Greetings and welcome to the first episode of 2021!! The past few months have been incredibly challenging for us all within the disabled and LGBT+ community and I've had my own share of personal loss which I explain here.
The main focus of this episode is an interview with the fabulous Vikki Walton-Cole, a social worker and LGBT and disability campaigner from Surrey who I met through a shared intrest in another passion of mine, music!!!!
Join me as I talk to Vikki about her own experiences of disability and coming out as pansexual. She shares with us the highs and lows of this journey and talks about her experience of being brought up in a Christian family and how this has led her to be involved in the Greenbelt festival. She also talks about how she got involved in organising her local Pride and and how there's still a need for a wider understanding of disability access within the Pride community.
Happy listening!!
Greetings and welcome to the first episode of 2021!! The past few months have been incredibly challenging for us all within the disabled and LGBT+ community and I've had my own share of personal loss which I explain here.
The main focus of this episode is an interview with the fabulous Vikki Walton-Cole, a social worker and LGBT and disability campaigner from Surrey who I met through a shared intrest in another passion of mine, music!!!!
Join me as I talk to Vikki about her own experiences of disability and coming out as pansexual. She shares with us the highs and lows of this journey and talks about her experience of being brought up in a Christian family and how this has led her to be involved in the Greenbelt festival. She also talks about how she got involved in organising her local Pride and and how there's still a need for a wider understanding of disability access within the Pride community.
Happy listening!!
Hi, and welcome to another episode of the Simply Equality Podcast, the podcast that seeks to foreground the lived experiences of disabled and LGBT people. Here we are then, another year. And in some ways this year has begun as the last one ended. I fully appreciate there's a lot of issues out there with the pandemic, and the effects of that are being felt acutely within the disability and LGBT community. And if you're somebody that has been particularly affected by that, then I do just send out my love and support. And please do reach out to your friends and family and anybody you feel able to, cos things are tricky, and we need to really be there for each other. But things go on. Here I am with another episode of the podcast, this episode was recorded a couple of months ago, I do acknowledge that there's been a bit of a gap in episodes. That's because I've had some own... issues of my own. My mum, who was my rock, and one of my fiercest allies and supporters, was diagnosed with secondary breast cancer in October of last year. And after a short period of illness, she actually passed away on the 10th of December. It was, and will be, a massive loss to us as a family. I myself am really feeling her loss. Whilst she did struggle a little bit just to understand what it meant to be trans, pretty much from the beginning of coming out, she's been one of my fiercest allies and supporters, and she regarded me as her daughter. And also she accepted my new wife, Claire, who you'll know from a previous episode, she accepted her as just as much of a daughter as well. So it's been a difficult few months. Thank you for being patient. I am still trying to work through it. So there may be a bit of a delay in future episodes. But I've really wanted to get this episode out to you because I think it is a fantastic episode with a lot of stuff that's relevant, just as much now as it was when I recorded it. So without any further ado, I will cut out my chit chat, and we'll get on with the interview. Here, on the Simply Equality Podcast, and I have a fantastic guest with me. This guest is Vikki Walton-Cole, she is somebody that I actually met through a joint love of ours, that would be a band called Bang Bang Romeo...
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yep.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah! Who, who if you haven't checked them out, please do go check them out. They're awesome. And on a very personal note, I found them to be incredibly supportive. And they are 100% LGBT inclusive. Just go and check them out. Vikki, they're great, aren't they?
Vikki Walton-Cole:They are, and also, you know, they'll happily help if you've got any inquiries for access, any of their concerts, really good like that as well. Really good.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:And that's how I found out about Vikki, because we were on a... one of those obligatory lockdown Zoom gig chat things. And Vicki understandably, being a music lover like me, was asking, or shall we say, commenting on the lack of access on certain venues. And I thought: SHE would be a good woman to talk to for my podcast!. So here she is. So welcome, Vicki.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Thank you. It's lovely to be here.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:It's a real pleasure to have you. So, actually, Vikki, why don't you introduce yourself, in whatever way you wish to?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Okay, I am Vikki, sometimes known as Vix, my pronouns are she and her, hers. Er, I am a social worker by day, I'm also a Unison disabled officer in my local branch. I am part of the Social Work Action Group taking a lead on disability at the moment. And my time is spent between social work and generally being active and an activist.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:It's amazing you've got any time for gigs and those days we would go to gigs, being that busy.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yeah, I like... busy is good for me, it's enjoyable. But obviously now I have to balance that with enough rest in between. But you can be an activist online more now which makes things a bit easier than handcuffing yourself to a bus.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:[Laughter]. Yeah, absolutely. Erm, yeah, we may get onto that a bit later. But perhaps Vikki, we could start by, as you've just alluded to, you know, not not handcuffing yourself to a bus, but I believe your your disability is primarily around sort of physical mobility, would you like to tell us a bit more about that and how your disability affects you?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yeah, so I've spent most of my life being pretty able bodied. And then, a couple of years ago, a number of ongoing illnesses kind of hit at once, had some complications with my body, and it just kind of gave up on me. I say my body broke. And so now I am a part time wheelchair user, I struggle with mobility, I struggle with lifting, carrying, fatigue, pain, but keep smiling and keep battling through. And I discovered that the world was not built for people like me, very quickly. And I think that realisation of how inaccessible the world is not just to me, but to quite a large number of people prompted me to become much more vocal, and much more a voice of saying we need to change.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:How- so you've just described there, so you were, you know, able bodied. Had you had much exposure to disability in general before your own journey?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yes, yes, I worked in a school for children with profound multiple, complex needs and disabilities. So I had worked with children who used wheelchairs all the time, who were maybe unable to communicate, had significant learning disabilities. So, in my mind, I thought I knew a bit about accessibility. And I knew that pavements weren't great for wheelchairs. And I knew that, you know, there was often a bit of planning involved, but I think until, until it becomes so personal, I don't think you realise quite what the struggle is. And as an able bodied person pushing a wheelchair, it's very different to being in a wheelchair and trying to move it yourself.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, absolutely. I mean, how- can you perhaps remember, was there a specific example of that sort of first time you've realised, actually, this world really is not built for disabled people?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Erm, it's been quite a quick realisation, like the lack of seats around when I was- even when I was more mobile, there's not enough public benches that people can sit down and take a rest. The definition of being wheelchair friendly, always means it's not wheelchair accessible. And quickly realised, and actually realised this when I tried to go away on my own for the first time, that there's a massive difference between somewhere being accessible with someone with you, so you've got someone to do doors, help with ramps and stuff, and something being independently accessible. So for me to be able to get in somewhere on my own. And that's, that's a massive difference. So I was very, very independent. And then I had to rely completely on my partner and other people to move me around, help me around, open doors, everything, everything just changed into not being able to do stuff on your own, in the same way as before,
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:How - I mean, how did you cope with that, on a sort of emotional psychological level because it is quite tough?
Vikki Walton-Cole:It's tough. I've previously done counselling, being a counsellor. And so for me, I sought therapy. Because I see therapy as a really positive thing. Something that I don't leave until crisis point, I do it beforehand. And that's been helpful. My wife, being the wonderful, amazing supportive person that she is, that's made a huge difference, really helped. And I think my general attitude is, grieve it, you know, grieve what you were wanting, grieve what you've lost. And then I accept and move on, adapt, however that is. That's, that's my way of getting through things is to feel the emotions, and let myself be upset that I can't do these things anymore, upset that I have to rely on people, and then adapt and move on, you know? It's an ongoing process. And there's still times I'll get frustrated, but that's okay. And I'll still get there. I'll still adapt and I'll still move on.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, I mean, it's really interesting you say that, [coughs] excuse me, because I think sometimes, I think because of media representation of disability, and we have all these sort of mega tough power warriors, dunno about you, Vicki, but that sometimes feels like, we're not allowed to just be a bit pissed off and annoyed at the fact that we can't go where we want, and do what we want, as easily as we could before?
Vikki Walton-Cole:I think there's two perceptions of people with disabilities. And you either have to be this sort of model person who smiles at everything and nothing upsets, or you're this, like, person who, you know, the world's treated you badly and you are this angry ball. And I think, for all of us, most of us, we sit somewhere in between, and we'll probably be both at different points. Erm, and actually, it's okay to not be either, to just sit in the middle and get on with your life. And I do think we miss a lot of media representation of disabled people just getting on with life.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:I completely agree. And that's probably a whole other podcast. But I really, completely agree with you. Erm, so that was your reaction, your response? And you've mentioned your wife was really supportive, which is fantastic. How did you feel other people's perceptions or attitudes towards you changed?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Erm...
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:If they did.
Vikki Walton-Cole:I think a lot of people just continue to see me as me. I don't really... I'm not the sort of person that would easily be pitied, I suppose.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mmm-hmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:And most of my friends that knew me before, my family,had just accepted and moved on. Yeah. And, you know, there's some friends I don't have now. And I have other new friends. So it's part of life, I think. It's certainly something where you will you will learn who your friends are.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, absolutely. And what about work, you've mentioned you're a social worker. I'm married to a social worker, that's a stressful, tiring, full on job. I mean, how was it with work?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Erm, so I had, I actually had quite a battle, where I work, to return to work as someone with disabilities.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mmm-hmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:And I changed my role. But actually, if you if you've got the right support in place, you know, as with any job, if you've got the right support in place, you can still do exactly the same job you were doing before, you can still be equally as successful. It's just that it's not...I suppose it's not as visible that disabled people are successful in their career, as it should be, maybe.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, absolutely. Just finding this element. We can't do anything at the minute, in the void, lockdown, Coronavirus. How has lockdown been for you? And what's been your experience of that as a disabled person?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Erm, it's had positives and negatives, I think with most people. It's been lovely not having to get up and drive to work and spend all that energy at the start of the day. But I'm definitely more extroverted, bit of a people person. So the contacts, of you know, just seeing colleagues or seeing friends that has pretty much stopped, has been quite hard to cope with. Along with, you know, a decline in disability with - as with many people with mobility difficulties, some of the things we were able to do, some of the therapies and stuff, aren't open, weren't open. And that's had quite an impact.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mm, mmm. Absolutely. So this podcast is obviously about disability and, you know, thank you for sharing your experiences, but it's also about being LGBT. And you've mentioned your wife, do you want to perhaps tell us a bit more about you and your LGBT identity, and what sort of journey that was for you?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yes, Oh, um, I would identify as a pansexual, homoromantic person, for my orientation. Pansexual means that I am attracted to people regardless of gender. Homoromantic means that I'm most likely to be in a relationship with someone who identifies similarly to myself. That's been quite a journey for me. I was brought up in a very religious sort of home. And I spent a lot of my early adulthood in various Evangelical, charismatic churches where the constant rhetoric was that, you know, gay is a sin, you need to be cured, you need to be - you know, you need to be straight. You need, you need to be what we perceive you should be. Erm, so it wasn't easy to come out. And I didn't come out until I was into my 30s. When I decided that actually, my own, my own mental wellbeing was far more important than being in a church, and actually being my true self, my true identity was what was going to be the best thing long term. And so yeah, I came out then, and then met my wife few years later. And that's that story, I suppose.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, isn't that fascinating. So we haven't really met before this interview. And I didn't know about that sort of church religious background. Because I had a very similar, similar experience. I was quite involved in the - yep, more charismatic Evangelical Church. In fact, my ex wife and I actually led a church for a while, was heavily involved. And then for me, I was basically told that if I stayed and identified as a male as I did before transition, then that's fine, they would support me. But if I wished to transition and go down the road that I knew I had to do, then that was pretty much it. And that was incredibly tricky. I know things have changed, and are changing slowly within the Christian world and the church. But I still think the number of LGBT people, ourselves included Vikki, find in there they once were very involved in the church and either just aren't involved at all now, or involved in a very different type of church and spirituality. Where are you at now with that?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Erm, so for me, it was an experience that I didn't really want to go back to, and I lost all my friends[inaudible] when I left the church to be myself,
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Snap.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Um, and it was, it was quite - I think, having heard so many times that me as a person was evil and wrong, does have an effect on your, your mental health, your mental wellbeing and I think for an amount of protection, maybe I wouldn't be in a church on a daily basis. I don't think I have those same beliefs anymore. Erm, I have however, I've always been involved with something called Greenbelt festival.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, I've been to Greenbelt. I love Greenbelt.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Erm, I'm on one of the teams there, absolutely loved it, and you know, you can go through the whole weekend and not do anything remotely religious if you want to. Erm, you can also do the whole weekend and not see anyone from the LGBT community. But it would be really hard to you to not miss us because actually, that's one of the most accepting places that I've found in the last 10 years, I suppose.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:For those that don't know Greenbelt, it's... well actually go on, you can describe it, Vikki.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Greenbelt is a festival that's been going over 40 years. And they would - they describe it as somewhere where faith, arts and justice collide. And lots of music, lots of talks, but not talks where they tell you what to believe, talks where you can question, where you can think, and you can actually go No, or Yes, or whatever. Lots of social justice issues, climate change, justice for Palestinians, all sorts of things there. And some amazing creative arts. Great pub. Lots of wonderful people. I could keep going, I've been going so wrong.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Well, you make me.... you make me think I should think about going again, it's been a long while.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Definitely, definitely. I encourage my friends to go.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Absolutely. And I'll put a link to Greenbelt in the show notes for anybody that wants to find out more. Um, so I mean, how h was it when you came to that point of realising who you truly were, and thought, you know what, I just have to be myself? How, I mean, how did that feel on a real sort of raw, visceral level?
Vikki Walton-Cole:It was half scary. And half exciting.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mm-hmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Um, and also, in amongst there, there was the massive relief of not having to pretend anymore. Um, so for me, you know, it was scary in that it was stepping out into the unknown. I did... I had a few friends that were LGBT, but not- I didn't have a connection with the community at all at that time. I was literally stepping out into the unknown. I was - I was single, and I was still happy being single. That wasn't it. That wasn't my main, that wasn't my main driver. It was just to be myself. And I think the relief with not pretending and all that sort of, it just helped me. It helped me so much to just be confident as a person, I suppose.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:So I guess you sort of came out as LGBT first, got married and all that, before you became disabled? I mean, were you quite involved in the LGBT community before you were disabled?
Vikki Walton-Cole:So yeah, so I came out, I started coming out to a few friends. And then met my now wife. I didn't come out to my family until I met my partner because I didn't see too much point in creating a rip or a wave, I didn't know which was which, which it was going to be. They've been wonderful, they've been so accepting.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Amazing.
Vikki Walton-Cole:So that's, that's great. But I didn't see a point in as a single person, letting them know. I found a women's group online. That was my first thing, I found a monthly women's group and just met some other people of a similar age. And we'd meet up and put the world to rights once a month. So that was kind of my introduction to the LGBT community. And then when I met my wife, I think together we we we started doing Pride, and being a lot more active, wanting to have more friends in the community, and from there I got involved with setting up Pride in the area I live in.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Excellent. So there you were, you're involved, you're doing that. And then obviously as you say, your body "broke." How did you find that that new sense of dual identity, of being, you know, LGBT and now disabled? How did you find that?
Vikki Walton-Cole:I was very, very much aware, quite quickly, that disabled people still need to fight for their place in the LGBT community, there's a lot of Prides that aren't accessible.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mm hmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Um, living near London, I haven't found a fully accessible LGBT venue yet.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeeeeah.
Vikki Walton-Cole:I'm not saying there isn't any. But I'm saying I haven't found one yet.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mm hmm, mm hmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:You know, from my experience, when I was able to go out, I've been to clubs and stuff with my wife. And a female bar was down a flight of stairs, there's no way I'd get in and out. You know, that I love the Royal Vauxhall Tavern. They're amazing, they're so welcoming, but they don't have an accessible toilet.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:No, it's outside or something, isn't it?
Vikki Walton-Cole:They don't even have it outside always.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Oh my gosh.
Vikki Walton-Cole:So I'm okay, I can still walk a bit. So I can wobble my way in and out. But someone who needs to transfer from a wheelchair wouldn't be able to do that. Um, so it was interesting to to see how, how quickly like, my social, where I could go socially was cut down quite significantly. And, and I know, there's some amazing people in the LGBT community, lots of really amazing people, really accepting. And there's other people who think it's an issue all the time, if you raise accessibility. They don't want to think about it. They don't wanna....
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Really?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yeah, it's a balance, I suppose. And I think my, my getting involved with a Pride was to try and make sure that, you know, accessibility was on the agenda.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mmmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:All the time.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Why do you think.. perhaps you haven't got an answer Vikki, why do you think that is? Why do you think some people are like that?
Vikki Walton-Cole:It's, it's really hard. Cause I know a lot of Prides in the UK, the smaller ones, erm, they don't have a lot of finances, they're reliant on donations. And this is a societal problem, not a Pride problem. But to make somewhere accessible is expensive.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:So, if you're having an outdoor venue, you're having an outdoor stage, it's an extra two plus thousand pounds to have a ramp so a wheelchair could access that stage. And a lot of small Prides wouldn't be able to afford that.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:No.
Vikki Walton-Cole:And I, I have compassion for that. But equally, some of the larger Prides just don't seem to be getting the right advice. Erm, I think yeah, I think there's... they're run by a lot of volunteers. But I think a lot of Prides could do with some disabled people on their boards, telling them more about accessibility, what makes something accessible. And for our voice to be there at the start, rather than we'll just plonk this little bit area here and call it an access area, we've done our bit.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, cause...
Vikki Walton-Cole:It's about people understanding what disability is as well.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, cause you need that you need those ramps, you need that mobility access. But that's not everything, is it? That's not, that doesn't mean that something's fully accessible.
Vikki Walton-Cole:No.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Cause they have a ramp.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yeah, and also, you know, there, as you know, as I know, there's far more disabilities than wheelchair use.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mmmmm, mmmmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Far more. Too many to start listing. And I think, when
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Absolutely. people say they're accessible, they may be they may be, they Mm hmm. So I guess you'd encourage may have a ramp, and they may feel that that's accessible, but actually, there's so many more disabilities. And yes, it's har to be accessible to everyone an everything, but there are way to help people. There's way that, you know, if you have, i you have volunteers or staf who understand disability an can help you navigate where are the best places, what to do, wh re you can get help, that make a massive differen anybody listening to this, who feels they have the capacity and is frustrated, to just try and get involved in whatever way they can in their local Pride or other events?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Definitely, I think it's a great way, it's a great way to learn about events, and about all sorts of interesting things. It's a great way to meet people. It's a great way to be part of your community, and it's a great way to be involved, to help people learn more about disability, because I'm sure most of it is just the fact that people don't know.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mmm, mmm, yeah, I think I think you're right. I think that's, you know, partly why I started this podcast, just to share the fact that... you know, you and me talking here, yes, we're both disabled, yes, we're both LGBT, but our experiences of being disabled and being LGBT, are different.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Mmm.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:You know, we're talking about some common issues, but we have different disabilities, different impairments, different issues.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yeah.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:And I think you're right, none of us can fully understand each other's experiences. But the more we talk to each other, learn from each other, the more that we can sort of broaden that horizon.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yes, definitely.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:So I mean, you've talked about the sort of physical aspect of access. Did you? Perhaps you did, perhaps you didn't... did you experience any difference in attitude from within the disability community? The fact that you are LGBT?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Not, not really. Um, I mean, I have -I've only been part of the disability community a couple of years, so I've not really experienced anything other than normal society heteronormativity. Heteronormativity, that is everywhere. I don't feel like I've experienced from the disability community, any, any sort of prejudice for being LGBT at all.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Good. Good. Something that comes up often is that obviously, from what you said, you have a wife, who therefore, you know, is female. And you I guessing, you know, present more female. So when you're out together, do you find people presuming you're sisters, friends?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yes.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Think that you're wife and wife?
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yeah, we've often been mistaken for friends or sisters. And now obviously, it's my carer.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, absolutely.
Vikki Walton-Cole:And I do remind people very often, no she's my wife, or no, she's my partner or, you know, whatever. It's - I think, also, you know, we certainly used to hold hands a lot. So it made it a bit more obvious. Erm, something that we've we've been quite conscious of is that we want younger people to see older women just walking around, and openly in a relationship as just as a normal thing.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mm hmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:So yeah, whenever we can, we will hold hands and just demonstrate, you know, that we're a couple.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:You'll just be yourselves out shopping, or going to the pub or the cafe or whatever. It's no big deal.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Yeah.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, absolutely. Erm is there anything you think that sort of both communities, the disability community and the LGBT community could learn from each other, and the ways they sort of campaign, or tackle issues in the wider world?
Vikki Walton-Cole:I think, I think they definitely could both do with learning a bit from each other. I think something I've seen in the disability community is that when people have one particular impairment, one particular disability, they tend to want to learn about more disabilities quite quickly. So something I've found is people trying to put image descriptions or captions, like captions on videos, image descriptions on photos, when they, you know, when they can, because they know that other people need them. And I think there's that understanding quite quickly that, you know, if I need adjustments other people do, what do they need? Can I do it? Can I be more accessible to other people? And I think that's something that maybe some parts of the LGBT community could learn from that sort of wanting to learn about others, wanting to learn about how to make things better for them. Erm, and I think it would be great for the LGBT community to consider those with access needs, and to think about how they could really include all disabled people in the community more, I suppose.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Mmm.
Vikki Walton-Cole:And, and I think, I think the disability community can learn a lot of freedom of expression. There's a lot of thoughts from society that you know, disabled people are either fetishized, is that the right word?
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yeah, yeah.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Or that they're just non sexual beings. And, and I think the LGBT community could really help with sort of ensuring that society understands that just because you have a disability doesn't mean you don't want relationships, you don't want... And that goes for heterosexual straight people, as much as anyone else that you know, it's still.. and for you know, cisgender, transgender, it's still you being your identity. And I think that sort of freedom of being who you are, is something that the disabled community could maybe learn a little bit more from the LGBT community.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Just one final question, I guess. I mean, 2020's being one heck of a year. That's an understatement. But now as we sit here, coming towards the end of it, looking
ahead:for you, Vikki, as an LGBT disabled person, how do you feel about the future?
Vikki Walton-Cole:It's, it's been a really strange year. I think everyone says it's really strange. I think, certainly for the LGBT community, it's.. they've gone from everything as face to face, everything is out socialising, to everything is online. And being disabled, everything online suddenly means everything is open to everyone that wasn't before. So it's been a sort of a twist for both groups, I think. Moving forwards, obviously, I can't wait for gigs to happen again.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:Yay!!
Vikki Walton-Cole:Wait to force my way down to the front of a gig and go, no, I'm done. I'm going to stand - sit at the front in my wheelchair, even though you want me to sit at the back in a little enclosed area.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:And you know what Vikki? I'll stand behind you. And yes, I know I'm tall. I'm blind. I don't care. I want to be in the thick of it.
Vikki Walton-Cole:So yeah, obviously, those sort of socialising... I really hope that we can, we can have a better level of back to - maybe not to what it was before. But definitely socialising happening again. And, and I hope that also, the whole society learns that a mixture of the two is really good, because not every disabled person has the energy, the ability or the care, to get out and go to everything all the time. So having online options has been really helpful to a lot of disabled people to feel a bit more included, for example, in the LGBT community, because they can actually go to things now. So I think moving forward, learning that actually, a mixture of both could be really helpful for everyone.
Sarah Stephenson-Hunter:It's been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much. And yeah, I really can't wait to be at that next Bang Bang Romeo gig with you. So until that day, I look forward to it.
Vikki Walton-Cole:Thank you.