I have a wonderful conversation with fellow Financial Advisor, Isaiah Douglass. We discuss:
Episode page: www.simplewealthkc.com/post/the-freedom-to-have-an-opinion-isaiah-douglass
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Andy Flattery is the Owner of Simple Wealth Planning, a Registered Investment Advisor. All opinions expressed by Andy and guests are solely their own opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Simple Wealth Planning. This podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only and should not be relied upon as investment, tax, or legal advice. Clients of Simple Wealth Planning may maintain positions in bitcoin and the securities discussed in this podcast.
I have a wonderful conversation with fellow Financial Advisor, Isaiah Douglass. We discuss:
Episode page: www.simplewealthkc.com/post/the-freedom-to-have-an-opinion-isaiah-douglass
Get the essential list of The Reformed Financial Advisor episodes
Follow Andy Flattery on Twitter
Send an email to andy@simplewealthkc.com
Andy Flattery is the Owner of Simple Wealth Planning, a Registered Investment Advisor. All opinions expressed by Andy and guests are solely their own opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Simple Wealth Planning. This podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only and should not be relied upon as investment, tax, or legal advice. Clients of Simple Wealth Planning may maintain positions in bitcoin and the securities discussed in this podcast.
Isaiah, thank you for joining the Reform Financial Advisor Podcast. How are you?
Isaiah:I am great. Uh, it's an honor to be here. I know you've had some, uh, awesome guests, so excited to, to chat.
Andy:Oh, yeah. Oh yeah. Who do you wanna talk up? Is there somebody in particular that you're, you're, thinking about?
Isaiah:I'm a big, I'm a big fan of Trent, uh, dude Hoffer. I know he's been on here. So big, big Trent fan. Um, there's been. The episode that you did where you broke down Peter Malu and I'm, I'm trying to remember, didn't you have a guest with that or is that just you?
Andy:Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was a guy that goes by an anon on Twitter, um, that had, that does the Value Stack podcast. Um, but we're gonna have to get Trent back on to do, uh, Peter Malu round two, um, because Trent is gonna go work for Peter. And, um, and I told him that that's gonna have to be his mission now is to get Peter on the podcast with maybe all three of us. So, um, Yeah,
Isaiah:I will put pressure on him. We'll make it
Andy:yeah,.Well, cool, man. So I, I got a few things I want I want to chat with you about, but I think first and foremost is like you and I met through the Metaverse, essentially like we've never met in person. Um, I went on your show. And, uh, we have connected on Twitter and I've like consumed a bunch of your material, for lack of a better word. I've, I've read your stuff. I've listened to your podcast for a while now. and, uh, you know, like with Morgan Rashard, we've got like the Bitcoin Financial Advisors Network. And the reason why I'm bringing all this stuff up is like, um, I, I feel like you are somebody that I admire for sort of putting your work out there. Trying different things with regards to the tools that are out there on the internet. This is like, you know, when I, when I launched an r i a, this was like a brave new world for me because I worked for like a broker dealer where it was not possible before. But I was wondering if you could maybe just open and just share a little bit about your experience, like what that's been like for you, what, what your strategy has been over the years, and so how do you, how do you view putting your work out there in Online with regards to podcast writing Twitter, you make good use of, um, man. Tell, tell me, tell me about the inner workings here.
Isaiah:Yeah. Someone the other day was like, oh, you know, you just have so much stuff. It like looks great. You're like, put together. I'm like, man, if only you knew behind the scenes. It's like, I, it's really not, there's not, you know, someone that is, you know, fully flushed out with like, here's the strategy, here's the plan. And it's, you know, perfect. And I know some people that have like very Specific dedicated times, that's not me. Right. And so I worked at Merrill Lynch, B of a, and similar to you, you know, it was one of those things where you can do whatever you want as long as it's, you know, firm approved, very bland and boring. Didn't really fit for me. And I knew early on in my late twenties this wasn't where I was gonna be forever. And so I launched an r i A in 2018 solo as a, a young guy, um, dedicated to kind of speaking to those within veterinary medicine and dentistry. Merged with a business partner in 2020. I have now exited in the process of exiting that r i a. And so I work at actually in, in Bitcoin now First Swan, Bitcoin and their private client team. And so what I have done always historically, has been finding a way to be consistent with content that I liked. And I've written for the Bitcoin Financial Advisor network. And you've seen it pre, um, getting cleaned up. It's not the best, like I'll be very candid. I am not a naturally gifted writer. and it takes a little bit of help from, you know, some edits, some, some revisions to make it work. The one thing that I was able to do and do consistently was much more of like a podcast format, so being able to talk, like I've always enjoyed conversation. I've never been one that loves like real surface level fake stuff. And so it's like how do you get into conversations and dialogues with people to unpack interesting nuance niche areas? And so I consume a lot of content. Via podcasts. Like that's how I've learned best. And then I've started to do a little bit of video stuff, but I still think just audio is probably the best way for me. And that's what I found. Didn't feel like work, didn't feel like a chore, versus trying to write always felt like a chore. Like, Ugh, what am I gonna do? Versus, Hey, if I needed a podcast episode that I wanted to release on Sunday and it's Saturday night, and I'm like, I don't know what I wanna do. I can think of a really good topic that would be meaningful to listen to and not feel like it was forced and like I had to get it out there. And I think. A lot of times people will struggle with trying to figure out like what's the perfect piece of content, and uh, there's a veterinarian that does an awesome job on social media and she's like, Hey, you have to kind of repeat yourself a ton, especially as you get new followers, because it feels like you're saying the same thing over and over again. But for a lot of people, it's the first time they've heard it. And that's always kind of stuck with me because I. Have made a reputation of talking about, you know, kind of financial advisors, Bitcoin, veterinary medicine, and like those are kind of the three, I guess, things that are interesting to me. This world of RIAs, the world of veterinary medicine and Bitcoin and being able to talk and go into those different worlds has been really fun and interesting. And there are ways where I think Bitcoin connects both of those. And obviously Bitcoin is gonna touch and connect and interact with so many different areas, but. Um, those are two that I'm passionate about of like, I wanna make sure folks that I know in both of those verticals get Bitcoin as best as possible. And to me that's like, that's a, that's a mission from a work perspective that I can get behind and, and have energy for.
Andy:I love it. And you know, a lot of what you see occasionally on online is, people building these platforms maybe for their own sake. Like literally the, the Instagram account or the Twitter account is itself a business, which maybe is the right view. But you know, the beautiful thing about what you and I have done is like, you can build it to sort of support the. Business you have in the real world, which like is a way to sort of supercharge it. So I guess what I'm saying is like, did you see, did, did that bear any fruit for you? Um, you know, like putting your work out there in the world of that result in, you know, new business for you or new connections or like, what were the results of, of, you know, all that content you put out there online?
Isaiah:Yeah, so I would say the, the podcast when I ran the RA was a great kind of pipeline for people that knew who I was, what I was about, what I wanted to talk about. You know, you can kind of self-select for who's interested, and I think that was super helpful. Twitter, I've always used for learning. But oddly enough, as I've just recently, you know, started working with Swan, it definitely helped me, I think, be able to get that role in a, in a world that is very competitive, to find Bitcoin related roles. Um, I never intended it to be, to me it was always a learning, uh, platform. I wanted to learn about Bitcoin. There's lots of content out there. There's lots of people creating things and That's what I always use Twitter for. And just to share thoughts like unfiltered. I'm not trying to, you know, make a best friend on Twitter. And I think there's people that are just jerks to be jerks. And I think there's people that will never hold others accountable. And I wanted to find, you know, some sort of happy middle ground where I'm fine to push people and not always be, you know, the person that's gonna be the nicest person out there because there's things that just don't make sense. And if you have a big following and you're saying dumb stuff, someone should tell you, Hey, you're saying dumb stuff. But at the same You know, point, you don't have to go out and just look for fights all the time. And I think hopefully as I've gotten older, I've realized, you know what? I don't have to respond to everything When people say stupid stuff, um, you gotta pick and choose like, is this worth the energy? Um, has anyone's mind really ever been changed by, you know, the back and forth? And I think I'm still naive in a way where I think that maybe there's some truth to that, but you never know who's lurking that doesn't comment, that might pick up something here or there, because I know I certainly have. Where I've never commented on a thread or commented on when someone's going back and forth, but I've taken, you know, some good pieces away from that or done, you know, kind of my done my own research, which I know is kind of not, uh, it's, I guess it's frowned upon now to, to have an independent thought at times, but I still like to, to look into things. So I would say the platforms have been helpful and sometimes it's not been the way that I thought they would be. And that's been the part that's been fun, where it wasn't intentional to be like, I'm gonna do AB and C and it will get me this. It was more or less, okay, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna put it out there. And I know a lot of people talk about LinkedIn not being great. It had been historically for me, where I've made a lot of good connections and found good podcast guests, people that maybe have never done content. And that's some of my favorite, um, episodes are with people that have never really shared their thoughts or maybe they've never talked about a certain topic. And then being able to share that. And I think that makes it a lot more enjoyable for an audience to be able to like, Hey, I've heard, you know, Andy talk about this a lot, but I've never heard him talk about this other thing, so let's unpack that. And he was a guest on this podcast, like that was really interesting. I.
Andy:Yeah. Agreed. Yeah, I, I've, I've tried to be intentional about not make, not trying to make this podcast just another podcast that has the same guests that you hear on every other podcast, and maybe that's, that's the, the detriment of anybody even knowing that this podcast exists to some degree. But, but yeah, I've used LinkedIn, um, I, uh, I had a coach years ago that encouraged me to use it and I had some success with that, but, What I found is that Twitter was just a lot more enjoyable.
Isaiah:Mm-hmm.
Andy:Like, I just, I just enjoy being on there anyway and find that there's people that are like putting real work out on Twitter, whereas on LinkedIn, you know, it just is, it's always seems so phony. Um, so Twitter is something that I'm, I'm sort of on there regardless of what the fruits of it are. I, I just, I follow people that I enjoy following. And I same, same thing you just said. Like, I, I try to put Very specific things out there that like self-select an audience and, um, and for having a very small audience on Twitter, like even that has resulted in, um, me making sort of real life connections. Like a couple weeks back I had coffee with a guy here in Kansas City that had like 20 followers on Twitter, like just literally a lurker and Uh, two or three years ago, I did a podcast on, um, like using s b A financing to acquire a small business. And this guy did that in, in, like his mid twenties. And it wasn't because, just because of my podcast, like he was already down that rabbit hole too. Um, but he reached out to me on Twitter and he was like, Hey, I listened to this episode you did two years ago. I did it. I'm 26 years old and you know, here, here I am running this multimillion dollar revenue business. And that, that was really cool to make that connection. So he, you know, a lot of the best people on Twitter or listening to these podcasts are way more successful than I am. That's, that's really, really cool. You've probably noticed that as well too.
Isaiah:A hundred percent. And I think sometimes people assume that those that put out a lot of content are instantly like super successful with everything they do. Everything you touch is gold and it's like, no, that's not how it is at all. And sometimes there are people that are just out there, you know, Keeping their head down, working hard, that aren't putting out content. And I said the same thing even in the kind of Bitcoin lens where I think, you know, sometimes Bitcoin, Twitter is just an echo chamber, where it's like, I know people that are creating value and that are old ER than, you know, the typical, you know, Bitcoin I. Uh, person that have a significant amount of exposure to the asset class. And then you'll have, you know, RIAs or financial advisors be like, well, no one over the age of, you know, insert whatever age you want owns Bitcoin. And I'm like, well, I know that's not true because I can think of three or four people that have quite a bit of exposure to Bitcoin that are in that category. And they'll say, you know, things that just don't make any sense. And I'm like, well, that's not actually true.
Andy:Yeah, you, you just started working, as you mentioned with swan and, um, I have to, I mean, I think if you are a C F P that has, you know, taken the orange pill and is in the Bitcoin maximalism lane, that's probably the best place you can land, if not one of the best places. Um, do you credit your presence online? To helping you land that job? Or I guess, how much, how much of your presence online do you think is responsible for you landing that gig?
Isaiah:I think some of it, and I think part of it is I started talking about Bitcoin in the summer of 2020. Um, so fairly early for, uh, an advisor to be public with it, which I think is starting to be normalized more, which is good. I see some people running polls that I like on Twitter that are RA owners that are like, Hey, what kind of content should I put out? And it's like tax savings, you know, investing strategies, Bitcoin, and you know, all these other things. And it's like, I love seeing that and People are starting to, to wake up and, and be more open. I was fairly open early on and I've had a couple, you know, run-ins with more trad five people that will look at tweets. When I tweeted when, you know, Bitcoin was 62,000, and I was like, Hey, it's cheap. And they'll be like, dunking on me when it's, you know, 17, like, Hey, you're so stupid. Um, and it's fine. Like, I don't delete tweets, so I'm not gonna go back and and revise things. Uh, but I do know that there's been a lot of people that have made claims around other, what I call like crypto assets that have then imploded and they delete their tweets, right? And I'm like, Hmm, I've never felt like I needed to go back and delete stuff on Bitcoin because it is a brand that you can attach to. Because honestly, what it is seeking to do is just be like honest, open, transparent money. And so it attracts the right type of people. On average, right? Not everyone in Bitcoin is a good person, and I'm not gonna say that, but I think there's a lot of people that are trying to explore, seek truth, all that. And it allows me to feel comfortable saying, I'm not gonna get myself in trouble by saying this Bitcoin thing is different and I think it's important. And so, yeah, I would say, you know, from a swamp perspective, I didn't say that. Like, Hey, we went back through your tweets. I mean, notice like you weren't, you know, big into all these other things. But one of the questions I did get asked, uh, going through the process was, Hey, talk to me about You know, the, your, your shit coiner or altcoin phase, and I was like, I didn't really have one because I was fortunate enough, I didn't really get into Bitcoin till 2019 and there was a lot of good education out already versus folks that came in in like 20 16, 20 17. It was still earlier and there was still some pain to be had. So there was people that, you know, I was able to learn from and not go down that slippery slope. It's like the worst thing I did, I had, you know, some U s d on block five trying to earn yield for a while, and I learned pretty quickly, eh, this isn't the right decision. I'm just gonna pull that money off. Right. So, you know, that would be the, I guess the worst thing that I, that I did that wasn't pure Bitcoin. Right. So, um,
Andy:Yeah, I imagine I, I don't know. I, I don't, I'm, I'm not all that self-aware, so I don't exactly know. How the broad public views, you know, like what it is that I do. But I imagine that one of the criticisms or the concerns of like an Andy flattery would be like, oh, he's hopping on the latest trend and, and he's trying to use like the thing that's, clickable right now to sort of like latch his brand onto, which I totally understand.'cause I see people do this all the time. Even people that I like, like, uh, do you follow Patrick O'Shaughnessy?
Isaiah:Yep.
Andy:I love him. He's great. Uh, I've been following him forever. I think he does a really, he's got one of the best finance podcasts, but even with him, I notice that, um, the things that he's doing, uh, I think he's trying to get away from it, but like, he'll, the things he's doing are like the topic du jour in investing right now.
Isaiah:Mm-hmm.
Andy:know, whereas like this year he will have more AI people on his podcast. Last year it was web three. The year before that it was, um, I don't know, tokenized economics or something like that. And I noticed, or, or I should say like, uh, holdcos, you know, even when he was really into like the, um, you know, HoldCo sort of model, like the Brent Bishore thing.
Isaiah:Mm-hmm.
Andy:And so my hope is with Bitcoin is like that. The thesis is gonna play out where we're gonna be validated and vindicated, and um, and at least that's my hope. What do you think, Isaiah, is that gonna work out?
Isaiah:Uh, I absolutely think so. And I, I know you're, uh, involved locally in Kansas City with some of the, the Bitcoin meetup scene and just folks talking about it. And I joke, it's like at some point there's not gonna be a, a Bitcoin meetup. There's no one that meets up, talk about dollars, right? Like that, that won't be a thing in the future. So it's great now because it is this niche kind of esoteric asset that a lot of people are still, you know, they've heard of it, but they have no idea anything about bitcoin. And it is one of those things that I don't have to be afraid that I'm gonna wake up and all of a sudden something crazy happened and all these changes are there because people wanted to, to do that. Um, you know, there's not a dao, there's not a, you know, a VC backed pressure to pivot or do something different and change. And that's what allows Bitcoin to be a little bit different, where you can feel comfortable talking about it. And I think if anyone's talked about it, And you still wanna talk about it. You know, you talked about it, let's say in the 2021 when it was running. People are interested, you still talked about it through 2022. I mean, that wasn't an easy thing to talk about. There are people depending on when they bought in, that only really saw it go down. That's not fun conversations for an advisor to have. If you know the, the Bitcoin that someone bought is in the high fifties, and then they basically did a nose dive after that and they're like, well, you know, this Isaiah guy told me this thing was great and all these other things, and it's gone basically straight down. Is this changed And. For me, the big thing I always told everyone is a, the big biggest thing I guess, that I learned is they can't borrow my conviction. They need to learn that. Um, you build trust as a financial advisor. They're gonna take your advice. Hopefully, if they're clients that are good, that are paying for advice, you should take it. And if you think it's bad advice, go find someone else to work with. But ultimately, you can't take the conviction of someone that's done looked at it for years and years and years versus, you know, an hour or a couple hour conversation like we're gonna. Present it to you, talk about it. This is why you should get it. If you wanna outsource all your thinking to us as an advisor, let's say, that's fine. But at the same, in the same main, like if you're gonna allocate to Bitcoin in any size, you have to kind of go down the rabbit hole yourself. And I think there's certain people that have and have been intellectually interested. And it's cool to kind of see that maturation over time that they get it, like they start to get it versus others that they don't really care. And that's okay. But I've told people like, if Bitcoin was$20,000 or$200,000 tomorrow, I'm probably gonna tell you the exact same thing. So you have to be comfortable with that. It's not gonna be super exciting and crazy where it's gonna be a trading strategy. Like the goal is to acquire this asset, save into this asset, and continue to do that over time and then learn. best practices along the way. Learn more about the why behind it so that the advisor isn't the single point of failure, right? If this person takes self custody and doesn't know how to do it themselves,'cause the advisor did it themselves, that's not helping that person that much because now you're the, you know, the only person that knows how to access the funds. It's like you gotta educate, and I think that's actually a really cool opportunity for advisors into the future to bring that into their financial planning practice. Is how to interact with Bitcoin, how to take self custody, how to think about these things and train clients that way because there's a lot of people that are gonna need help and they're gonna look to their trusted, you know, relationship for that. And if they can't do it, that's, that's not a good look.
Andy:Yeah. And, and the problem is though, you, you can't, every time you say the word like Bitcoin, you can't qualify it with all the things that you want to qualify it with. Five to 10 year outlook. Um, don't be a, don't be a leveraged trader. Um, take self custody, like all the things that you, all the presuppositions that, you know, I've, I've mentioned before, but you know, I, there's,'cause there's somebody listening to this podcast right now that's gonna listen to me once, and then they're done and, and the only thing they'll remember is maybe I said the word and in their head they thought, well that means it's gonna go up in the next six months or something. And I should, uh, I should borrow from my HELOC to, to make an investment. And so that is a challenge. And I think, um, I think what you said earlier about always you do have to kind of repeat yourself is probably good advice. because there's plenty of people that have not followed my back catalog and know sort of where I'm coming from It's a challenge I guess I would say.
Isaiah:Yeah. Anytime that there's something new it, it's gonna be, there's gonna go through phases of being exciting and then it being like it's dead. And Bitcoin has done that, right? And I think someone on Twitter put it out there where it's like 90% of the time owning Bitcoin, you're in pure pain. And 10% of the time you're a genius. So you just have to get comfortable with that, right? Like there's gonna be shorts, spurts where you look like you're so smart, and the rest of the time it's gonna just be a lot of pain. and, you know, suffering from that standpoint. But I also joke at that. I'm like, well, what, over what timeframe? Because if you look at it over any sort of timeframe, it actually helps make life a lot easier, um, if you have the right allocation, if you think about it in the right way. And you're not forced to sell into, you know, a situation. And I think that's just where, again, an advisor could come alongside and say, this is kind of what the optimal allocation is. And knowing your personal situation, what cashflow looks like, employment. Goals, all that other stuff. This is probably the right amount of Bitcoin to own.
Andy:That's right. Um, so I think the other thing that I should bring up about Twitter is, um, at least once, but probably more than once. I know I've talked to smack about soccer and, and you mentioned that this is something that we have to address and I don't, I don't remember, I don't remember exactly what I said, Isaiah, but whatever it was, I think I'll probably stand behind it. But, um, Yeah, I guess maybe I'll throw it back to you and then we can have a little discourse here. But what, what was I wrong about with regards to soccer?
Isaiah:I think you said it was boring. I think that's what you said. And I, I look at it and I'm like, Hmm. So I grew up rural Indiana on a hog farm, so this is not like soccer central by any stretch of imagination.
Andy:Yeah. I like how you have to use that to like, um, build your credibility here as not like a suburban soccer kid.
Isaiah:Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I live in an area now where soccer is huge, right? And so, like my four-year-old plays soccer was trying to, he's trying to learn. I mean, you go to four and five-year-olds playing soccer. It's not real soccer. They're just kinda chasing the ball for a while. Although there are a couple kids that look pretty darn good. However, um, if you look at soccer, it's the, it's the world's game, right? There's kids all over the world, adults all over the world that play it. Um, and you look at the passion and the connection of These clubs and the communities. I think it's really interesting. And so I, on my honeymoon with my wife who went to Italy is the only time I've ever been outta the country. We were like, Hey, we wanna have kids, so let's go and take a bigger honeymoon. And we went to Italy. So in Rome we went and saw an as Roma match. I'd never seen live soccer match in my life out, at least professionally. So they play in the top division, Syria, and they were playing a big rival at the time. I didn't know as big of a game as it was. It was amazing. Like the pageantry The, the singing, just the, the experience was amazing. And I've been a diehard fan since 2017, seeing that match and they've not been that good. I'll be candid. Like they haven't been great. And I think that's part of it. Like you just get connected in a different way. Where if I go to N F L game, it's pretty quiet. Like, unless they score a touchdown, but like the entire match, like it's this whole thing. It's, it's different. It, it reminds me more of like, uh, collegiate sports. That there's just a different vibe and different buzz around it, but it's even almost greater than that where people have like, Hey, I went to University of Missouri, or I went to iu, or I went to wherever. And they hold that kind of close to themselves for a long time. Or they'll, there'll be songs. There's different things. You just don't get that in professional sports. And so I think that's what soccer brings. And you see it a little bit in the World Cup as well. And the World Cup's gonna be here in 2026, so, uh, You know, it's gonna be wild and exciting. And my goal is the, the family, the Douglas family's gonna, you know, rent an rv and we're going all over the United States to watch soccer and spend the whole summer doing that. And hopefully the US can do something and not get eliminated early. But,
Andy:Nice. You have to come to Kansas City. I think some of the rounds are gonna be here.
Isaiah:Abso I was gonna, that was gonna be the next thing is like, if the US plays in Kansas City, which odds are, they probably won't, they'll probably play in like New York or LA or one of the, you know, Miami, right? They won't play in Kansas City. It'll be the, the smaller countries that'll play in Kansas City. But, um, it would be really cool to, to be able to, to go see, uh, a World Cup match in your hometown. Like that's amazing. So I would highly encourage you to find a way, even if it's not the, uh, the US playing to, to go get, see a match. But it is, it's an experience. And I think that's the biggest thing where I, and this sounds crazy, but I, I would prefer watching, you know, a soccer match over N F L. And that was way, way, way different prior to that. So,
Andy:Did you grow up playing soccer?
Isaiah:no, I never played soccer. I've never played soccer. Yeah. Never played club, never played. Like, we didn't even have one at my high school.
Andy:How, like how did you, how did you get into it?
Isaiah:so it was through the trip to, uh, to Italy, just watching in person. That was how I got into it. And so I literally, I think I looked up like, who plays for this team on the flight over, like we, my wife and I both like live sports. We both come from families that, You know, like sports, her dad and brother, coach basketball. And so basketball's a big thing in Indiana, but also, you know, within even the families. So basketball's always been kind of the, the sport that we would pay attention to more. And yeah, we both loved it. It was a ton of fun and so I hold very fond memories of that. I think part of it, yeah, it's your honeymoon, it's a big experience, but it was just one of those things where I've just enjoyed watching it since and. The nice thing is when you watch, uh, European matches, it's nighttime there and it's, you know, early-ish or early afternoon. It just fits, you know, Monday night football in the east, eastern time zone is just too damn late. I mean, it starts at nine o'clock.
Andy:Yeah. Do you follow the m l s or is it just the European soccer?
Isaiah:it's European, m l ss, the, the talent level isn't good. It's kind of where, uh, really talented folks will go to, like, retire from Europe. So like messy right now is all the rage at the moment, you know, across the country where I looked at getting tickets. There's another, uh, Bitcoin advisor in Cincinnati. I was trying to maybe scoop up some tickets and go down when they were there. And it was that, you know, they'd probably get'em for 20 bucks and they were going for like$600 a ticket and I was like, Hmm, I'm not that interested. So, Um, but yeah, I mean the m l s to me is kind of a proving ground for really young players sometimes, um, or more what I would call like Latin America or, um, US players. But a lot of, even the best US players don't play here. They play, um, in Europe and a lot of'em actually play in Italy right now. So the best, well, the captain of the United States, uh, Christian IC plays for AC Milan, so he plays in Italy right now.
Andy:All right, so this is not gonna be a podcast where I'm just gonna agree with you on everything. Um, nor nor should it, nor should it be.
Isaiah:that'd be really boring.
Andy:The, the thing that I will say in agreement is I 100% agree that I. The N F L is, um, not a place I wanna be on a Sunday afternoon in, especially in December, um, or January when it's freezing out. Uh, I have been to a couple games here in Kansas City and it is a, it's just pure, it's a pure, um, drunk fest, debauchery. Um, it's very loud, but it's off. It's also, it's often like just, you know, they pump the DJ music through the speakers and it's super annoying. Everyone's hammered, especially if it's like the Raiders are in town, there's like fights breaking out and it's that sort of experience that you, you. You just wouldn't wanna really wanna bring your kids to. Um, but it's like 45 year old fat guys wearing football jerseys. and it's like their entire Sunday that, that that is sort of my cliche, irreverent way of thinking about what a going to to an N N F L game is like. Um, so I, I agree with you if that's sort of what you're getting at with regards to the N F L. Um, it's very commercialized. It's like a product that's being served up for us. And so that annoys me. And even like compared to. Um, like Sporting Kansas City, which is the m l s team here in Kansas City, um, it's a smaller stadium. You feel like you're closer to the field. You feel like you're more, have a more intimate experience with the players. They don't pump in, um, DJ music. It's like the chance and there's like the, uh, the cheering session, session, uh, section rather of people that do all the chants and they wear the scarves and they pretend like they are, you know, like European soccer fans.
Isaiah:mm-hmm.
Andy:So, I dunno, maybe some of that is a bit of LARPing where it's like they're not really you know,
Isaiah:Yeah,
Andy:um, but they're, they're trying to do that. And so I, I do think that, like here in Kansas City, I would probably rather take my kids to an m l S game than a, uh, an N F L game. And I know you're not really defending the N M L S, um,
Isaiah:Yeah. One other thing real quick just to, to think about. The other nice thing with with soccer as well is the idea of relegation. Bottom three are relegated. And so I think there's some incentive, um, for folks to play. So even if you're a bad team, you don't wanna drop down to lower divisions. There's a lot of money involved. Um, and in England, the most expensive game of the year is the promotion to the Premier League. That's the most amount of money in Lutton Town, which was one that got promoted this past year. Literally there's houses you have to go through to get into this stadium. Like it's so small and it is not like the massive oil money for most of the other teams. So it's kind of funny that they're such a tiny club got promoted. But it is, I think that idea is interesting and I think it would be interesting to see that in the N F L and other places where you don't see the, you know, like tanking for draft picks or this team just sucks. So there's no real reason to play because there is a reason to play at the end.'cause you wanna stay up in the top divisions across, you know, whatever country it is.
Andy:I totally agree. Yeah, the relegation is very cool and, uh, it's like, um, yeah, it adds like, uh, sort of a, I don't know, an honest market aspect to the league where you can't just, I. Tank, um, to, plan for the next three years or to make more money for an owner or something like that. So, I totally agree. I, so I, here, here's what I would say. I, I think my criticism of, soccer is twofold. It's, it's me, my sort of boomer Americanism, and also the way it's sort of served up for kids in like suburban Kansas City as like a, a very organized thing that your mom drops you off at so that in 18 years you can get a scholarship or you can become a, a professional yourself. And I despise that. Meme, if you will. Um, the whole, like if people remember Rush Limbaugh, he had the whole soccer mom, um, meme that he would talk about. And so that, that's what I'm, that's what I'm talking about here. And so the Boomer Americanism, like I, I'm totally fine with soccer for people that like grew up with soccer. It's part of their culture. Um, I, there's a, a park here in North Kansas City by my office where, um, there's like black dudes that are playing pickup soccer all the time. Uh, presumably from Africa. I have no problem with that. Like that's a sort of organic part of their culture. The part that, you know, we nineties kids sometimes scoff at is where it seems like it's being served up to us from E S P N, um, you know, like wanting to broaden their fan base to like international players and like they are trying to make this a product for us. and and like make us enjoy this thing that is being sort of, uh, pushed on us. And um, so that's kinda where I'm coming from. I. I guess I like federalism in this regard. I think it's cool that America has its own sports that sort of come from America and were invented here and um, you know, England has cricket and uh, you know, the US has baseball and Canada has hockey and like, I think that's cool. Like, I like the sort of federalism and I like, um, sports played in different seasons and I think that's where I'm coming from. I mean the sport itself, I probably said it was boring, but that, I don't know if that's a real critique, that's just me not knowing much about soccer. Um, and you know, going to a couple games and not seeing a lot of scoring. But I think my real critique would just be about, um, I don't want to have, I don't want there to be the Gresham's Law of Sports. I, I like the fact that we have a lot of sports and not everyone plays the same one. Um, that's sort of my point.
Isaiah:I like it. I think that's fair. I like it. Yeah. I don't have any pushback on that.
Andy:My kid, uh, Leo played soccer, this summer. And, um, the way that I made peace with that is our friend Sean, um, together like, uh, sandlot soccer. So what he does is he's a fellow dad and he's got a couple daughters that are around my son's age and he just says, Hey, show up every Tuesday. It's at six o'clock, and we'll let the kids run around. I'll be the coach. It's free, and that will be the way for us to do this without making it super organized and super official.
Isaiah:I do think just youth sports in general, I mean, whether it's basketball, whether it's soccer, whether it's baseball, parents just get so over over involved in thinking that their kids are gonna go play professional sports, and that's just not statistically gonna happen. And so you take so much of the You know, childhood and I played sports growing up and they were super helpful for me. Um, a something to do, learn you fight through adversity. I got hurt a lot. Uh, I broke bones, tore muscles to different things just'cause I'm not the, uh, you know, pinnacle of an athlete. But I fought through those things, you know, went through rehab, came back through, was able to play and get back out there and, you know, do things like just going through that as a You know, young adult, you know, coming into, you know, adulthood learning adversity. That's good. And I think that's what sports should be, um, for kids. And that's why I want my boys, if they're interested to be involved in sports, but I wouldn't push them to be like, Hey, you're gonna be in this travel soccer league every weekend. We're going all over the Midwest to play. If you're a no good and B, you hate it, like that's just stupid.
Andy:It's pretty in vogue right now to, um, at least online for the very online people, um, to just dismiss youth, youth sports entirely. And I think there's good reason for that, but I, I I think I'm more of a reformer here, where the other thing I, I, I totally agree about the adversity thing, but the other thing that I think is, is helpful is, uh, teaching kids to have their own license or, and, and take, take their own leadership with, with some of these things, and. you know, create their own games and pick their own teams and, you know, resolve their own conflicts on the field. I think that's really helpful. Um, you know, it's like the whole sandlot thing. I think there, there has to be a way to sort of recapture that and, uh, I think it still exists in some areas. So, um, I'm hoping that the youth sports experience for my kids will be more sandlot and less, um, You know, on the sort of, uh, uh, youth sports industrial complex treadmill,
Isaiah:Mm-hmm. Well, and there's just so much that has been, I don't know, skewed, broken and changed that isn't, isn't the same. And it just feels off and it feels weird and feels strange and you know, that's a good, good example of one, but there's plenty of other areas and I think that's Again, you can try to figure out, you know, ways to tie that back into Bitcoin. Um, and just having the ability to say like, is this something that I wanna do? Do I wanna, you know, opt into play in this sport? And I always ask Everett, our son, like, Hey, did you have fun? Are you enjoying this? And for the most part, he's like, yeah, it's fun. Now, is he the best player? Absolutely not. But he's four and he is learning. And so it's like, Hey, this is good for you.
Andy:Yeah, yeah, yeah. The other thing I want, well, the other thing I wanna talk to you about, there's a lot of things that you've written about Isaiah and, and I listened to, um, I listened to you talk about sort of dedicated financial planning topics all the time and, um, and you're really good on these things. But when I asked you, Hey, what are we gonna talk about? You're like, no, the thing that we should really talk about is like how Bitcoin actually can change you and can give you sort of a different perspective on, on the world. And, um, That's a little different than, you know, financial planning per se, but, um, yeah, tell me where you're coming from here. What, what, what are you thinking about?
Isaiah:Oh boy. I mean, I know you, uh, gave me kind of a timeframe for our conversation, but this is, this is years of in going through just personal changes in seeing things differently, and it's almost like. You have the, the horse and the carriage. They have the, the blinders on. They keep doing what they're supposed to do. And then you take those off and it's like, Hey, there's this whole world outside of this road, right? That I can go explore, I can go over to the field, I can go over here to, you know, the mountains and there's all this stuff going on. Um, let's go explore. And I think that's what Bitcoin can do for people. And ultimately I look at Bitcoin as one of those things that gives, um, a lot of people, and if you go to your average, grocery store today, and I'm not talking like the high-end ones, right? People are struggling and you can see it. I, I feel it. I can see it. We don't shop at, you know, the, the fanciest places. A lot of what I like to do, and this is part of Bitcoin, I want to go and, and buy local. So, you know, I'll buy, uh, you know, a hog. I'll go buy a cow, I'll go do whatever and, and freeze it, right? Like, that's one of those things too. But I also grew up on a farm, so I was a little bit of kinda the way I was raised as well, but When I, when I think about, you know, Bitcoin changing me, a, it's looking at, you know, the, the system as it is. And, um, I don't, I couldn't call him friend, but someone that I look up to is Jeff Booth and he talks about you can't change a system from inside the system. And I look at the political circus, I'll, I'll say circus, that is, you know, what we have today where we have this two party system for all these people and it makes no sense. And everyone gets it that it makes no sense, but yet we still play the game that somehow we're gonna vote harder, we're gonna have the right person, it's gonna change. And it's like, guys, we've seen that this obviously doesn't work. Um, and, and yet we try to fool ourselves every four years that when we get this other person in that they're gonna make all these changes and then nothing ever changes. And I think everyone gets that for the most part. But then we're not really honest with ourselves that that doesn't change. So I think Bitcoin opened my eyes to just The political process is, is wrong. And I think the idea that I am blessed and fortunate to live in United States. I love where I'm from. I don't plan on leaving. But this idea that, you know, America is the greatest country ever. We've done all these positive things. There are truths, but history is written by the victors and there's a lot of things. That should be questioned about just the country in general. And I think Bitcoin's opened my eyes to some of those things and sometimes it's hard and I think Bitcoin shatters a lot of worldviews and I think that's why some people will push back on it. Um, I've kind of tried to embrace that and I definitely feel that I am a different person post 2020 and I think 2020, uh, I'll say it, it radicalized me. I think it changed a lot of people's views. but I'm not the same person. And I think Bitcoin is one of those tools that allows me to say, you know what? I can voice my opinion. I can stand up for what I believe to be true, and I don't have to conform to whatever the narrative is that I'm supposed to believe. And I'm fine to push back and if I get canceled, um, so be it. And I, I think I've come to terms with that and I'll give credit again to, to where I'm working today. At Swan, they're very open that it's like, Hey, you don't need to go be nasty to people, but you're allowed to have an opinion that is your own. And we don't all have to agree with that. Um, and I think that is important'cause there's a lot of employers that don't let you have an actual opinion today at all. You can't have an opinion. And I think that's why you're starting to see more people want to have their own businesses or start their own thing because You can't push back against some of the lunacy that's being, you talked about like ESPN pushing soccer on us. There's a lot of other, what I'll call propaganda that's being pushed from media or other, you know, entities that is out there. And I think that's where Bitcoin's changed me is just opening my eyes to seeing some of these things that it's like, I don't believe that and I can see where it's a gentle nudge and like that idea of like the nudging state. And all of a sudden it's like, okay, now it's mainstream. And then it's like it just goes from there. And to me that is. One of the things that Bitcoin's been able to do is just say, enough is enough. And I think, you know, Bitcoin shouldn't be put up on a, a pedestal that's an idol, but I think it, it, it does fit and goes along. And I think you've done a lot of work in this spot too, uh, for people that have, you know, their, their faith in the right spot. It's like Bitcoin and, and your, your faith in God, those things together. It's a really powerful thing for an individual to, to have those things rooted where they can have honest and open money. And they know that, hey, you know what I believe, um, gives me the ability to have freedom. And, um, yeah. I mean there's a lot there that's, we can unpack and go different directions, but that's, that's to me really what, what Bitcoin's been and has helped foster and change conversations.
Andy:Let me just say, I, I love the conviction here because, you know, financial planners, you're not supposed to have any conviction. You know, you're supposed, you're supposed to be exactly down the middle and exactly balanced and measured about every statement, and so it's just so refreshing to hear you as a, a fellow. Uh, C F P to have, have that, that sort of conviction. Um, it's, uh, it's very unusual and, um, it's not, you know, it's not a con necessarily just a conviction and number go up. Maybe that's part of it, but I you're talking about something a lot deeper. Um, yeah, I mean, I, I totally agree. Like, there's, to me, there's no conflict, um, in saying that I, I'm proud to be an American, but What happened in 2020 was on American Like, like if you think that the American dream is life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, um, uh, printing dollars and making everyone stay at home is anathema to that And like, if you think, um, criticizing, Woke corporations for, um, not allowing people to voice their opinions is on American because like, that's capitalism or something like, well, it's just not capitalism. Like that's, you know, whatever you wanna call it, it's cronyism or capitalism or whatever you'd like to call it like that. That's what a lot of these corporations are engaged, engaged in. Um, so I, I see no conflict there. Um, so I love it, man. Yeah, that's great stuff. I like, I like that's where your head's at.
Isaiah:Well, and just to go kind of along that, you had people that lost their jobs and I had clients that lost their job because they stood up for what they believed in and they said, no, I will not do this. And in the end, If we were able to have honest, open dialogue, we would've came to conclusions a lot quicker. But now it's like, oh, it's 2023. We should just let bygones be bygones. But oh, by the way, all the stuff that you said way back then, it's correct. And it's just funny how that works. Funny with, you know, my eyes rolling, right? That that's acceptable where people were made fun of and demonized. And you had, you know, the president of the United States basically wishing a good chunk of the population to die over the winter. Like, those are things that I will never forget till the day that I pass. Right? And that does change someone. You do look at things different. The government, to me, is supposed to be there for the people that elected them, not to dictate in, you know, Lord over them. But it's definitely changed and I think that's where Bitcoin allows for some freedom. Where today you talked about it printing money, right? So the Federal Reserve technically is supposed to be, you know, separate, um, from the The federal government, but we all can kind of know like, hey, they were kind of working in unison, right? And so you have this control over the money, which if you can't pay your mortgage feed your family, you're gonna change the way that you act and respond. But if you can have a money that allows you to voice your opinion, and no one can steal it from you and steal either being able to take it or just print it at infinitum to where your purchasing power is gone, all of a sudden you can have a little bit more of a backbone. And you can say, this isn't right, and I don't agree with you. And ultimately, like the idea and the, the foundation of what this country was about is that you're supposed to be able to bring people of different, you know, different faiths, different opinions, and bring them together. And this like giant melting pot was, was what has made America great in the past. And now we're trying to say, no, if you don't agree with the party line, we're gonna censor you and we're gonna bury you and, and try to ruin your life. And that's not okay. And I think that's where Bitcoin can allow, as people understand and see that it will, it'll change at the edges, but that in and of itself is a huge, huge lift to, to individuals and to families. So to me that's a, a really attractive thing. And yeah, the ability to make life cheaper, that helps too, because people are struggling. And if you look at groceries, you look at housing, you look at cars. And measure any of those things in, in Bitcoin terms over a longer period of time. And I'm not saying weeks and months, but if you saved into this asset class and you have a couple years, all of a sudden it's cheaper. And it's like, wow, that's amazing. When, when you don't have money that's, you know, basically being siphoned from you. Uh, you can afford the things that are there and I'm not gonna, you know, say, Hey, you know, I wish we could go back to the 1950s and it was the perfect world and all. There were problems then too. But I think we have a really unique opportunity today. To help usher in, uh, Bitcoin into the mainstream, which is happening. That Overton window is changing. You have three political, you know, presidential candidates talking about Bitcoin. That is insane. That's amazing, right? And so think about that in the next four years and the four years after that. And I think one of the key things with Bitcoin is this, like long time horizon and thinking longer term. So many people in this country, it's the next quarter for publicly traded companies. It's, it's the next four years. And I think as Bitcoiners, a lot of it is, it's decades. And with that mindset, it's really hard to, you know, unseat folks that have a longer time horizon that are willing to, you know, gut through it and ensure success in the other end. And so that to me is super exciting to see the amount of people and the passion and conviction behind Bitcoin. It grows. I've seen it at the meetup here locally in Indianapolis. I see it where I work at Swan. I've seen it in lots of conversations. It's not that people build this conviction and then they just go away. It sticks and it's like it sticks. And then those connections around those people, slowly over time it sticks. And like that's how this grassroot adoption happens. So, uh, it's super exciting. It's super exciting.
Andy:I think, I think, um, what you're saying is still It's still undervalued or niche even. Um, you know, most people are still pretty blue pilled in with regards to like something like inflation where, you know, most people still think of inflation as like an act of God or like a natural disaster or something like that. Um, or just like something that naturally. Happens throughout history, you just always have a little bit of inflation. Like they don't realize the connection to currency, debasement, or the the monetary supply. I mean, it's a complex topic, but I think, I think, you know, I think it's, at least the meme is becoming more relevant, um, since, you know, the, the Biden inflation has, has become part of the discourse. Um, but anyway, most people are blue pilled, but a lot of people are also black billed. You know, I was talking to a guy. A few months ago, who was like really down, I don't listen to Tim Poole, but apparently Tim Poole was black, pilling him on, I don't know, like the fall of the dollar or something like that. And he was saying the bricks, the bricks are going to combine. I. Forces to create a viable alternative to the dollar and the US is screwed. And so like that was where, where his head was at. My point is like, um, you know, Bitcoin is one of, one of the answers to that. It provides one of the optimistic solutions for like the thoroughly black build. And if you're blue pill, like it's maybe a wake up call, like read the Bitcoin standard and see that there is a alternative worldview here from all your presuppositions.
Isaiah:Yeah, and I think inflation is the one. Going back to tying kind of these different tangents and threads that we've had going through. There was a, a financial, uh, advisor works for a big company that had written a piece in 20. Two, early 22 about how inflation was good and seven reasons why. And that was one where I called it out and said, this is wrong, this is why didn't go over well. Um, we were gonna have a debate, never got done. My son was born around that time. So it just got tricky where we were gonna have, you know, this public discourse and record it, like do a Twitter spaces, do whatever. But the amount of advisors that think inflation is good, uh, blows my mind. Like they, they just don't understand what money is. And I think I would say a good 95, 90% of financial advisors don't really understand money at a fundamental level because they don't like gold. And I'm not a gold bug, but anytime a financial advisor kind of dismisses or slams gold, I'm like, yeah, you instantly don't know what money is. It's interesting you don't understand it though, and that's why you look at, you know, this stock bond portfolio and I've had plenty of people tell me, well, aren't stocks and bonds enough? Okay. Um, That's fine. I mean, if you run the numbers and look at it, since you know gold's been around or even easily to buy, let's say as an E T F G L D came out in, I don't know, 2004, look at G L D, look at bond ETFs and if you did a 60 40, so 60% stocks, 40% bonds or gold, the gold allocation, better performance, better risk adjusted returns better all the way around. Uh, yet most advisors would never. say that that's true or run the numbers to actually see that and it's a better diversifier because you don't have to worry. Uh, you know as much about like interest rates going up. And so many people that manage money today have never seen interest rates go up. They've seen 40 years of falling in interest rates, and so they only know what has happened. You know, in more recent times it's like the fish swimming and then the older fish comes through is like, Hey, how's the water? And they're like, what? What's water? They have no idea of how these things work. It's just Hey, uh, you allocate. And when one does well, the other one maybe doesn't do as well. And when one really stinks, the other one is kinda the ballast. That's what they're taught, and it's really, really frustrating for me. And it's not even like a Bitcoin conversation. It's just like this inflation thing isn't good. Look at people and why and when and how has it ever been Okay to basically make people poorer and poorer. Over time because the idea of inflation is if you already own all the assets that you want, inflation is great, but if you're trying to acquire those things, good luck. Your, uh, perpetual hamster wheel. And for most people, they just can't ever quite get it. And there's plenty of, you know, charts and, you know, topics and W T F happened, 1971 that show these things. But Um, inflation is a monetary phenomenon. You know, Milton Freeman talked about that, and it is in like, it's, it's horrible. And I never really understood why inflation was good or bad. It just was a thing. It was an input on a financial planning tool, and that's a whole other tangent about financial planning tools. But inflation isn't needed for a healthy economy, and most people would argue it is. It's because that's what they're told. Hey, we need this 2%, or maybe it's 3% now, maybe it's gonna be 4%. And then when. When asked, you know, Jay Powell, the Fed Fed president, why He kinda stumbles over his word. Why? Well, it's enough that we can steal that. People don't wanna riot in the streets, so we'll say it's 2%. Like it's, it's laughable. And that to me would be the best wake up call is if people, and I think that again, because of the higher inflation, um, over the past couple years, people are starting to ask like, why do we need this thing? And this has been really bad. We just haven't lived in a world that that's happened in in quite a while.
Andy:Yeah. And by the way, and I know you feel the same way, but I have a lot of sympathy for, for that because that was me too. Like I,
Isaiah:Same, yeah.
Andy:I was a, you know, typical myopic financial advisor who, um, you know, sort of read some things like in, I. Like on mesis.org, but never related it to anything of what I was doing with, you know, personal financial planning. And, uh, it's sort of, you know, typical of our time. Like we're all sort of in our own lane and we don't have sort of broad knowledge of what's happening in the world. Um, and so I have a lot of, sympathy for that. And By the. way, I, I, um, I recommend Everyone listen to your episode with a Phil back because he had a good, sort of a good come to Jesus story about that too. And he's not exactly a Bitcoin guy, although he has some sympathies, um, with our side of things. But, um, I think his revelation was, Because of inflation. You know, perhaps like real estate is a, um, is a safe haven. And so that was one of the things he brought to your podcast. And so I thought that was a really good conversation of you, you know, Isaiah trying to evangelize with another sort of financial advisor who had his own come to Jesus with this problem. And, um, that was a nice back and forth.
Isaiah:Yeah, Phil. Phil is a Bitcoin. I, I still believe
Andy:yes.
Isaiah:he'll come around to it. It's just gonna be it. Well, it's gonna take him some time. He doesn't own any, he's not there yet. But like his, the, the way he looks at the world, the problems he sees, like he is there squarely. It's just, that's not the tool that he looks at to solve it. But I think he can identify all those different things and yeah. I. I want to have more conversations like that, um, with people that maybe are not die in the wool bitcoiners that get it. Because again, just like you talked about before, all you're gonna do is say, yep, we agree. This is right. We agree, we agree. It's like, no. You want people that are gonna say, I don't understand why this is, or this is a problem. And then how can you help them come to maybe see it in a different light? But, you know, at the end of the day, it's one of those things that everyone's gonna get. Bitcoin when they're ready and they need enough touchpoint. And so maybe that is helpful to be one touchpoint and maybe this podcast could be a touchpoint for someone else to be like, you know what, maybe the juice is worth the squeeze. I should check out those resources that Andy has talked about. Um, because it is, it is worthwhile and it doesn't have to be an all or nothing. And I think that's ultimately one of the other big things that I get frustrated with when it comes to financial professionals is the, this bitcoin thing's bad. It's like, well, no. It doesn't have to be a hundred percent or 0%. Like there's a lot of leeway for some, a little more and a lot. And for each person they're gonna have to help make that decision. But as the financial professional or the trusted relationship that they have, your goal is to educate and inform. And I think a lot of people, again, going back to they don't understand Bitcoin'cause they don't understand money and they also don't understand how like technology involves over time either. And same thing, Andy, like I, I'm sympathetic to that'cause I didn't get it either for a long time. And I'm not saying that I've arrived either. And I don't want people to think like, oh, well he thinks he knows I, I'm still learning, still learning a lot.
Andy:Well, you're doing good work, Isaiah. Um, I think you add a lot of credibility to our space and I appreciate that. Um, I mentioned the Phil Bach podcast, but where, where would you, um, send the, uh, the listeners to learn more about you and, and your work?
Isaiah:I would let people know. Um, you can find me on Twitter, ID financial. Um, I do have, again, like I talked about the top, the, the passion for those kind of financial professionals. So whether you are a financial professional work with one, um, CFPs, that stack is the, the podcast that Andy's referencing where I've talked to various different folks in that space. You can find it anywhere that you listen to podcasts, YouTube, um, connect me on LinkedIn. I know some people are like, ah, LinkedIn stinks. I try to share as much content there as well. Uh, I can do a better job, but. Again, getting touchpoints and getting people to think and ask questions. Um, LinkedIn is one of those spots where people do see the things that scroll by, and I think it's an underutilized tool for folks to, you know, get some Bitcoin education. So you can find me on there as well. Um, obviously if you're looking for more Bitcoin content, you can listen to various different episodes that Andy's done. Um, Swan has great stuff. There's plenty, plenty, plenty of resources. I think the pen tweet on my, uh, Twitter as well has a bunch of resources that I really like.
Andy:Good man. Great stuff. Let's do it again sometime.
Isaiah:absolutely.