Awakened in America
Awakened in America
S2 Ep #1: Celebrating History
Host Z and Host Jess chat with Claudia Walker, the owner of The Black Toy Store and recently published author of "ABC's of HBCU's", regarding her innovative business ventures that are elevating Black History. This episode celebrates American history, and specifically highlights Black History Month.
You're listening to awaken in America, two minds on a journey to create dialogue about diversity, inclusion and optimism. Welcome
Speaker 2:Back to awakened in America. We hope everybody's doing well and enjoying the new year. So far today's episode is called celebrating history. And we are specifically making this episode about black history month and acknowledging that quote, black history while having its own significance should be valued as a part of history, which cannot be separated from American history. I actually read an article. I was just telling the ladies that I saw published by the Atlantic in January. And the title is black history month and schools retire or reboot. So that headline caught my attention, but it said now when it's 40th year questions remain about the value of commemorating it in classrooms. So basically just wanted to call out a few of the points. I read a little bit of history here. The seed of what is now known as black history month was planted in the doctoral thesis of a man named Carter G Woodson. He is a noted scholar author, and co-founder of the attention for the study of Negro life and history. He was the son of former slaves and he received a PhD in 1912 from Harvard, where he studied under renowned historians who minimize the importance and vitality of black history that led him to in 1926, he created and declared the second week of February Negro history week. And in his words, if a race has no history, if it has no worthwhile tradition, it becomes a negligible factor in the thought of the world. And it stands in danger of being exterminated, which I thought was really profound for our listeners that, you know, maybe like myself previous to recent events and recent years, haven't known a lot about the foundation of black history month that, you know, really, I think speaks to the importance of it and why it's so important in our school curriculum and, and elsewhere in the world. So first celebrated in 1976, black history month was the result of a growing racial pride and consciousness of black Americans. And what seems association pushing to expand the weekly celebration, a driving force behind what's in setting aside time to study and reflect on black culture was this frustration that children black and non-black students were deprived of learning in American schools about black achievements. Yet according to the NAACP, even the creator hoped the time would come when a black history week was unnecessary. So I had to read that again when I was reading the article and his idea on that was that he was optimistic than America quote would willingly recognize the contributions of black Americans as a legitimate and integral part of the history of this country, which kind of brings me to today and recent events in Utah. I don't know if everybody has seen that same headline that Z and I have been talking about this week, but there was a private school in Utah that was giving a waiver for certain students to be exempt from learning black history, also known as American history. And that was kind of an indicator to us that this episode, you know, had kind of a deeper importance in light of this recent events. Just wanted to mention for the record that they rescinded the waiver after a conversation with the local NAACP chapter. So one last kind of closing thought on that comes from a man quoted in this article. He's a fourth grade English language arts teacher in Maryland. And he was saying he would like to see black history taught every day in his view, the only legitimate way to build racial and cultural understanding and reflecting the spirit of Woodson's word and intentions quote, black history should be celebrated every day because all history begins with black history when black history is not taught throughout the year, it is reinforcing anti-blackness, which I also thought was profound. All right. So that was kind of a long intro, but like I said, clearly there are parts of the country and people who maybe don't have the same standing of the value of what it means to be American. And so I wanted to spend some time on that. So without further ado, we are thrilled to have with us today, Claudia Walker, she's a very busy business woman. She's an educator administrator, mother of three owner of the black toy store. And most recently a published offer she's based in Oakland, in addition to being an author and all the other things I mentioned, she also does public speaking. She founded the black toy store in 2019, and the website has been featured in the New York times, essence and Vogue. She's deeply committed to showcasing and celebrating stories that mainstream outlets tend to overlook. So she launched HB CU prep school, which is a publishing company that centers black voices and black joy and children's books. And her debut book is called the ABC's of HBCUs and is inspired by her undergraduate experiences at Spelman college. We're so excited to speak with her today. She's a thought leader obviously, and overall just an inspirational woman and she's leading conversations about race and the importance of African-American history in her own ways. And through her own creative business enters, thank you, Claudia, for joining us today, I'm excited to be here. Zane, do you want to say hi to the listeners before we kick things off
Speaker 3:Listeners, we hope that you enjoy this episode and that you learned something about not just black history, but American history.
Speaker 2:All right. So HBCUs, so this is something I've seen on the news. You know, obviously raising the importance and the place and the role that it holds within our country and our, and our culture here as Americans. So, you know, again, super excited to have somebody like yourself who is not only an alumni, but also just kind of taking it upon herself through her business ventures, to expand the world's understanding and kind of appreciation for this, this very special place. So I read something when I was compiling information for your bio and you wrote where you want Spellman is in close proximity to four other HBCUs it's in the Atlanta area. And you took classes at Morehouse college, Clark Atlanta university and Morris Brown college. And you wrote, I went to football games, homecoming parades, coronations concerts, speaker series, and step shows. But most importantly, I learned to truly love myself because for four years I was surrounded by a community that uplifted affirm to and embraced me and my culture in ways that my predominantly white elementary, middle and high schools never could. So thanks Claudia for being with us today. I don't know if you want to kind of comment on that too, to start off and then we'll kick off some questions for you. Sure.
Speaker 4:I grew up here in Oakland and my parents are educators, so they really instilled a deep appreciation for education. And so when I was growing up, I went to all predominantly white schools. I had a great experience, great friends, but oftentimes people think that when you go to an HBCU, when you're a black student, that you're, you're not outside of your comfort zone. And I think that that is the case for some people, but for me, having attended predominantly white schools, it was not the norm. And it was a place where I never had to justify my existence. I didn't have to explain some of the just basic experiences of being a black girl, becoming a black woman in society. And so it was a really transformative experience for me because I had never attended a predominantly black institution. And it was a place where I was able to be educated about the world, but also about myself and my culture. And so that was a new experience for me.
Speaker 2:And I know I'm in one of your publications, you wrote about being inspired by it's a different world. And that was a show I actually watched growing up. I was telling Z when I was reading about you, I was like, Oh my God, that brought me right back to it. Must've been, I dunno, I think it was like pre-teen or something, but I remember just being so drawn to the closeness and the comradery that you could see on TV, you know, and here I was in a predominantly white town going to predominantly white schools, you know, it was not college age, but it came through on the screen that it was just a very special nurturing environment, you know, which is probably why I liked watching it so much. I think I raised some eyebrows with my mom. She was like, you want to watch it's different. Well, okay. Yeah. But, um, so we'll, we'll kind of going with some questions here. So the first one I have for you, one of the many hats you wear as educator, and did that influence your decision to write the book, which again is called AVCs of HBCU?
Speaker 4:Yes. So I have taught pretty much every grade level or worked with every grade level except for elementary school. So when I first became an educator, I was working, uh, in middle school as a middle school teacher taught all of those grades. And then I'm now working at the high school level, I guess by default, I can say that I now work or have had experience as an elementary school teachers, as all of our kids are at home. And in some capacity, you know, we're homeschooling little people, but as a mom and as an educator, the whole purpose, right? Whether you are a kindergarten teacher or whether you are a 12th grade teacher, is to prepare your students to be ready for, to contribute to society, right. Or what they're going to do once they graduate. And it doesn't mean that college is always in the cards. I definitely am an advocate for getting a degree after high school, predominantly for students of color. I think that, you know, now because of the age of the internet, and there's so many people who are able to start at businesses and maybe bypass college, or, you know, now we've got these games that millionaires, right? So we have a lot of students and young people who are thinking, well, I can just, you know, I can start a YouTube channel or I can invest in they'll. All of those things are viable options. But I think particularly for, for students of children of color, it is important to have a college experience. Just, you know, if not for the networking in and of itself, just to have something to say, you're going to deny me a position. You can't say it's because I didn't go to college or get higher degrees. So education has always been important to me and because of my experiences at Spelman, because my mom also attended an HBCU Savannah state. And she is definitely one of the main reasons why I chose to attend. And also, as you said, because of a different world, which really, you know, came into my home Thursday evenings and made me see education in a different way. I think in addition to it just being an HBCU, I think children all over the world at some point, get to a place where they're kind of over school, right? It's like, I've figured this out. This is boring. I don't want to do this. And now as a high school teacher, when I talk to students about college, they often think if it's another four years of what I just had to go through. No thank you. I don't want to be signed up for that. And so different world, like you said, really was, was it transcended that just education? And it was really about comradery and a community and family and history and tradition. And so those experiences, my own personal, my mom's and what I saw on a different world really inspired me to attend an HBCU. And as a teacher and parent, I wanted in some way to be able to share my experiences and the experiences of others who have attended HPC use in a book so that children
Speaker 2:Would be able to know a little something about schools that they may not otherwise know about. That's a beautiful way to explain it. And the, like I said, it's, it's such a compelling place, you know, it's so interesting. I'm so glad that you were able to have that experience in college. And you know, I'm really glad that HPC is, are, are here in the U S and Z kind of pointed out the history of HBCU is, might not be quite as positive. You know, it might be reminiscent of the days of segregation and things like that, which is important to note. And that was an important part, you know, as I was educating myself to, to remember that, but to find the positivity, which you were so eloquently doing, I think it's tying in education, you know, which we know is so important for elevating and normalizing these conversations about race and to, to have a place like HBCU, which is kind of giving that accurate depiction of American history specifically to the people who were victimized the most by it is really important, you know, to understand. And when we're talking about schools that are kind of giving the option to celebrate black history month, that's for me, why is terribly upsetting? Because there shouldn't be a delineation between American history and black history, but there is Carter Woodson was saying until that time, when there is no delineation and we can acknowledge and educate, you know, our students on everything that has, has happened in our country's history. I think it's important that we, that we celebrate black history month. So, so speaking for myself and those who I like to refer to as allies, my white allies, so little has been known about what an HBCU is outside of Kamala Harris, graduating from Howard university. I think everybody knows that now, which is awesome. Can you describe what you kind of already did this, but maybe if there's something you want to speak to specifically and Z
Speaker 3:I'll actually add something as a fellow member of an H VCU, uh, Clark Atlanta university can find a way or make one, right. It does. Right. That was it. Find a way or make one and you know, to this day, honestly, I always think about if the door isn't open, come in through the window. I mean, like, you know, if you have a hurdle, if you have an obstacle, don't just tell yourself, well, this is in my way. And so therefore I can't go around it, like find another way, you know, there's always another way to do something. So it's about brainstorming or networking with peers and figuring out a way to do something differently, a way to do something meaningful, just like Claudia did with creating this great book. I didn't learn about H VCU until I was in high school. And I've spoken to, you know, other friends who have said similarly, like if it wasn't for a quote unquote black college tour or something that, that we wouldn't have been exposed even ourselves to necessarily going through to a black university, a predominantly black university. And it's not because there aren't family members who have actually been some, because I have family members that have been to like Howard, uh, specifically, how would the university where Kamala Harris has been and graduated from, but it's just that it's not something that's mainstream. And so it's not always forefront of mine, I think. And I had to actually give some advice not to long ago, to some friends of ours. They were considering where to send their daughter in. There's, you know, he's a doctor and the mother, she like does different genetic in HR and insurance. And they were just like, where should we send her? Or, you know, Z, we know that you've been to an H VCU. She really is kind of contemplating it. Is that a good idea? And you know, it was really based on the premise of how is white America going to perceive her when she's done. They know that their daughter is capable. The daughter knows that she's capable, but because she's, African-American like they didn't want her to have this stigma of, Oh, you went to a traditionally bad college. So therefore you didn't get an adequate education or you got less than or something. And it's really, you know, it's really about a lack of education. Like, and I feel like that's what we, we're trying to accomplish today with letting our listeners know and be aware of the fact that African-Americans, don't go to HBCU because we want to skate by we're going there because we realize that is someplace where we can grow and get fed and get nurtured and have an experience that's unlike any other experience we may ever have in our lives, which is being around people that look like us, that accept us. We don't have to make excuses for our hair being a certain way or dressing a certain way or thinking a certain way. We don't have to personally explain ourselves as being in that type of environment of just acceptance that we don't experience on a day-to-day basis, the 95% of our lives. And so for that small percentage of our lives, it's like we finally get to feel maybe what it feels like to have white privilege, which is your accepted just generally speaking. And so now we get accepted, generally speaking amongst our own. Still when we step foot off campus, we have to deal with whatever. But for some moment in time, we get to feel like a normal person, just everyday normal person, not having to, you know, like I said, explain ourselves or pretend to be something that we're not to fit in or any of that, any of the, that we have to play to survive in a white America. That's to me, why use are so important? I'm proud to say that I attended the HBCU and anyone that has attended one should be proud to plant that flag.
Speaker 2:I really feel that pride. And I'm a little envious of it. You know, I have to be honest, just hearing you guys speak about it. I mean, it's, you can tell it's just, it was a very special place, special experience, you know, and I loved my college years too, but I'm just thinking about it. I read something, you know, when I was prepping for this. So it was talking about, can you imagine being, African-American going to a non HBCU where you have one building that everybody that's a person of color lives in. You have one bar that all the people of color go to your college experience is completely different. It's really valuable insight to hear that I wanted to ask you Katia, in terms of the transition for you, what was that kind of like when you went from, you mentioned like a predominantly white school to an HBCU, like Spellman, was it hard at first or did you like kind of, what were your first thoughts?
Speaker 4:It, wasn't hard. I think that most people, I can't speak for most black people, but I think that many people who have my experience of growing up black in America and living in like I'm from California, right? So California is very liberal and I always grew up with this duality. So I went to very elite private schools from birth. And so that was a norm for me. I didn't really think that it was that it was strange or that it was different. It wasn't like I was busting from, you know, my parents were educated as well. So we lived in a middle class community, but my parents worked in public schools. So during the summer they would take me to their schools and they would enroll me in the public schools, which were predominantly black. And then my parents did a good job of making sure that I had balance. So I kind of in mimicking the life that my parents created for me. So my children also attend predominantly white schools. And I have recognized that it's very important to provide balance because when you have a child who attends any child who attends a school, where they are not part of the majority is very easy to start to question your own identity and your own worth. And so my parents did a great job of finding balance. So whether that was bringing me to their jobs and having me attend summer school, where it was a completely different racial and socioeconomic makeup, whether it was our church life on Sundays or the extracurricular activities that I was involved in, those were predominantly black. And so I felt like I was constantly straddling these different worlds. And I, as a kid, you're always trying to figure out where you fit in. So I would say when I attended Spelman, it wasn't a culture shock. It wasn't like I'd never been around black people. I knew what I was getting into. I think the thing that was, I guess, the most challenging, and it's funny to say this, but it was figuring out where you fit in, right? Because at my predominantly white school, particularly high school, you know, there's a book called why are all the black kids sitting together in the cafeteria or something like that. You often see these groups, right? Your Asian kids may be sitting together and the next kids are sitting together. And even when you have integrated schools, they're typically still segregated. And so socially. And so for me, when I stepped foot on campus, it's like, where do I go? Who do I, you know, I'm not just going to pick that group of black kids over there. And that, that for me was really the beauty of it because you really get an opportunity to realize that, you know, when we talk about the black community, it's so diverse. And so when I, when I was at Spelman, you have your black girls who are into, you know, rock music. You've got girls that are, you know, really into like science and biology. And that's all they want to talk about. You have, you know, your skateboarders, you have those that are into gospel. I mean, you have your students who are not from America, so they don't identify as African-American, they identify as Haitian or, you know, Trinidadi in or God name. And so what is that like, what was your experience like growing up in another country or no? What was your experience like growing up on the East coast, or you have students who come from very privileged backgrounds and you have students who, you know, came from really impoverished backgrounds. And so you have this real mix of, I would say the same type of socioeconomic diversity that you would see just within, you know, the American society, but it's, you're, you're dealing specifically with black women or black girls. And so that for me was, was I wouldn't say the culture shock, but that was, that was the adjustment that I had to make in terms of figuring out which groups am I a part of? Who do I get along with, you know, more like, you know, where do I find my own community within my community? Um, and so that was the interesting part.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. One thing you brought up the other day when we were talking, not all students at HBCUs are African-American, so that was good for me to know. Just an example of rear of all that. I don't know, I'm learning from people like Claudia, and I'm very grateful to get the opportunity to speak with you.
Speaker 4:I'm sorry. It's really similar to what CZI was saying. There's so many black students who don't know about HBC use, and if they do know about them, they're not really sure how they may measure up to other predominantly white institutions. And so we're part of the book was really about making sure that specifically black students or black children are familiar with HBC use, but if it's still an issue in our own community, then obviously, you know, people outside of our community will not be as familiar or will not recognize that those schools are open to any student who is interested in attending. And some of the schools have done a great job of having exchange programs where students can spend a semester on campus. And that Spellman that's the majority, a lot of the white students that were there were students who were doing an exchange program. And I mentioned to you that it was really cool when one of the young ladies on campus decided not going back to my school. I really love, you know, the community that I've built here. I liked the school and she decided to transfer
Speaker 2:Yeah. What an amazing experience for her. So along those same lines, when I was seeing all these headlines, I think it was the president of Morehouse who was talking about recruiting. I think he was on MSNBC or one of those shows that are always on in my house now that my husband works from home. But, um, he was talking about recruiting efforts specifically, and I actually looked at my husband cause you know, they're hiring. And that seems like such a huge opportunity for right now, you know, things that can happen right now for people in the working world, my fellow white allies, who are trying to figure out now that we have this information, what can we do with it to really make things better or take action, you know? And I think that seems like a really easy opportunity, make sure your HR department and whoever's handling recruiting is visiting HPCs and putting them on the map in terms of hiring. Because, you know, if you really want diversity, we've mentioned this in previous episodes, it's it's every company has this obligation and responsibility. I think, you know, now more than ever to really kind of put the pen to paper and say, this is what we're doing to diversify our organization. What better way to do that then, uh, recruiting from HBCUs and bringing people into the organization that way. So that's one thing. But do you have any other advice for, for white allies in terms of how they can show support for HBCUs? You know, there's recruiting, like I said, your book again, ABCs at HBCUs internships. How do you, how do you think we can, we can best improve our allyship?
Speaker 4:I think normalizing HBCU. So I think what's really cool at a lot of schools that they will have a school named after or not a school they'll have a classroom named after a particular college campus, or they'll have the little pennants in their classroom, making sure that in addition to the different UCS or the different private institutions, the predominantly white private institutions that you also have some HBC use in your class, and guess what? You don't have to put those up only if they're black students in your class, right? You can include those for all students just to make sure that they recognize it. These are actually viable institutions that any student can attend. I love the recruiting idea. That was the way that I got my first internship in my first job out of college, was companies coming to the HBC and saying, I actually want to recruit from this school. I think that it's also important to make sure that organizations are looking at all HBC use. So if you have an HBCU, that's headquartered in the state that you're in to look at those schools as well. And while I'm a proud alum of Spelman and Clark and Morehouse and Howard and Tuskegee, I mean, those are some of the more popular ones, but it's important that people are looking at HBC use that are not as well known and talked about in the media as much. And I think similarly scholarships, you know, if you're able to donate money, if you're able in anything helps, right? Anything can help a student to defer the cost of, of tuition or funding bare their college education. So making sure that there are opportunities for students to apply to different scholarships, so that, so that money isn't a barrier to them persisting in the college education, particularly at an HBCU.
Speaker 3:And to that point, actually, I was going to say that, you know, it might be assumed also that, you know, just because a black student or minority student attends an HBCU, that they get scholarships or they get some type of financial path. And the Clark Atlanta university is a private institution. And yeah, my mother was a single parent and it was difficult to come up with the tuition. And unfortunately that's the case for many of us, especially if it's a one parent household. So I think there also should be some education about that aspect of it. In many instances, black students are, are trying to change. We're trying to change the dialogue, the narrative, and we're trying to make a difference and, you know, become successful entrepreneurs so that we can change history and continue to change history. But there are these obstacles that do exist and there are people that do have way to help. And those are the ways that you can help is that yes, black students still do need financial help in many instances, because as Jess and I have mentioned on previous episodes, there's still a huge, a huge socioeconomic disparity that's going on. I mean, health disparity, I mean, it just goes on and on. And so, you know, obviously that continues when you talk about higher education and yet we know that higher education is a way proven way to, to change the narrative and, and lift people out of poverty so that they can come back and they can make a difference.
Speaker 4:Yeah. And I mean, the endowments for HBC are totally different than, you know, your larger private institutions. And so oftentimes again, I'm an educator, you have students who get accepted into HBC use. And when they look at the financial aid packets that they're receiving, it's a huge barrier. And so they have to make a decision between, you know, I've had parents saying I'll mortgage my home. Right. You know, we'll, we'll try to figure it out, but it's, it's definitely, they're definitely hard decisions that many families have to make when they're, when their children say, I want this experience, but they're looking at their packages and they're thinking, well, if you go in state, we don't have to make these same sacrifices. And so money could definitely,
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's in a really important connection to make. I just have one more question here before we move on. So, and this is something that I would love to know personally, you know, and I think it's beneficial for again, my white allies, how can other colleges and universities be more inclusive and, and actually not even just colleges and universities, like taking it a step further, how can companies be more inclusive to, you know, beyond the recruiting efforts? Because that's something that I think about sometimes, you know, every company, especially now, like I said, has said they want to be diverse and stuff, but how do we prevent this? You know, all the white kids sitting together at the lunch table and people of color sitting at other lunch table,
Speaker 4:Ah, that's a big question. I don't know that I have the answer for that. I would say, I think the most important thing is that given the visit happened over the summer and calls for so much social change, you're right. There are so many institutions and organizations that are saying that we want to do better and we want to diversify. I think that first schools and corporations need to really figure out to what extent they're committed to this because for many, for many organizations and institutions, I think people say it because it feels like, Oh, I got to say something, you've got to do something. And so you, you make these statements and the actions don't follow because the intentions aren't pure. And so I believe in being honest so that you can stay true to whatever it is that you have said that you believe in and that you stand behind because otherwise people are looking for you to do things that are not consistent with the true essence of the culture or what, what you're truly committed to. Right. And so I think that it's the first thing to do is to ask yourself how committed are we to this work? And if organizations are truly committed to diversifying, I think that it's important that whether you're talking about a school, which ask students, you know, you're applying to a school, oftentimes they ask you why you want to attend the school or how you hope to contribute. And they may ask some pointed questions, whether it's in the personal statement or whether they provide an interview with organizations when you're interviewing with them, your cover letter sometimes has to address certain things. When you come in to interview, they may ask you about, you know, your experience, right? They, I mean, when you interview, they ask a number of questions and usually those questions are very specific and well thought out to, um, help them figure out whether you'd be a good fit for the organization. And so if companies are committed to diversity, I think that that has to be a part of the process. So when you are determining which students are a good fit for your campus for a year, trying to figure out whether this employee is a good fit, then maybe you should, maybe you should be asking questions around issues of diversity and inclusion and equity, because it's one thing for me to say that I'm committed to something. And then the other people that 99% of the other people in the organization, whether it's a student or whether it's faculty, whether it's an intern, if those people are not new or I haven't done a good job to vet to see whether these people have the same value system and beliefs that I do, then that could end up being a recipe for disaster, because I've said something, but the people who are now part of this organization aren't necessarily committed because I didn't ask. And so I think that organizations are going to need to start to figure out how to make sure that the people that make up that community have similar values and I get it, not everyone has to agree. Not everyone has to, you know, have the same moral compass. But I think when you look at at colleges in particular, it's important that you have a diverse faculty is important that the student body be diverse. If that's important to you, it's important that the curriculum reflect, you know, a number of experiences. But if you have, oftentimes students will talk about microaggressions or negative experiences that they've had with their peers. And so if colleges are not trying to think about how they can change those dynamics on campus, then I think regardless of whether they are admitting more students of color or students from different backgrounds, you're going to continue to run into challenges because the community doesn't necessarily value those same doesn't value, those, those same things.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Those are excellent points for me. You know, a lot of the times he and I talk about something she was worried about when all, you know, black lives matter and all of that was kind of at its peak. She said, I am worried that once the hype kind of quiets down a little bit, that this won't be top of mind, you know, like it is right now. And I said, I don't think w you know, I don't think we're going to go back to that place, but, and I certainly hope not, but I think all of those suggestions or ways that we can kind of keep the conversation moving forward, you know, prospective students applying for colleges, there was a huge portion of the country that was, there were young adults that really cared about what was going on, maybe for the first time, since they've been alive with all of the protesting and everything that was going on. So hopefully those are the same people that are going to be considering what the racial makeup is of the colleges, you know, they're planning to attend and even what they choose to study once they're there. And then again, like you said, continually raising this in any sort of interview setting, really, you know, the importance of DEI. And that's something I've been doing myself as I've been evaluating schools for my, my kids after COVID. And we, you know, go to school, just asking at any, any opportunity I have, whether it's a parent of the school or somebody that's giving a tour or anything like that, you know, what are you guys doing around diversity, equity and inclusion. And I think that's going to be a part of my life, you know, forever. Anyway, I digress. Thank you so much, Claudia, for all of your time. And I'm going to hand it over to Zach.
Speaker 4:Yes. So I have a few questions about the black twister. How did you manage to have time to create the blacklist in 2019? I guess the more children I started having, the more birthday parties we were going to, I'm always the mom, who's trying to find the right toy for the right the right child. And as I mentioned before, I think that it's so important that children see themselves in whether it's a reflection of them in the books that they have, or the toys that they're playing with or shows that they watch. And again, my mom did a great job when I was growing up, when I was growing up, one of the most popular toys were cabbage patch dolls, and I loved them. And my mom did everything that she could to try to find out for those who are not familiar with cabbage patch, they were dolls that, you know, yes. Right. Um, I guess they grew from lettuce or cabbage and they were, you would adopt them. I found out that there is actually a hospital or adoption agency that you could go to and you would get this birth certificate. But the thing about it is Nate came named. And the thing about it is they were so popular that they would sell out. And so all of the parents around the holidays would be going to toys R us or whatever toy store to try to get the toe, you know, the dog before it sold out. And my mom was able to not only get me a bunch of dolls, but they were all black cabbage patch, dolls, even harder to find. And so it was really important for me to make sure that my children had toys that reflected them. And, but I was always, you know, going to this website and then trying to go to another website or going to big box retailers and asking, you know, it took a lot of work. And so I just thought, well, what would happen if there was just one site where you could get a lot of recommendations or ideas about different games and action figures and books. And when I realized that no one had done it, I just decided to take a stab at it. And so, you know, it took a little bit of planning, but I was ultimately able to get a website up and to launch the store. And a lot of people will reach out to me. They think that I actually am stocking all of the toys and that would not be my kids. Wouldn't I wouldn't be able to sell anything because I'd go into wherever we had the inventory and they'd all be opened. So it's, I don't hold any inventory. We're really an affiliate site. And so I find the toys and then I provide a link to the toys. And it's great because I'm able to highlight and showcase a lot of small black owned businesses that might not get as much business because they're just selling one product, they're selling one doll or, you know, a puzzle, but because they're on the black toy store, it's sometimes gives them a little bit more visibility because it provides, you know, the black toy store as a site where people know that they can go to find a number of things. So oftentimes it's a way for them to find smaller businesses and to drive business to, um, that site.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I was on your website and, uh, I found myself browsing for a bit and I was like, Oh, well, this is such cool stuff on here. I actually was looking at your, your books that you have on there. And I was like, Oh, we have this one. Or we have that one. I was like, Oh, I was still meaning to get this one. And, you know, like, uh, one of my favorites is, um, the princess and the pea you happen to have that book. And may amongst the stars is one of my kids' favorite about the astronaut Mae Jemison. But then you also had the book by, uh, LeBron James
Speaker 4:Called yes,
Speaker 3:I promise. And I was like, yeah, I still need to get that one. And then there's one about Kamala Harris. And I was like, I need to get that one too.
Speaker 4:I mean, I can't keep up. I told my daughter, I would hire her to manage the site because there are so many products that come out and we, you know, obviously we don't have everything on the site, but there's so many cool ideas that different organizations or different companies come up with. And so we want to try to capture as many as we can.
Speaker 3:And I think it's a great platform, but you also have some STEM toys I noticed. And, um, and specifically I noticed that you focused on some products for girls, like, you know, not just the dolls, but you actually had like chemistry sets, but girls, there's always an under-representation of females in those types of industries,
Speaker 4:Just the packaging alone to be able to, you know, have on the cover of the box, people of color, why don't we have more of that? You know, it's like they're kids, they need to see, you know, representation when I built the website, I thought, okay, I don't, it would be great to just focus on black owned businesses. That would be great. But I also want it to give a nod to manufacturers who were non-black owned companies that were saying, you know what, here's a, here's a slime set. And, you know, on the cover, we're just going to put a black boy on it because black boys, pink plates line too, you know? And so that's just important in terms of representation. It doesn't have to be a black doll. It doesn't have to be a black action figure, but you can put kids of color on the cover of your packaging and people will buy it.
Speaker 3:And thank you. Thank you for noticing that, you know, that's important too, and I'm glad to see that there's more representation generally speaking. I think that I've noticed even on television, that more commercials and just starting to see a little bit more diversity just overall, I'm grateful for that to them. I don't know if that influenced your thinking as well, but I feel like there definitely is a movement to do something different and people recognize that it's important to, to recognize and give, give credit to all the cultures that America is supposed to represent. For sure. Thank you for doing that. And I was going to ask, how has the overall response
Speaker 4:It's been great. So I don't think I've ever shared this before, but when I came up with the idea in about 2019, I believe I like most people who watch a business, you know, I came up, I come up with a lot of ideas and this is one, I usually bet my ideas with my husband. And he, you know, he's like very supportive, but he will tell me, no, he doesn't think is great. And then I get mad. And then, you know, I might try to launch it just, just because, but this was an idea that he thought this is great. I think that there's a need in the market. And so after all this months of planning, I launched it and I expected that everyone would just be like, this is the thing we were looking for. This is wonderful. And that obviously didn't happen. And again, I am a mom and I have a full-time job. And after a few months of, or maybe almost a year, it was a while of, of really trying to pour into this business. I just got tired actually. So it's an affiliate site. And in order, a lot of the products are products that are on Amazon. And Amazon says, if you want to become an affiliate, you've got to make two qualifying purchases. You have to have two qualifying purchases in six months. So what does that mean? It means that two people that don't know you have to go onto the site and purchase something. And I thought six months that I can, I can do that. And six months later, Amazon said, sorry, you did not make your two sales. And so you can't be an affiliate. And that was really discouraging. I didn't do it to make money, but you know, I'm paying for hosting this site. I just want it to at least be able to break even, and that wasn't happening. And then life just continued. It just, it wasn't something I was prioritizing as much because I thought that nobody was interested in it. I thought that it just wasn't a good idea, but I kept the site up because, you know, if people want, even though I wasn't gonna make any money off of the site, it still would be a good reference for people who were looking for these products. And I really just kind of forgot about it until we were on vacation during the summer, we just took a road trip to Southern California. And I happened to be in an old email. And I saw there was just a lot of emails from black twister. And I thought it was really bizarre. And I logged on to Instagram and I think I went from like two followers to like 200, but it was just pretty like amazing. And I didn't know what was happening. And obviously because of all the social unrest, people were looking for, looking for ways to support black businesses and then things just exploded from there. I went on vacation spot, Oh, maybe this was a viable idea. And you know, people are actually into it. And I think there was the New York times article that happened that summer and I just got recommitted to it. And so it's been great because it's something that my kids can also be a part of. And I think for them, that's a learning experience as well. You know, how do you find not just cause if I left it up to my eight year old, it would just be a Pokemon toy store, right? Like that's all that it would be. And so we talk about, you know, a market, like a target market outside of yourself and you know, what kind of products would a little kid want versus an elementary school student. And, you know, my daughter is an avid reader. So what kind of books would you recommend for, for young readers? And so that's been a great, um, a great way to just involve them in, you know, starting a business and starting a business that has a greater social mission than just, you know, trying to make money. It's an affiliate site. So it's not work. It doesn't make a ton of money, but I also am really big on investing. So the money that we do get, I, I give to my kids and I asked him to invest it into, to give back with it. But I think I'm most proud of being able to support other black businesses when Vogue Rand ran a piece on black businesses to support the business that they chose from the black toy store was a business called kids coloring co. And so they're a coloring book. They create coloring books and crafts to go with those coloring books, but they also have a, like a gardening kit that was the product that ran in Vogue. And literally a friend sent me an email and said, Hey, you know, we saw the black toy story in boat. And when I realized that it was their company, they're registered nurses, they work a full time job. And my heart was so full just because of that, when I tell you how exciting it was to just send them a DM through Instagram and say, you guys are getting involved, like that was everything. And so that's really the greatest joy of business.
Speaker 3:I liked that. I liked that passing it on. Yeah, exactly. I know that you've, you've given a lot of thought to probably many of the same issues. We have everything that was going on last year and then your children being home, everyone being home, what would you want our listeners to know about social justice and inclusivity? What, what would you think is an important takeaway from your experiences?
Speaker 4:I think that as a parent, when you think about your children's experiences, we all want our kids to feel valued and included, right? I mean, the worst thing is for your to come home and say, so-and-so, wouldn't let me play with them for no reason. Right. And so I think on that level, we can all agree that like inclusivity and making people feel like they're part of a community is important. And I appreciate all the work that is being done, where people are becoming more conscious of the value. I guess I would say that I think the most important part of it is to be willing to listen and be willing to learn, especially as adults. So often we kind of feel like I've got this down. I know what I'm doing. Whether you know, it's in my, you know, professionally or personally, I've got this figured out. And I think that it can be when we're, whenever we're asked to step outside of our comfort zone, that can be, it can be a little scary. Right. And I think as a society, we, we have become so comfortable with being comfortable, right? I mean, that's the thing that we value. Like you do. What makes you feel comfortable? What makes you feel good? Like you deserve to be happy and you deserve to feel great and you know, be around people who make you feel good and who cheer you on. And those things are important. I think it's also important to recognize. I know as a teacher, I'm often telling my students when I'm trying to really get them to do the thing that I want them to do is that oftentimes the greatest growth comes from being uncomfortable. Right. And it's the thing that I try to get my students to do. Just make that phone call. I know you w you said that you want that internship. You said that you're, you know, you want to go to that school. Remember when you met that person and they gave you a business call, pick up the phone and call them. And it's a thing that they don't want to do. And I think as adults, we often have to recognize that part of ourselves where we don't want to get uncomfortable because we like what we created here. And so if we are to be, you know, on the right side of history and we want to advocate for change, it's important to find those areas in our lives where we become very comfortable, but our, a certain level of discomfort may help to push things a bit further. And I think that it's important to listen. I am, you know, I'm a woman, I'm, African-American, I'm heterosexual. I am, you know, Christian. So I understand those communities. But when I am in community or having conversations with people outside of those communities, I have to be willing to listen. Even if their experiences don't necessarily reflect my own experiences, I have to be willing to listen. And I think sometimes we're so quick to maybe feel threatened by other people's experiences that sometimes instead of listening, we want to justify our own experiences. And so I think in order to move the work along, we've got to be comfortable with a level of discomfort and we have to be willing to listen actively, listen to other people's experiences and then be willing to ask questions and be okay with feeling like, well, there's this question that I want to ask, but I don't know if, if you know, maybe it makes me look bad because I'm asking this question again. It goes back to my experience as an educator, there are so many students who don't get what they need, because they they're afraid to ask the question. They're afraid to look dumb. Right. And the, the students in my experience who Excel are those who are like, I don't care what you, I'm going to ask this question because I need to ask the question. And so when we're talking about these kinds of sensitive issues, it doesn't mean that you just blurt the first thing that comes to mind, because it could be a little insensitive. If there's a question that you genuinely want to know, what's the correct way to frame it. Is this question that I should be asking in this group, or could I maybe wait and ask a presenter or ask someone that, you know, I work with the question privately, you know? So I, I think that those are the things that we need to do if, if we truly want to advocate for the change. And I think many people in our country recognizes is important in timely. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Thank you for all of those thoughts. And it reminded me of something, you know, just since we started the podcast, I realized how much pointless time I spent on social media browsing, celebrity nonsense. If you just carve out a portion of that time and, you know, start following people like yourself, thought leaders around, you know, diversity, equity, and inclusion, there is a ton that you can learn from the comfort of your living room, on your sofa with your phone. So could you tell us, I think it's HBCU prep school is the handle for the ABCs of HBCUs, the publishing company, right? Yeah.
Speaker 4:Yes. That's our handle. That's Instagram and Facebook and clubhouse. And then the black toy store is at the black toy store. The website is black toy store.com. And the book is HBC U prep, school.com.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So like I was saying, I was literally looking for Christmas gifts and I went on your Instagram page for the black toy store and you have all kinds of ideas right there for everybody to see. So it's super easy if, if, if people are looking for, you know, holiday, birthday, whatever, just looking to diversify your kid's toy room, which is also something I'm always trying to do, visit her website and, or her Instagram page and check out the ideas there.
Speaker 4:Thank you. Yes. Great ideas. And we're so grateful for having you today. You've said so many things that are very profound and I hope that our listeners appreciate
Speaker 2:Having someone like you on opening for you guys. This has been so much fun. Thank you, Claudia. I've learned a ton and I just wanted to close with, sometimes I get caught up trying to get all my, my notes in, but you know, black history month has definitely taken on a whole new meaning, you know, in my household with my family. And I hope there are a lot of families that feel that way also, but I hope this, you know, this episode really enlightened people on why it's important to, to have it and to understand it and understand the history and, you know, it's place within American history. It's not, it's not two separate things, but, you know, it's, it's certainly deserving of, um, separate conversations, separate educating until we can get to a place of more inclusivity and, um, less delineation between quote unquote black history and American history. So thank you so much, Claudia. It was a pleasure. The pleasure is mine. Thank you.
Speaker 1:Thank you for listening to awakened in America. If you enjoy today's podcast, be sure to subscribe and leave a review. You can also find us on Instagram at awakened in America. That's awakened underscore in underscore America and remember be mindful, be grateful. And most of all be you.