Beneath Your Bed Podcast
Beneath Your Bed Podcast
Yule Monsters and Good Saint Nick
It’s that time of year when you might spy Santa’s sleigh sailing through the air. But are there any darker spirits afoot? Tonight we’ll discuss the legend of Krampus, the Yuletide evil man-beast who comes to punish the wicked. Along the way, we’ll also look at Santa’s origins in St. Nicholas of Myra.
Have a topic suggestion? Email us at beneathyourbedpod@gmail.com
It's that time of year when you might spy, Santa's sleigh, sailing through the air, but are there any darker spirits, a foot tonight we'll discuss the legend of Krampus, the Yuletide evil man beast who comes to punish the wicked along the way. We'll also look at SANAS origins and St. Nicholas of Myra.
Speaker 2:Hey there, Jen. Jen, how are you? I'm actually doing really well. How about you? I'm doing great. It's Wednesday. Yes, it is.
Speaker 1:It is. And it feels like this week is going really fast and that means we only have what, two and a half more weeks until our winter break. I can hardly wait. Yeah. What are you going to do? What are you going to do on your break? I don't have any plans other than just staying home and relaxing pretty much what we've all been doing, but that'll be really nice. I don't, I don't have any plans either, but Mardi thinking about, you know, what we'll do on Christmas Eve and Christmas day, mainly thinking about what kind of food I'm going to make. I'm looking forward to our friends, giving that we've decided we're going to have, and in July, that will be amazing. Do you think we'll be able to get together by then? I think so. Yeah. We're hopefully going to be vaccinated by then. So it's going to feel so good to like, just all be together. Like to have friends in the house again will just be the best feeling. Um, December is a good month. I just wish we would get some snow. I would love a good three feet of snow, but speaking of snow and a movie, um, I watched Krampus for the second time this weekend and I love the snow in that movie. I mean, it's, it's the other kind of thing where it's almost suffocating the whole neighborhood. There's so much snow and it's so wintry, but it looks like heaven to me. I watched the two last weekend. Did you? I watched the woman's Toni Collette and that's the one I watched and the guy who was from parks and rec who played Ben? Yeah, I liked him. I think he's really cute. I'm excited because we are getting our Christmas tree tomorrow night. I can't wait. You're getting a fresh one, right? We are. We are. Um, I know you think that I should take my husband to a place where he can chop it down and feel really mad,
Speaker 2:But I don't, I don't know where that is
Speaker 1:Around here. So we're just going to go where we always go to this nursery that has, you know, they have really nice trees and they're really nice there. And, um, so we're going to pick it out and I think we're going early enough that we will have a really good selection. So I want to get a really big one this year, just because everything else sucks when as we'll have like this big gorgeous tree. So I guess we should talk about what we're drinking. And I have to say, I have like, literally have like one sip left in my glass. It's really sad. Um, because it's maybe the best drink that I've made in a long time. Can I tell you what it is please? So it's a peppermint Patty, which is one of my favorite candies, by the way. I love do you, you don't like mint. I don't think I would like it in a drink. Well, I never thought I was a fan of sweet desserty drinks, but so this is a peppermint Patty martini, and it has equal parts of Godiva, chocolate liquor, some creme de mint. And then the other part that you put in is half and half so equal parts of that, shake it with ice and a cocktail strainer and just pour it into your glass. And I garnished it a little tiny wedge of peppermint patties.
Speaker 3:It was so it's so delicious and it's super Christmas-y. What was the first ingredient?
Speaker 1:Um, the Godiva liqour the chocolate liquor. Um, it's really, really good. I think you could really get drunk on these without realizing what you were doing
Speaker 3:After your, your, you had several undrinkable drinks, right? Or a couple undrinkable drinks. I E yeah, I had one that was just awful. It was,
Speaker 1:I hate a lot of money. Like I spent$75 at the liquor store for the ingredients and I make it and I can't even drink it. Yeah.
Speaker 3:The worst drink that I made was unfortunately, it's my favorite drink right up there with a French 75. I love my ties. You do love though. When I made it, the ingredients started to separate from each other. Wasn't it kind of like a brownish color too. I am. I had to write down my ingredients because there were so many because you're drunk because I'm drunk. I told you, you're
Speaker 1:The queen of making drinks with tons of ingredients.
Speaker 3:This has a ton in it. And I haven't had one in a long time. This is the most ingredients. I think I've made a drink with, well, what is it? So I'm having a zombie. It has light rum, dark rum, orange carousel, OJ, passion, fruit. It has lemon Grenadines and bitters. Oh my God.
Speaker 1:That is a lot of ingredients. Now, when you say passion, fruit, do you mean juice or like liqour
Speaker 3:Ideally you would make your own passion fruit puree, but since, I don't know, but where the hell do you buy a passion? Per se? Since I don't know where the to get passion fruit, I don't order it through Amazon. It's infused with passion fruit, but it's basically sugar. It's really just sugar. Is this glossiness. It might've been responsible for the terrible by Thai, but Oh, and then also I forgot you can float one 51 on top of it, which I tried. No. What does that does that vodka? It's either one 50 or one 51 again, excuse me. Cause I've I finished him as his guns draws. I'm drunk. It's a high proof rum. Oh.
Speaker 1:And it floats on top. How interesting.
Speaker 3:Ideally it floats on top, but mine kind of partially on top of a flop, but I tried, you should try to light it on fire and see what, how I didn't even think about that. I'm going to try that.
Speaker 1:Well, don't really know. Don't really do, I'm do it tonight. I was not serious.
Speaker 3:I told you, I said no.
Speaker 1:If you do, you need to get the fire extinguisher handy.
Speaker 3:For sure. I hadn't eaten dinner tonight. So I had to eat some crackers. It's not serving me. Well, let's put it that way. You need to eat something to eat something. I have, have maybe a quarter of my drink left, but it's diligent. I don't have any, and I'm. I'm about it. Your husband make it. I yelled for him and he's he didn't answer. I think he went on a wonder. Why upstairs answering you either.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So we ha we've had our drinks, at least I've I've had, you're still working on the rest of your, so do you want to jump into tonight's story? And this is, this is our holiday episode. So we're going to both kind of, who's starting. Am I starting? Yep. You're starting. You're
Speaker 3:Talking about me. What do you mean having too much to
Speaker 1:Drink? Oh, I thought that went right over my head. All right. So tonight we're going to be talking about some Yuletide monsters and I'm going to start out talking about Krampus. The history of Krampus is really hard to pin down like his origins. I just wanted to throw out there though. My husband had started calling me Krampus, like around my peak, because I'm a real, like, I'm a real joy to live with and I'm a monster as well. We haven't been cramped as he's really, he's really scary. Yeah.
Speaker 3:He is really scary. And also wanted to mention too. We're going to end on a good note with
Speaker 1:Nicola. So yes, and I don't think Krampus is all bad. I mean, I hate children Krampus. Isn't the nicest to kids. So I, I feel like Krampus and I are on a good understanding. So a lot of what I'm going to be talking about tonight is from a book that I found called Krampus. It's got the longest title Krampus in the history and lore of the mythological figure who punishes children during the Christmas season is not the craziest title it is. And it doesn't have an author. It says it's by Charles river editors. It was, it was one of those books that like, they print it after you buy it. Have you ever gotten a book like that? Like it's only printed onto me. And so it'll have the date as like the copyright date or the printing date in it. So I don't think it's on the bestseller list, but it was very informative. I have to say, I learned a lot about Krampus in it. Krampus. He's also referred to as the Christmas devil or the demon anti Santa, his origins are hard to determine, but he definitely comes from Europe and probably central Europe, especially the mountainous regions where the name originates. It could be from the middle German word Corolla, which is meaning it means claw or in this sounds a bit more likely to me, it could be from a word called crampin, which is a Bavarian word. That means something that's withered or lifeless. So something, something dead. So I thought that was cool. Krampus might be a bastardization of the Norse goddess hella. She also goes by hell, but I'm just going to call her hella. And she's the Norse goddess of death. And she's supposed to be the youngest child of Loki. Who's the God of mischief and fire. And she's an interesting goddess because she has she's Chris split in some accounts, she split down the middle in another's like she split from top to bottom. And when I say split, I mean that like her upper appearance is really beautiful. And then her lower half is disfigured. Oh, I thought you meant like, like she's not in two pieces, but it's just the two, the two sections of her appear very differently. The upper half is apparently beautiful. Like she looks like a young maiden has flowing blonde hair really gorgeous, but her lower half, not so hot. So she, um, she has rotting legs and they're decaying and like worms are crawling in and out of them. So pretty gross, like around what time period was, I mean, this is from Norse mythology. So that's, pre-Christian I'm sure. So hella is said to have been disfigured by her father and how that happened is that she was part of this awful ritual. And I don't know what he was trying to do, like what he was trying to summon up or what he was trying to do with this ritual. But he took her any bound her by her limbs and half submerged her in the water and just left her there for days. God, when low-key comes back to get her, she's basically at the edge of death. So he gives her this heat, tilt her head back and he administers this potion that revives her. So she's among the living, but there's part of her that's forever. Like her lower half is completely atrophied and Rodan. And so she becomes kind of this, this liminal figure, this goddess of the underworld and she's the queen of hell Haim, which is the North realm of the dead. And it was said that she loved to eat the souls of those people who are bad or wicked. When you say Norse mythology, Norse, meaning from like Norway and the Scandinavian countries. And a lot of this I'm I know you're such, you're so enamored of Iceland and really want to go there. A lot of this mythology is a lot of Norris mythology. I don't know, probably because people from Norway and the Scandinavian countries went over and settled Iceland. I think I don't my history. There is not the greatest. You'll see a lot of like Norwegian legends or I'm sorry, Norse legends in, um, in Iceland to the reason I tell you about hella is because some origin stories suggest that Krampus is the son of Hela. And then I did read somewhere that there was another, um, belief that maybe he is her romantic concert. So maybe he's like her boyfriend or something. He's the person who brings her drinks. So one night, each year, according to this mythology on the coldest winter day, Krampus was allowed to leave the underworld of eternal cold darkness and mist. And he would leave the underworld to come up to earth and search for wicked children. You know, I was thinking about that and it kind of parallels Santa who wants
Speaker 4:Might a year, right. You know, one night a year, usually. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Cold night it's December. Although he goes all over the world. So I guess some places are hot, but Santa leaves his realm of the North pole to deliver gifts. But two good kids, you can already start to see how Santa is kind of like the other side. So the other person that I want to talk about in relation to Krampus is somebody called[inaudible] and I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly. It may be perked up, but I'm going to call her purse. We hear drumming. So you don't care. So some of what I read said that she, that Krampus might be a descendant of her and she was a shapeshifter and she had two forms. And this is, this is kind of like, um, frown, frown, something, no hella. So th what I'm about to tell you about for our purchase sounds a lot like hella. So she had two forms and one of them was a lovely maiden. And then the other one was a hideous crone. And she also apparently had one really oversized foot. I don't know what that's about, but I think that it is very randomly random. So she was very concerned that people celebrate her feast day and she would get really off if you didn't. So if you didn't set aside work and, you know, engage in frivolity on her feast day, um, she would get really. And what she would do is she would slice, open your stomach, pull out your guts, and then, then the hole to the hole in your gut, she would fill it up with straw and garbage. And then I guess, so you back up, but that was what you got. She, um, she was scary. So she, she expected you to refrain from work on her feast day, but every other day you had to work really hard or she would punish you. So she, he was real dead really. Um, and one of her nose was broken stone and one of her worst punishments was reserved for children who lied. So she would take shards of glass. And can you guess what she did with them? Put it in their mouth. Yeah. So she sliced out their tongues because they told a lie. On the other hand, if you were a good kid, you might get a silver coin left beside your pillow. So you paid to be good. Like God, some people think that Krampus actually originates from Purchas. And I'm going to try to pronounce this shown Preston and Shia perished. And those are her Phantom entourage of beautiful souls. Those are the shown person and then ugly souls, which are the Shia Kiersten. Um, so Krampus was one of the ugly songs sadly for him. And if you look at his picture, you'll, you'll see that reflected in how he's portrayed, but the ugly souls were those people who were unbaptized. And I guess that would be me cause I've never been baptized. And they appear as monstrously Harry, and they have rows of sharp teeth, a human torso and the legs of a horse or a goat. So Persha, and then her entourage of souls, she would sweep into the human realm two times a year. So once was during the 12 days of Christmas, and then once on her feast day, which we've already talked about how important that day was for her. I actually don't know what day that is. I better well find out because if I don't observe it, then I might get my guts know, let me know. I will, because I feel like we need to observe it this year. So some people suggest that, um, Pusha and Krampus are romantic partners. I think I said earlier that Krampus and hella might be, but that's not right. I was, I was confused. So Krampus might be like her, her man, her. Yeah. So Krampus, his feast day is coming up. Do you know, do you actually know the date? It's really soon. Can you guess December six was you're so close. You're so close, but you're you're wrong. And so Krampus is going to get you because it's December 5th. Oh, okay. And some people say that Krampus may also owe his origins to something called the wild hunt. I don't know if you came across that in any of your reading, but with the wild hunt. Yeah. With an age, with any age within H 10 within eight, during the wild hunt, apparently fairies elves and spirits, all of whom were led by Oden, who, I don't know how to describe Odin, except he's the Norse equivalent of Zeus. He's the big honcho head honcho. So they would come into the human world. And this was a really scary time for regular humans, regular mortals. So it was best to stay inside. You know, you cover the windows with a black cloth because they're actually, they're looking for souls and they can suck out your soul. And if they do that, then you'd be damned forever take part in their processions. So in order to kind of confuse them, people would engage in what was known as Mummery. Now, my first experience with Mummery was when I lived in Philadelphia, because they have something called the Mummers. And have you ever heard of them? No, such a Philadelphia thing, but I'd never heard of it before I lived there. Mummers like, they dress up and really fantastical costumes and they do this crazy, like almost like a strut thing. And they all marched together, but marching is the wrong word for it. Like they would be in parades, but they do these crazy dances and it's just, it's got like a whole history and it goes back really far in the idea was that you dress up in costume, you chant you dance. And you're basically trying to camouflage yourself from the spirits or the gods. Now what this reminded me of when I read it, I don't know if we have any listeners out there who watch or used to watch the walking dead, but there's this scene early on in the series where Glenn, one of the characters, I remember this vividly, he's stuck in this whole hoard of zombies. Plenty of that. Your drinking is on beach tonight. His only thought about how he can save himself and not be attacked and eaten is to despise himself as a zombie. So he pulls out there's somebody who's dead or something. And he pulls out like their entrails and like drapes, the large intestine, the small intestine around his neck and like covers himself and like blood and guts and then kind of lurches around, like, he's one of the zombie hoard and they, they totally miss it. Like they think that he's one of them. So that's how he survives. So that's kind of when I think of the Mummers, that's kind of what they're doing. They're trying to pretend like they're one of these bad monsters, so that there'll be left alone by hella by Krampus. Yeah. Well Krampus. And then also all these souls that are coming to earth from the wild hunt, it's kind of a Motley crew. So some of the costumes people would wear, they would do old man winter. Um, they would dress up as the horned goat and then later Krampus and then even Santa or Saint Nicholas, this is kind of cool because the practice is still ongoing. So Mummery still happens in Europe and then increasingly here in the United States. And there's something called, um, I'm going to talk about it later, but it's called Krampus loaf, which means the Krampus run. And I'll tell you in a little bit what that means or, or what, what, that's all about. One cool thing about Krampus that I read is that in some versions he's missing his ears and that's related to a belief that he was born that way. And the reason he was so evil was because he couldn't hear the screams of his victims. I have how it's really fascinating. That's to me, that's basically saying like, he's so mean because he doesn't have empathy. Now, some Wiccans say that Krampus is the offspring of the horned God of the witches. And I read a little bit about the horned God, and apparently he predates Satan and he was considered the Lord of life death in the underworld. And he was always crowned at the winter solstice. So really he's, he's the figure of, well, it says he's the Lord of life and death, but I think of him because he, he comes about a winter that he's got of that dead time of year. If you've seen the movie Krampus, you'll remember he's portrayed, he has all these chains around him. And I thought that was, that was kind of interesting. And I read, read a little bit about the chains, but before I go into that, something that made me think of was one of your favorite books, which is a Christmas Carol, right? You love that book, but Marley, he has those chains around him. And I thought, Hm, is that kind of out of the Krampus lore? Maybe there's so much overlap between a lot of these things there really is. And that's, that's why it's so fun. But it's been said that the chains could be a Christian overlay, so that like Christian lore was put on top of this pagan lore. And the idea of the chains was trying to bind the devil. But other other sources say the chains are actually related to a pagan initiation, right? So who really knows what the meaning of the chains or the Roman conquests in the fourth century meant that more Germanic tribes were being converted to Christianity, but there were so, so Krampus kind of took a hit during that time. You know, the, some of the oral tradition died out as Christianity took over, but there was still some holdouts. So especially villages that were far apart, you know, that were way out in the wilderness that not everybody was converted. And so the Krampus Loris survived and was passed down orally, um, different regions. I said that cramp has comes from really central Europe. So I'm trying to remember all the countries. So like Southern, I think Southern Germany, parts of Italy that, that sort of border on the Alps parts of Switzerland. And then the Czech Republic think even Romania, I feel like I'm missing a big one, but I might come across it later. So these are the areas and also Norway, different regions kind of describe Krampuses appearance and backstory differently. So there are a lot of different regional variations, but what did he look like? So if you haven't seen a Krampus figure, if you haven't seen the movie think of like, kind of this animal human hybrid, is that, why is that how you would describe him, John? He looks, I guess you could say he looks like a humanoid, a bit of a humanoid, I guess. Yeah. Like in very, with an emphasis on kind of animal, like, like he's covered in fur. He super hairy in his first kind of matted. He has cloven hooves. He's got really long claws. The upper half of his body looks more human. Like he's got this broad chest, but his face is totally animal. So he's got like this pointed chin kind of like almost like a goat looking kind of face. His mouth is all snarly. He's got yellow eyes usually. And then he's got these big horns or antlers, but one of the most notable things about Krampus is he's got this really long tongue, almost like a snake's tongue. And he can just like hurdle that tongue out and he can be, it's really long it's it's like kind of lewd, actually a serpent. It is like a serpent. Yeah. And apparently he would, um, he could use the tongue to like lasso children and like bring them up to him. Did you? I thought that was crazy. That would be horrifying. Apparently has very bad, I guess, dental hygiene, oral hygiene, because he has bad breath. And he slobbers, I guess, with a tongue that long who wouldn't slobber and other, other sources say that he smells like sulfur, which we all know why that might be because it's related to hell. Um, and he, he has that long chain. Sometimes they're lost children who were attached to the chain. So that might be another reason. You know, we were talking about whether the chain was like a Christian sort of addition, but it could just be a practical thing. Like he needs somewhere to put all these kids he's capturing. So he just hooks them to his chain. He also had Cal bells attached to him. And that was so you could hear them coming. I don't know why. I mean, you would think he would want to be silent, but I guess he wanted more cow bell and he carries Birch rods and an empty sack or draws or reads well rods or reads really either one, just like basically big switches. Like what my mom threatened to whip me with when I was a kid I actually got whipped with. Did you, well, I think the only time I got whipped, but I think she used her hand was when I, I crossed the street and I wasn't supposed to she'd like whipped my. Well, she pulled my pants down and whipped me in front of all my friends. It was horrible. Like everybody. So my bare told me that one out of, I feel like I told you that I got the switch when we were all playing in the woods, it was raining, but
Speaker 3:Like young, I don't know why we're allowed to go out in the, in the woods.
Speaker 1:That's poor. That's probably why you're in trouble.
Speaker 3:Weren't allowed. And we didn't come home when she was calling us. Oh no. And she got a switch
Speaker 1:And we were in shorts. So on your bare legs, when it's wet with a switch, that sounds really painful. Did you have marks? I don't remember having marks, but you know, it was traumatized. So I don't know. I'm still talking about it to this day. Yeah. Well, I was traumatized too. It was so embarrassing for me because your friends see that kind of thing. That CPS would be called today. Exactly. Can you imagine? Absolutely God, we lived in, we lived in the seventies, people we grew up in, you're asked to speak at times. It's like a badge of honor for the moms. Um, so that sounds, I mean, not description of Krampus, I think describes describes him pretty well. Don't you think? Yes, it does.
Speaker 3:Yeah. We did a much better job than I would
Speaker 1:Have. Oh no. I mean, I was just going on what I've read, but I think it sounds like, for example, the images of Krampus that I've seen are like in the movie and stuff like that, this is going to interest you. So over the years, apparently the way people have described Krampus, like that half animal, half human figure has led some sociologists to speculate whether he was an actual creature, kind of like a cryptid of some sort people are actually, I guess there's a, there's some people out there who think Krampus could be like an actual creature. I don't think there are many, very many of those people, but I found, I hadn't, that really shocked me. I didn't know that I wouldn't have guessed, but you only watched the movie. Yeah, same here. Um, so during the slow season, Krampus would get really bored. So sometimes he would try to entice kids in the mischief so that he could punish them. Exactly. Exactly. So you would be punished according to your level of misbehavior. So the lowest punishment is what you got, which was spanking with Birch huts. And I read that there were some phallic overtones there. My God, I know isn't that disgusting. We feel dirty. I shouldn't have that. You shouldn't have that to yourself, the middle. So repeat offenders. So if you had gotten in trouble and you just didn't learn your lesson, Krampus is gonna like lasso his big tongue out at you and drag you into his bag and take you to the underworld for at least a year. And until you learn your lesson and then you might get to come back home until it's hellos holiday. And then he St. Brian brings you back. Exactly. That actually might be true. Or[inaudible] I forget which one. Um, so the final punishment. So this was for kids who were so bad that even their parents had given up on them, like just didn't know what to do with them. So he would pull you slowly apart and devour you. Sometimes he would eat their tongue first, sometimes I guess if he wasn't hungry or maybe if he, he ate what he wanted and whatever was left, he would throw you off of an Alpine cliff sometimes would drown you. And he would retrieve your soul with a Pitchfork and put you on a ghost train that was chugging away to the Lake of fire. So that was like a Southern Baptist sermon. Actually, it really does. It's so bad. I mentioned that his feast day is December 5th, but Krampus, I guess, could be active anywhere from late November until the second week of December. So he can walk the earth during that time. So you need to be on your best behavior, at least, at least until about December 14th. I would say after that, he's going to retreat back to his Alpine cave for the remainder of the year. So thank God we got out. We got to try to be good people for the next couple of weeks. Yeah. That's about 10 days maybe. Yeah, we gotta be good for about 10 days. So no cussing Jen. No F-bombs Oh, well I can't promise that that's not gonna happen. All right. So there's something called Krampus Nacht, which means Krampus night or night of the Krampus and people settle in that was on his feast day of December 5th. I so wish we were together because we could totally celebrate Krampus knocked. It would be so cool. People would get together and they would have offerings. Um, you'd make like a big feast and gather around the warmth from the Gulag and children would leave baskets of food by the hearts, along with alcoholic offerings. And D can you guess what Krampus his favorite drink is? Oh gosh. Um, don't tell me, let me think. It's um, is it like a beer Doppelbock what is that? It's called Doppelbock topple Bach. Is that like double brew or something? Yeah, it was actually shops. Um, that was his favorite. His favorite thing. He did have a refined palette for such a monstrous guy, but it's probably also because the people in that region, right. The sort of Germany and Norway and all those places, I think they like shop because a lot of shops comes from Germany. So that may be why Krampus would come. And he would, he would like take everything you left for him. But unlike St. Nicholas, he left nothing in return. He wasn't an. Apparently it was enough that he loved the kids alone and everybody was safe and sometimes he would leave behind a single Birch rod. It was either, I guess, a reminder to behave or some parents made up to make their kids behave. Well, it's funny that you say that because something I read said that the Birch rod may have been the precursor to the elf on the shelf, which makes sense if you think about it, right. Oh, that's so funny. I know. I thought that was super funny too. So on Krampus knocked'em adults would dress up in Krampus costumes and parade through the streets of the village and they would drink like booze was flowing. And that was the thing that was called. I mentioned earlier, the Krampus Lau for the Krampus run, um, it may have been inspired by Saturnalia, which was a very old Roman custom. And then the feast of fools like is in 12th night from Shakespeare's 12th night. And that was a tradition that continued into the middle ages. And the Renaissance it's interesting, that cramp is knocked is it's on the Eve of Saint Nicholas's feast day. That's maybe why you said the six. Cause I think, yeah. Yeah. So it's, it's really interesting. They're so close together. And it was common back in the sort of old ancient days to celebrate with something they called Nicholas plays and those plays would have both Krampus and Saint Nicholas, his, a character now kind of getting into some of the Krampus versus St. Nick stuff. I read the Krampus. He's not so much like the anti St. Nick or St. Nick's nemesis as much as he is his compliments. So where you have like Saint Nicholas is in, you're going to talk a lot more about him, but where he's good and he brings gifts and, you know, seems to be loving. Krampus is, is not, he takes, he, he comes and he takes, and he's more associated with, with revenge and things like that. But in certain parts of the world from, I guess this was from the early 17 hundreds through really the end of the 20th century. And maybe it's still going on in some little villages, both Krampus and Saint Nicholas would visit kids together about an hour before their bedtime. I guess that was, I don't know if that was on Krampus knocked or if it was Christmas Eve, I'm not sure, but so St. Nicholas would give the kids these quizzes where he'd quiz them on their Bible trivia. And while he's doing that, Krampus is like pacing around and huffing and puffing and his chains and trailing his chains and taunting the kids. Like you don't know this, I'm going to drag you to hell. And I read one of the quotes from the author is like, he would say, Aaron, your response and you shall be my prize for so long. I have yearned for a companion in hell. And so like, you're trying to remember, like, you know, who, I don't know Shaq was in the Bible and then this creature's like menacing you now, Saint Nicholas would give the kid a little piece of candy for each right answer. But I mean, who really cares about candy at that point? So the intensity of how Krampus would act would depend on and keep in mind, like these are people dressed up in Krampus costumes, right. Doing this. So when the kids got older, Krampus would be even more intense. So he would smash plates. He might pretend like he's picking a fight with the father of the family, or he might make really like sexual advances on, on the women. So like the daughters of the family or the mother. Yeah. Isn't that crazy. It was crazy. This just keeps getting worse. He might even try to like pick up a child and like carry it out of the house. But people, parents thought that, you know, these frightening theatrics would help their kids develop into disciplined law, abiding citizens. So they thought, you know, um, this was, this was good for kids. So in terms of Krampus and his popularity, now there was, you know, he, he hasn't really begun, I think, to gain in popularity in the United States until fairly recently. Well like 2010, something like that. But I don't know. I don't think that's a hard and fast kind of thing, but it's fairly recent until you,
Speaker 3:You told me a couple of years ago, or maybe it was just last year that you'd watched Krampus. I didn't know what you were talking about.
Speaker 1:And I don't think I heard about it. I heard about it from a friend on Facebook, um, this crazy guy. And he like, he posted these old Krampus postcards because people used to actually send Krampus cards. They would, um, you know, in, in the movie Krampus that bell says Bruce farm Krampus means greetings from Krampus. And a lot of the old postcards would say that as well. But there's a theory that Krampus never really gained a footing in the United States because of anti-German sentiment following the second world war. And of course, Sansa caught on because Santa was like a good way to market things. Like if you think of the Coca-Cola Santa and all of that. So in the early 20th century, Krampus became more of like a figure for adults kind of like Halloween in some ways becomes more, more for adults and his lewdness was emphasized and he became part of the scene. I was going to say, make a crack about that. It's yeah. So actually, apparently, um, this, this actually was true and there is one of the old Krampus cards, which shows Krampus, spanking this very scantily clad woman. I think this was during like the early, like the early 19 hundreds. So around my end of the 1920s and until like sort of the Nazi party starts to take over in the thirties, it was called the Weimar Republic. And this was really a flowering of pre-thinking and artists and like all these artistic movements. And there was, you know, if you've ever seen cabaret, cabaret takes, takes place. I think during that time, we're just on the edge of that time. And so there was a lot of like sexual stuff going on and like, and these cabarets and all this kind of exploration. Um, so I think Krampus was, was part of that. He was actually outlawed by conservative political parties in Austria at one point. And then the Austrian Catholic union wanted to do with Krampus do away with him altogether. Um, they felt deleted and this was just like a really bad influence on people. So they told people they should boycott any Krampus merchandise. And that if you did play Santa, if you wanted to play Santa Claus, you had to have a license to play Santa. So this is the thing I'm most excited to tell you about all around the United States and Europe. Definitely in Europe, there's the Krampus knocked Krampus left, you know, the Krampus running all of that, where people have parades. And so people dress up like Krampus. Sometimes people dress up like the other characters, like there's Frau Perstas, there's the good souls and the bad souls. And would you believe that there's one in Richmond, Virginia. Really? Yes. It's called the RVA Krampus knock RVA, I guess for Richmond, Virginia. Yeah. So when I saw that, I wasn't sure it was Richmond. And when I found out it was, I was like, yes. So it's been going on since 2013. Yeah. I was thinking next year we have to go. But if you actually go to it, like you can watch the parade and then the walk ends up at a pub. I just think that sounds doesn't it sound fun. And apparently there's a lot of shops. Their website is really cool. If you go to RVA, just look up Google, RVA, Krampus, Krampus knocked. So I just think these people sound like so much fun, a lot of fun, a lot of fun. And they also, they raise money for really good causes. So they raise money for, um, women, um, who are diagnosed with breast cancer and, you know, dealing with that. And then for kids who are ill. So they do like toy drives and money drives and, and all this stuff. So I'm going to end up with, so I think I told you everything I know about Krampus, but I do want to mention another figure. And that is the UL cat. And I don't know if people, even for him, Oh, I don't know if people know about the UL cat. Now he actually originates from Iceland and he is near and dear to my heart because there are no, there are no like big cats, you know, like Pumas or what are big cats around here. I'm trying to think, what do they call those cats? I saw one at Dollywood. One time. It wasn't a Bobcat. It was the most exciting part of my trip and deli wasn't combined. Yes. On the little cart, on the way into the park. They like take everybody like on this little tram into the park and there was a slow pop cat just running along. And that was like the highlight of my whole three days. But anyway, so people think that the Yule cart is probably modeled after a Norwegian forest cat, which are native. I guess they come from Norway. And I guess there are a lot of them in Iceland, but I have a Norwegian forest cat Hugo. I do. And he's really, really bad. So I think he's like, he's the we've started calling him the old cat now. Totally suits him. I'm afraid of him. I didn't, I'm afraid of him too. I didn't realize that he was that breed until you told me, I think it was today, but, and you looked him up or you looked up pictures he's really, really mean I'm afraid of him. Well, he's huge for one thing, like he's just Norwegian forest cats are really furry. Like they've got this long fur, but he's just really, um, mean built really solid. And he is, he is mean, but he's really nice to my husband. Like, he's so sweet to Brian, but he doesn't like me the only time are you sure? He doesn't like you? I don't think he likes women. He won't let me in the hallway. Like when you have to go to the bathroom. Yeah. I can't walk past him or I'm afraid to watch to walk past him. Cause he's looking at me like just do it, just do it. That is too funny. He's not a bad guy. He's just, he's a complicated beast. I think Krampus suits them. I do. So he's definitely the old cat. Um, and the yolk had apparently pulled phrase wagon. Freya is what is she? The goddess of, I think the goddess of beauty and some other things. So he pulled her wagon through the sky and he would pray on the lazy people. And he was, he was very huge and very vicious, much, much like why you go? Yes. So the, your cat, he wants to see you dressed in like crisp new clothes because it was apparently in the old days. Um, if you were lazy, you wouldn't contribute to tending the crops and processing the wool. And that meant that you wouldn't be given a new suit of clothes, but if you were industrious and did what you were supposed to be, the former would reward you and you'd get new clothes for the new year. And then the UL cat would leave you alone. So basically if you're, if you're not wearing new clothes, that means you're lazy, then you're, you're no good. So the old cat is gonna, I guess, just abduct you and he would eat you. And, um, he, it was said he was the pet of gorilla. I hope I'm pronouncing that. I think it's gorilla. And she was the mother of the Yule lads. And I think you're going to talk about them, but she would cook and eat disobedient kids. That was some of the stuff that she would do. So with that, I'm going to, I'm going to throw it to you. The first I had heard of guerrilla was on the remake or the Netflix version of Sabrina, the witch. And they have a really good Christmas episode that was out last year. And I'm going to watch it again because I just liked it so much, but she was one of the main characters and it involved her and the Yule lads. So the Yule lads are 13, like elfish type, I guess, creatures. And they visit kids the 13 days up until Christmas day. But they all visit at the same time or do they take turns? They take turns and they have weird names. I can't even pronounce them. But it's funny that you say about the names, because somewhere in my notes, I have, I have like some of their names, like what they translate into and they're really weird. Like one of them was, Oh, I don't know, like pots look hot liquor. Yeah. And there was another one, like something, yeah, there was one that sounded kind of dirty. I'm going to, I'm going to try to find it. And I'll, I know the one you're talking about. Cause I was gonna say about him. Okay, good. Then I won't look for it. The window paper. I think that was it. Yeah. Yeah. When I heard that one, I was like, Ooh, because you know, that's one, uh, one of your fears. Yeah. One of my fears is someone watching me through a window. Well, as you know, we're, we're afraid of, we're afraid of a lot of stuff. We really are. What are we afraid of? So when I heard that one, I was like, Oh my God, that's so super creepy. But what he does is the wood, the window paper, he looks in on children to see how they're behaving. And if they're behaving
Speaker 3:Badly, he'll go back until Grella and then she'll come. I don't know if she sends a Yoel cat or she comes herself and she might come with him, takes the children and eats them. Isn't that true,
Speaker 1:Caroline, can I just, I just have to jump in here. First of all, I found out one of the other names, it's the sausage swiper,
Speaker 3:But when I was growing up and many other people can identify with this, my, my grandmother,
Speaker 1:I called her my LA, she was from Switzerland. I'm not Switzerland. Jesus, I'm drunk. She's from Sweden. Excuse me. And my grandmother is from Sweden, but she would say like, she would say to me, like, it'd be like the heat of July. And she'd be like, I just saw[inaudible] looking in through that window and he's watching you. And it was really threatening and like really scary Santa. Yeah. She'd be like, he's watching you. And he doesn't like what he sees or like, you know, in this really threatening way. And now that I think about it, cause you know, she was from the Scandinavian country. She didn't come to America until she was like 16. She probably had heard some of these things. So yeah,
Speaker 3:It makes me wonder about if she did never heard of other than watching Sabrina and seeing the Yule lads. I just thought that was something maybe they had made up for the episode.
Speaker 1:Well, I guess, I mean, in, in Santa Claus, Laura, I mean Santa is supposed to watch kids too. Right. I mean they say he knows if you've been nodding.
Speaker 3:Nice. Yeah. And then you also have elves that work on standards workshop. So that's true. Creepy little, these things just blend in and melt into one another. But yeah. So you should watch the episode. If you haven't seen it, watch Sabrina.
Speaker 1:Do I need to watch the whole season to watch the Christmas episode? Yeah.
Speaker 3:Okay. Don't need to watch the whole season.
Speaker 1:There's the whole thing, but I'm not sure I'm in the like Halloween-y mood right now. So I would like to,
Speaker 3:You just need to watch the episode. It would be fine. I think when I read today about the window paper, I was like, Oh my God. That's
Speaker 1:Like the worst scary
Speaker 3:Peeping Toms back then. But what I also read too, which was really interesting or I found funny was that, um, and I'm drunk again and it's alluding me. Oh, I was going to say, you're drunk again. You're still drunk. I'm still drunk. I haven't sobered up in the 17 hundreds. He was the 17 or the 18 hundreds. Iceland passed a law where you couldn't threaten kids with UL, lads. You could seize it. Yeah. You can't use it or you in an intimidating way.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh. Yeah. That's fascinating. So that was the 17 hundreds. I'm surprised it was
Speaker 3:That early 17 or 18 hundreds. Oh seven
Speaker 1:Two hundreds just seems like it was still like kind of a, a rough time. You know, that surprises me. That's really interesting.
Speaker 3:So now that I've been, when I was reading about that and I was thinking, God, I think I would really like to study folklore. Maybe I should go back to school, but now I don't think I should.
Speaker 1:There's actually something, um, called the Colorado school of folklore that you can do some classes online. I've thought about doing that. So I'll send you some of that information. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. It really, really kind of, I was always interested in folklore anyway, but to me, really, really interested. So yeah, it's so cool. And there really was a Saint Nicholas. I mean, not a whole lot is known about him, but he lived in the third and fourth centuries and these are the various stories I could have associated with him. Well, one, he was born into a rich Christian family and his parents died at an early age. So he inherited the money and what he did with the money is he traveled all over the place. And then he also following the teachings of Christ. He was giving money away and being very generous with the poor and people in need and that sort of thing. So being an actual person, I was like a really good guy. Yes. So one of the stories associated with him is that, well, first I want to say that after he traveled, he came back to, um, the region of Turkey that he was from and that's Intellia Turkey today. And it's by the sea when he returned, he was appointed Bishop of Myra and that's also on the sea. I think that's relatively close by. So he became a, he became a Bishop and another story that's associated with him, or I guess the major story that's associated with him is that he was passing by a house one day and he heard a father, very upset talking to his three daughters. And they were upset because they didn't have money for a dowery. And that meant that they would be, they would have to enter prostitution. So St Nicholas, what he did was what he was passing by. I've heard red passing by window or throwing this through the, um, through the chimney. I think I had read another place or had seen one place for three nights. He dropped off or threw in like one bag of money for each girl. So the oldest got one on the first night. Another one got money on the second night. And then he tossed in money on the third night. So they didn't have to enter into prostitution. Another story that's associated with him is that an innkeeper killed three boys and St. Nicholas resurrected them. I think I read that story too.
Speaker 1:Didn't he like, he'd cut them into pieces and pickled them or something.
Speaker 3:Yes. That was one story that he pickled them. There was another story with him is that he reportedly saved like three men who were falsely imprisoned and sentenced to death. So those are the three major stories he's like immensely popular. That's even an understatement on the world. He's the patron Saint of Russia. And then also grace he's considered the patron Saint of there's a lot of different things I'm mentioned, but the primary one is sailors also have children. Of course, I guess that's the major one. What about like maybe unmarried women? Um, I had seen prostitutes. Oh wow. There's a lot of different things that he's supposedly the patron Saint of. Yeah.
Speaker 1:That's funny that you he's patron Saint in Greece because I feel like there's so many Greek men named Nicholas or Nico, you know, that movie, my big fat Greek wedding. And she's like, he was my son, Nico, and my nephew, Nico, and also Nika. It's just like, they're all named and Nicholas. I didn't think about that.
Speaker 3:That might explain it. Yeah, it probably does. Probably does. So St. Nicholas Day, it's celebrated throughout the world and especially in like Europe and Belgium and Germany and Eastern France to name a few, um, in Germany, he's called Nikolaos and in Holland he's he's called center Kloss. Cool. And this is really, to me, this is really, really strange. I didn't know anything about this, but so everybody basically wants a piece of Santa wants to lay claim to Santa. And just to give you an example, there's all this jockeying for, I guess, to be able to claim that you have Saint Nicholas's remains. So he was supposedly laid to rest and Myra and the church that was built for him was destroyed by an earthquake. And so a new church was built for him and Demerara, which is I believe, which is in the same area as well. It might be. Denver might be the same as Myra to tell you the truth. I'm not sure. I can't remember. Okay. Maybe like the more modern name of it or something. So after the church burned down, a new one was, was built for him. And he became so popular that in 10 87, Italian soldiers supposedly stole his remains and they took it to Bari Italy, where there was a, where they built a Basilica. And gosh, you have Turkey saying, no, we still have his remains. And you have Italy saying, no, we have his remains. And also it might be, I don't know if Russia also lays claims to having at least part of his remains. There's all these different countries that yeah. Say that they have his remains. And then also
Speaker 5:France also claims to have
Speaker 3:His remains as well. And because of his generosity and giving gifts or providing money for the girls' dowries, um, he's been associated gift giving as magical gift giver started to be associated with him by the 13th century. And I guess with sailors, the reason why he's the patron Saint is because sailors, um, if you think about it, like his, the story of Saint Nicholas was spread to other countries through, by sea, the ceiling, that sort of thing. That's true. Yeah. So that makes sense. So Santa came or Saint Nicholas came to, um, the U S from the Netherlands. And again, they called him like Centre Klaus, and they brought it to the new world colonies. So that's where, yeah. So it came from them fascinating. And with Christmas celebrations, um, it was really frowned upon around the 15th, 16th century because of the Protestant reformation. So with the colonies, they didn't celebrate Christmas, outwardly those Puritans, they were so, they were so boring. They may celebrate it privately, but they didn't do publicly until later it became more acceptable to do. So I think sometimes you could actually be punished if you were found to be celebrating. Because with the, with the Puritans, I saw like Christmas to be like the trappings and stuff of, of Catholics really. And they were, well, they were all about simplicity. Right. And having this is just very austere understanding of God and life. And so Santa Claus really, I think around what was it? 1823 the night before Christmas, or it was the night before Christmas, that poem, he was the guy who wrote that Jed, um, Clement, Seymour. I believe there were two people that I think there was some controversy about who wrote them, but we'll, we'll go with climate. I think limits sounds right. So that's really, when Santa really started to take off was with, um, twas the night before Christmas and early, like a rendition of him, I believe for that particular poem, he looks more elfish. I believe that's true. He even refers to him as an elf. I believe at one point in that poem. And it wasn't until her right. Jolly old elf. I think he called it. It wasn't until Nast that he started being portrayed, you know, something larger than an elf. And of course Christmas has become commercialized, but I've heard people say, well, Santa was made up by by department stores or by companies while he wasn't, he wasn't made up by a company. Cause I remember when I first heard that I was like, Oh my God, really? That's not true. Totally false. No, isn't that? I think it's really lovely to, to know that, to know that this folklore goes back so far, it does have its origins in something real or something. Don't let anybody ruin it for you. If they say that, cause it's not true. Right? Like, like my mom did when I was eight or something, she told me he didn't exist. Oh really? She did. Yeah. We were having this conversation and she was irony and she's like, well, you know, Santa, it doesn't exist. And I'm like, Oh yeah, yeah. I knew that. But inside, I was like, I don't know why, what did she tell you? Not unless you weren't even suspicious. Where are you? I don't know. I think she just didn't want to have to keep the secret anymore. She didn't, you know, I think that probably made everything harder. Cause she had to wait until I went to bed and put stuff under the trees. You weren't even questioning. I wasn't questioning. No. My cousin believed in Santa, I think until she was like 12 and that's a good, long time is a good long time. Did you ruin it? Did I slip for her? 12 year old thinks are still Santa Claus. I know that's a long time. And then she goes, I thought so. Oh, so she wasn't, she wasn't upset then? No, it just seemed like the, the bulbs started to fully go off at that point. So how did you, how did you figure out that there wasn't I figured out because my uncle who was a fireman, he dressed up like Santa Claus and I could tell it was him. Oh, okay. But you couldn't when you were really little kid? No, I, no. I believed it when I was like really little. Yeah. I totally believed that. Oh, it's the, isn't it the best when you're little. And I remember my brother, cause my brother's 10 years older than me. He used to say, now, if you, if you're
Speaker 1:Really, you know, quiet and you look out the window, like you may see the Glint of Rudolph's red nose off in the distance. I really would think I would see it. You know, speaking to that, I actually bought the rest of the, um, Rudolph, the Red-Nosed reindeer characters. Are you serious? Oh my prospector. I got him like, Oh, he's Jack here. Hold on a second. Do you have Claire EES?
Speaker 6:I'm gonna get my wife to stay in the car thing.
Speaker 1:I just got a kick out of him. That's great. I like him to route off and listen to him. Like he sounds so whiny. I mean, I was just so crazy about this, but like he's a whiner. Hold on.
Speaker 6:Does any
Speaker 1:A little bit, but it's because of his nose. Is, is he wearing his fake nose over his, for his red nose? Well, first I have the Bumble. So I've been playing with them today. I mean, I've been working, but I like to have them out, but also playing with your plane with my finger rains. Yeah. That's awesome. I cannot wait to put my stuff up. I've ordered so much like crap and just, I love it is like playing when you set it all out and I ordered some angels and I've got these new Wiseman and I've got, Oh, I don't know, Santas and snowmen. And it's just so fun. I got my it's like being a kid. My, well, I have two old world Sandoz. I have one that I just got that's um, he's dressed in like blue garb. I think he's more like, I loved that when you show me that picture, he's in the other one. I think it's arrived today, but I haven't opened the box yet. But from the picture I got this off of eBay, it's like Saint Nicholas wearing the Bishop hat. That's so cool. And now, you know, all the folklore, but I didn't realize that because when I first saw it, I was like, what is this? Why is he wearing that hat? And then that is so cool. I started researching this. I'm like, Oh, okay, now I get it. Yeah, it's really cool. So I'm really excited about all this folklore stuff and it's so fun. So now I need to get you Krampus. I'm just really excited or happy that Saint Nicholas existed. I am too. And I think the spirit, you know, that spirit of gift giving and caring and loving and that's really what it's all about. And this has been really fun. I'm sure there's a lot more on St. Nick. I didn't do it justice, but I just wanted to hit some of the major points and let everybody know that Santa lives Santa lives, especially after we told you Krampus, just to be completely inappropriate. I'm going to end with a story of the boodle frown. Okay. Sounds like a good one. I think because when I was reading about this, I'm like, Oh, I know what Jen would say about this, but maybe it's just what I think you would say. So there was this figure called the boodle Frau. And I think this comes from she's it's loosely related to St. Luchea, but apparently she would come and visit your house and all these presents would fall out of her voluminous skirts really? And she's like super ugly. And she would like inspect your house to make sure it was clean. Um, and if everything was in order and if like you were clean and your house was clean, then like all these presents would drop out of her skirts. And she would also drop turnips and tomatoes and they would have coins tucked inside. Them sounds like a stripper. What's it called again? Boodle frown. So B U D E L. I don't know what the German word boodle means, but Frau of course it's woman. Um, I don't know what boodle vagina. I should look that up. Vagina woman, but China women with all the presents falling out of her, her giant vagina Frau that might be, have to be what I, what I referred to a bit. I know I couldn't, I couldn't not mention her. She was, she cracks me up too much. I love it though. He did too. I know this is so fun. I'm definitely, definitely ready for, I don't know for Christmas. And I feel like there's like something to celebrate almost every day in December. I mean, a lot of these old, um, St. Lucy's day, I think is the 13th of December. So like all this stuff is just, you know, all those great lore and the solstice. Yeah. Which is the 21st. And Robert Burns supper. When is that? When is January? I think is January. January. Good times ahead. I think here's to 2021. I don't have any left of mine. I don't have anything left in my dream. I have like a tiny little like, like, um, I don't, it's not a morsel cause he can't call liquid a morsel, but it's like a tiny drop. I'm going to like cramping. My cramp, his tongue Disgusting like a brutal frown.
Speaker 2:I can't
Speaker 1:Believe you just said that mine was delicious. Thank you to everyone who listened. The best thing you can do to help us grow is to like review on subscribe on iTunes and even better yet tweet about us or post about us on Facebook. Tell your friends if you think they would like us and have a good night.
Speaker 2:[inaudible].