Selecting solar power systems for your home or business with Adrian Williams, MD of Solar Technology International

Welcome to The Real Life Buyer.

In this episode I am extremely pleased to interview Adrian Williams, Managing Director and Owner of Solar Technology International. Where local design, global manufacture and distribution come together. Make sure you understand what solar products and services a buyer should undrstand.

ABOUT THE COMPANY
Solar Technology International was founded in 2000 by Adrian Williams and is now celebrating its twentieth year of bringing outstanding  and groundbreaking solar products to the global market. This business is based in Tewkesbury, Gloucestershire, England, not particularly far from the beautiful Cotswolds. The company is a leader in the design and installation in solar power technology covering applications including solar panels for domestic and commercial property (PVE),  solar panels for caravans, motorhomes and custom applications (PV Logic), solar lighting solutions (Solarmate), solar power hubs (Hubi) and advanced lithium batteries (Lifos).
Products to provide you with power at your finger tips, reduced energy costs, that are environmentally friendly, all delivered by high quality products, covered by superb warranties.

ABOUT THE HOST
My name is David Barr.
I have been working as a Purchasing Manager for over 20 years and have had the joy of working in various manufacturing industries throughout this time.

I have signed contracts for many millions of pounds Sterling over these years across a range including, but not limited to Capital Equipment; Recruitment services; Finished, semi finished and raw products including castings, machined parts, fabricated parts, moulded parts, rolled and extruded products; PPE; Carriage and Logistics services; Printed books and boxes; Gaming materials; Contractor Services including building, plumbing, roofing, AC, maintenance etc.

I am passionate about saving money, buying quality goods and services, developing positive and effective working relationships with suppliers and colleagues and driving improvement through out the supply chain.

Now I wish to share this knowledge and that of highly skilled and competent people with you, the listener, in order that you may hopefully benefit from this information.

CONTACT DETAILS FOR SOLAR TECHNOLOGY INTERNATIONAL
Website : www.solartechnology.co.uk
Instagram : @solartechint
Email : Hello@solartechnology.co.uk
Telephone: 00 44 1684 774000

CONTACT ME, The Real Life Buyer @
Website: www.thereallifebuyer.co.uk
Email: david@thereallifebuyer.co.uk
Find and Follow me @reallifebuyer on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter

Disclaimer
The views, information, or opinions expressed during this podcast are those solely of the host and guest(s) involved and do not reflect the views of any other individual or company. This podcast does not constitute professional advice or services. We do not make any warranties about the completeness, reliability and accuracy of this information. Any action you take upon the information is strictly at your own risk and we will not be liable for any we will not be liable for any losses or damages in connection with any information provided.

Transcript

SPEAKERS

Dave Barr, Adrian Williams

00:01

Welcome to The Real Life buyer, whether you are buying for yourself or your business. Here you will find tips, techniques and knowledge to support your journey to buying smart, interviewing business owners and technical experts to give you information and guidance before parting with no money, save money time to get what you want, when you want it. Now introducing The Real Life Buyer, Dave Barr.

Dave Barr  00:25

Hello, and welcome to the real life buyer. In this episode, I'm very pleased to introduce you to Mr. Adrian Williams, owner of Solar Technology International Limited, based in Tewkesbury, Gloucestershire, and now celebrating its 20th year of business. With increased focus of climate change, the need for green energy has never been greater, being able to generate electricity for your home, and business is becoming once again, at the forefront of people's minds, particularly if any excess energy can be re channeled and sold back to the National Grid. Solar Technology International not only produces solar panels for both domestic and commercial applications, but also produces other products, for those with a mobile life. This encompasses applications for motor home owners, right through to the Rambler, I'll hand over to Adrian to explain more about the company and the range of products produced. So hello, Adrian, and welcome to the show,

Adrian Williams  01:30

Hello Dave and thank you very much for inviting me on. So solar has changed, well, quite a lot in 20 years, although the technology itself is pretty much where it was. It has become more efficient, but efficiency in solar terms, just means you can get a lot more power into a smaller package. So you know, solar panels are about 30% smaller, or you can get 30% more power in the same size. And this is very useful. Certainly when there's a limited space, as often there is in many of the applications that you mentioned. So whether it's the portable power pack system, you know, we have systems that literally are the size of a pack of playing cards, too, sort of medium power, sort of base camp units, if you like, which don't take up an awful lot more space, right up to the solar panels you may see on the roof of a house. The typical sort of 14 solar panels on the roof of a house is roughly speaking, not far short of double the power that it would have been 20 years ago. The other key element in the solar world is the cost reduction. Around about 2010, 2011, the cost of silicon feedstock stock dropped dramatically. And this, of course, meant that the accessibility to most people financially speaking for solar became incredibly viable. And that trend, although has sort of ceased to be as dramatic as it was certainly still going down and the viability of solar is becoming more and more prominent.

Dave Barr  03:26

Okay, I said you do quite a range of projects, are they all produced in your own factory.

Adrian Williams  03:33

So all the products that are effectively a Solar Technology International product are all designed here in the UK. They're all made in Asia, we use a mixture of our own factory and contract manufacturers. But in essence, everything is designed in accordance with our specifications, quality controlled in accordance with our specifications and of course, they're made exclusively for us because we own the tooling and the design rights to those products.

Dave Barr  04:07

Okay, so if we were going to take a virtual walk through your facility where you are now what would we see?

Adrian Williams  04:15

Well, if you walked into the office, it would be an office like any other office, number of individual rooms, a few large rooms where a number of people work. And here we have everything from the quality control, to ordering, to logistics, to operations, sales order processing, working with suppliers, accounts, and of course myself. And then if we were downstairs, we would have our warehouse. So you'd see a lot of rows of high bay pallet racking with products all stacked up, right to the ceiling. And as we go through the warehouse toward the back of the warehouse, we have a separate large room, which we use, partially for packing and dispatch, and partially for product testing, and quality control. Above that room, there's a little bit more storage where all of our packaging materials live.

Dave Barr  05:28

Okay, and how many people are on your site?

Adrian Williams  05:30

So we have 14 people, not all on our site, we have some Field Sales Engineers. So one based in Blackpool covering the north of the country, one based in Stratford on Avon that generally covers the east side, and then another down in Devon, who currently covers the South and Southwest.

Dave Barr  05:57

Okay. So when I've been working my way through your products, particularly interested in solar panels, the type that go on domestic property, and I noticed there are some different types. Perhaps you could explain to the listeners, the difference between "in roof", "on roof" and "solar tiled" systems.

Adrian Williams  06:19

Yes, certainly. So the conventional solar panel is called "on roof". This is what most of us are used to have been seen. They effectively for want of a better word float above the roof tiles, they're held on to the roof tiles by stainless steel hooks, which effectively are anchored to the rafters, the timber rafters of the house. And then obviously, the tiles are relayed over those hooks to maintain the waterproof integrity of the roof. So effectively, the solar panel sits about three centimeters to five above above the roofline. And they're the easiest to fit. And obviously, from a retro fitting point of view, ie the house is already up and built. By far the lowest cost method of getting solar onto a property, "in roof" effectively does away with the conventional stainless steel and aluminium roof structure as roof mounting structure. And instead, it basically lays the solar panels into a tray, which flush fits onto the roof. Now, these are typically fitted on a new build, because they are more expensive than "on roof". And part of their case, the cost saving offset is of course to reduce the number of tiles needed on that on that house. Of course, if you were retrofitting in roof, which certainly we have customers that request us to do that, then of course, we have to remove those tiles. And the cost saving is effectively not there for that. So "in roof" look smarter, it's flush with the tile. But you know from a distance, you'd have to have a fairly keen eye to tell the difference between "on roof" and "in roof" because ultimately the panels are the same. And then "solar tile" is as the name suggests, instead of using a concrete or clay or slate tile, there is a man made substrate with a solar cell laid on top of each tile. This is then of course laid on the roof in a similar way that a conventional tile was and effectively replaces that tile. So the tiles but up exactly with the tile that would be used on the property, you know, in other words on the edge of the roof. And of course the idea is to try and color match the solar tiles so that it suits the roof. And practically speaking, it's only ever going to do that if the roof tile is slate. So you've kind of got this fairly uniform dark black color. Again, it's one of those propositions where often as not it's been dictated that the owner has to have that to achieve a building regs or planning commission where it's in a in a area of outstanding natural beauty or a conservation zone, there may well be an objection to having conventional "on roof" or "in roof" solar. It is more expensive, a lot more expensive, more most expensive of the three. Technically it's not without its issues. Because ultimately I'm an "on roof" and "in roof" system has 14 electrical connections and a tile system has 200 electrical connections. And of course, as we all know, the weak part point of any electrical circuit is the connection. So, you know, this isn't this isn't to, to necessarily scare anybody off the connectors use our industry standard multi contact connectors, they're very, very reliable. But it has been known that these have failed. And of course, you're multiplying the potential of that happening, obviously, by sort of eight or nine by using the tiles compared with a conventional. So it's, it is a considered purchase. And it is something that we've certainly done quite quite a few systems for. But it's by far the least popular of all three options.

Dave Barr  10:46

Okay, thinking of efficiency, I assume the in roof and on roof are fairly similar to the tiles? Are they more efficient at generating energy or less? Or is there any difference at all?

Adrian Williams  11:02

Okay, so this is kind of touching on the point that I started our conversation with, efficiency in solar for photovoltaic terms is a slight misnomer. We think of efficiency in normal works of life, being generating more energy, being lower cost, being all the things that we actually associate with a refrigerator, or a car or any appliance of that source. But efficiency in solar terms, is simply dimension, the higher the efficiency, the smaller the size. So, you know, we could take, for example, a 300 watt solar panel, using a very lowest efficiency, I mean, effectively a b grade cell, and we could take the same 300 watt panel, using a high efficiency cell, the very best you could get some power, you know, they have 22.5% efficiency, and there are higher efficiencies than that. And both of those panels are still gonna produce 300 watts per hour, they won't produce any more, they won't produce any less, they will produce exactly the same, the only difference is, of course, your high frequency panel is going to be a lot smaller. So the the question simply is, how much power can we squeeze into the smallest space possible? And that is a relevant question for a lot of domestic properties. Because of course, you know, with hip roofs and, and valleys and whatnot, you know, there may be a key limitation to how much power you can fit on that roof. So yeah, I mean, if somebody were looking at solar from a pure efficiency, I want to get the most watts on my roof as I can, then we wouldn't be looking at tiles, we wouldn't be looking at "in roof", we'd be looking at "on roof". Because, by far, you know, the biggest choice of solar panels, for example, "on roof", there are about 160 manufacturers "in roof", there are four, tiles, there are two. So you know, your your choice is dramatically improved by going for "on roof". And so yeah, that that's that that conversation would develop depending on what the customer wanted.

Dave Barr  13:39

Okay, that's very interesting. Thanks. I believe your own engineers install your rooftop systems in the UK and what training? Sorry?

Adrian Williams  13:50

Sorry, they do? Yes.

Dave Barr  13:52

Okay, fantastic. Just thinking about the training and competence for those engineers, so probably quite demanding role. I certainly wouldn't want to be climbing onto a roof. Making electrical connections and such I don't like heights particularly. So what kind of training and competence do your engineers need to have become fully qualified to do the work for you?

Adrian Williams  14:15

Okay, so the fitting of solar panels is probably 80% electrical and 20% roofer. Now the roofing element, there is no training as such, it is one of those roles that you sort of learn on the job. Of course, it's it's critical that the guys have working at height training. they're familiar with harnesses and rope systems. They can fully anchor themselves to scaffolding or cable ways that are sometimes used more on commercial roofs and domestic but ultimately, this is this is a job that is learned through experience and obviously training for the specific safety elements. The electrical side of things? Well, yeah, if you're if you're installing and commissioning PV systems, you've got to be a fully qualified electrician. There's no shortcut to that. And so of course, they have to be up to the very latest electrical addition, which I think we're an 18 at the moment. They have to be certified obviously, they're assessed every year, I will use a an organization organization called Alexa. That does that certification training. So that's the requirement for the for the team that physically installs. And then for us as a company, we have to be certified by MCS. MCS is sound for the Microgeneration Certification Scheme. It's a kind of government quango, sort of, but it's been outsourced. And it was set up in the first instance, to ensure a certain degree of quality was supplied by the installers to ensure obviously, customers properties weren't damaged by solar. And of course, solar, you know, put up incorrectly is a very dangerous proposition, you know, your solar array will be generating somewhere in the region of 400 volts DC, which is death, you know, if you get it wrong, it's affecting the roof structure, which of course, could lead to significant damages if it's done incorrectly. And we've seen plenty of evidence of this where either a fire has caused or being caused on the roof and burnt the tile through. Or simply water has got in and effectively damaged the entirety of the upstairs ceiling and a lot of furniture below. So right from the right from the word go, when the MCS feed in tariff process started in 2010, we sort of had a warranty document sort of created, so that it gave customers that peace of mind that we weren't just liable for the equipment we fitted, we also covered any consequential loss. And I'm pleased to say we've never been called on that warranty, but it is part of who we are and what we do as a business. You know, if one of our people accidentally sticks his foot through the ceiling, plasterboard, and, you know, takes out some expensive furniture or what what have you, we're liable for that, and we willingly accept that we are so you know, the the training of the guys from a legal point of view is obviously a given that that's required. For us as a company to comply with MCS, of course, that's a given we must comply with that. But then, we overlay all of that with our own training for our for our people, to make sure that things such as, you know, basic courtesy for for the building owner, you know, being aware that, you know, if it's raining outside, nobody's going to want somebody with big old boots clumping up the stairs, so they're obviously supplied with over socks to wear, or these kind of waterproof things. That, you know, mess has to be cleared up at the end of the day in a particularly if it's a multi day job. And, of course, when scaffolding is erected, you know, simple things like, you know, the scaffolding poles don't stop people opening a window or opening a door or things like that. So, you know, that's and of course, every company will have its own sort of diktat on whether they do or don't do that type of process, but we certainly do.

Dave Barr  19:19

Okay, sounds very comprehensive, and I think, an excellent peace of mind for a customer. And if I just inquire a little bit more about the warranty itself is obviously that's on product systems and installation. Is that a 5, 10, 15, 20 year warranty? How does that work?

Adrian Williams  19:35

Yep, so this depends on the on the kit. So we basically put a 10 year warranty on the solar panel, although I believe that's just right, raised to 12 years, building pretty pretty decent long time and that's basically covering the integrity of the solar panel. Manufacturing water ingress, delamination, normal typical sort of process. And then on top of that, there's a 25 year cell warranty. So this, in essence is a guarantee that by year 20, the solar panel won't be outputting, any less than 80% of its new power. So this suggests that the panel itself degrades at a rate of 1% per annum. It doesn't, it's very little in the first few years, and then it sort of starts to taper off after that. But the reality is, I mean, we've got solar panels, when we first started out in the field. And you know, them being well, when we last tested, they were 19 years old, and they only degraded by around about four and a half percent. So you know, the warranty is kind of almost irrelevant, because there's no way the solar panels are going to degrade that fast. So that's the score with the solar panel. The next piece of kit is the inverter. Now that comes with a five year warranty, although there is an option to extend that to 10. The roof equipment, so this, these are the stainless steel brackets, the aluminum rails, they have a 10 year warranty. If at all of the electrical equipment, these are the isolator switches, the kwh meter, they all have 10 year warranty. The installation labor is covered for two years. So this is more to do with what I spoke about earlier regarding consequential loss, because the warranty on all the parts also includes the labor element. So if a solar panel were to fail, you know, in year year nine, that wouldn't be a question of us just sending the customer new solar panel, it will be a question of us turning up with scaffold and a solar panel and fitting that solar panel and removing the failed unit. So yeah, the warranties are not over complex, but certainly, you know, our terms and conditions, we hope really kind of clearly define what we're liable for which, which in the case of the job is pretty much everything

Dave Barr  22:23

Now that sounds very comprehensive. So, so with the 12 year warranty, then see that materials are very robust, etc. and not likely to corrode. Just curious what are the main materials of construction for a solar panel?

Adrian Williams  22:40

Well, the process starts with building the cell circuit. So when we started, solar cells were mostly manually soldered. So if you've seen a solar cell, you'll notice there are silver ribbons on the top, these are the electrical busbars, the cell itself, or the cells will be laid out on a on a board. And then somebody would go along and they'd be soldering each busbar to the cell. So you'd be basically creating this sort of skeleton, if you like, of the of the server cell circuit. Well, nowadays, this is all robotically done. And much to the better, obviously reduces cost massively, but it also completely removes the potential for finger marks and over heavy handedness and potential for cracks in the in the solar panel. So you've got your cell circuit that then effectively moves forward in the production process. And it's top and bottomed with an EVA This is a clear film of the zone which is between the underside of the solar panel and the glass at the top. And it's there to protect the solar cell. And it's also there to effectively not quite melt but effectively vacuum form around the cell circuit during the lamination process. So then the rear of the solar panel has a typically white I mean you can be black depending on the color of the solar panel. It's a it's a Tedlar DuPont, Tedlar material, which effectively is a is a I think it's a polyurethane and it's essentially a weather resistant coating for the backside of the panel. And then finally the solar glass is laid on top of that sandwich. And solar glass is really quite a specialist thing. Most of our commercial glass in fact all of our commercial glass has a high degree of UV filtration in it to obviously stop curtains getting faded and so on. So well this is the last thing you want with a solar glass. Of course you want as much as UV radiation penetrating the surface as you can. So removing these materials, which effectively is iron, it's iron that's impregnated into commercial glass or removing that weakens the glass quite significantly. So to make sure we compensate, solar glass is made in typically 3.5 millimeter thickness, which is a lot thicker than our commercial glass. That is necessary because these systems are designed to withstand two inch hailstones fired at the glass surface at 60 miles now. So once the glass is on top, It then goes into the the laminator. So the laminator puts heat and pressure on that sandwich and forms it into one complete laminate structure. So from there, the solar panel is then flipped over so its cell surface is facing down, the junction box is fitted. So basically you've got your two terminating silver ribbons from your cell protruding out the back of the white surface, the junction box is glued around the outside. And those ribbons are then connected to the main positive and negative terminals within the junction box. And this is of course where your cable feeds onto. So with the junction box fitted, sometimes cable fitting sometimes not. The the entire product then moves on to framing. And again, the framing process in some factories is fully automated in some it's semi automated, but essentially, the profile the server profiles, which are hard anodized aluminium are then basically bonded onto the panel edge. And sort of Dogtooth connectors are used to in to go inside the panel apertures or sorry, the the framing apertures that basically hold the mitered corners neatly together. And so that's your finished panel. And then they go off for testing. And testing is done two ways. The first is is flash test. So solar panel is measured in accordance to standard test conditions. These are a set of criteria that are a standard around the world. And also the panels should be supplied with an electrical readout that confirms the barcode of the solar panel complies with the electrical data, which will approve its conformity. From there we move on to electro luminescence testing EL testing. An EL is the equivalent. Now I mentioned back in the day, when solar panels were soldered, the the electrical ribbons were soldered, that actually couldn't happen anymore. Simply because solar cells are now laser sliced they used to be mechanically cut and laser sliced they're very, very thin and microns thin. so thin in fact, if you were to hold one by the corner, it would break under its own weight. So the potential for a cell to be cracked during the lamination process is low but not impossible. And a cracked cell is a serious business for a solar panel because of course during their normal life cycle they will be expanded during the daytime when the sun shines on them and they heat that heated up. And of course they'll contract at night time when the cooler and eventually if you have a cracked cell whilst it works in the first place. After successive expansion and contraction processes, it simply work will expand and not contract. Then you've got an open circuit and you've got a dead solar panel. So vital that any completed solar panels with a crack are sort of fished out quick and basically quarantined and scrapped. So the electro luminescence tester shows exactly if you've got a crack in the solar cell. And we still have around about 8% of failed panels. And our plants are some of the most modern in the world. Not every manufacturer does this. So it's more than likely that there are a lot out there that are blissfully unaware of the fact that their panels have got a time bomb fitted within them. But not us. We ensure that every single panel has this EL testing. And of course the photograph that shows the test is then married up to the barcode. So when we receive product, we have the full test data, showing the flash test, the electrical test, and also the EL test.

Dave Barr  30:07

Alright, it's very comprehensive. Thank you for that. So interesting process, but obviously, it's a very complex as well, lots of opportunity for issues perhaps to arise. So it's good to hear how robust you have your systems. Just thinking about a three bedroom typical property, detached house, can you give a rough idea of what a typical say on "on roof" system would cost for that size of property?

Adrian Williams  30:37

Sure, well, I suppose the system size would probably be four kilowatts, four kilowatts is without doubt, the most populous size, and it seems to fit the bill for for an awful lot of properties. The cost of that type of system to supply and fit would be anywhere between sort of four and 5000 pounds. There are some variables, obviously, hence the spread. But that type of system, assuming it's not heavily shaded, or facing north or anything like that, would typically be generating 3500 kilowatts per annum. Assuming that somebody were to use all of that, just get my calculator. And assuming that somebody pays about 17 pence for their unit of electricity, it would save them 595 pounds per year. But of course, it's very unlikely that anybody could use all the power generated. Because obviously, there are gonna be times when we're not on holiday, there are going to be times in the height of summer when the system is going crazy, and you simply can't use that much power. But you know, our job is to understand the power demand of the customer. And to match the solar system in accordance with how much they can use. Because, yes, you can export your power if you've got a smart meter, and your electricity supplier will pay you for that. But they'll only pay you around about five pence. So you're basically selling electricity of five pence, and you're buying it back at 17 pence. So it's far better to understand that you will certainly be exporting in this, there's no way you can't export unless you've got battery storage. And therefore, limit the system size that matches with the user's demand profile. So as I say, we spend a lot of time understanding that so that we can offer a system size that gives best value for money. 

Dave Barr  33:10

Looking at an installation, no doubt you need an engineer to do an assessment of the property. Are there particular factors that suggest this will be a successful installation? and other other factors that would suggest may not be appropriate for that type of property? What kind of evaluation is undertaken by the engineer?

Adrian Williams  33:33

Yeah, well, this is, this is something that actually is more about our interests to get right than the customers. Because ultimately, if we do the job, and then there are all manner of follow on consequences, we're liable for that. So it is without doubt, not a fit all. And when we do the survey, we are taking careful details of the roof structure. And we were not structural engineers ourselves, but we use a firm structural engineers that basically do an assessment on the roof capability, on the wind loading for the area. And this is all from the data that we provide, which is all about roof joist thickness, rafter thickness, and spacing between each rafter, the direction of the roof, the height of the building, obviously pictures that we take during the survey. And so you know that's, that's something that they will look after, for us. Things that we don't need to ask them about, really are in very, very old properties where there's no felt batton where you basically got the tile is the only membrane between the outside world and the and the loft, we won't go anywhere near. Because obviously, we know for well, that during the course of the installation, it's, it's it, the tiles themselves will have to be disturbed, because we've got to remove them to fit the brackets. And of course, on those type of aerial roofs, typically using clay tiles, it's next to impossible to replace them in exactly the same position as they were. And of course, in many instances, the only thing thing holding those tiles is actually moss, which, of course, we will have to remove. So we don't, we don't need to ask an engineer for that. We just don't do it. But for all of the circumstances, we are getting outside assistance to make sure that we are not creating a huge liability for ourselves.

Dave Barr  35:54

I say, see, I also noticed, just thinking of those people who may not be able to afford an installation outright, that you offer a solar leasing facility. Can you explain what that is?

Adrian Williams  36:07

Um, well, we actually don't anymore. In fact, I'm not sure anybody does in reality. So solar leasing or "rent a roof", as it was called, was a particular favorite during the feed in tariff days. So the feed in tariff was the sort of incentive program government introduced in 2010. And it basically paid customers a fixed amount of pence per kilowatt generated by the solar system. The "rent a roof" program effectively meant that instead, installers would go and essentially cover the entire cost of the installation themselves, homeowners would benefit from the electricity those systems produced. But the solar energy company would keep the feed in tariff, and they would keep the export tariff. Now whilst feeding tariff was in existence, this was a very lucrative way to build a pretty nice portfolio of investment. But since it ended, that's pretty much come to an end, I'm certainly not aware of that type of property proposition on a domestic property, different I think, on a ground mounted proposition, you know, where you got a field with five megawatts of solar panels, that as you say is a different set of economics. But the the downside that some "rent a roof" customers are now facing is, of course, the, the we're a fairly strict set of terms and conditions, to these rental agreements, if you want. So that, you know, if the homeowner needed to sell, of course, the new homeowner would have to accept those terms and, and responsibilities. Of course, if the new homeowner didn't like solar panels or wanted them upgraded or changed or whatever. They simply couldn't unless they paid the solar energy company, a very fat exit fee. There are there have been other issues with regards to service ability, the homeowner is responsible for the system performing and if it doesn't, then you know, there there have been case occasions where people have got very badly sort of fined for for something that really wasn't their fault. So yeah, I mean, it was it was a good way to get affordability for those that couldn't into using green energy. But it's something that always concerned us as you know, what happens if and of course over this period of time, there have been lots of ifs and it has put people in a very tricky position.

Dave Barr  39:06

Okay, thank you for explaining that. Thinking about best practice, your customers bought a system, they obviously want to make sure it's maintained as well as it can be, are there certain things they should do to ensure the integrity and life of the system to get the optimum performance?

Adrian Williams  39:27

Well, the the most obvious one is having the solar panels clean. So you know, dust and particulates from the atmosphere, particularly if it's in an urban zone, do sort of sit and accumulate on the surface of the glass. And you have been multiple studies done show that a dirty solar panel can be losing anything up to 5% of your yield and this is is significant to know if it if it continues year after year after year, the customer doesn't necessarily notice the yield is going down, then this really affects the performance and their return on their investment. So having the panel's cleaned every couple of years, once every couple of years is more than adequate. And most window cleaners can do it from the ground with extended wands. There are specialist solar panel cleaners out there. And you know, they they will do it too. But it's nothing more than sort of soapy water and a sponge needed for the job. In terms of the electrical side of it, there isn't anything that a homeowner should think about DIY, because, well, they put themselves in grave risk if they get this wrong. But it is sensible to get their systems serviced by by a, you know, an MCS qualified company once every three to five years. We provide that service as well. And the typical thing that we would do is to check the integrity of all the wiring, we checked with our high level cameras, we check the solar array to make sure there's no visual issues going on in terms of crazing cracking potential warping of the frame. We would be checking all the electricals inside, typically connected to the inverter making sure there was good airflow around the inverter, we'd be looking at the cable and the AC cable running down to the connection meter. Again, to make sure that was good and solid. We make sure the isolator switches. So there's AC and DC mechanical isolator switches would make sure those were functioning. And then we'd look at the yield of the system. We look at when it was installed, whether we installed it or not is irrelevant, we would work with calculate theoretically what the system should have generated during the time. And then we'd see what it actually has generated. And of course, if there's a big disparity, then there can be one of the few reasons number one, the installer rather over egged, the potential of what it could do. Or there's been an issue that may have been subsequently resolved. Or there's an issue that remains. And somewhere along the line, it's our job to try and identify which one of those three options it is. Because, you know, we're obligated, once we do a service to effectively clearly say the system is working or is not working, or is not working as well as it could. And these are the reasons why. And this is a quote from putting it right. Whether the homeowner chooses to act on that with us or somebody else's down to them. And at least we've given them all the information so that they can make that sort of informed choice.

Dave Barr  43:07

Good. Very good, thorough advice there. Thanks. Now something it's affecting us all right now COVID-19, it must have affected your business to some degree. How have you managed, pivoted and adapted to maintain supply maintain supply to your customers?

Adrian Williams  43:26

Yes, it really has affected us. I mean, in in April of this year, revenues dropped by 80% May 50%. And then from June onwards, we've been running about 125% on a on a year to date month by month basis. And whilst we can't really take any blame for the loss of revenue in the early part of the year, we also can't really take any credit for the increase in revenue because where solar installations have necessarily been quite low. Of course people are nervous about having, you know, a stranger in their home and we can understand that we're probably doing more commercial work than domestic at the moment but there are signs that the domestic market is is coming back. What's kept us going and going very well are our products for off grid solar. So you know, one of our big market channels for off grid solar panels are the marine and caravan and motorhome sector and of course, these areas have seen an absolute boom over the summer months. Mainly because of course people can't fly or don't want to fly. You know, staying in a hotel, even in the UK, not necessarily everybody's cup of tea. And from a safety point of view you know, they wanted to make sure they weren't necessarily excluded themselves to perfection. So the caravan and motorhome and campervan industries have seen just the most incredible lift. And we make solar panels for most of the caravan and motorhome manufacturers and boat builders and so on. So their sort of fortune and has been our fortune in that regard, you know, they've they've kind of dragged us along with them. And then, you know, there are strange other things, we have a brand called hubie, which is a small scale, power and lighting system. These are used in things like stable blocks and workshops, in summer houses, into glamping, structures, family camping, you know, that type of thing. And one market that's really spiked over this summer / autumn period, has been people buying these lighting systems for their summer house in a shed. And in fact, there was a report I saw about a month ago that said, the shed was the current "must have" home accessory. We, we make these kits and sell them mostly through sort of shed manufacturers and retailers. And of course, they've long offered our product as an option. But this year has seen a real uptake. So we're probably supplying maybe 30 of those kits a day every single day to to them to their customers. And it's been a very, very high growth. And I suppose this, again, is relative to the fact that people have had a lot of time at home, maybe they've been working from home, they want to position their office in their summer house to kind of have some quiet time. So this has been an area that there's been been been very significant for us. So this is kind of, by and large, the reason we've met kind of weathered the storm quite well, will we actually cover the losses we make made in the early part of the year? Well, time will tell.

Dave Barr  47:14

Okay, obviously, the next big storms, so to say coming up is Brexit, how do you feel that will impact your business?

Adrian Williams  47:24

Well, I don't, I can honestly say I've no idea. I don't think anybody has any idea because obviously we don't know what the rules are going to be. But all of our manufacturing is done in Asia. So, of course, import duty, customs clearance is a factor for us. So I don't see there's any additional burden there. Of course, it does mean that the import process is going to be slower. Everybody importing from Europe is of course going to have to go through the same process. So customs clearance and delays at ports I think are going to be given. But the reality is it only means adapting to your supply chain flow by adding a couple of days into the lead in time than would ordinarily be the case. From an export point of view. We certainly export a lot of materials to Europe. And we've already got in place various export codes and approvals for for going to the countries we sell to. And of course, customs clearance from export, like import really is done on and mostly on an electronic basis. So we work with a number of forwarders, who have systems in place to be able to process those customs documentations well in advance of us physically shipping them. So I think there's probably going to be a bit of a bump in the early months, whilst you know, systems are tested. But I think by March, the process will be effectively the same as as it is at the moment maybe with a say an extra day or two needed for arrivals. And inevitably a little bit more cost in terms of paperwork. I think the competitive nature of the UK, importing from from Europe isn't going to be massively affected as I say doesn't really impact from us because we don't import from Europe. But I think the wider industries that do I sort of seem to think that there's going to be a balanced done between ourselves in the EU whether there's a Deal or No Deal. So that effectively either both sides are going to have to pay some but a small sum because ultimately You know, we're not in a an economic cycle that can really afford to take any form of inflation, certainly governmental imposed inflation, by import duties. So coming up, coming up with a sort of an agreed duty format, I think is is an almost certain certainty. And therein is what I stand to be corrected on in January. But I do think the two sides will inevitably conclude something that works from, from a from a balanced point of view.

Dave Barr  50:38

Right, yeah. I fully understand where you're going from there. Do you feel that you're, as well informed as you can be about Brexit? Or do you think there's other things that could be done as?

Adrian Williams  50:52

Well, I don't think anybody can be more or less informed. In reality, there's plenty of information out there. And ultimately, it's done to anybody affected by the potential changes to to either be provided with professional advice or to read up themselves on it. But in the end, it's all sort of, it's all it's all guesswork, because ultimately, we don't know what the deal is going to be or not. And until we have clarity on that, then then we're looking at lots of scenarios, most of which will never happen.

Dave Barr  51:33

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. very much a developing situation. very conscious of the time. Thank you very much so far. One last question. If we were to fast forward in time to the next 10 or 20 years, how do you foresee solar power generation developing?

Adrian Williams  51:56

Well, I don't necessarily think there are going to be any major leap forwards in solar technology per se. You know, you never know, we are some way downstream of the boffins in in white coats, who are developing all the new swish tech. So you know, there might be something next year that completely revolutionizes. You can get four kilowatts from the size of a postage stamp. But, but in all probability, it's not going to happen. And solar is no doubt going to improve in efficiency, but in very small incremental sums, and nothing major that would necessarily notice. However, what I have long since thought is that what's really benefited from solar is actually the reduction in the power consumption of the appliances that we use that solar powers. If you take the the humble light bulb, when we started, lighting kits had a 60 watt light bulb, it was a filament light bulb, it was called 60 watts, because it consumed 60 watts per hour. 10, eight years ago, the compact fluorescent bulb came out. For the same level of lumen output, we're now only consuming 11 watts. And now today for the same level of lumen output with an LED we're consuming three watts. And this is sort of mirrored throughout all of our appliances, whether it's televisions and refrigeration, computing, hi fi everything, not everything, but most things we use in the home have seen some dramatic reductions in their energy consumption. Now, what's also true is that a lot of appliances still operate on a DC current television is a perfect example, computing a perfect example, they need a power adapter to enable them to plug into the mains. Now in that process, of course, efficiencies are lost. Wouldn't it be better if our homes had a DC ring main, as well as an AC ring main where we could run certain things from each so you know, you'd be running all the house or lighting from the DC room main. Your plugins for your television and your computers, potentially your refrigeration, and then you're leaving your AC ring main for the heavy duty appliances, which will be for from that for the heating element four cookers. For for areas where you're putting serious kilowatt power. This would have a number of benefits. Number one, of course it makes your efficient products even more efficient because there's no electrical losses. And number two, it means that a solar and battery storage system could be completely off grid. So all it's doing is powering your house in your DC ring main and secondly it means that in the event of future power shortages and power cuts, you've got an independent power source running through the home, that keeps you going, even if power is off for a few days. And so the notion of having this separated DC ring main, I think, has got some some strong legs, we do a lot of work with a number of housing developers. And we've had sort of exploratory conversations with some of those, and I don't expect this to be a fix you see coming in the next four or five years. But I do think within a 10 year timeframe, there will be a lot. And what you may or may not know is that a lot of new houses, are now being built without a gas mean, that all electric, which of course, further, if you like plays into this notion of part of that house being entirely self sufficient, which of course it can be. And so, so in some respects, I don't necessarily see the future of solar being anything particularly clever, that us in the industry do more what other people do in terms of that DC ring main, and in terms of the continued efficiency gains on appliances, that solar compound is

Dave Barr  56:29

Very interesting, something I hadn't considered. Thank you for that. And thank you very much, Adrian, the discussions they I find quite fascinating. If a listener would like to learn more about your products and services, where would they find you? What's the best way to make contact with your company?

Adrian Williams  56:49

Well, I suppose the website's the best place to start. And that can be found on www.solartechnology.co.uk. And I'll just say it's technology, there is a company, well, there was a company called technologies g-i-e-s no longer exist. But Solar Technology o-g-y, at the end .co.uk is us and our on grid installation via our PV brand can be seen there. And all of our off grid brands can be seen. We can be contacted on Hello@solartechnology.co.uk. And of course, good old telephone. (0044) 01684774000. 

Dave Barr  57:38

Brilliant. Well, thank you, again, very much for your time. It was great talking to you. Obviously, I wish you and your business, great success for the future. And I hope. Perhaps we can touch base at a later date as well.

Adrian Williams  57:53

Thank you. Yeah, that would be great.

Dave Barr  57:54

Okay, Adrian. Take care now and goodbye. 

Adrian Williams  57:58

All the best. 

Dave Barr  58:00

Thank you for listening to this podcast. Please subscribe and leave a positive review if you can spare a minute or two. If you would like to contact me. My email address is David@thereallifebuyer.co.uk or find me @reallifebuyer on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter, where you're welcome to direct message me. I look forward to you joining me on future episodes. Take care. Remember, Save Money and Buy Smart