The Return of Public Hearing: “We’re a real a** City,” with Julie Bowditch

This episode aired on 10/23/24 on WICN 90.5FM

Hey Worcester! Public Hearing is back, and I’m excited to dive back into conversations that matter to our city. I’m your host, Joshua Croke, a queer and nonbinary designer, artist, and community advocate with a deep care for driving positive, equity-centered change. In this first return episode, I’m joined by my friend and community powerhouse, Julie Bowditch, Executive Director of the CASA Project Worcester County, as we talk about what’s been happening in Worcester and how we can all get involved—whether you’re just starting to pay attention or you’re already deep into local activism.

We’ll chat about everything from how to make sense of local elections, to staying engaged in our overwhelming political climate, to how relationships are the foundation of meaningful community work. Public Hearing is here to give you the inside scoop on what’s shaping life in Worcester in ways that are approachable, digestible, and—most importantly—relevant to you.

Tune in Wednesdays at 6 PM on WICN 90.5 FM or wherever you listen to podcasts. We’re here to keep you informed and part of the conversation!

Key Topics:

• Reintroducing Public Hearing and its mission
• The importance of local elections and civic engagement
• Challenges of staying informed and involved in community issues
• Building meaningful relationships to create positive change in Worcester
• What it means to be a part of Worcester’s growth and transformation

Chapter Markers:

• 00:00 – Welcome and reintroduction to Public Hearing
• 03:38 – Conversation with Julie Bowditch begins
• 07:00 – Discussing Worcester’s community and how to get involved
• 12:22 – Local elections and civic participation
• 20:00 – Reflections on recent election outcomes and what’s next for Worcester
• 25:35 – Wrapping up: The importance of relationships and what’s ahead

Learn more and follow at QueerForCities.com/PublicHearing

Created & Hosted by Joshua Croke, founder of Queer For Cities.
Our Audio Producer is Giuliano D'Orazio.

Available anywhere you listen to podcasts. 

Transcript

[00:00:00] Joshua Croke: Hello, Worcester and the world. You're listening to public hearing on WICN 90. 5 FM, Worcester's only NPR affiliate station and wherever you get your podcasts. I'm your host, Joshua Croke. I'm a queer and non binary designer, artist, and facilitator working at the intersections of social justice, urban development, and creative placemaking with a passion for cultivating equitable and joyful communities.

I'm the founder of Queer for Cities, a project out to make queer a joyful norm, and the founder of Love Your Labels, a non profit centering joy and celebration as an antidote to LGBTQ plus hate for queer and trans youth and community, and I've been a Worcester resident for over 13 years. If you've tuned in before, Public Hearing is a project I created in 2020 to talk about equity centered change work in Worcester and topics impacting the lives of residents and members of our community.

We featured mini series on things like education, including early childhood, as well as the school to prison pipeline. We dove into digital equity and access to technology and the roles it plays in people's lives, to a bunch of stuff about ARPA, which, like, come on, is still, like, a whole lot. It's a whole thing.

From housing, to public art, to transportation, Public Hearing centers, the voices of people doing the work in Worcester and in support of our community. We wrapped the show in July 2023 to work on and launch a new project, Queer for Cities, that I mentioned earlier, that also has its own podcast talking about the intersections of identity and place and queer influence on urbanism, public space, and community justice, which is part of a larger urbanism, media, and movement building project I'm working on.

If you want to learn more, you can find out at QueerForCities.Com. But I am very excited to announce that Public Hearing is back and nested under our gay little umbrella of queer for cities. I really missed having regular conversations with people in my home community about timely and important topics that impact our lives.

So we're bringing back the show to have more conversations about the things you care about. So buckle up. Our show is back, revamped and recommitted to bring you stories close to home here in Worcester, Mass and our region. I also took a job a couple years ago working to support concentrated neighborhood development work across the state that currently has me supporting a community partnership in Springfield, Mass.

So I myself have felt a bit disconnected from the many happenings going on in the community, and so these first episodes back may have me asking, Wait, so remind me what that is, or can you tell me about that? So if you're looking to catch up on all things Worcester, I hope you'll join us by making Public Hearing a regular part of your listening schedule.

And share the show with a friend. I'll really consider this show successful if it becomes like regular conversation at dinner to hear someone say, So I was listening to public hearing and dot dot dot. And when and if you do have those conversations, please tell me. Email me voice memos, thoughts, and ideas to josh@queerforcities.com and follow us on Instagram at queerforcities where we'll be sharing posts related to public hearing as well as other Queer for Cities content like our title podcast, Queer for Cities. So, you can tune in every week on WICN 90. 5 FM and on Wednesday at 6pm to hear me interview people doing things that impact our day to day lives here in Worcester, the second largest city in New England.

Oh, by the way, conversations, positions, and perspectives shared on public hearing do not reflect any official positions of WICN. Okay, let's jump in. Our first guest in our return journey to public hearing is the one, the only, and the fabulous And incredible Julie Bowditch. Julie, welcome to Public Hearing.

[00:03:38] Julie Bowditch: Thank you. I'm so excited. 

[00:03:40] Joshua Croke: I'm so excited to have you here. We have known each other for quite a while now. 

[00:03:45] Julie Bowditch: Several years. 

[00:03:46] Joshua Croke: Yeah, going back to before our 40 under 40. 

[00:03:50] Julie Bowditch: Yes. 

[00:03:51] Joshua Croke: Shared class. 

[00:03:52] Julie Bowditch: That was our, probably our first official intersection. 

[00:03:56] Joshua Croke: Yes. 

[00:03:57] Julie Bowditch: But we were sharing spaces before then. 

[00:04:00] Joshua Croke: Yes, we were. And I have so valued our relationship and how it's grown from there and so appreciative of the work that you do.

When I met you, you were not in the job that you currently hold now. And for anyone who lives in Worcester, you can find information about Julie in her website. Many articles, many accolades and, and things. So Julie w I want to talk about your role now at Casa, which we're going to get into but for folks who look you up, who read your bio, what's something that they might not find that you want to share with our, our listeners here? A little about you. 

[00:04:39] Julie Bowditch: I love that question. So it's not so much of a secret, but it's something I don't talk about that often, and I'm not totally sure why. But I had I have a very unique family structure.

I think some folks know, cause it does have intersections with my work currently, but it's not something I generally lead with mostly because I don't want to sort of, I don't know what the version of appropriating lived experience would be, but I don't want to give the wrong impression that my lived experience Is the same as the folks that we're serving, but my family was formed growing up through foster care and adoption.

So I am the only biological child of the Bowditch family, which is quite large and including the fact that my youngest sibling is over 20 years younger than me, so we never lived together. 

[00:05:37] Joshua Croke: But, okay. So I'm like fascinated for a few like reasons, mainly because like having that level of age gap between siblings is so I have one sibling and she's two years younger than me and I'm like kind of envious of people who have siblings across like a much wider diversity of age, especially now that like I am of the age where.

Like teens are using language that I don't know what they are talking about. So like having someone that you're like, Hey, 

[00:06:06] Julie Bowditch: what does this mean? 

[00:06:07] Joshua Croke: Let's chat what's happening right now? Like what is, you know, 

[00:06:11] Julie Bowditch: truly, well, there's a flip side to it, which is the, the darker side of the age gap, which is you are not raised by the same people, even though you are raised by the same people, those are not the parents that I was raised.

Now they're all adults. It's much more comfortable to talk about. But it, yeah, 20 years people change a lot in 20 years as they should. But you know, when you see your younger siblings being raised with a completely different environment oddly enough, the same, my parents, you know, are, have always been married are still married.

So Structurally. In fact, they grew up in the same home, the same neighborhood. But other than that, I would argue nothing was similar. 

[00:07:00] Joshua Croke: So you're like, I can't give you too many ways to navigate the relationships with the folks because like you got different ones and times have changed. 

[00:07:10] Julie Bowditch: And it's funny how the older siblings have sort of processed that differently through the years and differently than each other too.

And different layers of kind of amusement and resentment laced through our processing. But otherwise it's, it's fun to have, you know, such a diverse family. And I think it shaped, I think it shaped a lot of my career and my professional and personal choices. So it's just not something that it's not something that I don't want to talk about.

It's just not often where I begin. 

[00:07:43] Joshua Croke: Well, thank you for bringing that into, to this space and, and sharing part of yourself with me and, and our listeners and you, you, I think you said this, but you were raised in Worcester? 

[00:07:54] Julie Bowditch: In Fitchburg. So just North of Worcester for anyone who doesn't know the geography, but most folks will likely.

But I've been like yourself here for I want to say almost two decades now actually. So it's definitely home. 

[00:08:08] Joshua Croke: Yeah, it, it definitely is. And speaking of Worcester, you are like one of the champions of Worcester. And I'm like, you know, sometimes I feel like people in community, even like as we see them, you know, out at events and different things like that, like it can sometimes be overwhelming to be like, I want to be involved.

Like I want to get connected to things that are going on and, you know, call it like, Me and like growing up and like being involved and also like falling in and out of that at times. But I also feel like we're at a time right now in just the world where there's so, there's too many things to hold for one person.

Like it's like impossible to be like, Oh yeah, I'm up to date on this stuff. I'm updated on this, I'm updated on these issues. So like even stepping into community can feel a little like anxiety producing right now. And like as someone who has been, Outside of like the past couple years as I've transitioned into like a new job and like that's had me in Springfield And so I've been building relationship in that community.

I'm like, okay, I want to like step back in I'm ready to like plug back into all of the things, and that can be a little stressful. And so like if you're listening and are like, oh, I feel like Getting involved in community is stressful. Like I hear you. It can be and let's not let that prevent us from jumping in.

So I wanted to just like chat a little bit in this first comeback episode about like, what are some things that. You know, we should recap. Do you have reflections from the summer or, you know, how, how has that been?

[00:09:42] Julie Bowditch: It's a wild time, of course, right? Politically here in the city, but of course, you know, nationally.

So I think that that it's hard because that kind of underscores, I think a lot of our work, you know, in these times. I definitely relate to what you're saying about the overwhelmingness. And I would just say to folks, because I have these conversations also all the time with people not knowing where to start or, you know, where there's a space for them.

And I always just sort of say, there's no wrong way to do it. You know, take it in digestible portions. And I think for me, my evolution with community work has been around not so much doing less, but learning what aligns with me more so I think there was a time when I was like drinking from the fire hose of like what you're talking about, like you can't possibly feel up to speed on all of the things all of the time or be in all the spaces that you want to be, but.

You know, I think it's okay. Something that I learned sort of through COVID, unfortunately, but it's like, things will go on with or without us. 

[00:10:44] Joshua Croke: And so it's 

[00:10:45] Julie Bowditch: okay. Right. And if you have to say no, or if you can't make it to something, or you need to step back from a role, it will go on and it doesn't mean you don't care, it doesn't mean you've forgotten about it but you know, I think my time has been more limited in the capacity I'm in now professionally.

And the result of that has, has. Ben, me being more intentional about, and honest, right. About saying this is what I can commit to for me. Like seasonal projects are generally more digestible than ongoing projects. Like a board commitment, for instance, I'm very selective these days, cause I know that that's something that you're really, it's kind of a longterm commitment and I don't want to do that, you know, halfway.

So, I don't know that I don't even think that answered your question. 

[00:11:32] Joshua Croke: No, it, it, it totally did. And like, I'm You know, I want to talk about like some things like, you know, what has been going on in Worcester that has been like present for you that, you know, may have happened over the past few months, the past year, as people are listening, as, as Public Hearing is coming back and, and rebuilding its legs, you know I want to talk about things from the perspective of, oh, maybe I wasn't aware of this and like, that's okay.

You know cause I, I know even in the past couple of years, there's been, you know, transitions with like school committee now has letters instead of district numbers. And that's really confusing to be like, Oh, I live in district two, but I'm school committee number letter E. 

[00:12:22] Julie Bowditch: And maybe my neighbor isn't the same, right?

Like it's so confusing. I swear districting is one of the many ways that they. Confuse voters with intention, not Worcester specifically, but just generally speaking, just to make it even more challenging to feel informed and to stay current. Like you were saying, even like thinking about, you know, this election season and how overwhelming it is even to feel like you're prepared to vote in an informed way on all of the things, you know and of course, you and I, I know, share the the notion that voting locally is as important, if not more than the more visible, more talked about, more promoted You know, elections and candidates, but those are the things that impact us first and most directly, and it is overwhelming, and I think knowing where to access information can be overwhelming more generally, but but also specific to this And how, what you can trust.

[00:13:22] Joshua Croke: Yeah, and, and that's, I, and I so appreciate that you brought it to like local elections and like the importance of voting locally because one of the early seeds that plant that was planted for public hearing to even become a project to begin with was my frustration at the The public participation process in like municipal government, like just broadly speaking, like Worcester definitely has a lot of work that we can do to make the way in which residents are heard better.

And also for our elected officials, like I do not envy being a city counselor that sometimes has to sit in a six hour meeting, you know, like, and it's like, we should be able to hold two things to be true. Like We need to create effective mechanisms for the way the public needs to be and should be heard.

And people's time needs to be respected and is valuable as well. And I cannot believe a Like, six hour, like, people can talk for two minutes at a time, is the, is the best solution. 

[00:14:30] Julie Bowditch: It can't be, right? And, and like you're saying, too, it's one thing for someone like me, I can pick and choose what committee, you know, agendas to have.

Or, or talk, you know, certain meetings. Oh, I'm busy this week, but next week I'll attend or listen in later. Right. I have that privilege because I'm, of course, I'm not on the committee. You know, our counselors are, are humans too, and they have families and they have, you know, their own health, mental health, physical health.

And so while certainly, you know. Of course, they, they chose this life, you could argue, but I don't think that anyone signed up for six hours of, you know, contentious conversation. And how is that also, by the way, accessible when I would think right about a role in city government? That's something I would have to factor in, and I'm sure that's the case for lots of folks.

So then we, now it's a conversation of accessibility, and who can really manage that kind of a commitment. 

[00:15:26] Joshua Croke: Absolutely, and for folks who may not be as familiar with Worcester's, like, municipal structure, City Councils are, Are compensated at a part time basis. So city counselors have other jobs which is in my opinion, like an equity issue, I think that our elected leadership in the city, like in Worcester should have the time and capacity that we can hold them properly accountable because they are dedicated their full time career or that portion of years that they serve as a public servant.

Like this is public service work and it is often thankless. In many, and there are so many justifications to why that is sometimes because the system itself is just so poorly constructed that, you know, people are stepping in and walking into these roles underneath This 100, 200, 300 year patriarchal supremacist kind of structure, right?

And so like, we can do better. And there are cities that have really re evaluated what their governance structure and their governance process look like, looks like, right? People have full time jobs. Salaried positions who are elected into position positions of leadership. Like I'm, I'm all ears if I'm, I'm glad we're like having this conversation early on, cause I'm going to just drop that ball of like, I want to have a serious conversation about what a review of the charter looks like in Worcester. 

[00:16:55] Julie Bowditch: Absolutely. And I think another thing we share is that we're both very solutions driven. We're not the type of community leaders or community folks who are just sitting here trying to pick apart. Those people are out there, right? We all know who they are. We all know that they're there and they're probably there in every city, but just picking apart poking holes.

But we're certainly, we're, we're comfortable calling. people to task and holding people accountable. But we also want to be part of a solution and a conversation that's going to bring us closer to the outcomes that are going to create equity and access, which I think is a very different approach than just saying, this is bad.

This sucks. Sure, we can call it what it is, but we also can say, let's be part of, you know, like you said, researching places where it's being done better and talking about what does evolution look like in a sustainable way for our city. We're a real ass city. You said it in your intro. We are the second largest city in New England. There is no reason that we should be operating like a smaller municipality. And these city counselors have significant responsibility. And frankly, I don't, I don't think it's a very accessible role. I mean, now that said, I'm also proud of the progress we've made in our representation in city government, for sure. We have lots of work to do, and I think those things will likely always be one whole sentence, right? We can be proud of progress and recognize we have a lot of work to do. But you know, you talked about the turnout for local elections. And that. Right. It absolutely, nothing will get me fired up faster than looking at the, the turnout rates.

And I will say that this last election, local election, the outcomes were not all what we had hoped for. In fact, it was a bit of a discouraging evening when we started to see some of the results. However, I personally feel that there are folks who took some risks candidates who are running against.

You know, folks who have been in their seats for a very long time and incumbents that, you know, have a long history and and even folks who didn't win. I believe changed the tide at least incrementally of the turnout and I will name for instance Dominica and Rob just for examples of people I think had a strong impact in more folks voting, generally speaking, and a better turnout rate, and I've reflected that back to to Rob in particular in our conversations about how like that's one of the small victories that I think we took away, and I think we It's moving us in the right direction.

Were the numbers where they should be? No, but we don't expect that to happen probably in a single election year. But I saw. Change and I think it's worth celebrating and also like naming the things that that were impactful towards that right? And I think folks like Rob and Dominica, I'll pick on them in the most positive way possible They brought new blood to the polls because people are excited for change 

[00:20:01] Joshua Croke: well and that is I think you know, there's there's like like legislative issues and things that I would love to like Get behind the, such as like reducing the voting age for municipal elections to 16. I like think about the impact and influence of high school students being able to vote and the impact that that would have in the conversation in the school hallways and like how civics education would be much more front and center. And this is a nonpartisan issue, right? This is saying like, we have this thing called a vote, which means a lot, and it doesn't mean everything, you know, I, we're in, and not to get like too down, like the political path here, but like, we're in a very serious time. And I know a lot of folks who have a lot of strong feelings about their vote and where it goes and where it doesn't go. And I think what we really need to be looking at is yes, our vote is really important and the our vote and the systems and the people and the things that we're voting for are at a further end of a river than where the work is really starting.

And so I'm like, yeah, vote. It's critical, it's crucial, like please do not not vote, and there's 364 days of the year around that day to be doing the work and being involved in the work and influencing things like who is stepping forward to run in these elections. The pipelines. Exactly. Right. 

[00:21:32] Julie Bowditch: And to your point too, at least I think the point that you're moving towards is that the outcome of elections impacts for decades, for generations.

So while I believe, obviously, I feel strongly that everyone should turn up and turn out it's also the youth who are going to be impacted for the longest by our elections because as we've seen, it take, can take a very long time to either do or, you know, undo what's going on, you know, locally, nationally, et cetera.

So these are conversations. I agree with you that the youth should be included in because first of all, even at our age, I don't think the youth, I don't think it's the same as it was when we were their age. I think kids are much more involved, much more informed. But also like you said, that investment and knowing that the outcome impacts you personally and for a long time.

[00:22:26] Joshua Croke: And, and the other thing that I say on this, and I, I didn't expect us to go right into the like political kind of sphere of, of things. And we're flying through this first episode, which is exciting. And, and we will have many more conversations. I think. You know, related to related to this is like the reality that finding access to information.

So folks feel confident in voting in local elections is also really critical and understanding like, Oh, I know who I'm voting for, for my school committee council member, for my district council member, for the at large candidates for and, and understanding like, What city council can actually do as a legislative body locally, right?

I think that there have been a lot of important issues that are raised and reflected as like, we want to take kind of a, a moral position as, as a city. And so we want to bring a petition to council that says like, we want to state this thing and this thing is important. And I feel like we need to recognize like what life altering work happens at the city council as a legislative locally legislating body that impacts like what, what, what can they actually control? And so something that we're going to talk about on this show is some of those things. And if folks want to listen along in podcast land, I am thinking about doing like a, a Joshua narrated reads the city charter. So if folks don't want to read it themselves I might do a little, 

[00:24:01] Julie Bowditch: actually is a point that I wanted to make before we run out of time on this topic, but is that I think sometimes it's so overwhelming for people. What is going on? Who should I vote for? Like, I would urge people to.

If you're too overwhelmed, you're trying to do your own research, which obviously should be the first stop. But you're just not sure you're having trouble teasing it out. I would urge you to find someone who's active in civic engagement, who you feel you align with. And it doesn't mean you're going to vote, you know, your ballot doesn't have to be identical to theirs, but I would urge you to use them as a resource because there are folks who are having these conversations, you know, very frequently and are doing this work constantly. And that I think that can be undervalued resource for folks who are feeling overwhelmed. Like, I know this is my responsibility. I know it's my privilege, but I don't, I just don't know where to begin. Find someone who's having these conversations that you align with and let that be a starting point for you.

Because then I think it's a lot more digestible. I've done that absolutely myself and I've used you, Josh, as a resource, even in past elections to say, you can kind of be a beacon, if you will, of, you know, at least I have a sense of where we're at and it gives me a place to start that's not from scratch.

And I urge folks to, to utilize, you know, some of the work you're doing, but also even this podcast but, but also other folks that you might align with and say, geez, you know, they probably would be willing to have a conversation with you, those of us who are doing. The work are excited to talk about it with people who want to learn.

[00:25:35] Joshua Croke: Yes. And we are going to continue our conversation with Julie next episode, getting deeper into the work that you do with the Casa project. And there is just the thing that continues to come forward in so many of my work as a community organizer, as a facilitator, as like an urbanist, as a practitioner of commute, like community justice, like collective power work is like relationships are everything relationships are everything and deepening and widening those relationships are critical. Like I have people that I go to and I need to Get guidance around housing around transportation around, you know, some agenda item That's getting thrown on the City Council, you know agenda.

So In our last like quick minute here what is something that you would like to charge our show with doing over this, over these next episodes? 

[00:26:29] Julie Bowditch: So, I guess the thing that jumps to mind is helping people to really wrap their heads around these conversations because I think a lot of times people kind of shut down. They're like, oh, this is way over my head, or I don't have any space in these conversations. So I would say both having the conversations in a sophisticated way that people who are already engrossed in the work can engage in, but also finding ways to make it digestible and for people to be able to process it in kind of, you know, maybe smaller, smaller bites or ways that they feel that they can really wrap their arms around.

[00:27:04] Joshua Croke: Awesome. Well, you heard it here, folks, so you can hold us accountable to trying to bring, you know, really clear information to you about things that are going on in Worcester from politics to poverty to health to food. Et cetera, et cetera. 

I've been your host, Joshua Croke. You're listening to our first return episode of public hearing on WICN 90. 5 FM, Worcester's only NPR affiliate station. Our audio producer is Giuliano, and you can find information about our show at queerforcities. com. Thanks for listening.