Speaker Key (delete/anonymise if not required):
HOST: VICTORIA HARRIS
DEREK: DEREK MUNN
MUSIC PLAYS: 0:00:00-0:00:08
HOST: 0:00:08 Hello, it’s Monday, 17 July. I’m Vicky Harris, the Head of Learning at the Royal College of Speech and Language Therapists, and I’m here with Derek Munn, the RCSLT’s Director of Policy and Public Affairs, for our regular catch up, which we do once a month, covering key issues and activities relating to speech and language therapy.
Hello, Derek.
DEREK: 0:00:27 Good morning.
HOST: 0:00:28 I guess the big news since we last spoke is that the NHS England Workforce Plan has been launched, and that’s good news. So, I wondered, what are the key take-aways for the RCSLT that listeners will be particularly interested in?
DEREK: 0:00:42 Thanks, Vicky. Yes, I think, like many people, we wondered whether this would ever see the light of day. It now has finally been launched. And the good news is that speech and language therapy is referenced – referenced six times in the 100 and something pages, and there was a clear recognition that speech and language therapy is a shortage profession. That’s all to the good.
We have to say that, like others, we’re not sure that we recognise some of the figures that have been used for the modelling, so we’re taking that up with them. And when there’s talk about 5% as a training increase number, we think that’s way too low and doesn’t take account either of demand for existing services or unmet need.
So, we welcome the reference to speech and language therapy, and we welcome a recognition that there’s a shortage and needs to be an increase, but we want to talk about the detail and the amount.
That’s the bit of the workforce plan which is specific to speech and language therapy. However, there are loads of other things in it that are talked about in general terms, not linked to any particular profession, but that are really important to us.
We strongly welcome focus on apprenticeships, for example. We know that apprenticeship courses in England are now going very well and there’s going to be growth and we’re pleased that NHS England sees that as part of the future growth.
We’re pleased with the focus on [inaudible 0:02:21]. Again, we see that as a critical part of not just the entry level to the profession but progression through a career. It does, though, raise the issue for us again around prescribing, because the increased focus on advanced practice and relating it to prescribing throws into relief that we’ve still got a number of allied health professions, including SLT, that don’t have full prescribing rights, so we’re going to be using that opportunity to push hard on that issue.
And clearly, we welcome the focus on retention, but it has to be said that in the area of retention it is pretty much [war on words/warm words 0:03:02]. And the fact that any conversation about pay is excluded from the workforce plan means that you’re only really talking about half the issues with retention.
So, welcome specific references to SLT in recognition of shortage, welcome the focus on apprenticeships and advanced practice and a number of other areas, welcome to focus on retention, but there’s no substance to that and there are a number of areas that we’re now going to work very hard with NHS England on taking forward.
HOST: 0:03:38 Wonderful, thank you for that summary there. I wonder if we can talk now about how the RCSLT is responding to issues around waiting lists and shortages in speech and language therapy around the UK please.
DEREK: 0:03:52 I guess, Vicky, that we would see that as intimately interlinked with the workforce plan, but you’re right to say around the UK because as well as the workforce plan in England there are workforce plans and strategies at different phases of development in each of the devolved nations, and were engaged in all of those.
Some of our response has been the vacancy survey, which many people filled in in the early part of the year; we launched in April, alongside a statement on workforce policy. We’ve just gone out to the second iteration of the vacancy survey, and it’s really important that people fill it in again, so that we have trend data.
We know that it’s cut-through. We continue to get mainstream media coverage from it, and to give an example, conversations we’re having with colleagues in the Department for Education about the promised joint workforce planning on SEND between education and health, they are essentially taking our vacancy survey as a starting point. So, it’s having real influencing value and that will be important going forward
We then take that into all of the conversations that we have, so the conversations we’re engaged in around primary and intermediate care. I’ve mentioned SEND. In the context of Northern Ireland, for example, conversations around the mental health workforce, and also a range of ministerial meetings. We were recently part of a ministerial delegation to talk about specialist SEND provision in in the classroom, particularly for speech and language therapy.
Going to the other side of things, we have a meeting this week with Will Quince, who is now the health minister responsible for rehabilitation, to press the case in that area.
In laying out all the things we’re doing, Vicky, we are very aware that the situation on the ground remains challenging. Our new CEO, Steve, is continuing to do visits to services and members around the country. I’ve accompanied him on some of those. We are acutely aware and constantly reminded of issues of vacancies, waiting lists and times, cuts, morale and wellbeing around the country, and we carry those member experience with us in all of the conversations we have with government and with the system.
HOST: 0:06:26 Thank you, Derek. What are your key points you’d like to highlight for each nation of the UK, please?
DEREK: 0:06:32 I would pick up ongoing issue in Wales around youth justice, where regular listeners may remember that we had a very helpful report from the Senedd. The Welsh Government accepting everything that was in it, apart from the bit about having extra speech and language therapists!
There was debate on the floor of the Senedd a couple of weeks ago; lots of members of the Senedd made very helpful points about the links between speech, language, communication and youth justice and the need for adequate provision.
We continue to discuss with the devolved nations student numbers. Regular listeners will remember that, whereas in England now, universities can set up speech and language therapy courses whenever they want to.
In the devolved nations, student numbers are still determined by government. We’ve continued discussion. We’ve had a slight increase in student numbers in Wales, which is needed. Some confusion in Northern Ireland, where numbers were taken down slightly and may or may not be going back up again, so we continue to be involved in that conversation.
In Scotland, the senior children and young people posts, which we were successful in getting established, are being recruited to, which is great, and we are involved in behind the scenes conversations, both with COSLA, which is the local government body in Scotland, and with the Association of Directors of Education in Scotland, to try and make sure that the local government side of things is clear about their responsibilities, and also the value that speech and language therapy can be to the priorities that they have.
HOST: 0:08:19 Thank you. And then finally, is there anything else that you’d like to touch on please?
DEREK: 0:08:25 A couple of things, I think. There continues to be media and wider interest in children’s language post pandemic. Now, we know there are issues with Long COVID and throughout the life course, but we welcome the ongoing evidence and focus on the effects that the pandemic may have had on children’s language. As we know, we still don’t know the full details of what that’s going to mean long-term.
Allied to that, I must mention Keir Starmer’s announcement about a focus on oracy. Now, I know not everyone likes the term ‘oracy’, but it’s the one that gets used. We made a submission to Labour’s National Policy Forum, along with Oracy 21 and Speech and Language UK, and we called for spoken language to be given equivalent status to reading and writing in the curriculum. And that is exactly what Labour have now announced as part of their five missions – the one on opportunity, which is kind of their equivalent to levelling up. So, that’s great news that Labour has taken this on board, and that spoken language is going to be a key part of their general election policy platform.
Keir Starmer talked about the importance of fluency – that was the word he chose to use – fluency as a key to opportunity in life. That’s fine as a shorthand, but we, of course, are keen to continue conversation with Labour to say, if you’re using the term ‘fluency’ in an abstract sense, you need to be very clear about the way that people with communication need, whether that’s a stammer, whether that’s use of AAC, are fully included in what that means in practice.
HOST: 0:10:10 Great, thank you. I just have a few little things to mention at the end of this podcast. Firstly, that the RCSLT conference is open for bookings now. It’s running from 1-2 November online, and the theme is embracing the future, so I will leave a link to that in the show notes. And also, everything else that we mentioned today, if there’s a link, I will put that in the show notes.
Also, a little request for you. There’s a feedback survey in the notes, so if you can please spare a couple of minutes to feedback to help us to develop and improve this podcast. Thank you.
Our next news catch-up is at the end of August rather than in the middle, so it’s a slightly longer gap due to holidays, so look out for that at the end of August.
Thank you very much.
MUSIC PLAYS: 0:10:54
ENDS
