The Power of Mentorship and Resilience with Dr. Kendall Brune and Dr. Ryan Rogers

In this heartfelt episode, Lisa sits down with Dr. Kendall Brune and Dr. Ryan Rogers to explore the transformative journeys of veterans and leaders. Dr. Rogers shares his deeply personal story of military service, the challenges of transitioning to civilian life, and how mentorship from Dr. Brune helped him find purpose beyond the battlefield. Together, they discuss the importance of community, the impact of unresolved trauma, and how a bias toward action and supportive relationships can change lives. Tune in for inspiring lessons on leadership, resilience, and the "something extra" that defines us all.

Guest Links:

• ARISE Veteran Foundation
• Dr. Rogers’ LinkedIn
• Dr. Brune’s LinkedIn
• Dr. Kendall Brune

Credits: 
Host: Lisa Nichols
Executive Producer: Jenny Heal
Marketing Support: Landon Burke and Joe Szynkowski
Podcast Engineer: Portside Media

Transcript

Lisa Nichols  00:02
Chromosomes, little strands of nucleic acids and proteins are the fundamental genetic instructions that tell us who we are. At birth, most people are born with 46 chromosomes, but each year in the United States, about 6000 people are born with an extra chromosome, making them a person with Down syndrome. If you've ever encountered someone with Down syndrome, you know that they are some of the kindest, most joyful people you will ever meet. They truly have something extra. 

My name is Lisa Nichols, and for 30 years, I have been both the CEO of Technology Partners and the mother to Ally. Ally has something extra in every sense of the word. I have been blessed to be by her side as she impacts everyone she meets. Through these two important roles as CEO and mother to Ally, I have witnessed countless life lessons that have fundamentally changed the way I look at the world. While you may not have an extra chromosome, every leader has something extra that defines who you are. 

Join me as I explore the something extra in leaders from all walks of life and discover how that difference in each of them has made a difference in their companies, their families, their communities and in themselves. If you like this episode today, please go to Apple Podcast or wherever you listen and leave us a five-star rating. 

I'm thrilled to have Dr. Ryan Rogers and Dr. Kendall Brune on the show today. Dr. Rogers is the president and CEO, and Dr. Brune is the Chairman of Arise Veteran Foundation. Well, guys, welcome to the Something Extra Podcast. Dr. Brune and Dr. Rogers, I'm so delighted that we can make this happen today, especially with everyone's crazy schedules.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  01:44
This is just a blessing. We can't wait to participate, Lisa.

Lisa Nichols  01:48
Yes, well, Kendall, you and I have known each other for 20 plus years, and you know what? We have our something extra, daughters, to thank for that, don't we? Your Paige, my Ally. And if it not been for these amazing ladies there is a possibility, we would not know one another. So, I'm so grateful.

Dr. Kendall Brune  02:11
Most of the time you know people, they'll be Dr. B. when I'm with students and then research, but my best title is Paige's dad.

Lisa Nichols  02:21
Absolutely. Absolutely, I feel the same way. Well, I was just thinking about it, and seriously, we probably could do a whole episode on just what these amazing young ladies have taught us, right, Kendall?

Dr. Kendall Brune  02:34
Follow up with Sherry on that presentation you know that she's doing with for the girls.

Lisa Nichols  02:39
I know. I'm excited about that. I'm excited about that. And of course, you know, you know one person, one awesome person, and they introduce you to another. So, Dr. Rogers, that's how I met you is through Kendall. And so, I'm just really impressed with what you're doing with Arise, and we're going to really dig into that. I have a lot of questions, though, that I want to talk about before we go there. Good. Well, Dr. Rogers, I want to start with you, because upon high school graduation, you join the army. And I wanted to ask you, because we didn't get to talk about this before, who or what inspired you to do that?

Dr. Ryan Rogers  03:22
So, honestly, I think a lot of it had to come and was closely associated with my grandmother and telling me a lot of the stories of my great grandfather. He was on one of the ships that sunk in Pearl Harbor. He wasn't on the ship, they were on shore leave when it happened. But he was on one of the ships when they were attacked. So, just hearing her detail some of the stories that were passed down, really kind of, you know, put a little passion in me to be very intrigued by what happens within the military.

Lisa Nichols  03:59
My dad was a Marine. My father-in-law was a sergeant in the Army. My uncle was a Green Beret. And my dad always would say, because my dad was fairly young when he entered into the military as well. And he always would say, it will the military will turn a young man into a man quicker than anything. 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  04:24
Very quickly. 

Lisa Nichols  04:25
Quicker than anything. And it's funny, because there were just so many things about my dad that carried forward. Like Greg would say his dad would be like, don't clean your room. He said, I'm going to police the area. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  04:45
Well, that was some pressure.

Lisa Nichols  04:46
It was pressure, Kendall, because Greg's like, he would do the white glove test, you know, on that. And then my dad was funny, because if you were 15 minutes early, you were late. So, I mean, it was just, there were certain characteristics that just definitely carried, carried forward. Well, I know that you served in Iraq to support Operation Iraqi Freedom, and then you were injured. So, can you just tell our listeners a little bit about that transition, if you will, from the military to civilian life? Because I think that probably is informed a lot of what you're trying to do today and what you've done with veterans.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  05:32
It is, and I would like to say that I was successful at it, but that would not be truthful. I failed miserably, and it wasn't because of lack of grit or determination or even will, for that matter. It was just a really kind of a lack of understanding of really kind of what was, what happened, what was going on with me. And then, you know, the, the treatment that I that I sought afterwards, was not conducive to really putting me in a forward projection motion. It just wasn't like it, it nearly killed me. So, I mean the transition, I didn't really understand what was going on, like why I was experiencing a lot of the things that I did. And it wasn't actually until many years after the fact, and I was, became really sick, and actually even became suicidal. Because of my sickness, because I wasn't able to work, because I was utilizing work as one of my coping mechanisms. I wasn't violent, you know? I wasn't a raging alcoholic or anything like that, but I was on 22 different medications. I was on seven narcotics and three psychotropics. 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  05:41
And that was the best that they had to offer me. That was their solution to what was ailing me. And it wasn't until I met this amazing counselor at the Vet Center who was also a combat veteran, Wes Shockley was his name. And he helped me, like, pinpoint so many different things, like, oh, well, the reason why you're, you know, responding this way is because of what happened in the military and the training. He was able to make so many connections for me that was never made before. And then I can actually step back and go, Oh, wait a minute, now I can understand why I'm experiencing life after the military the way that I am experiencing it, and make some adjustments. I didn't know how to make those adjustments before. The adjustments that I did make, they weren't necessarily positive adjustments.

Lisa Nichols  07:45
I know that it's a challenge for so many I mean, on multiple fronts. I mean, maybe if you didn't even have any kind of PTSD or that, I mean, it's just translating what you did in the military to civilian life. It's just difficult, and that's what you guys are trying to, that's what you are not just trying, but you've, you've served a lot of veterans, 75,000 veterans so far. But enter Dr. B or Obi Wan.

Dr. Kendall Brune  08:14
Obi Wan Kenobi.

Lisa Nichols  08:17
Obi Wan Kenobi, Jedi. You know old man, whatever you want to call it.

Dr. Kendall Brune  08:25
Hence the beard, now.

Lisa Nichols  08:26
Hence the beard. I think you guys, you two met, Dr. Rogers, when you started going to, you went to St. Louis Christian College. And Dr. B., I think you were either the President or the Development, Director of Development, some Vice President of Development there.

Dr. Kendall Brune  08:48
Hey, you. I was the administrator for the college. And then kind of interim president, we had a presidential transition team, and so I pretty much did everything from cut to grass to recruit to students, so which is very typical for a Bible college.

Lisa Nichols  09:06
Sure. Well, you guys met there, and you know, Dr. Rogers, you went on to get your Bachelor's in Human Resources, an MBA, a doctorate, and I think that you two struck up a kindred relationship. And I think Dr. B was a big part of your journey after that, right Dr. Rogers?

Dr. Ryan Rogers  09:28
He was, you know, I settled into a very simplistic kind of, you know, life. I was perfectly okay with the, the thought process that I was like, I was a grunt and I was happy with that. No, I meant not to say that there was anything wrong with it, because I still kind of self-identify as a group. I just do. I just happen to have, you know, the most expensive letters that I've ever paid for in front of my name. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  09:56
They'll hire deeper debt.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  10:00
See, the thing is, though, is I know that I would have not gotten to the point to where I'm at now. And this platform of where, you know, I've been able to get to, had it not been for, you know, Dr. B's, you know, consistent like, you know, hey, just keep moving forward. Hey, what about this? Keep trying this. It was a very positive mentor, just to keep me going and to keep me moving forward.

Lisa Nichols  10:25
We could probably do a whole podcast on that and mentorship, because it's so important. But Kendall, you've got a bachelor's in healthcare administration, an MBA and a PhD in healthcare admin. You've held, and we're not going to go into all of these, but you have held so many leadership positions. I remember at one time, Kendall, years ago, meeting you or talking with you, and I said, Well, how many companies are you involved in right now? And you go, oh, about 19. And I'm like, what? It was crazy.

Dr. Kendall Brune  10:57
I've slowed down, it's only 12 now.

Lisa Nichols  10:59
It's only 12 now. Oh, my goodness, I think you maybe sleep three hours a night but I mean, you've had positions across Senior Care, healthcare, veteran support. Can you tell me what, out of all those, what are some of the common leadership principles that you have carried forward, no matter what industry or where, what organization you're serving in?

Dr. Kendall Brune  11:23
Well, I think my root is, I'm an educator, so the mentoring part is kind of a natural component. When, when Sherry and I, as you know, we were young parents moving to Mizzou to go to school full time. Stuart was just 14 months and so I ended up writing a grant as the month that I got at Mizzou to develop a Student Parent Center. And that was basically in partnership with the School of Medicine and the School of Education to support students that were single parents, our young parents. And so, I remember, never will forget, sitting in the provost office because we were trying to use an old building that was going to be torn down for a parking garage, which, that's what it is today. And I said, Well, how long is it going to take to build that? And he said, three years. And I said, well, good, so we can use it for a year or two. And he just laughed. And they said, Yes, well, we ended up getting the grant, and we had 90 kids right off the bat, and so they had no idea. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  12:31
But the same thing happened, you know, with Ryan and I, when he started at St. Louis Christian College, and it really was his wife that that applied and came to school. And then Ryan ended up joining the evening program that was called AIM, which was perfect for him, adults in ministry. And they had kids, you know, they, they were three little kids, and so it's much different as a parent. You don't have time to waste. Time management is critical, because you've got little kids, and they got to get places, and you got babysitters, and you got to make money, because you still got to pay bills. And so, it's a very complicated process. I don't know any different, Lisa, that's just the way we work. Sheri and I were a young couple. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  13:21
And so, I always look for mentoring. How do I mentor? Ryan was right there, St. Louis Christian College at that it was originally built in 1956 we had 28 veterans that were going to school, and it was not handicapped accessible. There was nothing about the college that was handicapped accessible. So literally, Ryan was a carpenter, and he's like, and they literally told me, I got this, we can do this. And so, we created a scholarship program that was MAP, Ministry Advancement Program. And it was, how do we create a MAP? And that's really a lot like leadership is, how do we create a MAP from we're going to go start here, and we're going to end up here, and it's one of those steps in between. And Ryan, as most vets, is like, Okay, I got a whiteboard. Here's what we're going to do, and started doing that. And I only stepped in his way one time. And being a sergeant, he stepped and said, I got this, sir, and that was that was to me saying, don't get my way. You gave me the orders. I know my orders, and we'll get there. And there was a great relationship. 

Lisa Nichols  14:31
Love that, oh my goodness, bias toward action. Tell me what you need, right? And I will put the plan together. I love it. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  14:40
Plan. Do. Act.

Lisa Nichols  14:44
You know, I know too, that you've spent a big part of your career, you know, I've talked about this a lot, working with 38 different tribes, 132 two different nations through tribal health initiatives. What have you seen, Kendall, the biggest health care challenges in the indigenous communities today?

Dr. Kendall Brune  15:05
Oh, wow. Officially, what I talk about is the social disparities of health and so that is just really chronic care issues from long term unresolved trauma. I mean that, and that's the same challenges that veterans face. It's just unresolved trauma. How do I deal with this, where we're doing it, and whether a native or whether veteran, you're, you're taught to bury it, just march on soldier, you know. We've got to do, so you, you figure out a way to mask it and bury it down, and it and it becomes an issue when you uncover it. And so, the, the blessing I've had is that my, my grandfather, who was instrumental in starting St. Louis Christian College. Ryan, got to meet him and get to know him. Roy Williams was Chickasaw, and had ran away from home at 14. And, you know, the story kicked off the train in St. Louis. And so I got to introduce him to the tribe, take him down there, you know, kind of and that started uncovering stuff. And a lot of it, I didn't know the trauma that existed because he buried it. And it's the same with Ryan. You start peeling that onion. It's like you take one piece at a time. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  15:50
I can tell you Lisa, after reading and facilitating with Ryan's book being published, if I'd have known everything that he faced, I would have treated him differently. That wouldn't have been good for our relationship, because I would have been much more medical and not just befriended. Being a friend and saying, How can we do this? And at that time, we met, we were just both young parents, you know. Had a goal to redo the campus and to build it, which we did become the fastest growing Bible college the United States with that. But it was because we were building, we were redoing things and, and so that was, that was the beauty of it was pretty simple. We created discipleship groups, which were really a five individual team. And we took a senior classman or our teacher to help lead that team, then for underclassmen, and we just kept going. We just kept going. Kept going.

Lisa Nichols  17:28
That is, I mean, it's really and truly, you're right. It is simple, it, but it worked, right? And I love what you said, We were rebuilding. You know, I think Kendall, I mean, we have to always have that kind of mindset, right? What worked before, we've always done it this way. Work for the future. We need to constantly be evaluating, evaluating our lives. You know, are we on track or not? The is our organization on track? Well, I want, I want to focus a little bit more on leadership, and then we're going to get into what you guys are doing today with Arise. But I'm going to open up these questions to both of you and whoever wants to whoever wants to answer, I'm good with it. But you know, if you said, have to say, what is the most important leadership lesson that you've learned in your life? What would it be either one of you.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  18:22
For me, I would say it's like, never take anything from grant for granted. Meaning, like, you'd be surprised if you have a willingness to learn on where you can learn the most valuable information from. You know, there's sometimes when you become a senior executive and a senior leader, and the interactions that you have with the mainline staff become very, very limited. But the reality of it is, is that you should value like, every single bit of what you're the information you're getting, because, I mean, they're the ones that are literally down in the trenches, per se, and can provide the most valuable information. Because what leaders have a tendency to do is leaders have a tendency to filter as it goes up. So, the telephone game like, Hey, this is what's happening here. And by the time it gets to the command, it's like, Wait, that's not what I said. That's not what the origination of the, the original message was. So, getting it firsthand, you know, and be prepared to pay some things that you may not necessarily find flattering.

Lisa Nichols  19:35
I was gonna say there may be some things that you learn that you're not that excited about, right? But you'd rather have the truth. 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  19:44
And the other part is like, Okay, is there validity, having enough, you know, personal integrity to say hey, is what they're saying, does it have validity? Is it something that me, as a leader, is causing to happen within in the environment that I'm responsible for? Is that my, is that my doing? Or do I have a part to play in this? And I mean, the question is, oh, the answer is, always, yes. I always have a part to play in that, but I want to make a positive influence in that, and not a negative so what can I do in order to facilitate that change?

Lisa Nichols  20:22
That's good. That's really good. Well, Kendall, let me ask you this one, what surprised you the most about being a leader?

Dr. Kendall Brune  20:33
People expect you to have all the answers.

Lisa Nichols  20:35
But you're Obi Wan Kenobi.

Dr. Kendall Brune  20:35
I think really, this humility is trying to have that humility and, you know, so you, you've got to really, you know, show that, hey, I grew up in the same way you did. At least I do. I don't like to have a be on a high horse, so to speak, and just really kind of, and I'm on, I'm from the service industry. So, you know, from health care, I don't want to, they always call it the white coat issue. And come in, the doctors got a white coat and, and, and all of a sudden, patients are like, Oh, you got to give me the answers. I don't, I'm, I'm investigating. I'm a scientist. So, I'm just trying to figure out what's going on, you know. And so, you know, for us, I was, I always just kind of say, but we're gonna, yes, I have a lot of experience, you know, I've had a lot of water under this bridge, so maybe I can share some of that. But I kind of do it not as a dictorial, it's just sharing, you know, when we did this, this is what happened. Is it going to work when I apply it? Let's measure it. And that's kind of where we're always ticking and tacking, you know, kind of like sailing. We're always kind of going back and forth, making adjustments and, and I that's, for me, my style has been very successful.

Lisa Nichols  20:42
I would say that, I would say that, that is the truth. What about, Dr. Rogers, I'll ask you this one, is there a piece of leadership advice? It could even be from Obi Wan over here that you have received over the years that you know you carry with you.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  22:24
Perseverance. Perseverance along with you know, if you don't know the answer, find it like search for it. Surround yourself with individuals who are smarter than you and who are going places that you want to be and you want to eventually obtain.

Lisa Nichols  22:49
That's good. All right. So, Dr. B, I'm going to ask you this one, and I know the answer to this, because I know you and Sheri will but when you're faced with impossible challenges, where do you go for strength?

Dr. Kendall Brune  23:06
To our Creator, to God. Our faith is, is really grounding together. And we kind of we share that among all of our friends and family, as you know, that's where we kind of start, and it doesn't, it's not always just within Christian faith. You know, we share that within our like our girlfriends group, they're varied backgrounds, different history. But one thing I learned in missionary work is you don't beat them over to head with just your faith. I will share with you how my walk came about and personal relationship, but I want them to share too. And, and so it just gives that opportunity for us to be grounded, and Sheri And I've had that many times, you know, especially with our girls, because there are a lot of challenges and opportunities. I didn't say difficulties, I just said challenges and opportunities. Because, like Ryan said, it's perseverance, and in the tribes, we call it razilient instead of resilient, R, A, Z, like reservation, you have to be always pressing, always pursuing. And failure is not an option. It's just a nagging possibility that keeps me straight.

Lisa Nichols  24:24
Yes, oh, I so agree. I so agree. You gotta have, you gotta have something, and it can be different for different people, but as you all, we share the same faith, and there's gotta be an anchor there. And I always go back there is, I think it's Jeremiah, 33: 3, I think, don't quote me on that, but where it says, you will show me things that I do not know. And my goodness, Greg and I run into things all the time, weekly, and our business were like, wow, we've never encountered this one before. But you know, going to the Lord in prayer and asking them to show us the things that we do not know and help guide us, right? So, I could not agree more with that. Well, listen, guys, we do need to take a quick break, and then we'll be right back with Dr. Brune and Dr. Rogers on the Something Extra Podcast.

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Lisa Nichols  25:50
Well, welcome back, everyone to the Something Extra Podcast with my friends, Dr. Brune and Dr. Rogers. I've loved our conversation so far, guys, but I really want to pivot, and I want to talk about what you're doing today. With Arise and you both have done a lot with veterans, mental health, vocational rehabilitation. Kendall, I remember years ago, I mean, years ago, when you were building community gardens, or you were helping the veterans build community gardens. I know we had taught years ago about the partnership with Southwest Airlines and taking the leather and helping not just the tribes but the veterans repurpose that leather for other things. I mean you, you both have done this for a long time. Let me ask you, so Dr. Rogers, you know, how did your personal influence, because we talked about this, your transition and that trauma, how does that really influence what you're doing today? And kind of it's almost like a calling on your life. I would say.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  26:57
100% it's a calling. I have, I have never been more assured of like, where I'm supposed to be and what I'm supposed to be doing in my life than I have in doing this. It's just, it's amazing how, you know, God has taken some of the things that have happened in my life and created this wonderful tapestry and how it can be utilized to help so many others. And I have often said, and it's really hard to say this, it's like that, if what I have gone through and experienced is able to help someone else so they don't have to go through the same things, here comes the difficult part. Then it was worth it. Then it was worth what I had to struggle through so that someone else doesn't have to do the same thing.

Lisa Nichols  27:49
That's beautiful. It's true. There is a quote that I absolutely love by Morgan Nichols, and her quote is and I'm probably not going to get it exactly right, but you'll get the gist of it. Don't be afraid to talk about how you climb that mountain, because it will become someone else's survival kit.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  28:11
Absolutely. And that's exactly what is like shared a lot. I share a lot in my the book that I've hopefully be out in June. You know, I share a lot of my personal story within that, and that's even difficult, because there's a level of transparency that is like, I'm sharing some not flattering moments of my life and choices and decisions, that it's like, you know, people could totally and completely judge me for, you know, some of the decisions that I made. I don't care you want to judge, go for it. That's on you. That's not and then, and then I'll follow it up with this book's not really for you then. This book is for those who are really seeking and looking for a different way, a different solution than what's been provided to them, or what they even know that exists for them.

Lisa Nichols  29:05
Right. But without that vulnerability, Dr. Rogers, it's really hard for people to connect with you. And I know that that is the purpose for you sharing those things is that you, as that book goes forth, and people are reading that, they can identify. Wow, he went through that too, right? And you can relate to it, right? So, it's so important.

Dr. Kendall Brune  29:31
We always, we say, if you've taken care of, you take care of veterans, great. If you take care of a veteran, that means you've taken care of a veteran. They all have a different experience, you know, they all have different ways of being brought up. So, you have different childhood experiences. So, all of that plays into that social DNA, you know, and how do you respond to issues. And so, we don't take a blanket or a badge of saying, I've supported a lot of veterans. I know exactly what to do. I run the other way when somebody acts like that. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  30:09
Absolutely.

Lisa Nichols  30:11
Well, I know that. And you did yourself, Dr. Rogers, and you even admitted there were suicidal kind of thoughts. And I don't, you know, we won't go any further than that. I don't know if there was anything manifested there, but we know for a fact that so many veterans struggle with this, right? So, can you, can you just tell us, what are some of those warning signs that you guys have seen that maybe a veteran is struggling with some mental health?

Dr. Ryan Rogers  30:49
So, I think a lot of it has to do with behaviors, and especially if there is maybe some changes in behaviors. Let's say, for example, you have an individual who is always kind of downtrodden or depressed, and then suddenly there is a shift, and then, oh, they're happy go lucky. You would think that, that would be a positive thing, right? But sometimes that is an indication that the individual is that, like, hey, all of these burdens and all of these things that I've been, you know, dealing with for so long, and I've never had an outlet. Suddenly, now that I've decided that, hey, I'm gonna end it now, now I feel so much, you know, the burden is lifted, when, in reality, it's not. It's just like a temp, kind of a temporary reprieve, because you think you've you have the solution. 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  31:47
But here's another crazy thing to think about, too. Is like every so they interviewed the individuals that jumped off the Golden Gate Bridge and had survived. And they asked them, Okay, what went through your mind as soon as you let go? And it everyone said the same thing, regret, regret. I shouldn't have done it like because life is precious. And it's hard, because there's so many things that we are dealing with internally, just individually, and we often feel like many times, that we can't really share it, or we can't really have those conversations because of the stigma that's associated with mental health. I mean, I literally just had this conversation this morning, or it was yesterday. I said, Look, let me explain something to you that's very easy to kind of analogize. If I came in and I had a cast on my arm, and you would visibly see that I have a cast. There's no reservation having a conversation about, Hey, what happened to you? I can see that you broke your arm or that your arm is in a cast. Let's talk about really, what happened to you physically. But whenever we have that conversation, we broach to something of like, something that I'm struggling with internally or mentally. Immediately it becomes super, super uncomfortable, in which it shouldn't it should, like these should be things and conversations that we should be able to have across the board, and we would not have the issues that we do if that was the case?

Lisa Nichols  33:26
Yes, but Kendall, were you going to say something about that? 

Dr. Kendall Brune  33:32
It's very true. Is that when you have a physical injury, you can see it. You get you instantly, you know, they'll pull out a chair, they'll move something so that you can make accommodations for you. But if it's mental health, oh, my God, I don't know what to say. I don't know what to do, or what the issue is, you know. So, so it is an invisible issue, and we run to that Lisa with our girls, you know, having Down syndrome, we can physically. They can see that there's a disability, but Lord, help the ones that don't, have that physical side and they they're challenged. So, it crosses a lot of different pathways, but you know, I think the really aspect with Ryan is just getting that first confidence to share and to have a safe zone. And so, what I've we've discovered with veterans is getting in a common space where they can share one on one. Kind of relate to somebody, or instantly, you know, Ryan will get with a vet and he'll say, Oh, I was in Fallujah. And they go, Oh, I was. And they start sharing. And then they know exactly what battles they went through. They know how rough it was, or what they were doing, because they've been through that war. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  34:51
And so that that's what we really tried to facilitate. And it's really not all about we own and operate facilities. It's just not about our facilities, because most of our connections always been out. You know, with other groups and the group call and we'll say, how can we help, you know, and how do we help serve you, whether it's getting the leather kits to their VA hospital, to their rec center, to the VFW halls, how do we help? Food products, getting food it really just is a is a way to open that door so we can start talking about it. Because you never know when you're going to have a tragedy and somebody might end up committing suicide or causing harm to somebody else that might be in their way. And that's what we're trying to avoid, the ultimate injury.

Lisa Nichols  35:44
Right. Well, I mean, you, you've said so much there. That's so important. I think one of the things I just heard, it's just about human connection and community and, you know, maybe you yourself have not struggled with it, but be aware, right? I mean, we can all be aware of what people might be going through, and it's just a human connection. You know, finding those common points of interest to start a conversation, and there's, there's so much good there that you guys have shared. Well, let's, let's move into Arise, because this is what you guys are doing today. Kendall, I know you're the board chair. Dr. Rogers, you're the President/CEO. Tell me the mission of Arise Veterans Foundation?

Dr. Kendall Brune  36:31
Well, ours is really a mission is to serve. We have a simple phrase, if we send them, we must mend them. That's kind of an easy vision statement for us. And so, if we've sent them out to defend our country, defend others in need, then we have to take care of them once they come back. That's very simple, really hard to do.

Lisa Nichols  36:54
Yes, yes.

Dr. Kendall Brune  36:54
So, we focus on the vocational rehabilitation of veterans, where they're at and providing those opportunities. And what we've done with Ryan is that he's gone from a board position because really Arise was founded with Ryan Rogers and Jon Hiltz, Army and Marine that were at St. Louis Christian College. And as we started a 45 bed mental health facility, it's like, Guys, this is really a great opportunity for us to replicate what we're trying to do. And so, in 2016 we finally got that all together and created a supportive board. So, I'm Chickasaw, Ryan's Cherokee, Jon Hiltz is Penobscot, and so there was a common entrance of being Native American. And so, we started looking, and there really wasn't an American Indian veteran organization that focused on that area of vocational rehabilitation and healing. So, that's where it started, creating it, and then with Ryan now, it's is getting Arise from a volunteer organization that we, we write grants and we provide support and services to actually an operational organization, and that's where Ryan's focus is now. 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  38:14
We went from, you know, providing support to other organizations that supported veterans, and now we're moving to provide, be the direct provider of those services. And you know, honestly, a lot of it had to do with not necessarily trial and error. That's not really the right word that I'm looking for, but it was just identifying a need. And as soon as we identified the need, like, Hey, wait, we should add this, or we should do this, because this provides this need for these five veterans. I mean, it was literally in that simplest form. We have these five veterans that need this. Let's add this, let's do this. Let's find a way that we could provide this service. I mean, and then it suddenly blossomed into something that was much more bigger than we could sustain, honestly, in the all-volunteer status is what we were doing. So, we had to do something different.

Lisa Nichols  39:08
I love it. Well, I think in, I don't want to put words in your mouth at all, but like in, there are other veteran support organizations out there. But I think that what really sets you guys apart is your holistic view, right? It's not just one aspect. I mean, it's holistically that you guys are, you know, really trying to bring to the to bear there.

Dr. Kendall Brune  39:35
We have a whole health model, and it is really kind of four quadrants of that medicine wheel, and its mind, body, spirit and kinship, it's that relationship. And so, what we've facilitated in it's taking that whole wheel and having Ryan dump all of the veteran experiences that he's had working for different veteran organizations, and then put that into a medicine wheel. And so that has part of his book, part of then is flushing that out, and then getting him to audiences and really, you know, with like, your show, and work with Technology Partners is just getting it out to the corporations. Because with like ADM, the big ag company, with Bayer, you know, with Boeing is, how do we help you through, like, almost employee assistance, provide that support and services for your individuals, so that way they can, they can leave a productive life and can keep contributing, you know. Because today we're not a drafted military. It's not 1819, or like Ryan came to me, and I'm, I'm at the end of my 30s. I've got three kids. I can't just stop, you know? I can't wait. I gotta keep moving.

Lisa Nichols  40:55
Well, I know that you guys had a recent partnership with the National Veterans Business Development Council. You know, how has this helped expand the mission of Arise?

Dr. Ryan Rogers  41:09
Well, so, you know, we're always about empowering. And sometimes for veterans, it's like, you know, hey, help me get a better, you know, working job, or help me become successful in a business? Well, with this partnership, it helps them to either have the designation of the, you know, service-disabled veteran owned small business, which opens up a lot of opportunities for them. But then also to, like, on the so that's an avenue in which we could kind of, you know, maneuver them into. And we're not the subject matter experts when it comes to that. So rather than us trying to take on and wear every single hat at the same time, we find entities and organizations who are not just providing a service, because that's that is like the antithesis of me. It's like, just because you provide a service doesn't mean that I'm going to give you the referral. I want you to provide an exceptional service. A service that these individuals need warrant and are justified in having. 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  42:11
So, with them, it has been a they're going to walk you through it. And I had, I remember, like, when I was doing it for one of the businesses. I was like, I had a very long conversation with one of the, you know, because I'm one who likes to test it out first before I assign my veterans to, you know, go through it. Because I understand I'm looking for things I'm looking for, okay, is this going to be a hurt or hang up for someone's walking through this, or is this going to be a true benefit for them? So, looking at it from that mindset, as I'm going through this process, it was phenomenal. Like I have to say that it was a very, very positive experience with that, and I know that this is going to be a key piece to helping them be successful with it. And we would provide some of the, you know, the business coaching too. I mean, it's just kind of our background.

Lisa Nichols  43:05
I love that, Dr. Rogers, that you actually went through it too. You know, it's kind of, we call it drinking your own champagne. So, you went through it first, right? So that you can truly understand number one is, is this worthwhile for them to invest their time in, and then just understanding what they're going through as they're going through that process. So, I love that you did that.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  43:27
And I don't tell them that's the purpose and why I'm doing it, because then they would treat me very different. So oftentimes I just go in as just like a vet, and I won't even acknowledge who I am, and just like, hey, I'm going through this process. Let me, you know, identify, and see what it would really, truly feel like it had it not been, you know, the position that I hold. What's this going to feel like for another person that's just walking through.

Lisa Nichols  43:53
Dr. B, were you going to say something?

Dr. Kendall Brune  43:56
In our with the tribes, it's called native ways of knowing and learning, and that's kind of like on the job training. And so that's the first things the tribes will ask me is, do you use this Dr. B, and if I say no, then I'm shot. If I can say yes, this is what we use, and I've used it in my facilities, and you can come see it, then they're like, Okay, that sounds great. And so, it's, it's that, like Ryan said he's not going to give anything to his vets that he hadn't done himself. 

Lisa Nichols  44:28
It's, it's more caught than taught, right? I'm thinking to myself, I was just laughing to myself, thinking it's kind of like telling your kids eat your peas, but then they never seen you eat anything green, you know, really, mom? Oh, that's so funny. Well, can I can we just camp out here for a minute? Because I know we've talked about this a little bit, but quite a lot, actually, but that faith is integral to both of your lives. But this holistic approach that you guys are doing with Arise. You know, what have you guys learned about, you know, why do you believe that spirituality, faith, whatever, you know, whatever you subscribe to, is overlooked sometimes in healthcare, holistic health for people. Why do you think that it is? And, you know, how can maybe medical professionals integrate that more into the patient care?

Dr. Kendall Brune  45:31
Well, I, I think that it kind of got labeled as voodoo, you know, it's just magic. It's, it's, it's almost like the mental health diagnosis. You can't see it, so therefore you don't know how to approach it. And so, for us, it's grounding. It's that anchor that we have is, is that there's hope, there's promise for more. And so we believe that in our core, and it doesn't mean it's going to be without error, it's going to be without judgment, it's going to be none of that is true. And in fact, it's quite the opposite. There's going to be challenges and opportunities, but we have to keep being persistent and keep pressing on. And so that that's just and I know Moses didn't want to walk for 40 years.

Lisa Nichols  46:25
It wasn't something that he was like, sign me up for that right, Kendall?

Dr. Kendall Brune  46:30
And I know I could just see, you know, Ryan was like, Caleb, I can take that hill right now. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go, hit it. And it was 40 years later, and he's still going, Okay, I'm ready. I can take it. I'm 80 now, but that's okay. I can take it so, but that's where our faith kind of grounds it. 

Lisa Nichols  46:50
Well, that's, I think that's why it's called faith, right? It's, it is faith because you are trusting in something that you don't see. But then you know, you know the effects of it in your life and I just think. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  47:06
And that's the thing for us, within Indian country. This the spirit world is allowed to be talked about. And so that's why I said on our balance of our wheel, it's mind, body, spirit and kinship. Is that how that relationship is. And so, for us, it just gets an anchoring point and we kind of build on that. And it could be that you're mad at God. I mean, quite frankly, you've been through a lot of moral injury, and you have to say it's all right. You can be mad at God.

Lisa Nichols  47:36
You know, He's not afraid of that. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  47:40
No, you think he hasn't heard that? 

Lisa Nichols  47:43
Right.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  47:44
And that is a very, very, very difficult question that I've faced a lot. And it's a very valid question, especially for individuals who have experienced a lot of trauma, they ask a very fundamental question, if God is an all loving and all-knowing God. Then Where was he when I experienced this? And it's not like an a question that you can answer just right off the cuff that comes a lot through relationship building and then showing the love of the Father through the actions and the things that you do. You can tie it back to like even when, during the creation, it said, you know, God said to Adam, it's not good for man to live alone. It's not good for man, we were created to be communal. We were created to be, you know, together, you know. 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  48:36
And then I go back to morality. Well, where did morality come from? You know, where did the, the sense of right and wrong come from? You know, in for those who are unbelievers, you can even, you know, kind of shift it back and say, let's just look at this from an anthropological standpoint. You cannot find a society throughout history that does not have some type of moral belief system. You will never find it because it doesn't exist. Every single society, culture, tribe has a moral belief system. They have a moral makeup. Where did that come from? Why do all of these you know, tribes that were individual families or people groups that never had interaction have that one thread in common. If they had that one thread in common that tells you that it was placed in you by something that's above you. 

Lisa Nichols  49:35
That's good. That's good. Well, let me ask you this, and then we're going to talk about something extra. Kendall, you've written several books, several books. People can go look up your books. Dr. Rogers, I know you've got your book, you've mentioned it. It's coming out, hopefully June, right? It's called "A New Mission". 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  49:54
Yes.

Dr. Kendall Brune  49:55
And working on another one. I gotta push him for number two.

Lisa Nichols  50:01
He hasn't even finished number one, and you're pushing it. 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  50:04
I'm just waiting for the publishing right now. That's it's all written, it's edited and everything. I'm just going through that process now.

Lisa Nichols  50:11
That's why we're supposed to live in community. We're pushing each other to new heights and get going on that second book there, Dr. Rogers. But it's called "A New Mission: Unpacking The Military Mindset", I love that. "And Building a Stronger Life After Service", and not to give it away, I want people to go get your book. Go get your book. It'll be on Amazon, I'm sure. Can you like building a stronger life after service? Can you give us just a couple little suggestions from the book that you talk about.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  50:46
You know the reality of it is, is that mindset matters. You're not, you're not broken. You've been trained to think, act, no, do, be and react a very specific way. And there is a, there is a different way that can, that you can run parallel with that training, but you just need to add a couple of more tools in the tool chest to be able to do it successfully, to where you don't struggle as much.

Lisa Nichols  51:14
I love that. I love that. Well, gentlemen, this is called something extra, I have to ask you, what do you believe, is this something extra that every leader needs? Obi Wan, you want to go first?

Dr. Kendall Brune  51:32
That you have to not only have faith in God, but faith in yourself and faith in your fellow man and so, you know, our woman. So, it's just that, that, as Ryan just shared, you're not broken. It says you've got to be repurposed and, and that's what we really kind of work on that basis. But I believe in people. You know, I know my daughter, Paige, I'm a people believer, Dad, you are, and that's the critical piece. I will not give up on Ryan and I keep pushing, keep pushing, and keep pushing. In some aspects, it's kind of like a tormentor, you know? It's just that I will, I will keep working with him to get there, because there's, there's such a great message there. And yes, he'll say, I'm a grunt, absolutely you are. And how does a grunt get to his next destination? One step at a time, keep putting that foot in front of the other, and so you constantly have to keep working.

Lisa Nichols  52:33
I love that a people believer. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  52:35
People believer. 

Lisa Nichols  52:36
I've never had anybody say that before. A people believer. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  52:40
That's from Paige.

Lisa Nichols  52:41
But I'm stealing it. Tell Paige that from her. Dr. Rogers, how about you?

Dr. Ryan Rogers  52:48
See, like he stole it, like I was literally going there. And I'm not being like a cliche. I'm being 100% honest. Is like people I believe in people like, you know, God believed in us. I mean, so if God can believe in us, why can't I believe in my fellow man? And you know the reality of it is, is that once you come to the acceptance that okay, for me, my life scripture is I Corinthians, 15:58, Be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work for the Lord. You knew that. You know that everything you do for him is worthwhile. I don't serve my fellow man for the sake of serving fellow man. I serve fellow man because that is what I've been edicted to do. That is my calling, to do it. So, I can't go wrong, even if I even if what I give is not reciprocated. That's okay. I'm building people, and that's truly what matters. At the end of the day, I could build an empire. I could, but okay, empires come and go, but what you do is long lasting, what you build within people, that's what matters.

Lisa Nichols  54:02
Could not agree more. Well, I always say about building organizations, but what are organizations?

Dr. Kendall Brune  54:08
But people. 

Lisa Nichols  54:08
People, right? It's all about people at the end of the day. And I'll just go back to the two greatest scriptures, right? Love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind and soul and love your neighbor as yourself, those are the two greatest scriptures. So, if we do those things, gentlemen, we can lay our head on the pillow at night knowing that we did what we're supposed to do. So, I have absolutely loved this time with the two of you. I thank you so much for making the time. This was so delightful, and I can't wait for our listeners to hear your wisdom and your stories. 

Dr. Kendall Brune  54:49
It's been a blessing to spend an hour with you, Lisa.

Lisa Nichols  54:53
It has.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  54:54
So, can I read something to you kind of that sums up like, who we are? 

Lisa Nichols  55:00
Absolutely, please do. 

Dr. Ryan Rogers  55:01
So, you know, most organizations, they have a mission statement, they have a vision statement, but there's something that we came up with that I believe, sums up who we are, like to the core of who we are. And it goes like this. It says we are a group of veterans, Native Americans, and patriots that feel our veterans deserve more than they have been given. We don't have the all of the answers, and we would always get them right, but we strive to do everything we can to empower veterans and their families to live their best lives in the here and now.

Lisa Nichols  55:36
Love it. That sums it up. Love it. I hope other people will, will put in show notes how to get in touch with you guys. And hope other people will raise their hand and say, I want to be a part of this. So, thank you guys for what you're doing, and I appreciate you both.

Dr. Ryan Rogers  55:55
Appreciate you. Thank you for having us.

Dr. Kendall Brune  55:57
Thank you, Lisa. Have a great day.

Announcer  55:59
Thank you for listening to today's show Something Extra with Lisa Nichols as a Technology Partners Production Copyright Technology Partners Inc. 2019. For show notes or to reach Lisa, visit tpi.co/podcast. Don't forget to leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, or wherever you listen.

*Please note, the preceding transcription has been automatically generated and should be used for informational purposes only.