part of my evangelism. It's, you know, um, that's what I love about my church. And when I say that's what I love about my church, I talk about having a peer group of other parents and learning the wisdom of so many other people. And we just don't have those peer groups anymore, especially as people are raising families far away from grandparents and all that sort of stuff. Having an extended family is just a huge blessing of church life. It's a it's a big part of my evangelism. Come to my church if you're a parent, because yeah, we're we're struggling with this together. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And I think we take that for granted, don't we? That we we forget because it's so obvious to us in some ways, we're so used to going to church on a Sunday and mixing with lots of different people with, you know, maybe different backgrounds and you know different lives to ourselves. I I know I certainly take it for granted that when particularly when I worked in the church and then I left the church in from a work point of view, um, you you realize how lots of people outside outside the church don't have anything like it at all. Um, and I'd almost forgotten, I was almost oblivious to that. You know, you you kind of take what you do as the norm, but um it is very, very different. So Ed, you were talking about um you know, youth groups, children's groups have their their place. Yeah. Um and so the inevitable question really is if we are to mix together, yeah uh how do we do that? Because I know so many churches have struggled with the kind of the classic all-age service type thing, and and you know, lots of people turn up at a a service where kids are there in the whole time and they say, Oh, I don't really feel like it was aimed at me, it was all due childish. And you know, I'm sure we've all heard similar things or degrees of that. How on earth do we do it? Any thoughts? Help us ever.
SPEAKER_00Here are some givens. And if you take the givens, some things fall out for the argument behind closed doors. The givens are uh when a family walks in with a one or two-year-old, or actually more likely a three or four-year-old, that that there probably needs to be somewhere for that family to go out of the service. It would be brilliant if from zero, one, two, three, and four they got to see dad singing and mum praying, and them opening a Bible together and talking about it afterwards with their best mates. That it would be great if they saw that from the beginning because that they are processing all the time. Where do mum and dad go when they're confused? Who do they talk to when they're in tears? Who do they when do they sing? Does dad sing loud with the football or in church? You know, all of that is happening from the beginning. It's also a given that at some point in the late teenage years, our our teenagers have to drop out and do church on their own with everyone else. So, you know, those are our two sort of fixed points, which is crush and what are we equipping our 18-year-olds to join a church and love it? So uh Tom is a is a friend of mine. He's he's now 19, second year uni. I remember being in his his parents' house the first Sunday of university. His mum said to me, I'm desperate to phone Tom, tell him to walk out the door, turn right, walk around. That's the nearest good church. Walk in there, sit down, enjoy it. She said, but he's 18. I left post-it notes all over his desk when I dropped him off. He's four hours away. You know, that that at some point there'll be a Sunday when your child has to walk out his door, her door, walk into church, think there is not one person I know in this room, but my love of Jesus compels me to sit down and get started. I mean, you so in fact, data says if you ask a bunch of 18-year-olds, will you be going to church next year when you leave home? nine out of 10 say, Yes, I will. If you follow the same group, only one out of ten is in church. In other words, they think they'll go to church next year until they arrive at a church where no one knows them and they go, I thought I like church, but actually I've discovered I like the people who sat next to me on the sofa. They're the reason I come. So now that data I'm sure is old and wrong and whatever, but the principle we can relate to, which is none of us really want to walk into a church where we know no one. But if you love Christ, you'll do much, much harder things for him. And you may even say, This is good for me, this is gonna grow me. Wouldn't we? Well, don't we want to send our teenagers out saying it's gonna be hard, grow for Christ?
SPEAKER_02Right. We so do want that, and every parent is now hearing you say that, and they're petrified, looking at their own children, thinking, okay, when I drop so-and-so off when they leave home. Um yeah, one only one out of ten, goodness me.
SPEAKER_00Um let me just sorry, you've just stumbled. Let me just say I I have heard from church leaders that right now a particular group they're concerned for are the 14 to 18s, who, if you like, have prematurely discovered they don't want to go to church. When they're offered church online, their parents are thinking, oh, they really don't. So there is a if you are listening to this and your teenager is refusing to sit in online church, and this is news, as you know, and I kind of want to say that's not that's you've not you've not stuffed up. You've been going to a church where they have enjoyed going up until this point. You it it is helpful, it could be the Lord's blessing. You have discovered this before you find out when they're on the other side of the country or the other side of the world. It's it's not too late in lockdown to sit down and say, tell me your doubts, tell me what you think of church, tell me what you think of Christ, and do more listening than talking. And and and lockdown could be a time to hear the reasons rather than when they're 35 and the conversation is warmed up again.
SPEAKER_02So tell me, Drew, what does it look like in the Drew household in terms of um do you do you have kind of family devotions? Do you do you have a kind of a what's what's the daily walk with Jesus as a family?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, um, I mean the first thing I want to say is I think most parents believe there is a family out there where the children arrive at the breakfast table wearing a shirt and tie and say, Daddy, please impart godly wisdom to me. I am waiting. You know that so that isn't my family. My wife took a photo of me doing a family Bible time where my five-year-old is clamped under one arm, my other hand is holding the Bible, my two kids are hanging over the side of the sofa with their feet pointing to me. So she took that picture to say, whenever you claim you know what you're doing, show this photo to parents. Uh so the first thing to say is um our time in the we try and we're trying to have a time in the Bible each day. At the moment, I'm doing daily family Bible times on YouTube and Facebook. So I practice them with my children first. So actually, there's a greater incentive in lockdown than any other time in my life. So we we manage five a week because of my job. Uh when we do it, I think our biggest arguments in the day happen in the one minute before. And I have actually concluded that's the devil. He he wants our family to be at our least functioning, our most argumentative, our most shouty for family Bible time. That is the time he wants to rip apart. And so it's normally difficult, but I I do think I want to say to parents, getting your children sat down for church is going to be really difficult. We believe it's a spiritual battle to engage our children in Christ as it is to engage our hearts in Christ. So I I hope this isn't shocking, but I have taken to saying to my 12-year-old daughter, this is the devil. He wants you to shout at your brother. And she kind of looks at me terrified. But look, we studied Revelation as a church last year. So I think for the first time in my life, I'm sort of thinking this is a fight.
SPEAKER_02Oh, we've got our we've we've got our clip for Facebook now.
SPEAKER_00Uh so you know, during when we're on sofas during church online, I'm I've now discovered I it's like a running commentary. The whole time we stand for singing. Children, we are now praying. Uh that that listen to that bit. That the vicar's doing that, you know. When when we think the preacher is doing that moment preachers do, like this is the big idea. You rewind it 10 seconds, you go again. Do you get the point? You know, it's it's I'm I've got to be a sports commentator for church. Because normally, when my kids are next to me, I'm just saying, don't don't make me look like the worst dad in the church. Actually, lockdown is the one chance to be actively training our kids to be. I I know you don't want to stand to sing. We because we're talking to God. Let's sing to him. And and I can do the thing I don't normally dare do in church, which is talk constantly, which I'm broadly doing now, and everyone's thinking having you as a dad must be awful. Get behind me, Satan.
SPEAKER_01Um Ed, for um those of us who are kind of parenting, um what kind of things do faith in kids do? Are there things we can plug into? Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I I do first of all want to say um parents don't need faith in kids. Uh if parents are trusting in Christ and they have a good church, that's it. You you know, you you love your children, you love Jesus, that is enough. So, first of all, don't let anyone tell you that, including me, that there is some new secret system of parenting children so they know Christ. Pray for your children more than anyone else. Uh speak to them occasionally about Jesus when you can, take them to a great church, and that that's that's great. Um, I I'd say for under fives, buy too many CDs of Christian music, play them until your ears bleed in the car and in the kitchen, pray before meals, read the Bible before bed. You know, do do the thing, do the thing. Um, we're doing daily family Bible times, I said, on Facebook and YouTube. We've got some sort of Sunday school resources at home, we've got some podcasts for parents and for families. So we you know, we're trying to fill the gaps, we're trying to help the conversation to happen. We're trying to say to parents, just keep keep doing it. If you are loving Christ with your whole heart to the best of your ability, the kids are gonna hear it, see it. So, you know, if you have a spouse, love them. Wouldn't it be great if your kids saw what loving relationship is? But just parents do it. You're doing it, you're doing it, you're doing it. If you hear that from Faith in Kids, that'd be brilliant.
SPEAKER_02That's awesome.
SPEAKER_00So, how can people catch up with the stuff at uh at Faith and Kids? We have Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, and a website, faith inkids.org. Go to one of them, have the time of your life, and drop us an email about what you hate because only our friends tell us what's awful.
SPEAKER_02You don't want to invite the haters, honestly. Honestly, Ed speaks yeah, I'm speaking from from personal knowledge.
SPEAKER_00Glenn, I I think you do a m every now and then I look at the comments in YouTube and I genuinely think to myself, we don't get them. No one no one gets that angry about children. Uh so Glenn, it's not personal. Keep doing it.
SPEAKER_02It's yeah, yeah, it's me. It's it's me. I I attract the haters, but you know, whatever. Sneerers gonna sneer. Um so yes, people do uh do check out Faith in Kids. The podcasts are fantastic, and the the daily Bible times on Facebook are really, really helpful. Are you are you planning on keeping on doing them during lockdown? Or is there is there an end date to this?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there is. Uh I think we're in the middle of week nine, and we are going through Mark's Gospel, and we're going to get to Mark's Gospel at the end of week 11. And then we have a brilliant master plan to start a summer program to take us through to September. So uh we have a plan to walk with parents until the beginning of September, and then we'll work out how to walk with parents through October. Uh so uh again, we we look, we we'll we'll keep offering something, but we also want to say to churches, you can do this. Kids want to see the people they know, those big brothers and sisters, those grandparents. So please don't think that you need you know you need Ed. Get involved with one another.
SPEAKER_02Sure, sure. That's awesome. And we'll put uh links in the show notes in the description box about how you can catch up with Faith in Kids on the website and on the Facebook uh page. But uh Ed Drew, thank you so much for joining us, and we'd love to have you back again sometime. It's been a pleasure, thank you. In great