Frank J. Aloia, Jr., is a senior partner at Aloia Roland, which he co-founded in 2004. The son of a successful Fort Myers attorney, Aloia, chose to make his own way in the legal profession, first as an assistant state attorney, and then later as a business and corporate attorney who quickly gained a reputation as a fierce litigator. This skill, combined with an extensive working knowledge of the real estate industry, led Aloia to increasingly focus his practice on multivariate real estate litigation, commercial real estate law, and corporate transactional law.
Over the past several years, Aloia and his fellow partners have heavily reinvested in their firm to offer the full range of legal services demanded by multifaceted clients. This expansive skill base and resource depth have assisted many of Aloia’s clients to, not only protect their business interests but to achieve consistent and positive momentum.
In this episode:
The Norris Group originates and services loans in California and Florida under California DRE License 01219911, Florida Mortgage Lender License 1577, and NMLS License 1623669. For more information on hard money lending, go www.thenorrisgroup.com and click the Hard Money tab.
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Frank J. Aloia, Jr., is a senior partner at Aloia Roland, which he co-founded in 2004. The son of a successful Fort Myers attorney, Aloia, chose to make his own way in the legal profession, first as an assistant state attorney, and then later as a business and corporate attorney who quickly gained a reputation as a fierce litigator. This skill, combined with an extensive working knowledge of the real estate industry, led Aloia to increasingly focus his practice on multivariate real estate litigation, commercial real estate law, and corporate transactional law.
Over the past several years, Aloia and his fellow partners have heavily reinvested in their firm to offer the full range of legal services demanded by multifaceted clients. This expansive skill base and resource depth have assisted many of Aloia’s clients to, not only protect their business interests but to achieve consistent and positive momentum.
In this episode:
The Norris Group originates and services loans in California and Florida under California DRE License 01219911, Florida Mortgage Lender License 1577, and NMLS License 1623669. For more information on hard money lending, go www.thenorrisgroup.com and click the Hard Money tab.
Video Link
Radio Show
Welcome to The Norris Group real estate podcast, a show committed to bringing you insights from thought leaders shaping the real estate industry. In each episode, we'll dive into conversations with industry experts and local insiders, all aimed at helping you thrive in an ever-changing real estate market. continuing the legacy that Bruce Norris created, sharing valuable knowledge, and empowering you on your real estate journey. Whether you're a seasoned pro or a newcomer, this is your go-to source for insider tips, market trends and success strategies. Here's your host, Craig Evans.
Craig Evans:You know, we've got our educational event, ELEVATE coming up in June out in California. And I know, you know, it was out there last year for that when Bruce was hosting the last one that he had hosted. And, you know, I had several conversations with people about structure business and how I was growing my businesses and how I formed things. And if you were guiding them, at what point should the real estate investment world be thinking about and planning on asset preservation?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, I mean, look, I think asset preservation is something that should be thought about, at the very beginning of asset accumulation, right? Because asset preservation is easier to accomplish, as you accumulate rather than looking backward, after you've accumulated a bunch of things. And now it all needs to be retitled and a plan needs to be put in place. So look, does it absolutely unequivocally have to be thought about at the beginning? No. But if someone were to say, look, this is where I'm going, this is what I plan on doing. I'm going to buy this particular piece of property, I'm going to build a rental property, I'm gonna put a tenant in there, I'm gonna let the market appreciate. I'm going to have it cashflow. And I'm going to keep doing it over and over again, I would tell that person well, okay. Let's talk about your current assets. We know where you're going, what do you have now? And where do you see yourself in a couple of years as you exercise this plan of yours. And I would tell them that you know it at a certain level, you know that the time is probably now to at least put in some type of asset preservation structure. And look, it may come to the point where if they're extraordinarily successful, that the current plan becomes antiquated, would need to be changed into something a little bit more complicated. But you know, you start small, but you at least have a plan in place. Because then look, I always tell people, no one likes to think about their own demise, right? No one likes to think about it, talk about it. Generally, as a topic, it sucks, okay. But what I tell people is, is think about it like a partnership agreement, right? You have a partnership agreement, you put that document in a drawer, right. And then you go about exercising, whatever the partnership is about, you're working in the day to day, you don't think about it, the documents there, you know what your rights duties and obligations are. And if you have to pull it out of the drawer and read it every once in a while you can, but you really on a day to day basis, you don't obsess and stew over. A will or a trust or some type of estate planning vehicle is the same thing you have it, you know, it's there, you know, there's a base level of protection, but you're not going to look at it every day, you put it in your safe, you know, you tell your kids where it's located, or your spouse, and you leave it alone. And then you go about your life. But at least if God forbid something unexpected happens to you, there's at least a plan in place. So what that plan is depends on where they reside, what their net worth is, what they've accumulated, what they're planning on doing. So it's a very, very individualized discussion.
Craig Evans:Young or old, right, whether it's beginning investor or seasoned investor, what do you see as some of the biggest mistakes that they make when it comes to asset preservation?
Frank Aloia Jr.:It I guess it's difficult to characterize them as mistakes, right. But, look, I mean, when we do probate work for someone that has recently deceased, right, and they have all these things that now have to go through a court proceeding for the succession to go to errors and things I mean, it costs a lot of time and it costs money, right. Whereas if you know they had taken the time to put those assets into a revocable trust, for example, their successor trustee would already be in control of the asset, handling the asset there would have been no court intervention really to speak of. And it would have been a much more seamless transition. So, you know, I think for the vast majority of the people that are probably going to listen to this podcast, a revocable trust with a pour over will, would do a lot of positive things, right? Because it would provide for that seamless transition to the to the next, you know, to the heirs of the particular assets without having to get too involved with a court. And it provides immediate access to those assets and to the bank accounts. But look, what the biggest you okay, we want to talk about mistakes. The biggest mistake I see are when people form a trust, but then they never actually put any of their assets in it. You have to actually transfer assets to the trust. I'm like, oh, yeah, to trust. That's wonderful. So what do you own? We own this, and we do this, this and this. I said, Okay, well, when was it transferred into the trust, blank stare, you have a trust, and haven't put the stuff into the trust? So that's the biggest mistake, I guess, if you want to call it when there's a mistake, that's the one, if you're going to spend the money to go ahead and execute the estate plan, finish the execution.
Craig Evans:If you take care of it and just stay a little bit diligent. It doesn't, it doesn't have to cost the world. But man, it saves you a ton of time and a son ton of money in the event that something goes wrong?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, I look, I can tell you what myself and my wife have, right. So you know, we have a revocable trust, with a Pour-Over Will. And let me explain to your listeners, what a Pour-Over Will is right? Invariably, people will forget about something in there that's not titled in their trust. And a Pour-Over Will, the beneficiary of the will is the trust. And so if you own anything that isn't already in the trust, the will just like it sounds, pours it into the trust, you still have to probate that asset. But it's a fairly simple probate because all you're doing is conveying it over to the trust, and then you administer the trust, right? So Pour-Over Will is kind of the catch all, you obviously want to avoid having to use the Pour-Over Will, but it's there in case you make a mistake, right. So I have a revocable trust with a Pour-Over
Craig Evans:Right. Will. I also own way I have a limited liability company, of which the sole member is my trust. And so anything that's owned by the limited liability company ends up in the trust, because the trust owns the membership interests in the limited liability company. So I get the corporate shield of a corporate entity, but I also get the estate planning vehicle of those assets technically being owned by my trust, because the trust owns the LLC. That's what I have. And it's not a complicated structure, it probably would fit, like I said, the vast vast majority of the people that are going to listen to this podcast. And, you know, but look, if you get to a certain net worth or a certain level of accumulation, a more complex tax component strategy where you're possibly going to exceed the federal exemption on the value of your estate, um, then you get into a different level of things, you know, generation skipping trusts and things like that. But, you know, A. I don't, that's not necessarily what I would need at this point in my life. And my suspicion is that very, very few of the people that will listen to the podcast would be you know, kind of in that realm. So, for for either the new investors coming into this world that are listening and wanting to learn or seasoned investors that may be coming from a different state that had been advised differently, from an investor standpoint, do you prefer and if so, why? An LLC, or a corporation?
Frank Aloia Jr.:So, so look, I will tell you, I have always preferred LLCs over corporations, primarily not from an estate planning standpoint, but from a liability shield standpoint, okay. And let me explain to you why. And let me explain to you some of the nuances that have developed in the law over the last decade that people need to be aware of. So if you end up where someone gets a judgment against you, right, and they're now looking to collect their judgment, if you have stock in a corporation, that stock is attachable or seizeable. In other words, you owe me $100,000. And you own stock in ABC Inc, right? And that stock could be worth something I have no other means to collect from you. I can petition the court to seize your stock as a means of either paying or partially paying the judgment debt that you owe to me, right? Limited Liability, company membership interests are differen, okay. corporate stock seizeable, membership interest in a limited liability company, not necessarily seizeable, okay. And I'll explain what I mean by not necessarily in a moment. Um, the way it traditionally worked is if, again, I've got a judgment against you, okay, for 100,000. You own membership interests in ABC LLC. I can't seize your membership interest, they're not seizeable that's what makes Limited Liability Companies unique. What I can do is I can serve on the LLC, a charging lien as to any distributions that the LLC would make to you who owe me the judgment deb, right. But as I mentioned earlier, 99% of all LLCs are closely held family companies. The workaround on that charging lien is you just never make a distribution to yourself. You pay all of your bills through the LLC, so there's never any money distributed. So it renders the charging lien completely worthless., okay. Now, let me explain to you some of the nuances that have happened in I guess we're going on 10 years now, Craig, every time I tell the story, I've added a couple more years to it, right. But about about 10 years ago, the 11th circuit court of appeal based out of Atlanta, which covers the state of Florida, federal appeals court was examining a bankruptcy case out of the Northern District of Florida, which I want to say it was based out of Jacksonville. And ultimately, to summarize, the appellate court took the position that membership interests in single member LLCs for judgment collection purposes aren't going to be treated like stock in a corporation. In other words, it's seizeable, okay. And so if you own a single member LLC, in other words, you own ABC LLC, as Craig Evans an individual 100%, and I get a judgment debt, you owe me a judgment debt of 100,000. I can go to the court and petition to seize or attach your membership interest in that LLC, because you're the only member, okay. And so that's what that appellate court ruling ultimately determined, we're going to treat single member LLCs. And the membership interest in those single member LLC is just like stock in a corporation for judgment collection purposes, all right. Look, it's an easy fix, because you just make it a multi member LLC, right.
Craig Evans:Sure.
Frank Aloia Jr.:I mean, look, and again, I don't want to scare people because it has to do with you know, you have to balance what your level of risk is based upon what you're actually doing through that corporate entity. As I mentioned earlier, currently, my limited liability company is owned solely by my revocable trust, because what I'm doing through that corporate entity is all passive income things. There's no real liability exposure, right? But if I'm actively renting properties, and I've got tenants and God only knows who the tenants are inviting and even though I have insurance, what if somebody you know, is horrifically maimed or injured or killed? I want to shield my personal assets, including membership interest in the LLC that owns the real estate. A multi member LLC is the way to go.
Craig Evans:So for those listening, I guess Um, I mean, you know, we see there's a million things online where you can go and you can create your own LLC, it's pretty easy if you know how you can go and create them, right from state websites, that type of stuff. But you know, what role does a lawyer role in play in that? I mean, you know, I know what role you play for me. But for those listening, you know, what role can you play? And how do you make that easy? And how do you handle that? If somebody new is coming to you? How do you walk them through the determination? Is it single member? Or is it not? The whole process? What does that look like for you
Frank Aloia Jr.:So I mean, look, I'm the person in the guys? office that that oversees the department that does those things, right? We, every week, we're meeting with people that want to discuss the right corporate entity for whatever business venture they're doing, how to set that up, we have the discussion about liability protection, we have the discussion about succession. And whether that's a relevant conversation, we at least have the conversation if they don't want to really address it right now, we at least kind of lay it out for them. So they know what the path forward would be if they want to then form a trust or something along those lines. And we kind of talked through it very similarly to what we've just done here on this podcast. You know, I, you know, I'm giving you kind of the broad brush, you know, scenario, but it's a much more individualized conversation, because I have to know, the people that I'm representing and what they're planning on doing, what their goals are, because there are nuances that need to be taken into consideration.
Craig Evans:So, I know for I think every entity that I own, I think you if I'm not mistaken, you are my Registered Agent, get asked that a lot. Tell people the Registered Agent, what is it? Who is it? What does it serve that process?
Frank Aloia Jr.:So in Florida, every corporate entity, whether it's a corporation, an LLC, you needs to have what's known as a Registered Agent. And a Registered Agent is a Florida based, non P.O address and person that can accept Service of Process or other important documents for the company or the corporate entity, okay. So for example, if Craig Evans owns ABC LLC, and Frank Aloia is the registered agent, and ABC LLC gets sued for you know, an unpaid utility bill, for example, right? They can serve me the registered agent with that lawsuit. And look, a lot of my clients prefer that because they're like, 'Hey, Frank, if I'm going to get sued for something, it might as well go to your office first anyway, because if it comes to me, I'm sending it to you anyway.' So it just eliminates a step. Um, you know, and then the other thing is, is that a lot of people like that, because it helps them avoid having their personal address out there in the public domain as well.
Craig Evans:But so to confirm, because I can't tell you how many people have thought that you and I are business partners, because at one point of time somebody has looked me up or things like that, and say, Oh, we see that your attorney is an owner of your business. Just to confirm a Registered Agent is not an owner, right?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Look, I mean, Registered Agent can be an owner, right? But...
Craig Evans:Correct.
Frank Aloia Jr.:For 98%. of the LLC, for which I'm the Registered Agent, I have no ownership interest in whatsoever. I'm literally the lawyer. And in some instances, I'm just the lawyer that formed it, you know, I have instances where I form an entity for someone that I didn't have a prior, you know, business relationship with, they need a lawyer to form the corporate entity, I set it all up, like give them the thing. And then they're, you know, in the wind, and I don't necessarily hear from them for years, if ever again, but they keep renewing their their LLC on their own. And I'm still the registered agent. And every once in a while, I'll get a, you know, a certified letter, or I get served with a lawsuit. And I'm like, Hey, I know, I haven't spoken to you in three years. But this was served on me as your registered agent, you may want to update your Registered Agent, if we're not really actively working together anymore. You know, all of those renewal notices come to me as well because you've got to pay a renewal fee and do certain things with for the state of Florida, the Division of Corporations every year. And so as the Registered Agent, I get those notices of renewal, and I handle all of the renewals for hundreds of clients. They're like, we'll pay you your annual fee. Well, you handle the renewal. Frank, you put it on cruise control. I didn't want to think about it.
Craig Evans:Do you do that for any other LLCs that are outside of Florida.
Frank Aloia Jr.:So the answer is yes. I mean, look, I have Florida base clients that own Delaware entities, for example that have to, you know, be renewed as a foreign entity doing business in the state of Florida and registered in the state of Florida. So I have to handle their renewals in Delaware, as well as their foreign entity status in Florida. And then, of course, I have, as you mentioned, I have clients all over the country, that own Florida based entities that I handle the renewals for them. And...
Craig Evans:uh, one of the questions that you'd have talked about that you get asked a lot, you know, especially with people that are coming in from California and other other states to our boot camps that we do throughout the year, is, you know, the difference between purchasing a home in an LLC or purchasing using the trust, kind of walk them through that if it's just in a trust, not an LLC, just an LLC, not in a trust? I don't know, that's going back to some asset preservation and that whole process, but is there anything that that our listeners should be aware of in one versus the other?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, okay...
Craig Evans:Or is that even a question?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Let's start with the scenario of they're buying, let's say residential property through their trust there existing say California trust, you said California, let's say they have a revocable trust in California, and they're buying this Florida residential property through their California revocable trust, right, the first question, and they said, What do you think of that? I would say, Well, the first question I would have for them is, well, what do you intend on doing with that Florida property? And if their answer is, oh, it's just a second home, it's just going to be us and our family. And you know, because we're considering maybe spending part of the year in Florida or maybe we're going to try Florida out and maybe leave California, if they're going to use it themselves. Or they're just their family and friends. And it's not an income producing property, leaving it in their trust is probably just fine. Because the liability possibilities are so small under that scenario, right? But if they were to say, Hey, Frank, well, no, our plan is we're going to find a tenant, we're going to rent it out, we're going to have it as an income stream, I would tell them that I don't love them owning an income producing property with third party tenants in their trust, I would probably advocate for them to form a limited liability company, for example, and that the limited liability company can be owned by their trust. That's still in their trust. But now there's that corporate shield that protects their other trust assets. If you know, something cataclysmic were to occur.
Craig Evans:You talked about irrevocable trust several times.
Frank Aloia Jr.:Yeah. I mean, look, you know, when when someone says, Well, look, I want to create something that can't be undone. We'll give you the most typical example, right? Husband and wife, second marriage, they're older. Their first spouses. They're either divorced or deceased, they have children and grandchildren of their own. They get, you know, married to each other. And they want to make sure that what they had accumulated prior to that marriage ends up with their heirs rather than their new spouses, heir, right. And so there are you know, that's that's probably the most typical scenario where an irrevocable trust comes into play
Craig Evans:in talking about what you do. One of the things that we haven't even mentioned today, you got Atlas title, we've talked about it several times Atlas title is not always the biggest moneymaker, right? title companies are not just cash cows, like everybody necessarily thinks they are. You know, obviously, depending on the size of deals, it's going through them things like that, but in a traditional sense of a title company, unless its sole focus is just a hammer deal after deal after deal after deal day after day. Why did it make sense for you from a business strategy to integrate a title company into what you guys do?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, I'll be, I'll tell you, it's it was more family based. So I will, so as you know, I never joined my father's law firm, right? I already chosen my own path and
Craig Evans:Right.
Frank Aloia Jr.:Those are attorney states, they don't know so later in his career as Ty and I are now building you know, I'd left the national firm that I was with kind, I formed a lawyer enrolling as it was known back in those days. And I'm like, I don't need a title company, as a licensed attorney, I can be a title companies, they don't like title companies don't trust licensed title agent without having a title company. But the title company was a way that I can do a business venture with title companies are not familiar with them, they want to close to my father, without us being involved in each other's law firms. And it was a nice, it was a nice way to have business venture with your father, and still have your own kind of an attorney, which is fine, we can accommodate that. And then legal things, if you will. That was really the rationale of how Atlas title came to be. Now, I will tell you that there are certain states in this country where people will not close to a title company, New York, New Jersey. there are states that are it's just the opposite. attorneys don't do those things. It's all done through a title company. And so we obviously can offer whatever people's you know, personal preference is one way or the other. It doesn't cost any more or any less, you know, what people don't understand is, is there's no, there's no real give in Florida title insurance. The title insurance rates are established by the Department of Insurance for the state of Florida. No one is legally allowed to charge any more or any less than what that promulgated rate is mean, that's it, they're just, you know, there's a little bit of variation in you know, people's closing fees, perhaps whether they upcharge, certain title policy endorsements that there isn't a set thing on, you know, we basically do the minimum stuff, but the actual main title insurance rate established by the state of Florida by law, and no one can charge any more any less.
Craig Evans:The reason I wanted to ask that, I'll be honest, I did not know that it started with a relationship for you and your father and never knew that. And I think that's, again, cool when you start learning the history of you and your family. So as we're starting to wrap this up, there's a couple of things I wanted to just asked to two quick things. But what's the biggest piece of advice you would give to a new investor?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, I mean, look, I the the all of the mistakes in the real estate realm that I experience, are because people went into things without getting legal advice. On the front end, I can clean up a lot of messes. But generally, the messes that I clean up are completely and wholly avoidable. And the cleanup costs are always more expensive than the front end cost, always, always. So look, it certainly doesn't have to be me. But a trusted legal adviser, if you're going to start doing real estate investing is a very, very prudent way to proceed.
Craig Evans:So listen, the last thing is completely off of real estate. I know that to you and all your partners giving back to the community is extremely important. You know, I know that a lawyer role and supports a lot of nonprofits in the area. The attorneys that you've got in the firm of people on the American Board of trail advocates, you got Family Resource Center's you got Valerie house is just to name a few. You know, you guys are extremely big with community cooperative. Great, great, you know, charity that does a lot of great things here. You know, for people that are hungry, right. But I know that you personally serve on the Board of Trustees for the Edison and Ford winter estates. Why is that one important for you to be a part of and to put your mark on?
Frank Aloia Jr.:Well, so has a little bit of a family connection. I don't know if you and I've ever discussed this. So but I'll give you a of a couple of things. Obviously, as we talked about earlier, I love history. Right? And one of the things that makes Fort Myers so very, very unique is that we were the winter home of Thomas Edison, and Henry Ford. And they lived right next door to each other they were, they became great friends. And you have these two amazing historical men, inventors and you know, just amazing industrialists, if you will, that ended up becoming next door neighbors and fast friends and little Fort Myers. You know, Edison said he goes, there's only one Fort Myers. And someday millions and millions of people are going to hear about, well, it was prophetic. But you know, back in those days, Fort Myers was a little spit of a town. And the family connection is, as I mentioned earlier, you know, my great grandfather, Michael Pavese, was a barber with his brothers. Well, Michael Pavese was Mr. Edison's barber when Mr. Edison was in town.
Craig Evans:Wow.
Frank Aloia Jr.:And Mr. Edison didn't like to come to town much. And so my great grandfather would actually walk from downtown Fort Myers, to the Edison home, and he would cut Mr. Edison's hair at the Mr. Edison home there at the estate. And it was Mrs. Edison minor, was was a very, very lovely woman. And at one point, you know, asked my great grandfather about, you know, his children or whatever, and my grandmother was the oldest of the four children. And, um, you know, Mrs. Edison said, Look, if you've got, if you ever have to, you know, bring one of your kids, please feel free. And so my great grandfather took her up on that, and he would actually walk my grandmother, Frances, with him to the Edison home and Mrs. Edison would give her you know, lemonade and cookies while all my great grandfather was cutting Mr. Edison's hair. So you had that little kind of, and I heard those stories growing up. And so you had that little family connection. And then, you know, when I was pretty young, in my legal career, the Edison and Ford homes were very, very hot topic. They had fallen into a certain level of disrepair. They were the income stream from the tourism, gate receipts, and, you know, gift shop stuff and whatnot, was just kind of dumped into the city of Fort Myers is, you know, general fund, and it was very, very easy for the city to use that money and not put the money back into the estates. And so a number of you know, longtime Fort Myers, people, obviously, became very, very concerned about that, because, you know, the Edison and Ford winter estates a make us unique, but also were a significant driver of tourism dollars. I mean, we're one of the top five most visited historical figure homes in the country. I think that you know, like Mount Vernon, Monticello are one and two, and then Dearborn Ford's place up in Dearborn is like number three, were like four or five. And so it was in you know, homes and no tourists. And so those kind of, you know, leaders of the community, led by my dear friend Robert Galloway's father, Sam Galloway, Jr, you know, took the city on and demanded, the state's basically be put in the control of a private board, you know, it still has to be it's still owned by the City of Fort Myers. But now the income stream stays with the estate's it doesn't just get sucked into the general fund. And we all know, governments, if you have, if you give them money, they're gonna spend not necessarily on what they're supposed to add to the city's credit, they they the the people that were in the mayor, and several of the council, people in charge, agreed that we needed to segregate that income stream, and we needed to put significant amount of capital dollars to restore the Edison estate, in particular to the Ford home as well. And so that's what happened. And Mr. Galloway had formed a kind of a private foundation to help raise money for that restoration. That was like, Look, you privatize this foundation is going to help contribute towards the restoration. And so they did. And so when they were putting together the the first board that was going to run the estates, Mr. Galloway's Foundation had the ability to appoint someone to the board. And they chose me a because of my long standing, you know, history here and those personal stories, and I mean, look, you know, Mr. Galloway was a mentor. I loved him very much as a great man. And so yeah, I've been on the board. Gosh, Craig, it's probably 20 years now. And maybe even a little over 20 years, and I'm the immediate past chairman of the board. I was chairman of the board for three years. And we those states have been fully restored. We've endured a couple of hurricanes that affected the grounds but we've recovered from that. We have magnificent leadership under Mike Flanders who is the President and Executive Director of the estates and his team. All sorts of wonderful educational programming a very, very robust nursery and plant sales and and I'm proud of what has been accomplished in the last 20 years. It really is an offer something new you know, before it was like ah, you know, I've been to the Edison home and there isn't a whole lot different about it anymore, that there's always something new, something different. Some magnificent programming concerts, events, they the the McGillicutty family, your listeners may know them as Connie Mack. Connie Mack the fourth was actually a state rep in California at one point. Actually think that back he was a state rep in Florida, he married Sonny Bono's widow who was a state rep from California, they were both in the in the US Congress thing but the mack family as you may recall, Connie Mack the first owned the Philadelphia Athletics and was the was the owner manager of of of, you know, the Philadelphia Athletics that spring trained in Fort Myers. And so the McGillicutty are the mack family as they're known, accumulated a unbelievable amount of baseball memorabilia over the generations and they had nowhere to display it. And so now very recently opened in the in the museum at the at the estate's this magnificent baseball memorabilia exhibit that's currently going on. I'm so excited to go see it myself. I haven't had the chance yet. But it's on my shortlist.
Craig Evans:It's very cool. We were there recently as a family. We love going down there. It's very cool. So I'll be honest, until we started researching. I mean, it sounds funny. We're researching my friend right? I mean, we were doing research to make sure I've got everything that I need to talk about on you. And I had no clue that you were involved with with the Edison Florida states and that is one of my family's favorite things where they're at least four or five times a year going and walking and just just enjoying the stuff they are so well Frank, Listen, man, I can't thank you enough. I know that you're busy. I can't thank you enough for spending the time with our listeners jumping on sharing things to try to better them and, and their abilities to grow. Their business and they're interested in and just to try to protect them and make them better. So again, thank you for your time. I really appreciate it to all our listeners. Thank you. We will see you next week. And hope you have a great day. Thank you Take care.
Narrator:For more information on hard money loans, trust deed investing, and upcoming events with The Norris group. Check out thenorrisgroup.com. For more information on passive investing through the DBL Capital Real Estate Investment Fund, please visit dblapital.com.
Joey Romero:The Norris group originates and services loans in California and Florida under California DRE license 01219911. Florida mortgage lender license 1577 and NMLS license 1623669. For more information on hard money lending go to thenorrisgroup.com and click the hard money tab.