429 Why Self-Awareness Is a CEO’s Real Competitive Edge: Lessons from Les Csorba, Author of Aware

In this episode of Partnering Leadership, Mahan Tavakoli speaks with Les Csorba — senior partner at Heidrick & Struggles and author of Aware: The Power of Seeing Yourself Clearly. Drawing on decades advising CEOs, boards, and leadership teams, Les makes a compelling case that self-awareness is not a soft skill but a strategic differentiator. With leaders facing complexity, speed, and pressure unlike anything in recent memory, Les argues that the ability to see yourself clearly has become a true competitive edge.

Throughout the conversation, Les breaks down why so many successful leaders overestimate their self-awareness — and why that gap grows as they ascend into larger roles. He draws from extensive leadership assessments, behavioral research, and personal experience to show how blind spots quietly shape decisions, team dynamics, and organizational culture. His insights on the “CEO bubble,” the tension between intent and impact, and the way digital validation dulls reflection will resonate with any executive navigating today’s environment.

The discussion also explores practical ways leaders can strengthen their self-awareness without resorting to vague platitudes or one-time exercises. Les shares stories from his own leadership journey, examples from well-known CEOs, and a grounded perspective on how to build cultures that make honest feedback possible. His framing of courage, humility, and reflection feels less like theory and more like leadership discipline.

Finally, the conversation touches on timely challenges — from AI’s influence on leader behavior to the importance of understanding one’s “shadow” as a driver of organizational culture. Les brings a balanced, seasoned voice to these issues, offering clarity without overconfidence. For CEOs and senior executives committed to leading with greater impact, this episode offers a set of insights that are as practical as they are thought-provoking.

Actionable Takeaways

• You’ll learn why most leaders dramatically overestimate their self-awareness and why the gap between perception and reality grows as responsibilities increase.
• Hear how to distinguish between internal awareness and external awareness, and why the difference between intent and impact is where many leadership breakdowns occur.
• You’ll hear why honest feedback rarely reaches the top, and what the best CEOs do to counteract the “bubble” that forms around them.
• Discover how small habits — reflection, solitude, and the “to-be list” — can sharpen judgment and strengthen leadership presence.
• Hear how blind spots form and why naming them isn’t enough, and why building a “courage muscle” is essential for behavior change.
• You’ll learn what leading researchers and leadership assessments reveal about the traits that help executives mobilize, execute, transform, and stay agile.
• Hear how top leaders like Jamie Dimon, Warren Buffett, and Elon Musk approach their own blind spots — and what that means for every executive who wants to keep growing.
• Discover why AI makes self-awareness more important, not less, and how understanding your wiring becomes a safeguard against unintended influence.

Connect with Les Csorba

Les Csorba Website 

Les Csorba LinkedIn 

Aware: The Power of Seeing Yourself Clearly 

Connect with Mahan Tavakoli:

Mahan Tavakoli Website 

Mahan Tavakoli on LinkedIn 

Partnering Leadership Website

Transcript

***DISCLAIMER: Please note that the following AI-generated transcript may not be 100% accurate and could contain misspellings or errors.***

Mahan Tavakoli: . [00:00:00] Les Csorba. Welcome to Partnering Leadership. I am thrilled to have you in this conversation with me.

Les Csorba: Thanks for having me, . It's good to see you.

Mahan Tavakoli: Can't wait to talk about your book. Aware, the Power of Seeing Yourself Clearly. But before we get to that list, we'd love to know a little bit more about you. Whereabouts did you grow up, and how did your upbringing contribute to the kind of person you've become?

Les Csorba: . My parents were both Hungarian refugees. So , they grew up in sort of Soviet controlled Hungary , in the forties and the fifties and in 1956. , My dad was 15, my mom was 12. they made their way to Canada where they met in a Hungarian community. that's where I was born. I was born in Canada to Hungarian immigrants refugees. And my story really has been shaped by their story and their hardship and frankly their sacrifice that they made for me. My brother, I have a younger brother. So I grew up in Canada very [00:01:00] close knit family.

And eventually made my way to the university of California Davis in the, 1980s where I studied, I was naturally interested in history because of my parents' background and political science. And that was during the the Reagan years. And was able to work in Washington one summer , as an intern in the United States Senate during the Reagan years.

And ultimately that led to a very fortunate situation working for. President George Herbert Walker Bush and his White House in the, office of Presidential Personnel, which is how I got into the recruiting business. And I loved it. I mean that opportunity exposed me to some really interesting leaders.

Obviously people that came from the private sector to work in government. So ever since then, that's probably 35 plus years ago, I've always been fascinated by leadership. Any, the impact that leaders have on their teams and on their country and their organizations, and that's how I fell into the business I'm in today.

Mahan Tavakoli: You've had great experience in government and [00:02:00] then private sector in recruiting, seeing what works in leadership, what doesn't work. What got you to realize that self-awareness was a real separator for leaders.

Les Csorba: I know you do a lot of work in the leadership space and coaching. Self-awareness is nothing new. I'm not breaking any new ground. , The wisdom of self-awareness has been around for centuries. The ancients, had talked about self-awareness.

Socrates to know thy self was considered one of the great aims of life. Marcus Aurelius said that we should be tolerant above all, be tolerant of others and stricter with ourselves. And of course, the Psalmist David said, search me, oh God, know my heart. You could go back.

And ancients talked about the wisdom of self-awareness. What's new about self-awareness today is we're at such historic low levels. So it's really a reminder of how important self-awareness is. I think it's the greatest tool that a leader has for transformation. And I guess, to answer your question more directly, [00:03:00] probably about, a 8, 9, 10 years ago, I noticed there was a lower level of awareness just with the leaders that I work with.

I think myself I noticed some blind spots then I read a book, written by Tasha Uric called Insight, why we Are Less Aware than we think we are written in 2018. She did a study with Harvard, showed that 95% of people think they're self-aware, but the data shows that only 10 to 15% really are. so that kind of confirmed my experience. But then I dug deeper and I wanted to know what our data at he said, we did a study. A couple years ago of 75,000 leadership assessments, the three sixties and all the psychometrics our numbers showed that the self-awareness among leaders was about 13%.

So it confirmed we're at low levels. And that's really what I wanted to write about. And really, I don't wanna focus so much on the negative. I wanted to focus on the opportunity. If you think [00:04:00] about it. If we can get those numbers from 1315 to 2030 or 50% awareness, think about how much better all of us as leaders and organizations and teams would show up accelerate our performance.

So that's really the argument of the book. Yeah.

Mahan Tavakoli: It is an opportunity, as you say, Les. In order to be able to take advantage of that opportunity, we have to be open to recognize it. We all see ourselves as being self-aware. So what do you think it takes for us to recognize that? Maybe what you're talking about applies also to us. It's not just about other people.

Les Csorba: It's an interesting question. It's funny because when the book came out. This year it was available on pre-order in April. And so I got a lot of calls and texts from friends of mine saying, oh, it's great. You're writing a book on self-awareness. I know exactly the right person who needs this book. And of course, I thought to myself. maybe before you, remove [00:05:00] the spec from your friend's eye, you might consider, removing the log from your own. So there is a bit of an issue there is a disconnect. We're deceived or diluted into thinking that we're self-aware and the way I would define true self-awareness, it's not just being aware of . Your motives, your aspirations, your strengths, your weaknesses, that's what you know, I would call internal awareness, but we also need to be externally aware. In other words, how are we showing up with others? How are we perceived with others? Because sometimes our intent is not the same as impact, right? We may be landing differently than we think, and that's where I think you have a disconnect between our own awareness and how externally we're being perceived. And so what I argue for in the book is, organizations have to be intentional about creating feedback cultures. We as leaders need to be constantly interested in how we're showing up giving permission to the people close to us in our lives to call out our blind spots, to be able to accept that with [00:06:00] humility. And like I said earlier, it's the greatest tool that we have for change growth and transformation.

Mahan Tavakoli: I wanna touch on a couple of elements that you mentioned, Les. One is that feedback culture. , Most of the CEOs I interact with believe that. People are open and give them feedback whether that's the case or not. So from what you have seen, what are the elements that the best leaders incorporate in making sure they are really getting honest feedback?

'cause part of what I see is when people get feedback, they come up with all kinds of rationale and excuses in the back of their minds. And after we have conversations of why the feedback is not really. Relevant. There's a huge element of denial in there. So what practices do you see that actually make that feedback more impactful to the receiver?

Les Csorba: Yeah, that's such a insightful question. I would say just applying my own [00:07:00] self to this question for years, I would say decades, I was identified as the classic people pleaser, which by the way, is probably the most common blind spot in corporate America today. I think 52% or more now identify themselves as people pleasers, has a lot to do with our digital culture and the constant validation and so forth.

But I remember. 25, 30 years ago one of my managers said that, I would never really make it as a leader because I was always interested in being liked and people pleasing was holding me back. And I initially dismissed it , because this particular leader was not very credible and he was terminated year later.

And so I wrote it off, right? I didn't take it seriously, but then, the firm. Considered me to be a high potential. So they did these three sixties and these assessments. And of course, all the data came back that I was the classic people pleaser. I was it was hard for me to have tough conversations and I avoided conflict, et cetera, et cetera. So [00:08:00] over time it took me some time to realize that it was holding me back. You can't lead if you wanna be liked. That's me personally. What I've tried to do is make sure that my team always has permission, not just once a year or twice a year during performance reviews, but all the time, whether it's after a meeting, or a pitch to provide feedback and know that they're not gonna be criticized for it.

I'm gonna welcome it. And so we have that two-way feedback loop, if you will. I would also say that leaders, it's hard because as you rise, as you ascend an organization, particularly if you become CEO, you know there's that term known as the CEO bubble, you think you're more aware.

But actually the opposite is happening because, you tend to, people tend to think your stories are more interesting, your jokes are funnier. You just, so you've got to make sure that you surround yourself with contrarians. Do you have somebody on your team who's [00:09:00] wired to be a contrarian versus a sycophant? That really helped. By the way, Ja, Jamie Diamond does that very well. He's a great example of that. There's so many CEOs that I could talk about that, that are intentional about surrounding themselves with contrarians. So those are just some of the ways to make sure that you're getting and then you're receiving it well.

And that you actually have vulnerable conversations where you can actually talk about whatever blind spot you have, and then you know what you're doing to actually show up better.

Mahan Tavakoli: That recognition, matters, and then how you receive it, as you said, makes a huge difference. I just wrote a piece less about a magnificent CEOI worked with in my first leadership team meeting. I disagreed with him on something substantial and after the meeting he wanted to talk to me.

My heart sank. But he sat down and he thanked me and said, that's what I want to see in our team. And that wasn't the only experience repeatedly, [00:10:00] he really encouraged that kind of pushback. So I find that adds a lot more value. There is value to three sixties, but the leaders showing that they're willing to take feedback, accept it, and really appreciate it, makes a huge difference.

Les Csorba: I think that's all anchored and hinges on humility, and how you view yourself compared to your peers. Often say that leadership isn't leading above others, it's leading among them. so you have to start with that baseline if you have sense of superiority or self-importance in leadership. You're probably not gonna take that feedback very well. And frankly, that in and of itself is a blind spot. Those are the hardest leaders to work with. And usually, there's something else going on. There's some insecurity, there's something they feel like they need to prove. They need to have command, they need to have control. so as coaches, you and I, we have to figure out what that is to help them [00:11:00] break that down so that they can develop a humility. And realize that the reason they're leading is not because of their own personal power or aspirations. It's they're leading for the followers. They're, leadership, the way you define that is, is you're leading others and trying to get them to a virtuous destination.

So it's it all anchors in on humility and whatever a leader can do to develop that humility. And I talk a lot about it in the book, by the way, serving others, being involved in the community selfless character. All the things that kind of break down our pride will really help us to become more humble and receive the feedback with open arms, 

Mahan Tavakoli: it requires a disciplined approach less, I joke about two different things. One, I think social media. Counters that effect unfortunately in that we celebrate leaders or glamorize the wrong things. And on the other side, and I have some friends in this [00:12:00] industry, I talk about the leadership award industrial complex where.

We are constantly recognizing leaders because there is a lot of money for various organizations to do that, and therefore leaders of organizations are consistently being told how great they are. And any feedback contrary to that seems to not hit the mark because everyone's telling me how wonderful I am.

How dare you have a view that is different than that.

Les Csorba: agree. I think there's a little bit of an issue in terms of the way we celebrate leaders who are in charge, or CEOs, , we make the attribution error. We attri attribute too much to one singular leader versus, as most organizations are led through a team of teams and not through one command and control leader at the top. That, that is a bit of a problem. I do also agree that the digital culture has [00:13:00] been very damaging particularly be just because of the constant validation and the dopamine that we get from all the mentions and the likes and the notifications. We're all instant celebrities on, whatever social media platform there is. so we have to be aware of that. It goes back to my argument by the way, it dulls reflection, it dulls awareness, when we're constantly focused on how we're, either distracted by the digital things.

And so that just requires another discipline and leadership to be aware of the dangers. Now, by the way I, I love. AI and all the information we're constantly learning. It makes us more productive and more efficient, but we also have to be wary of the unintended consequences and how it impacts the way we lead and show up with our people and our teams. Yeah.

Mahan Tavakoli: And in order to do that will, I love the fact that you say leadership isn't about controlling others, but controlling [00:14:00] once. Being able to do that requires a different mindset and for us to be able to focus on it. So would you say are the practices that it takes for us to develop that greater self-awareness?

Les Csorba: We obviously talked about giving people permission in your life to provide feedback. That's number one. Number two, I think we're so focused, in our free market capitalistic system, which I love by the way, and, I embrace I'm the biggest free market capitalist.

The danger, of course, is we're so focused on tasks, right? And we're and we, all the productive leaders, we all have our to-do list. So I do focus in the book on encouraging leaders to focus more on your to be list versus your to-do list. So what do you want to be? Do you wanna be more kinder and empathetic? Do you wanna be more patient? Whatever it is. And so I think that's a mindset, sh mindset shift. I also think being deliberate about solitude and getting [00:15:00] away whether it's on a weekend or it's carving out time your day for thinking time and reflection. I think reading, is important.

I think getting unplugged, when you go walk or you go run, instead of taking your AirPods, just think reflect. Those are all healthy exercises that I think build reflection and self-awareness. So not just the feedback, giving permission to people in your life, but also some of these other exercises. You might call it stoicism. The idea that we just get away. In solitude and silence. I think those are all healthy disciplines for a leader.

Mahan Tavakoli: So Les, how do we know we are making progress towards that and where our self-awareness is at? As you mentioned referencing Tasha Yuri's. Research the vast majority of us, 95% or so, think we are self-aware. While anywhere 10 to 15% are self-aware. How can we measure or understand our [00:16:00] own self-awareness and our progress . 

Les Csorba: I can only apply it to myself, going back to my people pleasing, which has been a problem for many years. And so it's one thing to name your blind spot like I did. It's another thing to have the courage, the courage muscle. To to show up differently.

So for me, I have, I have a scorecard internally of how many, difficult conversations, I've had in the course of a week. Am I, sharing blunt truths? Am I having tougher conversations, obviously with grace and kindness, but, and and then of course, asking, others am I showing up differently? Is that people pleasing, tending to fade away? And it's just like any other muscle, right? If we work out or if we run. The more you do it, the more it grows, the stronger you get. That would be one way to measure, are you really being courageous in engaging whatever that blind spot or flaw is? then you can do your own sort of internal measurement, but you can also externally ask others how you're showing up. For [00:17:00] me, my spouse, my wife of course of almost 40 years does that for me. She, reminds me when I'm, being direct and when I'm not, or when I'm beating around the bush.

So those are always good measurements. We all have our own ways of doing that and it's a work in progress in terms of becoming more and more aware. but, those are just some of the ideas that I share in the book.

Mahan Tavakoli: And it is a journey. There is no end point to it.

Les Csorba: Yeah.

Mahan Tavakoli: It's consistently recognizing that we have blind spots trying to find what those blind spots are. And I love the fact that within a blind spot that you had found,, you have come up with specific measures or specific ways to see whether you're making progress in that or not.

Les Csorba: , The bottom line for all of us as leaders and managers of people is and I, make this argument in the book the best of the best leaders to me do not view themselves as the completed, finished product.

They're always working on something. I mentioned Jamie Diamond earlier, he is almost 70. He's been in the chair 20 years [00:18:00] of, he is arguably the most iconic CEO in America, and I was with him. In April and he, I was just struck by how he's still working on stuff, showing up, being more empathetic, maybe cleaning up his language.

He sometimes emotes and gets emotional about certain issues, but the fact that he's naming it and talking about it and in those issues, even at, almost 70 years old pretty remarkable. And I. I love that about leaders. Warren Buffet, who's probably the most iconic investor of the last century. He talks about his blind spot over the years as he's so loyal and he's so nice that he tends to move slowly on moving out underperforming managers. That's been a an issue for him. Elon Musk, who's such a fascinating. Leaders had such impact in so many different industries.

Talks about his pathological optimism, which is a strength, but as if it can derail, in terms of unrealistic expectations on your team and deadlines that are hard to meet. And so I just love that leaders [00:19:00] like that talk about their blind spots and they're working on them and they're vulnerable and talking about it.

I think that's half the battle.

Mahan Tavakoli: Whitney Johnson also talks about kers of leadership. I see a lot of leaders that. Flatten out at a certain point. The ones that you mentioned continually go through new s-curves of leadership, in part because they recognize that they need to consistently be looking for those blind spots, consistently strengthening themselves and moving on Now.

At Hydric and Struggles, you've spent a lot of time there. Obviously you work with some of the top candidates in placements with top organizations. You also have a metamodel, mobilize, execute, transform, and agility. How does that connect to self-awareness in leadership?

Les Csorba: Yeah it's based on years of research. The meta. Model. , Basically we call 'em the super accelerators of high performing companies, tend to have leaders that [00:20:00] are high in mobilization, high in execution, high in transformation. then of course the multiplying factor is agility.

The ability to adjust and pivot. we call that the multiplying factor because it's just so important, particularly in our complex wor world that we live in. But I think going through our assessment, which is based on the metamodel it basically would reveal to you whether you're, lower, let's say on the mobilization scale, which is about shaping strategy or. You're a little less innovative. So all of those things just reveal certain areas that you might need to spend more time on. And on the agility piece, whether you need to develop more resiliency, it's all about, dealing with a setback and getting it back up on your feet and moving forward.

Some people have a hard time doing that, they struggle. That metamodel would reveal to any leader whether there are any shortcomings. By the way, it also reveals strengths. I don't want to just dwell on the negatives. Awareness is important in [00:21:00] leveraging your strengths and capabilities and turning them into amazing superpowers. So the awareness plays a part there as well, 

Mahan Tavakoli: In doing that, you also work a lot with boards. Placing the right CEO makes a huge difference. leader. Leadership in an organization models the behaviors that they want to see. How can a board think through the self-awareness of the candidates they are assessing for CEO.

Les Csorba: The board should have exposure to top internal successors to the CEO. They should be spending time with those individuals and developing a point of view of whether. Those perspective CEOs can command a room obviously they're gonna lean on management, in terms of some of the tools that are necessary to identify gaps. In development areas. You might have a candidate who's strong on the financial side, but needs some operational chops and some experience. And so they may [00:22:00] recommend, rotating into an operating role or maybe rotating into more of the investor relations or capital markets exposure.

But principally at the end of the day, a board's responsibility is really around CEO succession.

Mahan Tavakoli: Doing that well makes a huge difference. And I know you've seen it throughout your career. . Now you end your book with the Raven Rules.

In your view which ones would be most impactful or relevant for leaders? Now as we are going through less a significant transformation where a lot of leaders are overwhelmed and feel off kilter.

Les Csorba: So the Raven Rules really is a metaphor. I share a story in the book. About a magpie, which is part of the Raven family, the beautiful magpie bird that we see in Colorado and other parts of the country the raven is considered to be among the most self-aware animals. They can , recognize [00:23:00] themselves in mirrors.

They're highly intelligent and so I use the raven and specifically the magpie. As a metaphor around self-awareness. And so that's where the concept of the Raven rules came up. And there's lots of rules. One, I think that gets to your question is the idea of flying in a flock and is safer than being isolated on your own.

So there's a story that I share. One of my, of my dogs that I would take out walking in the morning for years was trying to. Knocked down one of these mag pies 'cause they kept swooping in and just toying with the dog, knowing that they would never be knocked down. And one, one year, I think it was last summer, one one magpie got away from the others.

And my dog lept up at perfect timing and knocked it down and, brought it back to the cabin. and the point being that, it's better to, to stay close to the flock instead of being on your own. And so the idea is for leaders today, particularly in the complex environment where they're so [00:24:00] busy, need to depend and rely on your team, most importantly and lead through your teams not just always feel like, you have to be the one to make all the decisions.

That's just one concept that comes from the Raven Rules that I think resonates with me personally. This shift from independence to interdependency in, in, in leading organizations is really important. And I think the best leaders who learn how to lead through their teams and empower and push authority down tend to show up the very best.

Mahan Tavakoli: It is very powerful being able to lead in that collaborative leadership. You mentioned team of teams. I love General McChrystal's book on that as well, in that it's a very different mindset than many leaders and many organizations operate under. So that's a great way of thinking about it. The other thing, Les, yuval Noah Harri author of Sapiens, talks about the impact of [00:25:00] AI and says that in part. We need to get to know ourselves a lot better if we want to have a chance against AI controlling our emotions and getting to know us better than we know ourselves. Would love to know your thoughts with respect to both the need for this self-awareness and the impact AI will have on self-awareness.

Les Csorba: Yeah. That's such a big question, we are all using and leveraging ai. I'm, always on different tools 'cause I'm always learning. AI by the way, has a tendency to be very flattering, by the way. And we have to guard against, because it's like any algorithm, right?

It wants to, bring you back in and draw you in and so you have to guard against that. But yeah, I think that the advent or the acceleration of AI in our lives is going to force us to ourselves more [00:26:00] clearly. Like I said earlier, it's not just a matter of knowing your strengths and your. Your flaws, but to go a little bit deeper and understand you are the way you are, and so if you're a micromanager, you're very controlling. You need to know where that comes from, like what is driving that. Me on people pleasing, I traced it back to, my parents' divorce when I was 16 and my mother dying very suddenly when I was 18.

And all that contributed to my wanting to fit in. And once I understood that more clearly it, it was easier to deal with. I didn't, I wasn't so consumed with it. So just like any other issue, I think a leader needs to spend some time in and solitude to understand they're wired the way they are.

And I think that's the best defense against whatever AI is gonna throw at us.

Mahan Tavakoli: I actually wrote a short piece I'm gonna put up this [00:27:00] weekend by the fact that first of all, the fact that AI is so sycophantic maybe that's what we look for ourselves, and that's what we reward. So as leaders, we need to be mindful of that,

Les Csorba: Yeah.

Mahan Tavakoli: as you're saying, it's going to require us to really get to know ourselves even better.

So if every CEO. Listener was to take an honest looking in the mirror tonight and ask themselves one question, what would you want them to ask themselves?

Les Csorba: I would want them to ask, first and foremost, how do you really want to show up with your team? There's this concept of the shadow of the leader. We all carry a shadow, which reflects the values, our motives the things that we really believe to be true that we carry that around every day.

And we get to decide what our shadow's gonna be. Decide. What your [00:28:00] shadow's gonna be and work really hard to make sure you're reflecting that every single day. I think if we just took that fundamental step that would be huge in terms of awareness because as the shadow you cast will filter down throughout the organization, right?

It's just like any culture, right? The whatever you model at the top of your team or your organization or enterprise is gonna ultimately reflect throughout the organization. So you have to be intentional about who and what your shadow speaks and what it says. So that's what I would. Encourage every leader to ask themselves 

Mahan Tavakoli: it's a powerful question and a powerful practice that I think more of us need to engage in where we actually take the time to reflect on that less

Les Csorba: Now , I don't wanna suggest that it's easy because, I talk about in the book the concept of, ego depletion. Sometimes we show up as our very best at the beginning part of the day. And we treat whether others [00:29:00] kindly and we're inquisitive and, curious.

We're not judgmental, but by the end of the day, we're tired and we're weary, and then we, we might not show up in the way that we want show up. I'm not suggesting that it's easy, but I think we're aware of what we want our shadow to be, and we apply that discipline daily.

More often than not, probably gonna show up as who you want to be. And and that will reflect well throughout the organization and people will wanna follow you more willingly and make sacrifices on not just your behalf, but on behalf of the organization. 'cause at the end of the day, it's all about, shareholders and employees and other stakeholders.

It's not about the leader. 

Mahan Tavakoli: Les. I've worked with hundreds if not thousands of executives and CEOs over the years . And I have to tell you, self-awareness is one of the biggest challenges that I see us having in leadership. And as we move up in organizational [00:30:00] hierarchy. The less self-awareness in most instances, part because our experience and success confirms that we have been right and part because, as you said, our jokes become funnier.

People like us more and give us the kind of feedback we want to hear.

Les Csorba: yeah. I often say that what you are aware of you can control and what you're unaware of, controls you. And so if we can make it part of our task to be more self-aware about how we're showing up, and you can apply that awareness in so many different things. It could be, situational awareness.

It could be just I just feel like that's half the battle is to understand that, if you're able to name your strengths, your capabilities, and your flaws in an open and candid way, you can control those things, and but if you don't, you're just, we're so busy, right?

We just, we probably never even think about the whole concept of self-awareness, but I think if we spend some time thinking about it and applying it, , we're gonna be much better off.

Mahan Tavakoli: To be able to [00:31:00] do that well, it helps to. Read your book and follow your work. So where can the audience find out more about Aware and follow your work as well as.

Les Csorba: Yeah. Thank you for that. Where the power of seeing yourself clearly is available with most retailers. Amazon. Barnes and Noble target. You can also get more information from my website, which is just less Shoba, L-E-S-C-S-O-R-B a.com. I have a self-awareness scorecard. On the website it's 30 quick questions that anybody can take which will give you a little bit of window into, how your self-awareness is, where it would be rated. It's not empirical or anything but it gives you a little bit of a baseline. Yeah. I'd be delighted if listeners and those in your audience would grab a copy of the book, that would be great.

Mahan Tavakoli: , I think it's critical for all of us. It has been critical to leadership. It's going to become even more so in the years ahead. [00:32:00] Now, I want to close with a line that was also highlighted in Arthur Brooks' endorsement. Of your book, which I love in that the goal for a leader isn't to control others, it's to control oneself.

Real power begins with the courage to look within. Thank you for giving us some thoughts and framework on how to look within. Thank you so much, Les. Yorba.

Les Csorba: So nice to be 

with 

you. 

Mahan Tavakoli: Bye.