Frank J. Aloia, Jr., is a senior partner at Aloia Roland, which he co-founded in 2004. The son of a successful Fort Myers attorney, Aloia, chose to make his own way in the legal profession, first as an assistant state attorney, and then later as a business and corporate attorney who quickly gained a reputation as a fierce litigator. This skill, combined with an extensive working knowledge of the real estate industry, led Aloia to increasingly focus his practice on multivariate real estate litigation, commercial real estate law, and corporate transactional law.
Over the past several years, Aloia and his fellow partners have heavily reinvested in their firm to offer the full range of legal services demanded by multifaceted clients. This expansive skill base and resource depth have assisted many of Aloia’s clients to, not only protect their business interests but to achieve consistent and positive momentum.
In this episode:
The Norris Group originates and services loans in California and Florida under California DRE License 01219911, Florida Mortgage Lender License 1577, and NMLS License 1623669. For more information on hard money lending, go www.thenorrisgroup.com and click the Hard Money tab.
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Frank J. Aloia, Jr., is a senior partner at Aloia Roland, which he co-founded in 2004. The son of a successful Fort Myers attorney, Aloia, chose to make his own way in the legal profession, first as an assistant state attorney, and then later as a business and corporate attorney who quickly gained a reputation as a fierce litigator. This skill, combined with an extensive working knowledge of the real estate industry, led Aloia to increasingly focus his practice on multivariate real estate litigation, commercial real estate law, and corporate transactional law.
Over the past several years, Aloia and his fellow partners have heavily reinvested in their firm to offer the full range of legal services demanded by multifaceted clients. This expansive skill base and resource depth have assisted many of Aloia’s clients to, not only protect their business interests but to achieve consistent and positive momentum.
In this episode:
The Norris Group originates and services loans in California and Florida under California DRE License 01219911, Florida Mortgage Lender License 1577, and NMLS License 1623669. For more information on hard money lending, go www.thenorrisgroup.com and click the Hard Money tab.
Video Link
Radio Show
Welcome to The Norris Group real estate podcast, a show committed to bringing you insights from thought leaders shaping the real estate industry. In each episode, we'll dive into conversations with industry experts and local insiders, all aimed at helping you thrive in an ever-changing real estate market. continuing the legacy that Bruce Norris created, sharing valuable knowledge, and empowering you on your real estate journey. Whether you're a seasoned pro or a newcomer, this is your go-to source for insider tips, market trends and success strategies. Here's your host, Craig Evans.
Craig Evans:Hey, everybody, thanks so much for joining us today. We are very excited about our guest today. Not only is he a good friend of mine, but Frank Aloia Jr. is a senior partner at Aloia Roland, which he co-founded in 2004. He's a son of a successful Fort Myers attorney, Frank Aloia, chose to make his own way in the legal profession, first as an assistant state attorney, and then later as a business and corporate attorney who quickly gained a reputation as a fierce litigator. This skill, combined with an extensive working knowledge of the real estate industry, led Aloia to increasingly focus his practice on multivariate real estate litigation, commercial real estate law, and corporate transactional law. In addition to bringing his substantive, commercial and real estate legal acumen to bear on behalf of his clients. Frank also offers perspectives and insights that can only come from being a successful entrepreneur. Frank and his fellow partners have grown their firm rapidly from A two attorney, two staff operation in 2004, to the 12 attorney 40 plus staff firm of today. Over the past several years, Frank and his fellow partners have heavily reinvested in their firm to offer the full range of legal services demanded by multifaceted clients. This expansive skill base and resource depth have assisted many of the firm's clients to not only protect their business interests, but to achieve consistent and positive momentum. Frank was conferred as a Juris Doctor at the Florida State University College of Law, and holds a Bachelor of Science from Florida State University. Frank, my friend, welcome to the show. I cannot thank you enough. I know it's busy time for you. But I appreciate you joining us today. How are you?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Thank you, Craig, I appreciate you having me.
Craig Evans:So listen, before we jump into this, I, you know, part of what we do with investors, and people within the industry that we're dealing with, we'd like to go and really get to know who they are not just about what you do as a business. What's your business acumen is, what you offer, what you do for the industry, but, you know, a lot of times we've got so many investors that are looking at how did this person get into where they are. So, if it's alright, I want to dive into a little bit of just the history of you that all right.
Frank Aloia Jr.:Sure.
Craig Evans:All right, here we go. Oh, alright. So listen, you know, again, full disclosure, you and I have known each other for, what, 17, 18 years now. So I mean, for you and I this is just having good conversation and I look forward to a lot of laughs today. But there's a lot of people that view what we do and just this will be the first time they get to know you. So part of this is you've been in Fort Myers your whole life, right. Born and raised?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Born and raised.
Craig Evans:So...
Frank Aloia Jr.:Correct.
Craig Evans:You know, my mother was it was one of the original Floridians, right? She was born and raised in Florida. So what was it like being that unicorn? When you got so many people moving to Florida and coming and going and then growing up with your dad as as a, you know, solid, grounded attorney here? What was it like being that person grew up in this environment?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, I mean, look, I you know, it's not just, you know, me being born and raised. I mean, as you already know, I'm a third generation born and raised in Fort Myers, my mother and my maternal grandmother were both born and raised in Fort Myers, my family's been here, let's call it 100 years now. And so, you know, it's funny because my experience of Fort Myers is vastly different than somebody that will relocate there now, but, you know, it's funny because, you know, my Great Uncle Frank Pavese who founded the Pavese Law Firm. So, you know, I have a long history of legal professionals in my family, but, you know, he would tell stories, you know, that were Colonial Boulevard is now was obviously the outskirts of town, and he said that you can walk to Miami and not hit a single fence line when he was a young man. So, think about that, think about that think from walking from Colonial Boulevard to Miami and not hitting a single fence line, right? That seems crazy to me, right?
Craig Evans:Right.
Frank Aloia Jr.:You know, when I was growing up, my parents bought a acre and a quarter in a new residential development called Villa Pines on a road out in the middle of nowhere called Daniels Parkway, right? In Daniels Parkway was a two lane paved road that dead ended at the 10 mile canal. And, and so you know what Daniels Parkway is now obviously, it's one of the major arteries of all of Lee County heading right to the International Airport. You know, when I was a boy, we would be stopped at stoplights on 41, you know, right there on adjacent to page field. And as we're stopped at a stoplight and Eastern Airlines, you know, what was a 727 back in those days, would would land at page field, and it would shake the car as it went over the top of 41 for its landing approach, you know? So Fort Myers is a little bit different today, you know, right?
Craig Evans:Well, alright, so, I'm gonna go down a different path with that, because one of the interesting things that I've always thought is interesting about your family is how many industries you guys were tied to here, you know, you know, when you and I first met, I was still tied into a second industry within the beauty industry, you know, and we own salons and spas and skincare products, all the stuff that you helped us work with, and getting set up in Florida. And I thought it was so interesting, because at that time, you know, you and Ty had just I think you were maybe a year into the building that you were that initial building, you're in down there. And to find out the history of that building, can you tell me a little bit about that?
Frank Aloia Jr.:So yeah, the the Earnhardt building where our first, you know, permanent law office was. So I'll give you the full story for the benefit of your listeners. So as you know, we were renting space, diagonally across First Street, in what was an executive center that was owned by our friend and client Dominic Gertz. And at the time, we were renting three offices, one for me, one for Ty and one for the legal assistant. And we were waiting because Dominic had up on the third floor, an architecture firm, whose at the time, he believes lease was going to end. And so we were going to be in these temporary rental offices downstairs. And then in a couple of months, we were going to move up to the third floor, where we'd have a more traditional compartmentalised office, once the architect firm moved out its lease end so, you know, we're, let's call it two months into that, and dominant comes into my office one day and look like somebody had just shot his dog. And I'm like, 'Dominic, what, what's wrong?' And he's like,'Frank, oh, I screwed up, I screwed up'. I'm like, okay, man, what are we talking about? He's like, 'you know, the architects,' I'm like, 'yeah,' he's like, 'they had an option to renew that I totally forgot about, and I just got their option to renew this today.' And in other words, I don't have the third floor office space for you anymore. And he says, 'But I have a plan.' And at the time, you know, him and his business partner, Niels Rector had bought the Earnhardt building across the street. And we're in the process of a basically a full interior, gut job. And the plan was that downstairs would be commercial condominiums and then upstairs would be residential. Then he's like, look, I have a, there's a unit that's not spoken for that I think would be perfect for your law office, we can build it out exactly how you want it. And let's have that discussion. And he says, I will treat you right, because I know that this is on me. And so to his credit, we sat down Ty and I sat down with with Dominic and Niels and we worked through a plan, we worked through numbers. And ultimately, we felt like yeah, this is going to be great, actually, maybe even better than the third floor option. And so we signed a contract and I gotta tell you, so we're probably right about now 20 years ago from when this whole all took place. Because I remember it being right before Easter. Because at the time, my grandmother was still alive. And you know, the my mother's side of the family and I've got she's got five sisters. I have 13 first cousins and you know, we all would get together for the holidays and so so yeah, I mean, every holiday at some level was 40 plus people. And so at Easter, I was telling my grandmother about what we had signed a contract. 'Oh, Grandma, it's so cool. It's got this great mosaic tile flooring. You know, it's beautiful.' And she's like, 'let me ask is that mosaic tile flooring got kind of some red and some green and some yellow in it.' And I'm like,'Yeah.' And she says in 'it kind of a narrower space kind of longer than it is wide.' I'm like, 'Yeah?' And I'm like,'Where is she going with this?' And she looks at me, she says,'Is it all the way on the far end of the Earnhardt building?' And I said, 'Well, if you're looking at the building, what side are you talking about?' She says, the 'right side,' and I'm like, 'Yeah?' And she's like,'Frankie I think you just signed a contract to buy my dad's Barbershop back'. And I'm just like, What? So, as a kid, I had grown up hearing about the Pavese barbershop. So my great grandfather, Michael Pavese, and four of his, three of his brothers founded a barber shop, late 19's right. They emigrated through Italy, came through, you know, Ellis Island, ended up in Tampa, and then one of them ended up scouting Fort Myers. And the rest of them followed. And they, they were barbers. And so but the Pavese barber shop closed in the mid early to mid 1960s, before I was born, so I had heard about it, but didn't know what that word was, right. And so So yeah, it was just kind of one of those divine intervention kind of moments that here I am buying back the space that my great grandfather started the whole family enterprise here in Fort Myers.
Craig Evans:Yeah, that I never forget, you know, because the first time I met you, we were going through some paperwork for one of the other businesses that we were starting at that time. And I never forget to sitting there and realizing, you know, what the building was, and you telling me that story. I thought it was a great story. And just to hear the history of your family, in the beginning foundational principles of what Fort Myers was, that was very, very, very cool to hear that, you know, so Well, listen, let me jump to...
Frank Aloia Jr.:And to this day. I mean, look, obviously, we outgrew that space. So we've turned it back into more of a traditional commercial enterprise. There's an ice cream parlor. That's been there for many years. And, you know, I know, this is a real estate investment, you know, show, you know, Ty and I bought it, you know, for what was would be unimaginable 20 years ago now, you know, it's almost paid off. It's cash flowing nicely. And it's turned into one hell of a good business investment. All by accident.
Craig Evans:So you're listening that was your great great granddad them? Or was your great, great grandfather? Yeah. Okay, so he was...
Frank Aloia Jr.:So, my great, my great uncle, that Frank Pavese who founded the Pavese Law Firm, it was his father's barbershop and his and his case.
Craig Evans:Okay, so they would be, I imagine they will be proud to hear that it's back in the family and how well it's doing for that space, then so? Well...
Frank Aloia Jr.:I certainly hope so.
Craig Evans:Let me let me jump back to your dad's because I do want to focus a lot on you and what we're doing, but you know, I was with you through kind of the passing of your dad and the man that he was, you know, I think I've met him twice. And but obviously, knowing you through him, so you know, your dad was a prominent attorney in this area growing up. How do you see that he influenced your decision to become a lawyer, but then also how you carry yourself through the practice as well?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, you know, it's a difficult question to answer simply because, you know, I think a lot of kids growing up, envision what their future will be right? What they want to be with their life. I never really envisioned anything other than being a lawyer. And I suppose that that's because of my father. But, you know, the, the honest to God, truth is my skill set. You know, how I think how I speak how I write really didn't, doesn't translate to a whole lot of other professions anyway, right. So, you know, I think I was pigeon holed to be a lawyer no matter what, because the gifts God gave me and then of course, my family. I didn't have much of a choice. I don't think.
Craig Evans:So does that mean that you learn to argue well, from a kid?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Pretty much right out of the womb. Yeah.
Craig Evans:So I guess the question is, and honestly, how early did you envision yourself or can you remember, envision yourself like, this is what I want to do. I want to be an attorney.
Frank Aloia Jr.:Very young, very young. I would say before I even got to high school.
Craig Evans:Wow. That's, you know, in today's day, where you see so many people with so many options, especially with social media, and everything that people can see stuff, you know, you just don't see many kids in middle school making decisions that now here you are a few decades later, literally doing exactly what you said you wanted to do in middle school. That's pretty cool. So, you ended up...
Frank Aloia Jr.:And there really wasn't any, you know, variation. I remember in college, you know, I remember when I went to college. And I knew that the minute that I got to Tallahassee in Florida State, that college wasn't the end of my journey, right? I went into college, knowing that there was going to be something next. And so that was kind of the approach I took to college is that I was still auditioning for something else other than a job. And while I was in college, like I always have loved history, and art history and so I can get lost in the museum. My family gets very, very annoyed with me when we go on vacation. They want to keep going, I want to read everything. And so I remember in college, I was taking an art history class that focused primarily on ancient Italy in the Etruscans. And I had an affinity for it already. And then I became very, very close with the professor. And she actually invited me to join her on her summer dig in central Italy, you know, where they had kind of an Arctic active archeological site. And I remember talking to my father about that. And he's like,'yeah, no, I don't think we're going to do that.' 'Why?' he says, because we've had a plan for a long time. And I got news for you. They're probably 1/100 of a percent of the archaeologists that actually, you know, do something productive. And as much as I love the fact that you love ancient stuff, and you love history, because I love history. We're not gonna go off, you know, starting to dig holes in the ground somewhere. So I mean, but look even my extracurricular activities that I enjoyed involves dirt, so.
Craig Evans:Well, if you'd like dirt that much, if you ever want a second career, I can put you on some equipment and you can start being run an excavator dozer for us. I mean, you know, we got a room for you.
Frank Aloia Jr.:I love it. I love it. I you know, I'm actually I'm in cowboy training, too. I've got a cousin that owns some ranch land out in Highlands County, and, and I'm gonna start learning how to be a cowboy on the side too. So...
Craig Evans:Well, so. Alright, so you went to school at FSU up in Tallahassee. I mean you know, I rip you about that. I'm sorry that you couldn't choose a better school. You know, I mean, as a Georgia fan, I gotta give you grief on that. But was there ever any thought, you're in Tallahassee? Was there ever any thought of staying in state capitol and working there?
Frank Aloia Jr.:So I mean, look, I think the answer is yes. But but not really. Okay. I love Tallahassee absolutely love it. And very much see myself as my, you know, life as a parenting of young children is coming to an end, you know, buying a condo or some property up there because I continue to have very, very, very good friends there and obviously I'm a season ticket holder. I love Florida State football and sports and the university itself. And I look I have a lot of lawyer friends and former fraternity brothers that are very active in the legislature and in lobbying. And so I actually do see some business opportunities there as well. So I could very much see myself becoming a lot more immersed in Tallahassee again, but look at the end of the day my heartstrings and my family roots in Fort Myers is what pulled me back. You know, if I was gonna grow something, if I was gonna do something if I was gonna make something I wanted to make it in Fort Myers.
Craig Evans:Well, so when you came out of school, how quick did you actually start working in your in law? Did you start in the proverbial mailroom, work your way up? How did that journey start for you after you came out of school?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, so I mean, look, I always, you know, I knew I wanted to be a lawyer, but I wasn't exactly sure you know, what kind of lawyer I wanted to be, right. And so this is a, let's call this it's 1995. I'm in finishing my second semester of my second year of law school, and so I've got one more year law school to go. And Florida State had an externship program at State Attorney's offices and Public Defender's offices, where you basically instead of being in class for a semester, you worked for a State Attorney's Office, or a public defender's office. And, and so I actually signed up to do that the fall of my third year of law school. And I signed up and asked to be working at the State Attorney's Office in Fort Myers. Well, the State Attorney's Office in Fort Myers had never had a Certified Legal intern and with the program, you take a class that second semester of your second year law school before you go into your third year where you would be the, you know, on this, externship, and you become what's known as a Certified Legal intern. It's almost like a, an AAA degree for a lawyer that you actually get Supreme Court certified. And you're actually allowed to practice law if you have a licensed lawyer with you. So you can go to court, you can do things, but you have to have a mentor, if you will. And so, I got my CLI. And, um, but like I said, Fort Myers never had had a CLI before they did, they had no idea what to do with me. No idea. And at the time, you know, and look, as you know, I've got a ridiculously large family here in Fort Myers. And at the time, the state attorney was my cousin Joe Velos. Andrew, who was also law school buddies with my father, and actually takes partial credit for introducing my parents. And so I mean, when I said I wanted to do this, they were like, of course, no problem. But again, they'd never had one before. So they didn't know what to do with me. They basically made me a prosecutor, they made me a lawyer, because they didn't know how to like, do baby steps at that time. And then it was, you know, back in those days, the guys that made up the, there were six county court judges right at the time. And every county court judge is assigned an assistant state attorney and an assistant public defender, and they have a docket to deal with their criminal cases, right. And so all of that, you know, it may still be the case now, but you know, the misdemeanor division is where the the lawyers fresh out of law school start, right, you're kind of cutting your teeth on, you know, less important things really, right. Not that they're unimportant, they're just less important than the felony division, for example. And so, um, you're talking about guys that are out of law school, and it was, to be honest, it was kind of like a little fraternity house and a couple of the guys, I had known that were also, you know, second generation or third generation lawyers that had come back home after school. And so it was very easy for me to kind of immerse myself in that group. And I'm like, 'Hey, I would like to do this, this, this and this,' they were like, you know, they got files all over the place. They're like, 'whatever you want to do, you just let us know.' And so, and this is this is no, I'm not exaggerating, in the least as a third year law student. I tried 13 jury trials, and over 50 non jury trials. I mean, we have our weekly conference calls or professor that ran the program in Tallahassee was Professor Larry Krieger, right. And there was a conference call number because we had to report in every week and we would discuss with the group on this conference call what we were doing, and you know, and look, like I said, no one ever wanted to go to Fort Myers. They always wanted to either go to Jacksonville, Orlando, Fort Lauderdale, Miami, Tampa, St. Pete, whatever, right? Fort Myers was the little outpost that no one had ever asked to go before. And those places, they knew what to do with CLS, right? They would give them that like, you know, they're like, Oh, I got to argue a motion to suppress this week. And you know, Oh, that's awesome. You know, I was in court watching bla bla bla bla bla and I'm like, hey, look, can I go because I've got a non jury trial docket and I've got 12 non jury trial starting and a half an hour. I've even looked at the files yet. Can I go please? I was lying. They all thought I was like that they finally, I finally by the end of the semester was like, 'No, I really did.' And so to be honest, that experience probably changed my, the trajectory of my legal career, right, because I, I got the litigation bug, right. My father had already finished doing any type of litigation work, and was really an office practice of real estate transactional law in some probate work. By the time I was really cognizant of things, right. And so he didn't do any litigation didn't really go to court very often. And it wasn't something that I was immersed in, where I had a dad who was preparing for trial, and all of the stresses that go with that. And so that was something that I kind of, I think, changed the trajectory of at least how I started my legal career, you know, and I made some wonderful, wonderful friends. My, the supervisor of the misdemeanor Division at the time was Amira. Well, it was swept back in those days, it's Amira Fox. Now she is the state attorney now, but she was to meet her supervisor. And so at the end of my semester, if you will, I mean, they really, really liked me, and they offered me a job. And so I had to go back to Tallahassee for one more semester of law school. And as you can well imagine, I mean, look, I've been in school my entire life, I just done a semester of being a lawyer. And then I had to go back to class work and book work for a semester. It was It was awful, awful, it was just mind numbing, and taxing. It was the longest three months of my life. But so I graduated, obviously, which was wonderful. And I get back to Fort Myers. And I hadn't seen, you know, that crew in, you know, three, four months at the time. And I pop in to say hello. And the way they kind of worked it back in those days, it was kind of like the one in one out rule. Like they had a number of prosecutors. And if somebody left the office, well, then they would hire a new person. And then everyone would kind of move up the chain, start out misdemeanor and work your way to juvenile and then on the felony, right. And so I pop in on the day, I pop in, I'm the number three person in the office guy by the name of Marshall Bauer says, 'Hey, Frank, how you doing? Blah, blah, blah. He says, Hey, you start Monday.' I'm like, 'What do you mean, I just got here like yesterday'. He's like, 'Yeah, you start Monday. Yvette put her notice in today. And we have an opening.' I said, 'Well, gosh, I was kind of thinking maybe I would start after the bar exam.' He's like,'Yeah, but I don't know when our next opening is going to be. So you start Monday.' Yeah, so that's literally how that happened. And look, they were very fair to me. I basically would work in the morning. They let me kind of close my door in the afternoon, I'd study for the bar. And then two weeks before the bar exam started, I basically got paid to go study for the bar and take the bar. Hey, you don't want to fail the bar, you know, who failed the bar the first time, you know, you didn't want to be that person. So yeah, there was an immense amount of pressure and peer pressure at the time to in all of my peers. Were studying for the bar in a vacuum. I was being harassed on a daily basis. knock on my door, hey, don't fail the statement. Don't fail this thing. You don't want to be that guy.
Craig Evans:...to carry your workload.
Frank Aloia Jr.:Right, exactly. But look, it it was crazy. It was frenetic. It wasn't what I was anticipating. But it all worked out. I don't think I would have changed a thing. So I worked at the State Attorney's Office for two and a half years, you know, matriculated my way up the ladder, it was in the felony division. And I think I disappointed my cousin Joe when I when I told him I was leaving to join private practice. So I had a buddy of mine from the State Attorney's Office and he had been hired by this law firm. I don't know, six, eight months before me, you know, he was older. And they were looking for a commercial litigation attorney. And he immediately recommended me most of the partners in that law firm had been kind of Old Fort Myers people they knew my father. And so I don't think it was a hard sell. I interviewed and so then the Smoot Adams Edwards in green law firm hired me as a commercial litigation associate. And that's kind of how I started my my path and private civil practice.
Craig Evans:That's what I was gonna ask is how did you get from, you know, what you were doing in prosecution to civil and the things that you do now. So, which really, that kind of takes me to where and listen, I, Frank, I mean, I think you and your family have such an interesting history here. Aside from you being a friend of mine, and we just I enjoy hanging out with you and get to talk and laugh. I love the history that your family has in this area. But and so that's part of what I wanted to hear our guests to hear so, but really, I do want to also dive in because there's a lot of people are listening and saying, Hey, Craig, great, it's great to hear about Frank, let's let's hear about what he does. And you know how that helps the real estate industry, right. So, So walk me through. And obviously, I know most of the guys down at your firm. I mean, I mean, there are a lot of teams in there a lot, but won't lead through and walk our guests through really what does your firm do? And then what are the particular specialties that you really focus in?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Sure, sure. So, look, we're a little bit of a unique business model, right? Most of the law firms that, but then Fort Myers are characterized as full service law firms. They do insurance defense work as a major part of their practice. They basically they defend insurance companies. We never did that. We actually took the opposite approach. We do all of the business work, all of the commercial litigation work, and I'll get into that in more detail. But we represent plaintiffs. And so in injury cases, you know, the traditional kind of silk stocking law firms, if you will, they represent the insurance companies, we don't do that we represent the people. And so my partner Ty Roland, and my other partner, Evan Lubell, they have built a very, very successful and very well regarded personal injury and wrongful death department. Andlook, we took the tax very beginning, we didn't want to be on the insurance company done. We wanted to represent the people of Southwest Florida. And so we don't represent insurance companies, we sue them. That's basically how that works, right. But look at that, again, that's a little bit that's one of the things that makes us unique and different. Because beyond that personal injury department, we probably look a lot like of those sell those silk stocking law firms, right, we do all manner of real estate, and corporate transactional work. We do all manner of commercial real estate construction, litigation, work, business disputes. You know, we have a family law department that does obviously divorces, paternity matters, child custody matters, all sorts of adoptions. You know, one of our partners is a currently a state senator. So we do some, you know, kind of lobbying level work. And then we do we do estate planning work. And that's the department actually this year that I intend on growing and further developing. Is that estate planning department?
Craig Evans:I was going to ask you, what, what do you see as the next biggest growth arm of your of your firm? And where do you see that you and the partners will be putting that focus?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Yeah, I mean, look, I think I think we need to further develop our Estate Planning Department, I mean, we do some of the work there, I think I'd like to be able to have the, the resources to do I would call more complicated, you know, tax based estate planning strategies. Currently, we don't have that capability just because we don't have, you know, somebody that I would view as you know, with an LLM and tax that really knows the tax code and can advise High Net Worth people, you know, how to best plan for avoidance of tax consequences in their estate planning. You know, we can form wills and trusts and do what I would call the basic level stuff, and we do it a lot. But I want to be able to have the resources to provide that next level of estate planning.
Craig Evans:Well, and that's, you know, Frank, that's one of the things that I appreciate about you and your partners is that you're not gonna blow smoke up somebody's skirt. You know, you're not going to tell somebody that you do things that you don't you know, there's been many times that we've needed things internally, and you may not have that but you find me and you act as a general counsel for me and you find me the counsel that we need for that and I'm Always grateful that you're as a firm, you're not trying to, you know, just throw things to the caution to the wind and say, Sure, we can do that just because you have the license, you know, and I appreciate that you focus on the specialties of that, you know?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, I'm saying that, you know, look, I've never, we really, really do try to build relationships with clients, right? I mean, there are law firms that you provide a service and they're on to the next person, we, we've really tried to grow our law firm, by having long term relationships, and long term relationships are based on trust and honesty and mutual respect. And, you know, it would be dishonest to suggest to someone that we do X, Y, and Z if we don't do X, Y, and Z. And I would, I would never do that.
Craig Evans:Well, and I think what you just said, what has always been important to me is the good, bad and ugly of it, you know, we're running 100 miles an hour, you're going 100 miles an hour. But knowing that your counsel, even if they don't know the answer, or don't have the resources for that, for what is needed, knowing that you have always found that and pulled that to the table for me is what's been a comforting process of that. And that you've just always been honest, right? There's so many people that will want to deceive and appear larger than what they are, are more than what they are. And I just always appreciate that about you guys. So let me ask you, you know, you guys went through some rebranding on the last, what, three years, four years, something like that. It may be longer than that now, when you switch everything over to law defined? And I'm sure you'll probably correct me, because I'm probably way off on my timetable. But I was always curious about how and this one is, we haven't talked about that. How did you guys go to kind of the branding of Law Defined, lawdefined.com. Everything that's Law Defined, compared to Aloia, Roland, Lubell & Morgan?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, I mean, look, first and foremost, you know, when you grow up, when you grow a law firm, right, your the chef in the kitchen, you're making omelets, you're breaking eggs, or making mistakes, you know, because I mean, you know, we because, as you obviously focus on not making mistakes for your clients, and so then sometimes you make mistakes on the business side of the law, right. And we were very cognizant of some of the mistakes that other law firms have made, as they have grown and, you know, unfortunately, have just kind of petered out. And so, but you're also always wanting to try and distinguish yourself in the marketplace, right? And the law define thing, look, I have to give credit to some fairly savvy marketing people like we wanted. And it just kind of grew out of what I was talking about earlier. There aren't many law firms that do what we do that are plaintiffs law firms, but also business law firms, right, that's usually insurance, defense and business. We, and so we were already unique, and we wanted our marketing to reflect the dualistic nature of our unique law firm, right? We wanted something that would capture people's imaginations and make us memorable. But we didn't want to lose that the dignity with which we practice the law. Because, look, we've you know, plaintiff's lawyers are typically characterized as ambulance chasers. And there's all sorts of kitschy and cheesy marketing out there that those types of lawyers do that we never wanted to be associated with. A that's not how we practice. Well, I mean, look, you know, I will never criticize somebody for attempting to make a living, right, that. But the point being, that that's not who we were as lawyers, and that's not how we wanted to present ourselves to the public. And so that's kind of how the whole law defined thing came to be.
Craig Evans:So, as the firm has grown, as you have grown in kind of your section of the firm, as well. Talk to me a little bit about you know, from an estate planning, entity creation, asset protection, because I know those are a lot of the things that a lot of our listeners are really going to want to dive into. And part of it is I like, Frank, you're working with me on the creation of an interesting nail for another venture. So you know, I know it's great having you because I just call and you guys take it and roll you know if I can never figure out the name correct. So yeah. So I think that's one of the things that you know, especially is one of the pieces of our, of our company that I mean, we rely so heavily on for you. I would love for artists listeners to hear, you know, kind of what you bring to the table. And and what does that look like, you know, whether it's estate planning entity creation, asset protection? You know, what does that look like for your firm?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, I mean, so look at what I would say, to your listeners. And what you and I have talked about on some of your personal matters is, when you form a corporate entity for a business venture, right? You're you're thinking about two things. One, you're thinking about, Liability protection, right? The Shield, if you will. And so that's one of the reasons why people form a corporate entity, they want to shield their personal assets from liability that may accrue as a result of the business venture, right. But the second component that we always like to talk about with clients is the estate planning component, or the succession component, right? How do you want your corporate ownership to be structured, so that if God forbid, something happens to you unexpectedly, the people that you want to end up with whatever the assets of this business are, do end up with it, in the least, obstructive way, right? And look, you know, 99% of all corporate entities are closely held family corporate entities. And I mean, look, it's especially true in my practice, it's Craig Evans forming, you know, ABC LLC, because he's got a real estate venture that he's going to do. And so we want to A protect Craig, from the liability of third party vendors and contractors and people on the property doing whatever it is they're doing, usually building some type of a structure, right? And then but at the same time, if God forbid, something happens to Craig, that Craig's designated heirs end up with the fruits of the labor that Craig had put into that venture in a way that doesn't cost them an arm and a leg.
Joey Romero:Hey, that's gonna do it for this week's episode. Please be sure to catch part two of our interview with Frank Aloia Jr. Next week. See you then. Now for Upcoming Events, Elevated tax strategies, wealth building tactics and market forecast June 8, at the Riverside Convention Center, early bird pricing is 99 for individuals, and 149 for individual plus a guest for tickets and more information, go to the Norris group.com/liveeventsandseminars.
Narrator:For more information on hard money loans, trust deed investing, and upcoming events with The Norris group. Check out thenorrisgroup.com. For more information on passive investing through the DBL Capital Real Estate Investment Fund, please visit dblapital.com.
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