High n' Dry Podcast

Rating Rian Johnson’s “Wake Up Dead Man” And The Cult Of Whodunits

• Ryan Baron North and James Crosslin • Episode 101

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We rate Rian Johnson’s Wake Up Dead Man, argue what makes a fair-play whodunit, and wrestle with how religion and charisma shape control, community, and consequence. Between jokes and toasts, we land on 3.5 out of 5 and ask for bolder risks next time.

• scoring the film by cinematography, acting, score, story, rewatchability
• standout shots that map power and space in the church
• ensemble performances and tonal hamminess on purpose
• pacing drag and the line between twisty and fair-play solvable
• faith, cult dynamics, and the soft-pedaled cost of belief
• media risk, IP fatigue, and why new voices matter
• playful “insert ourselves into the plot” alternate scenes

“Always wear your seatbelts”


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SPEAKER_00:

No time like the present then. So let's get this uh boat on the show. You guys ready? All right. Hey everybody. Welcome to Hindry Podcast. I'm your host, Ryan Barron North. With me as always, James Crossland, Luke, fellas, how are you doing? Happy New Year. Happy New Year! Happy New Year. Yes, it's our first episode back after the new year. You of course know that we are the only podcast keeping alive the fandom of the PJs.

SPEAKER_01:

I remember the PJs. Was that uh was that WGN? No, that was Fox. Yes, it was Fox. Yeah. Version is Fox, yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

The PJs doesn't look like it was real.

SPEAKER_01:

It was real, man. It was fucking real. Looks like a real fucking fever dream.

SPEAKER_00:

Like if you watch the early episodes of Futurama, even the PJs is imprinted on all the sewer crates. Like all the yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Pretty sure they ran back to back.

SPEAKER_02:

That's funny. It's love some Futurama. Of course. That's funny.

SPEAKER_00:

But uh, we're not gonna be talking about the PJs today. On our Dalmatian episode, get it, 101 episodes. Um, we're actually gonna be discussing the movie this week. Uh Wake Up Dead Man, and that's uh part of the knives out mysteries.

SPEAKER_02:

I watched 101 Dalmatian specifically for this episode, so damn it. I only have notes on that.

SPEAKER_00:

Well, that's gonna be really confusing as we break this down into three parts. Uh so the first part, we're gonna rate this bad boy. We're gonna give you the definitive score out of five. Um, it puts Fandango especially uh to shame, uh, as well as everyone else, all of our competitors.

SPEAKER_01:

Um there's the most accurate is Amazon.

SPEAKER_00:

Well, we can't compete with them. Uh please remember uh for all of your uh home good needs, reach out to Amazon now. But no, no, fuck them. We're better than Amazon, we're better than Fandango, we're better than the two guys, Siegfried and Royd and all them. Um we're gonna get you the definitive score out of five. All right. And then we're gonna get into our part two. We're gonna step onto the golden path and we're going to dive into the deeper meaning that uh Ryan, the director, Ryan, what was his last name? Johnston. Ryan Johnston was beating us over the head with. Um and then John's Johnson. I thought you said Johnston. All right. Well, that guy. He had some thoughts, and we're gonna get into those. And then finally, for our third part, we're gonna insert ourselves, drugs, or alcohol into the film. And what makes it so great, special, and fun, is that we're gonna be doing it drunk, high, and or medicated. So, uh fellas, uh, what are you uh popping, smoking, or drinking this week?

SPEAKER_02:

I've got some pineapple paradise. Nice.

SPEAKER_01:

I'm going to cross it. Nice. So it's a hybrid.

SPEAKER_02:

Well, you, James.

SPEAKER_01:

I I'm going to have 10 milligrams of Focalin plus uh unnamed sweet leaf hemp. CBD hemp.

SPEAKER_00:

Unnamed sweet leaf hemp. And I will be joining you guys today with uh just your basic knob creek nine years, uh 100 horsepower. And on the side, I will be sipping this here ball jar of uh Tito's and Coke Zero. I'm sorry. It's whatever it takes to quiet the D.

SPEAKER_02:

Fair enough. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00:

So line them up. This first toast, first shot, first hit. This one goes out to our Dalmatian episode. 101 episodes.

SPEAKER_02:

I thought it was gonna go out to you because we're worried about you, Ryan.

SPEAKER_00:

For drinking as anything, water down my knob Greek. Oh my!

SPEAKER_01:

Oh my but uh the hemp is real nice, smooth. Yeah. I accidentally uh I accidentally uh cleared out the pipe. I didn't realize that uh my wife had had a little bit of cannabis and cleared out my I cleared out the pipe the other night. I thought it was my my hemp, and boy did my mood swing. It was just a it was just a reminder. It's really frustrating. I cannot do cannabis anymore. Uh I missed it, of course, but I'm not like shaking from it or like, oh my god, I can't do anything without it. It was a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_02:

You're not gonna suck a dick in an alley for it yet.

SPEAKER_01:

No, I I no I just suck the dick because I like it.

SPEAKER_02:

For the flavor, obviously.

SPEAKER_00:

All right. Well, uh, this next shot, next toast, next hit, this one goes out to our newest listeners. These ones are coming at us from well, we got a few. We got uh Tracostelli, it's the province of Ancona. We got uh Cambridge in Family Shire. We got Council Bluffs, Iowa, we got Wimbledon, Merton, Vilnius, the Vilnius City Municipality.

SPEAKER_01:

Uh that's Lithuania. Bucharest.

SPEAKER_00:

But we got more fucking Lithuanians on this goddamn thing.

SPEAKER_01:

I'm pretty sure Vilnius was the same one as last time.

SPEAKER_00:

I think maybe we just remember I my hatred was misdirected. We were fine with the Lithuanians. It was the Latvians that uh were coming around this show last time.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, but uh no, no, no, no, no. I mistook and I apologize to the Lithuanians. It was what it was Lithuania, it wasn't Latvia, and we don't like the Latvians because they don't listen to the show.

SPEAKER_00:

For uh yes, for obvious reasons. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

And also we hate our listeners, so fuck Lithuania also.

SPEAKER_00:

Fuck all y'all. Uh but those are some wonderful VPNs, guys. So uh cheers.

SPEAKER_01:

Cheers. Cheers. All hail Lithuania.

SPEAKER_00:

Lithuania forever. Well, this uh I'm not looking forward to this next one.

SPEAKER_01:

Good luck on not getting invaded by Russia.

SPEAKER_00:

Well, good luck not getting invaded by us. Uh, you know, I mean if the Epstein list comes back into the news cycle, you're in some trouble.

SPEAKER_01:

We'll do Greenland or Canada first. We're staying in this hemisphere so far.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. Thus far. So uh for this last toast, I actually got switched to Tito's. I am out of knob creek. So I'll be doing a shot of vodka. I'm not looking forward to it. Crap's nasty. So uh this final toast, final hit. This one goes to Wake Up Dead Man Knives Out Mystery. Cheers. Cheers.

SPEAKER_01:

That's a injured drink. Cheers, Ryan Johnson. You're doing a good job making your movies. You're doing movies. Yeah. They're movies that I want to watch. I go and sit down and I'm like, hey, there's a movie that Ryan Johnson made. I'm gonna watch it.

SPEAKER_00:

I'm excited for the new Ryan Johnson outing. I hear that a lot. I like the what else is he? I know he's big for something else.

SPEAKER_01:

Well, here, let me go ahead and read some of his some of his big ones. Um did mixed past. He did, of course, the three knives out series. He also did the poker face series uh on Netflix, the television show. What'd you say?

SPEAKER_00:

The Lady Gaga documentary.

SPEAKER_01:

No. No, it was uh the one with Natasha Leone, who I think you're probably a fan of.

SPEAKER_00:

I am, yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Uh because she's so gritty.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. He did looper.

SPEAKER_01:

He did looper, which I think you were a fan of.

SPEAKER_00:

No, I was not, no.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, you didn't like looper?

SPEAKER_00:

That's the one with uh Bruce Willis and Bruce Willis's uh the child played by Gordon Lovett, right?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, no, you didn't like that one?

SPEAKER_00:

I didn't even I didn't see it.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, you didn't see it. I think you would have liked it.

SPEAKER_00:

Really? Huh.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, I think you would have liked it. Okay, well, maybe if you don't know the premise of the whole thing, you should check it out. I think you'd like it.

SPEAKER_00:

Okay. All right, maybe I will. Maybe I will. All right, well, maybe Ryan Johnson and I aren't so at odds. So he did Rogue One. Oh, there's the problem. Okay. He did the last one.

SPEAKER_03:

Rogue One?

SPEAKER_00:

There we go. There's the problems. He did all that Star Wars crap. I knew there was something wrong with him.

SPEAKER_02:

I didn't do Star Wars one. How dare you say that about Rogue One? Rogue One's a piece of earth.

SPEAKER_00:

Uh uh.

SPEAKER_01:

He did American fiction, which a lot of people liked.

SPEAKER_00:

Not familiar. Well, well, fuck this guy. Let's talk about his movie. So part one, let's dive in. How did we feel about Wake Up Dead Man? Uh, you want me to kick this one off? Yeah, sure. Let's hear it. Okay. Um, so cinematography. I mean, it was alright. Um, like there it was alright. Uh there was nothing particularly I don't know. Uh uh nothing really stood out for me, I would say, but nothing also detracted. I felt that it did well. I I feel that it might have been a little behind the cinematography of the first or second knives out, but nothing that detracted. Nothing that detracted. So I'm gonna give it a 3.5 for cinematography. Acting, um, I thought it was good. The the all I I had to question myself for a second with um Glenn Close. For a moment today, I was like, is she too hammy? But then I'm like, no, I've just met these people. Yeah, she's she's playing a real person, it's just the person she's portraying is fucking ridiculous. So across the board, solid acting. James Bond is always a standout in these things, and uh I I truly enjoy the acting. I will say uh Jeremy Renner is a drag on anything he's ever been in, ever.

SPEAKER_01:

Um just like the snowmobile. He was a real drag. Uh no, sorry, that was mean Jeremy Renner. If people don't know, Jeremy Renner got run over by like a snowplow. Yeah. That was he had like rented one and he had gotten out of it and it took off, and he got dragged under it and nearly died. Oh my fucking and that was a couple years ago, and he had to go through severe physical therapy. He's just all scarred up and still crippled a little bit.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and uh, you know. It didn't help his acting ability. That accident is clearly still playing on his mind.

SPEAKER_02:

Um, the rooting man whose wife just left him is actually a perfect role, though. So I thought he played it very well. Well, that's what it's kind of right up his alley.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean, that's what confused me. He's like, you should have killed him.

SPEAKER_02:

I thought he was playing that character when he was Nighthawk in Avengers as well. I thought his wife had left him there, too. I was so surprised to see it was a connected family.

SPEAKER_01:

I was like, damn.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh, yeah, people who love you? Yeah, what the fuck? I uh wouldn't have guessed it.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, so uh Jeremy Renner, of course, uh he just kind of plows through any scene he's in and really uh just uh so uh for that uh I'm gonna give the adjustment. You know, and that's not his fault. That's not his fault. He he shouldn't have been trying to operate at that level anyway. So fuck. So yeah, four. Score, stay on track. I thought fantastic. Um the knives out is starting to develop its own um flavor, while not, in my opinion, quite as recognizable as like you know, your Star Wars's, your Indiana Jones's is and all those. Um it's starting to create it's starting to create its own. And uh I hear certain sounds, I'm like, oh shit, it's a knives out experience. I know what I'm in for. It always adds to it. It gives me that feeling of like I'm in a whodunit. Like I feel like they really are doing, they know their job, they know where they're at.

SPEAKER_01:

Everybody got the memo.

SPEAKER_00:

Uh yeah, is John Williams doing it? No, but I think it's fantastic, regardless. Uh so a score on soundtrack I'm going to give a 4.5. Um story and plot. I enjoyed this one more than the second one, not as much as the first. Really? Yeah. Uh the thing that kind of gets me with the thing I loved about the first one, and I love Who Who Done It, where I could figure it out. Where if there's not some fucking magic thing that happened, or not like I don't you know, like you remember those old like click game mysteries back in the 90s and early 2000s, where you essentially had to be in the brain of the writer to figure it out because he has some twist that only he could possibly know that that isn't readily available, it's convoluted at the end. Um so that kind of took me out a little bit. Was that I'm waiting just for your fucking gotcha twist instead of watching something that I could potentially solve myself. Um, and I I feel that when you're watching a who a pre-wequ prerequisite of a good whodunit is that your audience, if they're intelligent, could solve it. Um, and I don't feel that was the case here because it relied on, you know, like I would have had to have gone there and said, well, it's those two, obviously. They're dressing up as simple, like it's just becomes nonsensical at a point. Um, but still very entertaining, still very fun. And so for that, I'm gonna give the story a 3.5. And rewatchability, I watched it for the second time today when I knew we were gonna do this one. So uh I'll probably wind up watching it again. I might just have a whodunit, you know, tickle, and I'll put on um clue and I'll throw on some uh knives out. So uh rewatchability, I'm gonna give a four.

SPEAKER_03:

Nice, very high rewatchability. It's pretty impressive.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

So who's rewatchability is probably one of the lowest scored categories for us.

SPEAKER_01:

Right. Makes sense. We got so many press so many things are pressing on our time. We gotta be real choosy about what we're gonna rewatch.

SPEAKER_02:

I agree. I agree. And I think that's what makes us different from these other these other brands. That like they're not thinking about it. Is this a movie you're gonna throw on again? They just think of it in a cinematic way, which is true, it can be rated in that way, but we're for the consumer, for the people. Uh a people's trading.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, we're superior.

SPEAKER_02:

Exactly, in every way possible.

SPEAKER_01:

We're supreme. We are supremacists.

SPEAKER_00:

If you will. What were my scores real quick? You don't mind, just so I can see that. Yeah, 3.544.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh wait, 3.5445.

SPEAKER_00:

I need a letterbox that bitch. Not letterbox that comma, bitch. I need to but uh well Luca, uh, what did you think?

SPEAKER_02:

So I I'm probably freshest mind on it, and you know, first thoughts is I I like the movie. I feel like it was it was fun. I don't th I feel like this whole series has been a very solid whodunit um in general. I get what you're saying with like the twist kind of being too far out there for you to ever know, but uh, if it's done well, I think it's fun. And I think that this one was pretty well done. The storyline was cool enough when I'm like trying to do an unsolvable murder, and like I liked the thought out. I thought it was done well when it was played back. But this one, for some reason, the chaos felt a little bit more chaotic, and not as yeah, I don't know, like the other movies, it was like it is chaotic, and I feel like it was done that way for a reason, and like that's kind of the pace of the movie. But this one, the chaos felt a little more out of place for whatever reason.

SPEAKER_00:

It felt like a snow plow you lost control of.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

We're definitely gonna upset some people at this point.

SPEAKER_02:

He's alive. But yeah, and then Barely did you see the movie? He could barely say a line. But uh overall, um, I thought it was good. It was funny you said that the cinematography wasn't anything that stood out because it there was a few shots that really stood out to me. Um, same here. There was some really cool cinematography. At times, I agree, was just kind of just doing its thing. It's fine. But there was one shot I specifically remember where it was, and they did this a couple times, I feel like the cross, and it was in darkness, and then the door would open and the light would go right around the cross. And I don't know why, but it felt significant in the moments in the in the storytelling he was doing. And then they also had a couple like real panned out, like grand scale, and they would use the soundtrack to like amplify these moments and give you this sense of grandeur. I just got this new little soundbar too, and it sounded really, really good. I was kind of testing it out for on this movie, um and it sounded really good. Uh so I thought overall they did all the pieces pretty well. Um and the story implies kind of where it was just a little chaotic for me and wasn't as as enjoyable of a movie. I got a little bored. Yeah. Um wasn't just like, okay, fuck. This is really getting elaborate. I looked down and I didn't realize there was like 45 minutes more. I was like, oh shit. And it was still good at the end. I was like, okay, it was a good 45 minutes still, but I'm like, damn, you guys had to put me through it.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, we look yeah, Sher and I at one point like looked at the like did a time check, and we were like, oh my god. It was right at that mark you were talking about, like 45 minutes left.

SPEAKER_02:

I was like, God damn, okay. So it did get a little boring, but uh yeah, overall it was good. So I'll run through the score. Cinematography, like I said, I thought that they did a little extra. I think it was pretty some really cool shots that they had throughout the movie. And uh in general, I feel like this series has had good cinematography. Clearly, Ryan Johnson's vision for how he wants things shot is very clear when he's doing these. I don't know if he how he'll you know, honestly, with Rogue One and stuff too, I felt like his cinematography was very direct and very um intentional. So I give it a I give it a four. So that maybe it was so hard, maybe four point five, but no fine. Acting I thought was really good. Uh funny enough, Daniel Craig I thought was kind of his accent threw me off a couple times. Um I was like, hmm. Uh we're he went a little harder.

SPEAKER_01:

He went a little harder than than the last one.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, and it almost came through like English accent came through a little bit more with the depth of the accent he was doing.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

So that threw me off just a little bit. Nat Charlot, I it was or Jeremy rendered this and I chose. Nat Sharp was because I literally was like, what the fuck? He was so just like very one-line monotone character throughout the movie, which was uh which was odd, but I felt like it fit in place. Um and I thought the main guy, the Judd Duplicity, Josh O'Connor, I thought he did really well. I'm not really familiar with him or anything else that he was in, but I thought he did a really, really good job um in the role that he was in.

SPEAKER_01:

Um but acting against. Wait, which one? Oh, uh Josh O'Connor, the main like the young priest.

SPEAKER_02:

Young priest, yeah. Um but his like his kind of like willingness to go along because he's just trying to like start this new life, but then also just like he's like, what the fuck is going on here? Like, and to the point where like he does finally snap, and I felt like his um Yeah, I thought he played it well. So I gave everybody a four. Um score soundtrack I thought was very solid. This one's gonna be the four. Um I think that again it's very consistent throughout the films. Story plot is where I'm gonna uh take a little bit off just because I feel like I I got bored and it was um just a little bit too chaotic at times. Um and I just uh wasn't able to keep entertained the whole time. Uh and then rewatchability. I could definitely watch it again. I feel like anything that's in some sort of a series automatically usually gets a little higher rewatchability as long as the series is in a fucking horrible throughout. If you enjoy it. At least one's really good, you might end up watching the other pair because it goes along with it, you know. Um so I could see myself watching it again, um, but I'm definitely not putting it on specifically uh to watch this one. Um I think I liked the onion the best. I don't know three. Yeah, yeah. I think I did. But uh rewatch but I give it a three. Okay. Alright, alright.

SPEAKER_01:

Not bad. Not bad.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, I feel like it's I feel like again, it it was a good movie. It was just I wish it uh probably the pacing could have been just a little faster. I don't know what they could have cut out, but um, like I said, anytime I'm checking the watch where I'm like, I feel like that's not a good pacing in a movie. Anyone, and that just might be my attention span, who knows? There might be people who were just sucked into this the whole time, but um not me.

SPEAKER_00:

Okay, all right, all right, solid, solid. Uh and James, where are you coming in at?

SPEAKER_01:

Sure. I'll go ahead and start with acting. I thought that most of the acting was pretty good in this movie. I think that essentially everyone was hamming it. Uh and I think that was kind of the vibe. Because this was kind of like a this was the this is the only one that's been like religious focus. Like religion that wasn't even mentioned in the other ones. And this is like all about like spirituality and the soul of the thing, and about like the the how the soul heightens things, and uh, you know, so I think that really mixes in with the the hammy acting. Uh, and I think that they I think that everybody got the everybody got the the direction and did did the right thing. Uh even Jeremy Renner did alright. Uh it was really nice seeing Thomas Aiden Church, who I like as an actor. He was the uh the groundskeeper. Uh loved him on wings.

SPEAKER_02:

Uh I really liked him as Sandman in Spider-Man was always how I remember him. Um yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

I like Thomas Aiden Church. He was the only good guy in the movie, as they said. But yeah, good acting. I think people really embodied their characters, and um give the acting a four. Uh cinematography, I think there were some really good shots in this movie. You know, you talked about the ones that you liked. I I specifically remember some pretty good shots where like from the side angle of the pulpit and the way like it jutted out and and loomed over his congregation. I felt that they really showed that very well with the cinematography. Uh, and they had some really interesting shots that are atypical, like low isometric shots, like low corner shots outside of buildings and the grounds. So you could see people moving around the property, and it helped you understand the geography of the property better and stuff.

SPEAKER_02:

It's world for world building almost, like yeah, in that in that general area.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, it was a lot of shots from the corner though, and people would walk back and sideways. And it was, and I thought that was really interesting. It was almost like people moving around game board, like clue. Okay. Which I thought was interesting. I'm gonna give the cinematography four. Score and soundtrack. I don't remember it at all. I never forget. I always forget to just think about it. It doesn't fucking register for me at all. I never think about it, so I gotta give it a three. It's what it is.

SPEAKER_04:

Uh-uh.

SPEAKER_01:

Story and plot. See, this is where it kind of goes a little lower for me because all the beats of this, I hit them early. Um, I knew that it was gonna be Thomas Hayden Church in the coffin as soon as he like walked, he walked out a different way than everybody else, and then she has to be in the room together. And I was like, these motherfuckers. Like I knew I knew exactly at that time that's what was going on. And you know, there was this idea that perhaps you know he had faked his death. Like that's what sh that's what my wife was thinking. Um but I was like, no, I ruled that out because they flipped his the way they flipped his corpse in the morning and stuff. I was like, no, that guy, that guy's dead. And I it this one I did guess very many of the points. One thing I thought they were gonna do that they didn't was make uh was make Jeremy Renner's wife the mother of of uh Josh Brolin's son sigh. I thought they were gonna make it like he cheated with Jeremy Renner's wife. But they did not do that.

SPEAKER_00:

I would have appreciated that that would have been fun.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, the um, but yeah, it did drag. It did drag in some times, especially when they were hunting for the diamond in the office. There were a few times where I was like, aren't you guys supposed to be really smart? Aren't you supposed to be real smart? Can't you fucking figure this out a little faster? Like it's clearly in the tomb. Like I figured that out. I figured that out like a third of the way through the movie, and two thirds of the way you guys are still like, yeah, what's going on? So yeah. Uh so I give it like a three 3.5. Uh and for rewatchability, uh, I'm definitely gonna watch it again at some point. I again, like you like Luke said, Glass Onion was my favorite. Glass Onion, I also um, you know, picked out the mystery, but I thought it was better, especially because it led up with us getting to know the characters before the murder. I think because there was like a mid a midpoint incident where in this one, like the murder happened like very early, and then we got to know the character. Like they went around and interviewed, interviewed everybody. That should have been the beginning. If we were gonna jump back in time and he was gonna write about all the stuff, that's when we should have learned about more about those people instead of like after the fact. They maybe just shouldn't have done that beginning thing, but but we got like almost a double dip that didn't that didn't give us enough there, and it makes the rewatchability go down. So I mean maybe a three. I'll give it a three.

SPEAKER_00:

Alright. Well, Luke, uh, what did we come up with?

SPEAKER_02:

That is a rating of 3.5 out of five stars.

SPEAKER_01:

That seems fair. That's that's fair.

SPEAKER_00:

That's fair. Yeah, I like it.

SPEAKER_02:

Alright. Well earned, well earned. I feel the thing is they kind of started to go into their stories, but I feel like with who done it, you want them. The whole point is to have this whole background for you to be like, oh, well, it's them. Everyone has a motive to kill the person. That's the that's the whodunit special, and they didn't really do that. But honestly, I picked the old lady out just because she was creepy from the game. She killed him. She's creepy as fuck.

SPEAKER_01:

Well, right in this right in the beginning of the story, they talk like they show her talking to the daughter, you know, Josh Brolin. Oh, Josh Brolin's mom, the whore harlot or whatever. But they show her talking to her and they show her whisper in her ear, and they they don't have her say it in the scene. And I'm like, oh, that's she definitely called her a whore and was like, she said some bullshit to her. And so it's really clear that she's not a good person.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

Very early on.

SPEAKER_00:

Very early. When you're purposefully excluding things, like so it's just yeah, like I it was never meant to be solved, it was just uh sort of roller coastery, but it's still fun. And yeah, so I mean 3.5 is fair. So it's time to get on to the second part of this thing. It's time to dive into the golden path. But before we do that, we gotta get a little more drunk, gotta get a little more high. So line them up. Our final toast and shot of the night. This one goes out to a respectable Tito, so disgusting.

SPEAKER_01:

Way to go, Rian Johnson. You make a passable hoodone. Yeah. Well, you know, the spirituality of this kind of turned me off.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean, he had a lot to say about it, but the thing I had the thing that got me about it was it's shit we've been saying for years. It's like the the the only thing that like really kind of got me is like, oh, you're saying something like, yes, thank you. I appreciate you saying that. Because the rest of it, like, yeah, it's all over the place. But I liked it when you learned that Josh Brolin's an illegitimate child and him, they teamed up and everything like that. And the guy with like Star Wars, and he's like, Yeah, like the rebels. And yeah, it's like it's just kind of it's a dumb joke, but it was also so poignant in the fact that you know, if you talk to these people, they think that that's who they are. You know, yeah, they think they're the heroes. I mean, like, this was clearly pointed at you know, conservatives, the religious, um, you know, just the MAGA specifically. MAGA. Like it was specifically pointed at them, but talking to them, they truly think that they're Luke Skywalker and Han Solo. And it's like, are you out of your fucking boot licking mind?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, because just to be clear, Han Solo is a bad person.

SPEAKER_00:

Just so we're clear first.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

He shot. I got it tattooed on my leg. He shot first.

SPEAKER_00:

No, and uh, they did not to jump uh the movies, but they really fucked that up with a Han Solo story where the arc he goes through is just given to us in his prequel. But anyway, um He's a scoundrel, yeah. But like you were talking about a group of people that worships the police. Like, really? You're not a stormtrooper, you're a fucking stormtrooper. That's what you are. Um, and so I did appreciate that. Just someone calling that. But other than that, it's like the these things aren't new. And where I'm at right now is like, I don't know what the fuck to do about it anymore because these people are still winning the vote. You know, every other election I still gotta live in their world, and it's like, you know, uh I I don't know what what is this doing anymore? Fucking Christmas Carol has been played to us since the you know the fucking the 20th century, the beginning of the 20th century, and capitalists still don't get it.

SPEAKER_01:

It's like did you know that Charles Dickens did not like that book? Like he wrote that book because he was commissioned to write a Christmas story, and he's like, people will really eat up this story about a rich guy learning his lesson and like being tortured.

SPEAKER_00:

He hated that book. Well, what's wild about it is in today's world, fucking Scrooge is a centrist, like a true centrist. Yeah, you know, yeah, yeah. He believes in his taxes, he believes that it's going to help. He'd be like, why do I have to pay charity when the taxes I pay are like, you know, he wasn't malicious.

SPEAKER_01:

He wasn't like I'm actually going to fuck everyone by hiding all my money and not paying taxes.

SPEAKER_00:

Like, yeah, he wasn't on the island. He was just a rich guy that needed to do better.

SPEAKER_01:

He didn't kick an orphan or anything like our rich do.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh, yeah, like our rich people do. Our rich people fuck him. Yeah. And it's just, yeah. So yeah, that's my thing. It's like, yeah, I know what you're saying, Ryan, but like, no shit.

SPEAKER_01:

You know?

SPEAKER_00:

So I don't know.

SPEAKER_01:

There was a there was a little bit here about trying to bring them back to the light, you know, like that's kind of what it was, was like, bring them back to the light. Like they're they're afraid, you know, and their their patterns are enmeshed in this in this charismatic person's fear tirade, you know? And it and it's like, yeah, yeah, they are, but they also don't trust the other. Like they're like they've they've been ingrained with distrust, and it's not this movie really made it seem kinda easy to like is like if only you just give them the chance for salvation, they'll take it. And it's like, no, that's just not actually the case. That's just not the reality because it's been offered lots of times.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. Kind of hand waves it.

SPEAKER_02:

Well, uh, Luke, uh, what did you pick up from your I think like this also, I mean, it's a pretty obvious theme of like like a cult and the fact that like when people are in low points of their lives, they can be easily influenced to believe something that gives what's happening to them reason or meaning or um resolution or you know, almost a way out of whatever they're feeling pain-wise. Um and the you know, a movie where it shows that religion is used to do that all the time. It's a pretty um known thing that you know it it's kind of people were preyed upon in that fact. And um I I have no no thoughts against like religion. I feel like everyone should have some sort of faith and like something greater than themselves to believe in. It doesn't have to be no no no, it doesn't have to be like a god, but just a greater there is a greater power out there, a universal power.

SPEAKER_01:

No, I don't think people should believe in anything. I think that nothing at all. Not even what they can touch or taste or smell. I don't think they should believe in anything. It's all the matrix.

SPEAKER_02:

But either way, I don't, you know, if they like, but at the end of the day, organized religion is a little bit fucking culty, and it's fucking weird in the in a sense and and the way that they want you to practice and just follow this all you know, something that's interpreted from a thousand years ago, and I feel like the movie is doing a good job of just that theme being this intertwined throughout a story that they're telling, which is just a hoot dummy.

SPEAKER_00:

Well, I feel like a lot of times these movies that try and like poke at organized religion, like this one did, like, yeah, it showed some kind of ugliness and everything like that, but it doesn't even fucking scratch the surface. I mean, are there are people who have gotten out of these communities who describe their religious trauma? I mean, just the countless women who have been victimized by these cultures and the way that it damaged their lives. And even after you get out of it, there is this level of pain that's gonna follow. And it's so like these these movies will like go at it for a second there, but it's always very just like tongue in cheek, pawn at it, you voted for Trump, obviously, like that kind of crap. It does not go into the victimization, it does not go into um like like take the the woman who they called like the whole fucking time. They vaguely say, I just thought about how she must have felt, and then I'm like, well, no, you guys are on something here for a second. How the fuck does she feel? Um, how about we dive into that? Um, because this is what you guys are doing to a half of the female population. So how about we actually go into that? Instead, but no, we just kind of you know, just poke at it, and we don't finish the job. Like a snowplow in Jeremy Renner's driveway. We didn't finish the job, and we just we just ignored the real problem. So that's what I'm saying. Um is like you were on the cusp of actually saying something, and then you just didn't. So yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

I feel like that's also these media, you know, these artistic mediums that are trying to portray, like, uh, you know, make these things palatable as well, um, for people and something that's not gonna get them booted off the internet, which is hard, especially when all these networks and the people who are paying for these movies give a shit is ratings. And if you fucking don't get ratings because you decided to make it something that is grander or palatable or less palatable, I should say, then you'll just fucking never be able to get you'll get blacklisted and get fucked. So, like, you know, and I think that's what it sucks. It's a broken, broken system when it comes to that.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and I've been thinking about that a lot lately, exactly what you're saying. Like, I as you know, this country's preeminent movie rating source, I I'm worried that we're going into sort of film dark age where if it's not a part of established um IP, there's no point in making it. If it's not gonna grow you know, if it's not gonna you know make this money, there's no point in doing it. If it's not just targeted at everyone with this just mush of you know digestible crap, it's not gonna be.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, I I think we're actually moving out of that period. I think we've been in that period for a while. Yeah. I think what you're saying has been going on for a while. The marvelification of every movie has been a thing that's been talked about for like ten years. But I think we're starting to come out the other side a little bit with things like uh weapons, you know, was a big hit that was really surprising.

SPEAKER_00:

Um well, this movie, the first glass for the first knives out was that. And that's why I was like really hopeful about it. But now there's the third now, we're talking about the fucking third one.

SPEAKER_01:

Um I I pretty I hope Ryan Johnson keeps making these.

SPEAKER_00:

I do too. I have fun enough.

SPEAKER_01:

I think they're enjoyable enough. Yeah. And this one, you know, has its own special tones and stuff. You know, with the spiritualism. It's different than the other ones. I think it makes it unique. And I hope he keeps making them unique. Even though this one doesn't necessarily do it for me.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. Agreed. Agreed. No, I I I can roll with that. I can roll with that.

SPEAKER_02:

And also, I mean, yeah, there were a few movies I was just looking back like this year that I thought were, you know. Like Friendship was pretty unique. It was a completely different style of comedy that I had never seen this year. Like um, The Life of Chuck I really liked. That was like, you know, that's a typical kind of like life of Walter Middy, just like a kind of a happy street.

SPEAKER_01:

Typical Stephen King.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. Uh yeah, Weapons was another one that I had pretty high on my list. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

K-pop demon hunters, which is weird that uh Josh Brolin was also in Weapons. Good Boy. Yeah. Sinners. Yeah, good boy. So there was Mekie 17. We did Mickey 17 on this one.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, we did a real weird movie.

SPEAKER_00:

Very weird movie.

SPEAKER_01:

It went outside of what was palatable a lot of the time and stuff, and that's what we're talking about. That's what it's doing.

SPEAKER_00:

Well, I mean, but even Mickey 17 at the end. And it was solved by an election.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah, that's true. So it's like we're we're we're try they're trying to bust out of it.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. Yeah, we're working on it. Well, I the fucking way that you're finally gonna do that is stop giving the same motherfuckers the wheel to the next goddamn thing. If they sucked in the last movie, cool. There are eight billion people on this planet. Pick a new one. Damn, so you fail, you're out. Yes. Just like it should be with like tough. Just like it is at my job in the real world. Um, just like it is with you guys at your jobs, just like it's a job I fail all the time and they can't kick me out because I'm white. Well, see, and that's where we're at. So No, keep it!

SPEAKER_03:

Keep it!

SPEAKER_00:

But I mean, like, if we were to finally open this up and stop giving everything to the famous person's kid, we might have something to actually be proud of here.

SPEAKER_01:

That'd be nice.

SPEAKER_00:

I don't know. Yeah. And I'm not putting this at Ryan Johnson's feet. It's just a thing that's been on my mind lately. And watching the third knives out that got a 3.5, it kind of just awoke it all in me, just this feeling that like we need new blood in there. Nepotism's gotta go. Rich people need to die. Yeah. But uh yeah, yeah. Why was the second season of altered carbon so bad?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, that was rough. I still think about that. I always I've to several people, I've been like, you gotta watch the first season of altered carbon.

SPEAKER_00:

So I wake up from sound sleeps screaming, and my girlfriend has to like calm me back down. She's like, Is it another altered carbon dream? Like, yes, yes, it is.

SPEAKER_01:

Always they they changed the cinematography, they changed the story away from a mystery, and not as good. It's not as good.

SPEAKER_00:

But anyway. Um, but that but I also bring up altered carbon because I can't I can think of very there's a few things out there, and that piece of media really describes the need to kill the rich more uh than others. So yeah, you know, if you're if you're a centerist and uh you like what we're saying, uh definitely check out altered carbon. You know, kill the rich. Uh no remorse. So, well, um it's time to get into the final part of this podcast. Rock on um time for the final section of this thing. So it's time to insert ourselves, drugs, or alcohol into this film. How does it change with the introduction of the guys? It's very different now because I don't think we've really done it.

SPEAKER_01:

How would it change with the introduction?

SPEAKER_00:

If all of a sudden you're there.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay. I got it. Yeah, James, please. Okay. So I would say I'm gonna take over uh the Thomas Hayden Church role. It's not gonna be my you know, you know, I'm gonna be an alcoholic, a recovering alcoholic, you know, someone who's who, you know, for many years, kind of like I am now, someone for many years who have who's been, you know, consuming, you know, you know, mind-altering substances and then and then had to stop, you know, not for the same reasons, obviously, but I had to stop. So I'm I'm here, you know, I found religion, I'm I'm doing all the work and stuff.

SPEAKER_00:

I can't smoke weed no more. The first dude ever.

SPEAKER_01:

So it's you know, you know, when they're doing the flash, the flash by of the seasons when you know when when the young priest is working a Jed, is or Judd, I mean, is uh is going through his time, you know, getting used to the Monsignor and uh goes through winter and stuff. Well, I I just can't handle it at one point. And so of course I I go ahead and you know smoke smoke some weed. Uh and uh as I'm as I'm plowing the driveway, I uh get out, I get out of the plow and forget to put it in bar. And I get dragged underneath. And it throws the whole plot off because there's no one to be in the coffin, pretend to be Monseigneur. Too busy with physical therapy. God damn it. That's how it would change if I was like I'm gone before the main movie starts.

SPEAKER_00:

Sucked under a snow plow.

SPEAKER_01:

He rented a really long driveway. You saw the long driveway?

SPEAKER_02:

Oh my it is a long driveway, very long driveway.

SPEAKER_01:

You remember what it's like? You remember what it's like we lived in the Midwest?

SPEAKER_02:

Remember what it's like? I do.

SPEAKER_00:

I do.

SPEAKER_02:

Can you imagine having all a super long driveway like that? You gotta rent a snowplow. We can do. Got no choice. Just put snowplows on the front of all your cars.

SPEAKER_01:

Well, uh I wish I had that advice.

SPEAKER_00:

A little earlier. You and someone else in this film. So, Luke, uh, how does it change uh with you? Uh what at what snowplow-related incident occurs?

SPEAKER_02:

I actually pull into the church because my car breaks down and I have to put like I put push it into the parking lot. Uh-huh. Um, I witnessed the whole thing happened with James. I'm like, oh, did you save me? No, I don't. I'm too high. Oh, yeah. I'm already freaking out. I couldn't believe what I was seeing. I was like, what the fuck is happening? Um and uh I pretty much just witness a bunch of shit. Like trying, I keep trying to get help, but then every time I do, I see some crazy thing going on at this freaking church. I'm like, not gonna ask those people. I'm like, uh, I'll go to the next person. I just keep like going to each room, and it's just gonna be like, no, no, not these people. Until finally give up. I go to my car and it starts right up. It was just a it was a fluke and I drive off. No change the fuck out of it.

SPEAKER_01:

You see the news later and you're like, oh my god. Oh my that's what I was doing. I was at that church.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, yeah. I was fucking joking. There you go. Oh my god. No one's gonna believe me. They're gonna be like, no, I'm like, yeah, I saw every single thing that they're talking about. That's fucking great. Right before it happened.

SPEAKER_02:

And that's how the film um would change. It would just be one background character. And then afterwards, people would be like, What's that guy in the background?

SPEAKER_01:

Like it's it's an additional little part about 45 minutes from the end where people are like, How much time is left in this thing?

SPEAKER_00:

Like the finale of Stranger Things, people are going, How much fucking time do we have left? Um, yeah, and for me, I like to I would put myself as Judd, I suppose. I I would be, you know, Oh, are you the main character?

SPEAKER_01:

I'm gonna put myself as the new priest.

SPEAKER_00:

But when um fucking uh Josh Brolin starts attacking me, um, I'm gonna kill him with a brick. And uh when he just starts beating my ass at a confession, um, yeah, I'm I'm gonna kill him with a brick. And then, you know, I'm obviously like I'm emotionally charged. I need to cool off for a second. I'm gonna call police, uh, I'm gonna clear my head like I always do. I'm gonna jump into my snowplow and I'm gonna back up and not see Jeremy Renner back there.

SPEAKER_01:

And uh the podcast really applauds Jeremy Renner on overcoming his incredibly tough struggle with being beaten in a fist fight by a snowplow.

SPEAKER_00:

So at the end of the day, I'm just gonna give Mila Kunis more screen time. Oh, yeah, for sure. Yeah, we all did. We all did. Yeah, yeah. And I forgot to bring that up in my acting because it wasn't just Jeremy Renner um who was plowing through this thing with mediocrity. It was also Mila Kunis. Um I I thought we were done with her when we learned about the that 70s show and the Scientology and all that. Then she shows up and like just was acting poorly all over this thing. So yeah. So I will give her more screen time because now she has the self-defense case that I'm putting forward towards Trosh Brolin, the Jeremy Renner snowplow manslaughter. It's a weird movie, it's a weird film. Uh, Luke is pulling off. Him and I never interacted. I just see him driving away. And I understand that there's been another snowplow-related incident with a member of the congregation. I haven't been here long. Like I knew him a little bit, but and now there's some southern detective around here because I guess the most attractive woman named Glenn did some things. So um yeah. It's a bizarre movie. It's a bizarre film, but and we gotta try stuff. We gotta try some things. 3.5. 3.5. So solid film, solid film. Yeah, uh yeah, Ryan Johnson. I I don't know how you feel about that. Um, I appreciate you sitting here with us for the 55 minutes. We did try to bring this in under the Stranger Things time there. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

If you if you want to say something, Rian, you can go ahead.

SPEAKER_00:

You've just been sitting there silent the whole time. Oh no, no, no, you waved it off.

SPEAKER_01:

People can't use it, just like you just waved his hand. Like, we you guys got it. Yeah, all right.

SPEAKER_00:

I appreciate that. Thank you. Uh yeah, thanks, man. We're excited to see you in the fourth outing. So um, well, there you have folks. Thank you all for listening so much. I'm your host, Ryan Barron North with me as always, James Croslin, Luke, um, and as always, Rean Johnson. Thank you. Um, so bye.

SPEAKER_03:

Bye, bye, bye. Always wear your snow belts.

SPEAKER_01:

Always wear your seatbelts. Always wear seatbelts.

SPEAKER_00:

Always wear your snow belts.

SPEAKER_01:

Bye.

Head Shot

Ryan Baron North

Host