High n' Dry Podcast

The Wicked 2 100th Episode Spectacular

• Ryan Baron North and James Crosslin • Episode 100

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We mark our 100th episode by reviewing Wicked 2 with clear eyes and full glasses, weighing standout CGI against flat lighting, soft songs, and a story that stalls whenever the music starts. The Oz lore tie-ins land, but the pacing and depth rarely do.

• definitive category ratings across acting, cinematography, score, story and rewatchability
• why blanket lighting flattens emotion and kills depth
• how song placement undercuts momentum and character beats
• propaganda, perspective and who gets to define “good”
• CGI creature work that actually impresses
• stage vs screen: why act two sag hits harder on film
• audience energy, theater vibes and expectations vs delivery
• our final verdict at 2.5 out of 5

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SPEAKER_05:

Uh yeah, it turns out that you shouldn't be shitting black clumps. News to me.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05:

That's the uh the corporate world we live in, you know.

SPEAKER_02:

So Hashtag we hate corporate America.

SPEAKER_05:

Yep. Kate the rich. Uh we're a centerist podcast, really. So well, you fellas ready to do this thing?

SPEAKER_02:

Let's do it. I suppose as ready as I'll fucking ever be.

SPEAKER_05:

Well, let's dive on. This is this is a uh special one for us, and I'll tell you why in a second. So hey everybody, welcome to High and Dry Podcast. Uh I'm your host, Ryan Bear North. With me as always, James Crosslin, Luke. Uh, we are the only podcast keeping alive the fandom that is saved by the bell, the college years.

SPEAKER_00:

Phenomenal.

SPEAKER_05:

It was a uh in '93 to '94, they decided they needed to do a Scrubs MD thing. So was Fred Savage in that one too, I guess. I don't think so. No. It honestly looks it looks like um Paul Blart with a mullet, but I'm not sure. Like I can't be entirely certain, but it looks very much like Wait, what what what what was this program again? Saved by the Bell. Oh, saved by the Bell.

SPEAKER_02:

I I thought you said Wonder Year. I I got things mixed up.

SPEAKER_05:

No, no.

SPEAKER_02:

Saved by the Bell. So Saved by the Bell college years, I do remember that shit. Uh I definitely remember that. I remember Zach Morris being a mon continuing to be a monster. Um pretty sure they that's when they went to Hawaii. That was their their Hawaii episode was in the college years. Um got to see. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah, well, well, uh, so we're gonna be talking about that for the next hour. Uh no, just kidding. So we're actually gonna be talking about a new film, Wicked 2. Uh, the wickeding, I don't think.

SPEAKER_04:

Wicked for good. Wicked for good.

SPEAKER_05:

I swear I saw it. Dirty the fog. It's about some green chick, right? Um, but uh yeah, we're gonna be talking about wicked. All right, and what uh how we're gonna do it? We're gonna break it down to a three-part method. First, we're gonna give you the definitive rating of this. All right, fuck Rotten Tomatoes, fuck uh all the other ones, fuck Siegfried and Roy, whoever you know, those two dudes. Sigurd and Roy. Um, we're better and we're definitive. So there's that. And then we're gonna break it down, uh, get into our second part where we jump onto the golden path and we'll delve into the deeper themes and uh meanings behind Wicked 2, the Wickening. Um, sure. I mean, yeah, they're lazy, tired, and you know, we're but anyway. Um, and then finally, um, in the third part, we're going to insert ourselves drugs or alcohol into it. And uh what makes it so special, so fun, so fresh and new is that we're gonna be doing it drunk and high. So uh fellas, what are you smoking this week?

SPEAKER_02:

Splue slushy. It's blue slushy. I don't know why. It just like it gives me like 7-Eleven slushy vibes. So I was just like blue slushy!

SPEAKER_05:

Like you said blue. I thought you said splue. It's blue.

SPEAKER_02:

Splue slush. Yeah, splue slushy. My favorite smoke is uh as for me, I'm not smoking today. Instead, I took 10 milligrams of dexmethylphenidate.

SPEAKER_00:

And so into a zante. Okay, it's all right.

SPEAKER_02:

It is a uh stimulant medication for ADHD.

SPEAKER_05:

Hell yeah. Fuck yeah. Um, and I'll be joining you guys uh with uh what the guy told me was HD ADHD medication at the gas station and uh some wild turkey 101. Uh just bourbon straight whiskey. I'm gonna finish this bottle off tonight.

SPEAKER_02:

Um more of a fan of the domesticated turkey whiskey, but I like mine a little wild, especially after a handful of pills.

SPEAKER_05:

I get that hean. So uh let's line them up in this uh first shot.

SPEAKER_02:

You have to do one, you have to do one dose of your medication per shot. Bro, like it had me when I first started, I was bouncing off the wall. Really? Yeah, there's no way. Now it's now it's more mellowed out, but do you find the focuses there though? Oh, yeah, absolutely. Keep us on fucking track. Oh damn. Yeah, please.

SPEAKER_05:

Well, um, this first toast, first shot, this one is a special toast. Um, it's got it's probably it's gonna get me emotional. This shot goes out to today, our hundredth episode.

SPEAKER_04:

Very exciting. Goosebumps.

SPEAKER_05:

So here's to our hundredth episode. It's been a pleasure serving with you gentlemen.

SPEAKER_02:

Um beautiful centennial celebration. Yes, with wicked. For good. God damn it. We should have picked something better for this for this one.

SPEAKER_04:

So cheers. Disagree.

SPEAKER_05:

I'm excited. But uh yeah, it's been uh it's been a hundred episodes. We originally started this with Trey back in my Vegas apartment. Um and look at us now. Now he's dead.

SPEAKER_02:

We just have to soldier on. And we're and we're uh I think it's funny too that we're all three separate parts of the country now, too. Yeah. Hey, from where you can where the where you guys started uh back in the day.

SPEAKER_05:

Nothing can stop this. I mean, I remember we uh there was a time where we had masks on doing this in my uh living room during COVID.

SPEAKER_02:

And which made it hard to pull kiss and pull them down.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah, it's like our third shot kiss was very awkward. So uh but yeah, 100 episodes. So congratulations, boys. Very, very exciting. So line them up. This next uh next shot, these ones are going to go out to our newest listeners, and I not to uh, you know, toot our my horn or whatever the fuck, but uh we have been seeing some fantastic traffic lately, and um I'm excited about it. So this one goes out to like we got North Lake uh to everyone and your um various um fucking what are they called? God damn it. It hides your uh location because uh the Republicans are banning corn in certain states. Yes, yeah, so to all of you in your various VPNs, such as Council Bluffs, Iowa, uh Scunthrope, North Lincolnshire, Bergen Vestland, Viedma, Rio de Janeiro, um the Russian Federation. There's nobody in Russia listening to us. Well, they he did for a minute and they got him. They got him.

SPEAKER_00:

I have a few Instagram followers from Russia.

SPEAKER_05:

Vilnius of the Vilnius City municipality, um, some very creative VPNs.

SPEAKER_02:

I think Vilnius is Latvia. Or is that Lithuania? Uh someone's gonna be very upset. It is Lithuania. Cheers. Cheers. Sorry, Lithuania, you're not Latvia. Yeah, fuck the Latvians.

SPEAKER_01:

The Latvians. Jesus. Oh shit. That was a Ritzke.

SPEAKER_05:

Finally, this final toast, final shot, final hit. This one goes out to our movie this week. Here's to Wicked 2. The Wicked.

SPEAKER_01:

I guess. Judgment Day.

SPEAKER_02:

Fuck. It was certainly a movie.

SPEAKER_05:

It was indeed that. Ooh. In the background, I'll be uh and Luke, you don't have to hide your coughs, man. Let 'em rip, dude.

SPEAKER_02:

When it's too much, I get embarrassed.

SPEAKER_05:

It it provides a sense of realism to the show.

SPEAKER_02:

I can't let the people know I'm a big fat pus though.

SPEAKER_05:

Uh it's not about you know how big a hit you can take. It's about that you keep coming back.

SPEAKER_00:

That's true, and take more hits. I get that, I agree. That's right.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah. It's not how many times you get knocked out, it's how many times you get back up. So alright. So it's time for part one of this thing. It's time to rate this film. Um, so wicked.

SPEAKER_02:

You start off, Rye. I want you just because the will the liquor hits you later later in this first section. So you you gotta rip them. Yep.

SPEAKER_05:

Um, and well, my tolerance is becoming troubling. But um until then, here we go. So uh so wicked too. Acting, I don't know. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02:

Um so so it's just that the drinking is an excuse.

SPEAKER_05:

I don't know, man. Uh they they certainly had lines and they read them when they weren't singing. They said things, they said things, they sang things, uh Bloom was there. He did, he was there. He did a little dance. He did a little dance. Um but uh I I don't know. Um, I I don't know. I I feel that uh Cynthia did a did a good job. Um as far as the acting went. Um to me it was a little hammy, but you know, it's a musical. Um a big problem with me and musicals is that my brain is wired to see over expression as either corny or you're trying to play me. Um and so I always kind of come into these things with a big sense of um uncomfortableness. Uh the way these characters behave, the way they act, it rubs me the wrong way. Um so uh just I guess as a disclaimer, I'm not a musical fan. I like comedy musicals um because the songs are more of a punchline. But in this, to me, the music was just like slamming the brakes every time the story was gaining a little bit of fucking steam. Um and I gotta hear a song, and I hate fucking key changes. And just so the songs are just reiterating what was just being discussed. Like you just said that to me. You don't need to sing about it. You you already covered that. Thank you very much, Cynthia. Um, and uh so I I was very troubled by it all. I I did not think um Ariana Grande's acting was really anything to write home about. Um Jeff Goldblum was just himself. I truly believe that that's Jeff Goldblum in his kitchen.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, yeah. They didn't he didn't have a script.

SPEAKER_05:

They just played he was being filmed. These two women walked into his house.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, he got his invite to the red carpet, and he was like, What the fuck? I was in I was in a movie.

SPEAKER_05:

Um, yeah, so I believe that was just him in his house um filmed on site, you know. Um, so yeah, the acting on this one, uh I'm gonna have to give a 2.5. Um yeah, there that sounds fair. There's just there was nothing here that um moved me in any sort of way. And yeah, uh cinematography, I thought was fantastic. Um there were uh especially when they uh I loved the way that uh the wicked witch traveled. I I loved that. Uh I loved uh shots with her and the monkeys, and um, I thought that was really well done. None of the special effects really pulled me out of it. Um even I thought the uh the animal CGI was fantastic. Um but like that's also Disney's fucking wheelhouse. If they fuck that up, then why not? It's universal. Yeah. Oh, is it Universal?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05:

Oh. I don't know who owns anyone anymore. Um that's true.

SPEAKER_02:

I go to Universal Studios all the time, so and then you got a wicked store.

SPEAKER_05:

Really? Yeah. Oh. Well, especially now that just Netflix just bought fucking uh Warner Brothers, and it's it's just so HBO's gone. But um anyway, uh score. Um I saw the first Wicked. Uh I wouldn't care for either. Oh, oh, yeah, with the cinematography. I'm gonna give it a four.

unknown:

Cool.

SPEAKER_05:

Okay. Yeah, I'm gonna give that a four. Um the score and soundtrack, uh, it's not for me. I hate key changes. I there and outside of these songs that were just fucking stabbing my ears, uh there was nothing there was nothing good. Um, it was just enough to keep everything going. It wasn't as bad as the latest Jurassic World outing.

SPEAKER_02:

Um very little good views as just just soul crushing of a movie experience as that latest Jurassic World.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

That was rough.

SPEAKER_05:

That was really rough. Yeah, it it it did enough to get to the next song, which I would inevitably like the first wicked, the songs didn't bother me as much. In this one, they were placed so poorly, and it was just every time that we were getting into the story, and there was actually about to be some form of you know momentum, it was shot dead by a song that, in my honest opinion, wasn't that good.

SPEAKER_02:

I was so my partner came, she told me that the second act, which would be this movie, is known to be weaker on Broadway as well. Well, um, this is change with music. So that's like a big yeah, like I I agree with that.

SPEAKER_05:

Well, I got in the car with uh with my partner Cali, and um she had to play versions of the song from the Broadway, which she felt were much stronger on the stage, and she also felt the same, but this one was not as strong as the first one. Um so I I don't feel I'm being unfair. Like I I you know, I I didn't like it. Um and I'm yeah, I'm gonna give it a 2.5.

SPEAKER_02:

I think something else to do with that pacing, and you were talking about how it kind of like essentially frustrated the story um and the pacing. That's kind of like what the songs were about. Was in the first one, they were kind of getting built up, like it was like forward momentum. But in this one, everything everything that they were singing about were frustrations they were facing that were killing the forward momentum, yes. Um which is it may be it may be thematic, but it's also not enjoyable.

SPEAKER_05:

No, no, it was like, yeah, just constantly getting fucking story blue balls. Oh yeah, yeah. Uh like I'm just I'm just trying to bust my nut here, and then Ariana's got some shit to say. Um and sing, sorry. And I'm like, fuck. Um the uh I actually used a few of the songs on twice. I used like, oh, they're about to sing. I would go to the bathroom. Um, I would order concessions. I like they're gonna be at that for a while. Um, I could come back. So yeah. So yeah, it wasn't as bad as the latest Jurassic World, but it wasn't much better either. Um, story and plot, I felt it was very rushed. Um, like the first one, they they spent so long just bringing us into the wicked witch's experience and how she feels so different and building this friendship with Ariana. Uh and like there was so much time spent on it.

SPEAKER_02:

The world building was astronomically better. Because even like at one moment I wrote I I said to myself with the the castle that they went she went to to hide with the monkeys, that like upside down castle thing. Where the fuck was that? Like, I don't understand in relevance to anything.

SPEAKER_05:

Like I like her new boyfriend just had a summer castle.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh, yeah, yeah, like he did mention it. I forget that that one point. He's like, Yeah, there was a line. There's a line. But like it just the world building just was not, I agree, rushed at times. It's like it's like an introductory portion of a video game where it like walks you through everything and you're taking steps and physically moving from one location to the next, and then you reach the outer world, and it's just like fast travel. There's like no, there's no overland map, it's just here we are, here we are, here we are, do this, here we are, do this. And it's all it felt disjointed. Yeah, yeah. I agree.

SPEAKER_05:

And and honestly, in my opinion, this was the worst resistance movement I have ever seen. Um she kicks a couple builders.

SPEAKER_02:

Um they're just working, man. Like they they have they know they're not making decisions.

SPEAKER_05:

She kicks a couple builders, um, gets frustrated, and then I will never be good again. I want to go off with my new boyfriend. And so I'm like, okay, whatever. Um, oh, but you're gonna sing about it. Cool. Um, so yeah, uh, for that story, um you can't say it was that bad of a rebellion because it weren't technically successful. I mean, maybe we don't we don't know. But it didn't make sense that it did. Like Ariana gets up on stage and it's just like racism is over now, animals come out.

SPEAKER_02:

Do we actually trust Ariana Grande to keep that up? She was pretty easily manipulated before. Extremely I don't disagree. Then she was easily manipulated again by the trick of pretending to die. I mean, so I don't know.

SPEAKER_05:

I was confused, like Cynthia, why are you falling for this? Ariana is the most two-faced person in this world. At least when you're talking to um uh your old headmaster, you know where she fucking stands. Yeah, she's you know, she knows like and but then but then even Cynthia was ready to like, alright, fuck it. And it wasn't until she would like she knew that they were keeping animals, she knew that, but she had to come face to face with it before she made the moral choice. Yeah, and it's like, how good are you people? Come on now. Um uh and but yes, the story I give it a two. Um rewatchability. I will never watch this again, um unless I am found and gagged. Um like I I I will never watch this again.

SPEAKER_02:

Smash my own head on the floor until I was unconscious to avoid watching it.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah. Um, like if Callie wants to watch it again, cool, I'll sit there, but I will be so intoxicated and wasted on sleeping pills that I will not actually be watching it. So um For that, I give Rewatchability a one.

SPEAKER_04:

Tough crowd.

SPEAKER_02:

Well next. No, no, no. I want to if I want to wrap this bad boy up based on based on opinion so far. So I like musicals. I've seen quite a few musicals that I really like. Yeah, I know you. Yeah, I've heard. I I I also watch like musical television shows. Like I I'll I'll go out of my way to watch obscure musical television like Schmigadoon on Apple TV or Gallivant, which was a show that came out in like 20 the 2010s on ABC. Like I like musicals, I really enjoy them. I think when they're good, they're good. And this one I did not think was very good for several reasons. I thought the acting was uh was serviceable in a lot of times, but yeah, I felt like they didn't, you know, the over, you know, when musicals oversell their acting, it's usually with a wink and you know a nudge. And this one didn't have enough winking and nudging. It it took its it was like pretty self-serious. Um it was up its own ass. And I didn't I didn't like that. Uh I mean that didn't do it for me, especially because the audience was like all children. I don't know what your theaters were like, but my theaters were like my theater wasn't even fully packed. It was like the biggest, it was the biggest theater they had, and we were like, okay, we're gonna go sit in a in a theater full of people to get reactions, and it was like not even nearly full. It was the right day after it came out. Yeah, we I watched it in IMAX. Oh, really? Yeah, biggest possible uh theater they had for the IMAX showing, and it was only like maybe half full. And uh and nobody was even that interested. It's hard to uh, you know, I I don't know what your guys' theory was like, but that was my experience, and it definitely it definitely fit with my own perceptions of the movie. Um yeah, the acting wasn't very touching for me. I give it like a three, I give a three. Uh the cinematography, you know, like you said, the CGI for like the animals was really good, and I enjoyed the CGI overlay for the sets. I thought the sets were were nice. My big problem with this one specifically is with their lighting techniques. I don't know how you guys felt about the lighting, but the it was the lighting was so flat across the entire movie. And the reason it's like that is because so they made a bunch of like real sets for like the munchkin land and shit. It was all outdoors, and what they did was they took this giant fucking tarp, like this giant white tarp, and put it across over the entire set and then shined light down on the tarp so that there's no one point of light coming into the frame. It's just this blanket of light that's all the same across the entire thing. That's why every that's why they'd switch cameras from one person to the other, and it always looked like light was coming toward their face no matter where it was. And it everything, it made just everything feel so fucking flat. There was no dynamism to their movements or or their cut the colors, because there was no shadows, like it was uh it it just it just felt it felt almost AI generated because it was just so there there was there was the things that make vision real were gone, you know? It was it was a totally artificial thing, light, light they created. Um and then and then they like went on and they filmed all of it that way, even the dark scenes, they'd go in and dim, dim everything in post.

SPEAKER_05:

Well, I felt that was the case when they were doing when the animals were going underneath the yellow brick road. Like it felt that felt bizarre. Like everything was dark, but not, and there were there was no shadow.

SPEAKER_02:

Everything in the tower, too. Everything and like every all of that was filmed the same way with this flat light across the whole thing, and and and then they darken it in post. And it's just it's it's fucking awful. It's a it's a thing that I hate in movies. Uh for for for a for a difference, if you want to see where where cinematography and shadows are like really apparent, good boy that we reviewed earlier this year, that had amazing directional lighting that made the scenes good and like and made them visually appealing. Agreed. Um, yeah, so so I'm gonna take this down. I'm gonna say this is it's only a three first the it was a huge problem throughout the whole movie. It took me out of it the whole time. Score and soundtrack, like I said, I like musicals. I couldn't tell you a single song from this one. I personally, I I guess the song I liked the most was the Tin Man song. I enjoyed that. I enjoyed the scenes that went along with it. Um, I just didn't like the songs of this one. I did like the songs in the first one. Um so score soundtrack, I'm gonna give a three. Story plot really predictable, serviceable though. I mean I from a mile away, I could tell you that the two guys in the movie were going to become the scarecrow and the tin man, because we we already saw we already met the cowardly lion. I was like, oh well, you know, those two guys. Yeah, it was incredibly adorable for sure.

SPEAKER_05:

I I loved him. He was kill myself or others for that lion.

SPEAKER_02:

He was like uh he was a cowardly sympathizer, though.

SPEAKER_05:

That's true. But uh, I mean that's uh you know, pretty bias.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, true.

unknown:

True.

SPEAKER_02:

I've been dealing with him my whole life. Um story plot give it a three. Um rewatchability. What'd you give for the score? I missed it, I'm sorry. Three. Okay. It's not the worst I've ever heard, but man, I've I left that movie going like uh what what am I do what are we doing? You know, um and then story plot three, just because like I said, serviceable. But rewatchability, I'm not gonna watch this again.

SPEAKER_01:

One I'm not gonna watch this again. No, I'm gonna I don't want to watch it. Please can we please find something else?

SPEAKER_05:

For the love of God. I hear Beavis and Butthead do America's on the other channel.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, I'll watch, I'll watch. You know, I won't watch Jurassic World. I'd watch this over Jurassic World. I would tell you, yeah.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah, yeah. But it's agreed. But I'm pretty sure I gave Jurassic World a zero. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

First ever allowed zero, the only one.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

But it deserved. Yeah, deserved.

SPEAKER_01:

Damn, that move is bad.

SPEAKER_02:

We we we watched this movie, and then afterward, we were literally like, at least it wasn't as bad as Jurassic World. Scarlett, like with Scarlett Johansson not acting at all, like not having any kind of character.

SPEAKER_05:

Jurassic World is so bad that we subconsciously let Rebel Moon off the hook.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, yeah, it's true. Agreed. Awful. All right, let me get just awful. Yeah, yeah, Luke. Let us know what you think. Okay, so I kind of disagree with you guys on acting. I I feel like the acting was competent on most levels. Yo, I do. I think everybody was. I said it was competent. I said it was competent free. So you guys did not like Ariana Grande, but that is how Glinda is as a character. Um, and even in Broadway, she is very like get Kristen Shenwith in here, de-age her. I'm just saying, so I I I feel like the acting was just like just that one step above. I don't think it was revolutionary. I don't think like this to be fair, I feel like story and plot a lot of times can affect acting just because of what can be provided to a story through through the acting, if that makes sense. Like, you know, if if the story isn't dynamic enough, then like how dynamic can the acting really be? But I gave the acting a four. Um cinematography CGI. So I a hundred percent agree with the lighting. I actually like by the fifth scene, I was like, what the fuck is going on? I said, like, I was like, why is everything and I didn't really even click it with the lighting, but you you saying it has made me re think maybe I was just so fucking checked out that I overrated myself. And I just actually went back to and looked at photos. It's it's true, and I even see the fact that it's like like every so there's a scene, uh, the end scene where she, you know, the sun's behind them, and it should be really glowing and like almost orange, and like you know, it's like sunset, and it but it's not, it's just a fucking yellow, and their faces are somehow bright as well at that moment. But there should be like a shadow around their face on some level if the sunlight was coming from behind them, and that's I'm looking at that picture right now. Holy shit, it should be an easy thing to do, and you're right, it uh it takes you out of it. Um, but I do think like the CGI on like those monkeys, I think were sick. Like I fuck, I was like, they were cool. I was like, Whoa, those look fucking cool. And I so it kind of brought me in. I gave it a 3.5. Um Universal also does Planet of the Apes, right? So it's the same, yeah. It was like the same ape. Like his look blue Caesar like fucking Caesar. Blue blue Caesar with wings, I'm in. Yeah, all right. I fucking love so yeah, I gave it a 3.5. Uh you know, I thought it was it was good, but again, there wasn't the the uh those the flatness is I I agree with what exactly with that that's a great word for it. Just like, what the fuck? Uh what the fuck's going on? Why? What is happening? It took all the depth out of every and you even see like in Unreal. I again looked back at photos. There's another shot where like there's light on their faces, and then it's the same exact light. I see what you're saying, all on the background, everything in the background, no shadows in the fucking background. Like, why yeah, there should be and like shadowing and stuff is what gives frames depth, and it's what gives you know those that that uh you know perspective. So, yeah. Anyways, the score soundtrack, I agree. It was like I came out, and I the first thing I said to Cameron, I was like, I don't like that one as much. I don't it because so the songs for me, like I love musicals, and I just got into them more recently, but I liked even like I didn't even realize like high school musical is a musical, and I loved those movies like growing up, and like so I feel like I do enjoy that, and I think the songs are big pieces of the story, and like this one I agree, it kind of sets up and then just says the same thing over. I don't mind that sometimes, but this one I don't the songs weren't that memorable or like good. I remember like oh every kid out of the theater when I was leaving the first one was singing the songs, like that fucking no, every kid, like it's iconic. It was really, really good. Um, and this one left me just like wanting more. And I feel like, you know, as a musical, the soundtrack should be standout. Like if you're not, you know, if your soundtrack isn't high, what like that should be your biggest, biggest seller. So I actually give it a 2.5. Um the story plot was definitely the weakest point of it. It was kind of thrown forward. I feel like what happened with this story is the first act. So the first act I feel like is like set up and it's like really well thought out and built the world out. And then the second act is like this like bow on it with just trying to kind of piece together how it connects to Wizard of Oz. Um, and that's how it feels to me. It feels like it's just like, oh and then and then the line was here in the scarecrow, and that's how he came, and then the 10 minute, and then like here's Dorothy, and that then the one that's how her legs were under it, it's her sister, and like it just like it all felt very thrown forward in that way. Um, and I wasn't a fan, so um, I did come out of the theater again, like just being like, huh, wow, I I really liked the first one. I remember coming out of the first one at least, and this is an old memory, but I remember liking it quite a bit, like I enjoyed the movie. Um, but I gave the story plot a 2.5. You know, um, it it's it was interesting you said that about it just you know, being just a tie-in. Um, and it it's like a subversion, it's like the classic um, you know, it was so the book the novel was written in the 90s, and in the 90s, that was a really big time for like story and fairy tale and child story subversions, or you take it and turn it on its head, and now it feels really like trite to us or quaint. Yeah, or it's like it's like, oh, you took a fairy tale and turned it on its head, great fucking job. You know, like everybody's thought of that, like uh and maybe the stage play it it comes through better. Like maybe that second, it's because Cam like speaks very highly of this one. She's seen it on Broadway, she's seen it off Broadway. Like, she really loves the story of Wicked. She was also a child when it came out. Yes, but she's seen it since as an adult. But nostalgia's nostalgia's a son of a bitch, yeah.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah, from what I understand, the book um delves much better into the themes that it was trying to hit on than this movie or even the Broadway play were ever capable of. Sure. You know, where they they kind of like eh, human rights aren't as important as nailing this next shitty music number.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, I I agree. God, I want to go watch Chicago now. Um that's what I'm gonna do. Let's go watch Chicago.

SPEAKER_05:

I'm gonna watch Chicago. Alright, everybody, take it easy.

SPEAKER_02:

We're gonna go uh and then last but not least, rewatchability. I I can't say that it's like gun to my head. Like, I mean, I probably like I could see Mia Cam wanting to finish the story of Wicked. She likes it enough, and I don't hate it enough that I I'm not like opposed.

SPEAKER_05:

Um I definitely sound like a wicked sympathizer. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

We need to put you the cowardly lion. I just yeah, I didn't I didn't hate it that that much to the point where I'd be like, I'll never ever watch it again. I could I could see I could definitely see me and Cam on a fucking but it's definitely not when I'm adding to a yearly list. Like I like I'm definitely giving pushback, and then there's gonna be that one time she asked, I'll be like, Yeah, fine, let's put it on. Like, sounds good. Um but I do, you know, four times before that I'll be like, I ain't watching Wicked this week, or maybe we're we're we're not doing that. There's a new jujutsu Kaisen movie, and that's what we're going to see. Um we'll see that three times in the runtime of Wicked. So uh yeah, I gave it a two.

SPEAKER_05:

So long. Oh my god, it was so long. But sorry, continue.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh no. I just deleted it.

SPEAKER_02:

Uh so yeah, and I gave that a two, um, which gives us a grand total of a 2.5 out of five for the movie of Wicked. That's fair. Yeah. Um I agree, I I feel like that's pretty fair, especially considering I feel I think like the hype, but I feel like the first story carries the this man this story quite a bit. Like if you think of it as like a grand story that's being told, you're like, okay, it's like kind of a like tied up bow, but it's still not great. But like it's it would kind of like bring that one down a little bit, but uh you know, this one was definitely low. I'd probably I'd probably put the other one at like 3.5 or 4. If I had I'd put like 3.5. Yeah, but which Googaloo is just worse. It's just worse.

SPEAKER_05:

All right, well, there you have it, folks. So uh Wicked 2 uh judgment day gets a 2.5 out of five.

SPEAKER_02:

Linda Hamilton could have lifted this.

SPEAKER_05:

Oh, yeah, without a doubt. With uh we she has a proven track record of taking back shots, and that would have been um that would have been something. So um, congratulations, wicked to uh 2.5. Yeah, I guess that yeah, that costs me a lot of money to see in today's fucking economy. The 2.5 pisses me off. So um well, it's time now to hop onto the golden path, which means it's time for one more shot, one more hit. This one wicked two. Cheers.

SPEAKER_02:

Twice to wicked is why uh I would like this one to go out to musicals and yeah, yes, appreciate it.

SPEAKER_05:

All right, to the pirates of pizzans, cheers, cheers.

SPEAKER_00:

I'm just thinking about me and this film.

SPEAKER_05:

We'll get there so we'll get there soon enough, all right? We we can't blow our loads yet. We can't disappoint this crap.

SPEAKER_00:

I bet Jake, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_05:

All right, so it's time for part two. It's time to jump onto the golden path. So, what are some the the deeper meanings of this one were fucking slammed into us face first with a ballpoint hammer. Listen, um racism bad. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

Racism bad. True. Racism bad. Yeah, true. True, no doubt. No doubt. A deeper just like thought or more like concept, which I do enjoy that this the story of wicked in general kind of set tells, is the different perspectives, like tale. Um, because obviously, like the Wizard of Oz being the known story, Dorothy, the wicked, you know, witch of the East is killed. Yay, now we need to kill the it's very like clear that the propaganda being fed to these people is effective and able to portray a completely different story from what's really happening on the back end, which is what Wicked is telling us is that the wicked witch of the West is not wicked. She is technically like a good witch, and there's a government, a tyranny, tyrannical, tyrannical, tyrannical, whatever tyrannical, you got it. Yeah, type of government that is um basically telling whatever story and kind of just faking this magic that doesn't actually exist, or what the wicked witch of the west has and does and wants to use for good. She's a true good soul. So I think, like, in general, that is a cool concept to do, and that's what kind of brought me into the first film, I think, even more, was I was like, oh, like this is fucking sick. Like, I love this concept because I think it's really cool when any story does that. Like, I'm like, oh, I love the two cut. I love when you cut like think a character is good and you get later in a story, and it's like, no, like that's yeah, they're not good. You were just like being kind of shown it from a perspective that made them see in that light. So and I think like it does this well, which is you know, it's kind of an obvious theme, and you know, it's it's done over time in other movies and shows and what have you, but it's still pretty cool. I think it's it it it is a really I think the story of Wicked and what what it does that that is sick.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

No, like Jason Bourne.

SPEAKER_05:

Exactly. I was watching it thinking, holy shit, this is Jason Bourne.

SPEAKER_04:

Holy shit, it's alpha.

SPEAKER_05:

He's got a sniper rifle on his fucking head. That's how you lead a resistance.

SPEAKER_02:

It's fucking, it's literally just Jeff Goldblum dancing around, just headshot fucking through the radical government done.

SPEAKER_00:

Yo, let's get out of here.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah, that's that's a rat. That was another thing. Like, how many times did this fucking domestic terrorist be invited into the same room as her problem? A bunch of times. A bunch of fucking times. And each time she was um sort of persuaded to start drifting towards that side. And um maybe it's easy. Honestly, like, yeah, these things were uh okay. So one thing I will say like we're we're very quick to say racism bad, like no fucking shit. Yeah, that's true. Well, we live in a goddamn world where you say something racist now and get cancelled for it or whatever it is, and you have half of America sending you donations to keep doing you. Um so that's true.

SPEAKER_02:

I mean, maybe some people do need to hear racism bad.

SPEAKER_05:

But those people aren't gonna be watching Wicked 2, I tell you that much. Uh right.

SPEAKER_02:

And they're not going to pick up on the themes that, you know, uh authority figures will use misinformation to paint actual goodness as evil.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

They're not gonna pick up on that.

SPEAKER_05:

Well, I would say the only thing that this movie did well was portraying that a person with a disability is also capable of being a massive piece of shit.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, they want you to know that. They want you to know that essentially everyone with a disability is a threat and you should treat them that way. Immediately when they come in your vicinity, you know, clock them as a threat, knock them out of the wheelchair.

SPEAKER_05:

Clock them neutralized. Neutralize the threat, move on. Always to the left, left, left, left.

SPEAKER_02:

That's what they were going for. Exactly. Obviously. That's what they'll get from it. Now, I'm not saying that's what the movie was going for, but a certain person's gonna watch this and be like, you're right. Sable people are fucking awful. They'll cast, they'll do, they'll they're they're self-centered, they're they don't give a shit about you, they use their disability to trap you. Some people are some people are gonna pick up that's what they're gonna get from.

SPEAKER_05:

Well, I mean, luckily, those people also weren't watching it. So I I saw this film um in uh the heart of Missouri, and the theater was empty. And and that's because the only people in this town who wanted to watch it at seven o'clock at night uh were busy. Uh they they had a lot of trad wife shit to do. Um, they're not gonna be able to see Wicked until you know their man is at work or out gambling, um, and they catch it really, really fast on a VPN, like most of our listeners. So um my theater was fucking empty. Uh I mine is almost full.

SPEAKER_01:

Really? Really? Yeah. And floors. Yeah. Oh shit. Huh. Hell yeah, brother. You guys I live in Orlando. Oh, yeah. Well, that makes sense. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah. Tourist town.

SPEAKER_05:

Like, well, wasn't it uh was it a governor you guys just no, it was a mayor of somewhere that you guys just voted for that was fucking out of left field. Ha.

SPEAKER_00:

Don't know.

SPEAKER_05:

Can't keep up on all of them. Nope. But uh yeah, um, yeah, but I I I think that the the the deeper meaning here is that uh there was no deeper meaning. It's shit that we should all know, but we live in a society where not everyone fucking has caught up with that.

SPEAKER_02:

Um and also starve yourself until you're a skeleton if you're a woman.

SPEAKER_05:

Holy shit.

SPEAKER_02:

Like there were some.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah. Um it it it just in terms of like Ariana, I'm concerned.

SPEAKER_02:

She didn't look that way in the first one, and neither did uh Cynthia. And in this one, it's very clear that a bunch of people were like, you should take Ozempic or something, and like they they lost all of their subcutaneous fat, and they look like fucking skeletons, and it's terrifying.

SPEAKER_05:

Was that they went back to the first scene we saw in Wicked One. Ariana looked fantastic, you know. She she is she's a she's a skinnier figure, that and which is great. Um but um in this one, she went beyond that, and what was what I felt was kind of weird was that the studio put those two stickers on her clavicles that weren't there in the first one.

SPEAKER_02:

It was to hide how deep the recess was because she was starved.

SPEAKER_05:

So uh, but and what's funny, so I I think that this might be like one of the golden path portions of it. I saw someone today um making a comment on how terrible um men are when they method act, which uh Jared Leto has shown us that yes, they fucking are.

SPEAKER_02:

Um I think I think I don't think it comes down to gender. I think just sometimes they're good and bad actors. And also not for nothing. Like with method acting, if you're like being a character that's shitty, like you're gonna like they're treating people like shit around like set and stuff. Yeah, like being that.

SPEAKER_05:

Well, and here I'm like, well, like just what the fuck was this? And like I went into this and I like I was force-fed these goddamn interviews um that uh Cynthia and Ariana were on, and just how fucking creepy they were. Um and I walked into this movie already on a bad footing just because of how uncomfortable these two women made me go, me, the white male.

SPEAKER_02:

It was like a meme around the internet about that. Like the people were saying, like, why are why are all the interviews weird? Why are they like, what is going on with this cast? Like, like it was like Do we need an investigation? Yeah, there was like there was a guy who had a premiere like ran out and like grabbed Ariana Grande, and that's where I saw like them offset, and like they looked like fucking ghouls. They like the you could see like their their bones in their arms in their upper in their upper and lower arms, and I was like, oh, what the fuck? What's going on? Like, I was afraid he he broke her just by hugging her or whatever. Yeah, and um which he shouldn't have done.

SPEAKER_05:

He should not have done her.

SPEAKER_02:

She shouldn't have done, and I was worried not just for her safety when it comes to her bodily autonomy, but her physically physical safety, because I can't imagine that their bodies could withstand any kind of physical force. Yeah, yeah. It's really wild.

SPEAKER_05:

Like just discussing from this this this place where I realize that we are three white men. I get that. Um, and I'm trying to be as you know respectful in that regard as I can.

SPEAKER_02:

It's not about beauty, you know, it's not about beauty. We're not criticizing their beauty or anything. It's like very concerning that they have no muscle or fat on their body that humans need.

SPEAKER_05:

But like I and just like the way they were behaving, like I felt very I was uncomfortable. I was uncomfortable by this whole thing. I maybe not I can't necessarily put it on any one thing, like like everything about it, the behaviors, the way the actors were talking, like I was off put by this film before I walked into it. Um and had I have walked into a five out of five film, that's one thing where I'm like, okay, you guys like dislike you guys did something here.

SPEAKER_02:

Uh like Christian Bale in The Machinist, where he was like skin and bones, but that was part of the movie. Like, I people were c rightly concerned about him. Which they should have been. Yeah, like he he probably shouldn't have done all that. No, he should not have but also there was a point in the movie.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah, it was freaky. It was freaky. Um, and it's well, it's like the same, but like Jared Leto has no excuse. Um, he needs to go away, to be honest with you. But um, but like Heath Ledger like losing his fucking mind for Joker, um, all those sorts of things. Like, a lot of it's like, guys, at the same time, I can't argue with Heath Ledger's results. Um, and he will probably walked into that knowing that he was about to be torn apart by uh such a sick fan base when it comes to those things. I remember when he did that and everyone was like, he's not Jack Nicholson, fuck him, fuck him. Um, but then all of a sudden now he's like one of the he's revered. Um just not just not as much as Jared Leto. No, no, obviously not. And I don't think anyone can be as revered as Jared Leto, especially there's a whole generation that's like Jared Leto is my joker. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

That's that's not true. No, it is. I swear. No, there's no one who said that. There's there's no there is there is a weird not just the younger generation, it's also the very old generation that's like actually Jared Leto is my joker.

SPEAKER_05:

This is what it was supposed to be. When I was watching Jack Nicholson uh back in '89, um, I wondered why he didn't have a stomach tap. Um I was very confused. Um, but uh honestly because they're closeted at homosexuals and they actually are in love with the Joker and they like the stomach tap.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. No one says that though, you're wrong. I don't believe it as a target.

SPEAKER_05:

There is a strange uh there is a strange Snyder cult that's popped up and they've just feed off of being the odd people out. You know, it's like ever there is any sort of cultural thing, um, whether it's, you know, you got Snyder's cuts, you got um fucking wicked, you got like T Swift, you know, like whatever it is that you attach onto, you label yourself that, and then you're willing to die on this fucking hill for someone who would not die on any hill for you. Um, and it turns into this just bizarre fucking like I don't know. Human beings just need to give the planet back to the animals, I think. Um, I don't know. Um we're we're just not responsible enough for fucking anything.

SPEAKER_02:

Well, all I can tell you is that I would die for Mark Paul Gossler and Saint Vanda Bell.

SPEAKER_05:

Oh, you're in the Gossler cult. All right. I like that. But like people define themselves by this like celebrity worship and culture hills, and I I think it's just because we have no agency in our own lives, and we have to find these statements that we can define ourselves with. And when you take a step back and look at it, it's like you need to just get fucking professional help, is what you need. No heroes, no heroes, no gods, no masters, no heroes. That's right. Fucking hell. Yeah, I think that's the deeper point of wicked too.

SPEAKER_04:

No gods, no heroes, no masters.

SPEAKER_05:

Oh, Jesus Christ. Um, well, I I I'm good with it. I'm good with it. I think it's time to insert ourselves into this shit, yeah? Sure. Let's do it. So, part three, it's time to insert ourselves, drugs or alcohol, into Wicked Two, the Wickening, Judgment Day. Um, what happens? Uh Luke, you had us start on the first one. So, Luke, you start on this one. What changes when you involve yourself in this?

SPEAKER_02:

So I'd like to think that I would just have enlisted into the military, like like I did. You'd be a monkey and military. I don't break my feet though, so yeah. No, no, no. Yeah, no, I'm the person that's with the team that's hunting the wick witch. Oh, okay. Um, but I actually have no clue. Obviously, like my perception of this is the witch is bad. Um, and I'm literally just like, yeah, fuck the witch. So I'm basically, you know, like the people who unfortunately were invading Afghanistan and Iraq and they're just ignorance, uh, just kicking indoors. Or Poland. Yeah, or Poland. Any, I guess any any government threat. Uh so yeah, just kicking indoors, and I'm just trying to find that witch. Like, and that's that's probably my whole role. And at one point, they actually uh a musical breaks out and they tell me do not sing, just fucking lip sing because I was so bad. Um, and they just so I'm in the background just lip singing just a little bit off uh in in one of the scenes. And you're like, wait a second, where the hell is my shadow? What the fuck? What is this land?

SPEAKER_05:

Could you imagine how disorienting that would be?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, it would be weird. It'd be weird. So yeah, that's how my uh I would I wouldn't change it all that much, honestly. The film would stay drastically the same. Um except, you know, I would kind of be questioning, like, I feel like we're just I feel like we're just not looking in the right place, guys. Like like the guy like the prince is trying to like lure us off, he's probably gonna take me in the back alley and shoot me because he I'm I'm getting onto the wicked witch. I'm I'm actually hunting her, I'm finding her. Um and uh and all the pieces are starting to go together. So that's that's you that's you don't even have our we the baddies moment. All the way until your eventual death. That's how I rented this one out. Propaganda gets you.

SPEAKER_00:

It does, it does. And in this world, I'm just susceptible to it, unfortunately. And that's that's my wicked. What about James?

SPEAKER_02:

Very nice. James? Oh yeah, sure. Uh so I would are are we taking these movies as like uh one piece, like the wicked the wicked uh series, like the two movies, like I can be a character in both of them, or sure.

SPEAKER_05:

Or would I have to come in for just a second? Be here for Wicked Judgment Day.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, sure, sure. Technically, I was I enlisted in the first one. I had already moved up in the ranks and was a part of the prince's team. We saw him in the background signing a pay. It could be the whole franchise with land ice. So you would see me in the background in the in the first movie. I would be uh I would be serving lunch. I'd be in the school's cafeteria, the the the witch school, and I would make sure all of these children get well fed. And I think that that would uh change their demeanors a lot because the starvation isn't eating their brains and making them do incredibly stupid, crazy shit. And uh so throughout the movie, you just see me like every time I walk, like every time they start saying something crazy, I walk up, you know, like hand them a bowl of soup, and I'm like, Yeah, go ahead, eat up, go ahead, eat up, it's okay. It's okay. And then they start making good decisions, like, oh, I why don't actually we just like you know, we can just talk out our problems with the two of us, like Glenda and I can we can talk about it and like sit down and come. We don't have to like stay stay a country apart and then only meet up to sing at each other twice. You know, we can just we can talk and uh and and they would enjoy a nice matzo ball, and I'd give them a little brisket, and it would be great. Uh the movie would totally change. Uh no one would be hunting anybody, or it would just be like, oh, okay, yeah, we know we we we're really good at resolving problems now. You know, you're my dad. You know, you're my dad. Oz wizard, you're my dad. It's that easy.

SPEAKER_00:

Easy peasy look at them and squeeze.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, uh yeah, mine would and they'd fit and their dresses would fit.

SPEAKER_05:

Yes. Yes. Um, but uh like uh uh like I I don't I don't I don't know what to say from the Ariane.

SPEAKER_02:

That's how you started section one as well. That's exactly basically what you did in section two.

SPEAKER_05:

Like Ariana looked fantastic. Um and that was partly the light. That was partly the light.

SPEAKER_02:

Like part of the lighting we talked about, it made all those things disappear, all the like dents in her head and stuff. Do you remember from the interviews? Like she had all these like divots in her head where her skull was showing. The light actually covers.

SPEAKER_05:

I mean, when you have flat light and I can see your rib cage from chest down. That's bad. But um, so for me, um, I would insert myself, and I see that this this green chick, which I'm strangely attracted to, um, is trying to run a rebellion. And I see that everyone in this world is kind of a bitch. Um, there it there would be a scene, so uh she'd be talking about it. You know what they need?

SPEAKER_02:

Some penis.

SPEAKER_05:

She'd be talking to Jeff Goldblum. He needs to go. Very obviously, he needs to go. I would walk in and they're all trying to cast spells that they didn't seem to have full control of. And I would very slowly insert a knife into Jeff Goldblum's forehead. Um, I would let him drop to the floor, and I'm like, Cynthia, babe, uh, who do you need next? And I would split the throat of her old headmaster. Um, I I would kill them all. And I'm like, that's how you run a rebellion, babe. Um, and uh we would have one spells. And you guys are sitting here fucking around with magic that doesn't seem to work. It it makes clouds and things, that's cool, but it doesn't change boots on the ground. Um so I kill all the problems, I have sex with the wicked witch of the west, and then because power corrupts absolutely, I suck start a shotgun. Um and uh that that's how the movie changes.

SPEAKER_00:

James is the only one who survives in this film after we join.

SPEAKER_02:

Uh yeah, yeah. I I uh, you know, I afterward I make some musaka to try to calm Alpha's spirits after her lover blew his brains out. It's okay, darling. Have your have some egg plan.

SPEAKER_05:

Have some carbs. Um you need it for your brain to function because you have some grief to process.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah. Um yeah, that's how I'd change it. Um I I think that's a phenomenal film. It's pretty fun. Five stars. Good guys win. Uh yeah. Um So, well that's wicked for good.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah, that's wicked for wicked for good. Judgment day. So uh for good. Yeah, I'm like, look, power corrupts absolutely. I already saw you kind of getting weird when you thought you could make it work. So yeah, I'm just gonna suck start this bad boy. Now that I'm the green wizard or whatever the fuck you people say.

SPEAKER_02:

Um stop putting people in this position. It's me.

SPEAKER_05:

Yeah. Um and yeah, that so that's that's how that movie would change. Um, it's one for the children, really. Uh I I need them to learn a real lesson.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, somehow still rated PG 13.

SPEAKER_05:

I get one fuck. See, and I would use it, I'll tell you that much.

SPEAKER_02:

No, it's you accidentally killed a wrong guy, and then that's what's in the sun, but like you the knife's in his head, and you're like, ah fuck.

SPEAKER_05:

And that's why I suck starts shot.

SPEAKER_00:

One too many.

SPEAKER_05:

Well, I'm a monster. Uh well, there you have it, folks. Uh, wicked two, the wickening judgment day for all, or for good, whatever. Um, two out of five. Wait, two point five out of five. I'm your host, Ryan Barron Nooth. With me as always, James Croslin, Luke. Uh, thank you all for joining us on our 100th episode. If you enjoyed it, please like and subscribe and do all the things.

SPEAKER_02:

Thanks so much to everybody.

SPEAKER_05:

We love you. Uh, five weeks from now, um, because we watched Wicked and we're impressionable, you'll be able to see our clavicles on the next recording. So uh get ready for that. Uh, we're all wearing uh something that stops at the neck and uh really shows how much we've lost. So enjoy it. I don't fucking know. I'm just riffing now. Goodbye. Bye.

Head Shot

Ryan Baron North

Host