Have you ever witnessed the quiet strength of a faith reborn? Kathryn M. Schneider, a dedicated Director of Christian Education, opens up about her spiritual odyssey, from an Iowa childhood through a college crisis of belief, to a heartfelt return to her church roots. Her narrative is not just one of personal enlightenment but a radiant example of how life's adversities can be a catalyst for profound growth and 'sparkling Jesus' in our every day. Kathryn's tale is steeped in the powerful influences of her grandmother and mentors like Pastor Ken Michke and Professor Pat Fick, who have left indelible marks on her journey.
Amid the beauty of redemption stories like Kathryn's, there lurks a darker side to religious life that many young adults face: the specter of hypocrisy and inauthenticity. Our conversation doesn't shy away from these thorny issues. Instead, we examine the void many feel between adolescence and parenthood and how the church can sometimes falter in bridging that gap. It's a candid look at the need for realness within our spiritual communities, the pivotal role of the Holy Spirit in shepherding the wayward back to faith, and how embracing our imperfections can pave the way to a truly authentic church experience.
As our dialogue progresses, we share the intimate moments when faith and purpose intersect, revealing the life-reshaping power of serendipitous encounters and the signs that nudge us toward our calling. We touch on the grace accompanying public missteps and the humility essential in our spiritual endeavors. Closing with an open invitation to the Global Zion Bible Challenge, we extend a hand to those who seek fellowship in their faith walk. Whether navigating your spiritual path or considering the call to ministry, this episode offers a treasure trove of wisdom, solace, and connection.
With 4Freedom, all your communications, internet activity, and app usage are encrypted using multiple layers of robust, military-grade encryption algorithms that surpass the standards used by the NSA.
You can start your secure account today:
https://www.4freedommobile.com?ref=bridgebuilders
Have you ever witnessed the quiet strength of a faith reborn? Kathryn M. Schneider, a dedicated Director of Christian Education, opens up about her spiritual odyssey, from an Iowa childhood through a college crisis of belief, to a heartfelt return to her church roots. Her narrative is not just one of personal enlightenment but a radiant example of how life's adversities can be a catalyst for profound growth and 'sparkling Jesus' in our every day. Kathryn's tale is steeped in the powerful influences of her grandmother and mentors like Pastor Ken Michke and Professor Pat Fick, who have left indelible marks on her journey.
Amid the beauty of redemption stories like Kathryn's, there lurks a darker side to religious life that many young adults face: the specter of hypocrisy and inauthenticity. Our conversation doesn't shy away from these thorny issues. Instead, we examine the void many feel between adolescence and parenthood and how the church can sometimes falter in bridging that gap. It's a candid look at the need for realness within our spiritual communities, the pivotal role of the Holy Spirit in shepherding the wayward back to faith, and how embracing our imperfections can pave the way to a truly authentic church experience.
As our dialogue progresses, we share the intimate moments when faith and purpose intersect, revealing the life-reshaping power of serendipitous encounters and the signs that nudge us toward our calling. We touch on the grace accompanying public missteps and the humility essential in our spiritual endeavors. Closing with an open invitation to the Global Zion Bible Challenge, we extend a hand to those who seek fellowship in their faith walk. Whether navigating your spiritual path or considering the call to ministry, this episode offers a treasure trove of wisdom, solace, and connection.
With 4Freedom, all your communications, internet activity, and app usage are encrypted using multiple layers of robust, military-grade encryption algorithms that surpass the standards used by the NSA.
You can start your secure account today:
https://www.4freedommobile.com?ref=bridgebuilders
Well, today, my guest is Catherine Snyder, dce. Catherine Snyder, how are you doing today, catherine? I'm good. How are you? I'm good. It's good to have you on the podcast. You're one of my new series on those who have walked away and come back to the church, and you came back full-blown, you weren't just.
Speaker 2:Yeah, God called me into ministry when I came back. That's right.
Speaker 1:You didn't just come sail to Back Pew when you came back.
Speaker 2:Well, I did do that.
Speaker 1:But tell us a little bit about your background, to kind of get to know you a little bit better.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so currently I'm a DCE in Manning, iowa. I grew up in Iowa, grew up in the church. I went to church my whole life with my family, but in college kind of fell away from my faith, stopped going to church, I would say I liked Jesus, I didn't like his church, and so God, in his amazing glory, brought me back into church and, ironically, called me into ministry, which surprised me, I think the most out of anybody and so I answered the call and I have been in ministry a little over 10 years now and this is my third call. So I've served two churches in the Texas district and now we moved back to Iowa and so, married to a wonderful man named John, and I have two little kids almost two and a three-and-a-half-year-old Leonard and Henry.
Speaker 1:Wow, what a blessing. What a blessing. Where'd you serve? In Texas.
Speaker 2:Word of Life. Fellowship in Cibolo. So it's just outside of San Antonio, a suburb of San Antonio, and then Resurrection Lutheran in Spring, texas, which is a suburb of Houston. So then I came from San Antonio, houston, to small town Iowa.
Speaker 1:Wow Rivers of San Antonio.
Speaker 2:San Antonio yes, yeah, I love San Antonio. It's a wonderful place yeah.
Speaker 1:That's great. I love to ask my guests this question Tell us about the best piece of advice you've ever received.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I couldn't think of just one cause. I kind of have taken a few from different people and like molded them together into my own life motto. Um so um, it's from a camp gladiator coach, which is the first part, and then my first pastor, which is the second part, and I've kind of molded them together. So life is hard but you're made to do hard things and you can either get bitter or you can give it to God and get better.
Speaker 1:Oh, I love that. It's kind of been my.
Speaker 2:You know you're made to do hard things, was definitely doing burpees and like late lifting is where that came from. But I was like no, like we are, we are made to do hard things, but through Christ we can do them.
Speaker 1:And and if I turn to God I can get better and not bitter. So I love that because it is easy to. I posted on Facebook just recently a quote about you know, suffering brings about resilience and resilience leads to character, and a person who walked away from the church was really angry and she's like no suffering is a bad thing and Kristen needs to stop saying that. And then I just responded by just quoting from Romans five.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a hard verse, though, man, like I don't want to suffer. Like every time I read that, I'm like, yeah, but I'm done with the fire, get me out of it, Don't I have enough character Fine.
Speaker 1:I going, god, I get it.
Speaker 2:Stop anytime now yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, oh, it's true, though like, but you can't like. You either get better from the things that life throws at you or you can get better and and be built up like scripture says.
Speaker 1:Right, exactly so we had. We had a little bit of debate. I didn't debate long because I was in the middle of my defending my doctoral dissertation. So I'm like I'm just going to give you this verse I'll talk about it later longer but just chew on this for a while.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, oh, that's great.
Speaker 1:I'm curious, catherine who are some people in your life who have served to inspire you or be mentors to you in your life?
Speaker 2:I think it's different people for different life stages, but for me, a huge one that's always been there, I mean like my, my maternity or my paternal grandmother just her faith and her steadiness, she's always been a huge mentor. She's a huge prayer warrior, but then also, like just going when I, when God called me into ministry, my first call, my internship church, my pastor was an amazing mentor, pastor Ken Michke, and there was, of course, one of my professors, pat Fick. I still love talking to her from Concordia, texas. She just like sparkles Jesus and and and that's what I aim to do, right, and so just having those people, those key people who I think have been walking the faith journey a little longer, that you can turn to for advice and and ask them how they've been steadfast, even though life is full of highs and lows.
Speaker 1:So I love that term sparkle Jesus. I'm going to have to use that as well. Yeah, as Keith always says, sparkle Jesus, I'm going to have to use that.
Speaker 2:As Keith always says sparkle Jesus, yeah, or ooze Jesus. I've said that a lot too. My first answer was like that's a weird word, but I was like I want to ooze Jesus, like you know. Shine his light.
Speaker 1:I love that, though that's a great picture for us to think about is like, yeah, the either oozing or sparkling Jesus that we kind of go in through life and wherever we go, wherever room we enter, we kind of bring a little bit of Jesus with us to kind of sprinkle onto the, onto the group that's there. That light, the, the love, the care, the compassion is all the things that we want to kind of put into our room when we come in or come into people's contact with, they leave us going. Man, I just felt like a little sparkle of Jesus was on that person?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I like that. That'd be awesome to be known for that right yeah put it on my tombstone.
Speaker 1:He sparkled Jesus.
Speaker 2:I'm going to make you a mug. It'll be purple with glitter. He sparkled.
Speaker 1:Jesus, that's better than my other statement. You can't fix stupid, so that was much more positive.
Speaker 2:Yes, it's a little more joyful.
Speaker 1:So, catherine, tell us about your personal story, because the way I brought you on was I'm doing this series, it's about people who have kind of drifted away. Tell us kind of what. Tell us your story.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so my story in general. I kind of mentioned it a little bit in my intro. Um, I was born in Iowa and, um, my parents are, are Christians and they, um, they were part of the ELCA church. Um, when I was younger and so when I was born, I actually had heart failure and was life flighted to Iowa city, um, and was baptized by my aunt's pastor in Iowa city, um, cause they weren't sure I'd survive and so and so faith has always been since the very beginning of my journey and then grew up in the church, was confirmed LCMS.
Speaker 2:We had moved to the Des Moines area and started going to Gloria Day, got confirmed by myself in high school and then I was really active in the youth group growing up. So I did mission trips, two mission trips to Mexico, I did the National Youth Gathering. I went to youth group almost every Wednesday. I remember asking my youth pastor at the time he wasn't a DCE, his name's Brian Peters. He's probably one of my mentors too, that I would point to. But I remember asking him how did you do what you do? And he's like well, just go to Iowa State, get a four-year degree, come back and I'll give you my job. And I thought that was funny, like I wanted to do youth ministry or ministry in general in high school and I thought about it. But then when I went to Iowa State I wasn't sure what I wanted to major in and I kind of struggled. I started out advertising, ended up in communications probably simply because my sister was in communications and it was general and so started in communications and accidentally double majored in speech because it was a minor and my senior year. They were like just take all the speech classes and you'll have two majors. So got a double major.
Speaker 2:But while at Iowa State that was the huge kind of almost unraveling of my worldview and I didn't get connected into a church. I tried going to church there and I just didn't feel like I fit in there, that there was a place for me or a place where I could be, and I started taking classes. There wasn't one specific hurt or one specific event that kind of had me drifting away, but it was like the slow unraveling. So I took history of Christianity from an atheist professor and I thought it was just crazy, you could be a theologist and be atheist, yeah. And he talked about like the Nicene Creed in different ways than I had ever heard and he talked about like the gospel of Judas and how that wasn't included and like it just made me question a lot of stuff and question just organized religion in general. And then I took world religion from a Buddhist, my philosophy professor, like it was very adamant, you didn't debate from a Christian worldview or you wouldn't get a good grade, and so you kind of had all these things.
Speaker 2:And then of course, just the scenes in college too of partying on the weekends and kind of being selfish and living for yourself, and I'm thinking I was being free when I was actually getting enslaved to other things that I shouldn't have really allowed into my life. And after college I hadn't gone to like I would go to church when I went home for Christmas and I think I'd go home for Easter. I think I went to a one Ash Wednesday service, all of all of college. Wow, so I really didn't go to church. I prayed and I remember a cousin who was very active in church saying that she was disappointed because I had been so strong in my faith and I had walked away, and I remember just adamantly refuting that like I still believed in Jesus, I just hated his church, which is just crazy now to think of.
Speaker 2:But I graduated, I got a job in life insurance and then later a job in Wells Fargo doing underwriting, and I just lived for the weekend and partied with my coworkers and I think the thing that brought me back Well, I know the thing that brought me back is a thousand percent the Holy Spirit, with some help from my mom. So my mom, she has always been a church choir director in different churches we've been at and she has had the small group that's two persons per part and I sing. Music is just. I came out singing, they say, and so my mom was like I need an alto or a soprano, I don't remember which it was. She needed someone for one of the parts. So I started going to her practice and I'd sing. I go to church when she needed me to sing and that's kind of how I started going more regularly.
Speaker 2:And I don't remember the day, I don't even remember if it was 2009 or 10. But I remember waking up one Sunday morning, having partied the night before, and I rolled over and I was like I can make it to late service and I was like, well, that's weird, where did that thought come from, and I got up and I went and I sat in the back pew and I was like this is weird. Why did I come? Like I haven't gone by myself in forever, and I saw some family friends from forever ago and it was great to see them.
Speaker 2:And then the next week the same thought came and I, so I went and it was just like this weird, like it wasn't this big grand, like I'm back and I like it, or it was just this I guess I'm going to church again. And then I started going to a Bible study at a different Lutheran church because one of my sister's friends asked me to go, and so that kind of got me back in and I wanted a new Bible because I was like I'm back to church. I bought a King James. Oh, I couldn't even. I couldn't even understand it. It's like it was pretty but I needed a different one, right? But yeah, so it's. It's crazy. Like I, when God called me into ministry, it wasn't much longer after I found myself in that back pew and I remember thinking like you're calling me into ministry and I've barely started going back to church, like that can't be right.
Speaker 1:So yeah, that's my story. Did you mean me God?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, like I.
Speaker 1:There's no pew behind me, so there's no one behind me. There's some other cat's been in the building that I'm missing.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, I may have said no a lot in the promptings to go into ministry, like I said yes and then no and then yes and then no.
Speaker 1:So yeah, I want to go circle back to something you said, because I've heard this term a lot.
Speaker 2:There's even a book written about this I love Jesus, but I hate his church.
Speaker 1:So tell us what you mean by that, because I think sometimes people who go to church, there are things about the church that the church is not very good at reflecting on itself. And it's fun, because I like to challenge churches, to say I'm glad you love the church, but a lot of people don't, and here's what they don't love, and it becomes a really uncomfortable conversation. So tell us what you meant by that.
Speaker 2:I think for me I felt like there wasn't a place for me, especially in that stage, and I think as the church we failed that. That life stage, that in between high school, the college and even the young adult, like that's just kind of it's like, oh, come back when you have kids, like I think we fail that gap in there. But also I think for me it was I didn't have any like abuse in the church or hurt in the church that I like ran away from or was leaving from, and there is that. And I know I have friends who like that's part of their story of why they don't trust the church. But for me it was like the hypocrisy. It seemed like I don't know rereading screw tape letters, and so it makes me think of like how he's like make them focus on the in the incongruencies between the butcher and what he's like on Monday and how he is on Sunday, and so it's like, well, you are like this on on Thursday but you're like this on Sunday, and so it's it's full of hypocrites. Or I thought you could be a Christian and not go to church. And I think, like, ultimately, like as the church, yes, we want people in the pews because they can receive the sacraments, they can receive forgiveness, they receive the grace, and I tell it to my youth kids as kind of like you think of it as a fire that it's starting to go out, but there's all those embers at the bottom of the fire and they're glowing red and you can pull one ember out by itself and it'll glow for a while but if it's not reconnected back into the source it will eventually fizzle out. And so, like I thought that I could be that ember and just on my own, keep my faith, um, with just Jesus, that I didn't need to go to be fed. I thought that it didn't do anything for me.
Speaker 2:Um, I thought that it like, yeah, I grew up knowing the sacraments and I knew up growing that you needed to go to church because you receive forgiveness and you could receive. Yeah, I grew up knowing the sacraments and I knew up growing that you needed to go to church because you receive forgiveness and you could receive Jesus in the sacraments. But like I didn't see that it was applicable to me and in that stage of my life and I think so much like we think as the church that we can debate people back into the pews or that if we show them the right evidence, we can get them back, and it's it's a hard issue more than anything else. Like it's a those who've drifted away. We can, we need to know apologetics, we need to be able to like defend our faith, but like ultimately we can't, we're not going to talk them back in. It's a thousand percent the Holy spirit.
Speaker 2:Like we need to be willing to do what James 19 says and like be slow to speak, quick to listen. But like listen. Like hear what they're actually saying, what their heart is saying. Like is it really that it's the science or that it's, you know, richard Dawkins book on whatever that that made you question your faith or deconstruct? Like deconstruction is a huge thing right now. Um, in the church and and like is it that or is it that there is something deeper in their heart that like they don't feel seen or known by God? Like that they don't. You know they don't. It's the. I think the church, leaving the church is the symptom. But like ultimately, our goal is to join Jesus in his redemption and his salvation. And so, as the church, like yes, we want those prodigals to come back, but like our job isn't to debate them back. Our job is to listen and pray for the Holy Spirit to do whatever it takes to bring them back into church, like to bring them back to faith. Ultimately, faith salvation.
Speaker 1:Like you know, three things you've said, or three things you just said. I've had someone else on the podcast too, who also dripped away when they were young, in college, and she mentioned one of the things you mentioned too the lack of authenticity.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I think when you combine and this is, I hope church people hear this the right way when your life doesn't seem to match your confession and we deny that, that we are, as Luther says, we're Satan's sinner. If we deny the sinner part and just pretend that we're the saint part, we come across as inauthentic people. We come across as inauthentic people and then when young people go off to college and they see contradictions in scripture and inauthentic people and you can't ask questions on top of it, I think you have a perfect storm of something that drifts people away. Because if the people aren't authentic and the message has in their minds has contradictions, then my faith must be on rocky soil. So I think you have that combination from what I've talked to some people so far, that those are kind of the three things that when they see the church in this inauthentic self and not see the Satan center part, it's easier to dismiss other parts of the church as well.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, because it's easy to go in and be like, oh, everybody has it. So together in here. And like, even now, as a DCE, like I laugh all the time I'm like I am so far from perfect, like like I do not have it all together my kids are probably the loudest ones in the pews, but like they're there. So I think like, um, like that's a huge thing now that I'm in back in the church and that God called me miraculously into ministry, is it's like being authentic and showing that, like you're not perfect. The only person who was perfect is Jesus. And like it's it's we are hoping to become more and more like Christ.
Speaker 2:That's what Christians are. Is little, is little Christ, right, but that it's progress over perfection. That it's. You know, I, I'm a DCE and I still struggle to read my Bible daily and like being open about that and and talking about the difficulties, cause, yes, as we grow in our faith, like our spiritual disciplines should grow, but I think too too much in like my, my story is like I saw all these people and it seemed like they had it all together, but then it also didn't match up, like, like there wasn't this authenticity, yeah, this, this reliance on God, almost like it was just yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's interesting. I remember one Sunday I was meeting one of my older members and I was talking about sin and she said to me you know, I'm so sick of you always talking about sin every Sunday. She says I'm just too old to sin. And I quickly responded back no, you're just too old to remember that you sinned.
Speaker 2:That's a blessing if you forget it, I suppose in the end, yeah, no, I mean, we definitely all sit. I think one of my favorite things, like I I'm music is a huge part of the stuff I do in ministry and like I talk about all the time I'm like man, that second that I think I'm doing so good, I'm like I played that part so beautifully, then it's like, and like it's publicly a failure and you're just like well, okay, I'm humbled, it's not about me, it's to you, like I, I think it's publicly a failure and you're just like well, okay, I'm humbled, it's not about me, it's to you. Like I think it's yeah, like the or the old person that says like I'm too old to change, like no, like there's a Sunday school song, like he's still working on me, like, as long as you have breath in your lungs, jesus isn't done like molding you. Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I think sometimes, because we have been in the church for so long and we do the comparison game Well, I'm not as bad as my neighbor who does this, this and this, so we get this, maybe the sense of out-of-worldly holiness that we have. Well, yeah, our life isn't as the other person, but there's still incongruities in our life, there's still things that we struggle with, and I think if we want to connect with younger people or people who walked away from the church, we got to let them know that there's never a point in your life where you ever achieve perfection this side of heaven.
Speaker 2:Right, right, and that like, oh golly, as humans, like we see sin as like murders, this huge sin. And like I always say to the youth, murders, this huge sin. And stealing a pencil is this tiny, itty bitty sin, but like to God, they're all sin. And I had this one DCE friend, she used it and I've used it ever since.
Speaker 2:Like, if you think of like a chain link, like it doesn't matter if one link is huge and one is tiny, if God's holding the top and one link breaks, like we're disconnected from God.
Speaker 2:So to us it might be a bigger sin than our neighbor's sin, but like it's still sin, it's still. It's still like it still takes us away from Jesus, it still takes us away from, it turns our heart away and we need to remember that we all need to repent and turn back in that. Like it's almost, sometimes almost a blessing when you are a prodigal child, to like know your deep, like you know your need for Jesus, like you've seen how depraved like the world is and like you could be, and like you're like yes, like forgive me, and like you're like Nope, I know I'm a sinner, like I need Jesus and I think like there is blessing in that and I think that's one of the hugest things with like having come back is that like God uses our brokenness to shine his light, all the more Like to like we are his glory is made perfect in our weakness, right, exactly and so, yeah, now that you're in the church and you're working in ministry, what would you do for someone like yourself?
Speaker 1:as to college left as strong Christians came back, not just as drif. Help that group that's searching for answers in that age, when they're kind of looking for it. What can the church do?
Speaker 2:I think for me, in our own denomination, like there's a little bit of like. We have our schools and we have those who grew up like going to the parochial schools, going to the parochial cut, like, and there's almost this like disconnect and like I love that I'm a second career because I have the corporate experience and I have walked away and so I have like a little bit different view from like the person who's in church work, who's just always like never struggled and like has always been strong in their faith, always like, never struggled, and like has always been strong in their faith. And so, like having that perspective and being able to relate to someone who is struggling or who is like hey, but this is what I'm learning at college or this is you know something that's I'm questioning, and like we need to be as church workers and as church, as the church in general, like it's OK to ask questions. It's OK to like we have a faith that can stand up to the biggest questions you got. Like let's ask questions. It's okay to like we have a faith that can stand up to the biggest questions you've got. Like let's ask questions, let's find stuff that equips our kids, before they go off to college to know like, hey, you're going to go off to college and you may come across people who don't believe about like the same as we do. Like you can listen to them, but then you can also like come back and ask questions about it and we can like let's grapple with this together.
Speaker 2:You're not alone, my pastor here. He does a phenomenal job of like people can come to him and he will give them as much time as they want to ask questions and like wrestle with things and like help them come to an answer. And like my thing is I don't pretend to know all the answers because I don't, and so like if you come at the answer together or I'll try my best to find somebody who might be able to answer that question, but having the ability to ask questions, having the ability to be approachable because I think sometimes it can seem like again, like I kind of said, like we might have it all together or we might be so unapproachable or too busy doing other things that we're not doing that you know, serving, serving that community, I think, when it comes to like being like talking to parents whose kids have drifted away and having friends who are still prodigal. Like for me, the main thing to do as Christians and this is this came from a curriculum that we started here, but there was a guy who was a prodigal child and his mom prayed for him Lord, do whatever it takes to bring your prodigal son home. Do whatever it takes. And his story is crazy.
Speaker 2:But like that's a bold prayer and a scary prayer to pray, and like I've started praying that for those in my life who are far from Christ and like Lord, do whatever it takes. Like ultimately, we want them to have salvation in Christ Jesus. Yes, we would love them to be back in church. Yes, we would love them to be connected and being fed the sacraments and hearing the word of God weekly, and like learning to grow in spiritual discipline. But ultimately, like we're all about a bigger heaven. We're all about them getting to heaven to be with Jesus, and so we get to be prayer warriors, we get to be good listeners and not listening so that, like we can tell our story or that we can give the right answer, but listening so that we can hear the actual, real question behind the question, because there's always, like you know, the question behind the question. Like, yeah, you might be struggling with that. But ultimately, like you're really struggling with this and and so like let's address the whole issue and let's let's.
Speaker 2:It's taking time for people. Like we're in a world where we just don't take time for people anymore because we're all so busy, and so, as the church, it's seeing that there is this underserved demographic, especially if you're a church in a college community. Like what are? Like what are you doing to reach that age? And even the young singles? We don't serve our singles well in the church. And being single for a long time in my first few years of ministry, like that was something that was huge on my heart. Like how do we, as the church, not just be a place where people can come and meet people, like here's a singles group so you can meet other singles, but like how do we serve where we are at, in the life stages that we are at, and helping people find their gifts and talents to serve in the church?
Speaker 2:And knowing that like you can try different aspects and if that doesn't work, try again. Like again the whole progress over perfection thing. That's a huge trope in my life right now. That's great Something you said.
Speaker 1:It made me think of a movie. I love movies. When you pray that prayer, do whatever it takes to get them back. The first thing that popped in my head was from Forrest Gump and Captain Dan, when he's out on the boat tied to the mast and he says, if you're a real guy, give me all you got. And he's out there in this horrible storm and the wind's blowing and the ships, waves are crashed across the boat and he survives and he says, okay, I believe, but it took God sending every wind, wave, crashing of winds and everything. But he fought and wrestled through the night and he came out to the side and said now um right.
Speaker 2:So I picture that when you said that it's like the v8 commercial.
Speaker 2:Like you should have had a v8, like some of us need that. Like even so, I didn't mention it. But like, even going into ministry, I fought, like I started taking classes but I was still working full time and then I got a 17% raise and I was like, oh, like I don't really want to leave this, this race, um, and like go into debt to go back to college and and all this stuff. And like I remember one Sunday and I know you're not supposed to do this kind of like him in Forrest Gump, like you're not supposed to really test God, right, but I was naive enough that I did so I remember sitting in the back pew and I was like, all right, god, like I know I've asked you multiple times and you keep saying yes through different like people and different things.
Speaker 2:It's like if you truly want me to go into ministry, the next song the praise band plays is amazing grace, my chains are gone. And like it had been quiet. We were praying, there was no like background music and the song starts and I'm like, oh man, like it is amazing grace, I can't say no now. Like I got specific like so yeah, I've been there and some of us need that. Like that, smack you across the face with the wind and the rain and the storm to to wake us up to okay, yeah, you are real.
Speaker 1:Um that's hilarious. I I tell I've told the story to a few people. Not many people know the story, but I was at seminary and I was ready to quit. It was hard. I walked in and was just hit with a bunch of troubles and I'm like I said to God I'm like God, if you want me to stay at seminary, you need to do something really big or I'm out of here tomorrow. I was ready to pack up and go back to Louisiana and go into computer science. I could be happy there, happy I get a. I get a call from the financial aid department that says a church in Decatur, illinois, um, just gave two gifts to students and we're giving you one of them for $15,000, $15,000 to cover your, your entire seminary education.
Speaker 1:I'm like what in the world?
Speaker 2:Well, that's big, I got to stay. God paid for it. He just paid for it.
Speaker 1:Oh well, you asked oh, that's a great, oh man.
Speaker 2:So I blame this to church indicated for me being a pastor, but I think that's part of it. Like, even when you go into church work like Satan's he works overtime on church workers and like there's so much like the church is full of sinners, so of course you know we're going to get hurt and there's going to be situations that are painful, and I know so many people who are in the church, who were workers and they've been hurt by the church and so like even in that, like my prayer has always been Lord, like I want to love you no-transcript joy, and it's like having those moments of like all right, god, I'm ready to walk away. Like show up and he does, and that's amazing.
Speaker 1:That's amazing, yeah. So, as you think about where you are right now in ministry, what are you excited about in this season of your life?
Speaker 2:I think so. I'm just a year into my new call here in Iowa and like my season of life has changed so much, like my seasons in ministry have changed so drastically. I was single, I got married, I had kids. Like you know, I've gone from moving across country with just my dog at 25 to now being back in Iowa with two little kids and a husband, and so this season is crazy. But the thing I love the most, I think here at my current call I get to be a generalist, so to speak, and I'm doing things like a women's book club on CS Lewis's Screwtape I'm doing confirmation. I'm helping with Screwtape. I'm doing confirmation. I'm helping with the youth group. I'm doing music. Like I get to do a lot of different stuff. I'm a learner, like I love to read. I have 20 books that I'm always kind of like going through and reading and I teach through what I read and what I learn at the time. And so, like, most excited about in ministry right now in this season, I think, is just getting to know the community I'm currently serving in and getting to become a bigger part of the community I'm currently serving in. I'm getting to see what needs there are here and how, like God has uniquely gifted me in this season for those needs Because we do have, like our church is just crazy blessed with just so many little kids and so many young families and like that's where the life stage I'm currently at. So how can I be authentic and serve in that way? And and um, one of the things, like I'm also doing a Bible reading challenge at our church. Um, and I'm so horribly behind and like, just being honest about that, like it's Holy Week and I've had sick kids, like I haven't read my Bible all week and so like just there's so much I'm excited about. Just in ministry in general, there's a ton of new stuff to get to learn. I'm new to the Iowa District West, so getting to like learn how this district runs and getting to be a part of that has been really exciting.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, I'll just tell you, this district is awesome, and the people and the pastors and DCEs in are really awesome too.
Speaker 2:So yeah, I've enjoyed it so far, but that's to do a lot so far. Thank you, ramda.
Speaker 1:If you had some words of wisdom for someone who was in the situation you were in and you have 30 seconds to just kind of speak to them right now, to their heart, what would you say?
Speaker 2:That you are never too far and that if God can call me back, he can call you back, and if God can use me in ministry, then he for sure can use you. Yeah, that would be my 30-second spiel. I could go longer, but that's good.
Speaker 1:I love to ask my guests this question what do you want your legacy to be?
Speaker 2:Oh, that's a huge question. I mean, like there's so many facets right, like I want my legacy to be my kids and my marriage and I want them to be strong and brave, courageous men of faith who sparkle Jesus in their own unique way, right, shine Jesus in their own unique way as they grow up. I think for me my legacy, kind of harkening back to what I just said you know the Japanese kitsuingi I'm totally butchering that, probably but the pottery, the pottery where they take the broken pottery and they infuse it with gold to fix it in the cracks.
Speaker 2:And so if I could think of my legacy, it would be that God uses our broken vessels, uses our brokenness, and he can make it better. And he, his light, can shine better through our brokenness. Um that if he can use a broken person like me, um, to shine his light, then he can use anybody um to shine his light and you don't have to. Like church work is fantastic, it's hard but it's fantastic, Um, and you don't have to be a church worker to shine his light. Like where you are, the vocation you are in, the, the job you are in, the family you are in. Like he uses you where you're at if you're willing, and so that he can take our brokenness and he can make it beautiful and he gets the glory for it and that's awesome.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. As we wrap up our talk today, what's the one takeaway you want the audience to walk away with?
Speaker 2:Progress over perfection, that we're all a work in progress, that you have breath in your lungs. Jesus isn't done with you. He's still working on you. Um that um that you are loved by the God of this universe, that he thought that the world needed one of you. And even if you question, even if you doubt, even if you have walked away the furthest you can walk away, it is never too far for God and that I pray that, if you have turned away from God, that you have prayer warriors in your life who are down on their knees daily for you, praying that God will do whatever it takes to bring that prodigal son, that prodigal daughter, home, because, ultimately, he is always at work doing his redemption and his salvation and sometimes we just get to come along and join him in it, which is just an honor and exciting, yeah, yeah it is.
Speaker 1:So where can people find you if they want to follow all the great things you're doing on social media?
Speaker 2:I actually don't do a ton of social media, so I have a Facebook account. I was really highly addicted to Instagram and I noticed that I needed to delete it for a while in my life. So I'm not on Instagram anymore, so I am on Facebook. Catherine Schneider, you can find me at scionmanningcom, our church. We have a newsletter I write for every month. I also have a Bible challenge. If you want to join us on our Zion Bible challenge, everybody from around the world's welcome to join us. It's Zion Bible challenge on Facebook as well. It's not updated because I haven't updated it yet this week yet, but I'll get there and you can always email me. D, c, e, catherine K A, t H R Y N at gmailcom. But yeah, those are, that's how you find me.
Speaker 1:Well, catherine, thanks for this awesome conversation and blessings on your holy week.
Speaker 2:Pray your kids are feeling better, because there's nothing worse than having sick kids on holy week on holy week, right, yes, yeah, thank you so much for this opportunity. It's been really fun yeah, it has been.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much blessings.