Unraveling Their Family's Departure During Iran's Golden Age | Danielle and Galeet Dardashti

Join Danielle and Galeet Dardashti as they share their journey of discovery  to learn why their father's family left Iran during the Golden Age for Jews. With limited access to records to answer their questions, the sisters relied on interviewing over 85 individuals, including family members, scholars, and unexpected acquaintances.  They have reconstructed an engaging story that transcends cultural boundaries and challenges preconceived notions.  What they learned sheds light not only on their familial roots, but also on universal themes of identity, belonging, and the intricate connections that tie us all together.

About Danielle and Galeet:

Danielle Dardashti is an Emmy award-winning documentary writer/producer, a former on-air TV news reporter, an author, and a Moth storySLAM champion who leads corporate storytelling workshops all over the world.

Dr. Galeet Dardashti is a vocalist, composer, and anthropologist of Middle Eastern Jewish culture. In her new album, Monajat, she sings with samples of her grandfather who was called The Nightingale of Iran. She's currently a Fellow at University of Pennsylvania’s Katz Center.

Connect with Danielle on LinkedIn 
Connect with Galeet on Instagram @galeet.dardashti or Facebook @galeet

Head to nightingaleofiran.com to listen to their story and join their list for bonus materials.

Are we connected on Instagram or Facebook yet? Find me @msheathermurphy

Transcript

Unraveling Their Family's Departure During Iran's Golden Age | Danielle Dardashti and Galeet Darshashti
Stories in Our Roots, Episode 76

Heather: Hi Danielle and Galeet, thank you for joining me on my podcast today.

Danielle: Oh, thank you so much for having us.

Galeet: We're excited to be here.

Heather: This is the first time I've interviewed sisters together, so I'm interested to see how, the conversation goes and how your experience has worked over time together, rather than just an individual journey that most of the people I've talked to have experienced. So with that, could one of you give us a little bit of an idea of what's your family? How did you get to be where you are today with your heritage?

Danielle: Yeah, I mean, I think it's interesting because that's what the entire podcast series is about. it's a six part audio documentary about Our family, their life in Iran as Jews in the 1950s and 60s, where they had a wonderful life. Where people are very surprised by often who don't know people who immigrated from Iran, but In the 50s and 60s, it was called the golden era, the golden age for Jews in Iran.

And, our grandfather was a famous singer on the radio and our father was a teenager who was becoming a pop star on TV. And they had an incredible life there and yet they left Iran a long time before the Islamic revolution, like, 15 years before the Islamic revolution, in a time when most other Jews weren't leaving Iran.

So we've always wondered, you know, what exactly was going on there and what parts of the story we hadn't been told. And I think that was sort of what kind of pushed us to want to know more.

Heather: And so what was it at, at this point in your lives that you decided to pursue it to learn more?

Galeet: Yeah. I mean, it's really interesting because Danielle and I are coming to this podcast from really different places. I'm a scholar. I'm an anthropologist. And I actually started my graduate work thinking that I was going to go to Iran and write about my grandfather many, many years ago. So, I guess I started this journey a long time ago, but then kind of dropped it because it became clear that I couldn't go to Iran. And, this project in many ways, sort of allowed us to go to Iran in some ways, because it Because of some of the material that we found, which you'll hear about if you listen to the podcast.

In terms of, you know, why now? I mean, part of it is also that we had more time on our hands. We started this project during And, COVID, and we both, you know, I wasn't performing, I wasn't, you know, teaching, going places. And Danielle had a lot more time with her work. And I also recorded an album where I sing with my grandfather. in September, I debuted that album.

So part of that is also that timing, but part of it is also, I think, just where we are in our lives. Wouldn't you say, Danielle?

Danielle: Well, I would say that, it was for me personally, during COVID for the first time, I wasn't like totally swamped with work. And, so something that we had always kind of like talked about doing, we started and also Zooming and talking to people all over the world became more of a thing. And so we just started interviewing people, Galeet and I, over Zoom in 2021, really not knowing what we were doing, not knowing if we were making a film, or writing a book, or making a podcast, just trying to get information at first. 

And then something interesting happened in 2022, we kind of like, put the project a little bit on the back burner as both of our work schedules got really busy again. And then a friend of mine who knew about the project and what we were starting to do sent me something about a fellowship, a grant from a foundation for untold Jewish stories. It was foundation, the Maimonides Fund was funding through this thing called the Jewish Writers Initiative Digital Storytellers Lab, , stories that were, you know, interesting stories and that haven't been heard before in the Jewish world.

And so I applied for this fellowship, got it. And then, actually, for me, having the structure of the fellowship, even more than the funding of the fellowship, actually pushed me, gave me deadlines to create a pilot for this series, and then Galeet and I started putting more time into it from that point on and then started fundraising to, get other, other sponsors on board.

Heather: Yeah, a lot of people that I've interviewed, that's when they started getting into their family is during COVID. So I think it's in a, one of the side benefits of having more time is a lot of people have been able to really learn the stories of their families and where they came from.

Galeet: Yeah, that's interesting that that is a common theme, but, you know, also just Zoom enabled us to interview so many more people and to have these kind of more intimate conversations than we would have, you know, just interviewing people on the phone wouldn't have really given us that same kind of way of connecting in an interview that we were able to have with Zoom. And so that kind of, that was a big game changer.

Heather: I listened to the first episode of the podcast, and you mentioned you can't go to Iran, and you found some sources within your family, was the most of how you learned the story of what happened through interviews, or did you use other sources as well?

Danielle: So I would say that what we ended up learning, I mean, we're pretty determined and pretty, you know, we kept on sort of talking to the same people, some of the same people again and again, because we would talk to somebody and they wouldn't go quite far enough. And then we would find something else out from another source.

And then we'd go back to that person and say, wait, when you said that. because a lot of the topics that we're talking about are things that people have really become, within that culture, used to kind of not sharing. And so there are things that it wasn't like people were purposely telling us the wrong story.

It's like over the course of 60 years, when you tell a certain story, we all tend to like tell the same story over and over and over and over. And when a culture kind of reinforces that that is our story, it's kind of hard to get people to open up. So it was it was a process and we've been working on it for the past 3 years. Over the last year it really, really sped up because of, some tapes that we found. I think you heard about that in episode one. That actually helped a lot because it gave it added a lot of color to the stories and we were able to really like Galeet said, it was almost like going back in time and visiting Iran all at once. And so that really kind of broke the door down on on a lot of the story that we end up telling in the series.

Galeet: and it's a real mix of the different kind of people that we talk to in terms of family members, and, you know, scholars that I know in the field and, yeah, a real mix of, of also just Iranians who we hadn't ever met before, who we learned had these connections with our grandfather.

So it was a real exciting exploration and journey for us to kind of, you know, we, we never knew where we were going to, we were going to go from there, but each interview took us to different places that we knew we had to explore.

Danielle: I think in episode 2, which was released today, people are going to hear a really interesting and very surprising interview. It was one of my favorite interviews in the entire series with a man named Habib Parto, who is a Muslim Iranian man, That was really close with our grandfather that we never knew him before.

And we met him and interviewed him. And his interview is so surprising about the relationship between Jews and Muslims at the time in Iran. And a lot of other things that were super surprising. It's one, it ended up being, and he's not any kind of a scholar or a, he was just someone that was 

Galeet: mean, it was kind of. Amazing. You know, I met his son and I would not have followed up with him. He told me, Oh yeah, I met your, I know that my, my father had a really close relationship with your grandfather and we would have, I would have left it at that, but we were doing this project so I got back in touch with him and it's kind of, kind of amazing what we found out from him.

Danielle: Yeah, that interview is really one of my favorites. So looking forward for you and everybody to hear that conversation with him.

Heather: Do you have a rough idea about how many interviews you were able to, how many people you were able to learn from about your family?

Danielle: I think it was like, we ended up interviewing about 85 people on tape. It's like, somewhere in the mid 80s, 

Galeet: but we had so many, yeah, so many more casual casual conversations.

Danielle: people that we had conversations with who told us who to talk to and, you know, gave us background information, but we did about 80 something on tape, which is a lot.

Heather: yeah. But that just goes to show, like, how much somebody can learn about their grandparents or different family members, just by following those breadcrumbs that you mentioned, talking to the people who talk to the people and following that along.

Danielle: Yeah, well, and it was, and it's like another thing that kind of stood out in my mind. So one of the people who gave us some really, really important information. He's also in episode two today. Sadly, he passed away since the interview that we did with him. And we didn't actually do the interview. We sent a producer to do the interview with him in LA because he didn't speak English.

 So we had a producer interview him in Persian and the information that we got from that interview was priceless. And I don't think there would have been a source to get that information anywhere else. And that man is gone now. And so I feel so grateful that we just pushed forward and did what we did when we did it 

Galeet: Yeah, we were a bit like racing against the clock because many of these people are old. And 

Danielle: yeah, the people who remember what happened in the 1950s in Iran are few and far between now. especially a lot of the key figures that people were like, oh, you should have talked to so and so or whatever. But this guy, luckily we interviewed him and he died at 90 years old this past year and we got an interview with him and it's a really beautiful interview that added a lot to the story.

Heather: So how have your different professional backgrounds kind of complemented each other as you were putting this project together?

Galeet: it's really been amazing in that, in that sense, because, I am both an anthropologist, I do ethnographic interviews for a living and I've been researching Jews in the Middle East and North Africa for my whole, my whole career. Yeah. And I'm also a musician and have produced albums.

So, being able to kind of use those skills that I've developed and sort of bring that together with Danielle's tremendous background in areas of expertise as a journalist, as a storyteller, as a producer and, and many, many more things, which, you know, Danielle can add, I mean, it's, we just together have really been able to bring all of our talents and it's been, it's been really exciting. We've never worked together on a project before. 

Danielle: just building on what Galeet said, like, in addition to, like, our skills and talents, we have such different skill sets and connections in the world. Is very well connected, in the Jewish world. I'm very well connected in the media world. And, it was just a beautiful kind of merging of our skill sets, our connections, are areas of expertise. We have a 3rd sister who is a rabbi and her skill set, she's been super busy because she has a full time job, but it would have been an interesting thing if we all three could have worked on this together, because we all have very, very different skill sets. But Galeet and I filled the pie pretty well. Just the two of us.

Heather: I did see that it has Michelle in the credits for doing the introduction of each episode, so I saw her in there. I

Galeet: we squeezed her in. We

Danielle: Yeah. We let Michelle be the voice that, you know, introduces everyone. And it's fun because like everyone in the family and all the friends recognize that that's Michelle's voice, who's introducing the two of us to the world. So yeah, it's nice.

Heather: So what themes did you find as you were completing this project? Themes that this within your family that found, I know you were definitely, music was a strong one that you started from the beginning, but what ones were you either looking for or you found along the way?

Galeet: Yeah. I mean, I think we allowed the story to develop and we weren't exactly sure, when we started this project, what the story was. I mean, we took a lot of time to sort of say, I mean, we knew we had amazing material, but we weren't sure what the story was, but it became very clear as we, you know, as we kept talking to people, what were the issues that were most interesting to us. And those were some of the questions that we had all our lives about our family's immigration from Iran and these questions of why, why they left Iran when they were huge, huge stars. And even though I have such a knowledge of Iranian history. It still didn't actually make sense to me and didn't make sense to us. 

So we, we kind of took those questions and Danielle she wrote the script and she, she sort of guided, she guided the script in terms of what we were most interested in looking at. Each time we talked to people, the, the, the story became much, much more clear.

Yeah.

Danielle: But I think Galeet is right we never really were like, this is definitely the story in the beginning. The two things that was sort of our guiding light from the beginning was like, why did they leave Iran? And how did we become so un Persian? Like, how did, how did it all get, and those two questions ended up being a really good ones for guiding our way through. But then there are all kinds of twists and turns and things that we learned, and it's funny because our father the other day said to me, so why did we leave Iran? He's like, I want to know, what did you find out? And I was like, dad, you just need to listen to the rest of the story. We haven't actually, we're still putting the finishing touches on episodes 5 and 6 now. So, episodes 1 through 4 are, are in the can and we're putting finishing touches on the last two, but my dad can't wait to hear the end of the story. And I'm like, Dad, you know why you left Iran and it, but it's just, it's very interesting because we've really spent a lot of time thinking about it. And it's something where, Again, you tell, he has told sort of like the same stories over and over for years and hasn't necessarily questioned it.

Galeet: we've been actually really surprised how open our dad has been to us shifting the story that he's been telling us over many years and being open to kind of seeing it in new ways, which we weren't really sure. But just it's, it's been amazing to see how he's really enjoyed being a part of this journey as well and, and has been excited, and open to, to hearing our take on the story. 

Danielle: you know, it's like, I was really nervous for him to hear it each episode when it's done. I'm like, okay, mom, dad, are you ready to hear episode 2?

Galeet: Have they heard three yet?

Danielle: No, actually didn't want to hear three until the whole world heard two. So the one here today, because they were confused. Like their friends were asking them so many questions about each episode, and they were like, didn't want to get too far ahead of them so that they were, it's hilarious, because it's their freaking life.

You know what I mean? But it's like, But they didn't want to know too much about the story. Like, it's just, it's very, very interesting. My parents, and my dad, especially. Yeah, I agree with Galeet. Like, he's been very open and really sort of like changed during the process. Changed the way that he sees the past and he's able to really kind of see more nuance in things than he has ever done. It's just pretty amazing because he's 81 years old. And, it's pretty impressive. it's fun though. It's, it's really, I mean, that is the most gratifying thing. I mean, I think seeing my parents reaction and seeing my kids reaction to this series has been the most gratifying thing for me because really, I mean, that's why we're doing it.

You know is to remember our family story and to really, tell our family story and, and, and to understand our family story. I think for us, I'm not quite sure yet. Like you asked, like about us, like what the process, I don't know yet. I'm not done. Um, I think, the process has, I've changed and learned a lot during this process. But I don't think I've fully realized yet the impact of this project on me. I'm still so deep in it. and it's, it's been a really emotional, crazy, crazy journey.

Heather: One of the themes that you kind of pick up in your intro or your outro to the podcast is identity, belonging, and music. So can you quantify how, or put into words, how that has affected your sense of identity, of who you are, by this project? Or is it still too ambiguous, like you said?

Galeet: I don't know. I mean, I have been thinking about these issues for a long time, probably much longer than Danielle has, as somebody who teaches about Persian Jewish culture for many years. I've been thinking about this and it's really interesting in terms of, I would say probably around 2017, 2018, I started much more talking about the fact that, hey guys, I didn't grow up Persian, even though you see me as this very, exteriorly Persian Jew.

Uh, you know, I didn't really start talking about that until around 2018 and that's been exciting to share because still not that many people understand, that piece

Danielle: Well, it's funny that she because it's that mine is exactly the opposite. And we talked about that a little bit in episode one, where for her, her identity crisis is people thinking she's a lot more Persian than she actually is because of what she does. And for me, it's the opposite, where, because the storytelling that I've done in my career, which doesn't have to do with it iranian identity or being Jewish. There are tons of people, I predicted this would happen, and it already has happened, where the moment this hit the, you know, world, I have a gazillion people reaching out to me being like, I didn't know you were Persian. I mean, I don't know, it's funny because I have a Persian last name, but people don't know that in your work world, if maybe it's your married name or why your name is that, or, you know, and I. It's it hasn't been a part of what I talk about at work. 

So it's interesting. I mean, people in our personal life, our family friends all know that our dad is Persian. But I think a lot of the issues that we're talking about, even to our family, friends and things. Friends of my parents on Facebook and things are writing like, I can't wait to hear this story from your perspective, you know, it's, it's a very interesting thing because yeah, it's like you're friends with people forever, but like, do you really know their story and like, a ton of people that I know, I never knew that they were married. He's married to a Persian woman and her family left Iran and you know what, like, 

Galeet: And everybody, so many people have mixed identities. And so it's a very, it's a story that so many people are relating to, you know, whether or not they're Jewish or Iranian, you know, every, most people have immigrated from somewhere or have relatives from somewhere that are not here. 

Danielle: Well, it's yeah, it's interesting what people identify with in our story. And that has been really amazing for us. This past week we have gotten so many messages, emails and social media messages and all kinds of things with people wanting to share their stories with us because they feel sort of seen in our story because their family had immigration kinds of things going on, or, family members who live really far, far away in other parts of the world and communicated in similar ways with tapes. I had several people say, I wish I could find the tapes that my family sent back and forth when my, you know, my uncle immigrated to America from another, you know, from South America or from wherever. But I think a lot of people see their own family story in our story and it's pretty amazing to see that and to see how it's resonating and how, yeah, I mean, I think there are parts of our story that even if you aren't from an immigrant family, maybe you felt like an outsider in some other way, everyone has sort of experienced that at some point in some way and I think can understand parts of our story from that perspective.

Heather: I've spent most of my life in rural western United States, and there's not much diversity out here. There's mostly people who have been United States for generations, and so I think When people like you are willing to put their story out there and put their family history, it makes the world smaller.

And it's not just Iran is some country clear over there, but let's look at the people and the, the different generations behind the person that I see across the table from me 

Galeet: absolutely. 

Danielle: but even if it isn't cultural differences, I think, you know, like people with disabilities or people with, there's all kinds of challenges that people struggle with where they feel not seen, or they feel like an outsider in some way or another. And I think this story will, will resonate with people, even who don't have any kind of like real, um, you know, cultural kind of.

Galeet: and we are hoping that people will understand that the world is also much more complex than, Jews against, Muslims. there's such a divide in the world right now, and it's, you know, such a, such a difficult time in the world. And just to remember that it wasn't always like this. think people are often really surprised when they understand these stories that just haven't been told very much.

Heather: and I think as people see these stories instead of just news headlines, then they get the real picture of the world rather than just what's going to sell newspapers type of thing.

Danielle: 100 percent and I think, like Galeet said, our story, while of course, we didn't plan at all, like, the timing behind when this story is being told, it's a really great time for people to hear a story like this, because it does speak a lot to the similarities, between some of the people that are seen on very different sides of issues these days. and it's a very emotional story. I'm excited for you to hear episode two today. It's, it's a great story.

Heather: Well, thank you so much for putting the time and effort into sharing your family's story and for joining me today here.

Galeet: Thank you so much for having us.

Danielle: Yes, and thank you for listening. Thanks to everyone else for listening and tune in, please go, and sign up. We have an email newsletter. I You can go directly to our Web page. It's a nightingale of Iran dot com and at our website, you can sign up for our email newsletter, which is going to be sharing information about our upcoming events and behind the scenes content and bonus content and all of that. so yeah, listen to the podcast and sign up for a newsletter.

Heather: Yeah, and I'll have links in the show notes for that to make it easy for everyone. I'm excited to go listen to episode two!

Danielle: Yes, so much keep 

listening. 

Galeet: Thank 

Danielle: Take care.