Move It or Lose It | Episode 147 | Nate West and Dennis White: Service and Strength Beyond Limits

Move It or Lose It | Episode 147 | Nate West and Dennis White: Service and Strength Beyond Limits

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:04

Hello, I'm your host, Kathy Fastor, and welcome to the Movement of Lucid Podcast, a podcast about all things that move the mind, body, and so on. The Movement Elucid podcast is for information, awareness, and informational purposes only. I am not a doctor and I don't have anyone on TV. So please consult your doctor before making any medical decisions. The views that's brought by advertisers, guests, or contributors are their opinions and not necessarily the views of the Movid or Lusit podcast. Introducing the Pulse device, cutting out wearable device, revolutionary, wellness designed to stimulate circulation, reduce heart pain and tightness, and speed up recovery. The PALS device uses advanced vibrotactile technology trusted by patients, clinicians, and wellness professionals. Whether you're recovering from an injury, battling a neuro condition, or just want to feel the best every day. Pulse helps you retange, recharge, so that you can live and feel better, lightweight, powerful, and easy to use. Experience better performance, better recovery, and a better you. Order now and save$30 using my code MSDisrupted at Paulsdevice.com. The Paul's device is your health recharged. You won't be disappointed. Get it now for yourself. I have it. I love it. Go ahead and grab it. Hello, welcome to another edition of Move It or Lose It. Today I have the honor of having some military veterans. So thank you very much, you two, and I will get you guys in your names for serving and protecting our nation. So I have been wanting to highlight some of our military, and you'll see that throughout our series this year. And so you might notice that, Dennis, I had you on. Dennis White, I've already had you on. And thank you. You are going to help me with some of these interviews. And today we also have Nate West. And I, these are names that are easy. I haven't messed up. They won't be on my bloopers of messed up names. So um thank you, Nate, for participating today. You are also a military vet. You served in the army, correct?

SPEAKER_02 2:36

Yes. I was um I joined before 9-11. So I joined in August of 2000 and I finally got discharged in November of 2022. Um, so my 22 years of service um ended because I got diagnosed with multiple sclerosis in 2008.

SPEAKER_00 2:56

Yay, who doesn't want that?

SPEAKER_02 2:59

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 3:00

Um you were diagnosed actually the same year as my son.

SPEAKER_02 3:04

Oh wow. Um, I highlighted congratulations.

SPEAKER_00 3:08

Right.

SPEAKER_02 3:08

A horrible disease, but um it was it was a shock to me. Whenever I first found out, um, I was actually very, very upset and mad. And I was dealing with a lot of survivors guilt, anyways. Um, my combat tours, um, because I I dealt with explosives. So obviously I'm unfit for military service after finding out with the mask, especially with the memory issues. Sure. Um, not controlled.

SPEAKER_00 3:36

Was that one of the first things, Nate? Sorry to interrupt you. Was that one of the first things that affected you was memory?

SPEAKER_02 3:44

Um I was really good at ignoring my body. Um, I guess the military training taught me to ignore pain, ignore everything, and just push through. Sure. Um, you know, uh they they say pick yourself up by your bootstraps or you know, mission first, or yeah, so many other military quotes, but right um I didn't pay attention to my body, right? But my family did. Yeah. So they saw the changes that uh was happening. Um, I was actually having a lot of foot drop on my right side, but I was contributing that to my knee injury because I've had three knee surgeries on my left knee. Okay. I thought I was overcompensating. Sure. But apparently that was first signs of MS starting back in 2013. Wow. Um, but I didn't get diagnosed until 2019.

SPEAKER_00 4:37

Wow. So when they did your MRI, were they able to see back that you were had it for quite some time?

SPEAKER_02 4:44

Yes. Um the military is not great at communicating well with civilians, as Dennis put it. And I saw some off-post doctors, and they actually did diagnose me um with possible MS as early as uh July of 2013. Um the records were off post versus on post. So whenever I did final out of the military, they gathered all of my medical records together, and that's when I saw it.

SPEAKER_00 5:14

Okay. Wow. So you get diagnosed, you get the news, and then what's what's next for you?

SPEAKER_02 5:24

Um, it is multiple sclerosis or any um autoimmune disease is pretty much a immediate medical chapter because you're no longer fit for duty. So they started me on a med board, uh, which is what it's called in the army. Dennis, I don't know what it's called in the Marines, I'm guessing something similar. But the medical board started and I had to fight because they wanted to give me the bare minimum. Um, I was sitting at, as I said, I joined in 2000. So I was sitting at 19 years. They wanted to get me out immediately, and I said no. But um, they started the medical chapter, and I had to fight because I was sitting at 19 years. I wasn't at my full 20 for retirement age, and they were trying to give me, you know, basically 30 from the army and wow, maybe 25 to 30 for the VA. And I said no. And I had enough.

SPEAKER_00 6:29

How do you fight that when you say no? When you say no, they're not just gonna say, Oh, okay. So when you say no, what does that mean? You have to do a lot. I'm I assume you what does that mean?

SPEAKER_02 6:41

There's appeal processes for everything, and they also give you a lawyer. Okay. So I had a JAG lawyer advising me during the entire time, and they said I'm thinking as a civilian, I'm I'm looking at this like Top Gun. So oh, absolutely. Um which is maybe.

SPEAKER_00 7:02

Um, but they Dennis, you're laughing at me, so just stop.

SPEAKER_02 7:07

Yes. Well, most people think you know, flight, so they think Air Force immediately, and it's actually maybe but um, yeah, so I was being advised by a military JAG lawyer, and I just started reading everything BA and found out that MS is covered. It's a minimum of 30%, which oh by the way, they were trying to give me 30%, so they weren't factoring in PDSD, 3 knee surgeries, or anything else that I was exposed to because my job was explosives or um it's technically called combat engineer, but we did route clearance, so we made sure the roads were safe, aka we got blown up a lot.

SPEAKER_00 7:50

Sounds like something I really want to get into, like right now.

SPEAKER_02 7:54

Oh, it's a blast, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 7:57

Pun intended.

SPEAKER_02 7:58

Absolutely. Um, it's a lifelong joke. Um, but yeah, so I started reading up on all the things that I was supposed to receive, and I just kept on telling them no every chance I got, which the military is so good at hearing the term no, um, sarcasm 100% intended. Um yeah, they hated it. Every single time I said no or I fought something, there's like, why don't you just accept this? This is a good deal. I'm like for you, not for my family. Right, right. And I kept on saying those words, and they uh that was during the time frame that COVID was happening, and um, everything was shut down, so everything was online or via Zoom, so that gave me an opportunity to tell them though and yeah, go see the doctors that I wanted to because they couldn't schedule things quickly. Right. So during their hurry up and wait, I was doing research, right? I was finding people in my corner and it worked to my benefit. I can't say that for everybody. Okay. A lot of military vets actually go out with that 30%, and then they have to fight for the other, you know, 70% um to get to 100.

SPEAKER_00 9:17

So questions for you guys, what do you both suggest? So this is why this these podcasts are so important and why I really wanted to do them. Because there are so many veterans that don't know what to do, and they don't have that anybody to reach out to. They don't they know, okay, they got their 30 and they don't know what to do. What do you suggest? How do they reach out? Is there a community of veterans that they can reach out to?

SPEAKER_02 9:47

Um in the world we live in today, everything is online. You can read as much as you want to, and I just suggest that you go to valid sources. I actually went through the VA website and that's where I got most of my information. I use their information against them to say no. And whenever you go to these doctors, you have to explain it to them as if it's your worst day. Yes, with MS, we do have good days where we can do some of the things we normally do, but it's not every day. And I had to explain that as not only a service member, but as a patient of MS. Because two weeks ago I couldn't even get myself out of bed. Right. I just physically couldn't. My body was not communicating well with my brain. I had no appetite, I didn't want to leave bed, I was extremely fatigued. And unfortunately, that's a new normal for me.

SPEAKER_00 10:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:51

So I had to I had to learn to listen to my body and know what it needed. Sometimes I just need a day of rest. Right. Sometimes I can go out and do everything I want to with my kids, right? But that's not the normal. And I had to explain that to doctors that what my new normal was.

SPEAKER_00 11:12

How many doctors would you say understand multiple sclerosis?

SPEAKER_02 11:17

I am blessed with a really good neurologist that does.

SPEAKER_00 11:21

Wow. Good. Good to hear.

SPEAKER_02 11:25

I'm originally from Missouri, but I ended up retiring here in Kentucky because of that. I did not want to move away from that really good doctor who actually listens to me.

SPEAKER_00 11:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:36

And that is so hard to find.

SPEAKER_00 11:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:39

That I hear, yeah. Whenever I say something, they listen and they put it in their notes.

SPEAKER_00 11:45

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 11:45

And the next time I come in, it's documented that I don't like taking pain meds, even though I'm constantly in pain. The army taught me that um I can easily be addicted to pain meds. Right. And they tried giving me all of them. And I said, no, I don't like the side effects.

SPEAKER_00 12:06

Yeah. I wholeheartedly agree. I think that's why um I've learned to work with different companies that um are really trying to help us so that we're not using all of the medication. I think for me, it's been almost 30 years. I was diagnosed young as well. And I think, you know, back in the day when it was like, you can look forward to a stroll later. I was like, what? So on wanting to be in the military, I would I just would get, I would go and run it out. And I would then make a phone call, you know, four miles in and say, okay, it didn't win today. I couldn't run the disease out. So pick me up, I'll do it again tomorrow. So it was so crazy for to be told that I would take a stroll or a bike ride, you know, years later. Um, I could not grasp that. It didn't make any sense. But, you know, being fit and knowing that I wanted to do training and stuff like that, it made nothing in my grandfather had it, my aunt had it, nothing that was said just to sit down and rest. None of that made sense. So, because of my background in training, it was like, no, you have to move it or lose it. So you have you'll be your atrophy. I was like, I am a big rule follower, but I will not follow that rule. I will move my body constantly so I don't lose anything. So I think that it's, I mean, that be, you know, in 2020, literally is when the MS Society issued movement is your most important medicine. I was like, whoa, okay, yeah, that is true. So frustrating because so much is unknown with MS. And so obviously, I it's a great month to highlight um veterans with multiple sclerosis. But with brain injuries or anything, it is um, so I guess what I want to go a little bit further with you guys is okay, we know we can go. You gave great advice. Go to the go look on the VA website, right? Because they're gonna give you they're that's gonna be the most um reliable information rather than going on different websites that are could give you just people's opinions or some kooky stuff. What about those that cognitively? Now I'm still talking about MS or stroke or any brain injury, cognitively can't do that, can't get onto a computer, can't cognitively remember what their reino can't think that far. Where's help for them? How do they get that out?

SPEAKER_02 14:40

Um, that's where um so for me it was a it was a lawyer because I was still active duty. Okay. Um for somebody that gets diagnosed after the military, um, Dennis, you might be able to help out, but I think it's eight years um after your discharge from the military, you have to claim uh MS. And then you can also claim all of the um subcomponents or um what is affected by MS. So like your cognitive ability is affected or your mobility is affected, those are all secondary causes of the MS that you can claim. Um whenever it comes to my cognitive ability, I use that fight in me and that the anger that I initially felt from being diagnosed because I didn't know what MS was, so I had to look it up. And whenever my kids or my wife would see that the stress of it was affecting my cognitive ability, they helped me out by having a second set of eyes to look over, you know, what I was looking at and being able to read it and understand it, which was a struggle. Um and those came into like whenever you see those those doctors, they have a form that they have to fill out. Well, you can download the form.

SPEAKER_00 16:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:14

Um and it's uh this um I know it has three initials, everything has initials, right? But it's basically your disability form.

SPEAKER_00 16:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:25

And I can't think of it right now.

SPEAKER_00 16:27

Do you know what it is, Dennis? Okay.

SPEAKER_02 16:31

I can look it up.

SPEAKER_00 16:32

But what are what is the years, Dennis? Do you know that you have the what? The year amount of years you have. Is it eight years?

SPEAKER_01 16:40

It's seven or eight.

SPEAKER_00 16:41

I okay. Yeah.

unknown 16:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 16:44

That's that's where that's where I had the difficulty because my MS was diagnosed. I got out in '93. My MS wasn't diagnosed until 2014.

SPEAKER_00 16:55

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 16:56

So my approach with the VA, um, I mean, at the time I was going to the VA because years a years uh prior, I'd lost my uh, we had a big layoff at work, so I'd lost my job, and I was on, I was talking to another veteran, and he mentioned that, you know, I mentioned I lost my job, so I was looking for work, and he said that he was like, you know, you can go to the VA for your you know all your medical stuff if you've lost your job. And I was like, oh, okay. So I went to the VA, applied, and I got you know benefits there.

SPEAKER_00 17:28

So okay.

SPEAKER_01 17:29

I've been going to the VA for you know years for all my well, most of my medical stuff. Sure. But when I was diagnosed with MS, um the VA sent me to Ohio State to get because they weren't sure. I was seeing just a neurologist at the VA and they weren't sure, so they were like, We need you to see a specialist. So they sent me to Ohio State, and Ohio State's the one that diagnosed me.

SPEAKER_00 17:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 17:56

But as far as things I was fighting for, um I'd had pretty much good luck with the VA. And I never I never even thought that I could get my MS service connected until years later I found out that um, you know, when I was serving in Okinawa, Japan, I got mono, which is the car virus.

SPEAKER_00 18:18

So now we know so much more about that.

SPEAKER_01 18:22

Yeah, and I didn't know that until I started seeing an MS specialist outside of the and he was, you know, he asked me about my history with the the military and if I were to get injured or anything, and I was like, No, really, the only thing that happens is I got mono in Japan.

SPEAKER_00 18:36

Right. And then it was like bang.

SPEAKER_01 18:38

Yeah, and he said, Well, you know, mono is linked to MS. So that's when I started filing my claim for MS. And I hired a law firm, and this law firm is like based in Texas, and they don't they don't take any money for you from you until you until they win you a percentage, and then they only take like 10% of the back pay.

SPEAKER_00 19:01

So why weren't you able to do um like Jag? Or why weren't you able to do a military lawyer? Is that because you weren't?

SPEAKER_01 19:09

I think that's because I wasn't on active duty.

SPEAKER_00 19:12

Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_01 19:13

Um and they so the way I approached it was I I really didn't have to fight for anything until I wanted that myocycle.

SPEAKER_00 19:24

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 19:24

Myocycle restored my walk ability to walk. So when I when I found that I called the company and they were like, Oh, if you're a vet, I mentioned I was a veteran. They said, Oh, you're a veteran, just request this through your VA, and they're like, give this to veterans all over the country. And I'm like, Okay.

SPEAKER_00 19:42

Now, is that something that you had heard about, Nate?

SPEAKER_02 19:46

I was actually gonna ask to us, what is that?

SPEAKER_01 19:49

Oh, um, it's a it's uh an FES device.

SPEAKER_00 19:54

Um don't you have it out like a little yeah, why are you there in that mess that you're in?

SPEAKER_01 20:00

No, it uses electric stimulation in it. Um, it's kind of like a bicycle, but it's made for people with MS and people that are have spinal cord injuries. So you can just if you were in a wheelchair, you just roll up to it and put your feet in the in the pedals, and they strap yourself in, and then you have all these electrodes all over your legs. I use about 16, like 20 electrodes on my legs.

SPEAKER_00 20:27

So it's really, really neat. I've been able, I was able to watch a class, and um it is really neat, but it's something that the military does provide, and I don't think most mil I don't think most military men know that.

SPEAKER_01 20:41

And I never I never even knew about it. You know, what what got me onto it was I had a bad fall when I was trying to ride a bike, and um so I just googled uh bikes for MS, and the this myocycle thing came up. So I called the company and they're you know, they said just request it through your VA. So I went, I told my doctor about it at the VA, and he put in the request with um PT, met with physical therapy, and and explained what the device was. And the lady was like, Yeah, that sounds like it would be really helpful. She's like, I'll go ahead and submit the request. So I didn't hear anything back, and a while later I found out that it was denied. And I'm like, Well, why isn't somebody calling me telling me it was denied? And so they said it was denied, and the reason was we don't supply bicycles to veterans. I'm like, okay, they don't even know what this is. So so I I met with the head of the head of physical medicine and the head of prosthetics to try to tell them what this was. And the lady at physical med the head of physical medicine, she just she didn't know it, what it was, and she didn't even want to know it. Was she was just giving me this attitude about she's like, Oh, I see devices like this all the time, but that doesn't mean they work, and I'm like, Yeah, but this is an FDA-approved device for people with multiple sclerosis. So, what are you talking about? And so I spent probably two years. If I knew what I know now, it probably wouldn't take that long because I wasn't real familiar with the appeal process. So I was contacting, you know, um uh different organizations like Semperfy Fund, um DAD, you know, and I I even contacted my congressperson, and they're the their department was the ones that told me about the appeal process. So I would I filed um three appeals. The third appeal goes outside of the VA, goes to like a board, and they and they make a decision. So they after my third appeal, they approved it for 12 weeks. So they sent it to me, came out and set it up. And I had to go in like every 30 days to get tested by the physical therapy to make sure it was working right. And I blew all their tests out of the water, so they ended up just giving it to me.

SPEAKER_00 23:10

So I'm gonna make you the contact person for when everybody talks and asks about the myocycle, I'm gonna make you the contact person for that.

SPEAKER_01 23:19

Yeah, I promote it all the time because it was so amazing. Because I went before I got it while I was fighting for it, I did this uh clinical trial in Ohio. It's called TMS therapy, it's a brain stimulation. And before I got that, I worked 7 a.m. to 3:30 p.m. And by 3:30, I was dead. I would just go late, go in bed and lay down, watch TV the rest of the night. I was just exhausted. So um I learned about this TMS therapy through a a veteran video that they were treating PTSD on with it.

SPEAKER_00 23:54

Have you ever heard of that, Nate? No, okay.

SPEAKER_02 24:00

So I um he's given me all kinds of information.

SPEAKER_00 24:04

I like it.

SPEAKER_02 24:06

No, I'm going to forget. So I have to read it.

SPEAKER_00 24:08

Yeah, no, I love that. And I and I love this is, you know, one of the things that is my heart that the veterans can share with each other knowledge that, you know, in the my the you know, in the month of March, but also that this becomes something that I think is is very important. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 24:27

Um I called my MS specialist in Ohio and I asked him, I said, Have you ever heard of this TMS therapy? And it would have would it benefit people with MS? And he was like, Yeah, I got a clinical trial right now with the do you want in on it? And I was like, Yeah, definitely. So he got me in the trial. It was open to veterans and first responders, and I had to go to Ohio to do it. So I'd spend, I we I work remote anyway, so I could just work from Ohio. And I spent six weeks, uh, it's like uh 12-minute treatments every day for six weeks. But while I was down there, I asked the TMS doctor if she was familiar with the myocycle and if it would help with MS. And she's like, Oh yeah, she's like, that would be perfect. And she said, You want to try it? And I was like, Yeah. So she set me up at Ohio State that has a myocycle in their physical therapy department. And I did over that six-week therapy sessions, I did seven 30-minute sessions on the myocycle, and they kept track of my progress. And by the end, they said my leg strength improved by 60 percent.

SPEAKER_00 25:37

That's amazing. That's really amazing.

SPEAKER_01 25:40

I was like, Can you put that in writing? Because I want that for me for my appeal. So I had that uh letter from them, I had a couple letters from my doctors, everyone's saying I should have it, and it's still denied. So, but then um, I think it was my after the second denial, I reached back out to my congressperson and I was like, Look, you keep denying this, you know, how what do I gotta do? And they're like, they reach they responded with file file another appeal, and that'll go outside of the VA to a board and they'll make a decision. So I did that and then and they improved it.

SPEAKER_00 26:17

So and you have it, yeah, yeah. So I think that's really neat.

SPEAKER_01 26:23

I think I got it in July or April of 2024.

SPEAKER_00 26:27

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 26:29

And by June, I was walking unassisted.

SPEAKER_00 26:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:33

So I was like on it every day, doing it every day.

SPEAKER_00 26:36

Yeah. Yeah, I think that's such an important thing that that we um that we fight for. Um, well, that you guys fight for. But I if I have, I mean, I have this platform, so I want it to be used for things like this. And I think it's really important that that veterans know about this. And um especially those who may be afraid to ask for those things. And I think because, you know, you talked about that, Nate, that fight is in you. So those who get exhausted of advocating, I think for most of our veterans, most of our um military, you are used to fighting for things. You are used to going to bat for things. And so do you think that gives you the strength to continue to advocate when you're told no? Do you think that that is just um in you to just say, um, I'm sorry, I will continue to fight for this until you get that I need to have this?

SPEAKER_02 27:37

It's not within everybody. I I used that negative response to my benefit, but I see so many veterans that just give up quickly because there's like it's not worth the effort in the strain and the stress that it puts on your body because stress really does affect MS so much.

SPEAKER_03 28:01

Absolutely, 100%.

SPEAKER_02 28:03

It puts you in an extreme fatigue state. I was early in my diagnosis and I was active duty, so I was still able to fight without it completely washing me out. Yeah. Now I wouldn't be able to do that. Um but the form that I used is actually a this uh disability benefits questionnaire, also known as a DBQ. Those are the initials that I forgot. Dennis was right, it is seven years. I was under the impression that it was fake.

SPEAKER_00 28:36

And I'll have them at the bottom of the show notes too.

SPEAKER_02 28:40

As everything in the military, um, everything is subject to change. And um, that's why it's so important to get the information from a reliable source. Right. But whenever it came to those disability benefits questionnaires, that's what the doctors have to fill out. And I went off of that. The bottom of the form, it tells you exactly what you're needing to get 30%, to get 50%, to get 80%, to get 100%. Right. It tells you what what are your requirements. Right. And I went off of that and use that to my advantage because information is key, and you're using their information against them. And they want you to be denied the first couple of times. They want you to fight because so many so many people are trying to get that magic number of 100% and they may not be qualified. And I understand that not everybody is qualified, but the people that do qualify for it should not have to fight that hard to get the yes, because it is debilitating for us with MS, us as veterans, right, to fight.

SPEAKER_00 29:56

And you see so many suicides and so many other things that the depression is, especially when we're talking about um well well, all of it, but when we're with our Vietnam vets, we've seen so much of that with um turning to with all of our veterans, but turning to um alcohol, something to numb the pain, um drugs and and suicide, and how many marriages you know make it with with vets, um, not many. And so I think that um to your point, what do we do with the vets that feel like you do right now? If I had to go through that again, I I wouldn't have the strength to do it. The ones that's overwhelming. Yeah. So is there help to come alongside your brothers and sisters in arms that say, okay, I I'm here to help. I'll help you do this because I know it's too much.

SPEAKER_02 30:56

Um, there are several organizations out there. Um, Dennis mentioned a few of them with the DAV, um, Veterans of Foreign Wars. Um, you also have American legions out there, but those are just the big names. Yeah. There's smaller local companies that do something similar. Um, and if you're close to a military base, you'll find them in abundance. Yeah. But they really do care. And a lot of them are veterans themselves, and they've been through that same boxhole of having to fight it and they know how to do it well. Yeah. Um, I try to use my my experience to help veterans in the same way because I do know how to fight it. Right. And I know how to win. That's so important. Yeah, for sure. Having somebody on your side that says, I've done it, I've got there, I got the t-shirt. Yeah. For sure. It's it is a challenge.

SPEAKER_00 31:57

Uh, you're how are you feeling now, Nate? How is your MS now?

SPEAKER_02 32:02

Um I have good days and bad days. Um, this is uh the MS Awareness Month of March, and this is the in 2026 from my 2019 diagnosis. I'm doing the MS walk this year.

SPEAKER_00 32:20

Good for you. Good for you.

SPEAKER_02 32:24

Nice. I'm trying to get everybody to realize that men are diagnosed within us too. Yes, because we're such a small minority, and I'm I'm super excited, like almost in tears. Excited to be able to do this.

SPEAKER_00 32:39

Let me know, I'll post it for you.

SPEAKER_02 32:41

Oh, absolutely. I'll let Adam know too.

SPEAKER_00 32:44

Yeah, because yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:45

We're competitive, we like that kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_00 32:48

Yeah, that's awesome. Very excited for you. That's that's really cool. When is yours?

SPEAKER_02 32:54

Um, I believe it is not until um April, April 8th, I think. I I don't remember. I'd have to look it up again. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 33:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:04

Yeah, put it in your calendar.

SPEAKER_00 33:06

Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, keep me posted and we'll um we'll do something for it. So that is um, I really appreciate you. Um do you have any questions, Dennis? Remember, you were supposed to host this with me.

SPEAKER_01 33:17

Uh no, but I did want to add that there there are patient advocates at the VA.

SPEAKER_00 33:22

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 33:23

The ones I've dealt with are haven't really been helpful, but um, I've heard there are some good ones at the VAs. And that's part of the problem. Not all the VAs are the same.

SPEAKER_00 33:34

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 33:34

But when I when I was requesting the myocycle, I was arguing with the the head of prosthetics. I was telling him, look, this device is being provided to veterans all over the country, and they're just to do their VA. Why? And he's his exact words were just because one VA does something doesn't mean they all do. So I was like, That is bullshit.

SPEAKER_00 33:58

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 34:00

Um, the other thing I want to mention there, there's a couple devices. I have both, um, that they just gave me like okay. I told them, you know, I was dealing with pain, they're like, Oh, have you heard of this? And I was like, No, but I don't, I'm not the type of person I hate taking medication, right? I take probably you know five or six different medications, and that's because I you know, I I need them and I have to. Right. Um, one is called an H wave, and one is called a Replexa Plus. The H wave is kind of like a TENS unit, and there's different, like if you're having like I have a lot of neuropathy, my hands and feet, so I use it for that. And there's certain like electrodes you put up certain areas to help with that, and it was it's been very helpful.

SPEAKER_00 34:50

Um, and that was just given to you, so you just explained, and they that was something that they gave.

SPEAKER_01 34:57

Yeah, my doctor one day asked me if I'd ever heard of it, and I'm like, no, he's like, I'll send you one, and I didn't really I didn't have to do anything for it. Same with the Reflexa Plus. Now, the Replexa Plus is a little different, I'm not sure what kind of technology it uses, but you don't feel anything, but it's supposed to um help with blood flow, pain.

SPEAKER_00 35:15

Okay. Um and this was your doctor at the VA. Yeah, okay, yeah, very neat. So there is an understanding, there is uh there is a desire to give out, to give things, just some of them, at least, some of the VAs.

SPEAKER_01 35:36

Yeah, most of my experience at the VA has been pot, I'd say 90%. And there's been a few times, you know, with like the trying to get the um the mild cycle. That's the big the biggest thing, but um I remember when I was getting my I'm on ocrevus, so I get that six months through the VA, and they my first dose got all screwed up. They I went, I went to my appointment, and they're like, Oh, your doctor didn't sign the release or the paperwork or whatever. And I'm like, Okay, just walk down the hall and get them to sign it. And she wasn't there that day, and I'm like, okay, and so the nurse comes back, your doctor's not here. And I'm like, Well, she has to have a backup, right? Just and the backup doctor for her said, I'm not familiar with them, so I don't I don't want to sign off on it. And I'm like, Right, you don't need to be familiar with me, you just look at my record and right. But so that was that was an aggravating thing. Sure. Um, but other than that, I've had pretty positive.

SPEAKER_00 36:47

Yeah, good. Now do you get your you're on ocvist as well, Nate?

SPEAKER_02 36:52

I'm on ocvist, and I go to a I don't go to the VA because they don't have an MS specialist. Okay. They have neurological specialists, which they tried to get me to see, and I again had to fight and say no, they're not specifically for MS. Right. They deal with neuroscience, but MS is different. Exactly. That has to be somebody that is MS specific. Um, the VA does have um MS um centers of excellence is what it's called. Okay. And the closest one to me, I believe, is actually in St. Louis. Oh gosh. Missouri. And I'm in Kentucky, so obviously I'm not gonna make that five-hour drive to go with the um a specialist. So but like Dennis said, you know, not all VAs are the same. Right. And those centers of excellence are absolutely amazing, and they do know all of these different um durable medical devices, which is what they're called in the VA, right? Um, that they can give us and they do help documented medically help us.

SPEAKER_03 38:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:06

Um, I use a Bioness, which was one of the first devices I got. And then whenever I was a And what is that? A Bioness is also a tens unit. Um, it goes on my right, uh right below the knee, and it is a tension that activates that um that muscle that lifts my foot up, so I don't have the foot drag.

SPEAKER_00 38:31

Yeah, the foot drop, are you are you dragging?

SPEAKER_02 38:34

Yes, absolutely. Um and then with my Modified by MS, um, which is the organization that's recognized by the National MS Society. I do Zooms once a week with the men on with MS.

SPEAKER_00 38:48

Um I've I've talked and I've I've um done some speaking with them, so very um very familiar with them.

SPEAKER_02 38:56

Great, amazing. Yeah. But um I I reached out to them whenever I was diagnosed, and they've given me so much information, and there's a lot of men on there that have been through similar things, you know. They may have been diagnosed for 20 years, and I'm barely hitting five or six. So they can give me those tips and great support group to be in. It is, and they held they hold you accountable, yeah. Um, which I need so many times. I need I need another dude to say, stop being a bit. Yeah, get off your ass, go do something. Yeah, uh, get up and move. For sure, yeah. Yeah, and Adam is great about that. Yeah, you know, he'll he'll call you out and say, Yeah, Adam's one of my best friends.

SPEAKER_00 39:45

So I I know, I know that he is. So um I do the walk in May with him all the time, just to do that with him. So I I've taught him, worked with him, love him. We are both, we're about 20 minutes from each other, maybe maybe close to 30. But um, yeah, we're really close.

SPEAKER_02 40:02

So and he just got those two uh sleeps for his legs.

SPEAKER_00 40:06

Yeah, yeah, I was really excited about that. I was doing a podcast with them and I was like, You're gonna be there, go talk. And so it worked. I was just super stoked that he got it.

SPEAKER_02 40:15

So yeah, it was amazing.

SPEAKER_00 40:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:19

Silent.

SPEAKER_00 40:20

Yeah, so really excited for him. So always, always excited for him.

SPEAKER_01 40:24

So really, but I I got frustrated with it because it was like every time I put it on, it was like a different experience. Sometimes my foot would shoot out the other way, and okay, just got aggravated with it.

SPEAKER_02 40:37

Interesting. Being in Kentucky, um, the person I saw was based out of Nashville, so it's only like a two-hour drive. They actually came up and programmed it to my gate or to the way I walk. And then they had to come back and adjust because with everything, um your your mind is a wonderful thing, and it will it will learn um whether you want it to or not. So it it learned the device and it helped activate it with my own mind versus the electrodes. So I had to get it adjusted. Um, and you have some re I think it's residual effects. It lasts after you take it off. Um and I really enjoyed the biomass. Yes. Okay. Luckily, that's all I need for right now. Okay. But like I was saying, the B was really good about the durable equipment.

unknown 41:32

Good.

SPEAKER_02 41:32

Whenever I get an extreme relapse, and I literally couldn't walk. I couldn't, I couldn't go upstairs or anything like that. They did give me a um oh, what's it called? I call it my go-go gadget machine. They gave me a scooter for the long distant walk so I can still do things with my family. Good, good. And that's been amazing. It's a pride victory ten or something, but um I only use it when I have to, but yeah, the fact that I have it is amazing.

SPEAKER_00 42:06

Yeah, good to hear. Good to hear that they fixed that too for because as you know, we can we can create bad brain plasticity or good brain plasticity. And so having it fit more secure will help you to walk in the correct way. So that's that's good.

SPEAKER_02 42:22

Absolutely. Very good. Very important to get it adjusted as needed. And yeah, people at Bioness are are good about adjusting that if you do still see a physical therapist or somebody like that. That's usually that's the office that I was working at of.

SPEAKER_00 42:38

Okay. Yeah, that's that might be a company I'd like to talk to. So um for sure. Well, I can't tell you how much I am grateful and probably will want to know more and dig your brains more for things. But I'm so grateful to have you guys on and to just kind of dig your brain about the military and about um the VA and just about how you guys have done what you've done and just so grateful for not just not just for the fact that that um for your service, obviously, so grateful for that, but understanding the above and beyond. We all have to to um to as well said activate. We all have to to uh to fight into to um that word's just not coming. I'm having that mass loop, yeah, advocate for ourselves. And we know how difficult that can be over and over again, but there is a totally different level when it comes to the military as well. And so um bringing that out and having that knowledge that most people, most civilians don't, I think is is really powerful. And Donna's get ready for a lot of phone calls about the mild cycle. So you are the point man on that. So um I look forward to having more stories. And so this month I really wanted to highlight some of our veterans with that are dealing with multiple scrolls. So Nate, it has been such a pleasure to meet you and to know your story. And um it just is um is just very neat to know that you were able to serve and to really get what you needed and to see how you went through those channels to really continue to say, no, no, I'm going to I need it this way, and that you were able to get it and to um to fight to be able to be the husband and to be able to be the dad that you needed to be. So um very, very proud of your service and proud of your ability to fight for that. So thank you.

SPEAKER_02 44:37

I appreciate that. And it's a pleasure meeting you. Seriously, yeah. Thank you very much. You got my number, so we need to talk more.

SPEAKER_00 44:43

Yeah, I have a feeling you guys will talk for I don't think you guys will not talk anymore. So that's great.

SPEAKER_02 44:49

You saved in my phone, buddy. Sorry.

SPEAKER_00 44:52

That's great. So thank you guys, and don't forget to tune in. Don't forget to subscribe and liking and subscribing are different. Please subscribe. That helps us with our podcast. And um, I will see you guys next week for another edition of Move It or Lose It. Don't forget, we do have to move it. That is our best medicine. See you guys soon. Bye-bye. Have a great day.

SPEAKER_02 45:14

Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 45:17

Thank you so much for joining me for another episode of the Move It or Lose It podcast. It would mean the world to me if you subscribed and left a review. Remember, you can find me on Apple, Spotify, Stitcher, and YouTube. New episodes of the Move It or Lose It Podcast air every other Wednesday. If you have any suggestions for future guests or topics, please visit my website at www.msdisrupted.com. Until next time.