Chewing the Gristle with Greg Koch
Welcome to Season 5! Listen in on Greg Koch's conversations with his guitar-hero friends. Every episode Greg unleashes his fiendish humor and unique perspective as "one of the most famous unknown guitar players in the world", asking his often-famous musical friends the questions that we all want to know the answers to! Each episode is brought to you by Fishman and Wildwood Guitars
Chewing the Gristle with Greg Koch
Jeff Kollman
Ever wondered what it feels like to tour the world with some of the biggest names in music? Join us as we catch up with the incomparable Jeff Kollman, who brings his electrifying stories from the road and insights into his latest record. From working with Alan Parsons and the Bombastic Meatbats to his own band, Cosmosquad, Jeff's journey through the musical landscape is nothing short of extraordinary. Plus, we dive into his regular performances in Japan and his daughter's new adventures studying in Tokyo, highlighting how personal life and global travels intertwine.
Remember the magic of vinyl records? We do too! This episode transports you back to the nostalgic realm of rich, immersive soundscapes and the unique joy of holding a tangible album cover. We explore the distinctive experience vinyl offers compared to the fragmented world of digital music, and share laughs about the evolution of record covers' secondary uses over the years. Whether you're a vinyl veteran or a curious newcomer, our conversation reveals why this format continues to captivate music lovers.
But that's not all! Get ready for some hilarious and insightful tales from Chad Smith of the Red Hot Chili Peppers. We chat about the dynamics of putting on shows, the camaraderie among musicians, and the art of high-volume guitar. From Midwest tours to unforgettable gigs in Los Angeles, this episode brims with personal stories, gear discussions, and the sheer passion for live music that keeps us all coming back for more. Don't miss out on this jam-packed session of musical wisdom and industry anecdotes!
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Lo and behold, ladies and gentlemen, season five of Chewing the Gristle is upon us. It's been a little while, folks, but it's going to be worth the wait. We're going to be featuring a lot of convivial conversations with various musical potentates, most of which you've heard of. Some are going to be some new discoveries. That's why I'm here to bring forth the chewable gristle matter to you via the information superhighway, brought to you, of course, by our friends at Wildwood Guitars in beautiful Louisville, colorado, and our friends at Fishman Transducers of beautiful Andover, massachusetts. Both I've had great longstanding relationships with, and continue to do so, and we're very grateful for their continued support in this endeavor of giving you the highest quality and chewable gristle possible. Now, without any further ado, folks, let's get down and dirty with some Chewing the Gristle Season 5.
Speaker 1:Buckle up, ladies and gentlemen, gentlemen, boys and girls, this week we have the return of Jeff Coleman. He's got a brand new record out. You've seen and heard him with Alan Parsons. He's been with the Bombastic Meatbats, he's been with Glenn Hughes. He's got his own band, the Cosmo Squad. He's an extraordinary musician and a cool cat. This week, ladies and gentlemen, we got Jeff Coleman. Come on y'all Recording in progress.
Speaker 2:Oh boy how do I see you, whoa?
Speaker 1:You gotta press that doggone thing. I'm a bob. You gotta press that doggone thing. What's going on, Jeff Wright? To press that doggone thing. What's going on, Jeff Wright? Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, once again we gather around the gristle fire for a little chewing that gristle. We have the mighty Jeff Coleman returning to our podcast. He's got a brand new fantastic record out. He's globin' trobbin' around the world. Globin' trobbin', that sounds German. Globentrauben around the world. Globentrauben, that sounds German. He's Globentrauben around the world, rocking people's brains. He's playing with Alan Parsons. He's doing his own thing. He goes to Japan and God only knows what he does there. I think it's forbidden, but I embrace it. Jeff, how the hell are you?
Speaker 2:I'm good, you know you make me laugh and I just get a recall, but it's going to be fun. It's not like my stepdad, damn it. You know that's a funny guy. It's kind of early out there though, and 9 am, I got you know, is my little world out here.
Speaker 1:I love lines.
Speaker 2:So he's got his lair out in california, a nice place to get away from the the family. But you know um I bring them to sometimes.
Speaker 1:Yeah that's because you're loving.
Speaker 2:I got her off to college yesterday. Uh in tokyo oh you're so.
Speaker 1:You decided to do that, so she's going to school in tokyo. This will be her sophomore year.
Speaker 2:We just had to get get her an apartment. She's pretty close to Shibuya Crossing, the five-point crossing, Wild. Close enough but just far enough Like a 10-minute bike ride.
Speaker 1:You've been going there every year to do a pretty consistent gig over there, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I do my own tours and also Cosmo Squad, but then I play with this Ikeji Izawa the Japanese know him as H-On, and Tony Franklin has done it. Doug Rappaport on second guitar. Yeah, doug Rappaport, we made it together. You know, originally it was Toshi Inagi, it was his gig. Then they brought me on. I was like the Scotty Pippen, he was Michael Jordan, and then they replaced him with me. I was like what happened? Then? They hired a Japanese guy from Japan who wasn't as good Not that one's better than another, but I thought we made a great team. And then, a couple years later, doug Rappaport came in the fold, which is fantastic. He's a beast.
Speaker 2:He's a beast of the night and Toshi comes back and forth sometimes, but it's never when I can do it. You know, basically it's Doug and I, but during COVID we didn't have visas to be over there, so they brought in Toshi. So you never know what the Japanese rock stars think. You know this business is fickle, but I love doing it because it's always in the time of the year when nothing's going on. You know, in the US meaning like Christmas and Thanksgiving, people like to stay home. They don't tour so much then.
Speaker 1:Yes, Well, let's talk about your new fabulous record. I was listening to it yesterday. As usual, just a glorious set of tones and tunes and performances, Doggone it. You know I love what you've done. I, you know there was all kinds of different high points out of it. It's pretty diverse. There's some glorious things on there. The song with Jimmy Johnson, it's very holds worth asking. That is just magnificent specimen.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know? Uh, I'm not afraid to show my influences. Try not to be too derivative.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, it's a nod to, but not a leg humping.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, man, I was thinking about Jimmy Johnson when I wrote it because obviously holds worth of that connection, and I had another player play on the track and he didn't quite hit the mark a couple of times in a row and I thought, well, why not just send it to the source, right? I emailed Jimmy, I met him through Mike Landau and Mike gave me his info and he played on a song years ago of mine called Song for James so and Jimmy's great. He's like oh, interesting harmony. Oh, who's the drummer? You know this kind of thing. And he said, yeah, I'd love to play on it. I said, you know, I'm hiring you to be you don't even think it just you're be jimmy johnson. And he sent me that take back. And it's just. It's, you know, one of the highlights of the record. I mean the interplay with shane and just amazing. I like it yeah he's great.
Speaker 1:So how long did it take you to put this record together?
Speaker 2:you know, uh, I spent a lot more time mixing it and preparing the business for it. I would say six weeks. Nice, bing, bang, boom. Yeah, I mean some tunes like that Holsworth thing I had underneath my fingers for a while you know how that works. You're like I don't know how this is going to make a recording, like you know what are the drums going to do? And I had this kind of vision of like Peter Erskine ECM kind of floaty. You know it's not a backbeat kind of tune, right, and it's not like there's a chorus and there's a hook, it's just it flows the way it flows, kind of thing.
Speaker 1:So yeah, and I dig it. Yeah, it's called 2023 ad out there, ladies and gentlemen, right you go, and you either get it from jeff colemancom or you can download it, but we always prefer, when you purchase, a hard copy, am I right, or am I right? Yeah, and you know what? We have double vinyl, bro. Oh you do.
Speaker 2:that is magnificentinyl is key to a happy lifestyle Three bonus tracks, because I realized I only had three sides of a side, you know, of a double album Meaning 12 tracks. It's like 49 minutes, it's like three sides. So I need a little more. So you put some on there for the kids. Yeah, you know, you do what you do.
Speaker 1:You know, what's interesting is that, you know, I do love vinyl and people are like oh, bing bang, boom, it's the same. Digital is better. Remember that argument when CDs first came out oh, it's so much better. And when I was doing the comparison of the audio on the same sound system with the digital, high-res digital files versus the, the record and the record is. I always like to say, and I've said it before this very podcast, jeffrey, it's like when you're listening to the digital, it's like you're looking at a two-dimensional thing, but when you listen to vinyl, it's like you're amongst it, you're in it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I did that with the bonnie rate uh album years ago. My next door neighbor audio hi-fi guy at Macintosh this and that and basically he could press one button, have the levels match in his sound room and I could really listen to the difference. And the difference was when they put the vinyl was on, it was almost like somebody put a warm blanket around me. I had this beautiful fat sound in the room.
Speaker 1:That was just like gorgeous, you know, yes it's kind of like I, when I I grew up, my dad went kind of went through a midlife crisis and instead of going crazed he just went out and bought a stereo this is like late 70s and he bought a bang and olufsen you know, ultimate hi-fi with the, the heat sensitivity to turn everything on and off, and a Tanberg cassette deck and all this kind of shit and I kind of inherited it from my parents were moving that you could take the um, you could take the stereo, and at that point I hadn't listened to vinyl in a in a good while and I remember setting it up and just putting a record on and it's like, as you said said, it's almost like a physical reaction that you have and I almost got weepy.
Speaker 1:I was like oh, my god, there's that thing. Yeah, I didn't know I was missing, but it's totally there. And you, it's just. You know how we listen to music back in the day now. Of course some of it's a little bit um sentimental, but it there is. There's something going on there without it I mean also.
Speaker 2:you know, I did a podcast with a couple of gentlemen and one of them there are no other- podcasts Jeff, there are no other podcasts.
Speaker 1:What?
Speaker 2:I think his name is Hugh Stein, I forget his name, but he did all these album covers Right. So he said, within the podcast, he said how much is the importance of the artwork itself? And as you know, I know, you know, and I said, oh my God, it's everything. I just sat there and look at like the cover of the Black Sabbath, the first album, you know, and the eerie witch in there and you know, you just, and you get into all the liner notes and you're really looking at the stuff and it's big and you're holding it and you know, you take it to school and you show it to friends.
Speaker 2:And I mentioned to Hugh, I said you know, right away I went right to Rush All the World's a Stage and I said I looked at that cover shot of that equipment on stage over and over. I mean, I sat there and just stared at it while I listened to the record. He goes oh, you shot that from the balcony. I was like, oh, you did this record. I mentioned Permanent Waves and Moving Pictures. He goes yeah, and Moving Pictures was different. So it was great that I had no idea the records he had done back in the day and I just mentioned that one first, but it's so important, you know, to have the physical product in your hand. You know you have people who mastered and mixed and produced, and you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, just mix and mixed and produced. And you know, yeah, it just makes. And plus, I think these sides, the idea of listening to the programming of it makes you digest the music differently.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean, as you know I remember when I got an ipod and I had like 72 000 songs on there, I just kept digitally, kept switching. It's almost like it kicks in your add right exactly, yes, you don't get to the end.
Speaker 2:What is it? They say seven seconds now is all you get out of people, yeah, so the vinyl experience forces you to listen in order. You know, dark Side of the Moon, come on, I wouldn't want to be shuffle mode and flipping around, right, so it's part of the listening experience which is so important to you, know. It's experience which is so important to you, know, it's like skipping around in a movie. What's the point?
Speaker 1:Right, exactly so and the thing is, is that kids these days? You know we can get into that whole oh kids, but you know it's, it's one of those things where it's never going to go back per se. But as long as there's enough people that savor the difference, then we're good that savor the difference then we're good.
Speaker 2:Well, you know, vinyl started out selling CD a few years back and vinyl's been a generation no doubt about it, and it's, although you know.
Speaker 1:The only downside is with it is that they've genetically engineered the weed so much these days that there's no seeds and stems. So they don't have to worry about the ancillary use for the record cover, which is separating those unsavory particles from the true value of leafy goodness. Not that I know anything about that at this juncture in time, but back in the day, Clean and sober.
Speaker 2:For what Good 25 years.
Speaker 1:It's been 30 years. This year 30 years.
Speaker 2:What? I'm still a child, I still drink, I like it, but you know, know it'd be better if I didn't. But uh, I'm kind of boring you know what?
Speaker 1:I don't judge, jeff. I just I don't judge. I look at my own pathetic self and just try to reel in my own primal desires, which now basically involve caffeine and food and and musical instruments.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know it is fun making a record and I always enjoy yours and listen to. Uh. You know you always have all these wonderful guests on your albums and there was a record you gave me like six, seven years ago. It just blew me away. Can't think of what it is right now, but, uh, I always enjoy your work oh well, thank you.
Speaker 1:I appreciate that. I try to mix it up for the kids. Yep, yep.
Speaker 1:I do enjoy making the records. You know it's. You know it's one of those things, as you know. I mean, you get to a certain age and you think back I've been able to play my guitar and make a living for how many years? And knowing that, as as as the, as you know, as the years go by, you realize, yeah, you, you kind of think there's a certain level of meritocracy and certainly you know you practice to get to a certain level and you'd like to think you treat people well and things, just you know, happen as a result of that.
Speaker 1:But really it's luck and timing, because the world is not a meritocracy, it's a bullshit. And you just think back I get away with making the music I want to play and I do various things to make a living that you know allow me to do that, but it's still a big part of how I make a living. But anyway, we just get into the point where it's just so awesome to just make music you want to make and not feel that you have to be compelled to always redefine the lowest common denominator. You know what I mean yeah, do your thing.
Speaker 2:I mean, you know there's a funny story ed roth the meat bats, chad and kevin and ed. And uh, chad was gonna play on this chick tarja, she was from the band night. Wish, we're all sitting around in circle and Ed always has the best one-liners. And so Chad goes you know what? I looked up Tarja's genre of music before doing the session and and Ed goes. Yeah, what was it? He goes symphonic metal, ed goes there's an ass for every saddle Meaning meaning. Whatever you create, if you stand behind it and you're honest and you do your thing, people will follow it Exactly Ridiculous like GWAR. I think GWAR is ridiculous in every way, but they stick to it, they do their thing, they got their following Good for them. Yep, I like to say you don't need, but they stick to it, they do their thing, they got their following Good for them.
Speaker 1:Yep, exactly I like to say you don't need a million, you just need enough.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And that's all there is to it.
Speaker 2:He's like we cater to our fans. We know there's enough people out there that like Toto and we're not going to get new people and if we do, great.
Speaker 1:But we know how to cater to our audience. Well, what's funny is, if I play a night and there's not a whole lot of people there and people come up like man, it's like the place was packed, it's like you were playing for a stadium. I say listen, I play the same way whether I'm playing for 15 or 20 people.
Speaker 2:Your shows only seem well attended.
Speaker 1:Oh no, it's been going good. I can't complain. But you know you do have those nights where it's like hey. But you know what always makes up for it is, um, is the merch sales. It's like whenever you have a night where it's like hey, the crowd isn't the best. We made okay money, but then the merch table just always comes through. Jeff, it always comes through, and I worked that word. People like I can't believe you're working your own merch sales, like listen, I will sell twice as much. If I'm doing the merch sales, yeah, and I enjoy it. Plus, once you meet people and you're shooting the shit with them and all that kind of stuff, it's like you got them. You got them from there on in. They know it's like hey, I spent a little time with this guy. It was fun.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it's a personable experience, man. I mean, imagine me as a kid being able to go up to a merch table and hang out with Randy Rhodes. I mean that would I just pass out, exactly. I mean I can think of a million different.
Speaker 1:I mean, I remember seeing the Allman brothers for the first time and just like just being, oh my God, it wouldn't be cool just to talk with those guys, and you know you go up to the merch table and you it's like they're nowhere to be found. But nowadays, I mean people, you know, have access to people like never before and I think that's a, I think that's a good thing and I I always put I always make this point too is that, I think as a result of the videos where I'm just kind of myself it's not like I'm putting on airs, I mean you're, it's not like the camera goes on and I'm any different than I am in regular life, which is troubling. But you know, I remember hanging out once at one of these music things I think it was up in like that Cosmo Music up in Canada. You ever been to that? They kind of put like a little mini NAMM thing up there. It's kind of like Sweetwater Gear Fest or something like that.
Speaker 1:And I had to do this panel with a couple of different people and one of them was Eddie Kramer and me being a huge Hendrixite and Zeppelinite, you know, sitting next to Eddie Kramer was awesome and we were just kind of shooting the breeze and he was cool enough. But I noticed how people would come up to him and they were like super fan, like real. They were like kind of psycho, like can you sign it? Can you sign this for me, eddie? You know, when you were with Jimmy and it just was uncomfortable and weird, and then that same person would come to me and be like hey, greg, how's it going? And it was just like they were totally different people. It was like no pageantry, just hi, how are you? And I was like I'm so grateful that I, you know, I've managed to have that kind of connection with folks, because the whole you know star thing that people manufacture and you know what I mean that, yeah, I think it's just, it's not a natural phenomenon.
Speaker 2:I think that's why Neil Neil Peart never liked doing meet and greet. He never did them. But he doesn't want to hang with fans and hear that he's great. I mean he could talk on the side of the road, motorcycles with somebody and all day long and ride and whatever. But he doesn't want that on the star and you're the fan thing. He's not comfortable with that at all Right, which it's weird, man.
Speaker 1:I mean I've, I've, I've witnessed it next to people who are, as I said, like Eddie Kramer and stuff like that. I'm sure you've done the same thing when you're, and it's just, it's a little off putting shall we say?
Speaker 2:You know, I have a funny Eddie K kramer story. I was chad and I, uh, again chad, um chili pepper drummer. He's on the way, so he and I are I think it's maybe that hendrix listening party. Yeah, I had fender with janie hendrix, was you know one of these releases? Anyway, eddie's there, I'm talking and chad and I are talking with him and chad keeps bringing up kiss to him. You know he did work with kiss but, right, such a larger career than kiss, that'd be like the lower end of the talent pool. And so he cuts Chad off and he's very kind of dry and just to the point kind of person you know, and he goes. Why do you keep bringing up Kiss Chad's?
Speaker 2:like you know, kiss was my first concert, you know. Well, I love Kiss, you know, and he goes. Why don't you bring up, you know, talk to me something more valid. Let's say like Hendrix or the who or you know. And he's like well, what do you want to know about Kiss? He says Chad, they were horrible musicians. Then here's their best line ever, he said, with a dry delivery even their instruments were bad.
Speaker 1:And I remember he told a story in one of those again one of those Fender gatherings, and it was a Q&A thing, and he was told that he was looking for things to produce and he was given the choice of a few different things. But one of them was like you could either produce Boston or you could produce Kiss. And of course Tom Schultz had everything like almost already ready. You know it's like it was already done. And then he listened to Kiss and he's like I've got way more work to do with this other band. It'd be much more of a challenge and fun to try to to pull something out of Kiss than it would be to Boston. So he turned down Boston and went with Kiss, which is fascinating.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. And then he went on to talk about Kiss Alive. He's like the only thing we could salvage is the snare drum on some of the tracks. And we're like what do you mean? Alive is not alive. Oh my God, you know, chad's brother lives here in my hometown and I see him all the time. Brad, yeah, yeah, brad, you know.
Speaker 1:Chad's brother lives here in my hometown and I see him all the time. Brad, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Brad, I know you work with him a lot with all the Hell Letter books and yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, I think it's so funny about those two. It's like Brad is like the before and Chad is like the after when you look at him.
Speaker 2:I'm not sure, yeah, and I think Brad's the older brother.
Speaker 1:He looks more fresh. You know, the road is tough. Yeah, it is. It is. It has its moments. So, speaking of which, what's you? What are you working on right now? What's what's the haps? When is your next?
Speaker 2:experience. Every day I'm doing pr stuff for the record, uh, so non-stop. Uh I have some random like I just did a lou graham gig, tony franklin on base, yeah yeah, a couple random shows with him. I probably have like 10 shows with Parsons before I leave for Japan and I'm going to be in Japan for two months with Rapaport and some other fellas and in between that and as I mentioned to you, I want to just start doing as many shows as I can of my own stuff with my trio.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know, bowling night, dart night, whatever man I like it, I'll slum it anywhere. We just did a couple of shows. We played up in Escanaba, then we played outside of Chicago and then we played Toledo and they were all well attended, great shows and a lot of fun. And you know, not all instrumental. I sing a bit, kevin sings a bit. Yeah, yeah, kevin Chown, myself and Dave Pot have been a drummer from Escanaba, so yeah, the mighty Escanaba.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know it's fun to put some shows together. I'm down with that. Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:I think we complement each other well, you know. Absolutely no doubt about it. So yeah, why not? So yeah about it. So yeah, why not? So yeah, I've been working on that and, uh, I have a record. I want to do all vocal stuff to get some different singers. I want to hand pick the singers for different. Make it glenn hughes, phil maude, call them my rock star friends. You know it's a great singer, jimmy netko from the band hours. I want to get him on the record. I've got probably 20, 25, 30 songs sketched out. Some are done, some aren't, and got a couple with the great singer Robbie Wyckoff, who was hired by Roger Waters to do the big wall tour. When they did that, all the David Gilmour parts wonderful singer. So he and I have written a couple tunes together that will be on there.
Speaker 1:So where do you live again when you're back in the Midwest, is it in Indiana or is it in Ohio?
Speaker 2:It's Northwest Indiana, so it's a little town called Chesterton.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:It's 20 minutes West of Michigan city. Okay, yeah, it's great. I mean five minutes from the Indiana dunes national park, a little golf community. I don't golf, but you know, and people asked me when I moved there, like what do you think of it here? I said, well, I feel like I'm in witness protection. You know, it's like I find myself looking out my front window see if the neighbor's out there Cause I want to walk my dog and not talk for an hour. And you know, and part of that was because we're in covid lockdown anyway. So life was weird, right, right. So we my wife's like let's buy a house during the lockdown.
Speaker 1:I'm like, great, I just lost how much money well, you know, what I find is interesting is, you know, we just got back from just shy of a three-week jaunt and most of of it is on the West Coast. And you know we were in a few different towns. You know we started in like St Louis, did St Louis, kansas City, denver, phoenix, we played out in Venice West, we played down in San Diego up to Northern California, blah, blah, blah. But what I realized is that I can't handle all the people out there. It's like there's the traffic at any time of day is a complete shit show. It's just so nice. Coming back here, it's like, you know, the Milwaukee metropolitan area. If you include all the suburbs, it's like a little over a million people. But literally, from where I live, it's like 20 minutes, even at rush hour. I mean maybe, maybe a half hour, you know. But I just realized I just have no tolerance for the preponderance of humanoids.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean I just drove to Fond du Lac, wisconsin, yep, for a Lou Graham gig and it made sense to just drive and said I'm not going to go to Midway, and then you know, milwaukee, whatever. So point of all that is, we're in great locations for touring most of the country. I mean LA. It's like you got LA what San Diego, vegas, phoenix that's seven hours away. There's nothing in the West Coast.
Speaker 2:Exactly you really want to hit 10 hours from your hometown. I mean you can hit a lot of places, as you know Exactly correct, which is all good Now now, where do you play out in la? Is it like maui sugar mill, one of those kind of joints? Well, this time we play.
Speaker 1:I mean so far. We played the mint a couple times, and both those how you do this.
Speaker 2:Uh, let's see, yeah rub my eyes.
Speaker 1:Um, we played the mint a couple of times, and those were both good. And then we did, um, we did a thing at, uh, the baked potato, and that was a good one.
Speaker 1:The only thing that was weird about the baked potato was you know it was. It was. You know, obviously it's the legendary joint. I know you've played out there a million times and it's every one of their brother. It's like the place to play and the first time playing out there it's like you sold it out. I'm like awesome, what does that mean? You know? It's like what? 60 people in there, but but it was still. Hey, you know, both shows are, are, are sold out, like awesome.
Speaker 1:So then we showed up. We don't make them pay, look what. That just seems a little weird. So then I mean it was fun and it was a legendary joint and I had a good time.
Speaker 1:But then the next time we were coming out there, I did a bunch of those Cadillac Zach gigs, which is an interesting thing, because what's wild about his things is that you know, like you came in and sat in that night at the Maui sugar mill, those gigs are. They're always packed and we can announce those like two weeks before they happen, and he puts out a mailing list and they're packed, asshole to elbow, which is cool. The only problem is they're not really at venues per se. You know, they're at kind of like I mean, the Maui is a little bit more like an old-style club where there's a little stage and so on and so forth. But a lot of the other places are, like you know, the stages are improvised, which is fine, I mean, certainly I've done that plenty over the years but it doesn't really lend itself for the full balls-deep experience, right.
Speaker 2:I remember seeing Eric Gale's at Mama's Rib Shack yes, Makeshift floor pseudo stage. At one point he broke a string and he had no tech, no backup guitar. I ended up changing the string for him. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's the thing I'm like. Let me get this in the audience. Yeah, I mean, Mama's Rib Shack Great show. But you need a proper venue to feel the ball.
Speaker 1:So the last two times we've been out there we've played at the Venice West and that seems to be a good place. I know at one point I played the place in Hermosa Beach where Grant Green recorded that live, or the Lighthouse. That was kind of a fun joint, but anyway. So those are a few different. This last time we played Venice West and that was cool. We're still trying to find, you know, our spot in San Francisco. We've messed around with a few different places. Yeah, maybe Yogi's would that work for you. I think Yoshi's is the place we should be going to.
Speaker 1:The last couple of times we played this place in Berkeley called the Cornerstone Brewery, which is kind of this new venue. It's a cool venue, but we've just not really had the response there, as we did, like at Sweetwater in Mill Valley, which is Bob Weir's place. We did pretty well there and then we played once at the Boom Boom Room, which was down by the Fillmore and that was down and dirty. I actually kind of dug it. But yeah, we're still trying. I think Yoshi's would be the room.
Speaker 1:So it's like what we're finding out is that you know, you have these rooms that are rooms that people that like our kind of music are kind of just checking out the schedule for and are like, oh well, I like that guy, I'll come and see him at that place because I like that place as well as all the different stuff that I do to try to get our crowd out, whereas a lot of these places, if you're just showing up at like rando rock club, that has everything kind of across the board, then we're kind of responsible for bringing everybody in. You know what I mean and that's and that can be a bit of a challenge. But, as I said, we get done with the tours and I look at the numbers and we're making grown up money, no matter what, you know it all balances out and so we're just going to keep on keeping on by God and it's working and it can only get better.
Speaker 2:As I said, it's such a blessing that your son is your drummer. You know you get to hang and yeah, totally.
Speaker 1:And there's a lot of cool. You know telepathic things that happen rhythmically. It's just bizarre, you know what I mean? Well, plus, we've been playing just as the trio for so long now and we've been touring so much that it's just locked. And that's the thing I'm sure you could speak to it too is the fact that it's like you can put together really good musicians who are just top shelf A-list players, and it's always going to be good. But there's something else that happens entirely when you germinate with a set lineup for a prolonged period of time that can't be duplicated by just assembling the super friends. You know what I mean?
Speaker 2:yeah, yeah, I used to go see landau. I mean I still do, but um, he used to play with toss panos and jimmy johnson and toss I mean him and that trio is like second to none man, those guys and I love you know, gary, uh, what's his name? Novak? He's great drummer, but it's not the same as it is with toss, it just is. It's not as greasy man. You know, he's a little cymbal heavy. He's great and I'm being really nitpicky, but, man, you know, I understand what you're saying.
Speaker 1:It's great, but it's not.
Speaker 2:It doesn't have that other thing yeah, they had a thing that they that's, you know, just intangible.
Speaker 1:God damn it yes, one of these days I want to hang out with. I've talked to lando on the phone a few times and just never really. You know, we just kind of shoot the breeze every now and again with text, but I've never really had a chance to hang, which would would be awesome.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because he's just such a pirate. There are two different mics.
Speaker 1:I've heard there's one that if you add water it makes its own sauce.
Speaker 2:I'll just leave it at that. I dearly love him. He's a great guy and he's one of the greatest players period.
Speaker 1:Frank Zabala add water makes its own sauce.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he's a funny cat man. Yes, indeed, and your buddy's with Steve Lukather, right I?
Speaker 1:am. You know we got to be pals. You know I've only really hung out with him in person a few times again, but you know we just really hit it off. I mean, it was I think the first time I met him in person when we were shooting the shit. Uh was like on an am show or something. But then when he was in town with ringo and uh hanging out with him and I of course I'd known bisonette for a while and I knew colin hay and they were all on the gig. So next thing, you know, I'm in the dressing room hanging out with those three and then ringo walks in. You're just kind of like, you know, but then ringo's like totally cool and just we just start, you know, and it was totally unassuming, just talking shit. You know, it was fantastic. Yeah, that's the way it should be, that's right, that's right. But who needs the pageantry?
Speaker 2:I think I get a little giddy meeting ringo, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah well, it was just kind of funny, because I I remember at one point I'm talking to him and then I think I get a little giddy meeting Ringo. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, it was just kind of funny. I remember at one point I'm talking to him and then Bissonette was asking about my son. He's like, so, he's like, ringo, you know, Greg's son is a great drummer.
Speaker 1:Where did he end up going to school? And then we started talking about that and I just told the story about how we were in Italy and we were touring and we're staying at some hotel and we checked in a little early cause we didn't, you know, we we kind of drove in early, so it's like two o'clock in the afternoon. I'm going to go for a little walk, so nice day. I'm walking down the stairs, I open up the door to the lobby and there's Steve Gad standing there. I'm like what? And I was like, what are you doing here? He's like, well, I'm in town with my band. I was like you know, my son's your biggest, you know, he's the biggest fan of your activities. And then Lando comes. He's like Greg, what are you doing here? I'm like this is weird.
Speaker 1:So at the end of our gig and their gig, we all meet up in the lobby and we're hanging out, and you know. And Lando's like you saying to dad you got to see Greg's trio. No, no, no. I'm like this is surreal. And then Dylan takes a picture with Steve Gadd and is just beside himself. So I'm telling this joke, geeking out about Steve Gadd, and I'm realizing I'm telling this story to Ringo Starr. I'm geeking out about a drummer to ringo star, but ringo didn't miss a beat. He's like man. I'll never forget the time back in the day where I'm hanging out with steve gatton. We dropped acid and, you know, one thing led to another, but oh my god it was just the whole thing was surreal.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's beautiful though you know mike would be a good one uh, to do some double bills with he. He reached out to me years ago when I was doing meat bat stuff with chad. He's like we should do some shows together. Yeah, yeah, basically he was pushing me to like, if you make some stuff happen, that would be great. But then I was dealing with like four meat bats and then landau's trio and we could just never line up schedules.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, whenever you get anything lined up, it's like so, but I know he wants to do his thing more when I first got on this, uh, the first trio record that we did with this lineup was on that label in in, uh the netherlands, uh, mascot and, and they had, and landa had a record that had just come out and he's like boy, it'd be great if you guys could do some gigs together and we talked about it and it all seemed to make sense but could never get the timing right. So, yeah, it's unfortunate thing, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is a tricky thing he's out with. Uh, james taylor a bit, and yeah he's out with he did a couple random things with eric johnson down in austin. I saw that down in texas.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's right, we're headed down to Texas next week. Now, jeff, there's nothing better than going to Texas in August. It's just so cool and crisp, oh my God, can you imagine? Well, what's funny is that my youngest has joined the Air Force and he's in basic training right now, as we speak, in San Antonio. You imagine doing basic training in the summer in San Antonio, texas. Some people can die from that.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, come on, and they don't really care because it's basic training. They want to put you down.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they want to weed out the weak and only keep the hardy and savage. Yeah, it's pretty crazy.
Speaker 1:I always forget. Is it five children? I have four, so he's my youngest of four. I did not have that on my bingo card that one of my kids would join the military. It just was like I did not see it coming. But you know, he was going to school and put two years in. He was a biochem major. He's always been organized and interested in all kinds of different stuff. He's a chess champion and he played sex and he's like this likes that. You know his philosophy and all this shit.
Speaker 1:And then one day my wife calls me up and she's kind of speaking in hushed tone, she's like I talked to John. I'm like, oh my God, did he get a girl knocked up? And what? What is this? What is this whispering? He wants to join the military. I'm like what?
Speaker 1:So I mean, all said and done, he had sussed it all out. He's like, look, I'm not entirely sure what. I know what I want to do, and I want to go into the air force and do like you know, you know generators or something where I want to get certificates and all this different stuff. I can probably get my bachelor's degree while I'm in there and then after four years I'll have money to go to school and I'll have this. That the next thing. And once I realized that he was serious about it, had done all the research, it's almost like I got a raise because now I don't have to pay for his college. We interrupt this regularly scheduled gristle infested conversation to give a special shout out to our friends at Fishman Transducers, makers of the Greg Koch signature fluence Gristle Tone pickup set Can you dig that? And our friends at Wildwood Guitars of Louisville, colorado, bringing the heat in the shadow of the Rocky Mountains.
Speaker 2:You know I agreed to do this podcast because I'm going to ask you for a loan at the end my daughter's apartment that we just got. Oh man, I'll tell you what.
Speaker 1:I get it. Kids are expensive, oh my God. Yes, well, I have two at home. Back are back at home.
Speaker 1:My daughter, who is living up in Minneapolis, got a job down here and but she's been singing and writing songs and so she came back down here. We're working on a record for and she's starting to do some gigs by herself and she's got a good gig and it's fun having her around. And then my daughter, who's the actress that does all kinds of different stuff. She's been on the West coast for a couple of years now and so she just moved back and she's kind of you know, figuring out her next step. So I've got two at home, which you know figuring out her next step.
Speaker 1:So I've got two at home, which is kind of fun, actually, cause when I go off on the road then my wife has someone to hang with while I'm gone, which is good, yeah, cause I'm out with the boy causing trouble. That's right. We're just feasting like warriors at all times. I got to say, you know, I used to be able to put away the food, and I've. I've had to. You had to cut back of my devouring ways because I don't want to be Jabba the Hutt. None of there's anything wrong with that, but he's 29, so his metabolism is still roaring along yeah.
Speaker 2:He's taller than you are right.
Speaker 1:Well, he looks taller than I am, but when we stand back to back we're the same height, so we're both 6'7", but he's got hair and he's a bigger dude, the same height.
Speaker 2:So we're both six, seven, but he's got hair and he's a bigger dude, you know he's got more.
Speaker 1:He's a bigger dude Anywho, so uh, but he could feast. Like. There's this in Venice beach. There's where we, we always stay with this really nice couple down in Venice and they put us up at their place and and right over there on Lincoln Avenue or whatever it is, there's a Lincoln Boulevard, whatever the fuck it's called. There's this, a street taco vendor that has the Alpastore that they cut fresh. They got a big vat of the of the carne asada, yada, yada, yada. And we go there like twice a day and when they see my son son coming, they just start going 10 taco, 10. Because he goes up and he'll say I want 10 tacos and a burrito. And then he finishes that and then goes back for more and they're just sitting there shaking their head. I'm like, yeah, welcome to my world.
Speaker 2:He's a I remember my husband, my buddy dan, and we're like last call at steak and shake. At two in the morning we get a walk in line. He could see the grill man. He said, hey, grill man put 13 patties on that grill. And I'm not joking and I was a vegetarian at that time. It was me and his two sons. I'm like Jesus, 13 patties, that's a lot of nourishment. Yeah, it's good for you a lot of nourishment.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's good for you. Well, probably not a grill man, and I'm not kidding. So have we talked about in your days in toledo? Were you a tony pacco's man? Oh yeah, yeah, I love that joint. Good god, almighty. That's another thing when we're traveling we got to go to, when we travel through toledo, we always got to go to tony pacco's and feast.
Speaker 2:you know toledo is like the test number one testing ground for new restaurants. So everybody go to Tony Paco's and feast. You know Toledo is like the number one testing ground for new restaurants. So everybody comes to Toledo A lot of people don't know this to test out their restaurant and see if it works, what works. So there's so much food in Toledo, ohio, it's unbelievable. That is great. There's some pretty great places. There's a fish house downtown you just die for I mean you, you know the fish collar and all this. I mean it's just unbelievable that's the power of toledo.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know. Do you still have family there or no?
Speaker 2:um, you know what I mean. On my father's side everybody had passed away, but on my mother's side there's cousins. I mean they each have like 10 kids and their kids have kids, and I can't even keep track of these people. So yeah, you know, I have a couple of uncles on my mom's side there and cousins. They're all still there. The thing about Toledo is people never leave Toledo. It's really blue collar. You know my wife it's like everybody she grew up with. They all went off to school, college, purdue, in Toledo. We were like fans of Iron Maiden and Black Sabbath and you know, most of the kids just go into a skill center and get a job at Ford or Chrysler. None of them ever went to college. College wasn't even an option, you know. So for me I just saw music and, okay, I got to get out of Toledo. You know you're going to die there. It's like Detroit with less options.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well the thing is too.
Speaker 1:I was kind of making a joke in my own head, as I do. Uh, you know, when you're from a town that's not a music town per se it's like you'll never. You know, like people say to me, it's like, well, how come you know, this and this and this in town doesn't take, you know, because you don't really get the respect in your hometown. I mean, I can't really complain because I've I've had a good run, but there's still times where it's like they'll have this festival or that festival and it's like, do I really need to pitch myself for that? You know, I've been around for so long.
Speaker 1:And then someone goes what's the deal with people, you know, in your hometown not respecting them? Like, listen, if you want respect in your hometown, you got to leave it. That's the only way you're going to get respect in your hometown. And then by the time you go out and you do and you make it elsewhere where you're able to make a living elsewhere, then you don't really give a shit what the hometown thinks and it's just like a place to visit. And you know, in my case, come back, raise my kid. I mean, I probably play in town two, three times a year and, as I said, I've had a good run, but there's plenty of different festivals and things that happen that we don't get called for anymore, and it's like the better you do outside of your hometown, the less they give a shit about you in their home, because if you're not in front of them every day, you know what I mean. They're like well, they're gone, okay.
Speaker 2:All right. Well, if that's the way it is, yeah, it's like a catch-22. You, but Toledo is a music town. I mean, it was a great place between bands that were playing Detroit, chicago. They would always hit Toledo on a Tuesday or off day. And I mean, even like I've seen Narciso Yippies, I've seen, you know, classical guys, rock guys, you know the Chick Corea Acoustic Band of Peristyle, downtown Right, so we'd see everything.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And if it wasn't in Toledo, I'd go to Detroit. I remember seeing Segovia in Detroit. I mean, everybody comes to Detroit, right, detroit Rock City, that's right. Wow, I love your Johnny Winters shirt. Oh, thank you.
Speaker 1:You're the legend. There's this cool website called bluescentriccom and whenever I need stuff for touring, you know cause I like to get wear nice shirts and stuff like that, but you know I'm a huge fucker so I can't find shit that fits. And then if I do and it's got long sleeve shirt, I can only really wear that in the wintertime, cause in the summer like we just got done being out West and we're going to be the great decision to go down to Texas in the middle of August it's like I'm going to sweat my balls off. So I just got to find cool looking t-shirts that I can wear on stage, and so they had a bunch of cool Johnny winter shirts and they got a bunch of cool Hendrick shirts and and then I send away to the Allman brothers museum has some really cool shirts, so I send away for that and then, you're.
Speaker 1:so you just kind of, they're cool, but they're t-shirts and then of course you know, laundry-wise they're easy to deal with.
Speaker 2:So I've kind of just yeah, I had a t-shirt on and I was like I'm not sure what this says. And then it could say, like you know, I love young Japanese women, or something I don't know if we'd appreciate that it could say something dirty. It could say anything. Know what? We're coming to your area with alan parsons um october 10th.
Speaker 1:sure, the venue, but it's on his website and then because I won't be home until we're coming back from the uk on the 12th. Yeah well, I will just miss you. Other than that, it would be great to get together, as we did last time you were through, or time before last you, I and dan tracy went to a couple music shops we did indeed. I believe we feasted at some point, did we not?
Speaker 2:probably we partaked partook, partake, partook you know, I found a place, d martino's. Yeah, yeah, ah, and we invite. We ended up inviting them to the show that night. They were wonderful people, the father and the daughter and you. They run the whole joint. It's wonderful, was it?
Speaker 1:Eddie Martini's or D Martini's?
Speaker 2:D Martini's, Okay, yeah gotcha, I think it's D Martino's. D Martino's, yeah, it's like south side of Milwaukee.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:On the south side over there one time oh hey, on a counter I made a Fargo reference when I was in Escanaba on stage I was like why did I just do that? Funny at all.
Speaker 1:I don't get up to the UP very much.
Speaker 2:It's beautiful up there, but yeah, there's a place House of Ludington you should play and Kevin Shown does a regular thing there and it's like the oldest hotel in Michigan.
Speaker 1:Oh, no, kidding. Yeah, there's a lot of Finns up there, finnish folk, apparently. There's like counties up there where the signs are written in two languages English and Finnish, which I did not know. Ken Haas, our friend from Reverend Guitars from Toledo, ohio, his kin are from up there, so he goes up there and goes to those counties where it's thin is the second language. Now you're still endorsing Reverend, right? I am.
Speaker 1:I've got a new guitar coming out in a few months, as a matter of fact, and then the cock amp as well. You know what? I'm not doing that anymore. I reached an amicable dischargement, if you will, from those folks. It just wasn't panning out for a few different reasons and I started working with the Tone King people. I had been using a Tone King Imperial at Wildwood for years, but they have this new Marshall-y type of device, the Royalist, and I've been using the single 12 combo with a 112 extension cabinet and that sucker sounds good. So it's more of a Marshall-y thing which I dig.
Speaker 1:I kind of go between two things. It's like you know. I'm sure you're kind of the same way. It's like you know, turning an amp all the way up, it always sounds best. The second option is preamp. Distortion is the next best thing. Yeah, for applications for live use and consistency.
Speaker 1:Set the amp cleanish and use pedals, am I right? Yeah, yep, so that's where I've pretty much on with this. I mean, occasionally I'll, like on the beginning of this last tour, cause it's a two channel amp and it's got attenuators for both channels, so you basically just turn it up and it's got the setting where you can be like JTM 45 or like, um, a 1972 Plexi, and so I'll use the clean sound to be more of the JTM45 and kind of dime the second channel, and so you're overdriving the power amp and then turning it down with the attenuator. But let's be honest, after three songs those attenuators are ineffectual and I've just dimed it. And then the only problem with that, of course, is that there's no effects loop. I wouldn't use the effects loop even if it had it, but um, so I got to turn the delays way down, so they're just just like a little bit of something, yeah and um, but then by the end of the tour it's just like I'll set it clean and just hit the pedals from there and be done with it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was quandary you had some awesome when I played your rig you had some awesome when I played your rig.
Speaker 1:You had some awesome gain stages.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it's more of that than a different effects. Like, I don't even have a chorus pedal on my pedal board, you know, it's just not my thing. Chorus is really my thing, right. But yeah, different gain stages. You know, use a Marshall. You can always backline a DSL JCM 2000. I go to the clean channel.
Speaker 2:Put the grid in just a little bit, right, just a hair right, just enough to compress it a little bit Exactly, and the pedals react the way they do with my old Mark II Marshall Right. So it always works and it's the only thing that works.
Speaker 1:Are you a reverb guy or do you like delay instead?
Speaker 2:I like both For rhythm't stand. You know, having delay on rhythm it's messy, right. Oh, uh, you know solos, yeah, like gary moore kind of. You know right, nice little tape echoes helps me sound better. Um, but I love, I love verb, you know, yeah, yeah. So I saw a, a program within that free the tone pedal board.
Speaker 1:Oh, I got you. Yeah, yeah, yeah 150 pounds.
Speaker 2:You know I can get my sound within two minutes, right away. Basically, I can go anything from like a clean Eric Johnson to Edward Van Halen, Right, but it's still my sound. But it's definitely, you know, crosses the gamut. I mean, who's going to bring like three amps out on a tour, Like you know? I mean, if you're a Johnson, it works for him. But I needed to figure out how to do it within one amp. Right, I get it, you know and people always understand all the details.
Speaker 2:I'm like hey, it took me years to figure this out. You think I'm just going to tell you. You know, it's not like I'm guarding, but at the same time, like you know, get your own thing. People are not going to sound like me anyway. You know, if you played my rig, you'd sound like you, Right, you know how it is? Yeah, absolutely, you know. Holsworth changed his gear all the time and he always sounded like Holsworth, Exactly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, it's kind of funny. We did one gig on this last tour that was in this basement at this cool club. There's a cool club in Portland. I don't know if you ever played it, but it's called the Jack London Review. I would recommend that. It's a cool, joint, cool listening room and they had a twin. So we're like, why load our stuff in, we'll just use this? And yeah, so I set the twin, I had it like on three and then I just used pedals from there. But what was so funny is I was so used to not using reverb and then my buddy, brian Kehoe, when I was in Berkeley, brought me out one of those MXR reverb pedals which just and I put that in the chain just added on a little bit, which was nice. But man, when you haven't used a Fender reverb for a while and you hear it's like on two, it's like way too much. It's like, oh my God, yeah, I wanted a little reverb. I thought two meant little. It's like it's crazy.
Speaker 2:I remember you, you looked at my settings on my twin for a Fender event. You're like it's great, I remember you. You looked at my settings on my twin for a fender event. You're like it's the same settings I use, like we, yeah, yeah, the range where it was, and the treble and the boost and yeah, all that. You know, if I had to just backline something other than that marshall that I use, I mean if I had an old hand-wired twin with pedals, it sounds amazing. Yes, you know, original 60s twins are just fantastic sounding amp.
Speaker 1:Absolutely Another one. I don't know about you, but I used to always love 10s. You know I loved them in super reverbs. I love Vibraluxes. But then something happened. Well, you know, when I started playing with this band, with Toby and with Dylan Dylan hits a little harder than any other drummer I've ever played with, and of course Toby, that that B3 gets ruined I realized I need, I need 12s, I just need that bigger tone. And uh, after years I plugged into a pro reverb. I'm like, I always love supers, but a pro is basically a super. With 12s it sounds fucking awesome.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's what I use when I play locally. Yeah, yeah, yeah, the old 60s pro yeah because 50 watts is a lot. Yeah, I love the super reverb. You know, with the 10s, with the strat in the studio, it's great, but live, you know, when you start adding distortion and humbucker and it's. I need 12s Right 12s do a thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know, it was funny. It's like years ago I remember I got to be friendly with Danny Gatton a little bit, right, and so we talk on the phone every now and again and I'll never forget him having the same conversation. He's like yeah, you know what? I'm tired of using 10s. I need to start using 12s again. I'm going to start using my tweed twin again, which I just thought was interesting. It's like everyone kind of goes through this thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what was he based out of? He was from in the DC area, okay, and we had done a show with him at shank hall, of all places here in milwaukee. Yeah and um, we just hit it off. He was so cool and nice and complimentary and I still have my legal pad where I wrote my set list. And he he wrote with a sharpie his name, address and phone number saying call me anytime. And I've got a upholstery sign and a buddy of mine framed it and and it says Greg. Um, you're fantastic and that's no bullshit, danny Gatt. Oh, I frame that. Yeah, I frame that, some bitch dude sweet he's a god man.
Speaker 2:What up? He'll just, you know, smoke anybody.
Speaker 1:I mean, he's just guys what was so great about it, too, is that you know how it and you see a lot of guitar shows and there's people that understand how to play great and entertain and there's people that just play great and you just really have to be into it in order to be really entertained. But he understood how to entertain and it was fun as fuck and he was great and he was funny and of course it was awesome. And, yeah, fuck, and he was great and he was funny and of course it was awesome and, um, yeah, he used a tweed twin and it was not quiet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but that's another thing I always talk about in these things is that you know, you, you go into these clubs nowadays, especially if you're in europe and you just get read the riot at for playing. You know a 50, a 50-watt amp, that's barely on. You know, god forbid you'd use anything more than that. But I'm thinking, jesus Christ, people used to tour with Marshalls all the time, you know, and come into these clubs with stacks. I mean, what did they do then? Yeah, you know, people are. You know they have a very different attitude of what's acceptable as far as volume these days, and my motto is just let the bands do their thing. And if you know what they do and you've hired them, just let them do their thing and tell people to wear earplugs.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I get to throw off a pretty good volume on stage with Ellen Parsons Sometimes they'll put the Plexi in front, but I'm moving a lot of air and the bass player as well, but basically we're the two that are pushing off the stage, which is nice and and the sound man's fantastic and he loves guitar in the mix and so excellent.
Speaker 1:Good, yeah, it's great I love it because I was visiting a buddy of mine who was teching for a for, uh, chicago, as a matter of fact, and I went and said, said hi to him, and there's literally nothing on stage. There's nothing other than drums, you know, and percussion. Everything else is, is, you know, direct, and there's no, there were no monitors on stage, so it's all you know earbuds and so on and so forth, and I understand, and I understand the quality control and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 2:It's a little weird, though. I mean, a buddy of mine went and saw Def Leppard and they're, all you know, using like Fractal or whatever that is, and you know it. Just there's like nothing coming off the stage. And recently Neil Sean switched instead of using Marshalls and all that he's, he's, he's went to the dark side, we'll say, and the guitar's just not cutting through the mix. Right Play with Toto. Luke's got his Wagner.
Speaker 2:He still uses the bomb distortion pedal. Yeah, there's, yeah, yeah, yeah, he loves that pedal Anyway, but his sound off the stage and through the PA is just cutting right through. And then, neil Sean, it's like you're hearing all this delay. It's almost like his sound is going to ascend and then it's just affected and then coming out like you're not getting this dry in your face signal right. I mean we could have a whole podcast on moving air and you know you're not going to replace amps for me, no way. Yeah, I'm with you.
Speaker 1:I don't know if you ever go on threads, which is like the um, you know, there's there X, which is the old Twitter, and then everyone left that to go on threads and there's all kinds of discussions and I don't engage in any of this shit, right, but I, you know I, but I do see it as I'm scrolling through and you know people get into these.
Speaker 1:You know long discourse of you know, uh, oh, this is just as good as that. You know, as far as the fractal stuff, it's gotten to the point where you can't even tell the difference and it's like you know, just like we were talking about earlier. It's like you can hear the difference between vinyl and digital. It's as real as the day is long and there is a difference between, yeah, you can you know if you're not paying, if you're not comparing it to anything. You probably get an awesome sound with these digital things and so on and so forth. But it was like for me when I was using the CyberTwin years ago. It's like I got a great sound out of it, I recorded stuff with it, it sounded great.
Speaker 1:And then one year or one time I was off the road and I went to a gig and I had the CyberTwin set up and then I brought my super reverb and put it right next to it and I plugged into the super reverb and goes oh, it's like you hear the difference immediately. There's a whole different thing that happens. So it's one thing to say, yeah, because of the. You know the situation we're in, where you can't crank. You're playing with a band or you're playing it. You know that doesn't play very loud or can't play very loud, or you're living in an apartment and you can't turn it up. I totally get it, but there will never be anything to replace the sound of an amp turned up, and there shouldn't be, because that's part of why we do this is to be loud is to move polyps.
Speaker 2:The idea of being able to tame the beast when you're playing at a high volume is a whole technique in itself. Right Now, you have kids where I get it at a high volume is a whole technique in itself. Right now, you have kids where I get it, they can. They're playing through a fractal or a kemper and there's nothing. They're not fighting anything. And then they'll even put a hair tie on the headstock to I don't know, because they have to mute, right? You're never going to see me do that either. I mean, right, it's cool, but a lot of these kids, if you had hand on my rig or your rig, it would be a effing mess, because they can't tame the beast, they don't know how to play at loud volumes and mute and properly.
Speaker 1:You know so you know, you know sometimes you have. There's a certain setting where everything's on as far as your gain stages and it's all your hands and just micro turns of the volume pedal between complete bedlam and sustain and clean. You know what I mean. It's all right there and anything could happen and that's the glory of it. But to quantize everything into this perfect sheen of just the right amount of delay and the perfect volume and compression, it's like you know it just takes the pirate right out of it. Frank.
Speaker 2:Marino wouldn't be doing that. Nope, you listen to Stone Live. It's like massive. You know All our heroes. Come on, edward Van Halen. Early Eddie, there's no way you're going to get a fractal sound like Van Halen 1.
Speaker 1:No, that sound was glorious. Or you know, I listened to a ton of old Hendrix stuff, especially was. Or you know, I listened to a ton of ton of old hendrick stuff, especially a lot of bootleg stuff and sometimes the the, just the tone. Live was so devastating but chaotic. I mean you never knew what was going to happen. But yes, that's the glory of it voodoo child live.
Speaker 2:it's like, oh, I'll hear versions that I've never heard before. No, I almost have to pull the car over because I'm having such a physical reaction. What I'm hearing on the radio. Right, I remember Let there Be Rock ACDC some live version. I'm like the guitar tone is so mean, man. Right, jesus, pull the car over Jeff, that's right.
Speaker 1:Lord, have mercy. Well, listen, my friend, it's been an absolute blast. Thanks for taking some time and I want to tell everybody to go out and get your new record, yep 2023, ad jeff coleman, get it favorite. It's a, it's a magnificent offering violence, violence. I can dig it and I hope to see you soon and let's talk about doing some gigs yeah, sounds great, greg all right my friend, you have a good one.
Speaker 1:Take it easy, all right. Cheers, bye, cheers, bye-bye. Bye-bye, folks, thanks so much for tuning in. We certainly do appreciate you stopping by and partaking in the most savory chewable gristle this side of Cucamonga. Gregory cock, looking forward to seeing you again next week, even though I won't actually see you, but I'll sense your presence. Bye.
