EMS@C-LEVEL
As Forbes, Entrepreneur, Fast Company and SCOOP writer, Philip Stoten, continues to talk to EMS (Electronic Manufacturing Services) executives he learns more about their individual and collective experiences and their expectations for their own businesses and for the entire electronic manufacturing industry.
EMS@C-LEVEL
Markets, Mayhem and Manufacturing: Insights on the Future of Electronics Manufacturing in the America
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The manufacturing landscape is changing rapidly, with economic headwinds creating a fascinating divide among electronics producers. While some companies hesitate in the face of tariff uncertainties and political tensions, others boldly expand capacity and embrace AI to solve their most pressing challenges. This dichotomy forms the foundation of an insightful conversation with Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young America at APEX 2025.
Looking beyond current challenges, we explore the fundamental shift in growth expectations for the electronics manufacturing industry. The explosive post-pandemic growth of 2022 represented an anomaly fueled by inventory rebuilding and backlogged investments - creating a "new normal" that requires technological innovation rather than simply waiting for another market surge. This reality is driving forward-thinking manufacturers to invest strategically in AI capabilities that can increase productivity without expanding their workforce.
Particularly fascinating is the developmental pathway of manufacturing AI systems, which mirrors human learning progression. Beginning with high-quality, trustworthy data collection, these systems evolve from making recommendations (which operators implement) to eventually becoming fully autonomous, self-correcting entities. We explore Koh Young's practical implementation of this approach through their KAP (Koh Young Auto-Programming) tool and review functions, which are steadily progressing toward the autonomous, or 'agentic', model that represents manufacturing's future. For companies seeking manufacturing advantage in uncertain times, understanding this progression - and having the right data foundation - may be the critical differentiator between struggling with today's challenges and thriving despite them.
Curious about how AI is transforming manufacturing floor operations and how economic uncertainties are reshaping investment strategies? This episode provides both high-level perspective and practical insights you can apply to your own operation. Whether you're cautiously waiting for economic clarity or pushing forward with technology-driven solutions, you'll find valuable guidance for navigating manufacturing's rapidly evolving landscape.
EMS@C-Level Live at APEX is sponsored by global inspection leaders Koh Young (https://www.kohyoung.com) and Creative Electron (https://creativeelectron.com)
EMS@C-Level is hosted by global inspection leaders Koh Young (https://www.kohyoung.com) and Global Electronics Association (https://www.electronics.org)
You can see video versions of all of the EMS@C-Level pods on our YouTube playlist.
Economic Climate and Industry Outlook
Philip Stotenhello , I'm philip stoden and I'm at apex 2025 and I'm on the koh yang bu talking to joel . Joel , pleasure to talk to you . Good to see you again . How have you ?
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young Americabeen always good to be together . Busy , yeah , yeah , it's busy , it's exciting , it is it , it is . But yeah , this is that time of the year where we're , I guess , a little extra busy with preparations . We want to make it as perfect as we can . It's a huge potential linchpin for our business for the rest of the year and into the following . So you know , we want to make sure everything is again as perfect as it can be , and that takes a little time .
Philip StotenYou have a great booth here . It looks great . I'm very happy with it , and you've had plenty of people here . I'm super happy with how things came out , so that's been nice Great team pulling it together . Yeah , it's always good when a plan works right , Absolutely Great when I was thinking about where we are politically and where we are economically in the US . And you know , I just Do you have any answers ?
Philip StotenNo , but I was reminded that when it was , when people were thinking about talking about the election they were talking about all these different things they always came back to it's the economy stupid , and you know , that could almost be the title of what we need to talk about . It's the economy , it's tariffs . It's the economy , it's tariffs , it's trade . Is that putting a lot of pressure on your customers and is it maybe slowing down some of their investments ?
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaWell , it feels like it is , and from some of the folks I've talked to prior to today and today , and today it certainly is . But at the same time , uh , we've spoken with others today that are plowing full speed ahead and and basically they made the decision that , uh , you know , the world is not coming to an end regardless and things have to get done . Um , you know , I , uh , I subscribe to , uh , to kiplinger , and they put out a weekly letter and they basically project the comparison at year end from how we finished the previous year to the year we're in , so 2024 to 2025 . And GDP is going to be down slightly from roughly 2.8 to 2.4 , not devastating . This is their projection . Interest rates are projected to stay in the fours . Unemployment's going to be about the same .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaIt doesn't look like we're going to see a radical shift either way . Yeah , based on what you know and these are guys that are smarter than me , these are economists , these are people that are paid to uh , to project and , uh , you know . So , with that , you know , you gotta feel like we just , we just have to go right , we have to go . I mean , literally , we're kind of in a mode where I think we all know that uh Trump is using these tariffs in particular with Mexico and Canada to get something above and beyond he's looking for a renegotiated trade deal .
Philip StotenLet's do it , do it , let's go .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaSo people can break free and start to see the money flowing again .
Philip StotenI've had people tell me that ?
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaOh for sure , absolutely . Look , we know . I think the confusion with Mexico is twofold . I think there's going to be a new normal in terms of what's a really good year for our industry . 2022 was an anomaly . We talked about this before Post-COVID . We're rebuilding inventories . We talked about this before
The New Normal in Manufacturing
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaPost-COVID . We're rebuilding inventories . We're investing like crazy to catch up for what we weren't able to do in 2020 , partially in 2021 . We had all the incentives , all the EV , all the green and as we know , now a lot of that's up in the air a bit right , at least for the Americans , right .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaSo you know , a lot of equipment was purchased . That was a major investment and I think that's a cycle that doesn't happen often . You need another major event to have something like that go on . So I think there's a new normal in growth expectations , but we still need to figure out a way to overcome that Right , and we do that with new products and new software , improvements to what we already have in Hena et cetera .
Philip StotenYeah , I think that kind of plays into the other thing I wanted to talk about . But what is really interesting from what you said ? I had a conversation just before I spoke to you with one of your very happy customers . They are planning to build or acquire another site , so they're looking at almost doubling their capacity . They have twice as many people at Apex as they normally have One looking equipment , but predominantly coming here to figure out how to use AI . How do they use AI in their business ? How can they really leverage AI to allow them to grow in an area where they can't necessarily grow their talent
AI's Growing Role in Electronics Assembly
Philip Stotenpool ? So it's really interesting that there are pockets , particularly here in the US , where companies are just going gangbusters . They're doing really well , yeah .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaSo for everyone that's kind of waiting and taking a wait-and-see attitude , there's others that , as I said , have made the decision that it's going to be okay . There may be a little bit of short-term pain . But in the end it's going to be okay and you know , the intention here is obviously to bring manufacturing back to the US and they're banking on that happening right .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaThey're planning for it and the AI piece is certainly at the forefront of how they're going to do that . We've talked , phil , over the last couple of years about how automation has to play a role . Now we're in a very highly automated space , as it is right . When you look at the PCB assembly line and even the Simicom side , a lot of it's hands up , back end not so much , but for the most part but there's still a huge opportunity and need to automate the balance and , as we've talked about in the past , ai is really the fuel that's going to make that happen .
Philip StotenIt's going to feed that .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaYeah , it's going to push us over and we've seen that even in our own business , in fact , what we really are showing as our most prominent piece and improvement our new , if you will , everybody wants to do is exactly that . It's all the work that we've been doing since we last met at this show a year ago to employ that superior parametric data set copious amounts , extensive in terms of volume that AI needs to correctly be trainable and provide the desired results . So when we look at our KAP tool , koyang Auto Programming tool just extensive effort in again utilizing that data , really , really turning up the
AI-Powered Automation Developments
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young Americaheat turning up the volume to to make that tool and others more intuitive , yeah , less dependent on human interaction , and in to the point where you know it at some point soon .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaBasically , we're gonna put a board in the machine . It's gonna , yeah , collect its data and bam , we're done . Right , put a board in the machine .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaIt's going to collect its data and bam we're done Fix everything it needs to fix and that drives toward the lights out , similar to the smart review tool , again using a much greater amount , if you will , of AI and creating these independent engines to do all these tasks , to address the various attributes that make up the process in total and creating a situation where we're going to eventually , if we're successful , take the review operator completely out of the process . And oh , by the way , move more to that horizon where we're now . What is it agentic ?
Philip StotenAgentic yeah .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaAgentic the term for it where ? Much like autonomous cars . We're self-correcting without any human need .
Philip StotenWe're seeing that already with our KPO tools .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaBut taking that to another level , right , if I can adjust those tolerances automatically at that review process , then why can't I feed them directly back to the machine itself , adjust the tolerances in the program and never create a situation where that decision needs to be made Is it a defect or not ? Well , we've taken that completely out of the mix .
Philip StotenI think what's really interesting in the application of AI is you have all the ingredients and you have the path . So it all starts from really good data . It's like teaching your kids . You can't teach them with bad data . You're not going to say go and read everything on Twitter , that's where you'll learn . You're going to say look at these books , this is where your sources should be coming from , so you know you have a reliable source .
Philip StotenSecond thing is you're creating processes that are quite often co-piloted , so you're advising and saying , hey , that needs to be adjusted a little bit . Someone comes and adjusts it , but if that gets it right every time , there's that point where you've got to say I don't need to go and check this on you , you take care of this . If you're not sure , by all means let me know , but if you're sure , do it . And to me , that
The Path to Agentic AI Systems
Philip Stoteneducation path , that development path to the agentic model , only makes sense if you can have all those bits . If you can't trust your image , you can't trust your data and you don't have that domain expertise what chance You're in trouble .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaYeah , and that's just such a great point I think I mentioned I saw an IBM ad recently for Watson that says you know if you're looking to , you know , employ your trust in AI to take you where you want to go . You damn sure better trust what it's doing and how it's doing it , and so that's such an important piece of this . You really have to understand to some degree . You know how AI works , the fact that you know the data has to be solid and it has to be in significant quantity . I mean , look at all the Google and Apple results that they're able to produce .
Philip StotenWell , it's because they're listening to us all the time , all the time they're collecting data 24-7 .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaSo you know , when we look in our space here , I think that's very important and we feel very emphatically that we have that superior data set . We have more data than anybody out there because we have been true 3D from the beginning . So it's the right kind , the right way , the right amount . And when we create these KPO tools we do it exactly as you said . Right , we started on the KPO printer side with PAM and PDM Analyzer and Diagnostics and basically we're doing an automated DOE to come up with the recommended parameters for speed , pressure and release , manually set them tool to again basically analyze that at a higher level or a broader level for trends and anomalies beyond just redshifts hotspots and all this kind of stuff .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaHey , we have a problem . I think this might be a solution on the screen . Mr Operator , please make an adjustment . Still , may not ? The final piece is that
Customer Partnerships and Sustainability
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young Americacompletely automated self-correcting the AI machine learning engine is going to , instead of advising you to make a change , it's going to go ahead and make the change in the printer setup .
Philip StotenThat's exactly what you do with someone on the team . If someone on the team gets it right every time , you give them autonomy .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaYeah , exactly , it's really a simple equation and I think the customers see it that way too right , and they were , in some cases , part of that development process . Similarly , on the mounter side , right , we started off . Hey , you might have an issue based on what we're seeing with this feeder , this bundle , this nozzle here's your report At the end of the run manually go change it . Nozzle here's your report at the end of the run manually go change it . Now we're to the point where we're not only automatically skipping that spindle nozzle on the fly based on what we see , but also making self-correction for X Y rotation theta without any human intervention .
Philip StotenSo when you talk to customers , are they smart enough to realize that if they don't need a new machine , they should still come talk to you and figure out what they should be doing to get more out of the machines they've already got ?
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaAnd that almost starts to migrate into the sustainability conversation , where we have hardware , literally , that's still running . Yeah , from installations we did in 2005 30 , 30 sbi machines they're obviously end of life . Yeah , we support them the best we can . Obviously we can't , but what we have been able to do with with those tools from that point forward is , on a very scheduled and regular basis , come out with new software , new features that basically take what was old and make it new in terms of capability , get a little bit more life .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaSo I think that you have to look at it that way and then understand that again . Hey , these guys have put their focus in the right place . We've been talking about this for years and I've been saying there's going to be a shift , a paradigm shift , in what can be done with the data and why the data is so important , and not only just the data , but accurate , robust , trustworthy data in the amounts needed to utilize things like artificial intelligence to drive this automation we were talking about , and it's coming to fruition . That's what's happening now .
Philip StotenSo you better be keeping that data .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaWell , exactly and that's another conversation it's certainly a challenge because , you know , in reality it's the customer's data right . So there's some ins and outs , there's some things that have to be overcome with that , but at the end of the day , you know , when you're making those partnership selections , you really have to pay attention to that . Not everybody is going to be able to do this . There's smart factory and then there's the smartest factory .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaAnd you definitely want to be the smartest and the definition lies in the beholder , but , yes , we want to be able to accommodate the smartest .
Philip StotenWell , keep doing what you're doing . Let's hope for some stability and clarity with the economic forecasts and the tariffs . It's coming and that should help us all move forward , absolutely .
Joel Scutchfield, General Manager of Koh Young AmericaThanks so much for your time .
Philip StotenYou're very welcome , thank you . Thank you .