Something Extra

Winning at Work & Home w/ Cory Carlson

• Technology Partners • Episode 324

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Many leaders excel in their careers but struggle to maintain the same level of success at home. Cory Carlson, Executive Coach, Keynote Speaker, and Co-Founder of RISE Community, knows this challenge well—and he’s on a mission to change it. With years of experience coaching business leaders, Cory helps them overcome burnout, develop their teams, and lead with greater purpose in both their professional and personal lives. In this episode, Cory shares his insights on balancing leadership, faith, and family, offering practical steps to elevate your mindset and create accountability in all areas of life.

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Credits: 
Host: Lisa Nichols
Executive Producer: Jenny Heal
Marketing Support: Landon Burke and Joe Szynkowski
Podcast Engineer: Portside Media

Lisa Nichols  00:02
Chromosomes, little strands of nucleic acids and proteins are the fundamental genetic instructions that tell us who we are. At birth, most people are born with 46 chromosomes, but each year in the United States, about 6000 people are born with an extra chromosome, making them a person with Down syndrome. If you've ever encountered someone with Down syndrome, you know that they are some of the kindest, most joyful people you will ever meet. They truly have something extra. 

My name is Lisa Nichols, and for 30 years, I have been both the CEO of Technology Partners and the mother to Ally. Ally has something extra in every sense of the word. I have been blessed to be by her side as she impacts everyone she meets. Through these two important roles as CEO and mother to Ally, I have witnessed countless life lessons that have fundamentally changed the way I look at the world. While you may not have an extra chromosome, every leader has something extra that defines who you are. 

Join me as I explore the something extra in leaders from all walks of life and discover how that difference in each of them has made a difference in their companies, their families, their communities and in themselves. If you like this episode today, please go to Apple Podcast or wherever you listen and leave us a five-star rating. 

Well, Cory Carlson, it is so good to have you on the Something Extra Podcast today. Thank you so much for making the time to be on the show.

Cory Carlson  01:36
Well, Lisa, thank you very much for having me. Before you can hit record. I've enjoyed this conversation just getting to know you and, and so thank you very much for the opportunity.

Lisa Nichols  01:46
So, Cory, I think you and I, we kind of met by happenstance. We have got a mutual friend, love this guy, I know you do too. Jim Bechtold, and I was on his Monday morning 8am leadership call, and you were on the call, and then you, like, reached out to me and said, Hey, I noticed you're going to be on the call. We should know each other, and you reach out to me on LinkedIn, and the rest is history. And I'm so excited because I think you and are very much aligned with our beliefs and our values and kind of our philosophies on life. And so, I'm just really grateful that we connected and getting to know you and, and sharing your wisdom with our listeners today. So, thanks so much for that.

Cory Carlson  02:30
No, well, thanks. As a mentor told me, wisdumb is spelled W, I, S, D, U, M, B, so it's a wisdumb that I've learned from, you know, making some dumb mistakes along the way. 

Lisa Nichols  02:42
Oh, my goodness, I say it all the time. I will tell people you see all these SOPs that we have and all this written documentation about processes, it's usually because I did something wrong or had a misstep. But you know, I know, and this is really kind of fun, because I know that you graduated with a degree in civil engineering from Mizzou, in Columbia. So that's fun, because we've got so many of our young people in St Louis that end up going to Mizzou. Great school. 

Cory Carlson  03:12
We loved it. Absolutely loved it. Met my wife there and got a civil engineering degree. I don't touch that degree at all anymore, but I'm grateful for the experience of Mizzou. It was awesome.

Lisa Nichols  03:25
So, who was there someone who inspired you, Cory, to pursue that degree? Or did you have somebody in your family? Why did you pursue that degree in civil engineering?

Cory Carlson  03:35
I think a couple reasons. I did have in high school. I didn't have any family members that did engineering. So, it wasn't a family, but just some of the older guys I looked up to, they were going to Mizzou for engineering. And so, I was kind of paying attention to that. I was better at math than I was English. I was awful at English, which is crazy. I went on to write some books, but I just say I was kind of good at math, so I thought I'd do it. I also love development. I love cities. I love downtown and seeing just growth. I've always loved it, even still to this day, and so that's why I went down the path of engineering, because I, I didn't know what else to do, and that seemed like that would be a good fit.

Lisa Nichols  04:26
I remember there is. Well, he's chair of the board now, but a large construction firm here in St Louis. And he's got a civil engineering degree, but I remember him telling me that as a little boy there we had the Missouri Botanical Gardens here, which is beautiful. If you haven't visited the Missouri Botanical Gardens. And I remember him telling me that he would skip school and go and watch the Climatron being built. And he was so fascinated, kind of like what you said by cities and building an architecture, and that's why he decided to go that route. Now he owns a large, large construction firm here. But, you know, sometimes it's just you kind of get intrigued by certain things, right? And your, curiosity, right?

Cory Carlson  05:15
It probably drives a lot of decisions we all make, is the curiosity? 

Lisa Nichols  05:20
Agreed. Well, you went on and intern. Well, you interned for Burns and McDonnell, which is a wonderful engineering firm in KC, and you interned for them every summer, right? And then ended up getting hired.

Cory Carlson  05:33
They were awesome. You know, there was a, there was a movie, it came out, we always kind of joked about Michael J Fox, Secret to My, Secret To My Success, whatever exact name was. I mean, I ended I did not do the success part, but I started out in the mail room. I did the mail room as the intern, and then every summer, interned in their Aviation Division. Great company. Loved the company. I had incredible bosses from Ronita and Doug, and just beyond grateful for them. And so, me leaving Burns and McDonnell wasn't in any indication of them as a company, more just me.  When I got in, so I loved Burns and McDonnell, they lot of great opportunities. And I was there for about four years after school, got, you know, got my PE, just trying to still check the boxes of I think this is the way I want to go, so I'll get my PE but I just, I didn't love it. I wasn't fulfilled. And so, I, you know, ended up exploring MBA and LSAT. I didn't, I didn't go law school. I chose to go the MBA route. But then Lisa, I got involved in a company that did technical sales, where we sold civil engineering products, storm sewer bridges. And I loved it. I love this idea of taking the technical blended with. Oh, I mean, I don't want to say people skills, meaning engineering is not people skills, but for me, it was taking the technical, keeping it at surface level. I didn't have to go crazy deep on the technical but then working with people and helping to solve their problems, whatever they need had on a construction site, and working on that consultative selling that's was awesome. I was like, I want to do this.

Lisa Nichols  07:15
You and I have more in common than I even realized, Cory, because I have a degree in accounting. And so, I went into McDonnell Douglas right out of school to practice corporate accounting, and loved McDonnell Douglas. Again, had amazing people that poured into me. John McDonnell was even the president at the time, and I got an invitation to have lunch with him, with nine other young professionals. Loved McDonnell Douglas, but did not love accounting. And after about five years, I'm like, I just this just doesn't fuel me. And so, I left McDonnell Douglas and went into corporate sales for another fortune 500 company. And same way, I'm like, I love meeting with people and helping them solve their challenges. And, so we have more in common, but you know, it's every step, here's what I would say to a young person, don't be afraid to pivot for one thing. It is okay. And if you're not loving something, you figure out what you do love, because you spend a lot of time at work, right? And figure out what fuels you, it's okay. I've met so many people that are doing something totally different than what they went to school for. And it's okay.

Cory Carlson  08:37
And I think to that young person on that if you're thinking of leaving or but really do check your heart on why you're leaving. Because there is a piece of just working in corporate America where there has to be some resilience built up. The project's hard or you don't really like your boss, that doesn't mean you leave because, I mean, fast forward in my career there was a season where I had the most difficult boss I ever had. But I learned so much, and now what I do is an executive coach and speaker. I will pull from those years of experience so often because of what I learned and how I had to adapt, or maybe things I did wrong, and it just was so helpful. So, to that young person, absolutely, if you want to leave, leave. You don't just because you got a degree, and it doesn't mean you have do it for life, but if you do leave, just check your heart to make sure you're just not running from something hard. I was just doing my well devotion this morning, and really is reminded of, and they talk of many listeners probably have heard this story before, but just a reminder of when a storm happens, the difference between cattle and bison. Cattles will run from the storm, which, in fact, they have to stay with it longer because they're running with the storm, versus bison or buffalo, they run into the storm. And so, there's sometimes we actually just need to run into the storm. It's better for us.

Lisa Nichols  10:07
We run into the storm. And I would, I would go as far to say, you learn more in the storm sometimes than you do on the summit. So, right? So, there's so much wisdom, so much wisdom packed in there. I'm glad that you brought that up and don't run away from hard things. But you know, for me, I'm like, I think, I think I really want to do sales. I want to do sales, but, you know, they were not going to let a 24-year-old sell F-18s. I had to go and totally pivot. But you know you after that, then you, you went on to Contact, and I think you were president of sales, groundwork, solutions. What was your during this time, Cory, what I really want to camp out on is, what was your mindset? What was your mindset about you, your career, success, all of that during this time?

Cory Carlson  11:01
Well, I had a few different mindsets during that time, which is part of my story. So, I left Burns and McDonnell and I went to Contact. I did sales start in Kansas City, got promoted, moved to Denver. And then managed a bunch of people in states and then got promoted and moved to Cincinnati, where I was vice president of sales and managing, you know, $120 million division. And so, there's a couple different mindsets I had at the different times. And Kansas City, unfortunately, it's probably all about myself climbing the ladder. Let's go sell, sell. I mean, you give me a sales challenge, I'm gonna go try to win and had success, and got to do some cool things. I go the Ryder Cup and go to a trip in Mexico and like I went for those and at the time, it was about myself at the expense of my family, which is a bummer. And then I went to Denver. I started to get better, less about me, more about team. As I was leading individuals, I also worked for one of my best bosses out there, and so he modeled it well for me. And then when I got to Cincinnati, I would say that was the biggest pivotal change for me as a leader. And truth be told, Lisa, it kind of took running into storm. It kind of took hitting a hitting a low to realize I needed help. 

Cory Carlson  12:27
But as I was in charges 100 $20 million vision or a VP of it, I had imposter syndrome. I had just leapfrogged my boss. I was now managing him. I was managing people older than me. People have been the, the company or industry longer, and so this imposter syndrome really, just how it manifested was I skipped the gym. I skipped quiet time. Kids playing on the floor in the family room at night, and my face is buried in the lap laptop. And I was like, There's got to be a better way. What kind of what's going on? And, you know, as I went to my boss, talked to him who I really liked, and he just said, get an executive coach. I've always had one. And I was like, Man, I wish you would have told me this sooner. Anyways, I did, in fact, get an executive coach. That's about 13 years ago, and I've had one ever since. Even though I do it now for a living. I now have a coach because the outside perspective, the accountability, the encouragement and challenge at the same time. It's just, it's, it's made me lead better. This particular coach I had wasn't just about work, it was home and work. 

Cory Carlson  13:39
And so, beginning then is when I really started lead differently. Lisa, so you talk about the mindset, that's when my mindset became, hey, it's just not about work. I thought it was just about work for so long, if I'm gonna be a good man, a good you know, employee, then I just need to crush it at work. And what I saw, Lisa is, over my 20-year career, I had 18 bosses and one family. But I made choices for those 18 bosses at the expense of my family. And to be honest, I don't even know if those people are alive or like if where they live, but yet I sacrificed. And starting with that coach, I just started leading different leading differently. When I met with my one-on-one direct reports, I said, Hey, how's it going at home? How's it going at work? What were your goals for this year in both I just started talking that way, and I saw change. I saw change in those leaders as I had experienced. And that's when I was like, All right, let's go. Let's do this for a living.

Lisa Nichols  14:41
That's so cool. That is so cool. Well, and I think you started, you and your wife started going to crossroads, which is mega church in Cinci. Jim Bechtold was one of the founders. Brian Tom, Brian Wells that we've talked about, and that changed you too, because I think you got into a program called 3DM?

Cory Carlson  15:02
That's right. Yes, that's a cool God story. We moved from Denver to Cincinnati. I volunteered once, and some, not somebody, Kim is her name, Kim put my name in a hat to go through that 3DM program after one volunteering session. So, I apologize to anybody who's volunteered at Crossroads forever and they didn't get invited. I'm sorry for me. I mean, it was, that was a God thing. I went into that program. I got exposed this particular executive coach, and that's when I just it was changed the trajectory of my life.

Lisa Nichols  15:39
Right, right, right, right. Well, you talk a lot, Cory, and I'd love for you to camp out here, because I do think this is so important. You talk a lot about identity, and we're going to talk about your books. You've got a couple of books. You're an executive coach. We're going to talk all about that. But you talk a lot about identity, and it's just a really huge topic. There's so much gold in here, Cory. I don't even really know where to start, but what I thought I would do is I'm gonna give you a couple quotes, and then that really resonate with me, and then maybe you can kind of use those to expound on those. So, here's one. You have to know yourself so you can forget yourself, so you can freely give yourself.

Cory Carlson  16:22
I do love you picked a quote by someone else, other than me in the book. That's, that's awesome, but that's a favorite quote by everybody, and that's from you know, the coach I ended up hiring. But it starts with just knowing ourselves, our strengths, our weaknesses. And, you know, kind of just kind of knowing who we are and when we show up somewhere, knowing who we are. And a big piece of that is for you know, since I've we're talking some, you know, faith, for sure on this is, by knowing that we're beloved sons and daughters of God. And that we're working from a place of approval, as opposed to for approval. Then when I show up, I, instead of having to win everyone's opinion of me and try to get their approval. I should know that I already have my identity, and because I know who I am, I can forget myself, and I can show up and I can just be present, how can I listen as opposed to just waiting to talk? How can I be curious to learn more about you, you know? How can I be more about the relationship instead of just the result? And, you know, getting to know you, and maybe that adds to additional conversations down the road, as opposed to. I just want to make sure I crush this podcast, because it's all about me, you know. And so, it's just, it's trying to, that's kind of the idea this whole quote is, by understanding who we are, we then can, you know, give ourselves into a, into situations.

Lisa Nichols  17:54
I'm going to repeat what you said, because that resonates with me working from a place of approval, rather than for approval. And I do think I mean, and I'm preaching to myself here. I've had to do a lot of work on myself in that regard, Cory. Not working for approval, but I'm already approved. I'm already everything I need to be, right, in, in Christ and, I just that resonates why? You know, tell me a little bit more. I'd love to camp out because I do think. I don't know if you know the name Jeremy coup attack, but Jeremy is the CEO for GIANT. Love Jeremy, and he said that we talked a lot about identity, and he's like, you've got to know yourself. What other things have you learned about identity? And because what we see a lot of times, right, is people attach their identity to what they do, and titles, but there's things change. 

Cory Carlson  18:54
A couple, a couple things. I'll answer that. But I'm really feeling prompted to share this story. So, maybe it's for a listener, but I share this in the book. And you can do this listener to when you see a sunrise, when you see a sunset, when you're on top of a, you know, a mountain, and you're looking or when you see the ocean, really, when you see anything that you're thinking, Wow, that's pretty amazing. And a mentor, we did this. We were in the top of a mountain in Montana, and he's like, Hey, look out. What do you see? Oh, you know, mountains and the river down there below. Give me words. What are words to describe it? And, you know, it's a group of us guys, and it's, oh, it's awesome. And, you know, it's epic. It's majestic. And here we are trying to come up with, you know, cool words, thinking that was the exercise. It was obviously part of the exercise. And as we're doing that, he just, you know, he basically says, when, but when God made it. He says, it's good. You know that that's all he said, that, that is good. But then after he made us, he said, It's very good. And when I heard that the first time, it stuck that. I mean, the whole experience just stuck. The idea that everything that we think is amazing is just good, but yet he sees us as very good. I've done that teaching to other groups. I've done that teaching to my kids, and even at young ages. It resonates with people. So hopefully for a listener, someone needs to hear that, and that's why I, you know, shared it. 

Cory Carlson  20:39
You know, from an identity standpoint, I mean, from parenting, it starts at home like, what are you complimenting with your kids? Are you complimenting that they scored the goals in soccer they you know, were amazing, the dance recital that they got straight A's? Are you complimenting the achievement, the what they did, or you complimenting who they are, and in complimenting and giving them the attributes of God that they're living out. And what we try to we don't get it perfect all the time in our house, for sure. But it's trying to make sure we're complimenting and affirming who they are as opposed to what they've done. And so, from a parenting standpoint, it works that way with my clients when we begin the beginning of the year. You know, the thing every coach wants to do with clients is, hey, what are you gonna achieve this year? Write down all your goals. And we'll definitely do an exercise similar to that. But what we also do is, who do you want to become at the end of the year? What do you want others, your spouse, your team, your kids, your suppliers, your customers, what do you want them to say about you? And so, it's really thinking about this identity is, who do you want to become, as opposed to, what do you want to achieve?

Lisa Nichols  22:04
That's powerful. And I love what you just said, because sometimes it's about working backwards, right? You know, I know you've seen that before, where coaches will say, not to get too, you know, not to get too much of a Debbie down here, but talking about writing your own eulogy. What would you want people to say? Right? And you work backwards from that, right? And there's intentional things that we can do to make sure that we end up where we are hoping that we end up in terms of who we become.

Cory Carlson  22:37
Absolutely! We because of that, downers of eulogy. And I'm like, I don't know when I'm gonna die. I don't know, you know, I will. I be 80. I don't even know if they're gonna say 80. But so, what I've done, and have you know, clients go through, is I just call it your best decade yet. The idea that none of us have lived our best decade yet, because there's different books out there that say, you know, it's a good, great book called decade by decade says it's your 60s is the best decade. And then we, some of us, have read Half Time, where it talks about the second half of your life's the best. With all that being said, I was like, You know what? Where my age is at, those years are still ahead. So, I believe in many of us and all the listeners, our best decade yet is yet to come. So, write a letter to your future self in 10 years, an emotional exercise. When I did that and I wrote down the ages of my kids that they'll be in 10 years like that's a game changer. My oldest is 20 years old. When she's 30 years old, well, that means she could be married, she could have kids.

Lisa Nichols  23:40
You could have grandchildren by then, Cory.

Cory Carlson  23:45
Come on, that's man. But all those emotions, it's kind of like, Hey, this is serious. So, anyways, your best decade yet. That's an exercise. 

Lisa Nichols  23:55
I believe it, I believe it. Just a little side note. I had Ken Blanchard on the show. He was 83 when he was on the show. He's like some people decide at the age of 40 that all their best years are behind them. He said, My best years are ahead of me. And he's 83 years old. You know, pushing forward. I love it. Well, let's talk about this, because we all have vision statements for our businesses, right? Or we should our vision mission, core values, all that. But you talk about writing a vision statement for your personal life, and you talk about the framework of the five P’s, can you what is your personal vision? I know what your personal vision is, but I'd love for you to tell our listeners, and then what are those five P's? How can someone go about writing this personal vision in statement? 

Cory Carlson  24:47
Absolutely. A reason to do the personal vision statement is to avoid burnout. And remind you, I mean, it's been said before. You know, we get burned out, not because we forget what we do. We forget why we do it. And I remember the exact night I was in Tampa. I was at a dinner set across the table from a guy in private equity. And he pulled out his phone and he showed me his brand-new car and how loud it was going down the street. And here I am away from my, and I have no issues with wealthy people. I know a lot of amazing wealthy people, and just awesome, awesome, awesome. For me, it was his tone in the whole evening because when we talked work and his car energy levels way up here. When anything was brought up about family and kids, it just went down. And so, that that was bothering me some. And then when he pulls out the phone to show me how loud this new car was, I just like, Is this my life? Like I was president of sales at the time. Is this my life, just to go around, travel the country and make more sales increase EBITDA, so, this guy gets a better car every year. Like, is that my life? 

Cory Carlson  26:08
And so, I was just struggling with it, and I go out to the to the front of the restaurant, waiting for the car to show up. And I called my, I called my coach. He doesn't I didn't always call after hours, so he probably was curious what's going on. And I just explained, like, Is this really my life? And he says, I want you to write a personal vision statement. I was like, What in the world is a personal vision statement gonna do to get me out of this jam? Like this is he goes, Just trust me. So, I did. I went through a similar exercise like this, but I'll explain the five P's I went through. The exercise came with my vision statement, and the vision statements to connect people to greater performance and even more significant purpose. 
Cory Carlson  26:51
So, for what that meant for me is greater performance. Anytime I interact with somebody at work, around a campfire in my own home, I'm trying to think, Hey, how can I help them perform better at work, at home? You know, is there a tip I can give them? Is there maybe a question I can maybe ask that will make them think it just it helps me just be present, not just talk about sports and weather. And the other is, help them into a greater purpose, or more similar purpose is, if I could connect them to God, then let's go. But if they aren't a believer, it's not the right place, then just serve others like a greater purpose. So, Lisa, as I traveled the country after putting together this statement, it, it was a significant game changer. When I went there, I knew that I was on assignment. It was my calling to see if I could help someone have greater performance and more significant purpose. If I could connect them to it, then job well done, and if EBITDA improved along the way, great. But I knew my job, and what was cool was it changed my mindset, and EBITA improved, and things got better. So, if you come up with a vision statement, I'm not guarantee you're going to get more profitable. That's not it. But it did work out. 

Cory Carlson  28:14
So, five Ps are, problems. That's the first one. What problems have you overcome in your life that you want to help other people overcome. For me, that actually was one of the biggest pieces for me personally. It may not be for you as a listener, but for me, it was because my problem was, I lost at home. I don't want to I didn't want to lose ever again. So, I want to make sure that worked. Another piece, passions. List out all your passions. What do you love doing? Some will make money. Some will make money. That's not really the point. Just list all out your passions. Next is personality. How have you been uniquely and wonderfully made? Write some of those items down, extrovert, introvert, your Enneagram, your DISC, whatever it is, just write things down your personality. Next is a potential. What do you see out there in the world that you think you know needs to be solved or achieved or gone after you may see something that others don't. I'm on the board of a nonprofit called Aruna, and the executive director. Before he started Aruna, he saw on the bottom of the news station, he was watching a ticker symbol go across, or, you know, an update about how many women were in sex trafficking in India. This guy lives in the United States. But he saw that, and it wrecked his world. And he went on. He saw the potential of seeing putting a dent in that. Like, if I saw that ticker, I'm not saying I'm heartless, but if I saw something like that, I'd like, Okay, hopefully someone fights that I'm gonna go read something different. 

Lisa Nichols  29:52
But for him, it pricked his heart. 

Cory Carlson  29:54
It pricked his heart. He saw that there was a potential of his life to put a dent into that number, and so he went after it. And he Al, he's run Aruna and we're in our 11th year, which is pretty darn awesome. And then the very last P is possessions. And what has God given you, whether it's degrees or it's money or whatever it could be that you could then go use help others. So, those are five P's I'd write down for the listener wants to do this, write down all the answers those piece, look at it, pray over it, and something's gonna percolate to the top to say that is your statement, and your statement doesn't need to motivate anybody else. You could tell me your statement. I'm like, Ah, that's okay, whatever. But it's not for me. It's for you. So, what gets you excited when you read that.

Lisa Nichols  30:41
That's so, so good. And you know, I'm not. I don't know if you've done this with your family, Cory, but as, as you're talking, I'm thinking, What a great exercise to do with your kids. What a great exercise to do with your, with your spouse, if you have a spouse. Getting everybody on the same page, I think is really good. 

Cory Carlson  31:03
And I'll just warn any listener who goes tries it with their spouse. There may be rolled eyes. There may be thought, this is dumb. I know from experience, but power through, and you usually get to something pretty cool.

Lisa Nichols  31:17
I, one of one of my favorite people on the planet is Rick Lytle, who's the CEO for CEO forum. And you know, he did that with his girls at a very young age. I mean, they would do their vision boards and everything as a family. Always thought that was really cool, and they had their own vision statement for their family, but it really was kind of their guiding, guiding force, if you will. I mean, all rooted in in God, you know, in faith. But I think that's really, really powerful. Well, tell me this. I've got so many questions for you, but what do you Cory, what do you see? I mean, you coach. You're an executive coach now for leaders, what do you see as being some of the biggest challenges that leaders are facing today? Can you just name a few of those, and how have you coached them to overcome those things? What are some of those challenges? I mean, there's all kinds. I know, burnout. There's all kinds. But what, what do you see as you're going around coaching people?
Cory Carlson  32:19
I see, I mean a variety of challenges. Some of the ones that are, you know, coming top of mind right now is, I will get leaders who are, they're just, they're frustrated in an area of their life, and it could be work or it could be home. And what you see often is, especially if it's at home, it's because they haven't applied the same intentionality that they have at work. And you know, at work, we have vision statements, we have one on one meetings with our direct reports. We've identified what our rocks, our initiatives for this quarter, and we have all this intentionality at work, but then we come home and we wing it. Do we have a date planned with our spouse? Maybe, maybe not. Have we spent any real intentional time with our kids? Maybe, maybe not. And so, I see a big piece in that, is it how it takes intentionality to have success at home. And many leaders don't put in the work. And I get it. I mean, it's hard at work, we have KPIs right? Key performance indicators. We understand what we need to go after. It's very ambiguous at home, there are no KPIs to know. And so, I mean, there are some KPIs I put in place. Is I want to do two dates a month with my wife. When we don't do dates, we drift. And so, it's going on dates. I'm paying attention to how many one-on-one times, I'm having with my kids, and making sure that I'm doing ice cream, I'm doing coffee, I've got a college daughter, making sure I'm sending a text, doing some touch point, because it takes intentionality. So, I think that's a big one that I see a lot. 

Cory Carlson  34:10
Another one as I learned this through one-on-one calls, especially there's a lot of leaders are lonely, and then there's a few reasons it. You and I talk before you're involved in CEO Forum, and I lead a couple different communities myself, one of men's, one called Rise, where we've got men who want to win at home and at work, and so they're engaged. We have weekly calls really, really cool and seeing life change through it. But many men and women too, but I primarily coach men. They're just lonely. They don't have friends, and this is part of my story. I when I was president of sales, I was traveling every week, every week, Monday through Friday, and leave it all on the you know, all on the field, come home. And I did, I knew about being an intentional home, so I tried. I was trying to be super husband, super dad and but I was talking to my coach, and I just said, Hey, I'm feeling empty. And he called me out. I said, basically, you're empty because you have no friends. And as we talked about it, yes, I had friends I could go grab a beer with and talk football. But I didn't have anybody in my life at that time where I had conversations of depth.

Lisa Nichols  35:26
Deep conversations.

Cory Carlson  35:27
I put, true story. I put together a list of about 15 guys that I had met up with at different times, and I, about 15-20 guys. And I went speed dating. I went and met with all these guys, and if we just talk sports and weather, I was like, I don't need any more. Guys where we talk sports and weather. I mean, I'm not a complete nut, I still want to talk sports. But we also talked about the ups and downs of our marriages, the ups and downs of interaction with our boss or a coworker, or feeling burned out, or a relationship with God. If there was depth to the conversation, like, yes, I want more of that. I want more of this guy in my life. And so, I put together a group of guys, and we've been meeting every Thursday morning for, I think, eight years. And then in January now, we've been doing this for about as long we go on an annual guy’s trip, that positive change. And so early on in a coaching engagement with a leader, it's kind of like, Hey, are you dating your spouse? Are you being intentional with your kids? Do you got friends? And you can kind of right away, it's like, Oh no, I haven't.

Lisa Nichols  36:38
Cory, when you were talking, I was just thinking again, it's intentionality. I remember our pastor one Sunday. It was so funny. Our pastor one Sunday, because pastors can be lonely, too, and I remember him talking about just going through this season where he's like, I have no friends. I have no friends. And he said, so, one day, he did exactly what you did. He sat down and made a list, and he said, so I started texting guys, oh, I haven't talked to that person. While I text him, he goes, all of a sudden, I'm getting 15 texts back, saying, let's have coffee next week.

Cory Carlson  37:14
Too many, too many.

Lisa Nichols  37:17
Yes, too many at that point. But you know, again, it takes intentionality to make sure that you're solving that. And I'm not talking I wouldn't call it a problem, but maybe it's a lack, an area in your life that's not going as well there's something you can do about it, right? 

Cory Carlson  37:40
I'd encourage you to do something about it.
Lisa Nichols  37:42
Do something about it.

Cory Carlson  37:46
There's accountability that comes in there. There's encouragement. You got someone to call when you're down. And hopefully there's some fun involved. And just release the pressure valve that we'd rather have done with friends and laughter than through just drinking or gaming or whatever the pressure valve release currently is.

Lisa Nichols  38:10
So, good. But, you know, I would say, like a lot of leaders, it's always a time constraint. Well, I don't really have time for that, but maybe you don't have time not maybe you, you don't have the time not to do it, right? Just do it. But hey, listen, I've got so much more that I want to talk to you about, but we need to take a quick break, and we'll be right back with Cory Carlson on the Something Extra Podcast.

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Lisa Nichols  39:06
So, welcome back, everyone to the Something Extra Podcast. I've been having so much fun with Cory Carlson here. Cory is a speaker, an executive coach, an author, and is a civil engineer by education. So, we've been talking about all kinds of things. But Cory, I read a post that you wrote. It was so good. Three ways to become a leader worth following. Three ways to become a leader worth following. Why wouldn't somebody read a post like that, right? So, can we just dig in here a little bit? I mean, you, you are, honestly, you start with the Bible verse I Peter 5:23, and shepherd the flock of God that is among you exercising oversight, not under compulsion, but willingly, as God would have you, not for shameful gain, but eagerly, not domineering in your charge over them, but being examples to your flock. And you said, that kind of shepherding, that shepherding piece you shepherd what's in front of you. And I thought that was really good, you know, do you have anything to add to that? I mean, you've got, there's more here that I and it just kind of spurred another thought. Shepherding the flock.

Cory Carlson  40:36
I mean, as I think someone even taught me that kind of break down this verse, or just thinking about this verse. Is it kind of breaks down in a couple different sections, but are you leading for the right reasons, for the right way, and really for the you got the right heart. And in that, it's just kind of thinking about a little bit of, you know what is, you know, what are the reasons for leadership? I mean, we kind of even talked about this at the very beginning. It's if I'm not careful for me, when we talked about approval, I could be so about results. And when I did lead people, I did think, hey, what do I need to do to get these sales people to do what I need to do so I can get the sales numbers, and we can hit our number. Then I shifted it more just about the relationships and as I invested in them, and they did better. Well, we got the results, you know. So are you leading, you know, kind of for the right reasons, right not, not just to, to get, but instead to give. So how can you give more to those that you lead? 

Cory Carlson  41:48
I think a lot about one-on-one meetings, where I had a kind of aha moment years ago, where a lot of my one-on-one meetings. I just go there, because this is how it was always modeled to me, is they extract information, almost like, show up, extract all the information. How's your territory doing? What's going on? Give me the information so I can turn around and go present well to somebody up the chain. And instead, it wasn't about, hey, just extract information. Hey, how can I give like, what resources do I need to be able to try to provide for them, or connect them to different people in the organization, you know? So, what resources can I help provide? What obstacles do I need to try to remove? And it just changed. So, just making sure we're leading for the, you know, the right reasons, right way, the right heart.

Lisa Nichols  42:38
I agree. The right way. I just read something this morning in my devotion that talked about, you know, a fool, only a fool would accept getting results in a wrong way. There's a right way, in a wrong way, right? But foolish people will, because you can get results in lots of different ways. But is it the right way? And a fool would go ahead and get results, even if it's the wrong way. So that's so good, but it's the right reasons in the right way, the right heart. So good. Well, okay, so I want to talk about your books. So, you've written two books already talked a little bit about "Win at Home First" Brian Tome, we mentioned before wrote your forward in this. You know, I love how you talk about in here, Cory, about recalibration. I love that word, recalibration. Why don't you in the you've got reflection questions at the end of each chapter, which I really, really love. You know, yeah, we see ourselves getting a little bit off course.

Cory Carlson  43:50
I think so the "Win at Home First" book has four parts. First part's on you. We talk about identity, we talk about approval, we talk about, Hey, how can you really, you know, kind of take control of yourself in a way that you show up as your best version of yourself everywhere you go. So, first part you, second is marriage, third is parenting and the last parts on work. The idea with recalibration is just a reminder that just because we screwed up yesterday, you know, Lamentations 3:22, says, Every morning the Lord gives us new mercies, like every day is a new day. So, stop we. We need to stop bringing head trash with us all the time, like, I'm a bad mom, bad dad, you know, bad spouse, bad leader, for what happened yesterday. And instead, how can you recalibrate whether it's daily, whether it's weekly, monthly, quarterly, at different times, having these recalibration periods in your schedule to say, Okay, what did I learn from the last quarter or the last week? Where do I need to grow? Where do I need to put some intentionality? And then applying that intentionality, and then, you know, moving forward. 

Cory Carlson  45:00
I remember reading a book long time ago. Actually, went blank on the name, but it talks about a torpedo. How a torpedo in the water is, you know, it is pointed towards the submarine, but it constantly is recalibrating as it shot. Where most shotguns as you shoot, well, it goes where you aimed. I mean, obviously there's wind force, and it may, you know, may may not make it as far as you thought, but it's not recalculated in the air like a torpedo does.  And so, there's a little bit of that is as we're aiming for whatever goal we have in our life, we need to recalibrate to be like that torpedo that's redirecting itself throughout the water to hit the target. The same thing applies to us to be a better husband, wife, parent, leader, that we can continue to recalibrate to show up better.

Lisa Nichols  45:51
That's a great metaphor. I really, I really love that. Well, okay, let me ask you this. And you already talked about a few of these tactics, like, you know, KPIs, like having two dates a month with Holly, you know? I mean, you're, you're, you're good about that. But what you know, we've all, I mean, let's just face it, there are so many things that are tugging at all of us. We have all these competing demands. What do you believe, Cory, are some of those daily habits that we can incorporate into our life to help us stay on course in the midst of all of these competing priorities?

Cory Carlson  46:30
One is buy an alarm clock. Buy an alarm clock and don't use your phone. If you can at all possibly, that the greater you can increase the gap between when you last look at your phone at night and you go to and you lay your head on the pillow, the better. And, and I've been guilty of this myself, and some people like, well, you know, I may see the email, but I didn't reply to the email. Well, you laid in bed thinking, well, I, in the morning, I'm going to write this email, and then, actually, I probably need to make an Excel spreadsheet to kind of show the flow, and then I need to do this. And so, you just spend a lot of time in your when you should be sleeping, or maybe reading another type of book. And so, you know, charge your phone in the kitchen, charge your phone in the bathroom. Just charge, try to charge your phone away from the night stand. Somebody's listening, who's like, well, I've got a college kid. I haven't need my phone by my bed in case something happens. Okay, I get it. If you got to have your phone by you, do it. You just got to be super disciplined that you don't fall asleep, scrolling social media, looking at the news. So that's one piece, increase it, and when you go to bed. 

Cory Carlson  47:42
The other works the same ways. In the morning, when you wake up, increase the gap as long as possible before you grab your phone. I talk about this in "Rise and Go." Cycle of awesome verse, cycle of awful. Cycle of awesome is a phrase you know, we're familiar with, right? Our thoughts lead to our you know, into our actions, which lead to our results. Our thoughts lead to feelings, lead actions lead to results. Cycle of awful is when we start our day by looking at the results. We grab our phone, we see, did that post I do yesterday, did it go viral? Did anything cool happen? Did we get that did that client send back the change order, did the prospects say yes? And we check our email for that. We go looking for the results. Odd are none of that happened while we slept. And so, we start off frustrated. We looked at the results. We then went to then our thoughts are, man, it's gonna be a bad day that client didn't say yes. Oh, and, you know, and there was a shooting downtown, oh, and this happened across the country. And, oh, this is happening in the political world, all things that we can't control. But we start our day with the results of the world, and then that leads to our thoughts that we think we're not enough, and it's not going to work out today. Then our feelings are, we're discouraged, and then guess what? Our actions are, we show up less than and we don't do our best effort. And I think it's so often because we start the day looking at our phone, and if we can start the day thinking of gratitude, scripture, journaling, meditation, working out like the variety of ways to start your day, I think can be so significant.


Lisa Nichols  49:25
That's really good. Starting, that we are starting with the results. That's, that's good. Well, we've got, we've got a little bit more time here. I really, I would love people to understand just how intentional you are in this, you know, win at home first. I would love for you just to really, if you can just encapsulate it in a short little story here, Cory, what you guys did for Kylie. I guess your oldest that's now 20 when she turned 13. What did you guys do? I mean, the intentionality behind that was amazing. I love it. And it there may be people with young, younger kids on the call that can take that and implement it for themselves. 

Cory Carlson  50:14
Great. Well, thanks, Lisa. It's cool. It did a listener. If you, if you hear this story and you want to go copy and paste it, do it. In, it's in my book, and go get the book and do the exact same thing we did, or tweak it however you want go for it. And so, for us, what happened was our daughter is now 20, and we've done this for both of our daughters. I have three kids, two daughters and a son. And we've now done it for both of our daughters. I will do it, we will do a version of this for our son. Well, what happened was, when our daughters turned 13, I wanted my wife to we wanted to do something for like an identity ceremony. And going into it, we knew they were materialistic identity ever kind of ceremonies like MTV, I can't remember the name, my sweet 16th birthday, or, I don't know, whatever it was. You get this brand new, amazing car. And maybe we just did all this because we knew we weren't gonna get an amazing car for our kid. We want to do something cool. I don't know. Well, we weren't going to do something like that. There's a lot of great father to son ceremonies. There's good mother to daughter, but there really wasn't anything for a father to a daughter that I could find. There may be something out there now, but I just couldn't find it. And I want to be involved in it, and I also want my wife involved in it. 

Cory Carlson  51:33
So, what we did is kind of taken a hodgepodge of about a bunch of other ideas that we had and we had seen, but we went to Proverbs 31 which is the, you know, the godly woman proverb. And we just felt that God calling us out to five different words to affirm our daughter in that, you know, generosity character. I don't remember all five at this moment on the spot here. But anyways, we identified five words. Well, what we did is we then put together a list of women that impact her life, and then men that impact her life. And so there are Holly's, my close friends, and we assigned a word to each of those people. They each got one word, and they were to write a letter. What does that word mean to their life. What does that word mean to a 13-year-old girl? And we got these letters back Lisa, and this was before chat GPT. I was blown away by the wisdom all of our friends that we got. It was incredible. And then we then put it together in a book, like a snap fish book. Awesome. It was so, so cool. The night of their, each of their individual birthdays, we had some of those people come over, read the letters, talk about the letters, and it was just, it was awesome, emotional, very, very cool. 

Cory Carlson  52:57
Well, then one of the highlights was towards the end. So, the book was great. The words people talk around the table, reading these letters, I mean, all that was great. So, its kind of crazy to think we could even top it. But at the end of the night, I had heard somebody do a teaching on Exodus 38:8, where the women had to hand over their mirror, bronze mirrors to be melted for the sinks, basically the wash basins of the tabernacle. And I was like, that, that's so cool. And so, I kind of took this one thing. I heard that they melted them, and I had also done this, what I'm talking about. We just took a bunch of cool ideas and try to blend it all together. But I heard but I heard that one verse I then had done, you know, burn the like, burn the ship's idea. You kind of write your sins on a piece of paper, and you throw them in the fire and they go away. That idea? 

Cory Carlson  53:54
So, what we did is we got two bronze mirrors. One bronze mirror. I asked, you know, like I said, we did this individually to each of our daughters, I but I asked them to write down, what are their identity issues, what are their character challenges? And I don't know what they wrote, it's confidential, but my thought is they probably wrote, you know, how? You know, how many guys like me getting straight A's? How am I doing in dance for the oldest gymnastics for the younger you know, how many people you know, Snapchat followers, I have Instagram followers like that. I'm sure that would have been all the things on their list that they wrote on this mirror. We then took the mirror, and after we, you know, I got it. I didn't look at it, but I took the mirror, we then threw it on the fire, and we watched it melt. And we told them that their identity is not in how many guys like them and how many social media followers they have, whether they got the, you know, the trophy at the dance recital or not, or they got straight A's or not. That is not their identity. Their identity is in these five words. So, we then gave them a new bronze mirror where my wife embroidered the words on the on a casing for it. And that these are God attributes that we see in each of you, that we want to affirm you in, and we want you to live into them, as opposed to what we just melted. And it was awesome. It was so cool.

Lisa Nichols  55:20
That is so beautiful, so cool.

Cory Carlson  55:22
And there was a cool, I think, the next day, very next day. So where are how we in their old house used to live in when my daughter was, she was on the phone, and I was down at the bottom of stairs, could hear everything. And she was on the phone with and on speaker with or two of her good friends. And she go, they said, Hey, so what did you get for your birthday? And she goes to explain the ceremony and kind of what it was in this book, and then they go, is that it? And my heart just dropped. I was like, son of a gun, you serious? And my daughter just says, yeah. And the two other girls says, Oh, I wish we would have had that. And I was like, Oh yes, yes, but they liked and the reason I just share that part story is all of our kids are, you know, longing for us to affirm them in their identity and who they are, as opposed to what they've done.

Lisa Nichols  56:24
Oh, so good. That's gold. 

Cory Carlson  56:28
Well thanks for letting me share it. It's been a minute. 

Lisa Nichols  56:30
Oh, my goodness. I, well, let's just talk really quickly, about "Rise and Go." I mean, here's what I really, I really want our listeners to do. I want our listeners to go get your books. If you need an executive coach, engage with Cory. Follow him. He's got a podcast. That's the other thing. He's got a podcast that is in the top 1.5% of podcasts, which there are 3 million podcasts. So, that is really cool. But you know, the forward of this, Cory, was written by guy I love, Jordan Rayner, I love him. He was a former Something Extra Podcast guest, and wow, follow Jordan too. He's got "The Creator in You" and "Redeeming Your Time." But, you know, the subtitle is, and I love this, is How to get back up with courage and move forward with confidence, you know. And Cory, the deal is, if we live for any length of time, you know, we're gonna get knocked down. We're gonna get knocked down. I mean, why did you write the book? What are you hoping listeners will take from the book? 

Cory Carlson  57:48
I don't know how much time we got left. I know we're going longer for you, but you know, really for me. I mean, the whole thesis of the book is, you know, great leaders getting all great every all leaders get knocked down. It's just the great leaders get back up quicker. So, what could it look like in your life if the next time you got knocked down, big or small, you were able to get up quicker? And so that is kind of the whole thesis of it. And for me, March 1, 2020. Is when I left corporate altogether. We went all in on coaching, like, Here We Come, my family, we made the decision. We decided, hey, where it's time to go? That's March 1, 2020 and we know what happened in 2020, March 13. So, two weeks later is when the world shut down and we had to do masks and stay at home mandates. On that day, I got some emails canceling workshops and speaking engagements. 35% of my revenue vanished. And I know for some listeners, they're kind of, you know, wham. Wham. 35% I lost my job. I lost a loved one. I get it. I'm, you know, sorry for that, for us and for our life, we didn't know what was going to happen next. 35% what about the other 65% I was scared. I was knocked down. And in that summer, over that course of those next few months, and God just took me on a journey. He pointed me to different podcasts. I got to hear cool stories of resilience. Pointed me to different scripture, different conversations. And I just there was just a stirring that started to take place. 

Cory Carlson  59:17
Well, in the ESV, the English Standard Version in Acts 8, 9 and 10, three different individuals are told to rise and go and go do something bold and courageous. And I could unpack each of those stories and instances, you know, if we like. But the deal is, they went and did it. And as I'm reading this, I really just felt a nudge of, like, rise and go, like, stop your pity party in the bay, you know, in the basement, get going and go do what you've been, you know, called and equipped to do. And so, I started, I started, and what ended up happening was that during that time, I still was, you know, reading my devotion as kind of, there's some cool parts of 2020. And I did a deep dive in reading different scripture that helped me get back up. And during that time, I'd have clients call, they were struggling with whatever it may be. And I said, You know what? I wrote this this morning or last week, why don't you read this chapter or this idea? And so, it got battle tested. They came back saying, Oh, that was super helpful. Or can you go a little deeper here? And anyways, because of that, I put together "Rise and Go." It's 20 different chapters. They're kind of written like the devotions. You open with the Scripture, there's some story, there's some leadership content, followed by reflective questions. And so, 20 chapters, first 10, and give you the courage to get back up. The next 10, give you the confidence and move forward. And that's the book. Anytime I write a book, Lisa, it's because something got screwed up in my life. So, if I write a third book, you may just say, Oh, what happened to that guy?

Lisa Nichols  1:00:53
What happened to Cory? I always tell that too. I always say, I usually serve up whatever God's, you know, making me eat at the time, you know so, but I love it. And you sent me a copy of it, and in there you said, in the first she said, Lisa, I pray this book will help you rise and go in the tough times of life and leadership. And, it's good. That's good, Cory. Hey, let me ask you this. This is called something extra. What do you believe is this something extra that every leader needs?

Cory Carlson  1:01:32
We said the word before I'm gonna say it again, because I don't think it'd be overused. Intentionality, you know, it's not about time management. It's about choice management. We all have the same hours in the day, and if there's an area in your life that's not where you want to be, you need to be intentional. You need to block out time. You need to write down some action items you take. I mean, I don't know what the next step is for you as the listener, but it's intentionality. You can have anything that you want. You want your marriage restored. You want a better connection, or teenage daughter you want to improve culture at the office, whatever it is, it just takes intentionally to get what you want, what you allow you approve. So, if there's man, if there's something happening your life that you don't like, you've probably allowed it.

Lisa Nichols  1:02:17
No, that's good. I like what you just said, and that is, that's golden, too, Cory. You go, it's not time management, its choice management, it's choice management. Mark Miller says having a choice is our superpower, and so we can choose, right? So, so good. This has been so much fun. Thank you so much for making the time. I love everything that we talked about. I know it's going to help our listeners, and I'm looking forward to the next time getting to spend some time with you, Cory, keep doing what you're doing. 

Cory Carlson  1:02:54
Thank you. Thanks for the opportunity. I know you're very busy. Keep doing what you're doing and then leading bold and with faith, and it's just encouraging. 

Announcer  1:03:02
Thank you for listening to today's show Something Extra with Lisa Nichols as a Technology Partners Production Copyright Technology Partners Inc. 2019. For show notes, or to reach Lisa, visit tpi.co/podcast. Don't forget to leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Google Play or wherever you listen. 

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