Visionary Ventures: Cooking, Culture, and Courage

From NYC's hustle to Italy's countryside, Ashley Bartner shares her incredible journey of life, love, and business. Discover how she and her husband turned a wild honeymoon idea into reality. 🐓🍷➡️🎙️ #EntrepreneurSpirit #TheWaterTrough #LeapOfFaith

Transcript

Ed Drozda 0:10

Welcome to The Water Trough, where we can't make you drink, but we will make you think. My name is Ed Drozda, The Small Business Doctor, and I'm really excited you chose to join me here as we discuss topics that are important for small business folks just like you. If you're looking for ideas, inspiration, and possibility, you've come to the right place. Join us as we take steps to help you create the healthy business that you've always wanted. Welcome back to The Water Trough, folks. This is Ed Drozda The Small Business Doctor, and today I'm delighted to be joined by Ashley Bartner. Ashley is the visionary co-founder and owner of La Tavola Marche. She wears many hats serving as a food and travel writer, photographer, and filmmaker along with Innkeeper, host extraordinaire and Chicken Wrangler. We'll get back to that one. In 2007, after a honeymoon in Italy, together with her husband Jason, they moved to Italy, started a farm, an inn, and a cooking school. Oh, she was at the time, 27 years old. She became a writer for Italia and Taste Italia magazines, sharing stories about life in Le Marque, along with local seasoned recipes documenting the seasonal rhythms of garden life and local traditions. Before moving to Italy she worked for ClubCorp, a private golf resort and athletic club, specializing in guest and public relations. She was also at the helm of their Move to Italy workshops, as well as consulting sessions for others looking to move to Italy or start businesses abroad. Ashley, hello.

Ashley Bartner 2:03

Ciao.

Ed Drozda 2:05

That was perfect. It's such a joy to have you here today. Unfortunately, my podcast is just audio, but Ashley has the most beautiful smile, so it's great for me. Thank you.

Ashley Bartner 2:18

Thanks for having me on Ed, I'm excited.

Ed Drozda 2:21

Your story is quite interesting. I'm gonna start with the chicken wrangler, just because it caught me off guard. I'd read it before, but go on.

Ashley Bartner 2:31

Well, it's something I never thought I'd be doing. We lived in New York before we moved out here, and before that I grew up in the suburbs, normal kind of kid going to a strip mall kind of thing or a mall versus doing anything in the countryside. And quickly we found ourselves raising hens and wanted them to be free range. And, we would try our best to fit in being Italian, but there was these things that we were so American that we would do like, come on, come on, and just kind of start wrangling the chickens and calling 'em in. And they would start to just follow me back down to the coop every night. And one of the guests nicknamed me the chicken wrangler, and it stuck. So it's a fun one to have.

Ed Drozda 3:16

Fantastic. I can picture it now, you running around chasing chickens. Okay.

Ashley Bartner 3:22

You never know where your life's gonna end up.

Ed Drozda 3:24

I imagine chicken wrangling is just one of the many things and one of the exciting things that's going on for you. But at 27 years old, you're newly married, you're on your honeymoon, and some would say this is more than a leap of faith. What happened? How did you embark on this thing?

Ashley Bartner 3:44

Well, um we were on our honeymoon and in Italy, so it's ridiculously romantic and it sounds just very dream drunk of an idea to do, and it literally was at the moment that it first happened. I remember sitting in a cafe or bar in this Piazza in Trastevere, this little neighborhood of Rome, and watching with Jason, we were at the end of our honeymoon, and I remember looking at him and saying we could live here. It was one of those moments where he is like, oh yeah, sure, have another drink. But it's one of those things too, we were at a different point in our life where we were ready for a change, looking to do something different anyway. I just thought, why not? We're young if we're gonna take a risk, we don't have kids, we don't have a mortgage, and within two weeks of returning home from our honeymoon I started researching property prices in Italy instead of property prices in Southern California, which is where we thought we were gonna be moving. That was in 2006 which was the height of properties before the crash, and so it kind of blew my mind. All of a sudden the reality shifted of going wait a second, we could do something totally different, completely outside of the box. We were crazy to even think that big. We didn't have money, we didn't come from money we didn't speak Italian, we didn't have Italian blood. I'll start to get too rambling, but that's hopefully the first part of the answer of your question.

Ed Drozda 5:16

You know, the reason I ask the question is because a lot of folks who are starting out in a business are contemplating doing it in a place in which they're familiar, and that by itself is daunting. But the idea that you could take it that much further, that far out of the box is intriguing. I'm sure most people would say, wow, that's just, it's more than just a leap of faith. It's got to be a lot more than that.

Ashley Bartner 5:44

Who's the guy who founded Virgin?

Ed Drozda 5:47

Richard Branson

Ashley Bartner 5:49

Yes. He has a great quote that I'll butcher, but he walked into the Bank of London to ask for like a 250,000 pound loan to start the magazine or something like that. And he has this quote that he was too young or too naive not to know how crazy this was. And I think there's a little bit of that. Part of it was I just broke it all down and thought, okay you gotta write a business plan. Let me just step by step it. If you look at the big picture, it's too crazy to even put your mind around. I think also there's that slight inspiration after being on your honeymoon and wanting to make a change in life and thinking about your life goals and thinking, I'd wanna learn a little language, I'd wanna travel more. I'd like to work together and build something with my spouse. You know? And somehow this culminated all of it. All at once. The craziest part is we went from our honeymoon to living here in a year and a half, getting the proper visas, doing a business plan, finding the property. I get excited to share the story because we were young, and naive, but it shows you could do it at any age, and that you just have to be willing to believe in yourself wholeheartedly, and say if we're gonna do it we're gonna do it. I think that was the other thing. When I had brought it up to Jason, I think we should move to Italy, Oprah says live your wildest dreams. We thought I was crazy at first. Don't start with Oprah says he said, but his point was if we're gonna do this I don't wanna half ass it, and I don't wanna be one of those couples who for the next 10 years says we're moving to Italy, or become that couple, weren't you gonna move to Italy and start a business or something? It was like if we're gonna do it let's do it, and we decided immediately to shut off the television. Today I wouldn't always recommend that because there's so many things like Netflix and Prime and different ways to watch Italian. Like if you're moving somewhere, submerse yourself in that foreign culture. But that wasn't the case back then. We thought if we're watching tv, we're not doing something to move to Italy. So we had a mindset of Italy or bust, I guess.

Ed Drozda 8:03

Did either of you have any kind of, let's call it skill set or interest that would lead to opening an inn, a restaurant, and a farm?

Ashley Bartner 8:16

Yes, Jason is a chef. He went to the French Culinary Institute in New York. He's classically trained, like old school, Jacques Pepin, Jacques Torres. These were his teachers, and then he was an executive chef in New York by the age of 25, so he was killing it. But the higher up you got in the professional kitchen, the less you're actually cooking. Your going to meetings, you are doing budget, you are handling staff, you're putting out fires and kissing babies is what he would say. And so you start to lose what you got in it for, cooking and making good food for people. And I had always worked in hospitality, well I had majored in theater and so that came in handy for putting on a show for the guests if you will, setting the scene and the mood and the lighting, and all of that. I had worked at this company, ClubCorp. They had dining clubs and resorts and athletic clubs and things like that. I started working with them at 17, straight out of high school. I was their youngest hire they had ever had at the Columbia Tower Club, tallest building west of the Mississippi, in Seattle. At a super young age I was trained in five star service and high-end hospitality, and taught by an old school concierge, if you will. I don't know if these old school concierges still exist, but it was a great culture to be put in young and grow up in that type of expected service for the guests. The intangibles were easily obtainable because it seemed like that's just what you're supposed to do. So we both had a background in the hospitality, the food service. In the restaurant world you'd say that I was the front of the house, Jason was the heart of the house, and so we knew we had that balance. Now he thought I was crazy because he would never really cooked Italian food. But I said, "you'll learn, you're brilliant. You'll get there. Don't worry. You'll, you'll get there. The locals will teach you". I had this utmost confidence that it was gonna work out. I was like, we're not building a McDonald's. We're going there to learn the ways and to immerse ourselves. But the part that we had zero background was country living in any way, shape or form, and then a garden, let alone a farm. And then later wrangling chickens and raising pigs and all of that. When we arrived, we were just so curious and hungry to learn from the first step. I mean, at the first steps they all thought we were crazy, and who are you guys? And then the elders if you will, the sixties and up, took us under their wings and just started showing us the ropes of the things we needed to learn to round it out.

Ed Drozda 11:08

It's fascinating how you emerged from, well not a lot of background that would allow you to take such a major step. Certainly a chef, hospitality, those things are fundamental, so I can see where they'd fit in. Being able to pick that up and go to a totally different place sounds like it would be pretty unnerving. I'm imagining how I would feel if it were me. What was the glue that kept it together for you as you embarked? This is it. You've got your place, you're getting on the plane to go there, physically live there. What is the glue at that point that held you two together?

Ashley Bartner 11:48

Um, that's a great question. The glue is in our relationship or in our glue to the belief that we could build this business. There was a bit of both. That's the crazy thing about doing this with your partner, your spouse is that line gets blurred. I think he had utmost faith in my plan and I knew he could. I think it was just this absolute glue that if we did it together we could do it and that we would figure it out. And there was also something about it where you're hungry. I think that's a big glue that kept it together. Holy smokes, if we don't do this or if this business doesn't work and this plan fails, where are we living now? Now we're home in a foreign country where our ability to stay and keep working is based on having a business we're running. If we can't afford our bills, oh my gosh. So the pressure was on and we were so hungry that I think it was almost that you could see so clearly what needed to be done and you just pull up your pants and do it. I think there's a huge advantage to being hungry in a business. We do a lot of consulting for people who wanna move to Italy and retire or start a business, later in life ideas, well later in life than when we were doing it. I think that if you have too much of a security net you either aren't willing to take the big risks that it takes to jump in head first and just go, oh my God, if this doesn't work out, not only do I hope that we're still married, but at least we'll have a good story to tell. But, I think 'cause there was no option to fail is really the glue that kept it together. You're hungry and excited and yeah the belief in each other. I didn't realize till later how much he was leaning on me those first years. Not that he wasn't sure, but I didn't realize till later just how much I was in the driver's seat where I thought oh, I'm just setting up the sweet pitch and he's hitting the home run, 'cause he's executing all of these ideas, you know? So it just worked out, that balance.

Ed Drozda 14:07

It's very evident from what I'm hearing, that he had complete trust in you.

Ashley Bartner 14:15

I think so.

Ed Drozda 14:17

Your vision I presume, had to be articulated in such a way that he had no choice but to believe in everything you said.

Ashley Bartner 14:26

Well, I think also there's this beauty in travel, especially when you're able to get off the beaten path and have a real, I hate to say the word authentic experiences, but like subversive, immersive, whatever you wanna call it. Any hot word experience where you're like welcome into people's homes, and you see things that they have built together over centuries in their family, and this simplicity and this joy in a different lifestyle that we're not accustomed to as Americans, where it's go, go, go, and more is always better. We're at a point where you realize there's gotta be more out there, and so I think that was part of it for him. Ready to leave New York, not crazy about going to California necessarily, and just seeing this quality of life that we hadn't experienced. I hate to say like simplistic level, but it was the good food, the being around people and family and the beauty of it and the slow pace and realizing that they're happy with what they have. They're not looking to "the grass isn't always greener", and it was I guess, the right time for us to experience that.

Ed Drozda 15:39

You found a culture that you actually could gravitate to. And a culture in which you lived that you wished to migrate from.

Ashley Bartner 15:49

Yeah exactly, and I think that helped with the language as well, because we knew we wanted to assimilate. So there was that, there's no option to not learn Italian. Was it easy? No. Am I still struggling at times? Absolutely. Do I sometimes just sound like a fourth grader after being here 20 years? Yes. Is that frustrating? Yes. But if you're moving to a foreign country to start a new life, let alone start a business too, you better learn the language. Again there was no option, so even there, there was so many hurdles if you will, to go over. It seemed a little bit old school, baby steps, just get that one done and then we go to the next.

Ed Drozda 16:29

Not usually short for words, but Wow.

Ashley Bartner 16:31

Something that was interesting to find out was on the hospitality or business culture side here, how different things were than in the states where something simple like if we had Americans here by the pool, it would be totally normal and expected for us to go up and ask would you like us to bring you some wine, a beer? You know, be openly, outwardly hospitable. Whereas we realized with Northern European guests and Dutch and whatnot, me going over there is being a pushy hostess. They're like, if we wanted something, we know where to come and find you and we'll come and ask. So some of it was a little bit of learning that and not being considered a nosy hostess. When guests would come back, tell me, how was your day? This and that. That and also very much the Italian culture of these kind of bed and breakfast or farmhouse inns is that the woman is in the kitchen, and the male is the one that is greeting and seating and doing the waiter, waitress work. So obviously our roles are switched. When Italians would come here they would think I was doing everything myself. So I of course leaned into it and said, oh yes, I'm just working away in the kitchen, and Jason's doing nothing. Also dealing on a business side is a woman in a culture where there's definitely a machismo. We only wanna talk to Jason to you know... I would like to pay the guy who delivers our wood, but he says no, I only do this with Jason. This is men's work and there's no reason to be offended because i'm not gonna change his mind. It's just a shame 'cause I told him I'm the one with the money. I'm the one who holds the purse. So Jason always says it too, going, no, no, no, it's Ashley. You gotta talk to her, and they're very confused. He loves it. So there's certain things, you just have to learn how the culture is and don't be offended, just learn to work within it. And if that means that he is just gonna ask Jason and Jason's going to ask me, fine, we'll play telephone to pay the bill. But it is interesting sometimes, some of those little differences along the way.

Ed Drozda 18:46

It's a lesson that any of us could learn. Those of us that are staying in the place that we were born and raised could definitely benefit from something like this because we lose sight of the fact that our familiarity presumably means that we know how to handle it. The reality is we often don't pay attention. You go to a place in a country like this and you're, I hate to use the word forced, but I guess you are, forced to engage and understand what's going on. We could well do that right here. In fact if we did it more, it'd be a lot nicer, but yeah?

Ashley Bartner 19:21

I think so. In many ways it's true.

Ed Drozda 19:24

Every country has its own language, and the culture goes very deep, and it can be really enlightening when somebody chooses to immerse themselves as you folks have. You can hide in Rome, you can hide in Florence. But you can't hide where you are. Right?

Ashley Bartner 19:43

We stick out like a sore thumb. That is for sure.

Ed Drozda 19:47

And even without a business, you'd still stick out like a sore thumb. 20 years in! What is it that keeps you guys going? What kind of fuel is in your tank?

Ashley Bartner 20:01

I think COVID was a great time to realize what that was. And Jason, we kind of realized it for each other, uh, Jason realized how much I need and thrive off of the guests and that experience and having people at our house and sharing the stories and sharing all of our local favorite places to take them and to go to the festivals with the guests, 'cause I know they'll have that much more of a great time 'cause there's no one speaking English out here. So they get to feel like a true local, and I realized Jason likes to cook for many. He has such a hard time with just cooking for two people and it's disappointing for him at times. He's used to cooking for many and growing a garden to feed people. He's a feeder and I'm a entertainer, whatever it is. We both realize that there's these aspects of it that we love and thrive on. There's also a thing where this house that we live in, this old house, that it needs the energy of having people passing through it and to have the whole property be nice and clean and the pride to share a place like this, where it's just two people out in the middle of nowhere. It can obviously get lonely and quiet, but there's such a beauty of it to share with people. So that was really nice. And then we thought for years at different times of changing gears, we thought about selling the business. We thought about keeping this one and opening another location closer to the coast 'cause we're in the foothills of the Apennines, to have one that's a cooking school of the sea and one of them kind of more mountains. We've had lots of different ideas and then thought about even not doing this at all and doing consulting but every time we've looked at other places, whenever we come back here we just love this valley and our crappy road so much. It's a terrible, crappy, dirt dusty road with tons of potholes, but oh it feels like home. And we've become such a part of the community here as well. It's funny because I always think about how at 19 I had no fear of moving from Seattle to New York, at 27 no fear of moving from New York to Italy. But now at like 45, I can't imagine leaving this valley, you know? And that it's really interesting. So we've definitely found where we feel like we should be. I think that's part of what just keeps you going too.

Ed Drozda 22:37

You found your home, you found a place where you belong.

Ashley Bartner 22:40

Exactly.

Ed Drozda 22:41

And you're together there and you both feel this.

Ashley Bartner 22:45

Yep, which is really great.

Ed Drozda 22:47

In business, a lot of people don't have a legitimate partner. What I mean by legitimate is they may be there because one serves a role and another one serves another role, but they're not really able to sense the value and purpose of each other. They're there for a role. That's it. Yours and Jason's relationship, that's the fuel in that tank.

Ashley Bartner 23:09

We had guests our first year. Kind of insight into her marriage. Maybe she was here a day or two and she looked around and saw how secluded we were and how much we are on top of each other, our little property, we're together all the time, and she said wow, you guys must really like each other. And I remember thinking, well, I hope so. We're married. And then I remember thinking, I don't know if a lot of people who are married actually like each other. We're really lucky that we had a good friendship before we started dating, and then we were living together for seven years before we got married. And I think actually a huge thing on my side is that since I had worked in restaurants before, I knew to some extent the chaos of the kitchen and of chefs and that that is their world in the kitchen when you walk through those doors. And the intensity and the professional, almost militaristic system that that kitchen can be on a high level. And I think I have a good sense of humor and thick skin at times, which I think is deeded with this dynamic, where I think other working together dynamics, if you're both like doing accounting or I don't know, could be different, but when you're working in the heat of the kitchen there's times to be, since this is a business podcast, I bet Jason's fired me and kicked me out of the kitchen multiple times. Multiple times for no reason and multiple times, plenty of good reason. He wasn't always wrong, but I knew how to handle it and or to go outside, give him the minute, take the break, suck it up, come back in, put your show face on, and finish the evening for the guests and deal with whatever breakdown happened that evening later. Doing this for 20 years, for sure throughout different years, there's been times where there's been fights and difficulties. In early years more based on finances and that stress that it brought and then later, other things that happen in relationships and businesses, but it is a really fine line at times to walk. And when you have people in your home, wait, if you're fighting for example, could take it to a whole 'nother kind of level or how you have to learn how to deal with it. But, I will give Jason credit, he learned one winter when we weren't working, he decided he wanted to get his pilot's license. It was something he always wanted to do and he said that as a chef, he never had to use his brain. It all just kind of came naturally. So he wanted to know if he could actually think, he could actually use his brain properly and could fly and stay alive. So we moved up to Central France for a winter for three or four months and he got his pilot's license. But that stress and realizing what any stress then in a relationship or business, what you would bring into that when you were flying. It really was like a therapy session in a way to realize what things you need to just let go and things you need to bring up and talk and don't hold it in because it's obviously stressing you out. So there's been the ups and downs in the relationship and the business throughout the years. But I have to say that if you've got a good foundation and a good sense of humor and just love the shit out of each other enough to make it work, you learn so much about each other later through this too, that you could see the writing on the wall or help put out the fire before it starts, which is good. Obviously you've gotta be willing to have good communication. We're not cheesy with it. It's not like we're super, and I don't mean that in a bad way. I mean it like that we're not over the top like tell me how you feel. You just learn after so many years if you hold it in, that doesn't help anything by the time you let it out. And with the business side too, Jason would always say I can handle anything, I just don't like surprises. If there was something wrong that needs to be fixed, just let him know right away because he doesn't wanna find out about it later, where now the time is cut. We have morning business meetings. What's the plan for the day? Who's coming, who's going? And you just get into that rhythm and routine. It also means you definitely have to leave your house. There's no such thing as a staycation 'cause there's always work here. So it's really important to get out, get away from the house and be able to have a trip or get away to remember, oh it's not all the business all the time.

Ed Drozda 27:51

There's so much to unwrap here. You're talking about the relationship between two people, a married couple in this case, but a relationship between any two people or more in a business fundamentally, comes down to these very things you're talking about. And I admire the way that you've been able to bring it together and learn so much about yourselves along the way, as well as together. It would be a lesson for people in business at large to think of it that way. Learning about self and about the people with whom they're working, though they don't have to be married couples, in fact partnerships are one of the groups of folks that I work with in my practice, because oftentimes partners don't take the time to have the breathing space, but to also acknowledge their role and who they are in that relationship. So I thank you for that because it really is bringing out some really important things. You've given me a lot to think about, and certainly those who listen as well. You know, time has a tendency to fly by when you're having fun and when somebody is what seven hours...

Ashley Bartner 29:10

We can keep going.

Ed Drozda 29:11

Somebody's seven hours away.

Ashley Bartner 29:12

You should do it Joe Rogan style and start doing two, three hours.

Ed Drozda 29:17

Oh god no, I can't do that girl. But that doesn't mean we can't come back to it.

Ashley Bartner 29:23

There you go.

Ed Drozda 29:24

So, we do have to wrap up, but before we do, is there anything you'd like to leave us with?

Ashley Bartner 29:30

Oh, here's a fun one. It's such a silly thing, but one of my bosses used to say this and sometimes with life, with the business. Ready, fire, aim. Sometimes you're gonna have to put the cart before the horse and if you ready, steady and you prepare as much as you can, sometimes you're just gonna have to pull that trigger and then hope you had prepared for the best and planned for the best and figure it out as you go. That was kind of what happened out here at times. So, ready, fire, aim.

Ed Drozda 30:02

Thanks for that. My guest today is Ashley Bartner. She's the visionary co-founder and owner of La Tavola Marche, but most importantly a chicken wrangler who has found herself. I want to thank you very kindly, 'cause you've inspired me. And that's what this show is all about.

Ashley Bartner 30:19

Thank you, Ed. Thank you so much. This was a wonderful conversation.

Ed Drozda 30:24

Folks, this is Ed Drozda, The Small Business Doctor, and here at The Water Trough I want to wish you a healthy business and I want to remind you of the words that Ashley has shared with us. Last but not least, ready, fire, aim. See you soon guys. Thank you.