Transforming SME Customer Service: Expert Tips from Vance Morris

ABOUT THE GUEST AND WHAT'S IN STORE FOR YOU.

Today you can discover how to deliver unforgettable customer experiences with Vance Morris, a former Disney leader who mastered the art of "Disnifying" businesses. 

Drawing on his time at Disney, Vance shares proven strategies to help SMEs create magical customer moments on a budget, recover from service failures, and scale without losing their service edge. 

Learn how attention to detail, culture-building, and practical systems can transform your business into a loyalty-driving powerhouse. 

If you’re an SME owner or professional eager to stand out with superior customer service, this episode is a must-listen!

To learn more from Vance, why not check out these links and don't forget to purchase his books!:

https://www.deliverservicenow.com 
https://www.linkedin.com/in/vancemorris/
https://www.facebook.com/vance.morris.9/
https://www.instagram.com/morrisvance/
https://www.youtube.com/@Deliverservicenow

ABOUT THE HOST

My name is Dave Barr and I am the Founder and Owner of RLB Purchasing Consultancy Limited.

I have been working in Procurement for over 25 years and have had the joy of working in a number of global manufacturing and service industries throughout this time.

I am passionate about self development, business improvement, saving money, buying quality goods and services, developing positive and effective working relationships with suppliers and colleagues, and driving improvement through out the supply chain.

CONTACT DETAILS

@The Real Life Buyer
Email: david@thereallifebuyer.co.uk
Website: https://linktr.ee/thereallifebuyer

For Purchasing Consultancy services:
https://rlbpurchasingconsultancy.co.uk/
Email: contact@rlbpurchasingconsultancy.co.uk

Find and Follow me @reallifebuyer on Facebook, Instagram, X, Threads and TikTok.

Transcript

Intro  00:00

Welcome to the Real Life Buyer podcast. In this podcast, you will hear interviews with business owners, entrepreneurs, thought leaders, authors and technical specialists in their field. These professionals will hasten your development, accelerate your career, and broaden your business. Know how now, introducing your host, Dave Barr, interviewing with a purchasing twist. 

Dave Barr  00:21

Hello and welcome to the Real Life Buyer. Today, I'm delving into the secrets of delivering extraordinary customer experiences, something I feel so many businesses are lacking in right now. Today, I'm joined by Vance Morris, a former Disney leader turned entrepreneur and Customer Service Authority, drawing from his 10 years at Disney, Vance now helps businesses disneyfy their customer service. Blending Disney inspired strategies with practical, scalable solutions for SMEs and many others. Vance is also the author of three books, "Systematic Magic", "Tales from the Customer Service Crypt" and "The Wealthy Cleaner Blueprint." Today we'll uncover his seven magic keys for exceptional service. Learn how to recover from service failures profitably, and explore how SMEs can create unforgettable experiences that boost loyalty and revenue. So without further ado, I welcome Vance Morris onto the podcast. Hi Vance.

Vance Morris  01:22

Thank you so much, Dave. I look forward to being here. Hopefully everybody can understand me with my American accent.

Dave Barr  01:29

I'm sure we can. We're very used to American accents in the UK, so thanks. Now I've been looking through your professional profile and your website and and loved yourself description and if I can quote it, it says, "former rockin birth control factory security guard turned Disney leader, turn bankrupt out of work executive, turn carpet cleaner turned successful entrepreneur". So please tell us some of the highlights of this quite incredible journey that drove your passion for helping others to make their customer service exceptional.

Vance Morris  02:04

Yeah, well, I mean, all of that is true. So you know, truth sometimes is stranger than fiction. I was a security guard at a birth control factory. It was my college job. Very interesting, very boring, but very interesting, really. Not much to say there, because nothing ever happened. But yeah, so when I got out of college, I worked for Disney for 10 years, it was probably the best thing that happened to me, is as that would laid the foundation for what I was going to do for the rest of my life. And one of the first things I learned at Disney, and it wasn't customer service, it wasn't wowing people, or learning how to pick up trash before it before it even hits the ground. You know, Disney's known for that kind of stuff. It was Disney runs on systems and processes, and I was thoroughly amazed. I got to my first job at Disney, and we were opening up a new resort, and this was before the internet, and, you know, a lot of computers and things, and there were these giant binders everywhere. I mean, just stacks of these binders. And I'm I had, I asked my boss, I said, What? What are all these binders? He goes, Well, these are our SOPs and our ojts on all of the different positions and how to open a new resort. I was, I mean, I was floored at the level of detail, not only for just running stuff, but for opening. I was just, I was like, This is amazing. And so no, no stern stone was left unturned. I mean, everything down to, you know, how to sweep the streets and how to clean the dishes. I mean, everything was covered. It was absolutely brilliant. I couldn't that was more impressive, really, than you know how we served people. I was just really blown away by it. I did leave Disney. People do leave. Spent 10 years there, but I get that question quite frequently. And I was 10 years with a company. I was like, Well, is there anything else out there in the world? So spent a number of years with different restaurants. Actually another 15 years in restaurants, hospitality, hotels along the way found out I make a lousy employee. I don't like to be told what to do. So hence me getting into my own companies. And I did. I started a carpet cleaning company, and that's what all small children dream of doing when they're growing up. So they're astronauts and baseball players. We all want to be carpet cleaners deep in our hearts, so we so I started. And the reason I chose that, one, it was small enough that I could do it, you know, on my own. And two, it was something that was considered a lowly commodity business. I don't know about in the UK, but in the States, you. Your carpet cleaners, not exactly looked upon as, you know, high Echelon type services, but I was going to make it one. I was going to make it a premium level service. And that's what I said about doing. We started out with premium level prices. We set our standards that we weren't going to clean certain types of homes. Primarily we started out with just, we wouldn't clean rentals because, I mean, people who live in rentals, generally, I'm being very broad here. I don't want anybody who's living in a rental to get all upset. But primarily the rental for us, it was a, we have a large resort area, and they're, they're weekly rentals, so, I mean, they just get beat up by all of the visitors and holiday people. And it just wasn't something we wanted to do, because the owners wanted it done quick and cheap and well, and we're like, Well, you know, pick one, but we can't do all three. So we really focused on the affluent market. We soon added a oriental rug washing facility to it, which again lends itself to affluent market. We were able to continuously increase prices continuously and to the experience because we were charging more. So when you when you charge more, you can create better experiences. And it's like this flywheel. You charge more, you put some of that extra money in your pocket as profit, and then you take some of that money and you reinvest it in the experience, and then it gets better. And you do the same thing again. You take some of that money, you put it in your pocket, and you take some of that money, and you put it back in the experience, and it just, it just keeps going, and there's really no end to it. And people started to ask me, this is probably about 2013 people said, you know, well, how are you doing this? Because you don't look like you're working very hard, which was a very astute observation. And so I started coaching and consulting with businesses on how I was putting this all together. Which brings us to today.

Dave Barr  07:11

Brilliant. I'll touch on two things you've mentioned there. Firstly, the systems, the processes, everything that you observed happening in the background in Disney, did you see that translated into other businesses you worked in? And did you have the same thing in your business?

Vance Morris  07:28

100% I knew well, one I knew I didn't want to clean carpet for the rest of my life, and so I knew if I was going to not sell the business or get out of it, but if I was going to not clean carpet and be able to do other things, I was going to have to put systems in place. So, and that's what I did from the beginning, constantly documenting marketing systems, operation systems, sales systems, you know, how do we how do we clean systems, everything? So when I hired a General Manager, which is probably seven years ago, put a general manager in place, and I said, just run the systems. Don't get any crazy ideas. Don't change anything. Just run the systems. Now, if you think there's a better way to do it, great. When we have our weekly meeting, we'll sit down, we'll talk about it. If it's something that's an improvement, great. I'm all ears. But just run the systems, and that's what he does, which allows me to, I mean, I, honestly, I and I have three home service businesses. I spend about 90 minutes a week on them. So systems equals freedom. It allows you to go and do things that without them, you would be, you'd be going crazy. Now, say you don't want to be a coach or a consultant, you don't want to go do other things. Great. Systems still have a place, and it will allow you to, well, let's see, go and get more business, because without systems, if you're just running around all willy nilly, you don't have time to build the business. So yeah, systems very important in in a small business.

Dave Barr  09:03

Yeah. And the second thing I'd like to touch on you mentioned that you'd be increasing prices and adding some of that value, I've seen to yourself, but also into the experience of the customer. Now, so many businesses these days are on the race to the bottom. They think they've got to get more market share by reducing prices. So what made you think and travel in the opposite direction by increasing your prices? 

Vance Morris  09:25

 Yeah, well, certainly. So you know, there is no competitive advantage to being second cheapest at all. Hey, come see us. We're second cheapest that that doesn't do any good. So you have to be the cheapest, which is constantly bringing price down and erodes all margins. And sooner or later, you're, you know, you're paying the customer to go and do the service for them. I'll give you a quick example. So I had a string of service stations here in the US, I don't know, in the UK, you may have them. They're like, Jiffy Lube. They're like, Oh. They'll change places quick lubes. And he was always getting beat up on price, and he was competing on it. And he said, This is just crazy. So we turned his service stations into the old 1950s style service stations where, like, four guys run out, they're all in white shirts and bow ties and gloves, and they open the doors, and one guy squeegee in the windshield, another guy's checking the air pressure in the tires, and they lead you into the waiting room. And in the waiting room there's not three day old stale coffee, there's actually a barista there ready to make your favorite coffee drink. And you know, I mean, I'm, I'm shrinking this down quite a bit. I mean, there's a lot of other components to it, but he is now 45% higher in price than his local competitors. Here's what that and he's got a huge line. People want the experience they are willing to pay for the experience. He's serving probably 30 35% less people than his competitors, but he's charging 45% more, much more profitable. It's less wear and tear on the equipment, less wear and tear on his employees. They're not working as hard. So now he's got higher customer or, excuse me, employee retention. The customers love it. And so increasing those prices have not just a a benefit to experiences and money in your pocket, but customer, customer retention, employee retention, wear and tear on the buildings, if you have vehicles, etc, there's, there are a lot of benefits to to to those prices. And you know, if you, if you want to go cheap, good luck, but you're competing against Amazon and Walmart, and you can't, it's just you'll be out of business real fast.

Dave Barr  11:50

Yeah, that's really interesting. And also you get a different type of customer, I guess, the ones that, as you say, truly appreciate and value the service you're providing. And you know, if you go cheap, let's say you just get everybody who moans and groans or wants everything for nothing, I guess, right?

Vance Morris  12:08

And they're pulling coupons out of their pockets, and they're like, Oh, well, this only expired yesterday. Take it today. And you're it's, yeah,

Dave Barr  12:17

Brilliant. So I guess this is what you talk about when you say about disneyfying businesses. So for those SMEs, they could be small manufacturing companies or whatever. What would you say are the most impactful low cost strategies to create a Disney light customer experience that you because you want to make sure you get the delighted clients that come back time after time, and you seem to be suggesting those, the people that you're managing to get with higher prices?

Vance Morris  12:44

Yeah, you know, I mean, there are a lot of ways to, especially, you know, by low, no cost ways, I call them, you know, ways to wow without breaking the bank. And it's, it's a lot of stuff that grandma taught us, you know, grandma taught us you write a thank you letter when you get a gift from somebody, right? And so that's what we do. We write handwritten thank you notes to all of our customers after we do the service the next day, handwritten thank you note goes out. Nobody's doing that. I mean, I have I go to the same auto dealer to buy vans for our fleet I have so I'm I'm spending $30,000 at a drop. Never once have I gotten I even gotten a postcard, but I've never gotten a thank you note. I'm doing a $300 carpet cleaning, and I'm doing thank you notes, thank you notes, thank you notes. What that does is it starts to create an emotional connection with my customers now. Oh, my God, he took the time to write a thank you note, just like grandma, another easy thing. How about answering the phone live, we all, I mean, really, this will separate you from every business out there, because we all have gotten lazy and we start with the automated, you know phone thing? Push one for this, two for that, three for this. Our companies aren't big enough for that. We really, I mean, unless you're AT and T or, you know, or one of the big grocery chain, you just answer the phone live, you will separate yourself from everyone else, especially if you're advertising on Google. So if you're advertising on Google, you're paying to be there and you don't answer the phone live well. One, when somebody calls you, one, you just paid for that phone call, probably a lot of money. Two, that person, that customer prospect, is not waiting for you to call them back. They just went to the second guy in the list on Google and so on and so on. So, I mean, we answered the phone live. And people are, I listen to the calls, and at least one call a day, people are like, Oh my God, you answered the phone. Oh yeah. So it's. Simple things like that, follow up, you know, calling the day after the service. Oh, my God. We give gifts. They're not expensive gifts. They're very small. So, like, when we come to a customer's house, you know, we're going, like, if you're going to a home for a party, or, you know, little gathering, you'll bring a bottle of wine or, you know, some hors d'oeuvres or snacks or something, and you don't go empty handed, well, we feel the same way we're going to somebody's home. So we bring a little gift, and it's Nothing extravagant. It's a custom little blue box and and it is a bottle of our spot remover, a bag of cookies and a little note from me. Well, when was the last time you had somebody from the trades show up at your house with a little gift I would imagine Probably never. I have no right, but to me, for us, it costs less than $5 US, it separates us from everybody else out there. Nobody's doing it, and when you do that little gift, it starts a process called reciprocity. If I give something to you, you feel compelled to give something back to me. It's just human psychology. It's just the way it works. And so when we do that, one, yes, we're doing it to separate ourselves. Two, we're doing it. Yes, it's to be nice, but we also know that customers are going to give something back. So when it comes time for us to do our sales presentation, 26% more people pick a higher package than before we did the gift. So for us, that equated to, like, an additional $65,000 in sales every year for a little $5 gift. Not a bad trade off. So you just have to look at your your customer journey. You know, where each point where your business comes in contact with the customer, and you look at it and you're like, how can we make that better? You know, answering the telephone. Well, if you're not answering it, live, the way to make it better, answer it. Live. Great. Six months later, okay, how can we make answering the telephone better? Well, let's answer it in four rings, right? Six months later, come back, we'll answer it in three rings, right? It's all just incremental, different iterations, but incremental, constantly getting better. All the stuff that I've been doing in my business have been just incremental improvements that gift. I mean, it took us probably 1824, months to get that gift to where it is today. It did. We didn't just think of this. It just, it just took some time to get to it. So don't think, I mean, I'm talking to I mean, I've had this business now 17 years, so I've had time to implement this stuff. So everything I'm giving you now, you could go out and do it and not have to wait 17 years. You just go do it.

Dave Barr  17:46

So brilliant advice that there's a couple of words that jump into my mind, is the personalization of things. People feel that you're talking to them directly. In this case, you particularly are. You're showing appreciation for their business as well. And it's not taken for granted. I think everybody these days feel a bit taken for granted. You know, you pay consistently a subscription, for example, to a business, particularly Telecom, shall we say, every month you pay the money, and the next time the renewal comes up, you see, it jumps up. And so what does everybody do? They have to ring them up and try and negotiate the price down. Rather, they will quite happily give a lower price to a new customer, to an existing customer, so they don't feel appreciated. And therefore, what they do the other negotiate down or just leave. Yeah, so in this case, we're talking about an emotional investment in the people, not a financial one, as you say, she's now, feels that she can relate to you as a human being and a human being's family, as opposed to a service provider, right?

Vance Morris  18:37

Right. And that's, and that's, and that's a problem. I think that is the the worst thing a company can do is give a better price to a new client. This is this atrocious. I I never do that. I would. I wouldn't dream of doing that. I think that's just a slap in the face to your your current customers, and the fact that the and the other thing that's bad is the only time you ever hear from a company is when they want money. That's horrible, too. So I mean, for your audience, if you you know it's, let's say you only see your customer once a year. Well, is that the only time you they ever hear from you is when you're taking money from them. That's not a relationship. That's just that's a one way street. You go out, you fix the air conditioning, and they give you a check, and then, boom, you don't see them for another year. If they find a better deal, they're leaving. So one of the huge things that Disney does, and what I teach, is creating a connection, creating some kind of and I'm not talking woo, woo. You know Hocus Pocus, I'm talking a real emotional connection. One of the best ways to do that is to stay in constant contact with your customers between services. So I am a firm believer. There in sending mail like through the Postal Service, last I checked, they have a better deliverability rate than any email platform out there. In the US, it's still about 99% and I'm about the UK, but in us, about 99% so I send a print newsletter through the mail, and I've been doing it and all of my businesses now for well over 15 years, and I shamelessly use my children in my marketing. Love it. So my daughter, when she was five, love to do ballet, and so at the recital, I took a picture of her in her tutu, and I put it front and center in the newsletter. And every year, ballet recital, picture, newsletter, and so my my my customers, watched my kids grow up. So she was probably 10 or 11, and we were in the grocery store, and this lady came running up to my daughter. She was, Oh, my God, Emma, how was your ballet recital? My daughter and I looked at each other and we're like, that was this lady. We're ready to run away. And I had to think, she's gotta be one of my customers. She is never leaving me as a customer. She we have created an emotional connection with her, and she's not leaving. And as small business owners, we have to be able to create those connections so that when we do a price increase, or, heaven forbid, we screw up and make a mistake, if we've created that connection, they are more more willing to forgive us, more willing to accept the price increase, because we have that connection with them, and it makes it easier, plus, we become more referable. Oh, you know, I just got a newsletter from the plumber the other day. And, you know, Betty Sue's got a plug toilet. Oh, I just got a newslet. You call these guys so, I mean, if it's even if it's not a newsletter, send a postcard once a month, and it doesn't always have to be salesy, you know. I mean, yeah, you can put an offer in there, but you know, if you're always pounding people with discounts and promotions, it's, it's not a relationship, it's just business stuff.  100% and you know, any chance you get to make a connection at some level with with your with your, your customers, you should do so I do. I do a lot of speaking. I speak around the world on customer experience, and I slip in in my speeches, I slip in a lot of a lot of my background, my personal background, into the speech so that I can make a connection with somebody in the audience. Because the more people I can connect with in the audience, the more they're going to listen and possibly even maybe buy something. So I mentioned the fact that, yes, I've been married a couple of times. Okay, great. I have now connected with all of the divorced people in the audience. Okay, I mentioned that I have four kids. Great. I have now connected with anybody who has multiple children, you know, and so on and so forth. So it's not, you know, I'm not talking about my shoe size or, you know, whatever. But I'm I'm mentioning things that are part of who I am, so that I can resonate and connect with people in my audience or my customers, and then they get it, they connect

Dave Barr  23:35

Absolutely Now, I mentioned in the introduction about seven magic keys, and you just mentioned a few seconds ago about when a business makes a mistake. So if we put those together, what do you see as the seven magic keys of a customer service recovery plan? I think that's what you referred to, and that in this case, it not only resolves issues, but turns dissatisfied customers into loyal advocates. So can you share about that?

Vance Morris  24:00

Yeah. So, well, first, I think most businesses should practice what I call anticipatory service, so that you prevent the problem from ever happening, you know. So I work a lot with medical offices, orthodontists and such. And notoriously, doctors are always late. I don't know about in the UK, but in the US, they're always late and behind which is a real irritant to the patient. So I was working with one doc, and then he agreed. He was, yes, we need to do something, you know, but he didn't really believe it. So I pulled the office manager aside, and I said, you know, why don't you go out and buy, you know, whole bunch of $5 Starbucks gift cards. And when people come in, if the doc's running late, I want you to give one to every patient that's coming in late. So front desk lady would stand up and say, you know, I'm really sorry, but Doctor Bob is running a. Little behind today, but we really value your time. Here's a $5 Starbucks card. Please get a coffee on us before, you know, once you leave, and so, I mean, you're, you didn't solve the problem, but you're, at least you anticipate the problem. And you know, the patient doesn't feel so bad. But we had a meeting, the finance meeting the next month, and a doctor was looking at it, and goes, you know, what is this $3,000 marketing cost? And we're like, oh, that's all the $5 Starbucks cards we gave away for every time you were late. I swear to God, the next day he was not late for one appointment. So we've we solved the problem. So that's anticipatory. Now, when you are when you do have an issue, one, if you've created these connections, they're going to be a little bit more lenient with you and not like yell and scream and pound the table, and it really depends on what you've done, you know. But let's take being late again. So my guys in the carpet biz or in the mold company, they know if they're running late one, they call the next customer and say, Look, I'm stuck on a job. I'm going to be a little bit behind. And they do that when they realize they're going to be behind, not when they're already late. Then they call the office and they say, you know, hey, I'm running late. So then the office manager calls and apologizes, and then on the way from that house to the next house, the technician stops at a local grocery store and buys flowers and takes the flowers to the next house and says, I'm so sorry. Mrs. Smith, I'm, you know, I was unavoidable. I'm really sorry we were late. Here's some flowers, you know, to brighten up your kitchen. Now, what lady is going to yell at a guy who's standing there with a bouquet of flowers, and if a guy answers the door, you know? Well, it's a little awkward, but you're like, well, here, just give these to your wife, you know. So, I mean, there are ways you want to you want to interrupt and acknowledge that you've made the mistake and try to fix it before it gets worse. Because when, when time elapses, the problem gets worse. The problem gets more expensive to fix. So it's like getting a cut on your finger. You got a cut on your finger, and you put a little loin and then the band aid on it. It's going to get better. But if you get a cut on your finger, you put a little dirt in it, and you rub that around, pretty soon it's, you know, it's infected, and then it gets gangrene, and then they got to amputate. It's the same thing with a problem, you know, if you know, if you have struggling, for an example here real quick. But if you, you know, let's say you have a burnt steak, you know, they send it back, and, you know, it's a party of six, and it's one meal burnt steak, and they're like, well, we'll recook it, and they send it back, and then it comes back out, and it's burnt again, and then they send it back, and then the entire party is done eating their dinner, and one guy you know finally gets his third steak. And it's easy. They've really ruined the dinner for this, this this party, and let's say nobody comes over to apologize. Chef doesn't come out, manager doesn't come out. Nothing's done now they're kind of getting cranky, right? I mean, they were probably cranky after the first burnt steak, where anybody could have come out and apologized, maybe offered the guy a salad or another glass of wine, and they probably would have been happy with that. Probably would have cost them, what, 10 bucks for that. Maybe after the second burnt steak, they could go, oh my god, we're really sorry, you know, let's, let's, you know, we'll buy a round of desserts, you know, for the table. We're really sorry, but if nothing happened now, the manager is getting called to the table because these people are ticked off, and now they're into the negotiation of how much do I have to take off of the whole ticket. You know, am I comping 50% 75% how much? How much do I need to compensate these people so that we can get them back in so you see how time elapsed. In the beginning, it wasn't very expensive. At the end, it's extremely expensive. And you've also risked that customer never coming back. 

Dave Barr  29:19

Yeah, absolutely. And equally, they'll probably share that experience with not just one friend, but probably many friends as well, exactly.

Vance Morris  29:26

Exactly and bad news travels faster than good news, absolutely. 

Dave Barr  29:30

Yeah, it's it's great you mentioned that, because that leads very nicely onto my next question of recognizing the higher revenue and profitability you get when you make sure your customer has an outstanding experience? Can you give us some context in what's possible? Do you have any particular clients or any experiences where you say, well, when they're operating as they were, they were generating X amount of money after they worked on the customer experience with yourself, they ended up at a. New Level. Can you share anything there? Sure,

Vance Morris  30:01

Sure, I worked with a dentist down in Florida. Now, I know UK, you have the national, national insurance. So here in the US, you know, we have insurance, but it's personal, but we also have private pay. So we I working with a dentist, and there were eight other dentists in her building. They all took insurance. So, you know, their co pay, you know, they pay, everybody pays $30 and you can pick whatever dentist. And there was no separating the dentist. She was she, you know, she was struggling, she was working, you know, she was seeing, you know, however many patients every day, really not making a lot, couldn't pay back her her student loans, because, I mean, you know, medical school. I mean, I think she was in her late 40s, and she still hadn't paid back the medical loans. And so we, we got hooked up. I can't remember, maybe orthodontist client of mine hooked us up. And I said, Well, what, you know, what can we do? Here she goes, I don't know, but this is, you know, this is really frustrating. I want to make more money, and I don't want to be working this hard. I said, Well, would you be open to stop taking insurance and go completely private pay, where you control your prices? She goes, I think I could do that. I said, Okay, so we do a brainstorming session about, again, their personality, what did they like? And I found out her favourite movie was Peter Pan. And I said, Okay, great. So long story. We did a whole bunch of negotiation and brainstorming and stuff. And so we created the pirate dentist, all right, so we, I mean, she was one that she just went she went all out on her office. So so now when you go see her, she turned 18. She also was going to be just a pediatric dentist. So once you turned 18, she didn't want to see you anymore. So now when you go into her office, she's dressed as Captain Hook. The dental technicians all look like Mr. Smee. They walk around the office saying, arg, there's a giant ship wreck in the in the front of the office. That's like a playground where they they go in and they do things. They have TVs in the ceiling that are playing Peter Pan. She charged it. They have the, oh, the floor looks like the ocean. So when you're, you know, and Wendy and everybody were flying into Neverland, and you could see kind of the ocean on the ground and the islands and everything, well, that's what the floor is painted like. The the chairs are like little row boats. I mean, she just went completely all out on this, and she stopped taking insurance, and she charged whatever she charges. So I mean, remember, she had eight other dentists in her building that she was competing with, so when she made the switch, she stopped picking insurance. So she got rid of two and a half people in her office. Eliminated two and a half positions because that's all they did, was insurance billing. So that was about $160,000 a year in salary she was able to eliminate because she didn't take insurance anymore. Obviously, she was able to raise her prices because everybody wanted to go see the pirate dentist. And so she had no problems with capacity. I mean, she was just seeing people like because everybody wanted to go there. She eventually was able to hire two other dentists, so we had two more Captain Hooks in there. And now she works, like, three days a week, and her medical debt is paid off. So she's kind of, I don't want to say she's an extreme example. And yes, she did some some infrastructure changes. I mean, she went all in on creating an environment that was, you know, really designed for the kids. But she doesn't have an advertising problem. She doesn't have a, you know, people lining up at the door problem. I mean, she is just the people just coming to see her. And could anybody have done that? Certainly, but nobody had the, I guess the word is the guts to try it. You know what I mean. But she was just at her wits end. She was just like, I don't want to do this forever. This is killing me. Is not why I got into dentistry. So she said, You know what? Let's take, let's take the leap. I'll, I'll make the leap. And it worked for her. So it's like a great case of certainly, trying to differentiate yourself your business away from all the others. And it may sound like an extreme case, but you know, how on earth do you segregate yourself from other dentists make yourself stand out? So it's a brilliant example of thinking outside of the proverbial box and such. I mean a dentist as a dentist, as a dentist, how do you separate one from the other?

Dave Barr  34:44

You know? Yeah. So it's all about creating that experience that everybody enjoys and makes you unique. So very few people can, you know, try and copy that as well, isn't it? Now, one thing I want to touch back on are systems and processes and the fact that you've. Talked about where people make mistakes and you anticipate. Now for many businesses, not many, spend a lot of time in anticipating what could go wrong, be it with a product they have or a service they have. So can you give us maybe another example or two of where businesses purposely go and identify all the opportunities where things could go wrong, and then make sure they have it documented and people are trained to know how to deal with the different types of failure that could occur. 

Vance Morris  35:33

Yeah, I think I don't know that you could document everything. I mean that to me. I mean, systems are designed to kind of give you guardrails or guide rails. And so at Disney and in my businesses, the the systems are designed to give you freedom, and not just for me, but for the technicians and the hourly workers. And when they have the systems, they understand this. These are the guidelines. This is what, this is the the the lane I need to be in. And if I do that, then I have freedom to add little things on the outside, the little wows, the little excitement we identify, as far as recovery we identify, or we, give the authority to the employees a certain dollar amount. So if you go to a Ritz Carlton, now, I am not advocating this for small business, but if you go to a Ritz Carlton, they give every employee there $2,000 to solve a guest issue, no questions asked. If you need to solve a guest issue, you have the ability to spend up to $2,000 to solve that issue. And I mean, you, you know, if it's if you spend, however much you spend, you know, you will get asked, say, Hey, what happened? And, you know, maybe coached on, could you have done something else? But you won't get in trouble. You just do it. So I like to work in kind of thresholds, and Disney does this is, you know, let's say, you know, from zero to $50 is this a zero to $50 problem? You know it. And you ask yourself, if this happened, and I was offered a $50 solution, would I be happy? Would that be enough to make me come back? And would that be enough to satisfy me? If, yes, great the line. And the thing is, it's got to be at the line level employee being able to do that. They got to be empowered to take and issue that. Because remember, if it goes up to the next level, time has elapsed and the problem has gotten worse, and now if the $50 thing doesn't work, okay, sir, well, you know, I can see you're not going to be satisfied with with my solution, which this is really all I'm authorized to do, but I want to make sure that you're, you know, you're happy, and we can really take care of you. It's going to be one second. Let me just bring in somebody who has a little more. Has a little more juice than I do, and we'll bring them in, and we'll get this sorted out. That would be, you know, kind of the way. And, you know, different levels have different authorities. Some people might want to say, You know what here, 500 bucks, just whatever you got to do. 500 bucks, take care of the customer. I mean, it really just depends on your business. I mean, I wouldn't I mean, I wouldn't give my guys 500 bucks to solve a problem, but would I say, You know what, if, if something's really screwed up, would I say, You know what, just go ahead and give it to them for free. The cleaning, yeah. Say, look, if they are that mad, say, Look, you know, Mrs. Smith, I know we were late. I know we weren't able to get that spot out of the carpet. I'm so sorry, and I know you're really frustrated. We'd like to just give this to you on the house. I usually that kind of shuts them up. They appreciate it. And we've even gotten, you know, reviews that said, you know, they did a really good job. They were late. I was probably a little out of line. I was angry with them, but they just just gave it to us.

Dave Barr  39:08

That's a great example. And I guess, in turn, your employees feel empowered, trusted and recognized as being somebody that can take a decision on behalf of the company. So I think they're probably quite fired up.

Vance Morris  39:22

It does and you know, that helps with employee retention. You know, you can't. You know, Disney tried this. They tried to say they wanted the management there to have an ownership mentality. Now, I know what they were trying to do, but it didn't come out well. I mean, there were, when I was there, there were 35,000 employees. Now there's 80,000 there is no way I was going to have any kind of ownership of anything in that company. I mean, it just, you know, it wasn't, I mean, I had my stock, but that was it. It should have been more authority, yeah, kind of thing so. But if you want people to be engaged. So they do have to have the authority to be able to take care of stuff, and that's how you get them engaged. If you have employees that are engaged, they're not leaving. There's they're gonna because they feel like they are contributing to something a little bit bigger. My carpet cleaning company, my guy, my general manager, has been with me 12 years, no, 14 years, that's like 17 lifetimes in the carpet cleaning world, you know, and my other guys have all been with me over five so, you know, it's just how you treat them, what you allow them to do. And yeah.

Dave Barr  40:36

I guess two things that just popped into my mind then is, firstly, you must be very good at recruiting the right people, so I would surprise you if you got a system for that. And secondly, it's creating the right culture in your business. If you've got a few words you could share on those two.

Vance Morris  40:50

Sure, so we hire for attitude, not aptitude. I can teach you to do anything, but I can't teach you to be nice, right? So then I can't teach you to be on time. So like, if you're late to the interview, I didn't even bother with the interview, that's it. You're done. You know, because you're going to be late to work, I don't even give my grace period, you know, if you don't want, I mean, you're one minute late, you're late, bye, you wasted my time. But if you're on time, etcetera, so I can, I can train you to carry a tray in a restaurant, I can train you to clean a carpet, whatever, but I can't train you to be nice. So you know, our interviews are really centered around questions about their personality, and try to elicit those kinds of of answers. What was the second part to the question? Sorry.

Dave Barr  41:43

So there's the recruitment. But then it was also creating the culture that goes with the you know, what you want to represent?

Vance Morris  41:50

Well, you know, so, so obviously, in our industry, we don't need you to have an MBA or college degree. We don't even require you to have a high school diploma. So they sometimes they feel like they're missing out on something. So I believe in trying to help them, not only by giving them the paycheck, but by offering them things that they may not get because of, for lack of a better phrase, the stature, their stature in in life. So, for example, I'll bring in a a financial planner, and during one of our meetings, we'll do, you know, he'll just do a 15 minute quick Hey, you should, you know, you're 20 years old. You should really be putting 10% of your pay away. And in 30 years, you're going to have X dollars, you know. And if you can't do that, hey, here's this, this app called "acorns", I don't know if you have that in the UK, where, you know, you can round up your spending and your pennies, and they'll invest the pennies for you and, you know, and we'll do things like that, you know, we'll have the insurance guys come in and, you know, we'll talk about insurance, and we'll talk about, we'll have the mortgage guy come in and say, you know, one of my guys was able to buy a house by working for me. He never thought he would be able to afford a house. And through the, you know, not through me. I mean, I don't know a lot about this stuff, but just through us bringing in people that they would probably never interact with, just by bringing them in 15 minutes during one of our staff meetings, they're like, Oh, I never knew that. So.

Dave Barr  43:34

Yeah, that must create an awful lot of loyalty among your employees, because it demonstrates that you care about them more than them just doing the job. Yeah, 100% quite amazing. Well, before I ask my last question, obviously, thanks for sharing those incredible insights today. Other than your books, obviously, where should the audience go to visit to learn more about you and your teachings?

Vance Morris  43:57

Sure, the website's probably best deliver servicenow.com. There's a tab there for all the courses that we have. We even have some free ones on there. So and I do a almost daily service tips and marketing tips. So more than welcome to sign up for that. But yeah, deliver service now.com. Is probably the best place.

Dave Barr  44:21

Fabulous, fabulous. Just the last question then. So you obviously had an incredible journey and experience with Disney if you're going to have a perhaps a seminar with small business owners. Now, what would you say about how to go about effectively introducing and embedding a strong service culture that aligns with their unique brand and identity. How could you help them to deliver that pizzazz that they're looking for?

Vance Morris  44:51

I think first and foremost is be yourself and use your personality, because that is at the end that is going to be the only separator. You're all in commoditized business. I am. You are everyone. The only thing that is going to separate it is your personality and the experience that we're delivering. The second thing I would offer is take one of the ideas that you heard today or that you've read about somewhere else and just take one one idea and implement it. Because if you just listen to stuff and don't do anything, then you're never going to profit. You're never going to move forward. So be yourself. Be authentic. Let that stuff shine through to your prospects, to your customers, and you'll be amazed at what what can happen.

Dave Barr  45:42

Brilliant, well, thank you for sharing so many really important nuggets of gold today. I'm sure people will take a lot from what you've explained. You know, for a man who's done it and not just talked about it, I think it's an incredible thing to share with others. Thank you very much for joining me today. Vance. 

Vance Morris  45:59

Thank you, Dave, I appreciate you having me. 

Dave Barr  46:01

So there's another Real Life Buyer podcast. I do hope you enjoyed it, and it has given you some ideas and inspiration for greater action and achievement. Don't forget to subscribe so you don't miss out on future episodes and a five star review would be most appreciated if you would like to discover more about me and what I do. Take a look at www.the reallife buyer.co.uk. Bye.