I have a conversation with Mike Marion about the anti-war movement and the great Ron Paul, before we shift into a celebration of recording artist John Mayer. Mayer is one of the essential artists of the last 20 years, comparable to my muse, Jack White, and someone we can learn from too.
Episode page - www.simplewealthkc.com/post/john-mayer-is-probably-into-bitcoin-mike-marion
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Andy Flattery is the Owner of Simple Wealth Planning, a Registered Investment Advisor. All opinions expressed by Andy and guests are solely their own opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Simple Wealth Planning. This podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only and should not be relied upon as investment, tax, or legal advice. Clients of Simple Wealth Planning may maintain positions in bitcoin and the securities discussed in this podcast.
I have a conversation with Mike Marion about the anti-war movement and the great Ron Paul, before we shift into a celebration of recording artist John Mayer. Mayer is one of the essential artists of the last 20 years, comparable to my muse, Jack White, and someone we can learn from too.
Episode page - www.simplewealthkc.com/post/john-mayer-is-probably-into-bitcoin-mike-marion
Get the essential list of The Reformed Financial Advisor episodes
Follow Andy Flattery on Twitter
Send an email to andy@simplewealthkc.com
Andy Flattery is the Owner of Simple Wealth Planning, a Registered Investment Advisor. All opinions expressed by Andy and guests are solely their own opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Simple Wealth Planning. This podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only and should not be relied upon as investment, tax, or legal advice. Clients of Simple Wealth Planning may maintain positions in bitcoin and the securities discussed in this podcast.
I was critiquing long term planning once. And the limits of very longterm planning. If you want to be a high achiever. And I was using Jack White of the white stripes as my model. The, uh, the rock singer and guitar player. And I was sort of coming up with a model of what he was doing. Well, it was saying, be a craftsman in something have brought in interest. Take small risks. Be a tinker don't retire. Just pivot. And I want to do something similar to that today with John Mayer, John Mayer is one of my favorite artists. He's one of the. Uh, best artists of his generation and the idea for that came from a guy named Mike Marion. Who's going to be my guest on the podcast. Uh, Mike's a really good guy. He's a family man. He tells me that he has a family music listening night in there in the music room, in their house. So that's pretty cool. That's next level. And he's a financial planner as well based out of orange county, California. He's the founder of senior life advisors. Which helps guide families through challenges in their later years, Mike likes to spend his free time with his wife and three daughters. Preferably on a boat or on the beach. And he's a hardcore music guy. So if you want to. Check out that episode I did with Jack White. It's called jack white tinkering in the limits of goal-based planning i'll put that link in the show notes as well as the link to connect with my guests here At Mike marion M. One note there was a bit of a poor internet connection i think on my end and at times it sounds like i'm talking over mike it sounds like i'm interrupting him Um i'm not the the internet was a little screwed up so sorry about that it's a little it's a little odd But um, this is my conversation with mike Marian and i hope you enjoy the john mayer episode something a little bit different here we go
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:You had found the pod and you had reached out and you said, Hey, man, I saw you're, you're, uh, you're talking about Tom Woods and Hans Herman Hoppa and even Ryan Adams I just got back in finance working for the family wealth management firm. We, we've got a lot in common. And so, we got together, we jumped on a call and, I told my wife, I was like, I, I just think I met my brother from another mother So it's good to talk to you, man.
Track 1:Yeah, that's funny. I felt the same way and had the same talk with my wife too, so that's, yeah. That's good to hear.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:I'm, I'm, I'm excited to have you on. we're gonna get into our, our topic, which we haven't covered yet on the podcast, so this is an exclusive, but before we do that, you had sent me a couple pieces that you had written years ago when you were, uh, more involved in the anti-war movement and actually had a chance to meet Dr. Ron Paul. And so maybe just gimme a little bit about the origin story. Like how did you get involved in that movement and what, and tell me more about your writing back then.
Track 1:Sure. Well, you know, so the Iraq war was, uh, very formative for me. unfortunately I supported it at the time, you know, I was, I was 20. Um, probably not a great excuse though, because people who died in it, on both sides were, were younger than that many times. So, uh, but anyway, I, I, uh, so I, it, I was really, felt bad about it for a while, and Ron Paul was the person who kinda showed me, uh, what I was wrong about and why, and, uh, and, and per, and why it would be, uh, natural to be kind of a cons, personally conservative type person. Like I, like I am or was. Um, or am, uh, to, to be anti-war. Because I think growing up it seemed like, oh, that's kind of a, a hippie thing or a lefty thing. And, and I really, I wasn't that, but Ron Paul kinda gave me permission and, uh, and kind of a roadmap of, of why that matters and, um, and why it's important to be, to understand, you know, the, the values in virtues of being anti-war. And, uh, so I, I really, he put me on a, on a journey, uh, where I just, I, I started to, to read and, uh, to understand what was going on. I just, I, I felt a lot of guilt for having supported that. Like I, like I mentioned, and, um, you know, I guess I felt like I was kind of on a path of atonement for like a decade of just making up for that mistake. And, uh, you know, I, I, I was able to start, I started writing articles, um, I was able to get published at anti-war dot com, at the Ron Paul Institute, uh, lou rockwell.com. Future of Freedom Foundation and, and a couple other places. And, um, yeah, I just, uh, it really, it was something, and it still is something I really care about. I, I don't have as much focus on it right now of writing anymore, but, um, something that was very meaningful
Andy:Yeah. I think you and I are about the same age, I have a similar story. I think I, I voted for George W. Bush. Um, I supported Ron Paul when he made waves in the Iowa caucuses. I. When I, when I was in college and, but even then, like on campus, it was, he was very much, um, popular with the left Libertarian, So, I didn't totally get it, but by the time Bush's second term came around, like I was definitely coming around to the idea. I think a lot of people were that like, like, what is the deal with this war? Um, even though like in the first term, I, I totally supported it and after nine 11, like I was gung-ho about all that stuff. So, um, yeah, he's, he's, he's a great man. And what, and did you have a chance to meet him, or tell me, tell me more about your interaction with him.
Track 1:So, you know, I did, uh, several times and it's, it's, uh, still kind of amazing to me. But, um, you know, I, I, uh, I, I met him a few times. I kind of got made some friends. I became friends with Daniel McAdams, uh, you may be aware of, from the Rom Paul Institute. Just a great guy, uh, became friends with Scott Horton and some other people in that movement too. But, uh, yeah, I got, I got to, um, be being a contributor. So I was actually, uh, you know, Ron Paul was involved after he retired from Congress. His first, the first project was called Voices of Liberty. Um, and so I, I became a contributor to that and was, was getting some articles published with them. I, I did, you know, really, like, one of the pinnacles for me was just, um, doing an interview with Ron Paul. Uh, it, it almost feels like it, like it was, uh, it was, it's surreal and it feels like it didn't happen. Maybe I imagined it. But, uh, occasionally I go back to YouTube and remind myself, oh no, it really did happen. And there's the, the proof right there. So I got to be, yeah, I got to be interviewed by him about articles I was writing at the time. And, uh, and then just like over time just was attended conferences and actually got to go to his, his house a couple times. And, uh, just, just such a, such a neat, uh, neat guy and just a hero. And, um, yeah, so it was very much a, a privilege to, to get to know that circle a bit. And, you know, it's not like him and I are buddies, but, um, certainly I've met him a few times and he, he's remembered me, you know, later times when I talked to him. So, um, I got to sit out on his front porch, under his big, uh, his big old oak tree and, and talk about ideas and, and he, and, and about kinda my, his role in, in my process of converting from, um, as it or from, um, Being kinda pro-war to anti-war. And, uh, and he signed my article that I've written that, which is really a thank you note to him is about how he had changed my heart and mind on that. And so I wanted him to know that, you know, this article is, is, uh, is about you and it's really, it's really my way of saying thank you to you. And, uh, yeah, so he signed that and I'm,
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:What, what's your impression on the current state of, um, You know, I, for lack of a better word, that comes to mind? American Imperialism and just the anti-war movement. you know, Trump kind of, Put his finger on some of that unrest, although he didn't do a whole lot during his presidency, and now it's like, interestingly, it's like the neoliberals that are the warhawks. I don't, I don't pay too much attention to it. Occasionally I'll listen to Scott Horton, but, But what, what, what's your impression on the current state of things?
Track 1:You know, I, I have to admit I haven't been following it as closely as I had, but, um,'cause it just, you know, it is, it is a bit discouraging. you know, I, I, but I, but it has been really encouraging to see the, well, it's weird to see kind of the sides shift. It's like, I wish that the sides united, but it feels like kind of the, the right became has become better on, on war. And the left, you know, and this is kind of broadly speaking, left and right, you know, but, um, the left half of America has become maybe more open to be, at least being open to being pro-war, you know, uh, or just supporting their team. It's, it's kind of feels like that, where it's like, but it, it does feel like, uh, that Trump stirred something up and, and maybe people didn't fully don't fully understand the, you know, all the reasons behind all the wars, but that there, there is an instinct and a, um, a feeling, uh, uh, among a lot of people that these wars are a bad deal and that we're just, you know, they, they're, they're, you know, they're, they're costing life. You know, we, we have people dying on, you know, I maybe, I guess less American troops dying now, but certainly there were a lot dying before and, and could be more in the future. But, um, you know, just the, the loss in the life and just, and just, I think the big thing now just seems like. We can't afford it, you know, um, in fact, I, so I was looking back, uh, at the other day kind of preparing for, to talk with you and, uh, looking at this war, this, uh, this article I'd written for anti-war dot com called Anti-War is Pro-American. And actually, this was, this was published back in 2016, and I, I, uh, referenced the ever-growing debt of$19.3 trillion And how quaint is that? I mean, it's now, it's now 70% higher. I mean, it's now like a 33 trillion or something, which these numbers are not even real. They just are not even comprehensible. But, um, it's amazing how, how, just, you know, I mean the, the trillions of dollars being thrown away on this stuff, it, um, you know, you've, you got all this money going to Ukraine and, and there's some things going around now online. Comparing like the amount of money that's gone to Ukraine versus amount of money towards, um, Hawaii for their, you know, the fires and stuff. So, um, I think people are, are kind of thinking, what the heck is going on? Even people
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:I mean my my, my dad who, um, is no, you know, anarchist or anything of that nature, he'll, you know, he'll, he'll show me Tucker car, Tucker Carlson clips, who, um, I think gets it in a lot of ways, you know, in the, the Bitcoiners will talk about how Uh, Fiat Funsies Wars where, you know, essentially you can just keep printing money to, to finance these operations. And, and Yeah. like you said, the, the UK uh, Ukraine meme, that's become another joke. That's become another joke on Twitter about how, weapons for Ukraine are being funded at the expense of things that we might actually need here for the, for the people of the United States.
Track 1:yeah. Yeah. You know, it is pretty, it's just wild. Um, that what, what they're doing it, I guess the, the hubris of just, um, DC and the people in charge of these things, you know, flirting with, you know, nuclear Armageddon. I don't have to spend too much time thinking about it because it's, but yeah, I mean, uh, you know, let's tune into, tune it into Scott Horton. Um, you know, you, you realize this is the, these things can get outta hand. Like they think they, they have control of the situation and that, oh, it's, we can just give, you know, money and weapons and, and uh, kind of fund this, this proxy work against Russia. But man, like the things can, can. Be set in motion that can't be unset in motion. You know, like things can happen. And so it's, it is, it's scary and it's, uh, you know, so, so on top of it being just a massive waste and, and it really a slap in the face to the American people who are paying for this stuff, um, to then think about not only is it those things, but it's also, you know, risking the species. Uh, it's, it's, it's crazy, man. It's just
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:so I'm gonna do a massive pivot here, just because why not? I wanna talk to you about a lot of things. I. I was like, okay, Mike, you gotta come on the podcast. What are we gonna talk about? Maybe we should talk about multi-generational legacy planning or working for your family business. And you said, no, we gotta do the John Mayer episode. You did the Jack White episode. Now you, you, you've gotta do the John Mayer episode. So I said, that's pretty good idea. So, so Mike, why are we talking about John Mayer?
Track 1:Well, you know, as we, as we talked about, you and I both seemed to, to understand John Mayer, and, and the thing is like, you know, I think for good, for a good reason, th this guy has been around for over two decades. Um, he's just at this point, kind of like a force of nature. Um, I, I just, and, and I, I don't mean to sound too much like a fan, a fanboy. I mean, I, although I guess maybe I am, but, um, I, I do, you know, like I've been critical of, of him at times and, and not loved everything. But, um, there's no doubt that, you know, he's, he's just one of our generation's biggest and most enduring talents. And what he is done in the, in recent years with, with that and company, which we can talk about whenever you want, but, um, it's just, it's been pretty remarkable his, his career and his, his just his career path. I think he's, he's, he's a brilliant guy. He's also just a, just a funny person and, um, and just kind of a unique, uh, a unique person to have in, in music. And, you know, like there's been times where I haven't loved him, uh, certain things and maybe kind of, you know, it's like I listen to him every day, all day, but he's just always there and always a a, um, someone who, you know, you talked about Jack White. and had a kind of a framework of, of looking at him and what makes him great and, and I thought a lot of those things applied to John as well. And um, and I'm also a big Jack White fan too. I think it's, you know, I think j John Mayer is just a, a unique person in, in music and in our culture and, and it's kind of been a stable,
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Yeah. It's, it's amazing. Um, for a guy that sort of came up as like a sensitive singer songwriter, and now, and if you were a hardcore fan, which I was like starting in 2001, I think maybe 2000, um, around the time where Room for Squares came out, you sort of knew, like you always kind of knew there was a lot going on there. Like it was more, it was a lot more than just, your body is a wonderland. If you were a really hardcore fan, you, you recognized this. But now I think It's not embarrassing to talk about it. You know, I think a lot of people recognize the genius of John Mayer, for his guitar work. Like, like you said, for his work with The Dead, for um, you know, just sort of like his, his public personality, which he's had a good decade, you know, after sort of like his, uh, hashtag MeetMe too moment. I don't wanna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna save my caveats for the end because I don't want this to become a podcast of just caveating John Mayer. so let's just talk about his virtues first and then we can talk about his, all the caveats. So Rick Beatos got this YouTube channel that I'll, I'll watch occasionally. He's a music producer and he does great commentary on YouTube and he called the Last Guitar Hero. And if you think about it, there, there aren't any guitar heroes anymore. Um, there's not a lot of like analog music anymore. And, um, he called Mayor the Last Guitar Hero'cause he really is. The only sort of guitar player that people even know anymore that's still relevant. Um, even more so than Jack White who, who is a guitar player. But I think, you know, may has been able to keep his re I mean, they, they're, they, they're both still pretty relevant, but I think may at least even more so with a pop audience. And if you think about it, the other day I was, I was picking up a, I think it was like the Fourth Kings of Leon album. Come around sundown. That came out in like 2010 and I was like, oh, this was the end of Kings of Leon. Like 2010 was like the death of that ba, like, I don't even know, I don't even remember their, their, their later albums. And I feel like 2010 was like sort of the end of rock. Anyway, like you haven't heard, like, when's the last time you've heard about irrelevant rock record? Now mayor, he's not exactly a rocker, although he has some rock songs. Um, but he's definitely, he's kept, kept guitar music relevant and so I think just for that alone, he deserves a nod,
Track 1:yeah. Yeah. F agreed. You know, he, and it's interesting, you, you touched on this, you know, like, you know, your body is one Land is, is is not my favorite song, Um, but you know, like, it, it, it did what it did and it, it's, it's a great, it's a great pop tune. And, and I, you know, when I saw him last time, the last show I saw of is, you know, he kinda, he brought it back and he just said, um, you know, this song is kind of fill out a favor for me. And, and now it's, you know, I realize it's, it's, uh, but, and he brought it back and played it and, um, you know, but, but it's, it's funny that, um, but's how he was, was known for. But like, yeah, if you're, if you're going to the live shows or if you're listening to the, if you're downloading the tracks online, you know, the, the bootlegs and, and stuff like that, you're hearing this guy who is, is clearly is, is holding back on his records and really in, in, in realizing, in, in hindsight, um, and kinda looking at the, at his Kellogg, it's, it's the benefit of his songs. You know, he, he values the songs more than, more than impressing you with his guitar skills, which is what, which is what makes them lasting. I think, um, you know, it would be easy for him to throw a, a crazy guitar solo here and there and, but it, but it wouldn't, it wouldn't serve the song. It makes more sense to, to make that, that song, you know, stand on its own and then, and to be able to, to, uh, embellish upon it live. So, so around that first album, he's like 24, 25, 23, around that age. And he's showing just a lot of, of restraint and self-discipline on, on knowing that he can play that stuff and just, and not doing it. Um, that takes a lot, you know, that takes a lot of maturity, you know, like there, um, you know, and there's other ways where he wasn't as mature as that, but that, to me, that shows a, uh, just, just a really, um, a good understanding of what he wants to accomplish and what it takes to get there and being willing to, to hold back and to, and just to be patient and, um, to do the right thing for, for
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Mike, you're, you're taking the words right outta my mouth. You're my, my brother from another mother. Yeah. I, I, I, I mean, I had that in my notes too. If you listen to his recent interview with Rick Rubin or if you just, you know, know anything about him personally, he's got a bit of an ego. Like he's, he thinks highly of himself, but he's also smart enough and poised enough and like enough of a master craftsman that exactly what you just said. Like, he has restraint in his music and he, his, his guitar playing, his singing is always there to serve the song and to serve the recording. And, um, I think that's pretty admirable. He, he knows what he is, he knows what his limits are, and he doesn't have to, he doesn't always have to overpower you with his guitar playing or even like, I think even after his first record, I like, I, his first record is my favorite, but after room for squares, he even started to limit like his, um, his lyric writing where he would, he wouldn't try to be as clever in his lyrics for the same reason. Like, he just like, well, I don't need to, I don't need to like, wow people with my, you know, verbal wordplay. And I think that's, that's to his credit, that he like recognizes that that is in him where like he's the sort of guy that would want to and probably could overpower you with his, you know, uh, genius lyrical pursuits. And so I think you just nailed it with that comment.
Track 1:Hmm. Yeah.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:okay. So, but a lot of people are listening to this. They're like, Hey, why are you talking about John Mayer? Um, you know, you're not talking about like Ed Sheeran or Coldplay or, um, I don't know, name your name, your Jack Johnson. Like what, what makes Mayer different than Some of the people he's associated with in maybe the same genre, like why is he not just another adult contemporary artist? Or, um, another one of these names, like if you're in the grocery store and, and you hear your body's a wonderland on a playlist, you're also gonna hear col by the way, I like Coldplay. But they've, they, they, they've also kind of fallen off, but why are you gonna hear him next to train, for example?
Track 1:Yeah. You know, and I, I think a lot of those peers are, are great. I mean, Jack Johnson, you know, basically created a whole sub genre of music and, and his Kellogg's great. And the vibe is, is awesome. And, you know, so, and I, I appreciate all that stuff and I just, it's just different, you know, and I, I guess, I don't know Ed Sheeran that well. I, I, although I've seen some videos in He's got a phenomenal voice and, and just is, is able to craft these, these songs that are obviously just perfect. but I just, I just think it's, it just feels different. Like, I mean, John Mayer does feel like a once in generation type talent, like you mentioned. Like he's the, you know, the last guitar hero. I mean, um, he's, uh, he's clearly one of the best guitars in the world and, or I guess that's subjective, but I would say greatest for sure. Like how could he not be the greatest? He, he's extremely technically talented. He's, um, he's in demand. He, he's huge. I mean, he can, he can, you know, go on tour every year and sell out, uh, arenas two nights in a row sometimes. And so he's clearly one of the greatest guitar living guitarists. He's, he's in demand from his, his peers to play on their, on their songs. You know, everyone would love to have John sit in on a song and play guitar tracks and, um, you know, and, and the generation below him, um, he sits in with them too, and, And, uh, and then his, his heroes, you know, he, he is, he, he is on their speed dials. I, I think it's a, just feel like a bit of a different thing. He, it really feels to me like he's transcended the, the, the singer songwriter genre. It's like he's cemented in music now where, you know, anything, anything he does will be good or great or at least interesting and, and, uh, it, it is just feels different than a lot of the other bands.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:well, he's admired by the best guitar players. So, I mean, if, if Eric Clapton is saying he's the best guitar player of his generation and he admires him, like, I mean, that sort of says it all. And that's, and that's echoed by, um, the, uh, you know, like the buddy guys of the world. He's played with everybody. And I have to say, I want to hear your, your thoughts on this.'cause I have not gotten into the Grateful Dead stuff yet. Um, I, I've tried, I have a couple of Grateful Dead vinyl records that when I was trying to be cool, like in college, I would try to get into it. I just never could. Like, it's, it's one of my blind spots. But I have a friend who is, has been a deadhead forever and he swears by the work of John Mayer, which is really interesting. You would think these diehard fans would be skeptical of him, but I think he's won them over. I think that's a big deal. I mean, I think that has made him relevant to a new generation and he's like the only guitar player that could possibly have done that. And, and channeled, um, I guess Jerry Garcia, right? Is he the Jerry Garcia in the Dead?
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah. Essentially. Yeah. You know, and I agree, and you know, I've I've said, actually, my, my brother quoted me on this, reminded me, I said it and gave me credit for it. But I, he, you know, John Mayer, it's like he's the only person I can see who could get into the Grateful Dead later in life. You know, he wasn't always a fan, but he got into them a little bit later. and then he got into the Grateful Dead. I mean, it's, it's pretty, it's remarkable that, um, you know, in a sense, like you obviously some members, uh, Phil West wasn't in the band, but Dead and Company Wa was as close as you can get to a reunion of Grateful Dead. And it wasn't just a one-off, it, it, uh, it went on for eight years. Um, you know, certainly he, he, uh, people were very skeptical at first, and, uh, but I guess I'll tell you kinda my, my story. So I like the Grateful Dead since I was a kid. Um, I've, I was a fan probably when I was 13. Um, you know, I'm the oldest kid in my family, but my, some of my friends had older brothers, and so they were kind of the ones who introduced me, um, to music, you know, the, the Beatles and Bob Marley and stuff. I, I just wouldn't have ever really found on my own. And one of those bands was Grateful Dead. Which I really liked a lot and, you know, and, and just, you know, listen to their albums over the years. But, but I guess I wasn't really a deadhead. I just, I liked the Grateful Dead and I liked, I liked the songs and I always appreciated them, um, from that standpoint. And then, um, but, but, so that was before I became a John Mayer fan. John Mayer was a, was not even playing. So then later I became a John Mayer fan, a big John Mayer fan. And, and then somehow miraculously, um, they joined Forces and I got, you know, John Mayer was gonna play with, with the Grateful Dead and play the songs I knew, right? So I'm like, oh my gosh, like, this is gonna be awesome. And I just kind of started to get, get back in the Grateful Dead and, and, uh, and so my wife and I went to the, on that first, actually, I guess it was the, the second tour in 2016. Saw them play. And I, I was like, I'm gonna know this. It's gonna be awesome. I'm gonna fit right in. And the craziest thing, so I actually, I did fit in. Everyone was very nice. And it was just a fun crowd and just the coolest vibe at the show. but I was shocked that I barely knew the songs. I was like, what the heck? I, I thought I knew every grief for that song, or most of them. And I guess the difference was, I just, I wasn't a deadhead. I, I knew a lot of their songs, but I, I, um, so anyway, John Mayer though, because of bringing me to that show and of set me on a journey and I was like, okay, I, I do love the Grateful Dead, but I wanted to understand what I'm missing here. And so the next year I just really committed to, to taking a deep dive into the catalog and listening to lots of live stuff, which I hadn't, hadn't really listened to before. And, uh, and then the next time my wife and I saw them the following year, um, we both knew every single song. And so it was, and it was like a dream set, and it was just amazing. So we, we went from being Grateful Dead fans and, and, but not knowing the songs of the show somehow to going the next show and knowing everything and kind of, um, just feeling more, um, a part of it. So, and then, you know, for, for the years after that, uh, really from That, that first show on it's been the band that's always my top. Listened to band, you know, by many multiples of the next one. And so he really, so I guess I was a fan of Grateful Dead. I was a, a John, a mayor head, if you will, and then became a deadhead, uh, because of John Mayer.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:it sounds like I need to do that deep dive. Um, one of the themes if I, if I have to try to make a lesson out of this, which why not? Um, one of the themes that I've talked about on the podcast was like, if you're trying to have, um, you know, like a plan for your life or even a financial plan or a plan for your career, you know, one, one way to view that is like, well, great, we'll have, get a great career and. You do that for 30 years and then you can retire. I'm speaking a little tongue in cheek and with like the Jack White stuff we talked about. Well, Jack White has, you know, an array of interests and a diversity of things that he's interested in, but he's sort of always kept those things in his toolbox and he still has like a, um, upholstery studio for example, where he upholster chairs for people and that's still an interest of him. And these things sort of, he revisits these themes throughout his life, always keeping them in his toolbox and always sort of tinkering., And, last week I was at Third Man Records. I had a chance to visit Nashville for the third, for the first time. And, um, it's called Third Man Records. I think it's because of that Graham Green novel. Is there a novel called The Third Man or, um, or, and, and there was a film made about, made about It. But in any case, that was like his favorite book when he was a teenager. And now it's, it's the name of his, uh, his record store. And that was a theme for the White Stripes. Um, and he, uh, he's used those, those things throughout his life. And, and you could say the same thing in some regards with Mayor, where, you know, mayor was always the guitar player. Like he, he became a, a guitar player first, and then he became a singer, and then he became a songwriter. And I think, I remember hearing him in interviews, like on his early records, where he would say, you know, At some point in my life, I would love to just be the guitar player in a band. And I doubt that his vision was, oh, I, I want to be the, the guitar player in the Grateful Dead. In fact, you just said that that wasn't the case. Like he had to become a fan of the Grateful Dead. But, uh, he, you know, he, he sort of like, maybe a little bit entrepreneurial was like open to the opportunity. Maybe it was a little bit, um, like his manager put him up to like, Hey man, you need to repair your image after, like this falling out that you had, um, in, in the public scene. If you're cynical, you could say that, but even if you are cynical, he's done it masterfully you like, like everything that you would wanna see out of John Mayer being in the Grateful Dead. Like he, he's done it master masterfully. So I don't think you, you can be a cynic anymore after, after watching how he's done that. And so, you know, may just like having this vision for his life. Maybe not knowing exactly what the plan's going to be, but sort of open to opportunity and of sort and like being a master of his craft. Now he's the guitar player in a band. Um, and, and, you know, one of the most famous bands in the world. And so, there you go.
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I mean, he just seems to have this natural, um, ability to kind of know where he needs to go. I mean, I, I don't, I, I think, you know, like I, I've at times have said he's like, just like a master marketer of his skills in his brand, but I, I don't mean like in a contrived way. I just think he does have, he has like an instinct of just, you know, I just now need to play with the Grateful Dead members and, and that's just what I have to do. You know, it just, it makes, it doesn't make sense when you think about it before it happened, but then after looking back on, it's like, wow, that's, that was exactly what he should have done,
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Or it's just so contrived, but he's done it. perfectly and you just don't even care because the way, the way he's pulled it off, like sometimes, you know, I'm gonna save this for my caveats, the, the, the contrived piece. But, but Yeah. overall it, it, it's just, it just works. And, okay. So we, we've done the, we've done the, uh, the podcast on Jack White. Um, you've listened to that, you're sort of familiar with some of the ideas there. Um, how, how would you compare Mayor to Jack White, and how does that relate to some of the themes that I tried to pull outta that?
Track 1:Yeah. Well, I think that, you know, you talked about being a craftsman. Um, of course Jack White is, you know, we talked about his, you know, the upholstery business and then all the, the line of creativity all the way through his music. So obviously, um, you know, we're talking about two craftsmen, but, but different, you know, like, I, I think that John Mayer's Craft is, well, first of all, he, his, his songs are obviously different than, than Jack White's. Um, and I, um, I, I love Jack White's songs and, but the, just, it's a different thing. John Mayer is able to have these very, um, well, I guess the irony is, I'm about to say this is that Jack White has the song that probably more people know than John Mayer, which has played in every sports stadium in the country, um, seven Nation Army. So I, I guess, but what, I guess what I'm saying is that John Mayer's a are, are more, John Mayer's more of a, of a pop friendly type of type of song, I guess. But, um, I think John Ray's more of a, of a guitarist though, like the, the guy who's just kind of like available to, to play on with other people. Jack White, obviously a great guitarist, um, but they're a little bit different.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:you know, they're, I don't know if they're, they're probably both about the same age. Um, one of the things I was thinking about, what, to your point that you said earlier with regards to restraint, yeah. Like I. You know, both of them kind of talk about this idea of constraints. So, um, you, you mentioned this with regards to how he's constrained with like his use of guitar on his records. He does it very tastefully. but I've also heard him mention the idea that, you know, in the nineties when he was learning how to play guitar, he, he, it was just him in a room with his guitar. And so like out of pure boredom, he would just like play guitar for hours and that's how he became a master. And he's talked about the fact that there's just so many distractions, like, or so much entertainment for a young teenage boy in their bedroom now that he doesn't necessarily know if that would be the case for him if he were, were coming up now. So I think that's this idea that that constraint allowed him to become sort of a master of his craft. And maybe we've, we've lost that. And so, you know what, what Jack White would talk about is how, um, limiting The white stripes is what made the white stripes. And so Meg White famously sucked at drums, but the fact that she was kind of a primitive drummer gave, you know, that the whole, the rawness to the white stripes, and I, I think the white stripes is his best stuff. Like he without Meg, like Jack White is not as good, um, with sort of better drummers. And I think he, I think he would probably even recognize that. Um, but like the, the whole three, three man thing, the three-legged stool or whatever, he would talk about like every song and has got three elements. So it's like guitar, drums, and vocal or something like that. And by limiting himself to those three things, like he opens himself up to a whole bunch of creativity. So I think both are aware of that idea that, um, constraints, um, constraints help develop creativity and um, they don't do it in the same way, but I think they're both from that sort of analog generation and it comes off.
Track 1:Right. Yeah. Yeah. Agreed. You had mentioned taking risks and being a tinkerer is how you described with Jack White, and I think that's true with, with John Mayer as well. You know, he's done, he's done numerous genres of, of music. Um, he's done lots of different collaborations, you know, standup comedy, um, he, you know, his Instagram show, You know, multiple different, different bands. Um, I think that there was something way back from the day that he had the cruise ship, the aircraft carrier, which I thought was really funny. Um, you know, he is done clothing and watch design. He is, and apparently he's like a, he's like a watch. And I actually have not watched the videos yet, but my buddy was telling me about these videos of him just like talking about watches where he is just a, he's just a watch genius. You know? I don't know what you would call what's, what's like the watch sommelier, like, what do you call those? I don't even know exactly, but, um, apparently he knows everything about watches. yeah. So, and just, so I, I think that having the kind, that broad curiosity has opened him up to, to trying different things and being open to do it. They kind of, it plays into the risk taking thing too.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:so Yeah. the, the tinkering thing, um, I, I dunno, I think, I think Room for Squares is sort of my favorite record still, but I like, I like all the records. Like when SA Rock came out and it was, you know, like the eighties vibe, um, or like 1990s Eric Clapton vibe, or, um, I like that too, I think. But I think his best records are the ones that are more constrained. Um, when, you know, room for Squares was recorded in a very bare bones way. Like I think he played all the instruments besides drums. Um, continuum is very, it's pretty constrained. Like it's basically the John May trio. And then, um, I think I would say maybe, um, born and Raised is my other favorite, where that's like, you know, him with a, a very much acoustic guitar, um, in, on a lot of the tracks. And so those are three different genres that I think he, he killed it on. And, um, maybe both of them are more of the constrained records. Not quite as produced, if you will. Um, but Yeah. he's done a whole bunch of different stuff and he's, he's sort of generalist too where he, he, he mixes a bunch of stuff together and it's a lot of his own thing.
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah. You know, it is, it is crazy how he, uh, so he can play a show where he'll, he'll play by himself, you know, acoustic guitar, singer songwriter type stuff, then play as a, a blues trio and then plays APS band, and it all happens in the same span of three hours. You know, it's, it is pretty. Uh, so there's, there's, there's a, a really broad, um, swath of, of genres he covering there and ways of delivering that, that music. Um, It's, it's, uh, I haven't really seen many people do be able to, I dunno if they, most people can't and don't and won't. Um, but it's, it is very unique and, and he just did his, um, I didn't go to this tour unfortunately, but he did his arena tour of just himself. I mean, like, who can do that? Like, you know, 20 plus years after they started just, you know, um, playing their entire catalog and, and oftentimes just playing based on a sign that someone wrote out and requested a song. And then just jumping into that song and pretty, pretty amazing. And songs that just do not even lend themselves to acoustic guitar, really the way they're known, the way they're produced on the record. Um, then being able to, to just play them and then reinterpret them as a, as a solo act and I guess speaks to his really, his early days and how he really built his chops and, um, and just has that, that ability and, um, you know, retain that. And so I was able to, to then bust it out 20 years later
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:I've had Ryan O'Connor on this podcast who is a really brilliant hedge fund manager, and, um, the reason why I bring him up is he has this terminology that he calls weaponized nostalgia, where it's all about how, um, you can monetize basically stuff that you're nostalgic for. So, for example, um, you know, Disney famously is monetizing every piece of IP that they could possibly have. They're overdoing it, um, right? They're, they're, they're doing it too much. They're monetizing Star Wars and, um, Marvel and all these pieces of ip. Anyway, he calls it weaponized Nostalgia. You see, um, music artists do this all the time. You know, like when you put out the greatest hits record or when you go on your tour, which is just your, your Greatest Hits tour. Um, it's, you know, hugely popular. Like, you know, Bruce Springsteen, his tours are still, um, they're still a huge deal and his best work hasn't come out in decades. Um, but it's a nostalgia, it's a greatest hits. It's a nostalgia tour. And I was a little worried about MA's solo tour'cause I was like, oh no. Does this mean like we've we've reached Apex, John Mayer and he's now no longer gonna be creating. But that actually wasn't my impression. I didn't, I didn't go to the tour, but I, my impression was yes, he, he wanted to reward the fans. It was a little bit of a nostalgia tour, but he was also playing new music. He was also just doing weird stuff that we've never seen him do before or playing tracks that he hasn't played in years. And so I wasn't, um, I'm not as worried, I think, I think there's still more mayor left to come,
Track 1:yeah, yeah, for sure. I mean, I, um, my, my buddy went to that, that show or that, you know, on that tour. I didn't go. But, uh, yeah, I, I do, I I like what you're saying. And, uh, I do think it's different with him. I think, you know, he, uh, I, I don't think he's done, I think he's got, got more, more in him. I'm not exactly sure what it's gonna be. I got some my, some ideas of what I'd like to see, but, um, you know, I, I, and, but I guess really at the end of the day, like he's just so good and it's like, I don't even want to say what I'd like to see.'cause I wouldn't have I never in a million years would've said, oh, he is gonna play with dead, or, you know, form a band called Dead and Company and just, uh, I would've never guessed that and I would've never said he should do that. And so, what do I know? I just, I guess I should just not, not, not, uh, give him ideas or not presume to be able to give him ideas.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:I mentioned my, I think my favorite albums. Uh, I've got Room for Squares, number one. Um, and then continuum number two, and then maybe born and raised, there's number three. Um, how would you break that down if you had to kinda list your essential John May albums?
Track 1:Yeah, well, you know, I guess, you know, continuum is, is definitely wide, I think widely recognized as as best, I think for good reason. You know, I agree in a lot of ways with that. Um, you know, the whole production's Amazing Vultures is like, is really just an all time banger. Um, I just think it's gonna be cool for like the rest of time. you know, and I think Neo Gravity and Stop This Train are like, are just songwriter career highlights. I think if you, if you wrote one of those songs, let alone two of them, let alone on the same record, you basically could just retire. Um,'cause it's just, it. Those are, are phenomenal I think. Um, but having said that, I, I think probably My personal favorite is Born and Raised, and actually it's my wife's too, it turns out. Um, I just, I something about that one as, as the full album. I just really, really like, um, there's a lot, there's some interesting stuff, but also it has a, it has that kind of country feel. It's kind of the same, like I, my, my favorite rule in Stones record is, is Beggar's Banquet. And I think I just like the kind of that, that country, uh, feel, but with a band who's not a country band. And so I think, I think that, you know, so yeah, I think Born and Raised would be a personal favorite. Uh, heavier Things is probably next, actually. Um, there's some moments on heavier things that are pretty amazing. Um, you know, clarity is still one of my, one of my favorite songs. Um, in fact, you and you'd mentioned hearing a song in a, in a grocery store, I think earlier. Um, I, I hear clarity in grocery stores and I'm still just amazed because, um, first of all, it's 20 years old. And, um, and, and second of all, like the word clarity is never even mentioned in the song. So it's like no one even knows the name. I feel like, or I feel like most people probably don't know the name of that song. Um, there's not like a dis there's not like a thing where you're like, oh yeah, that's your buddy is a wonderland. Of course.'cause these sings, your body is a wonderland. And the chorus, um, clarity is different. And I just, it, it, it feels like it's ubiquitous still and
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Yeah, there's the ho, there's the horns in that. And I remember when that came out, I was like a little, my first, when I first listened to heavier or heavier things, I was a little disappointed'cause I was like, oh, this is overproduced. He should have kept it somewhat minimal. And um, you know, like Roomer Square sounded like a guy in his bedroom recording on Um, you know, an eight track player or something. Whereas heavier things you can tell, oh great. Now he's got all of the bells and whistles of like a big studio production. However, um, the horns like then you, you saw, you saw the horns show up in his live show and that was really cool how there was a pop record that had, um, Those horns on it. And, um, Yeah. that's such a unique track. That's a good call on that. Um, I think on, um, on Born and Raised, is Walt Grace submarine test 1967 on that one? I think so.
Track 1:Yeah.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:tried to shoehorn that into an episode one time where my, it was my soapbox about how people shouldn't retire.'cause why would you, why would you wanna put yourself out to pasture? And my, my little, um, anecdote there was how Walt Grace, um, he built a summary as when he got older, which is pretty, and it made it to Japan. So there you go. That's what everyone should do in retirement.
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah. No, I like that. Yeah. I love that song and I, I enjoyed your analysis of it. That was
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Um, so you mentioned a couple of tracks. I, I, I, um, I. I wanna highlight a few tracks too, and then if I have some time, I'll pull up the actual clips and I'll, I'll put'em in the podcast. But, um, a couple of things I wanna highlight, because I think if, if you wanna get to the point where me and Mike are, where, um, you're just waxing poetic about John Mayer, um, you, you gotta go into the deep cuts, which is his best stuff, in my opinion. Um, and I, I don't think that's a hot take. Um, and I don't even think that's me being like a cool guy, indie, you know, I, I think really it's just literally his best stuff are his, his album tracks, like the non, the Nons singles, even though you mentioned Clarity, which is a, which is a great song. But, um, I think Three by Five might be my, one of my Desert Island tracks. Um, really fun to play on the guitar by the way. and, um, I was like, Mike, hey, should we play guitar on this podcast? And you're like, ah, I haven't practiced in a while, so, so we're not gonna do that today. But, but a three by five actually, uh, prefigured Instagram culture, he's talking about like an like a three by five photo. The kids don't even know what I'm talking about, but he's talking about how, you know, you should have seen that sunrise with your own eyes. And, um, I mean now that's, he's just literally skewering Instagram culture. So that's a, a beautiful song musically. And then, and lyrically it's really good St. Patrick's Day is one of my favorites. And um, it's just really cool. Like, it's got over 20 chord changes. It literally sounds like the Christmas season and, um, it's sort of like one, You know, his humor's coming out in, in that track. And, um, I would play that if I could actually remember how. But, um, it's got too many core changes. And then the other one,
Track 1:You know, that one really highlights the cleverness too. Sorry to interrupt you. The cleverness, the, the, the, um, just his clever, I mean, he, he ends, uh, his first album with that song. And for, you know, like you, no one writes a song about St. Patrick's Day, but he got to have a song called St. Patrick's Day because it, it just, it fits into the narrative of the song. It's not about that, but it's just, it just seems to be like so clever to have a song named that after a, after a holiday, you'd never write a song about. But it's, it just, it fits into the lyrics and it's very clever, I think. And just in beautiful sounding, like you said.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:And then the other one that I would send people, oh, you know what? I didn't put any of his like electric guitar work on here. That's okay. I'm just gonna go with what I, what I had written down. Um, LA's La Song or in your atmosphere? I think, I don't remember which one it actually is called, but it's one of those two LA song or in your atmosphere? Um, he. The studio, well, there is no studio version, but there's a, it was on the live, um, uh, the live record that he did, which the name is now escaping me at the moment.
Track 1:Yeah. Where the light is.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Where the light is. And, uh, it just shows his, uh, acoustic guitar playing skills and, uh, super cool sk song. I wanna highlight that because some of his stuff is like sort of esoteric and it's not a conventional pop song. And, um, you know, sometimes I'm like, oh, I wish he would do like a whole record of these more esoteric, um, pop songs that are, that are necessarily a conventional form. And that one is, uh, is great and, um, it's clever too in, in the same way that St. Patrick's Day is. So, those are my highlights. Mike, what do you got?
Track 1:Yeah. You know, and actually I love in your atmosphere too, I call it, in your atmosphere, I think on the album, that's what he calls it. Uh, so the, the show, the first show I ever saw of his, as it turns out, um, was in Santa Barbara in 2002, and he played that song for the first time. That was the debut of that song. Um, and I've, so I've always just loved that song. So it's cool that you highlighted that one too. Um, just, just a really unique guitar part and, uh, yeah, I just, it's a really cool song and I'm really happy that it got, Uh, uh, a good recording to be able to listen to.'cause you know, before that I was just kind of like bootlegs and stuff, but yeah, I never made it to an album. Or maybe it will someday, you know?
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:I remember I remember re like hearing somewhere, he said like, in my estate plan, I have a law, a rule that you can't release the unreleased tracks. Like he's that much of a perfectionist with his, with his, with his albums. And so I think I'm, I think I remember thinking, oh, there's never gonna be an in your atmosphere. Um, and I think he was, it was right. of him to make it a live version'cause that, that song is, is great live. But, um, unlike, you know, like our friend Ryan Adams, for example, who's just released everything he has possibly, ever, recorded at this point. He's, he's probably overdone it. Um, actually, maybe not. Maybe there's probably more Ryan Adams stuff that we would still love to hear. Um, but Yeah. Mike, what other what other songs do you wanna highlight?
Track 1:Let's see. Um, well, you know, so I always go back to Covered and Rain And, and it turns out, so he actually played that the first show I saw and the last show I saw of his. So like, you know, 17 years apart, I got to hear that song Live. And then that song, you know, obviously is a recording exists on his first concert film, uh, any given Thursday, which I just think, you know, that guitar solo is just so brilliant and so awesome. And, uh, gosh, I mean it, and it's, it's blistering and it has, it has multiple movements. I mean, it, it's, it starts off rowdy, calms down, he even sits down and it gets quiet and then, then just explodes into, into the crescendo and he jumps back up during that, that film. And, uh, man, I just, I love that that song gives me goosebumps to that, that
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:know what, and uh, lemme just mention one thing there, you know, this, but for the, for the benefit of the listeners, I think he wrote that, Um, living in New York City as like a response to the feeling there thereafter. Nine 11. yeah. Sent or covered in rain. That's the metaphor. And in retrospect, I mean, that's aged well because like he didn't do, um, like a Toby Keith song or something like that. Like he just said, like, no, this was just my experience of the feeling of living in New York City and the sadness after nine 11. So, um, I guess we are, we're all, we're, we're tying all the threads together here, Mike, with regards to, uh, nine 11
Track 1:Right. Yeah. You know, and actually, and so, and that song too. Yeah. So I, I've read that and it's, it's a continuation of, of the Song City Love. And in fact, when I saw him, the, the first time that he played both back to back, so he played, he played City Love, and it went into Covered Rain. I went back and looked at the set list and, and that's what had happened. And, and so yeah, it, it's kind of the continuation of that story where City love is It's very, uh, optimistic and, and uh, and, um, you know, bright-eyed and then, and then covered and Rain is, is darker and, and like you said, fits in with the kind of the, you know, maybe City Live is the pre nine 11 New York, and then Covered And Rain is the, is the post nine 11 New York. And yeah, so just really interesting, um, you know, uh, music choice that he
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:You're, you're my brother from another mother. I, I knew you knew that. I knew you knew that the cords were the, the bridge of city love. So, um, you, you.
Track 1:Yeah. And yeah, Lydia is in the, in the song, right? So she, in both songs. So,
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:what else do you get? You get anything else you wanna highlight?
Track 1:um, let's see. You know, I, I love, uh, so, so in the film where the light is and, and on the album continuum too, but Belief is just a really standout one for me too. Um, the, the, in the live version, the guitar solo, well, I guess the intro he does on guitar is just amazing. The whole song is awesome. Um, you know, uh, a, um, and to, to tie back into the, the stuff earlier that we were talking about too, with this one, uh, there's a line in there that always, uh, really hit me. He says, uh, what puts a hundred thousand children, children in the sand, a sand belief, can, what puts a folded flag inside his mother's hand belief can. So, um, really heavy and, uh, and yeah, really impactful. And, um, yeah, those lines always stick
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Yeah, that was great. I, um, good, good call there. I, I haven't revisited that in a long time. Um, I, I wanna do, Uh, maybe a final category here because you mentioned city love and, um, if we're gonna do our gripes or our caveats, I think the thing that I would say for what I wanna see out of, out of John at this point in his career is like, I'm having a harder time relating to the songs as like a happily married guy with three kids. And, um, I know this is like, sort of famously the death of a lot of artists, like when they try to do like their Happily married album, like it doesn't always work. But like I can listen to City love and um, I think about my wife or I can listen to, um, what's the one that's like, it's a Friday. I finally made it, um, love on the weekend. I was like, there we go. This is, this is me and my wife. Um, however, like, um, there's a really cool track on, um, his last album. Uh, what's the last track on? So Rock, it's called, I just had this in my head. not you're gonna live Forever In Me, but sort of, um,
Track 1:let's see. I can look it up real quick. Um,
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:all I Want is to be with you
Track 1:I want is to
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:cool track. I can, I can no longer relate to this. Like I just, I just enjoy it as what it, for what it is, but like, it doesn't have the emotional hef that maybe it would have years ago. Um, so what I, I would love to see outta John is, is there a way for him to move? Because, because it's hard to separate. Like he's obviously writing about personal experiences. is there a way for him to enter into the dad phase and incorporate that into his music so that I can appreciate some of these things in the, in a sort of an emotionally gratifying way, in the same way that I would have maybe when I was single? What do you think Mike? Am
Track 1:Yeah. I,
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:much?
Track 1:yeah, I, I, well, I mean, I, uh, that would be cool and I, I hope that for him and, you know, he, um, it's hard, you know, part of, uh, part of me does wonder, it's like, is the, and actually part of my own experience too, is that heartache produces a lot of, a lot of good art. And so probably the stuff that I had written that I still would be the most proud of in the past, I, I play guitar and sang back in the day, another lifetime ago, it feels like, but, um, was inspired by heartache. And so I don't, I don't know, I, I, I do wonder if, if being content and happy, it makes it more difficult. I, I'm sure if anyone could do it, John could, um, Uh, you know, like you'll, Walt Grace's example of a song that's not about a heartache, it's about, it's a story. And I'm sure you could do more like that. Um, yeah. Or even, even just put yourself in the shoes of someone in heartache, even if you're not, you know, upset at the time. So that's possible. Um, yeah, I, I think it, it'd be cool for, for John Mayer to, um, to have to experience that, you know, the, the, the happy, you know, happily Married Dad life. Um, I, I think I'm, I consider myself there too. And, um, you know, I, I, yeah, I, uh, I, I, I would, you know, as someone who who does, I feel like, you know, I'm not like a celebrity guy, but like with John Mayer, I do kinda feel like a, someone I just want the best for, and I do kinda care about what happens to him. And so, yeah, I, for his own, for, I would think that would be really cool for him. So,
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:I, if I'm, if John's listening to this, um, you know, maybe he is uh, I would say, John, let's get your people To connect with Jerry Seinfeld's, people who maybe he probably knows Jerry Seinfeld, who's a, a good corollary. Um, Jerry Seinfeld was like famously single for a long time. I think he had some weird thing where he was like in his thirties dating some like 17 year old or something like that. Everyone loves Jerry Seinfeld. Just like everyone loves John Mayer. And look, Jerry Seinfeld is now happily married. He's got kids. He talks about it in his, uh, standup now. And, um, and that's a good, a good model for maybe what we could see out of, out of John. to your point though, I think about this, um, there's a, a Ray Lamont song, which is called, we'll Make It Through And, um, And this is sort of what you could think of, could be the model musically. It's like, it is, comes from a, a place of pain, but it's like we will make it through. I think he's talking, he's probably talking about his, uh, relationship with his wife and, um, and So, there it's, you've got a little bit of both. You've got sort of like the real experience of going through stuff with your, with the love of your life. And, but you're saying we'll make it through despite the pain. And, um, and so I think Ray Lamont, although um, you know, he's not John Mayer, but he's done a few, a few good things. It's Ray LaMonte.
Track 1:Mm. Right.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:So that's what I would say for John. That's what I wanna see, see outta John. And, uh, he doesn't owe it to me'cause he's already done. Uh, he's already done plenty. But, um, but yeah, I think that's, uh, in terms of what I would like to see outta John in the, in the next stage, that would be, uh, yeah, make a dad record, make, make your Springsteen tunnel of love. What do you got, Mike?
Track 1:Yeah, it is funny. I have actually a coffee mug and it says, um, it says SOB Rock is Dad Rock, I think is what it says, Um, but my, my wife had bought it for me back when that album came out. Um, yeah. But, uh, you know, I think so from, from John Mayer. Um, Gosh. It's like I, and I just, I love the guy and I appreciate what he is done. And so I, I feel presumptuous, but you know, like, Hey, I'll, I'll, I'll give you some ideas. I wanna see another concert film. Um, I think he's due, I think, you know, like, so he has in the game on Thursday, uh, from two, uh, uh, what was that? 2002? In 2003, he has where the light is, uh, which was 2008, I think. Lemme look at my note here. But, you know, so, so we're due, you know, uh, it'd be cool to have a proper, a proper concert film kind of now with this whole catalog, uh, for the, you know, for the picking. Um, and, uh, or, or even like a, I don't know, like a, a little mini series and like a, like on Netflix or something, just kind of about his, the tour life or the, or the recording process or something. You know, like something like that would be cool to see. Um, I think, I think John Mayer's just a, a compelling person to watch. I think, you know, not only, we've talked about the, the music, obviously that's his, his bread and butter, but he, he's a, he's a funny guy too. He is an interesting guy and a thoughtful person. And, um, you know, like I, I enjoyed watching the episode of, of Hot Ones, you know, where he is eating hot wings and, you know, have you seen that?
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:of course. Yeah.
Track 1:Yeah. And he's, and he's just, he's a master. Like he, I he's somewhat able to be, he just decides he's gonna do that. And he is, he is really good at it. And he has a conversation while eating these, these hot wings. I, I couldn't do that. I mean, it's, anyway, he's, yeah, and he has a funny joke in there where he says, um, he says, is this, is it considered doping that I took an anac acid, an antacid before the show? Um, so that was funny. But, uh, yeah, so I think that it would be cool to see him do something like, like that, um, And, uh, yeah, like, yeah. Proper documentary film or mini series. Um, and then I'd love to see more Grateful Dead somehow. And I, I just, I, I kind of, I hope he's gonna always keep a foot in that camp. I, I, I expect he will. You know what happened over the course of the last eight years, um, that run with De and Company, it was so special and successful. I mean, it, it is crazy'cause it, it was, it was huge. They were one of the biggest touring acts in the country for, for many years there. Um, it, it seems to be like a deep part of who he is now. I don't, I don't think you, you, you step into that world and, uh, and, and learn that whole catalog and, and play it and, you know, experience millions of people together with you. I don't think that, um, that goes away. And so I expect there to be something else. I'm not exactly sure what it's gonna look like. And, um, but there's gotta be something.'cause you know, that was a really special thing, um, for so many people. Uh, who, who became John Mayer fans who became Deadheads. And, uh, and I, I think that, yeah, I just, I I gotta believe that there's something else there too. So, um, we'll see. And if nothing else, I mean, he, he has the song like, uh, last, the last concert I saw him play solo, his, his own concert. Um, he, he, he played, um, uh, queen of California and then transitioned into Fire on the Mountain by Grateful Dead, which was so cool. I mean, it was just, it was cool to hear him play a Grateful Dead song in the context of his own show. And then you and I, I was actually, I was wearing my Grateful Dead shirt at that concert, and I looked around and I see other, other guys wearing their Grateful Dead shirt, and we had like a moment together. And I, I, I then it's funny, I, I walked to the bathroom after that concert or after that song'cause it, the set ended, um, and I like was given hugs and high fives to all the deadheads there. And so, yeah, I, I think that's a, that's just a special part of I. Of him now. That's, um, yeah, I'm looking forward to seeing, uh, how that turns up and other outlets for him
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:I, I agree,
Track 1:and yeah,
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Sorry, did you have one more thing you wanted to add?
Track 1:no, that, I think that's about it. Um, yeah,
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:good. Um, you know, we didn't get into it, but, um, I guess maybe my last question question, Mike, is, you know, is John Mar into Bitcoin?
Track 1:I hope so. And I, he seems like the kind of guy who, who, who would be, and just, you know, and just wouldn't talk about it, you know, kinda like he stays, he stays outta politics, you know, he is, he's mentioned a couple things in songs, but he doesn't talk about politics and so he, he just kind of focuses on, well, I, I guess that's funny that I'm saying that'cause he is been known as having a big mouth and talking about lots of stuff out of his lane. Um, but I think that he's, he's changed over the past decade and doesn't really do that as much, um, seems to, to stay on on his, um, what he knows
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:he's smart. He doesn't,
Track 1:known for.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:not outing himself as a coiner. That's very smart. So, yeah, he's probably into
Track 1:so, yeah. Right. He probably is. Yeah.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Mike, this was great. Um, yeah, we could, I mean, I love the way you're thinking about this. Um, I love where your head's at. Maybe we should do, maybe we should take this in some different directions on another podcast. But, um, yeah man, thanks for joining. Um, this is really, really interesting and, um, I'm glad I found the one person in the world that I could see eye to eye on this exact issue. And, um, so I appreciate you reaching out and, um, yeah. Where would you have people, um, connect with you if they wanna reach out about John Mayer or the anti-war movement, um, or Mike Marmion.
Track 1:Well, you, so I still am working on, on a, a personal website. I've gotten, you know, on Twitter, um, I, I kind of recently made an account. I, I haven't been too active on that, but I do have a, an at Michael c Marion on Twitter. So if you wanna add me there, um, and get me more involved, I, I've been kind of preoccupied, I feel like, distracted by just, you know, in a good way, uh, family stuff. But I do want it to be a little more active on, on Twitter. Um, yeah, so I think that's the main thing. You know, I recently started a, a company, uh, called Senior Life Advisors, and so we're helping people in a challenging, uh, point in their life as they're getting older. And so, um, yeah. And then, yeah.
andy_1_08-17-2023_111241:Well, good, Mike. Appreciate it, man. Great stuff.
Track 1:Awesome. Thanks Andy. It was fun.