Armenian News Network - Groong: Week In Review Podcast

Tevan Poghosyan - State Sovereignty Day, TRIPP Trap, Iran & Russia Reactions, Kitchen Sink | Ep 464, Aug 24, 2025

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State Sovereignty Day, TRIPP Trap, Reactions, Kitchen Sink

Groong Week in Review - August 24, 2025

Topics

  • August 23: Armenia’s declaration of State Sovereignty
  • The TRIPP Trap
  • Iran - Pezeshkian’s Visit
  • Russia - Overchuk’s visit
  • The Kitchen Sink


Guest

Hosts


Episode 464 | Recorded: August 25, 2025


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Asbed (00:00:04):

Hello, everyone,

Asbed (00:00:05):

and welcome to the Armenian News Network Groong Week in Review for August 24,

Asbed (00:00:08):

2025.

Asbed (00:00:10):

Today, we're talking with Tevan Poghosyan,

Asbed (00:00:12):

who is president of the International Center for Human Development.

Asbed (00:00:16):

Hello, Tevan. Welcome to the Groong Podcast.

Tevan (00:00:18):

Hello, Asbed.

Tevan (00:00:20):

Hello, Hovik.

Tevan (00:00:21):

Thank you for having me today.

Asbed (00:00:23):

Great to have you.

Hovik (00:00:24):

Thank you, Tevan.

Hovik (00:00:26):

Tevan, and folks, we are going to, of course, cover the

Hovik (00:00:32):

uh trump corridor heavily in this episode we know that we have a lot of

Hovik (00:00:36):

international guests who are interested in this topic so you know but before we

Hovik (00:00:41):

jump into specifics of that um so-called you know deal that was brokered in

Hovik (00:00:47):

Washington DC you know we want to sort of help portray or help convey the feelings

Hovik (00:00:54):

of ordinary Armenians now living today and going through these times

Hovik (00:00:59):

In fact,

Hovik (00:01:00):

last week,

Hovik (00:01:02):

August 23rd,

Hovik (00:01:03):

was the 35th anniversary of the declaration of state sovereignty of Armenia,

Hovik (00:01:08):

the so-called declaration of independence,

Hovik (00:01:10):

which was adopted on August 23,

Hovik (00:01:12):

1990.

Hovik (00:01:15):

And it became permanently inscribed in the constitution of the Republic of Armenia

Hovik (00:01:21):

afterwards and the Declaration of Independence.

Hovik (00:01:24):

And now this is exactly the object of this desire by Aliyev and his puppet or his

Hovik (00:01:33):

servant here in Yerevan,

Hovik (00:01:35):

Pashinyan,

Hovik (00:01:36):

to remove or extricate these clauses from the Armenian constitution or any

Hovik (00:01:42):

essentially legal document of the Republic of Armenia.

Hovik (00:01:45):

Specifically, it talks about the unification of Armenia and Artsakh.

Hovik (00:01:50):

Pashinyan now says that he wants to end the struggle for Karabakh.

Hovik (00:01:55):

And he says it flatly to the parents and family of the tens of thousands of people

Hovik (00:02:00):

who gave their dearest over these last decades of war.

Hovik (00:02:05):

He says it to all the people who just even four years ago, this is after the 2020 war,

Hovik (00:02:12):

believed him when he said that his platform for the 2021 elections was going to be

Hovik (00:02:18):

about the occupation of Shushi and Hadrut.

Hovik (00:02:22):

And now he says that he's the leader of an Armenia,

Hovik (00:02:25):

which will have peace imposed on it by force.

Hovik (00:02:29):

And he says that if people don't like it, they can do a revolution.

Hovik (00:02:33):

At the same time, dozens of people are in jail right now,

Hovik (00:02:36):

particularly, for instance,

Hovik (00:02:37):

Mikayel Srbazan.

Hovik (00:02:38):

And what's his offense?

Hovik (00:02:41):

According to Pashinyan, he called for a revolution.

Hovik (00:02:44):

So this is the situation we're living in as Armenian citizens.

Hovik (00:02:49):

And I wanted to ask Tevan your thoughts about the situation in general before we

Hovik (00:02:55):

start talking about the details of the Trump TRIPP trap,

Hovik (00:02:59):

whatever it's called.

Tevan (00:02:59):

In reality, nothing in my view changed in Armenia after the loss of 2020.

Tevan (00:03:12):

Third war, 44 days war, I don't know how you'd put it.

Tevan (00:03:18):

Armenia starting losing and losing,

Tevan (00:03:20):

and until we in power,

Tevan (00:03:22):

we have a loser,

Tevan (00:03:25):

Armenia would be losing again.

Tevan (00:03:28):

The beaten guys would be always beaten at the negotiation table or in the field.

Tevan (00:03:38):

The only one truth that ever said by

Tevan (00:03:42):

today's ruling leader,

Tevan (00:03:46):

is the only,

Tevan (00:03:47):

let's say,

Tevan (00:03:49):

statement which has been always said that if the people of Armenia wouldn't wish

Tevan (00:03:57):

that I will stay in power,

Tevan (00:04:00):

they can do everything and I will not be in power in the next 10 minutes or

Tevan (00:04:09):

something like that.

Tevan (00:04:11):

This is the only truth, but unfortunately is great manipulator.

Tevan (00:04:16):

And by this manipulation,

Tevan (00:04:18):

just to keep his chair or staying in power is a perfectly manipulating.

Tevan (00:04:25):

And a lot of people in my view has been always with the same values.

Tevan (00:04:32):

Let's do historical, a small review.

Tevan (00:04:37):

As of today in 2025,

Tevan (00:04:42):

August 25th.

Tevan (00:04:44):

We have historically the smallest Armenia ever from the time of Tigran the Great

Tevan (00:04:53):

from sea to sea,

Tevan (00:04:55):

which meaning that we have been always the same in our value system.

Tevan (00:05:01):

We have been always losers and always try to give up,

Tevan (00:05:04):

give up for something which is maybe in our value system has been different.

Tevan (00:05:11):

And that's why he's easily manipulating.

Tevan (00:05:14):

You can do the revolution,

Tevan (00:05:15):

but he perfectly knows that if he would go with repressions,

Tevan (00:05:20):

not only Mikayel Srbazan,

Tevan (00:05:22):

Bagrat Srbazan also,

Tevan (00:05:24):

a lot of other political prisoners now in the jail,

Tevan (00:05:29):

Samvel Karapetyan as one of the greatest Armenian benevolent in the history of

Tevan (00:05:35):

Armenia in the jail,

Tevan (00:05:36):

and many,

Tevan (00:05:37):

many of them.

Tevan (00:05:39):

are staying in a jail because he is manipulating with the logic and perfectly

Tevan (00:05:44):

understanding the fear would run possibility to keep up this ruling regime in a

Tevan (00:05:53):

power, and they are doing it.

Tevan (00:05:55):

But in reality,

Tevan (00:05:57):

how they wording it,

Tevan (00:06:00):

how they covering the message,

Tevan (00:06:02):

how the framing is different.

Tevan (00:06:05):

Whatever is necessary, they will call it peace.

Tevan (00:06:10):

I'm starting to come into your Trump position.

Tevan (00:06:15):

For Trump,

Tevan (00:06:16):

there wouldn't be anything interesting in the logic of the peace in the Caucasus

Tevan (00:06:21):

besides of making money.

Tevan (00:06:23):

He's a businessman.

Tevan (00:06:24):

And he's really, in his interest, is the interest of American.

Tevan (00:06:30):

That's why if it's possible to get up guys to sell on them history of making money,

Tevan (00:06:38):

let me do it.

Tevan (00:06:40):

Guys, we will invest some millions for the road, but you will make much more money.

Tevan (00:06:46):

And who is you when he's referring?

Tevan (00:06:50):

Do you think that he's making a difference between Armenians and Azeris?

Tevan (00:06:56):

Zero.

Tevan (00:06:58):

In a one-week time after the peace,

Tevan (00:07:02):

so-called,

Tevan (00:07:03):

I don't know how to say this,

Tevan (00:07:05):

TRIPP or something like this...

Tevan (00:07:09):

He forgot about Armenia.

Tevan (00:07:11):

He didn't remember even the names.

Tevan (00:07:14):

Albania.

Tevan (00:07:15):

"Albania and Aberbaijan".

Tevan (00:07:18):

He wrongly pronounced two countries name.

Tevan (00:07:22):

Which meaning that, guys, it's story about money.

Tevan (00:07:27):

And in this regard,

Tevan (00:07:28):

that story about money,

Tevan (00:07:30):

which is very nicely presented as theoretical thinking.

Tevan (00:07:36):

If there is a road, there should be a trade.

Tevan (00:07:39):

It's meaning that someone would be making money,

Tevan (00:07:41):

but who would be using that road,

Tevan (00:07:43):

how it would be used,

Tevan (00:07:45):

which goods will go and come,

Tevan (00:07:48):

where this money would calculate it is not of any interest.

Hovik (00:07:53):

In fact,

Hovik (00:07:54):

Tevan, I want to tell our listeners,

Hovik (00:07:56):

because we've talked a lot about this from many different angles,

Hovik (00:07:58):

but one angle that I want to highlight today is that,

Hovik (00:08:02):

in fact,

Hovik (00:08:03):

most of the documents signed on that day in Washington

Hovik (00:08:08):

are actually hidden.

Hovik (00:08:11):

There are three documents.

Hovik (00:08:13):

One of them was the Washington's involvement in the crossroads of peace.

Hovik (00:08:20):

Another one's on the so-called artificial intelligence and semiconductors and third

Hovik (00:08:25):

one on energy security.

Hovik (00:08:27):

So Armenia and the United States signed three documents.

Hovik (00:08:30):

None of them

Hovik (00:08:32):

are public as of now, so this is more than two weeks later. Why is Armenian

Tevan (00:08:37):

government keeping the content of these agreements secret uh it's a new modern

Tevan (00:08:46):

value of democracy keep everything hidden from your public. Haven't you heard it,

Tevan (00:08:56):

i've been

Tevan (00:08:57):

taught in my university time that democracy is about three golden rules.

Tevan (00:09:04):

Public should pay taxes.

Tevan (00:09:07):

If you're paying taxes, public have to be informed.

Tevan (00:09:13):

It's a must of any government because they have these rights to be known, everything.

Tevan (00:09:20):

But starting from the last four years,

Tevan (00:09:24):

when the democracy beaten by the autocracy.

Tevan (00:09:28):

But if there is an interest,

Tevan (00:09:30):

then the other strong democracy like US are much more,

Tevan (00:09:34):

or EU,

Tevan (00:09:36):

supporting political prisoners,

Tevan (00:09:39):

supporting political repressions,

Tevan (00:09:42):

supporting hidden policies of the government and call them democracy.

Tevan (00:09:47):

It's a new theory.

Tevan (00:09:48):

It's a new world.

Tevan (00:09:50):

This is the story.

Tevan (00:09:52):

Like everyone knows about artificial intelligence because there was an information

Tevan (00:09:57):

that there would be 500 million investment.

Tevan (00:10:01):

No one knows.

Tevan (00:10:02):

Is this deal signed finally?

Tevan (00:10:05):

It's official or no?

Tevan (00:10:07):

See,

Tevan (00:10:08):

for example, just in one case,

Tevan (00:10:11):

as you know,

Tevan (00:10:12):

in 2015,

Tevan (00:10:13):

there was a movement in Armenia about the Armenian electricity distribution system

Tevan (00:10:20):

and so on.

Tevan (00:10:21):

Everyone has been known.

Tevan (00:10:22):

run by the Russian government,

Tevan (00:10:24):

has sold to Samvel Karapetyan for some amount,

Tevan (00:10:32):

X amount,

Tevan (00:10:33):

300 million,

Tevan (00:10:35):

500 million.

Tevan (00:10:36):

And then Samvel Karapetyan said that I will invest 500 million.

Tevan (00:10:39):

There was a document and so on.

Tevan (00:10:42):

The numbers there, documents there.

Tevan (00:10:44):

Now, the only information that we have, some news in media.

Tevan (00:10:51):

And because Facebook,

Tevan (00:10:53):

Twitter, and everything now is newsmakers,

Tevan (00:10:56):

you never know what is published there.

Tevan (00:10:58):

Is it true or not?

Tevan (00:11:00):

But for example, let's imagine when in one year or two years,

Tevan (00:11:04):

there would be this really artificial intelligence investment of 500 million.

Tevan (00:11:10):

And what?

Tevan (00:11:12):

The one who is investing, that system would be working for them.

Tevan (00:11:17):

If it's American investment, then it works for America.

Tevan (00:11:21):

not for Armenia.

Tevan (00:11:22):

The same was road.

Tevan (00:11:24):

Now, we had noticed that like the Nazi document is about energy security or energy something.

Tevan (00:11:33):

No one knows in reality.

Tevan (00:11:35):

Some that it could be another nuclear power plant build it,

Tevan (00:11:41):

or maybe not even that,

Tevan (00:11:43):

something else.

Tevan (00:11:44):

No one knows, but it's energy.

Tevan (00:11:47):

And the third one is even unknown.

Tevan (00:11:50):

some road who would be building that rule how the system would be working who will

Tevan (00:11:57):

be paying why it's this payment who is the decision maker i don't know but or even

Hovik (00:12:03):

how long like trump says 99 years, Pashinyan says nothing you know, no one knows.

Tevan (00:12:10):

Everyone is presenting because Trump's interest was Nobel peace prize. He got

Tevan (00:12:15):

this letter

Tevan (00:12:17):

Uh, nothing else.

Tevan (00:12:18):

In a one week time, he didn't remember even names of the countries whose guys was there.

Tevan (00:12:24):

But the second,

Tevan (00:12:25):

the most important missing opportunity is that Azerbaijan get the right to make

Tevan (00:12:35):

decision about Armenian roads,

Tevan (00:12:40):

Armenian transit or any kind of roads.

Tevan (00:12:45):

Because, and as a signatory, Trump is a witness of this document.

Tevan (00:12:52):

He is not the side of the contract.

Tevan (00:12:56):

Aliyev is the side,

Tevan (00:12:57):

which meaning that Aliyev once was able to stop one American investment in Armenia.

Tevan (00:13:07):

Two years ago, in Yaraskh, there was a factory that should be built for the

Tevan (00:13:12):

metal production they shoot it so many times until decision has been made to move

Tevan (00:13:19):

the factory even American flags was there to uh airs to show that it's American

Tevan (00:13:27):

investment but Azerbaijan shoot it shoot it and it stopped from that they are

Tevan (00:13:33):

leaving saying i am deciding in which spot of armenia what kind of an institution

Tevan (00:13:40):

you can build

Tevan (00:13:42):

or business you can have.

Tevan (00:13:44):

And now it's official.

Tevan (00:13:46):

It's now and this is official.

Tevan (00:13:48):

If last time,

Tevan (00:13:50):

two years ago, it has been by shooting,

Tevan (00:13:53):

this time it's official with the witnessing of United States of America,

Tevan (00:13:58):

the greatest democracy in the world,

Tevan (00:14:00):

the strongest superpower,

Tevan (00:14:02):

that Azerbaijan has a right to decide whatever is going on in Armenia.

Tevan (00:14:07):

U.S.

Tevan (00:14:08):

president is a witness because that road

Tevan (00:14:12):

communication, electricity,

Tevan (00:14:14):

gas pipelines,

Tevan (00:14:16):

railroad structures,

Tevan (00:14:17):

everything would be decided if Azerbaijan is okay with the tournament.

Hovik (00:14:22):

That even makes the next question even more important to me because the Pashinyan

Hovik (00:14:27):

team now is tripping over each other,

Hovik (00:14:30):

if I can use that word,

Hovik (00:14:31):

pun intended,

Hovik (00:14:34):

saying that this trip road will bring security guarantees to Armenia.

Hovik (00:14:40):

What security can Armenia expect

Hovik (00:14:43):

even if the U.S.

Hovik (00:14:44):

has a stake in this route?

Tevan (00:14:47):

First of all, it's not security guarantees, it's security challenges.

Tevan (00:14:51):

Because,

Tevan (00:14:52):

as you know,

Tevan (00:14:53):

Armenia is living in this,

Tevan (00:14:58):

let's say, world with not only Azerbaijan and Turkey as neighbors.

Tevan (00:15:04):

We have Iran as a neighbor.

Tevan (00:15:06):

Would Iran be okay for the American presence?

Tevan (00:15:10):

See, like I'm saying American presence.

Tevan (00:15:13):

But who knows what will be the end?

Tevan (00:15:15):

Because I know one thing, there is a loss of nature, which no one can change.

Tevan (00:15:23):

The one who is paying, he ordering the music.

Tevan (00:15:26):

And I believe that Trump and U.S.

Tevan (00:15:30):

as countries, whatever if they are going to pay, they would be the ones ordering the music.

Tevan (00:15:37):

And as of today, I know what is the situation in the region.

Tevan (00:15:42):

I perfectly can understand that editor or director of that conductor wouldn't wish

Tevan (00:15:52):

any success for Iran in the region.

Tevan (00:15:55):

And as a neighbor, Russia, the same feeling.

Tevan (00:15:59):

Because whatever we're talking about,

Tevan (00:16:01):

three or three other signed documents,

Tevan (00:16:06):

finally,

Tevan (00:16:07):

there should be some investment,

Tevan (00:16:09):

which means someone would be paying.

Tevan (00:16:11):

And if that someone has still other relationship with Russia or Iran,

Tevan (00:16:16):

it's meaning that they wouldn't be allowing that someone would come and say,

Tevan (00:16:20):

Iran,

Tevan (00:16:21):

let's enjoy this investment.

Tevan (00:16:23):

Let's benefit this investment.

Tevan (00:16:26):

Use this road.

Tevan (00:16:27):

Or Russia, you know, please go and do.

Tevan (00:16:32):

But besides of this, do you think that Russia has finished his presence in the region?

Tevan (00:16:39):

What is the statement of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation,

Tevan (00:16:44):

which said that no one has canceled November 9 ceasefire agreements,

Tevan (00:16:52):

specifically 0.9 of that agreement?

Tevan (00:16:56):

Now, can you imagine that U.S.

Tevan (00:16:59):

is paying for the roads which should be under the control of the Russian border guard?

Tevan (00:17:05):

As of today, I cannot imagine.

Tevan (00:17:07):

Then my question, guys, about what we're talking.

Tevan (00:17:12):

And the second, if so much everything is perfect, why Azerbaijan hasn't signed it finally?

Tevan (00:17:21):

That said, this is something pre-signing.

Tevan (00:17:27):

element and if you coming the details devil in details check the statement of

Tevan (00:17:36):

today's ruling dictator of armenia uh in the white house at the table near trump

Tevan (00:17:43):

and check the wording of our enemy alive yeah

Tevan (00:17:49):

Everything is clear.

Hovik (00:17:51):

Yeah, I was gonna say so when Pashinyan came to Yerevan He gave a 30-minute speech where

Hovik (00:17:57):

and someone counted this but in this 30-minute speech He used the word peace 50

Hovik (00:18:03):

times Aliyev

Hovik (00:18:05):

came back, he went to Kelbajar, or Karvachar, Armenian Karvachar.

Hovik (00:18:10):

He met with the implanted residents there.

Hovik (00:18:12):

And in that speech, he used the word enemy about Armenia four times.

Hovik (00:18:19):

Things like, you know, we have defeated the enemy, we have forced the enemy to capitulate.

Hovik (00:18:24):

so exactly you know my question is how sincere is Aliyev or even his his stooge his

Hovik (00:18:30):

puppet in Yerevan about peace what kind of peace is being sold by both of these

Tevan (00:18:35):

people and is that even possible probably on your question i would say this if you

Tevan (00:18:40):

are really armenian you need to be feeling you so good that you got such an honest

Tevan (00:18:49):

uh enemy Aliyev always

Tevan (00:18:53):

openly presenting what is thinking,

Tevan (00:18:57):

what is real relationship,

Tevan (00:18:59):

what is his real attitude,

Tevan (00:19:01):

and what is real plans.

Tevan (00:19:04):

It's a given kind of way.

Tevan (00:19:07):

You don't need to even have a special security or special forces to understand what

Tevan (00:19:12):

is in mind of Aliyev.

Tevan (00:19:14):

He's wishing to destroy Armenia, and he's doing it.

Tevan (00:19:19):

And he's openly telling it.

Tevan (00:19:21):

The only problem as of today is that

Tevan (00:19:23):

His Armenian nation would wake up and as,

Tevan (00:19:27):

for example,

Tevan (00:19:28):

has been said by today's ruling government,

Tevan (00:19:31):

if the nation of people would wish,

Tevan (00:19:34):

I wouldn't be staying even 10 minutes in power.

Tevan (00:19:38):

The only one problem is here,

Tevan (00:19:40):

how long Armenian nation would be standing if we living in a logic that our nation

Tevan (00:19:50):

is the same who has been

Tevan (00:19:53):

initiating and generating Karabakh movement back in 1988,

Tevan (00:20:00):

who has been in advance,

Tevan (00:20:01):

who has been fighting and taking everything to then August 23,

Tevan (00:20:08):

1990, not 91,

Tevan (00:20:09):

as today a ruling dictator has been made.

Tevan (00:20:13):

It's not mistaken.

Tevan (00:20:15):

It's not a mistake.

Tevan (00:20:17):

Believe me, it's not a mistake.

Tevan (00:20:18):

He perfectly understand it, that he is talking about 90.

Tevan (00:20:21):

It's meaning that he needs to say that Artsakh and Hayastani Hanrapetutyun have

Tevan (00:20:27):

been the same root and beginning of the independence.

Tevan (00:20:33):

Artsakh movement was the base and foundation for the independence desire in the

Tevan (00:20:43):

Republic of Armenia.

Tevan (00:20:45):

this is the same that's why it's not mistake he's done it specifically but the most

Tevan (00:20:51):

important let me say and and whenever it's in the air and next day i will find how

Tevan (00:20:56):

to explain it in a different world how to manipulate by this that's why whenever

Tevan (00:21:03):

it's needed it's Artsakh is armenia and full stop whenever is needed we will go that

Tevan (00:21:11):

Our pre-election campaign is about deliberation of Hadrut and Shushi,

Tevan (00:21:17):

and whenever it's needed,

Tevan (00:21:19):

Artsakh is a security threat for the occupied Republic of Armenia.

Hovik (00:21:24):

Okay,

Hovik (00:21:26):

now we all know that the trip agreements were essentially memoranda of

Hovik (00:21:31):

understanding and intent towards a certain goal like the Trump route,

Hovik (00:21:36):

you know,

Hovik (00:21:37):

which probably many are doubting would even happen.

Hovik (00:21:41):

Key factors that could influence the outcome of how this goes could be like the

Hovik (00:21:48):

war, the outcome of the war in Ukraine,

Hovik (00:21:50):

the outcome of parliamentary elections in 2026 in Armenia,

Hovik (00:21:54):

perhaps even a renewed U.S.-Israeli war on Iran.

Hovik (00:21:58):

So there's a lot of things in the air right now.

Hovik (00:22:01):

And I want to ask you, what do you expect the next stages of this Trump route agreement to be?

Hovik (00:22:08):

And how would it unfold in your opinion?

Tevan (00:22:12):

Honestly saying, for me, it's understanding of intention, how you said it.

Tevan (00:22:18):

For example,

Tevan (00:22:19):

when I was born,

Tevan (00:22:20):

I was living in Stepanakert and I was thinking how to rebuild and make it

Tevan (00:22:28):

stronger,

Tevan (00:22:30):

my grandfather's house.

Tevan (00:22:32):

Then the life changed me and then I've been in Armenia and been singing with the big family,

Tevan (00:22:40):

I need to build a house.

Tevan (00:22:42):

Then you're visiting architect, telling him you're some dreaming elements.

Tevan (00:22:48):

At the moment when architect is putting a painting,

Tevan (00:22:52):

then you go to the engineer construction guys and he's making so many differences

Tevan (00:23:00):

on the possibilities,

Tevan (00:23:01):

what is possible or not possible.

Tevan (00:23:04):

Now,

Tevan (00:23:05):

In Washington, D.C., they have been speaking.

Tevan (00:23:08):

I don't know even if they've been discussing something on demand.

Tevan (00:23:13):

But imagine next day some construction guys coming and saying that,

Tevan (00:23:17):

oh, you know,

Tevan (00:23:18):

this is a mountain.

Tevan (00:23:20):

I don't know how I will be going here with the tunnel or do whatever.

Tevan (00:23:25):

Oh, we're thinking that it should be $42 million investment.

Tevan (00:23:29):

Oh, now it's $420 million investment.

Tevan (00:23:32):

We are not agreed on this.

Tevan (00:23:34):

And something would stop.

Tevan (00:23:35):

Or, as you said, are U.S.

Tevan (00:23:38):

and Israel fighting Iran?

Tevan (00:23:41):

Iran is retaliating.

Tevan (00:23:43):

I don't know what will be here.

Tevan (00:23:45):

Azerbaijan and Turkey is attacking and taking it by force.

Tevan (00:23:50):

Russia is saying that it's enough, more than enough.

Tevan (00:23:55):

I have an agreement on November 9,

Tevan (00:23:58):

and besides of that,

Tevan (00:23:59):

the South Caucasus is historical,

Tevan (00:24:01):

my interest part.

Tevan (00:24:03):

Or maybe the China saying that,

Tevan (00:24:05):

you know, I put so many investments to build up a railroad to Tehran,

Tevan (00:24:10):

that from Tehran that railroad should take from through Armenia to Batumi.

Tevan (00:24:17):

Who said that it should be controlled by the US?

Tevan (00:24:22):

Because there are so many if, who knows, how, when it will be calculated.

Tevan (00:24:31):

Yeah, trip is a nice Hollywood scenario.

Tevan (00:24:36):

Because depending on who would be the editor of this final movie making,

Tevan (00:24:44):

and you perfectly better than me knows,

Tevan (00:24:47):

there are so many books written by authors,

Tevan (00:24:50):

but whenever the movie is done,

Tevan (00:24:52):

so many stuff are changed from the book to movie.

Tevan (00:24:56):

And in reality, I don't think that it would be so simple.

Tevan (00:25:02):

And I believe that in upcoming episodes,

Tevan (00:25:05):

Still a year or two,

Tevan (00:25:06):

it would be just a point of manipulation by way,

Tevan (00:25:12):

way stronger on the information.

Asbed (00:25:16):

Tevan, I want to ask you a little more about Iran,

Asbed (00:25:20):

as you mentioned,

Asbed (00:25:21):

because last week,

Asbed (00:25:23):

President Masoud Pezeshkian made his first official visit to Yerevan.

Asbed (00:25:27):

And in fact, it was the first time since 2019 that an Iranian president had visited

Asbed (00:25:32):

More than 10 agreements were inked covering politics,

Asbed (00:25:36):

culture, energy,

Asbed (00:25:37):

science,

Asbed (00:25:38):

yet overshadowing the handshakes was the elephant in the room,

Asbed (00:25:42):

you know, the so-called Trump route.

Asbed (00:25:44):

And Tehran has long resisted any redrawing of Armenia's maps.

Asbed (00:25:48):

And as you mentioned,

Asbed (00:25:49):

it would not want anybody else to be in control except Armenia and Iran,

Asbed (00:25:53):

any kind of corridor that's going to go through that.

Asbed (00:25:56):

But the announcement of TRIP in Washington split opinions in Iran.

Asbed (00:26:00):

Supreme Leader Khamenei's circle and the IRGC issued a sharp rebuke and even

Asbed (00:26:06):

military threats,

Asbed (00:26:07):

maybe,

Asbed (00:26:08):

while the more constructivist camp of the president and the Ministry of Foreign

Asbed (00:26:11):

Affairs struck a cautious measure tone.

Asbed (00:26:14):

As Ovik mentioned,

Asbed (00:26:15):

Armenian officials have been tripping over themselves,

Asbed (00:26:18):

trying to swear that the corridor will not ruffle Iran's interests or chip away at

Asbed (00:26:22):

Armenia's sovereignty.

Asbed (00:26:23):

But after leaving Armenia,

Asbed (00:26:26):

Masoud Pezeshkian made a tweet saying,

Asbed (00:26:28):

our concerns regarding the presence of third party forces near our common borders

Asbed (00:26:34):

must be fully addressed.

Asbed (00:26:35):

So it seems like during his visit,

Asbed (00:26:38):

the concerns went from seeming to have been addressed to must be fully addressed.

Asbed (00:26:42):

Does it seem like Pezeshkian returned from Armenia with more questions than answers

Asbed (00:26:46):

about Iran's concerns about the Trump route?

Tevan (00:26:51):

Today,

Tevan (00:26:52):

you even can know that his talk with President Putin,

Tevan (00:26:57):

and there was even another formula discussed,

Tevan (00:27:00):

that all regional issues should be resolved by a 3 + 3 formula.

Tevan (00:27:07):

If you didn't follow still news,

Tevan (00:27:10):

then you need to know that President Pezeshkian and Putin today started to talk and

Tevan (00:27:15):

presented that information that,

Tevan (00:27:17):

in their views,

Tevan (00:27:19):

issues in the region should be resolved by three plus three format questions,

Tevan (00:27:25):

which meaning Russia,

Tevan (00:27:27):

Iran, Turkey,

Tevan (00:27:28):

Georgia, Armenia,

Tevan (00:27:29):

Azerbaijan.

Tevan (00:27:30):

There is no any US.

Tevan (00:27:32):

Second,

Tevan (00:27:33):

I think Iranian diplomacy also learned the new approaches of democratic war,

Tevan (00:27:43):

that when it's needed,

Tevan (00:27:46):

dictator can be a great leader.

Tevan (00:27:49):

Trump sent a photo to Aliyev with such a signature that you are a great leader,

Tevan (00:27:57):

which means that democracy is congratulating autocracy as a great leader.

Tevan (00:28:03):

The same way Israel,

Tevan (00:28:04):

their religious leaders can say that,

Tevan (00:28:07):

okay,

Tevan (00:28:08):

I can go with the strong message,

Tevan (00:28:11):

our civilian leader,

Tevan (00:28:13):

you're making this nice move.

Tevan (00:28:14):

The world is manipulating with us.

Tevan (00:28:18):

We have been

Tevan (00:28:19):

trying to deal their nuclear deal.

Tevan (00:28:22):

Instead of that, we got the 12 days military attacks.

Tevan (00:28:27):

Now, we will be plagued by the three guys.

Tevan (00:28:30):

Military forces, one message.

Tevan (00:28:33):

Religious leaders, one message.

Tevan (00:28:36):

Syphilians, one message.

Tevan (00:28:38):

Today, we can change like this.

Tevan (00:28:39):

Next day, like this.

Tevan (00:28:41):

So, like, if you're following the Pezeshkian, he kind of a first welcome, calmly.

Tevan (00:28:50):

Then it has been visit here with some messages.

Tevan (00:28:54):

Then he went to Belarus with a bit stronger messages.

Tevan (00:28:59):

Then today by phone with Putin, he changed it.

Tevan (00:29:02):

Can you guarantee that if even today Trump's making a statement,

Tevan (00:29:07):

we are not paying anymore for Ukraine war,

Tevan (00:29:10):

he wouldn't be saying that,

Tevan (00:29:12):

guys, you know,

Tevan (00:29:13):

I'm not going to pay for anything that Iranian and Russian trucks would be paying.

Tevan (00:29:20):

benefiting.

Tevan (00:29:21):

Because whatever he said in the beginning, this is a road for everyone.

Tevan (00:29:27):

If everyone, again, I'm saying that I'm not able to change my geography.

Tevan (00:29:32):

My one neighbor is Iran, another neighbor, Russia.

Tevan (00:29:37):

And finally, China built a railroad to Tehran for its communication.

Tevan (00:29:43):

Is U.S.

Tevan (00:29:44):

going to

Tevan (00:29:45):

really put the money for benefiting of these three countries.

Tevan (00:29:49):

Ask yourself and get the answer.

Tevan (00:29:52):

I don't know.

Tevan (00:29:53):

I have a very big suspicion about this.

Tevan (00:29:56):

Or finally,

Tevan (00:29:57):

they would say that, you know,

Tevan (00:29:58):

guys,

Tevan (00:30:00):

there should be only Azerbaijani,

Tevan (00:30:02):

Turkish,

Tevan (00:30:03):

and Europeans passing this through.

Tevan (00:30:07):

And then we would be having another problem.

Tevan (00:30:10):

Again, I'm saying that, yes, until it's a Hollywood scenario,

Tevan (00:30:16):

Everyone can manipulate in the media as they wish, depending who is strong.

Tevan (00:30:22):

But when it's coming to the reality to fulfill on the land,

Tevan (00:30:26):

there should be an engineer construction worker and finally bank endorsing your

Tevan (00:30:32):

credit or saying that someone is paying until it's not there.

Tevan (00:30:38):

This is a nice project about what could be a lot of materials written, but never fulfilled.

Asbed (00:30:47):

Tevan, you mentioned the 12-day war.

Asbed (00:30:50):

There are a lot of concerns internationally that Israel's demands or concerns about

Asbed (00:30:55):

the nuclear program in Iran have not been addressed with that war.

Asbed (00:30:58):

And there could be another US-Israeli aggression against Iran,

Asbed (00:31:02):

possibly before the end of 2025 or maybe during 2026.

Asbed (00:31:06):

If that were to happen,

Asbed (00:31:09):

do you think that Iran has the bandwidth to defend its so-called red lines about

Asbed (00:31:13):

the Armenian-Iranian border sanctity?

Tevan (00:31:17):

As much as they can,

Tevan (00:31:19):

as much as they able,

Tevan (00:31:22):

as much as they would be ready,

Tevan (00:31:24):

and as much as it's in their interest.

Tevan (00:31:28):

But can you tell me what is the interest of Iran to defend the Armenian border?

Tevan (00:31:34):

Is it because of nice Armenian eyes?

Asbed (00:31:37):

Well, they are defending Iranian interests, not just Armenian interests.

Asbed (00:31:42):

They're defending their own.

Tevan (00:31:44):

And then what is the Iranian interest?

Tevan (00:31:46):

Our Iranian interest for this border, which is the reason?

Tevan (00:31:52):

Until we are not asking why Iran is wishing to defend it.

Tevan (00:31:57):

It's meaning that they have something.

Tevan (00:32:00):

Imagine Iran is defending that I need Armenia,

Tevan (00:32:06):

not Azerbaijan and Turkey,

Tevan (00:32:08):

passing through this place.

Tevan (00:32:12):

Because Iran has a road through Azerbaijan.

Tevan (00:32:17):

If it's only Iran, Russia, they have a Caspian Sea.

Tevan (00:32:22):

They don't need neither Azerbaijan nor Armenia for this road.

Tevan (00:32:27):

Much cheaper, much easier, much direct, much secure.

Tevan (00:32:34):

Iran has Turkmenistan links go through the other places.

Tevan (00:32:39):

Which meaning that for Iran,

Tevan (00:32:42):

there is something over which through Armenia should be something over.

Tevan (00:32:47):

And as I understand, in the world, there is a consensus.

Tevan (00:32:52):

Iran should be as much stronger as not allow Turkey to get high in the region.

Tevan (00:32:59):

Turkey should be as much stronger, not allow Iran get high in the region.

Tevan (00:33:06):

No one is going to destroy Iran,

Tevan (00:33:08):

which will be keeping against Turkey,

Tevan (00:33:10):

and no one is going to destroy Turkey against Iran.

Tevan (00:33:15):

But all these games in all these parts will be the point.

Tevan (00:33:22):

All the strongest will get their interest.

Tevan (00:33:25):

What will be the destiny of Armenia?

Tevan (00:33:27):

Because for me, it's not an interest.

Tevan (00:33:30):

Iran is benefiting, not benefiting of this.

Tevan (00:33:33):

Turkey is benefiting, is not benefiting of this road.

Tevan (00:33:36):

Azerbaijan is benefiting, not benefiting.

Tevan (00:33:39):

Russia is benefiting, not benefiting.

Tevan (00:33:40):

China is benefiting.

Tevan (00:33:42):

For me, it's only one issue.

Tevan (00:33:45):

Is Armenia benefiting?

Tevan (00:33:47):

Absolutely. And when I'm finally understanding that Armenia is out of the game and everyone is

Tevan (00:33:53):

deciding, and I think we have discussed this a few months ago,

Tevan (00:33:57):

you can take one of our previous,

Tevan (00:33:59):

when I said it,

Tevan (00:34:00):

in my view,

Tevan (00:34:01):

there's an international consensus that the road should be working.

Tevan (00:34:08):

And there is only one fight with controlling that road.

Tevan (00:34:12):

And now we're guarding that the two countries, U.S.

Tevan (00:34:17):

and Azerbaijan, make a deal.

Tevan (00:34:21):

I don't know for which interest, but a control should be under this too.

Tevan (00:34:26):

First of all, Azerbaijan signed that they have a stake to permit or not permit or allow this.

Tevan (00:34:33):

And America says,

Tevan (00:34:35):

guys,

Tevan (00:34:36):

good or bad, I will see whatever is possible to invest for this road existence.

Tevan (00:34:41):

But it's not stopped the conflict of controlling.

Tevan (00:34:44):

It's still with Iran,

Tevan (00:34:45):

Russia,

Tevan (00:34:46):

Turkey, China,

Tevan (00:34:47):

and many others who would be benefiting from this control.

Tevan (00:34:51):

It's not about road, which meaning it's not about Armenia anymore.

Tevan (00:34:55):

Finally.

Asbed (00:34:55):

Yeah.

Asbed (00:34:56):

Like you said, Armenia really is not at the table.

Asbed (00:34:59):

It's actually on the menu.

Tevan (00:35:02):

I think very soon it wouldn't be in a menu.

Tevan (00:35:05):

It will be in the rubbish.

Tevan (00:35:07):

And the issue is, will someone load Armenia?

Tevan (00:35:11):

And I think, once again, we can't get the point.

Tevan (00:35:14):

Again, I'm not so much genius, but who said that if we'll lose Artsakh, we will turn.

Tevan (00:35:20):

Armenian statehood in this last historical page.

Tevan (00:35:24):

And we turn it.

Asbed (00:35:26):

And that is happening right now, right before our eyes.

Tevan (00:35:29):

Our enemies put the pen or pencil or I don't know what kind of a stuff in the hand

Tevan (00:35:35):

of this today's ruling dictator and said that now fulfill.

Tevan (00:35:40):

It's not Ararat.

Tevan (00:35:42):

It's Aragats.

Tevan (00:35:43):

It's not genocide.

Tevan (00:35:44):

Who knows this word?

Tevan (00:35:46):

It's not Karabakh movement.

Tevan (00:35:48):

It's not existing.

Tevan (00:35:49):

until he will say that it's not Yerevan and it's not Armenia Republic and we'll

Tevan (00:35:54):

make a full stop.

Tevan (00:35:55):

That's why he's fighting against independence declaration.

Asbed (00:35:59):

I want to ask another question about Pezeshkian's visits,

Asbed (00:36:03):

because right after going to Armenia,

Asbed (00:36:06):

he went to Belarus and talked to Lukashenko there.

Asbed (00:36:09):

In that visit,

Asbed (00:36:10):

the two leaders decided that they want to increase trade across the border,

Asbed (00:36:14):

the Eurasian Economic Union border between Iran and the union,

Asbed (00:36:19):

which is actually the Iran-Armenia border.

Asbed (00:36:23):

How should we read that signal?

Asbed (00:36:24):

Should we read that as indicating critical stake in the border and the sovereignty

Asbed (00:36:30):

of Armenia over that border?

Asbed (00:36:33):

What are they saying? Are they saying that they are going to defend their economic interests there?

Tevan (00:36:38):

I would say that it's such an untrustful situation with Yerevan that he's went to

Tevan (00:36:46):

another capital of Eurasian Economic Union,

Tevan (00:36:50):

Minsk.

Tevan (00:36:51):

before he would finally speak with an Azure capital Moscow,

Tevan (00:36:56):

which is done today,

Tevan (00:36:59):

about the following.

Tevan (00:37:00):

Guys,

Tevan (00:37:01):

as I said,

Tevan (00:37:02):

I have an interest with the cooperation with the Eurasian Economic Union,

Tevan (00:37:06):

but then you need to discuss how we will be keeping up this border.

Tevan (00:37:11):

Because I am now an associated member and signed a treaty to join this custom,

Tevan (00:37:18):

all the properties,

Tevan (00:37:21):

stake, uh, and trust that, uh, all the borders crossing would be proper.

Tevan (00:37:28):

And on that regard,

Tevan (00:37:30):

he is trying to understand there was like,

Tevan (00:37:33):

Iranian,

Tevan (00:37:34):

uh,

Tevan (00:37:35):

civil president Pezeshkian also went to Shushi.

Tevan (00:37:39):

He did.

Tevan (00:37:40):

Parallel to his visit.

Tevan (00:37:42):

There have been every day in Iranian media that they have full information that

Tevan (00:37:48):

Azerbaijan has been helping with Israel by providing surveillance information,

Tevan (00:37:54):

I don't know,

Tevan (00:37:55):

something like this.

Tevan (00:37:56):

And even from their territory, there has been attacks on Iran.

Tevan (00:38:00):

But Pezeshkian went to Shushi.

Tevan (00:38:02):

It's, I think, new policy of Iran on how they...

Tevan (00:38:07):

building up their democracy,

Tevan (00:38:09):

trying to keep up the doors open,

Tevan (00:38:11):

but also to checking their information.

Tevan (00:38:14):

We never have been heard about Belarus and Iran, great cooperation or something like this.

Tevan (00:38:25):

And finally,

Tevan (00:38:26):

what is today,

Tevan (00:38:27):

it has been,

Tevan (00:38:28):

I think,

Tevan (00:38:29):

the most important and issue deciding day was today when his speech was put in.

Tevan (00:38:34):

What is the real discussion?

Tevan (00:38:36):

It's very difficult to say,

Tevan (00:38:37):

but whatever is has been interesting that for at least this region,

Tevan (00:38:43):

they see the proper format for resolution of all issues in the three plus three

Tevan (00:38:48):

format and not anything else.

Hovik (00:38:51):

Tevan,

Hovik (00:38:53):

this news from today is interesting because I should also mention that after this

Hovik (00:39:02):

TRIPP announcement,

Hovik (00:39:03):

Russia's Deputy Prime Minister Alexei Overchuk also flew to Yerevan and some of

Hovik (00:39:10):

these issues were also discussed.

Hovik (00:39:11):

But essentially Overchuk reminded that Russia still has interests in the region.

Hovik (00:39:19):

There is the EAEU and Russia has a base in Gyumri and the economic dependence of

Hovik (00:39:26):

Yerevan against Russia.

Hovik (00:39:29):

And I understand what you said,

Hovik (00:39:30):

which is that Russia,

Hovik (00:39:32):

you know,

Hovik (00:39:33):

said that things should be solved within the framework of 3 + 3.

Tevan (00:39:37):

Not Russia, only Iran also.

Hovik (00:39:40):

But what can they do exactly?

Hovik (00:39:42):

Are they willing to commit military resources?

Hovik (00:39:47):

Because it seems like Turkey and Azerbaijan are very committed to committing

Hovik (00:39:52):

military resources to get this thing done.

Hovik (00:39:55):

Meanwhile, all we're hearing from Russia is very diplomatic language, to put it mildly.

Tevan (00:40:03):

There was a lot of very diplomatic Russian language before the Ukrainian war.

Tevan (00:40:12):

Guys, it's very difficult to say that what Russia would do.

Tevan (00:40:17):

There is one interesting proverb.

Tevan (00:40:19):

You never would be able to understand Russia by brain.

Hovik (00:40:24):

Yeah, by reason, maybe.

Tevan (00:40:28):

By reason, yeah.

Tevan (00:40:32):

It's very difficult to understand Russia by reason.

Tevan (00:40:34):

You never know.

Tevan (00:40:36):

But who said that?

Tevan (00:40:39):

100 years ago,

Tevan (00:40:40):

there wasn't been a Russia 11th Red Army who penetrated the region and make a

Tevan (00:40:47):

Sovietization of Georgia-Azerbaijan army,

Tevan (00:40:51):

and so on.

Tevan (00:40:52):

I don't know.

Tevan (00:40:53):

It's very difficult to say.

Tevan (00:40:54):

But imagine Russia and Azerbaijan signing in,

Tevan (00:41:00):

at least like a union documents,

Tevan (00:41:04):

friendship,

Tevan (00:41:05):

I don't know, something like this.

Tevan (00:41:07):

One day,

Tevan (00:41:08):

Russia's attacking all Azerbaijani diaspora guys,

Tevan (00:41:12):

and then next day,

Tevan (00:41:14):

Russia attacking all Azerbaijani investment in Ukraine.

Tevan (00:41:18):

Who said that? The next, I don't know, this UVA or some missiles will not fly to one side.

Tevan (00:41:27):

Let's not forget the world changed.

Tevan (00:41:29):

Turkey can shoot Russian planes, Russia can

Tevan (00:41:33):

fight something else.

Asbed (00:41:36):

Tevan, Azerbaijan can shoot Russian helicopters.

Tevan (00:41:41):

The same way.

Tevan (00:41:42):

With impunity.

Tevan (00:41:43):

And Russia can shoot the Azerbaijani airplane.

Tevan (00:41:48):

It is a different world.

Tevan (00:41:50):

Yeah, that's why I'm saying that it's very difficult.

Tevan (00:41:53):

It's all coming to the point how they would be reading their interest.

Tevan (00:41:59):

In this regard, Ovik, your question is following.

Tevan (00:42:02):

Do we as a state,

Tevan (00:42:04):

as an all institutions,

Tevan (00:42:08):

or possibility to influence on the others breeding their interests?

Tevan (00:42:16):

Once we have been very proud nation, always saying that Armenian lobby in the U.S.

Tevan (00:42:22):

is so strong, they can do everything.

Tevan (00:42:25):

Armenian lobby lost 907.

Tevan (00:42:30):

Armenian lobby is not able to do it now or anything.

Tevan (00:42:36):

Armenians has a big influence in Russia.

Tevan (00:42:39):

I don't know if they can do something.

Tevan (00:42:42):

They know it now, having Samvel Karapetyan even there to do something.

Tevan (00:42:47):

Armenian lobby once has an in France.

Tevan (00:42:53):

Armenian lobby don't have anymore anyone in Paris to influence on there.

Tevan (00:43:01):

Other countries can decide,

Tevan (00:43:03):

shoot each other,

Tevan (00:43:04):

fight each other,

Tevan (00:43:06):

make a deal with each other,

Tevan (00:43:07):

make a peace with each other,

Tevan (00:43:09):

make a trade with each other.

Tevan (00:43:11):

How much we have now ability to influence the others,

Tevan (00:43:16):

read their interest in a way that they will think about Armenia.

Tevan (00:43:23):

Because your question, who does Azerbaijan and Russia or Turkey

Tevan (00:43:29):

or Iran be able to fight each other to defend something?

Tevan (00:43:36):

It's not so much interest of me.

Tevan (00:43:39):

What if they one day decide to shoot on which territory it would be?

Tevan (00:43:44):

If it's about destroying Armenian territory and someone else is capturing,

Tevan (00:43:48):

what is the difference?

Tevan (00:43:49):

Is it Azerbaijan, Turkey, US, Russia, China, or someone else?

Tevan (00:43:54):

It's captured Armenian territory.

Tevan (00:43:57):

And it's not anymore Armenian.

Tevan (00:43:59):

This should be our issue.

Tevan (00:44:02):

And unfortunately, we're going to destroy it.

Tevan (00:44:05):

We're discussing hypothetically about some peace treaty,

Tevan (00:44:10):

but whenever it's coming to details,

Tevan (00:44:13):

as you mentioned,

Tevan (00:44:14):

we don't know the real documents.

Tevan (00:44:19):

We don't know what it would become.

Tevan (00:44:22):

We don't know what is the real plans.

Tevan (00:44:25):

The only one thing that we really know is how Azerbaijan is happy about this.

Tevan (00:44:30):

Now, by your own words, in Karvachar, Aliyev called us four-time enemies.

Tevan (00:44:37):

Can you imagine in one day Aliyev changed and become such a peaceful dove that he's

Tevan (00:44:45):

so happy about this trip?

Tevan (00:44:48):

Just ask yourself, not me.

Tevan (00:44:52):

Stand in the front of mirror.

Tevan (00:44:54):

Look at this and ask, how it's possible that Aliyev is so happy about this document?

Tevan (00:45:00):

doesn't mean that there's something good for him or vice versa.

Tevan (00:45:05):

Until any Armenians wouldn't be asking himself,

Tevan (00:45:10):

wouldn't be changing himself,

Tevan (00:45:11):

and wouldn't be honest by himself,

Tevan (00:45:15):

we'll be losing and losing.

Tevan (00:45:17):

From the sea to sea Armenia, becoming historically the smallest Armenia ever.

Tevan (00:45:23):

And it will be still in the plans to become smaller and smaller.

Asbed (00:45:28):

Let's wrap up our topics here.

Asbed (00:45:30):

Let me give every one of you a chance to sound off and share something that's been

Asbed (00:45:36):

on your mind with our listeners.

Asbed (00:45:38):

Hovik, you want to go first?

Hovik (00:45:42):

Well,

Hovik (00:45:45):

as heartbreaking as the situation of Armenians under this occupation regime is,

Hovik (00:45:52):

I have to take,

Hovik (00:45:54):

you know,

Hovik (00:45:56):

It would be criminal not to mention that right now a genocide,

Hovik (00:46:00):

a child-murdering,

Hovik (00:46:01):

child-killing genocide is continuing unabated.

Hovik (00:46:04):

In fact, it's being increased in Gaza.

Hovik (00:46:08):

And I believe at least the conservative number is more than 19,000 children have

Hovik (00:46:14):

been killed in Gaza since October 7,

Hovik (00:46:17):

2023.

Hovik (00:46:20):

To me, it's beyond comprehension how this is allowed to happen.

Hovik (00:46:25):

Maybe that explains why Artsakh was allowed to happen at the same time.

Hovik (00:46:31):

Now,

Hovik (00:46:32):

what's interesting is that even aid organizations are being instrumented to help

Hovik (00:46:37):

the genocide continue.

Hovik (00:46:39):

And I'm talking about the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation, which is, you know, they closed down

Hovik (00:46:44):

UNRWA,

Hovik (00:46:45):

they closed down all the aid organizations,

Hovik (00:46:48):

which previously were distributing aid through 400 distribution points in Gaza.

Hovik (00:46:53):

And now there are only three or four distribution points,

Hovik (00:46:56):

and they're all being handled by this organization called the Gaza Humanitarian

Hovik (00:47:03):

Foundation.

Hovik (00:47:05):

And if you've been watching alternative media,

Hovik (00:47:08):

you would know that there is this Lieutenant Colonel Aguilar who is coming out in

Hovik (00:47:14):

public about what's really going on.

Hovik (00:47:16):

Basically, this Gaza Humanitarian Foundation,

Hovik (00:47:19):

which is allegedly controlled by the government of Israel through shady means,

Hovik (00:47:24):

basically is starving

Hovik (00:47:27):

all the survivors who weren't killed by bombs.

Hovik (00:47:31):

And what's even more reprehensible is that one of the people whose name is

Hovik (00:47:36):

associated with this Gaza Humanitarian Foundation is a certain David

Hovik (00:47:41):

Papazian,

Hovik (00:47:42):

an Armenian,

Hovik (00:47:44):

and I'm ashamed to say,

Hovik (00:47:47):

son of a famous diplomat Papazian,

Hovik (00:47:50):

who was an acting foreign minister,

Hovik (00:47:52):

Vahan Papazian,

Hovik (00:47:54):

acting foreign minister.

Hovik (00:47:56):

More notoriously,

Hovik (00:47:58):

he, David Papazian,

Hovik (00:47:59):

was also in charge of ANIF,

Hovik (00:48:02):

Armenian National Investment Fund,

Hovik (00:48:05):

and that, you know,

Tevan (00:48:07):

And now there is even criminal case against him is open,

Tevan (00:48:11):

and now he's under investigation.

Hovik (00:48:15):

Yeah, Middle East Eye published a story where they have referred David Papazian for a

Hovik (00:48:20):

criminal investigation.

Hovik (00:48:22):

The journalist involved,

Hovik (00:48:25):

his name is Elis Gjevori,

Hovik (00:48:27):

I believe I'm pronouncing that correctly,

Hovik (00:48:29):

he has reached out to me asking why the Armenian government is being unresponsive

Hovik (00:48:36):

about his request.

Hovik (00:48:39):

I don't know whether to laugh,

Hovik (00:48:41):

but if anyone knows any information about David Papazian,

Hovik (00:48:46):

and if there are any investigative journalists in Armenia who want to be involved

Hovik (00:48:50):

in helping Mr.

Hovik (00:48:53):

Gjevori to do this investigation on the Armenian side,

Hovik (00:48:57):

please reach out to us and I'll put you in touch.

Hovik (00:49:00):

And I think it's important to help achieve justice.

Hovik (00:49:05):

And if even one Armenian finger is involved in the Gaza genocide,

Hovik (00:49:10):

I want to cut that Armenian finger off.

Asbed (00:49:13):

Yeah, thank you, Hovik.

Asbed (00:49:14):

We'll try and find some good links and put them in the show notes about this.

Asbed (00:49:18):

Tevan, what's on your mind?

Tevan (00:49:20):

I'm honestly now saying that maybe it would be perfect to have our discussion on September 1st.

Tevan (00:49:27):

But maybe it's even better that we have still one week.

Tevan (00:49:32):

I would call,

Tevan (00:49:37):

beg,

Tevan (00:49:38):

ask for all Armenians in the world,

Tevan (00:49:41):

not forget about September 2nd,

Tevan (00:49:44):

Artsakh Independence Day.

Tevan (00:49:47):

It's a one-week time.

Tevan (00:49:50):

And we need to remember it.

Tevan (00:49:52):

We need to raise our voice.

Tevan (00:49:54):

We need to keep up this movement alive.

Tevan (00:49:57):

We need to keep up the pace to raise their voice about our prisoners in Baku.

Tevan (00:50:06):

Raise your voice against political prisoners in Yerevan.

Tevan (00:50:10):

Raise your voice against 150,000 refugees who see the genocide history and his life

Tevan (00:50:21):

from ethnic cleansing,

Tevan (00:50:23):

which took place only two years ago.

Tevan (00:50:27):

Keep up this movement on the part.

Tevan (00:50:29):

Nothing else to say that Gaza genocide is really bad.

Tevan (00:50:34):

But guys, we have been two years ago in the same situation.

Tevan (00:50:38):

I haven't been hurt.

Tevan (00:50:41):

World and nations, other nations relating these issues.

Tevan (00:50:46):

Yes, maybe we are not enough to have CNN every day presenting that story.

Tevan (00:50:53):

We have that type of person.

Tevan (00:50:55):

Ruben Vardanyan,

Tevan (00:50:57):

who,

Tevan (00:50:58):

being under the blockade in Stepanakert,

Tevan (00:51:02):

has been reaching much more international media than anyone else,

Tevan (00:51:06):

and now Aliyev is trying to punish him for many,

Tevan (00:51:09):

many of these issues,

Tevan (00:51:11):

keeping him as a prisoner.

Tevan (00:51:13):

Now,

Tevan (00:51:14):

Nation,

Tevan (00:51:15):

if you are not even able to raise your voice and change the government,

Tevan (00:51:19):

at least raise your voice and keep that part of our history

Tevan (00:51:24):

part of our story, part of our values, part of our identity, part of our is now occupied.

Tevan (00:51:32):

And we will never forget Artsakh and we will not forget about Artsakh Republic Independence Day.

Tevan (00:51:39):

And we'll be raising at least just with the memory of our national hero,

Tevan (00:51:46):

saying that we are maybe physically now not in Artsakh,

Tevan (00:51:51):

but if in our heart,

Tevan (00:51:53):

mind and soul.

Tevan (00:51:55):

We will keep up our Artsakh.

Tevan (00:51:57):

One day we will be able also to return it.

Tevan (00:52:01):

Maybe with some generations, not in our own life, who are sitting here in the studios to turn.

Tevan (00:52:10):

But no one back in 1921 who wasn't been able to see the Artsakh as part of Armenia,

Tevan (00:52:19):

their grandkids in 1991,

Tevan (00:52:24):

fulfill that dream.

Tevan (00:52:26):

Maybe our next generation's grandsons would be able to do it.

Tevan (00:52:33):

But for that, we need to keep this moment alive.

Tevan (00:52:36):

That's why remember September 2nd, make the day of day of Artsakh.

Tevan (00:52:41):

Put the stories, use the Facebook, put the flag in your home,

Tevan (00:52:46):

Uh, open up the Marlboro Bush Vodka,

Tevan (00:52:49):

drink Kataro,

Tevan (00:52:50):

I don't know,

Tevan (00:52:51):

do a lot of things,

Tevan (00:52:52):

but leave that day with Artsakh in your family.

Tevan (00:52:56):

This would be my small request, call and begging for my side.

Asbed (00:53:04):

Thank you.

Asbed (00:53:06):

On my part, you mentioned a little earlier that the Armenian lobby lost Section 907.

Asbed (00:53:11):

I won't talk about who lost what, but I was thinking when you were saying that,

Asbed (00:53:20):

When Armenian poets say,

Asbed (00:53:21):

Armenian nation,

Asbed (00:53:24):

your salvation is in your unity,

Asbed (00:53:25):

a lot of people start taking those words as if they are pablumy,

Asbed (00:53:31):

they are feel good sentences without consequences.

Asbed (00:53:34):

And the reality is that today with the Armenian nation,

Asbed (00:53:38):

the global Armenian nation in disunity,

Asbed (00:53:41):

when the diaspora is not connected to Armenia,

Asbed (00:53:44):

Armenia is not connected to Artsakh,

Asbed (00:53:46):

Artsakh is not connected to anyone.

Asbed (00:53:48):

We fall.

Asbed (00:53:50):

And this is what they mean.

Asbed (00:53:51):

There are real consequences to not being a united nation.

Asbed (00:53:57):

And we really,

Asbed (00:53:58):

really need to think about what we have read in Armenian literature saying,

Asbed (00:54:02):

Armenians,

Asbed (00:54:03):

you have to be united.

Asbed (00:54:04):

Okay?

Asbed (00:54:05):

These are not feel good words.

Asbed (00:54:07):

These are consequential words with strategic consequences to all of us.

Asbed (00:54:13):

So think about that and understand what they were saying and why we need to keep

Asbed (00:54:16):

those things in mind.

Asbed (00:54:18):

Thank you.

Tevan (00:54:19):

I fully agree with you.

Tevan (00:54:20):

And let me just say that after losing Artsakh, definitely 907 would be lost.

Tevan (00:54:26):

And this is losing and losing policy which is going on.

Tevan (00:54:30):

Once it has been there.

Tevan (00:54:32):

Now it's so easy to change.

Tevan (00:54:35):

But let me come up with my personal story.

Tevan (00:54:38):

Back in 1997 and 98,

Tevan (00:54:41):

I was Karabakh representative to the United States,

Tevan (00:54:45):

living in Washington, D.C.

Tevan (00:54:47):

I remember how,

Tevan (00:54:50):

in 1998,

Tevan (00:54:51):

ANC,

Tevan (00:54:54):

which is in this rewarding,

Tevan (00:54:56):

let's say, Dashnaks,

Tevan (00:54:58):

Armenian Assembly of America,

Tevan (00:55:00):

in this,

Tevan (00:55:01):

you can say, Ramkavar,

Tevan (00:55:02):

Hunchak, I don't know,

Tevan (00:55:03):

sir,

Tevan (00:55:04):

all other groups,

Tevan (00:55:05):

personnel,

Tevan (00:55:06):

fighting together,

Tevan (00:55:08):

unified,

Tevan (00:55:09):

and keep up 907,

Tevan (00:55:10):

even with that time.

Tevan (00:55:14):

That's why I said that, whatever we,

Tevan (00:55:17):

uh from one side we lose we're losing and there is no anymore but and that's why

Tevan (00:55:21):

i'm saying thank you for this your words and mentioning unity is our victory but

Tevan (00:55:27):

that unity once i hope that once outside uh be a fruit of unification uh if we will

Tevan (00:55:36):

remember and keep up these issues one day maybe we will again wake up with unified

Tevan (00:55:41):

at once.

Tevan (00:55:43):

Thank you for your words.

Asbed (00:55:44):

Thanks for joining us, Tevan.

Asbed (00:55:46):

We appreciate your time.

Tevan (00:55:49):

Thank you.

Hovik(00:55:50):

Thank you.

Asbed (00:55:55):

Okay, Hovik, let's talk about the stuff that is too weird, too corrupt to leave out of the show.

Asbed (00:56:02):

Let's do the Kitchen Sink.

Asbed (00:56:03):

What do you have today?

Hovik (00:56:05):

I want to begin by talking about this.

Hovik (00:56:08):

So we know about the story about Samvel Karapetyan, one of the most...

Hovik (00:56:12):

famous Armenian benefactors who is in jail right now.

Hovik (00:56:16):

And he has vowed to start a political campaign.

Hovik (00:56:20):

And that seems to be now in full swing.

Hovik (00:56:24):

And they're going for... Our way, #MerDzevov.

Hovik (00:56:26):

Yeah, it's called Mer Dzevov, Our Way.

Hovik (00:56:29):

And they're saying that they're going to vie for the 2026 elections.

Hovik (00:56:33):

I'm very interested to see the polling numbers that they start getting because I

Hovik (00:56:37):

don't think they have been featured in any polls.

Hovik (00:56:40):

But as part of that, so Narek Karapetyan, he is a businessman and nephew of Samvel Karapetyan.

Hovik (00:56:49):

He has been publishing regular news.

Hovik (00:56:52):

video addresses talking about various issues,

Hovik (00:56:56):

mostly from the perspective of business and economics to challenge Pashinyan's

Hovik (00:57:01):

mismanagement of the Armenian economy.

Hovik (00:57:05):

And I was able to catch the latest video that he published.

Hovik (00:57:10):

And to be honest, it's very logical.

Hovik (00:57:14):

It's very clear, well-argued.

Hovik (00:57:17):

And unfortunately,

Hovik (00:57:18):

that is very rare in Armenian politics today,

Hovik (00:57:21):

because if you're a normal Armenian oppositionist,

Hovik (00:57:24):

then you get all emotional and you start calling Pashinyan a traitor,

Hovik (00:57:28):

which he is a traitor,

Hovik (00:57:29):

he's a filthy traitor.

Hovik (00:57:31):

But if you're Pashinyan,

Hovik (00:57:34):

then you're going into populism,

Hovik (00:57:36):

you know,

Hovik (00:57:37):

see, I'm going to bring you peace,

Hovik (00:57:38):

I'm going to bring you peace.

Hovik (00:57:40):

But Narek Karapetyan's video response is,

Hovik (00:57:43):

to be honest,

Hovik (00:57:45):

it's a breath of fresh air,

Hovik (00:57:46):

if I may say so.

Hovik (00:57:48):

And

Hovik (00:57:49):

you know, reasoned arguments about why Pashinyan is running the Armenian economy

Hovik (00:57:54):

at least to the ground.

Hovik (00:57:56):

And one thing that he brought up, I hadn't thought about.

Hovik (00:57:59):

If you remember in 2024,

Hovik (00:58:03):

He started doing these inspections of school construction sites,

Hovik (00:58:06):

and he did a live video of himself on Facebook,

Hovik (00:58:11):

and then he pulled one of the hangers or one of the clothes hooks from a locker room

Hovik (00:58:16):

and it came off.

Hovik (00:58:17):

And he made such a big deal about it.

Hovik (00:58:19):

He fired the governor of the region, even where this construction was being done,

Hovik (00:58:27):

And you would think, oh, that's good, right?

Hovik (00:58:31):

The dictator is making sure that all the construction is happening.

Hovik (00:58:35):

But what Narek Karapetyan was able to inform us was that, that act by itself raised

Hovik (00:58:43):

the price of construction in schools in Armenia by 50%.

Hovik (00:58:48):

And he argues that this is now, it was a wrong signal or wrong impulse to communicate because

Hovik (00:58:56):

Construction companies are now emphasizing,

Hovik (00:58:59):

you know, making the construction inspection proof so that someone like Pashinyan wouldn't be

Hovik (00:59:04):

able to find any faults on the last day of the,

Hovik (00:59:09):

contract and then,

Hovik (00:59:10):

make a mockery of their work.

Hovik (00:59:13):

But all of the real problems, the real issues are being hidden underneath, right?

Hovik (00:59:18):

So people are going to prioritize looks over security, over safety and things like that.

Asbed (00:59:24):

But Hovik, do you think a rational approach, a fact-based approach like Narek is trying to

Asbed (00:59:33):

do in his videos is going to win over the populism of Pashinyan?

Asbed (00:59:39):

I mean, you and I have tried to be extremely fact-based and everything,

Asbed (00:59:42):

and it seems like there's a limited audience for that.

Asbed (00:59:44):

And then Pashinyan goes online and says peace 50 times,

Asbed (00:59:49):

and there's this cacophony of his goons who go,

Asbed (00:59:52):

"As our great leader said..."

Asbed (00:59:54):

blah, blah, blah,

Asbed (00:59:55):

and 5 million people are watching those things.

Asbed (00:59:58):

It's disheartening.

Hovik (00:59:58):

I think the view...

Hovik (01:00:01):

Yeah, I think the view count of our videos gives you the answer to that.

Hovik (01:00:04):

So,

Asbed (01:00:05):

you know,

Hovik (01:00:05):

the thousand or so people who viewed our videos,

Hovik (01:00:08):

you know, out of those 200 who would be maybe Armenian citizens might enjoy this and might be

Hovik (01:00:13):

influenced by this.

Hovik (01:00:14):

But in reality, Pashinyan is a populist and right now this is a time of populism.

Hovik (01:00:20):

So I'm very, very pessimistic whether this approach would work.

Hovik (01:00:25):

But at the same time,

Hovik (01:00:28):

I can't but not notice it and I can't but not talk about it.

Hovik (01:00:34):

Unfortunately,

Hovik (01:00:36):

this whole election issue,

Hovik (01:00:37):

I know we're going to be long on this one,

Hovik (01:00:39):

but I have to say this because there's this big debate whether there should be

Hovik (01:00:45):

impeachment or there should be street movement to remove Pashinyan, or Pashinyan

Hovik (01:00:49):

should be removed through elections in 2026.

Hovik (01:00:53):

Let's even put aside whether it's possible to win elections when every single

Hovik (01:00:59):

Western agency is going to support Pashinyan.

Hovik (01:01:02):

We're seeing how even Turks and Azeris are going to help Pashinyan out with this

Hovik (01:01:07):

"peace treaty" and so forth.

Hovik (01:01:09):

But the sad thing is that if it comes to elections,

Hovik (01:01:12):

then Pashinyan's party will achieve some percentage of the votes and they will not

Hovik (01:01:18):

be held accountable to the treason that they committed against Armenians,

Hovik (01:01:24):

which is,

Hovik (01:01:25):

you know,

Hovik (01:01:26):

yeah. If it comes to elections, I think Pashinyan will have at least a minority.

Hovik (01:01:31):

That means that he will have parliamentary immunity and he will be just another

Hovik (01:01:35):

politician and not behind bars.

Hovik (01:01:37):

Yeah.

Asbed (01:01:40):

Hovik, I want to talk about this lengthy article that foreign policy advisor Jirayr

Asbed (01:01:44):

Libaridian,

Asbed (01:01:46):

he was the foreign policy advisor to the first president,

Asbed (01:01:48):

Levon Ter-Petrosyan,

Asbed (01:01:50):

and he wrote this article about the August 8th meeting in Washington between Trump

Asbed (01:01:55):

and Aliyev and Pashinyan.

Asbed (01:01:57):

Yeah, I think it was in Aravot.am, right?

Asbed (01:02:00):

We'll put the link in the show notes.

Hovik (01:02:02):

Yeah, August 18, Aravot.am.

Asbed (01:02:04):

Thank you. I didn't remember the date, but it was in Aravot, and I will have that.

Asbed (01:02:08):

And you can put it in your Chrome browser and have it translate to English if you

Asbed (01:02:11):

don't read Armenian.

Asbed (01:02:13):

But some of the points that he made,

Asbed (01:02:14):

like when Libaridian says that the strength of the Armenia-Azerbaijan agreement is

Asbed (01:02:18):

that it was hammered out bilaterally,

Asbed (01:02:21):

or that trust between the two leaderships has increased,

Asbed (01:02:25):

Frankly, I wasn't sure if I was reading Pashinyan or that Pashinyan wrote this for

Asbed (01:02:30):

Libaridian, or if I was reading Libaridian, because the two of them are basically

Asbed (01:02:34):

saying the same thing. He's going out there.

Asbed (01:02:36):

Pashinyan is going out there and saying these things in his speeches and Libaridian

Asbed (01:02:39):

has written it in this article.

Asbed (01:02:41):

So I don't know where the origin is, but it's really eerily the same.

Asbed (01:02:47):

In any case, what's disturbing is that he pretends like the two leaders have been,

Asbed (01:02:51):

"working together".

Asbed (01:02:52):

And I think this is a gross misrepresentation of what's been going on in the

Asbed (01:02:56):

so-called negotiations between Aliyev and Pashinyan.

Asbed (01:03:00):

Hovik, name one thing, one thing that Azerbaijan has agreed to in these so-called negotiations.

Hovik (01:03:07):

No, I mean, it has been basically a session of threats and, you know, capitulation.

Hovik (01:03:16):

So, I mean,

Hovik (01:03:17):

I think that people would,

Hovik (01:03:19):

many people know that Libaridian is not my,

Hovik (01:03:22):

you know, one of my favorite people in the world.

Hovik (01:03:24):

And he has always been saying that we have to capitulate on everything and give up

Hovik (01:03:31):

any of our demands in order to satisfy Turkey and Azerbaijan.

Hovik (01:03:34):

Or let me put it this way, he has had the most pro-Turkish positions over the last 35 years.

Hovik (01:03:42):

And, you know, at some point it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Asbed (01:03:46):

I also cannot name a single concession that Aliyev has made.

Asbed (01:03:50):

In fact,

Asbed (01:03:51):

just, what, three,

Asbed (01:03:52):

four days ago,

Asbed (01:03:53):

five days ago, he went to Kelbajar,

Asbed (01:03:54):

as you mentioned,

Asbed (01:03:55):

Karvachar.

Asbed (01:03:56):

And he's saying that we made the enemy capitulate.

Asbed (01:04:01):

I mean, it's clear as day as to what he's thinking.

Asbed (01:04:05):

And if everything has come at the cost of Armenia capitulating on issues or

Asbed (01:04:11):

conceding,

Asbed (01:04:12):

I don't think that is to be called working together.

Asbed (01:04:17):

consider that Azerbaijan has conceded something by not attacking Armenia further or

Asbed (01:04:22):

killing thousands of people,

Asbed (01:04:25):

they consider that working together,

Asbed (01:04:26):

then it's hard to consider these guys as experts worth listening to.

Asbed (01:04:30):

And that's just my opinion.

Asbed (01:04:32):

I also want to note that everything in Armenian interests are left out to hoping.

Asbed (01:04:39):

Okay, read the article.

Asbed (01:04:40):

Librarian hopes that POWs will be released.

Asbed (01:04:44):

He hopes that Azerbaijan will decide that the constitution is not such an important

Asbed (01:04:49):

issue and they will drop it.

Asbed (01:04:51):

He hopes that Turkey will open the border and so on.

Asbed (01:04:55):

He also mentions that neither the US nor anyone else has the will to impose

Asbed (01:04:59):

compliance with this agreement on the two sides,

Asbed (01:05:02):

Armenia and Azerbaijan.

Asbed (01:05:04):

So if hope can be considered a strategy,

Asbed (01:05:07):

You tell me about that.

Asbed (01:05:08):

That's new to me.

Hovik (01:05:09):

There have been reports,

Hovik (01:05:10):

Asbed, that Libaridian has been seen a lot in the company of the foreign ministry of

Hovik (01:05:17):

Armenia,

Hovik (01:05:18):

and he's known to be advising the team.

Hovik (01:05:21):

I'm not sure how accurate those stories are, but I would at least...

Hovik (01:05:27):

Seeing what Pashinyan is saying and seeing what Libaridian are saying seems to be a

Hovik (01:05:31):

very close match.

Asbed (01:05:33):

Okay. Hovik, how many times did Libaridian talk about Artsakh in his very long article?

Asbed (01:05:40):

Not once did he talk about Artsakh.

Asbed (01:05:43):

"Karabakh" is mentioned only to refer to the war, the issues that concern Iran and stuff like that.

Asbed (01:05:50):

So for Libaridian, it seems like there's no Artsakh cause.

Asbed (01:05:53):

There are no Armenians who were wronged.

Asbed (01:05:55):

There was no ethnic cleansing, no human rights, nothing, nothing.

Asbed (01:05:59):

To me,

Asbed (01:06:00):

it seems like when Libaridian puts on his hat as an analyst,

Asbed (01:06:03):

he removes his hat as an Armenian.

Hovik (01:06:06):

The fact is that you don't have to be an Armenian to talk about human rights,

Hovik (01:06:12):

to talk about self-determination,

Hovik (01:06:14):

to talk about the fact that 150,000 Armenians are now homeless.

Hovik (01:06:18):

And when you don't even mention the word Artsakh or the rights of the people of

Hovik (01:06:23):

Artsakh,

Hovik (01:06:24):

which does involve them being able to collectively return to feel secure,

Hovik (01:06:30):

and to be able to visit the graves of their loved ones,

Hovik (01:06:34):

the ones who have given their dearest in all these wars,

Hovik (01:06:39):

if you're not talking about that,

Hovik (01:06:40):

then you're talking about an imposition,

Hovik (01:06:44):

like a Versailles type of humiliation,

Hovik (01:06:47):

And we know how far non-dignified peace can go and it won't go very far.

Hovik (01:06:53):

Yeah.

Asbed (01:06:55):

I mean,

Asbed (01:06:56):

thanks for saying that because I think that that's also very important to keep in

Asbed (01:06:59):

mind that when people say there needs to be a dignified peace,

Asbed (01:07:04):

this is what they mean.

Asbed (01:07:05):

If it's not a dignified peace where one side is clearly a loser and comes out of it

Asbed (01:07:11):

sore,

Asbed (01:07:12):

even if they sign on the dotted line,

Asbed (01:07:15):

the peace will not last.

Asbed (01:07:17):

Exactly.

Asbed (01:07:18):

That's the problem.

Asbed (01:07:20):

Okay.

Asbed (01:07:21):

We will put the link to this article in the show notes.

Asbed (01:07:24):

Check it out.

Asbed (01:07:25):

Thanks.

Hovik (01:07:26):

So,

Hovik (01:07:27):

folks, I want to also bring to your attention that this saga between Russia and Azerbaijan

Hovik (01:07:34):

does not seem to be dying down.

Hovik (01:07:36):

And most recently,

Hovik (01:07:38):

I saw that the Russian government has put many of its top spokespeople,

Hovik (01:07:45):

talking heads who frequently appear on Russian state television,

Hovik (01:07:50):

who are known to be pro-Azeri.

Hovik (01:07:53):

So Russia has deliberately classified them as foreign agents.

Hovik (01:07:59):

As you may know, Russia has a pretty strict foreign agent law.

Hovik (01:08:03):

Among them is Sergei Markov,

Hovik (01:08:05):

who is one of the so-called bloggers and experts who is frequently featured on

Hovik (01:08:11):

Russian state TV.

Hovik (01:08:13):

And all these people are now being classified as foreign agents.

Hovik (01:08:19):

This is bound to have effects on,

Hovik (01:08:23):

you know, what is communicated in Russia,

Hovik (01:08:25):

because frankly,

Hovik (01:08:26):

sometimes,

Hovik (01:08:27):

you know, these people,

Hovik (01:08:28):

the voice of these people was amplified by Russian state media in the past.

Hovik (01:08:33):

And I'm hoping that Russia curtails, you know, these caviar pundits, caviar pundits.

Hovik (01:08:41):

Yeah.

Hovik (01:08:43):

So good riddance, Sergei Markov.

Hovik (01:08:46):

So we talked about this in the past.

Hovik (01:08:48):

The Stockholm Arbitration Court had ruled in favor of Samvel Karapetyan,

Hovik (01:08:53):

whose electric networks of Armenia were being nationalized by Pashinyan.

Hovik (01:08:58):

And so just recently, just last week, Pashinyan approved the decision to allocate

Hovik (01:09:05):

$3.25 million from the state budget to hire a U.S.

Hovik (01:09:08):

law firm to defend against the Stockholm Arbitration Court.

Asbed (01:09:13):

Yeah, absolutely.

Asbed (01:09:15):

Certainly there seems to be no lack of funds when it comes to fighting Pashinyan's

Asbed (01:09:19):

cultural wars.

Hovik (01:09:22):

Asbed, well, besides the subvention funding of pet projects and enormous inflated school

Hovik (01:09:31):

construction budgets,

Hovik (01:09:33):

is there also funds that are allocated for defense?

Hovik (01:09:37):

What do you know about that?

Hovik (01:09:38):

I think that that was in the news recently.

Asbed (01:09:40):

Well, yeah,

Asbed (01:09:41):

just last week, Pashinyan said that there would be no increase in defense spending in 2026 in the

Asbed (01:09:47):

budget that he plans to unveil in September.

Asbed (01:09:51):

As you know, the 2025 budget allocation for defense was 1.7 billion dollars.

Asbed (01:09:57):

Of course, we have no idea how much of it has actually been spent already.

Asbed (01:10:00):

I mean, I certainly don't know how much of it has been spent.

Asbed (01:10:04):

So while Aliyev is spending $5 billion a year on defense and threatening Armenia

Asbed (01:10:09):

and calling it "the enemy",

Asbed (01:10:11):

Armenia is lowering its defenses and begging for peace.

Hovik (01:10:16):

Yeah, it sort of reminds me of dogs rolling on their back and showing their bellies.

Hovik (01:10:20):

Yeah, pretty much exactly.

Asbed (01:10:22):

But we're pretty sure that Iran knows that it doesn't take $5 billion a year to

Asbed (01:10:26):

destroy an unarmed Armenia,

Asbed (01:10:28):

right? So they know what "enemy" Azerbaijan really is targeting with all that defense spending.

Asbed (01:10:33):

Do you want to talk about one of your favorite people in Civil Contract?

Hovik (01:10:37):

Yeah, there is this piece of shit called Arsen Torosyan.

Hovik (01:10:41):

And he has been actually on Twitter before this last week.

Hovik (01:10:48):

He was on Twitter calling everyone a Dashnak.

Hovik (01:10:52):

So last week, Arsen Torosyan resigned from his mandate from the parliament.

Hovik (01:10:59):

Remember that Torosyan was a failure as a minister of health before and during COVID times.

Hovik (01:11:05):

Armenia had astronomical...

Hovik (01:11:07):

rates of death from COVID because of his policies.

Hovik (01:11:11):

So, you know, that prompted Pashinyan to promote him to become chief of staff of Pashinyan.

Hovik (01:11:19):

He failed at that too.

Hovik (01:11:22):

Yeah, so he resigned.

Hovik (01:11:23):

But before you celebrate,

Hovik (01:11:25):

you should know that he resigned because reportedly he's being slated to become the

Hovik (01:11:30):

new minister of labor and social affairs.

Asbed (01:11:35):

There's always a long line of rubber stamp dickies lined up for this civil contract

Asbed (01:11:41):

mandate for the parliament.

Asbed (01:11:42):

So like you said, there's absolutely no reason to celebrate here.

Asbed (01:11:45):

As one friend recently wrote to us,

Asbed (01:11:47):

never underestimate the persuasive power of a steady paycheck,

Asbed (01:11:51):

Hovik.

Hovik (01:11:52):

So where did the current Minister of Labor and Social Affairs go then?

Hovik (01:11:57):

Can I give you guys a hint?

Hovik (01:11:59):

Sure.

Hovik (01:12:00):

Well,

Hovik (01:12:01):

Lilit Makunts,

Hovik (01:12:02):

Pashinyan's English tutor and a dishrag who got appointed as ambassador to the

Hovik (01:12:08):

United States,

Hovik (01:12:09):

announced that she's completing her tenure.

Asbed (01:12:12):

Her illustrious tenure.

Hovik (01:12:14):

Yes, as an ambassador on September 1st.

Hovik (01:12:18):

So that is your hint.

Hovik (01:12:19):

And we'll see what happens afterwards.

Asbed (01:12:22):

As terrible as she has been,

Asbed (01:12:24):

Hovik,

Asbed (01:12:25):

I still don't know if there's anything to celebrate there because my experience

Asbed (01:12:29):

with this administration,

Asbed (01:12:30):

this regime is that things only get worse.

Asbed (01:12:34):

Anyway...

Asbed (01:12:35):

Thank God Trump ended the conflict between "Aberbaijan and Albania".

Hovik (01:12:40):

I'm pretty sure that people who are following news about Albania,

Hovik (01:12:42):

like woke up one morning and started reading this news about the conflict between

Hovik (01:12:47):

Albania and Aberbaijan.

Asbed (01:12:49):

I'm surprised he didn't call it Badiljan.

Asbed (01:12:51):

Badiljan and Albania.

Hovik (01:12:55):

Yeah,

Hovik (01:12:56):

we should make a commemorative map of Albania with Aberbaijan as neighbors.

Hovik (01:13:01):

And, uh, you know, I don't know.

Hovik (01:13:03):

I've been thinking about,

Hovik (01:13:04):

uh,

Hovik (01:13:06):

you know,

Hovik (01:13:07):

merch, uh, merchandise on,

Hovik (01:13:08):

on Groong and this might be a fun one.

Asbed (01:13:11):

Yeah. Well,

Asbed (01:13:12):

we can't blame "Ttump" too much for this,

Asbed (01:13:15):

uh, misstep after all,

Asbed (01:13:17):

maybe he needed some "Covfefe".

Asbed (01:13:19):

Who knows?

Asbed (01:13:21):

All right.

Asbed (01:13:22):

I guess we should be done.

Asbed (01:13:23):

This was our Week in Review show, folks.

Asbed (01:13:26):

We recorded it on Monday, August 25.

Asbed (01:13:28):

We were talking with Mr.

Asbed (01:13:30):

Tevan Poghosyan,

Asbed (01:13:32):

who is the president of the International Center for Human Development.

Asbed (01:13:35):

He was an MP in the National Assembly between 2012 and 2017 from the Heritage Party.

Asbed (01:13:41):

And from 1997 to 1999,

Asbed (01:13:44):

as he mentioned,

Asbed (01:13:45):

he served as the Nagorno-Karabakh Public Affairs Office Director in Washington,

Asbed (01:13:48):

D.C.

Hovik (01:13:50):

And folks,

Hovik (01:13:51):

before you go,

Hovik (01:13:52):

you know that we're the only independent news media covering,

Hovik (01:13:57):

you know,

Hovik (01:13:58):

the region of Azerbaijan and Albania with so much fervor that we produce at least

Hovik (01:14:07):

twice a weekly podcast.

Hovik (01:14:10):

If you appreciate this,

Hovik (01:14:11):

then do us a favor,

Hovik (01:14:12):

open up Spotify,

Hovik (01:14:13):

open up Apple Podcasts and subscribe,

Hovik (01:14:16):

like and comment and share our content there.

Hovik (01:14:19):

Help us.

Hovik (01:14:20):

Actually, we're doing good on Spotify, but now that I'm looking at Apple Podcasts, we are not.

Hovik (01:14:27):

Yeah, we're behind the forum funded agencies on that one.

Hovik (01:14:30):

So help us change the situation on Apple Podcasts.

Asbed (01:14:35):

Okay. Well, I'm Asbed Bedrossian in Los Angeles.

Hovik (01:14:39):

And I'm Hovik Manucharyan in Yerevan.

Asbed (01:14:41):

We'll talk to you next week.

Asbed (01:14:43):

Bye-bye.

Hovik (01:14:44):

Bye-bye.

People on this episode

Head Shot

Asbed Bedrossian

Co-host
Head Shot

Hovik Manucharyan

Co-host
Head Shot

Tevan Poghosyan

Guest

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