E5 - Singapore Sling | Rebound - the Future of Medical Education and Humanitarian Surgery | Chris Pearce - Part4

What next?  How does this pause for medicine shape the future?
In this final part of the interview with Chris Pearce, we look to the future and the opportunities for medical education and humanitarian work.

Transcript

Ros 

In 10 years' time, what will life look like?

Chris 

For the world? Hopefully, this kind of nationalistic phase that we're going through with the likes of Donald Trump will have finished by then and then we can all start living together better.

Chris 

I imagine I'll still be here with any luck. I've signed up for a PhD, which is very geeky.  I think I'll probably stay here and see out my career. 

In terms of like technology taking over the world, I'm not sure. Certainly, for my kids, it will be very different.  For instance, my wife's job as a radiologist surely won't exist by the time my children are in medical school, because there's got to be a computer that can read an X-ray or an MRI scan better than a human by then.

Ros 

So not to scare you too much - there already is.  And it is pretty much the same for the cardiologists, anything that you can make an algorithm for, such as heart rhythms, is replaceable.

Chris 

The computers are better at reading the text as well. So at least the lawyers will be affected as well.

Ros 

It's interesting when you talk about Trump.  My brother and I fell out over Brexit. He's in the States, and literally, when Boris got in, he hung up on me and we didn't speak for three months. But I texted him on the day I thought I had COVID because I didn't want to tell my mum and my sister because I knew they would panic. From that day for four weeks, he face timed me every single night.  It just shows, where Brexit divides, COVID unites. 

Ros 

So not a medically related question.  If you could have a dinner party, with anybody from the present or the past who would your six top dinner guests?

Chris

David Attenborough. Michael Palin. Joe Rogan. Einstein. Brian Cox.

Chris 

My favourite thing is travel so the reason I chose some of those people is that they've seen so much of the world in so many different cultures.  Anthony Bourdain was great. I'd love to do that job going to different places and eating food in perfect.

Ros 

One more. The last one has to be female because every single one you've mentioned is male, right?

Chris 

Okay. Sorry about that.

Ros 

Still only about 12-15% of surgeons are female, even though 50% of Medicine is female. And I think, I hope there are some things that are going to change with the fact that people have been at home for a long period of time.  Men are starting to re-engage with their children and women can work from home. I hope that some of that will be a positive change, particularly for the kids. 

Chris 

Mary Curie.  

Ros

What about someone like Michelle Obama?

Chris 

She's amazing, but I'm not interested in politics. I've got huge admiration for her but I have more things to say to David Attenborough.

Ros 

Is humanitarian, charity or philanthropic work something that you do want to do?

Chris 

Yeah, I'd love to.  I went to Cambodia to the children's surgical Centre in Cambodia.  We saw patients in the clinic and operated for four or five days. I did three operations I've never even seen before let alone done before. Gavin and I did a shoulder fusion together this young guy had ankylosing spondylitis and so we did a shoulder fusion.  That was really good actually. It's a lot about training the Cambodian surgeons as well. I also went to Vietnam.  I was due to go to Hanoi for three days and gave some lectures and did some surgery for a week, but that all got cancelled due to COVID

Ros 

And I think that's where actually things will come together with education is that you can do quite a lot of the technical stuff and the theory stuff by zoom and all this kind of stuff. But the hands-on training is not possible

Chris 

Yeah, but there's nothing like that Vietnam trip. Yeah. You know, of course, the lectures I could have done like this easily enough. But again, you need to see the audience so that you can, especially when you're doing it in English, so I speak in English, I tried very hard to speak slowly. There was a Vietnamese guy that was translating, but, you know, I knew and he didn't really get what I just said, Yeah, the translator, you know, because I could see his face and I could see his body language and that, you know, whatever else, I need to phrase it a different way or to do something else. And so even the lectures are much better in person because the operating is, you know, is much, much better.

Ros 

Yeah, I think what I mean is that I think you could potentially use this as the, you know, this The pre-course material could be something that's fairly scripted.

Chris 

Yeah, yeah. I think Yeah, we're, we're kind of slightly behind in that, I think.

Ros 

And do that and then go out when I'd have a much more productive meeting when you're out there. But I think, you know, I did the thing with Mark Myerson in China, which was, which was great fun. And I've got some colleagues that are doing some stuff in Africa. And who world orthopaedic concern actually and he left with Gavin knows and Gavin had done stuff when his when he did his elective and he went on one of the hospital ships don't the Amazon or something like that? I think. Yeah, no, he did.  I think it was a Christian Fellowship thing, 

Ros 

Well, and he wouldn't either apart from the fact that he bought a lot of these things are run by these kinds of mission type things. And so I don't think he can, the reason I laugh is that I don't think he got to drink for the whole time. 

Chris 

I have a moral problem with that as well. I don't like the idea of going somewhere and saying, well, we'll give you the health care you need to take probably the Bible. Yeah. Yeah. And so that part of it I don't agree with but I think there's a bad bit. I think there's a big opportunity for us to do the great stuff, but also the good stuff as well. And something else that you might be interested in, although, I know you're more in that sort of like higher technology stuff with the MRIs. But I've always since I went to Cambodia, I was thought, I want to write a book on how to do foot and ankle surgery with minimal equipment. You know, basically, you can do anything with a 135. You put it in the right place. Yeah. It's kind of like, I think we quite get to write a book of orthopaedics for the third world.

Ros 

Yeah. I think you're right and the sea swim is I don't actually think is higher at that much higher technology. It's just a modified dental burr, and some screws so that there's not really that much to it. And x-ray.  Well, you do I have done at once without and it really forces you to think about your anatomy and just because the machine broke halfway through the machine through the operation and you're kind of stuck. So yeah, but again, I think some of that comes with as 3D printing and becomes more online as to how you can make personalised jigs and stuff like that and entertainment will become much cheaper, and then they'll prohibitively expensive. But you know, wouldn't it be great that if you had some of these big deformities, so for instance, that shoulder that year, and that young gaff did that you take that and you managed to get some sort of imaging that they can then make the jig for you and see there you go. Two days later, it's for you and you can you know, where you're putting the screws and stuff with a better You know, and these big companies and people that are making lots of healthcare. And personally, I think there needs to be a bit more philanthropy and a bit more give back that. Yes, on the one hand, you can check. I mean, I was hearing that in the states that can charge like 55 grand for an ankle replacement that's just outrageous in some of that should be going back to doing that stuff. So you can go off and do the fun stuff, you know, the really complex stuff that still exists around the world. Yeah. And that, yeah, for me, that allows you to do a lot of the travelling and the and the good bits too.

Chris 

But yeah, great. Well, listen, thanks. And I hope I didn't disappoint you too much, though.

Ros 

You didn't you're perfect. And you're my inaugural guest.

Chris 

Am I really?

Ros 

Yeah, of course, it was always gonna be, you,

Chris 

I'm very flattered.