{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":6.21,"endTime":9.48,"body":"Hello, welcome to"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":6.21,"endTime":9.48,"body":"the alcohol problem podcast. I'm"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":9.48,"endTime":12.84,"body":"Dr. James Morris, an alcohol"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":9.48,"endTime":12.84,"body":"researcher interested in harmful"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":12.84,"endTime":16.62,"body":"drinking and addiction issues."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":12.84,"endTime":16.62,"body":"This stems in part from my own"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":16.62,"endTime":20.25,"body":"experiences. So the show aims to"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":16.62,"endTime":20.25,"body":"explore a range of left and"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":20.25,"endTime":24.06,"body":"academic perspectives relating"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":20.25,"endTime":24.06,"body":"to the question of what really"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":24.09,"endTime":30.84,"body":"is an alcohol problem. In this"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":24.09,"endTime":30.84,"body":"episode, I talk to a range of"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":30.84,"endTime":34.89,"body":"guests about alcohol use and the"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":30.84,"endTime":34.89,"body":"pandemic. I asked researchers,"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":34.92,"endTime":38.58,"body":"policy advisors, and people have"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":34.92,"endTime":38.58,"body":"lived experiences of changing"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":38.61,"endTime":41.31,"body":"reflecting on their relationship"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":38.61,"endTime":41.31,"body":"with alcohol about the effects"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":41.31,"endTime":48.72,"body":"of COVID, nearly one year on. I"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":41.31,"endTime":48.72,"body":"started off by talking to Dr."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":48.72,"endTime":51.84,"body":"Sadie Boniface. And Habib"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":48.72,"endTime":51.84,"body":"kaduri, at the Institute of"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":51.84,"endTime":54.99,"body":"alcohol studies, I asked them to"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":51.84,"endTime":54.99,"body":"tell me a bit about the survey"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":54.99,"endTime":55.44,"body":"data."},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":55.44,"endTime":58.29,"body":"So far, your"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":55.44,"endTime":58.29,"body":"listeners have probably heard,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":58.29,"endTime":61.62,"body":"there's been quite a lot of talk"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":58.29,"endTime":61.62,"body":"of alcohol and people drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":61.62,"endTime":65.34,"body":"more drinking less in the news"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":61.62,"endTime":65.34,"body":"throughout the whole pandemic,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":65.34,"endTime":69.3,"body":"really, the surveys do generally"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":65.34,"endTime":69.3,"body":"tend to find that some people"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":69.3,"endTime":72.0,"body":"are drinking more, and some"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":69.3,"endTime":72.0,"body":"people are drinking less. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":72.0,"endTime":75.18,"body":"generally, that's kind of about"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":72.0,"endTime":75.18,"body":"between a quarter and a third of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":75.18,"endTime":79.11,"body":"people in both of those"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":75.18,"endTime":79.11,"body":"categories. So that on the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":79.11,"endTime":83.01,"body":"surface doesn't sound maybe that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":79.11,"endTime":83.01,"body":"interesting, or maybe that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":83.04,"endTime":87.39,"body":"concerning or relevant in sort"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":83.04,"endTime":87.39,"body":"of health terms. But there are"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":87.39,"endTime":90.69,"body":"some things that do make us"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":87.39,"endTime":90.69,"body":"concerned one of those is that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":90.69,"endTime":93.72,"body":"the people that are drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":90.69,"endTime":93.72,"body":"more, there's some evidence that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":93.75,"endTime":96.57,"body":"they were heavier drinkers to"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":93.75,"endTime":96.57,"body":"begin with. And so that's"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":96.6,"endTime":99.45,"body":"obviously something of concern,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":96.6,"endTime":99.45,"body":"thinking about health further"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":99.45,"endTime":100.2,"body":"down the line."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":100.23,"endTime":102.27,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":100.23,"endTime":102.27,"body":"And that's kind of"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":102.27,"endTime":106.38,"body":"understandable picture in a in a"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":102.27,"endTime":106.38,"body":"sense that if you already have a"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":106.38,"endTime":109.5,"body":"kind of moderate relationship"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":106.38,"endTime":109.5,"body":"with alcohol, you drink to maybe"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":109.5,"endTime":112.74,"body":"within the guidelines are not"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":109.5,"endTime":112.74,"body":"massively over it, then that's"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":112.77,"endTime":116.1,"body":"suggestive that you kind of"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":112.77,"endTime":116.1,"body":"reasonably healthy relationship"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":116.1,"endTime":118.95,"body":"with alcohol, and you're not"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":116.1,"endTime":118.95,"body":"using it as a kind of potential"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":118.95,"endTime":121.98,"body":"coping mechanism. Whereas, you"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":118.95,"endTime":121.98,"body":"know, heavy drinkers, we know,"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":121.98,"endTime":126.06,"body":"there's so many comorbidities in"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":121.98,"endTime":126.06,"body":"terms of mental health issues,"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":126.09,"endTime":129.99,"body":"you know, stress, anxiety, those"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":126.09,"endTime":129.99,"body":"kind of things. So it's not"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":129.99,"endTime":132.93,"body":"surprising in some ways that"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":129.99,"endTime":132.93,"body":"people have pre existing"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":132.93,"endTime":136.38,"body":"problems, including with alcohol"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":132.93,"endTime":136.38,"body":"that might have been exacerbated"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":136.38,"endTime":136.68,"body":"a bit."},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":136.74,"endTime":138.99,"body":"Yeah, there's"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":136.74,"endTime":138.99,"body":"a lot of unanswered questions as"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":138.99,"endTime":142.29,"body":"well. So what we really don't"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":138.99,"endTime":142.29,"body":"know is whether the sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":142.29,"endTime":146.1,"body":"changes that we've seen to"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":142.29,"endTime":146.1,"body":"drinking, are they just"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":146.13,"endTime":149.13,"body":"temporary while we're living in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":146.13,"endTime":149.13,"body":"these repeated sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":149.13,"endTime":152.82,"body":"lockdowns? And they'll go away"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":149.13,"endTime":152.82,"body":"when things start to move back"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":152.82,"endTime":156.69,"body":"to some sort of normality? Or"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":152.82,"endTime":156.69,"body":"are those kind of new patterns?"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":156.75,"endTime":160.5,"body":"Are they here to stay? And it's"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":156.75,"endTime":160.5,"body":"probably not even that simple,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":160.5,"endTime":164.01,"body":"because we've got all of the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":160.5,"endTime":164.01,"body":"economic and wider social things"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":164.01,"endTime":166.92,"body":"going on with furlough and"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":164.01,"endTime":166.92,"body":"people being made redundant and"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":166.92,"endTime":171.96,"body":"in recession, that they all"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":166.92,"endTime":171.96,"body":"impact on alcohol too. So it's a"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":171.96,"endTime":174.63,"body":"really messy picture. And it's"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":171.96,"endTime":174.63,"body":"definitely something that one"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":174.63,"endTime":178.53,"body":"poll or one survey on its own"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":174.63,"endTime":178.53,"body":"can't really tell us very much."},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":178.53,"endTime":180.51,"body":"There's a lot of piecing"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":178.53,"endTime":180.51,"body":"together different pieces of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":180.51,"endTime":184.8,"body":"data to make sense of it. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":180.51,"endTime":184.8,"body":"I think so. And I'm sure many"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":184.8,"endTime":188.76,"body":"people who've produced survey"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":184.8,"endTime":188.76,"body":"data will be continuing to do"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":188.76,"endTime":191.58,"body":"that and kind of track it over"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":188.76,"endTime":191.58,"body":"time. And it's just something"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":191.58,"endTime":193.86,"body":"we're going to have to keep"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":191.58,"endTime":193.86,"body":"paying attention to and keep"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":193.86,"endTime":194.76,"body":"delving into,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":195.12,"endTime":198.48,"body":"I think, what's"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":195.12,"endTime":198.48,"body":"important, there's an implied,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":198.57,"endTime":201.27,"body":"let's take this figure in the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":198.57,"endTime":201.27,"body":"aggregate, and maybe see that"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":201.27,"endTime":204.6,"body":"the whole nations drinking less"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":201.27,"endTime":204.6,"body":"than 100, nations drinking more,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":204.6,"endTime":208.5,"body":"and it's important to actually"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":204.6,"endTime":208.5,"body":"notice that the split is really"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":208.53,"endTime":212.34,"body":"what you need to be looking at."},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":208.53,"endTime":212.34,"body":"And from that split, you need to"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":212.37,"endTime":215.28,"body":"work out what people's"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":212.37,"endTime":215.28,"body":"behaviours are, because it's"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":215.28,"endTime":218.73,"body":"less about what's happening in"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":215.28,"endTime":218.73,"body":"total sum and more about"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":218.76,"endTime":222.27,"body":"pockets, where people's"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":218.76,"endTime":222.27,"body":"behaviours come together in kind"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":222.27,"endTime":225.33,"body":"of minority groups where it's"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":222.27,"endTime":225.33,"body":"having an impact on, say, the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":225.33,"endTime":228.48,"body":"health services that provide"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":225.33,"endTime":228.48,"body":"alcohol treatment, I think there"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":228.48,"endTime":231.33,"body":"was some data that came out, I"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":228.48,"endTime":231.33,"body":"think, was the level unit,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":231.39,"endTime":235.05,"body":"actually, at King's College"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":231.39,"endTime":235.05,"body":"Hospital, there was a nearly 50%"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":235.17,"endTime":240.6,"body":"increase in admissions rates"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":235.17,"endTime":240.6,"body":"between June 2019 and 2020. And,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":240.66,"endTime":244.32,"body":"and, you know, it might not be a"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":240.66,"endTime":244.32,"body":"huge figure in the aggregate,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":244.41,"endTime":247.71,"body":"but it's definitely something"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":244.41,"endTime":247.71,"body":"less impacted to some degree"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":247.71,"endTime":251.61,"body":"because of because of COVID. And"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":247.71,"endTime":251.61,"body":"the pressures on the health"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":251.61,"endTime":255.42,"body":"service, and trying to admit"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":251.61,"endTime":255.42,"body":"people for alcohol treatment,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":255.42,"endTime":258.81,"body":"because COVID is taking over"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":255.42,"endTime":258.81,"body":"those spaces that would"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":258.81,"endTime":261.3,"body":"otherwise be reserved for those"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":258.81,"endTime":261.3,"body":"people. 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I think those figures"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":267.9,"endTime":271.98,"body":"from the liver unit at King's"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":271.98,"endTime":275.25,"body":"College Hospital, they are kind"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":271.98,"endTime":275.25,"body":"of an early warning sign in a"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":275.25,"endTime":279.09,"body":"way because we don't have"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":275.25,"endTime":279.09,"body":"complete data on the whole"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":279.09,"endTime":282.9,"body":"country. It's not been released"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":279.09,"endTime":282.9,"body":"yet. And it's kind of also"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":282.9,"endTime":287.4,"body":"complicated further, by the fact"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":282.9,"endTime":287.4,"body":"that people are not accessing"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":287.4,"endTime":290.43,"body":"health services anymore in the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":287.4,"endTime":290.43,"body":"way that they used to. You've"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":290.43,"endTime":294.78,"body":"heard, I'm sure about people"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":290.43,"endTime":294.78,"body":"being afraid to go to the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":294.78,"endTime":297.24,"body":"doctor's or to go to a\u0026e when"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":294.78,"endTime":297.24,"body":"there's something wrong with"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":297.24,"endTime":299.82,"body":"them because they're concerned"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":297.24,"endTime":299.82,"body":"they're going to catch COVID I"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":299.82,"endTime":299.97,"body":"think"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":300.32,"endTime":302.93,"body":"That's less"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":300.32,"endTime":302.93,"body":"of a problem now than it was,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":302.96,"endTime":306.53,"body":"say six months ago and the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":302.96,"endTime":306.53,"body":"height of the first wave, but"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":306.56,"endTime":309.44,"body":"what's worrying is that problems"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":306.56,"endTime":309.44,"body":"might be getting stored up for"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":309.44,"endTime":312.5,"body":"the future, and people not"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":309.44,"endTime":312.5,"body":"accessing health care, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":312.5,"endTime":315.26,"body":"these problems might not be so"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":312.5,"endTime":315.26,"body":"visible as they otherwise would"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":315.26,"endTime":319.43,"body":"have been. I think it's a really"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":315.26,"endTime":319.43,"body":"important point because alcohol"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":319.49,"endTime":324.14,"body":"related conditions is so many in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":319.49,"endTime":324.14,"body":"which the effects are longer"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":324.14,"endTime":327.68,"body":"term. And we know this from"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":324.14,"endTime":327.68,"body":"minimum pricing studies that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":327.68,"endTime":331.49,"body":"there are in often cases very"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":327.68,"endTime":331.49,"body":"long term lag effects from"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":331.52,"endTime":335.18,"body":"changes to things like pricing."},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":331.52,"endTime":335.18,"body":"So you know, liver disease"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":335.21,"endTime":340.82,"body":"amongst heavy drinkers often"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":335.21,"endTime":340.82,"body":"develops over decades. So a"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":340.82,"endTime":344.12,"body":"changing consumption at one"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":340.82,"endTime":344.12,"body":"point might not manifest or show"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":344.12,"endTime":347.63,"body":"in two decades down the line. So"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":344.12,"endTime":347.63,"body":"I think it's fair to say that we"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":347.63,"endTime":350.9,"body":"will be seeing these effects for"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":347.63,"endTime":350.9,"body":"decades to come. Yeah, that's"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":350.9,"endTime":354.11,"body":"definitely true. Some changes"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":350.9,"endTime":354.11,"body":"are immediate with things like"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":354.11,"endTime":358.64,"body":"minimum pricing, you can see an"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":354.11,"endTime":358.64,"body":"impact on alcohol sales and some"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":358.67,"endTime":362.0,"body":"health indicators. But other"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":358.67,"endTime":362.0,"body":"things and the whole kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":362.03,"endTime":365.51,"body":"benefit of policies like that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":362.03,"endTime":365.51,"body":"will be seen much further down"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":365.51,"endTime":369.41,"body":"the line. Definitely. Also, it's"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":365.51,"endTime":369.41,"body":"January, there was a lot of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":369.89,"endTime":373.73,"body":"excitement, I think about this"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":369.89,"endTime":373.73,"body":"being the biggest dry January,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":373.97,"endTime":377.63,"body":"ever. But then with the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":373.97,"endTime":377.63,"body":"circumstances in this third"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":377.63,"endTime":380.96,"body":"lockdown in the UK, I've read"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":377.63,"endTime":380.96,"body":"reports that there's been a lot"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":380.96,"endTime":383.75,"body":"of people dropping out of dry"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":380.96,"endTime":383.75,"body":"January, more than kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":383.75,"endTime":387.29,"body":"visually would be expected. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":383.75,"endTime":387.29,"body":"I think that really highlights"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":387.38,"endTime":390.2,"body":"as a country, we have a very"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":387.38,"endTime":390.2,"body":"strange and unhealthy"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":390.23,"endTime":391.76,"body":"relationship with alcohol."},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":391.9,"endTime":395.05,"body":"Yeah, I mean, that's good,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":391.9,"endTime":395.05,"body":"interesting point. Because Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":395.05,"endTime":398.47,"body":"I've certainly seen a lot of the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":395.05,"endTime":398.47,"body":"memes around dry January playing"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":398.47,"endTime":401.68,"body":"to the idea of why would you"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":398.47,"endTime":401.68,"body":"want to make it even worse, or"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":401.68,"endTime":404.5,"body":"whatever. But I do sort of thing"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":401.68,"endTime":404.5,"body":"that, you know, there is an"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":404.5,"endTime":408.1,"body":"importance in recognising the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":404.5,"endTime":408.1,"body":"reasons people drink and they do"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":408.1,"endTime":412.66,"body":"it as a coping mechanism,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":408.1,"endTime":412.66,"body":"because alcohol might help you"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":412.66,"endTime":415.63,"body":"to feel better in that moment."},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":412.66,"endTime":415.63,"body":"And it's important to not kind"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":415.63,"endTime":419.02,"body":"of lose sight of of that. But at"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":415.63,"endTime":419.02,"body":"the same time, of course, we"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":419.02,"endTime":423.22,"body":"want to be encouraging people to"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":419.02,"endTime":423.22,"body":"recognise that that might be"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":423.25,"endTime":425.77,"body":"counterproductive, because I"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":423.25,"endTime":425.77,"body":"think that's the issue just a"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":425.77,"endTime":429.34,"body":"lot of people just don't realise"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":425.77,"endTime":429.34,"body":"that knock on consequences of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":429.34,"endTime":432.1,"body":"that. And of course, the social"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":429.34,"endTime":432.1,"body":"norms that that's I think one of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":432.1,"endTime":435.76,"body":"the pros about increase in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":432.1,"endTime":435.76,"body":"popularity in January is just"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":435.76,"endTime":439.27,"body":"kind of normalising not needing"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":435.76,"endTime":439.27,"body":"to drink or being expected to"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":439.27,"endTime":442.72,"body":"drink, even if it is just a"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":439.27,"endTime":442.72,"body":"January that it's becoming more"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":442.72,"endTime":445.99,"body":"socially accepted. And the other"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":442.72,"endTime":445.99,"body":"thing that is a really worrying"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":445.99,"endTime":450.49,"body":"longer term impact is the shift"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":445.99,"endTime":450.49,"body":"to home consumption. And when we"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":450.49,"endTime":453.61,"body":"know that that's been the longer"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":450.49,"endTime":453.61,"body":"term shift anyway, that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":453.7,"endTime":457.33,"body":"obviously, the big rise in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":453.7,"endTime":457.33,"body":"consumption, certainly from the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":457.33,"endTime":462.22,"body":"kind of 1960s until around 2004"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":457.33,"endTime":462.22,"body":"was that shift to off trade is"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":462.28,"endTime":465.37,"body":"mainly supermarket sales. But"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":462.28,"endTime":465.37,"body":"you know, what's the effect and"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":465.37,"endTime":469.18,"body":"a half on kind of maybe in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":465.37,"endTime":469.18,"body":"bedding new heavy home drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":469.21,"endTime":472.36,"body":"patterns, and you know, how many"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":469.21,"endTime":472.36,"body":"pubs are actually going to"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":472.36,"endTime":476.35,"body":"survive, be able to reopen as"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":472.36,"endTime":476.35,"body":"what many might argue a kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":476.35,"endTime":479.41,"body":"more safe and controlled"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":476.35,"endTime":479.41,"body":"regulated drinking environment?"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":479.62,"endTime":482.41,"body":"The thing that"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":479.62,"endTime":482.41,"body":"concerns me, and this is the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":482.41,"endTime":486.85,"body":"hole that the industry seem to"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":482.41,"endTime":486.85,"body":"want to have on this narrative,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":486.88,"endTime":490.72,"body":"the idea that alcohol sales, in"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":486.88,"endTime":490.72,"body":"the aggregate have they seem to"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":490.72,"endTime":494.86,"body":"have fallen, but it's because"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":490.72,"endTime":494.86,"body":"the pub trades been decimated,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":494.86,"endTime":498.04,"body":"the hospitality trades been"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":494.86,"endTime":498.04,"body":"decimated. And a lot of the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":498.04,"endTime":501.31,"body":"slack has been taken up by off"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":498.04,"endTime":501.31,"body":"licences supermarkets in"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":501.31,"endTime":505.24,"body":"particular. And home drinking is"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":501.31,"endTime":505.24,"body":"the knock on effect of this, but"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":505.27,"endTime":508.96,"body":"seems to be what I've seen in"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":505.27,"endTime":508.96,"body":"recent weeks, especially and I"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":508.96,"endTime":512.2,"body":"think, in the run up to the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":508.96,"endTime":512.2,"body":"budget, I think is the plan is"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":512.32,"endTime":516.22,"body":"for many alcohol industry"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":512.32,"endTime":516.22,"body":"players to say, well, we're"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":516.28,"endTime":520.78,"body":"being batted here, we need cuts"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":516.28,"endTime":520.78,"body":"in tax to make up for it. I"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":520.78,"endTime":523.96,"body":"think it's quite dangerous,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":520.78,"endTime":523.96,"body":"actually. Because, again, it's"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":523.96,"endTime":527.62,"body":"the idea that they're seeing"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":523.96,"endTime":527.62,"body":"things in the aggregate and the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":527.65,"endTime":531.34,"body":"decimation of the pub trade is"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":527.65,"endTime":531.34,"body":"obviously a bad thing that is"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":531.46,"endTime":535.18,"body":"definitely worth the industry"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":531.46,"endTime":535.18,"body":"shouting about and saying, Well,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":535.18,"endTime":540.85,"body":"how do we recover post pandemic,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":535.18,"endTime":540.85,"body":"but it's quite telling, but not"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":540.85,"endTime":543.88,"body":"a lot of noise has been made"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":540.85,"endTime":543.88,"body":"about the fact that it's a"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":543.88,"endTime":547.39,"body":"relative Bonanza for"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":543.88,"endTime":547.39,"body":"supermarkets. And home"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":547.39,"endTime":550.9,"body":"deliveries is also an issue,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":547.39,"endTime":550.9,"body":"something that's been possibly"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":550.9,"endTime":555.22,"body":"swept under the carpet, and"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":550.9,"endTime":555.22,"body":"could prove to be quite a big"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":555.28,"endTime":558.88,"body":"proportion of sales going"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":555.28,"endTime":558.88,"body":"forward. So I suppose you know,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":558.88,"endTime":562.12,"body":"it's the volume that people buy,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":558.88,"endTime":562.12,"body":"you could when you're doing your"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":562.12,"endTime":565.09,"body":"shopping by huge amounts of"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":562.12,"endTime":565.09,"body":"alcohol that you can get if you"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":565.09,"endTime":568.3,"body":"get a whole house full of people"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":565.09,"endTime":568.3,"body":"very drunk on and they wouldn't"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":568.33,"endTime":570.52,"body":"have any way of knowing or"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":568.33,"endTime":570.52,"body":"controlling that."},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":570.55,"endTime":572.5,"body":"I really"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":570.55,"endTime":572.5,"body":"agree with what you said that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":572.5,"endTime":576.4,"body":"this is part of a longer term"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":572.5,"endTime":576.4,"body":"shift. So there has been a big"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":576.4,"endTime":579.76,"body":"move towards more and more of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":576.4,"endTime":579.76,"body":"people's drinking being done in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":579.76,"endTime":583.21,"body":"home over the last couple of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":579.76,"endTime":583.21,"body":"decades. But obviously the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":583.21,"endTime":586.9,"body":"pandemic has really, really"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":583.21,"endTime":586.9,"body":"accelerated that. I think that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":586.9,"endTime":589.9,"body":"there's a couple of other things"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":586.9,"endTime":589.9,"body":"that that that raises red flags"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":589.9,"endTime":593.77,"body":"for me for is around children"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":589.9,"endTime":593.77,"body":"and families so our children"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":593.77,"endTime":597.94,"body":"being more exposed to alcohol in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":593.77,"endTime":597.94,"body":"the home than before and also"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":597.94,"endTime":602.08,"body":"things to do with domestic"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":597.94,"endTime":602.08,"body":"violence and abuse.We've seen a"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":602.08,"endTime":606.76,"body":"lot of reports that calls to"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":602.08,"endTime":606.76,"body":"domestic abuse charities have"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":606.79,"endTime":610.81,"body":"really risen a lot over the past"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":606.79,"endTime":610.81,"body":"year. And I'd be surprised if"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":610.81,"endTime":613.96,"body":"alcohol didn't have some sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":610.81,"endTime":613.96,"body":"role in that and the increase in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":613.99,"endTime":617.47,"body":"home drinking and where there"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":613.99,"endTime":617.47,"body":"aren't other people there to see"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":617.5,"endTime":619.45,"body":"what's happening so much else."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":619.45,"endTime":621.91,"body":"I spoke to Dr."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":619.45,"endTime":621.91,"body":"Emily Nichols, Dr. Dominic"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":621.91,"endTime":624.88,"body":"Conroy, who I asked to talk"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":621.91,"endTime":624.88,"body":"about their research on drinking"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":624.88,"endTime":627.49,"body":"during the pandemic, based on a"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":624.88,"endTime":627.49,"body":"number of interviews,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":627.7,"endTime":629.14,"body":"I guess, to"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":627.7,"endTime":629.14,"body":"start by saying, one of the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":629.14,"endTime":631.9,"body":"reasons we were interested in"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":629.14,"endTime":631.9,"body":"doing this research is because"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":631.9,"endTime":634.6,"body":"we've noticed the the kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":631.9,"endTime":634.6,"body":"headlines that were coming out"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":634.6,"endTime":637.42,"body":"around people drinking more"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":634.6,"endTime":637.42,"body":"around people purchasing more"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":637.42,"endTime":641.53,"body":"alcohol, you know, this kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":637.42,"endTime":641.53,"body":"quite simplistic idea in the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":641.53,"endTime":644.05,"body":"media that people were just, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":641.53,"endTime":644.05,"body":"know, drinking more, and that"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":644.05,"endTime":647.29,"body":"there wasn't any kind of nuance"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":644.05,"endTime":647.29,"body":"in that. So Dom and I were quite"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":647.29,"endTime":650.26,"body":"interested in actually speaking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":647.29,"endTime":650.26,"body":"to people in the UK, who were"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":650.26,"endTime":652.57,"body":"current drinkers and"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":650.26,"endTime":652.57,"body":"understanding, you know, what"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":652.57,"endTime":655.06,"body":"were their relationships with"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":652.57,"endTime":655.06,"body":"alcohol actually, like during"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":655.06,"endTime":658.9,"body":"lockdown, and we certainly found"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":655.06,"endTime":658.9,"body":"evidence of some people talking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":658.9,"endTime":662.23,"body":"about perhaps drinking more in"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":658.9,"endTime":662.23,"body":"lockdown, and others drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":662.23,"endTime":665.74,"body":"less. And then a few who said"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":662.23,"endTime":665.74,"body":"that actually, they tended to be"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":665.74,"endTime":668.32,"body":"home drinkers anyway, so their"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":665.74,"endTime":668.32,"body":"drinking practices hadn't really"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":668.32,"endTime":670.99,"body":"changed that much. So in terms"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":668.32,"endTime":670.99,"body":"of the people who talked about"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":670.99,"endTime":674.38,"body":"drinking a little bit more, a"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":670.99,"endTime":674.38,"body":"lot of this was around using"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":674.38,"endTime":677.89,"body":"drinking as a way to carve up"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":674.38,"endTime":677.89,"body":"time during the day to market"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":677.89,"endTime":681.7,"body":"transition to the evening, for"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":677.89,"endTime":681.7,"body":"example, or starting drinking,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":681.7,"endTime":685.48,"body":"perhaps earlier in the day to"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":681.7,"endTime":685.48,"body":"tackle boredom. And a lot of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":685.48,"endTime":688.27,"body":"people had obviously lost their"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":685.48,"endTime":688.27,"body":"normal routines and regimes"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":688.27,"endTime":690.55,"body":"around their daily practices,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":688.27,"endTime":690.55,"body":"particularly if they'd been"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":690.55,"endTime":693.49,"body":"furloughed, for example. But"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":690.55,"endTime":693.49,"body":"then for other participants"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":693.52,"endTime":696.37,"body":"locked on particularly the first"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":693.52,"endTime":696.37,"body":"lockdown represented what we"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":696.37,"endTime":699.07,"body":"might call almost a sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":696.37,"endTime":699.07,"body":"teachable moment for people"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":699.07,"endTime":702.19,"body":"where they took a step back from"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":699.07,"endTime":702.19,"body":"their drinking, and there was a"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":702.19,"endTime":704.95,"body":"period of reflection on their"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":702.19,"endTime":704.95,"body":"relationship with alcohol. So"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":704.95,"endTime":708.97,"body":"actually, they were using this"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":704.95,"endTime":708.97,"body":"opportunity to experiment or"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":708.97,"endTime":711.25,"body":"change their relationships with"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":708.97,"endTime":711.25,"body":"alcohol, because they weren't"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":711.25,"endTime":714.25,"body":"experiencing these social"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":711.25,"endTime":714.25,"body":"pressures to go to the pub, or"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":714.25,"endTime":717.55,"body":"to drink socially or to go out"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":714.25,"endTime":717.55,"body":"with friends. So there was"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":717.55,"endTime":719.56,"body":"definitely quite a lot of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":717.55,"endTime":719.56,"body":"nuance, and quite a lot of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":719.56,"endTime":722.26,"body":"variation in the way people"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":719.56,"endTime":722.26,"body":"talked about their relationship."},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":722.41,"endTime":724.72,"body":"Yeah, we were"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":722.41,"endTime":724.72,"body":"going into this quite sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":724.72,"endTime":727.54,"body":"open minded really, I mean, and"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":724.72,"endTime":727.54,"body":"exactly as M says, you know, we"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":727.57,"endTime":730.78,"body":"were really interested in these"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":727.57,"endTime":730.78,"body":"different media reports coming"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":730.78,"endTime":734.17,"body":"out thinking about, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":730.78,"endTime":734.17,"body":"increased hits on to alcohol"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":734.2,"endTime":737.29,"body":"support websites, so more people"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":734.2,"endTime":737.29,"body":"concerned about their drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":737.29,"endTime":740.74,"body":"value during that first spring"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":737.29,"endTime":740.74,"body":"lockdown, 2020 period, people"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":740.74,"endTime":744.4,"body":"buying more alcohol in it, some"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":740.74,"endTime":744.4,"body":"evidence, supermarkets or other"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":744.4,"endTime":746.98,"body":"outlets might be having some"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":744.4,"endTime":746.98,"body":"particular kind of strategy in"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":746.98,"endTime":749.86,"body":"response to things in terms of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":746.98,"endTime":749.86,"body":"alcohol sales. So I mean, that"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":749.89,"endTime":752.14,"body":"there was all this stuff coming"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":749.89,"endTime":752.14,"body":"out. And then and I was just"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":752.14,"endTime":754.6,"body":"really interested in having"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":752.14,"endTime":754.6,"body":"these conversations with all"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":754.6,"endTime":756.52,"body":"about drinking, and you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":754.6,"endTime":756.52,"body":"conversations with drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":756.52,"endTime":758.89,"body":"about people are always going to"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":756.52,"endTime":758.89,"body":"be that bit different and that"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":758.89,"endTime":762.04,"body":"bit more spontaneous. And then"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":758.89,"endTime":762.04,"body":"having people complete these"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":762.07,"endTime":764.86,"body":"anonymous surveys where they"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":762.07,"endTime":764.86,"body":"could be, there could be all"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":764.86,"endTime":767.14,"body":"sorts of issues involved. And we"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":764.86,"endTime":767.14,"body":"were really interested in sort"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":767.14,"endTime":769.33,"body":"of having having these"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":767.14,"endTime":769.33,"body":"conversations through these"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":769.33,"endTime":772.0,"body":"focus groups, and these drink"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":769.33,"endTime":772.0,"body":"diaries that some of our"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":772.0,"endTime":775.39,"body":"participants, you know, very"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":772.0,"endTime":775.39,"body":"kindly completed. So thinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":775.39,"endTime":777.94,"body":"about sort of home drinking is a"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":775.39,"endTime":777.94,"body":"lot of emphasis about sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":777.94,"endTime":780.55,"body":"drinking out on, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":777.94,"endTime":780.55,"body":"Friday nights out, and that kind"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":780.55,"endTime":783.4,"body":"of thing, and, you know, images"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":780.55,"endTime":783.4,"body":"that that sort of conjures up,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":783.4,"endTime":787.3,"body":"there's very little sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":783.4,"endTime":787.3,"body":"research conducted about alcohol"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":787.3,"endTime":790.12,"body":"consumption in the home. So this"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":787.3,"endTime":790.12,"body":"was really sort of a unique"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":790.12,"endTime":793.42,"body":"opportunity to be to be thinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":790.12,"endTime":793.42,"body":"about that, like I was saying,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":793.42,"endTime":796.06,"body":"you know, in terms of how"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":793.42,"endTime":796.06,"body":"alcohol might play this symbolic"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":796.06,"endTime":799.63,"body":"role, in terms of carving out"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":796.06,"endTime":799.63,"body":"different sections of the day."},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":799.69,"endTime":801.73,"body":"And that's one feature of this"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":799.69,"endTime":801.73,"body":"paper, we were sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":801.73,"endTime":804.88,"body":"particularly interested in this"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":801.73,"endTime":804.88,"body":"idea of the symbolic role of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":804.88,"endTime":808.42,"body":"alcohol in the home, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":804.88,"endTime":808.42,"body":"this idea of a finished work, I"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":808.42,"endTime":811.87,"body":"don't have all of those"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":808.42,"endTime":811.87,"body":"environmental or contextual kind"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":811.87,"endTime":814.9,"body":"of markers to say, right, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":811.87,"endTime":814.9,"body":"finished your day's work,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":815.65,"endTime":819.52,"body":"pulling a beer out of the fridge"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":815.65,"endTime":819.52,"body":"at five o'clock, that was, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":819.52,"endTime":822.79,"body":"know, had a real kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":819.52,"endTime":822.79,"body":"symbolic power to sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":822.82,"endTime":826.0,"body":"shifting the different different"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":822.82,"endTime":826.0,"body":"parts of the day. And there were"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":826.0,"endTime":828.01,"body":"some there were some problems"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":826.0,"endTime":828.01,"body":"with that for some people, I"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":828.01,"endTime":832.06,"body":"mean, but some reflective"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":828.01,"endTime":832.06,"body":"opportunities as well. We"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":832.06,"endTime":834.79,"body":"definitely had a couple of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":832.06,"endTime":834.79,"body":"participants who described the"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":834.79,"endTime":838.21,"body":"kind of trajectory where at the"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":834.79,"endTime":838.21,"body":"start of lockdown, they noticed"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":838.21,"endTime":840.73,"body":"that their drinking had"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":838.21,"endTime":840.73,"body":"increased. And this had kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":840.76,"endTime":842.89,"body":"been triggered a period of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":840.76,"endTime":842.89,"body":"reflection where they thought"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":842.89,"endTime":844.69,"body":"about making changes to their"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":842.89,"endTime":844.69,"body":"drinking."},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":844.69,"endTime":846.85,"body":"So one"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":844.69,"endTime":846.85,"body":"participant I talked to, in"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":846.85,"endTime":849.61,"body":"particular, Allison, music, a"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":846.85,"endTime":849.61,"body":"student in there, I should say,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":849.7,"endTime":853.12,"body":"she talked about this initial"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":849.7,"endTime":853.12,"body":"increase in her drinking. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":853.15,"endTime":856.42,"body":"then she engaged in this kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":853.15,"endTime":856.42,"body":"period of change and reflection,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":856.42,"endTime":859.18,"body":"where she actually stopped"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":856.42,"endTime":859.18,"body":"drinking for a period of a month"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":859.18,"endTime":862.69,"body":"or two and embarked on a new"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":859.18,"endTime":862.69,"body":"exercise regime and made changes"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":862.69,"endTime":865.96,"body":"to her diet. And I'm not saying"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":862.69,"endTime":865.96,"body":"this came completely out blue."},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":865.96,"endTime":868.99,"body":"Certainly for participants like"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":865.96,"endTime":868.99,"body":"Alison, they talked about kind"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":868.99,"endTime":871.57,"body":"of reflecting on their"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":868.99,"endTime":871.57,"body":"relationships with alcohol, even"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":871.57,"endTime":874.87,"body":"pre lockdown and perhaps having"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":871.57,"endTime":874.87,"body":"some, even some concerns and"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":874.87,"endTime":877.93,"body":"anxieties about regularly going"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":874.87,"endTime":877.93,"body":"to the pub or regularly drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":877.93,"endTime":881.71,"body":"to access. I think the key"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":877.93,"endTime":881.71,"body":"takeaway here is that lockdown"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":881.71,"endTime":884.38,"body":"created the space for"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":881.71,"endTime":884.38,"body":"participants like Alison to say,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":884.38,"endTime":887.47,"body":"Actually, I can play with"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":884.38,"endTime":887.47,"body":"abstinence or sobriety I can"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":887.47,"endTime":891.49,"body":"take a break from a step away"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":887.47,"endTime":891.49,"body":"from my drinking, and I can use"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":891.49,"endTime":895.18,"body":"this period to stop drinking but"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":891.49,"endTime":895.18,"body":"without the kind of pressures or"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":895.18,"endTime":898.33,"body":"triggers or social cues that"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":895.18,"endTime":898.33,"body":"would come with going to the pub"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":898.33,"endTime":901.6,"body":"for example. So I think"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":898.33,"endTime":901.6,"body":"something else to add here"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":901.6,"endTime":904.81,"body":"that's that's quite interesting"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":901.6,"endTime":904.81,"body":"is we know from other research"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":904.81,"endTime":907.21,"body":"that there's this idea that"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":904.81,"endTime":907.21,"body":"periods of sobriety and"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":907.21,"endTime":910.33,"body":"abstinence are sometimes"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":907.21,"endTime":910.33,"body":"associated with kind of moral"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":910.33,"endTime":914.26,"body":"and ethical processes of almost"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":910.33,"endTime":914.26,"body":"kind of creating the self. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":914.26,"endTime":916.78,"body":"there was some evidence of this"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":914.26,"endTime":916.78,"body":"as well. So Allison talked"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":916.78,"endTime":919.48,"body":"about, you know, I don't want to"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":916.78,"endTime":919.48,"body":"come out of lockdown being that"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":919.48,"endTime":922.81,"body":"person who drinks a bottle of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":919.48,"endTime":922.81,"body":"wine, it's a, I want to come out"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":922.81,"endTime":926.02,"body":"a better person. So there was"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":922.81,"endTime":926.02,"body":"certainly this interesting"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":926.02,"endTime":930.61,"body":"narrative emerging around this"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":926.02,"endTime":930.61,"body":"idea that you could somehow use"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":930.61,"endTime":933.73,"body":"lockdown to become a better"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":930.61,"endTime":933.73,"body":"version of yourself. And I think"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":933.73,"endTime":936.22,"body":"we see this more widely, don't"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":933.73,"endTime":936.22,"body":"we this idea that in the first"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":936.22,"endTime":938.47,"body":"lockdown, we should all have"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":936.22,"endTime":938.47,"body":"been learning a new language and"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":938.47,"endTime":941.5,"body":"developing all these new skills"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":938.47,"endTime":941.5,"body":"and making the most of it. So"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":941.71,"endTime":944.29,"body":"there was definitely some"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":941.71,"endTime":944.29,"body":"evidence of that this process of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":944.29,"endTime":948.31,"body":"kind of forming the goods or the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":944.29,"endTime":948.31,"body":"ethical or the moral self"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":948.31,"endTime":951.25,"body":"through some through sobriety or"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":948.31,"endTime":951.25,"body":"abstinence during the initial"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":951.25,"endTime":954.64,"body":"lockdown period. That's really"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":951.25,"endTime":954.64,"body":"interesting, because as you"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":954.64,"endTime":957.73,"body":"said, in terms of why you wanted"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":954.64,"endTime":957.73,"body":"to perhaps do this paper was"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":957.73,"endTime":961.78,"body":"these more stereotypical media"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":957.73,"endTime":961.78,"body":"narratives about drinking to"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":961.78,"endTime":965.41,"body":"cope, and I did find some of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":961.78,"endTime":965.41,"body":"that in the interviews, the new"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":965.59,"endTime":969.82,"body":"around that, understandably,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":965.59,"endTime":969.82,"body":"people might be using alcohol in"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":969.82,"endTime":973.0,"body":"a way to deal with some of the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":969.82,"endTime":973.0,"body":"issues presented by the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":973.0,"endTime":973.57,"body":"lockdown."},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":973.57,"endTime":975.22,"body":"But on the"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":973.57,"endTime":975.22,"body":"other hand, you know, not"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":975.22,"endTime":978.55,"body":"everybody responded in that that"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":975.22,"endTime":978.55,"body":"one way, certainly not even"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":978.55,"endTime":981.34,"body":"amongst just heavy drinkers. I"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":978.55,"endTime":981.34,"body":"mean, I think people were sort"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":981.34,"endTime":983.47,"body":"of talking at different points"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":981.34,"endTime":983.47,"body":"about sort of tricky to cope."},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":983.47,"endTime":985.48,"body":"And that, you know, I think that"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":983.47,"endTime":985.48,"body":"there wasn't just from an"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":985.48,"endTime":987.55,"body":"individual's perspective,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":985.48,"endTime":987.55,"body":"sometimes it was, well, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":987.55,"endTime":989.77,"body":"know, there's that person on the"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":987.55,"endTime":989.77,"body":"other, you know, on the other"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":989.77,"endTime":991.63,"body":"end of a zoom call, and you"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":989.77,"endTime":991.63,"body":"know, that we're having a"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":991.63,"endTime":994.39,"body":"difficult time before lockdown."},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":991.63,"endTime":994.39,"body":"And you know, it's important,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":994.39,"endTime":996.46,"body":"I'm there for them. So we're"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":994.39,"endTime":996.46,"body":"going to have this regular zoom"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":996.46,"endTime":998.95,"body":"call, and in the absence of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":996.46,"endTime":998.95,"body":"being able to actually meet with"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":998.95,"endTime":1000.81,"body":"each other, and yeah, we're"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":998.95,"endTime":1000.81,"body":"going to have a drink on that"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1000.81,"endTime":1002.94,"body":"zoom call, you know, that's,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1000.81,"endTime":1002.94,"body":"that's what we do when we meet"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1002.94,"endTime":1005.49,"body":"up, you know, alcohol could"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1002.94,"endTime":1005.49,"body":"sometimes provide that kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1005.52,"endTime":1008.46,"body":"constant, it could provide that"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1005.52,"endTime":1008.46,"body":"sort of ongoing thing, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1008.52,"endTime":1011.04,"body":"you weren't there, you couldn't"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1008.52,"endTime":1011.04,"body":"be in that person's front room,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1011.04,"endTime":1014.01,"body":"you couldn't see that person or"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1011.04,"endTime":1014.01,"body":"shake their hand or give them a"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1014.01,"endTime":1017.28,"body":"hug or anything. But you could"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1014.01,"endTime":1017.28,"body":"sort of connect with them"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1017.28,"endTime":1019.86,"body":"through through having an"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1017.28,"endTime":1019.86,"body":"alcoholic drink with them. Sure."},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1019.89,"endTime":1023.49,"body":"But I mean, the the sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1019.89,"endTime":1023.49,"body":"internet based parties or"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1023.49,"endTime":1027.27,"body":"connections and drinking that"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1023.49,"endTime":1027.27,"body":"people obviously adopted is"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1027.27,"endTime":1030.18,"body":"really interesting in itself. I"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1027.27,"endTime":1030.18,"body":"mean, I certainly heard about"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1030.18,"endTime":1033.81,"body":"some people saying, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1030.18,"endTime":1033.81,"body":"after experimenting with a kind"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1033.81,"endTime":1037.23,"body":"of internet based drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1033.81,"endTime":1037.23,"body":"occasion, that Gosh, the Xoom"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1037.23,"endTime":1040.74,"body":"party hangover was like a new"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1037.23,"endTime":1040.74,"body":"sort of feature in their life."},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1040.74,"endTime":1043.89,"body":"So I think, you know, some of it"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1040.74,"endTime":1043.89,"body":"was trying to explore this new"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1043.89,"endTime":1046.47,"body":"way of for certainly people"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1043.89,"endTime":1046.47,"body":"maybe that you were used to"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1046.47,"endTime":1049.92,"body":"going out in shared drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1046.47,"endTime":1049.92,"body":"spaces trying to make up for"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1049.92,"endTime":1052.95,"body":"that in the home sense. It was a"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1049.92,"endTime":1052.95,"body":"bit of a learning process. But"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1052.95,"endTime":1056.37,"body":"you did touch on, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1052.95,"endTime":1056.37,"body":"negotiating the home as a space"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1056.37,"endTime":1058.77,"body":"for drinking, when that wasn't"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1056.37,"endTime":1058.77,"body":"maybe what they were used to"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1058.77,"endTime":1059.19,"body":"doing."},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1059.3,"endTime":1061.91,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1059.3,"endTime":1061.91,"body":"absolutely. I think there was"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1061.91,"endTime":1064.16,"body":"definitely a lot of variation"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1061.91,"endTime":1064.16,"body":"for some of our participants,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1064.16,"endTime":1067.55,"body":"particularly parents with young"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1064.16,"endTime":1067.55,"body":"children, for example, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1067.55,"endTime":1071.03,"body":"they talked about how regularly"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1067.55,"endTime":1071.03,"body":"drinking at home was a very"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1071.03,"endTime":1073.49,"body":"normal practice for them, and"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1071.03,"endTime":1073.49,"body":"actually going to the pub going"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1073.49,"endTime":1075.62,"body":"out and drinking socially was"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1073.49,"endTime":1075.62,"body":"something that had declined for"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1075.62,"endTime":1078.95,"body":"them in recent years since"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1075.62,"endTime":1078.95,"body":"becoming parents anyway. And for"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1078.95,"endTime":1081.53,"body":"other participants, it was quite"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1078.95,"endTime":1081.53,"body":"a different story. So some of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1081.53,"endTime":1084.86,"body":"our participants, perhaps who'd"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1081.53,"endTime":1084.86,"body":"have done their own work purely"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1084.86,"endTime":1087.47,"body":"social drinkers. And for them,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1084.86,"endTime":1087.47,"body":"it was very much about going to"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1087.47,"endTime":1090.5,"body":"the pub about meeting friends in"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1087.47,"endTime":1090.5,"body":"that social space. And there was"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1090.5,"endTime":1093.44,"body":"a bit of kind of hesitant, some"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1090.5,"endTime":1093.44,"body":"reluctance for Sal about"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1093.44,"endTime":1097.01,"body":"transferring their drinking, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1093.44,"endTime":1097.01,"body":"know, to the home. So one of our"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1097.01,"endTime":1099.86,"body":"participants in particular said,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1097.01,"endTime":1099.86,"body":"you know, that she was felt"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1099.86,"endTime":1102.65,"body":"quite uncomfortable with"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1099.86,"endTime":1102.65,"body":"drinking at home on her own, and"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1102.68,"endTime":1105.14,"body":"the drinking for her was very"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1102.68,"endTime":1105.14,"body":"much a shared experience in the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1105.14,"endTime":1108.38,"body":"pub. And it was often about, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1105.14,"endTime":1108.38,"body":"know, experiencing what it feels"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1108.38,"endTime":1111.68,"body":"like to drink a nice round of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1108.38,"endTime":1111.68,"body":"beer together. So for some of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1111.68,"endTime":1114.71,"body":"the shift to home drinking had"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1111.68,"endTime":1114.71,"body":"to had not really taken place or"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1114.71,"endTime":1117.26,"body":"something that they have quite"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1114.71,"endTime":1117.26,"body":"an ambivalent relationship"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1117.26,"endTime":1121.85,"body":"towards. I think for others as"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1117.26,"endTime":1121.85,"body":"well, this idea of of the pub as"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1121.85,"endTime":1124.91,"body":"actually in some senses, having"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1121.85,"endTime":1124.91,"body":"a moderating influence on"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1124.91,"endTime":1128.21,"body":"people's drinking behaviours. So"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1124.91,"endTime":1128.21,"body":"we often tend to think about"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1128.24,"endTime":1130.82,"body":"drinking environments as being"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1128.24,"endTime":1130.82,"body":"consciously designed to"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1130.82,"endTime":1133.55,"body":"encourage people to drink more,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1130.82,"endTime":1133.55,"body":"you know, everything from the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1133.55,"endTime":1136.73,"body":"layout to happy hour drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1133.55,"endTime":1136.73,"body":"promotions, to the music to the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1136.73,"endTime":1140.24,"body":"lighting can be used in some"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1136.73,"endTime":1140.24,"body":"ways to encourage more alcohol"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1140.24,"endTime":1143.3,"body":"consumption. However, I think"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1140.24,"endTime":1143.3,"body":"one of the things that we found"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1143.3,"endTime":1146.18,"body":"was that home drinking is in"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1143.3,"endTime":1146.18,"body":"quite a few ways, kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1146.21,"endTime":1149.78,"body":"unbounded and uncontained. So"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1146.21,"endTime":1149.78,"body":"the pubs, for example, with"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1149.78,"endTime":1153.41,"body":"their limited opening hours do"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1149.78,"endTime":1153.41,"body":"play some restraints on people's"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1153.41,"endTime":1156.02,"body":"drinking. Whereas for some of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1153.41,"endTime":1156.02,"body":"our participants, they were"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1156.02,"endTime":1159.29,"body":"remarking how it was easier to"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1156.02,"endTime":1159.29,"body":"perhaps start drinking earlier"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1159.29,"endTime":1162.83,"body":"at home than they would do"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1159.29,"endTime":1162.83,"body":"before lockdown. And the idea"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1162.83,"endTime":1165.95,"body":"that the pub is a kind of social"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1162.83,"endTime":1165.95,"body":"space where people might mingle"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1165.95,"endTime":1168.41,"body":"and mix with others there might"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1165.95,"endTime":1168.41,"body":"be gaps in their drinking, where"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1168.41,"endTime":1171.14,"body":"they go and talk to others. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1168.41,"endTime":1171.14,"body":"of course, even the physical act"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1171.14,"endTime":1173.96,"body":"of having to get up and go to"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1171.14,"endTime":1173.96,"body":"the bar and purchase and pay for"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1173.96,"endTime":1177.35,"body":"another drink. So a lot of these"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1173.96,"endTime":1177.35,"body":"kinds of checks and restraints,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1177.35,"endTime":1179.69,"body":"if you like on people's"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1177.35,"endTime":1179.69,"body":"drinking, were absent in the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1179.69,"endTime":1183.17,"body":"domestic context. And some"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1179.69,"endTime":1183.17,"body":"people reflected a little bit"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1183.17,"endTime":1186.74,"body":"more and felt a little bit"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1183.17,"endTime":1186.74,"body":"cautious. Almost they were aware"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1186.74,"endTime":1188.78,"body":"that there was more alcohol in"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1186.74,"endTime":1188.78,"body":"the fridge and that there were"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1188.78,"endTime":1191.96,"body":"in some ways, less constraints"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1188.78,"endTime":1191.96,"body":"and less things to stop them."},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1192.14,"endTime":1194.81,"body":"They also commented that you"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1192.14,"endTime":1194.81,"body":"know, the pub has a restraining"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1194.81,"endTime":1197.36,"body":"influence and that we often"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1194.81,"endTime":1197.36,"body":"don't want to appear drunk or"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1197.36,"endTime":1200.72,"body":"messy or out of control in those"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1197.36,"endTime":1200.72,"body":"public spaces. So the drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1200.72,"endTime":1204.26,"body":"at home again, it was perhaps"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1200.72,"endTime":1204.26,"body":"easier to slip into drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1204.26,"endTime":1206.63,"body":"more without really thinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1204.26,"endTime":1206.63,"body":"about it. That's really"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1206.63,"endTime":1210.17,"body":"interesting because it relates"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1206.63,"endTime":1210.17,"body":"both to some of the broader"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1210.17,"endTime":1214.34,"body":"policy debates about pricing and"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1210.17,"endTime":1214.34,"body":"availability and rising trend in"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1214.34,"endTime":1218.15,"body":"consumption through the second"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1214.34,"endTime":1218.15,"body":"half of the last century as"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1218.18,"endTime":1221.72,"body":"supermarkets and began to sell"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1218.18,"endTime":1221.72,"body":"alcohol and affordability"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1221.72,"endTime":1225.26,"body":"increased. But also, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1221.72,"endTime":1225.26,"body":"that idea you're talking about"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1225.26,"endTime":1228.83,"body":"of people having a sense of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1225.26,"endTime":1228.83,"body":"well, actually drinking at home"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1228.83,"endTime":1233.06,"body":"alone, there often signifies if"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1228.83,"endTime":1233.06,"body":"for many people, the stereotypes"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1233.06,"endTime":1236.54,"body":"of having an alcohol problem"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1233.06,"endTime":1236.54,"body":"means drinking alone or at home"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1236.6,"endTime":1239.93,"body":"and suddenly locked down was"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1236.6,"endTime":1239.93,"body":"kind of well required a"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1239.93,"endTime":1242.75,"body":"reevaluation of that, because"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1239.93,"endTime":1242.75,"body":"you didn't have the opportunity"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1242.75,"endTime":1246.8,"body":"to go and drink in a traditional"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1242.75,"endTime":1246.8,"body":"social space or pub. Yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1246.8,"endTime":1248.54,"body":"mean, it's just, this was some"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1246.8,"endTime":1248.54,"body":"of the really interesting parts"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1248.54,"endTime":1250.76,"body":"of the data. And, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1248.54,"endTime":1250.76,"body":"mean, m\u0026r did our separate"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1250.76,"endTime":1253.16,"body":"interviews, but some of these"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1250.76,"endTime":1253.16,"body":"consistent bits did sort of come"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1253.16,"endTime":1255.08,"body":"out, and both of them and it's"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1253.16,"endTime":1255.08,"body":"exactly what you're talking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1255.08,"endTime":1257.09,"body":"about there, actually, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1255.08,"endTime":1257.09,"body":"it was these phenomena like"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1257.12,"endTime":1260.69,"body":"solitary drinking, and drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1257.12,"endTime":1260.69,"body":"at home, or these, these are"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1260.69,"endTime":1263.42,"body":"things that immediately sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1260.69,"endTime":1263.42,"body":"carry those sorts of the sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1263.42,"endTime":1265.88,"body":"associations, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1263.42,"endTime":1265.88,"body":"there is this particular sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1265.88,"endTime":1268.31,"body":"layer of stigma around some of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1265.88,"endTime":1268.31,"body":"these things, even as we use the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1268.31,"endTime":1271.19,"body":"expressions. And I think a lot"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1268.31,"endTime":1271.19,"body":"of people, you know, on the one"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1271.19,"endTime":1273.5,"body":"hand, they were talking in those"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1271.19,"endTime":1273.5,"body":"sorts of more kind of concrete"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1273.5,"endTime":1276.32,"body":"ways around, well, I have this"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1273.5,"endTime":1276.32,"body":"drink, you know, at home on"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1276.32,"endTime":1279.11,"body":"these days, and this is how I"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1276.32,"endTime":1279.11,"body":"have it with and this is when I"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1279.11,"endTime":1281.93,"body":"don't have a drink, but there"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1279.11,"endTime":1281.93,"body":"was just that sort of general"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1281.96,"endTime":1285.17,"body":"sort of way in which talk around"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1281.96,"endTime":1285.17,"body":"solitary drinking, sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1285.17,"endTime":1288.32,"body":"worked in some of these"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1285.17,"endTime":1288.32,"body":"interviews. And the role of you"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1288.32,"endTime":1291.08,"body":"know, just you know, having"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1288.32,"endTime":1291.08,"body":"alcohol drinks home amongst some"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1291.08,"endTime":1293.69,"body":"of our participants who would"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1291.08,"endTime":1293.69,"body":"never normally have an alcoholic"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1293.69,"endTime":1296.3,"body":"drink at home, there was, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1293.69,"endTime":1296.3,"body":"know, a real sense of sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1296.3,"endTime":1299.27,"body":"ambivalence to drinking at home,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1296.3,"endTime":1299.27,"body":"in some of the interviews, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1299.27,"endTime":1301.76,"body":"know, real sort of lack of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1299.27,"endTime":1301.76,"body":"interest in that as sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1301.76,"endTime":1303.8,"body":"something to do I mean, alcohol"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1301.76,"endTime":1303.8,"body":"might have played a really"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1303.86,"endTime":1307.4,"body":"important role in some people's"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1303.86,"endTime":1307.4,"body":"lives three lockdown, because it"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1307.4,"endTime":1309.86,"body":"was there for socialising. But"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1307.4,"endTime":1309.86,"body":"that idea of will"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1309.89,"endTime":1312.35,"body":"What's this"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1309.89,"endTime":1312.35,"body":"for then, but also a real sense"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1312.35,"endTime":1315.17,"body":"of kind of discomfort. In some"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1312.35,"endTime":1315.17,"body":"of the interviews a real sense"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1315.17,"endTime":1318.14,"body":"of well, I'm almost sort of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1315.17,"endTime":1318.14,"body":"positioning myself to be"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1318.14,"endTime":1321.14,"body":"understood as someone with some"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1318.14,"endTime":1321.14,"body":"kind of difficulties with"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1321.14,"endTime":1324.89,"body":"alcohol, if I'm having a drink"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1321.14,"endTime":1324.89,"body":"on my own, you know, if my"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1324.89,"endTime":1327.68,"body":"partner doesn't want a drink,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1324.89,"endTime":1327.68,"body":"for example, and that was the"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1327.68,"endTime":1330.71,"body":"case in a few of our interviews,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1327.68,"endTime":1330.71,"body":"and just that whole thing about,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1330.71,"endTime":1333.53,"body":"you know, having a stock of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1330.71,"endTime":1333.53,"body":"alcohol at home, that was"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1333.71,"endTime":1336.71,"body":"something that people often"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1333.71,"endTime":1336.71,"body":"weren't comfortable with. So"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1337.07,"endTime":1340.31,"body":"it's just quite interesting how"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1337.07,"endTime":1340.31,"body":"things that have those kinds of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1340.31,"endTime":1343.1,"body":"associations with them anyway,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1340.31,"endTime":1343.1,"body":"like drinking on your own"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1343.13,"endTime":1346.55,"body":"drinking at home, how that sort"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1343.13,"endTime":1346.55,"body":"of came out of this lockdown"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1346.55,"endTime":1349.67,"body":"drinking project, like say,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1346.55,"endTime":1349.67,"body":"they're the kind of stigma that"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1349.67,"endTime":1353.21,"body":"that kind of makes people often"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1349.67,"endTime":1353.21,"body":"aware of, you know, what the"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1353.21,"endTime":1356.51,"body":"social norms or expectancies"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1353.21,"endTime":1356.51,"body":"are, but both in terms of"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1356.51,"endTime":1359.84,"body":"drinking and so many other"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1356.51,"endTime":1359.84,"body":"things like working from home or"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1359.84,"endTime":1363.53,"body":"exercising, and so on, it's just"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1359.84,"endTime":1363.53,"body":"presented challenges that maybe"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1363.56,"endTime":1367.43,"body":"have prompted us to reflect or"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1363.56,"endTime":1367.43,"body":"behave in different ways. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1367.43,"endTime":1370.13,"body":"some of that may be positive,"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1367.43,"endTime":1370.13,"body":"and some of it may be less so."},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1370.13,"endTime":1373.46,"body":"So first thing briefly on on"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1370.13,"endTime":1373.46,"body":"where next, a couple of the"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1373.46,"endTime":1374.84,"body":"things we've been thinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Dominic Conroy","startTime":1373.46,"endTime":1374.84,"body":"about,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1374.9,"endTime":1376.82,"body":"I guess,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1374.9,"endTime":1376.82,"body":"drawing on on our background,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1376.82,"endTime":1378.68,"body":"we've both kind of looked at"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1376.82,"endTime":1378.68,"body":"issues around gender in the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1378.68,"endTime":1380.78,"body":"past, there's some interesting"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1378.68,"endTime":1380.78,"body":"stuff starting to come out"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1380.78,"endTime":1384.11,"body":"around kind of motherhood, and"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1380.78,"endTime":1384.11,"body":"this phenomenon that is called"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1384.11,"endTime":1386.48,"body":"mummy wine culture, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1384.11,"endTime":1386.48,"body":"this kind of the ways in which"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1386.51,"endTime":1389.54,"body":"alcohol is often bound up with"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1386.51,"endTime":1389.54,"body":"motherhood now in the alcohol"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1389.54,"endTime":1392.27,"body":"industry, and the kind of things"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1389.54,"endTime":1392.27,"body":"that circulate through social"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1392.27,"endTime":1396.08,"body":"media that kind of promotes"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1392.27,"endTime":1396.08,"body":"drinking as a kind of reward for"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1396.08,"endTime":1398.84,"body":"parenting or, you know, a kind"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1396.08,"endTime":1398.84,"body":"of compensation for the"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1398.84,"endTime":1401.42,"body":"challenges of motherhood. I"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1398.84,"endTime":1401.42,"body":"think that's quite interesting."},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1401.48,"endTime":1404.33,"body":"And so I think, really, we need"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1401.48,"endTime":1404.33,"body":"to get to grips more with what"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1404.33,"endTime":1407.39,"body":"started to come through and all"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1404.33,"endTime":1407.39,"body":"this interesting data, and then"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1407.42,"endTime":1409.4,"body":"where we can go next with some"},{"speaker":"Dr Emily Nicholls","startTime":1407.42,"endTime":1409.4,"body":"more research."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1409.62,"endTime":1412.56,"body":"Next, I spoke to"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1409.62,"endTime":1412.56,"body":"Dr. Julian shorter, who asked to"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1412.56,"endTime":1415.56,"body":"talk to me about British"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1412.56,"endTime":1415.56,"body":"Psychological Society guidelines"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1415.56,"endTime":1418.23,"body":"that she'd helped to develop to"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1415.56,"endTime":1418.23,"body":"support health care roles in"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1418.23,"endTime":1421.38,"body":"their response to the health"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1418.23,"endTime":1421.38,"body":"challenges presented by COVID."},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1421.95,"endTime":1425.7,"body":"The briefing"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1421.95,"endTime":1425.7,"body":"is really to try and support"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1425.73,"endTime":1429.48,"body":"those who are working in health"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1425.73,"endTime":1429.48,"body":"to help the general population"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1429.48,"endTime":1433.8,"body":"keep within those 14 units that"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1429.48,"endTime":1433.8,"body":"the chief medical officers have"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1433.8,"endTime":1437.37,"body":"put in their guidelines. The"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1433.8,"endTime":1437.37,"body":"idea behind this is that so much"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1437.37,"endTime":1440.94,"body":"of our life has changed. The way"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1437.37,"endTime":1440.94,"body":"in which we were trying to"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1440.94,"endTime":1444.15,"body":"implement the guidelines before"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1440.94,"endTime":1444.15,"body":"maybe just doesn't apply. So the"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1444.15,"endTime":1446.61,"body":"way in which we think about"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1444.15,"endTime":1446.61,"body":"policy and the way in which we"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1446.61,"endTime":1450.27,"body":"think about trying to support"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1446.61,"endTime":1450.27,"body":"individuals has to change. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1450.27,"endTime":1453.03,"body":"of course, our healthcare"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1450.27,"endTime":1453.03,"body":"systems more generally, not just"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1453.03,"endTime":1456.78,"body":"the alcohol treatment side of"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1453.03,"endTime":1456.78,"body":"things, or online, self help, or"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1456.78,"endTime":1460.38,"body":"whatever, everything has changed"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1456.78,"endTime":1460.38,"body":"so much, that we really want to"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1460.38,"endTime":1464.61,"body":"be making sure that we look"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1460.38,"endTime":1464.61,"body":"after our NHS, we look after our"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1464.61,"endTime":1467.97,"body":"health systems, and all those"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1464.61,"endTime":1467.97,"body":"sort of long term risks that we"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1467.97,"endTime":1471.33,"body":"know occur from alcohol, we try"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1467.97,"endTime":1471.33,"body":"and prevent some of those from"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1471.33,"endTime":1475.44,"body":"occurring to minimise our"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1471.33,"endTime":1475.44,"body":"pressure on the NHS. And it's"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1475.44,"endTime":1478.71,"body":"really interesting in terms of"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1475.44,"endTime":1478.71,"body":"the shifts that's happening and"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1478.71,"endTime":1481.56,"body":"certainly worrying you could say"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1478.71,"endTime":1481.56,"body":"in many ways, but we've seen"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1481.56,"endTime":1485.25,"body":"this kind of longer term trend"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1481.56,"endTime":1485.25,"body":"towards home drinking or"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1485.25,"endTime":1488.61,"body":"purchasing alcohol in the off"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1485.25,"endTime":1488.61,"body":"trades, you know, promising"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1488.61,"endTime":1491.67,"body":"figures from Scotland in terms"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1488.61,"endTime":1491.67,"body":"of minimum pricing. You know, a"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1491.67,"endTime":1494.61,"body":"lot of people say that pricing"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1491.67,"endTime":1494.61,"body":"is the big kind of issue here as"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1494.61,"endTime":1497.79,"body":"a policy perspective. Do you"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1494.61,"endTime":1497.79,"body":"think that's ever more important"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1497.79,"endTime":1500.16,"body":"now? Absolutely, James, and I"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1497.79,"endTime":1500.16,"body":"think"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1500.22,"endTime":1503.43,"body":"We kind of go back to the safer"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1500.22,"endTime":1503.43,"body":"guidelines from the World Health"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1503.43,"endTime":1506.61,"body":"Organisation, they're kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1503.43,"endTime":1506.61,"body":"five things we should really be"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1506.61,"endTime":1509.91,"body":"focusing on from a policy"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1506.61,"endTime":1509.91,"body":"perspective right now. So things"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1509.91,"endTime":1512.55,"body":"like marketing, making sure that"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1509.91,"endTime":1512.55,"body":"we're not marketing to children"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1512.55,"endTime":1515.16,"body":"and young people that we're"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1512.55,"endTime":1515.16,"body":"being responsible. But how we"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1515.16,"endTime":1519.39,"body":"communicate, alcohol and alcohol"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1515.16,"endTime":1519.39,"body":"branding, talk to others,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1519.75,"endTime":1522.96,"body":"prices, obviously a big one, a"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1519.75,"endTime":1522.96,"body":"minimum unit pricing is showing"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1522.96,"endTime":1525.75,"body":"a big difference in Scotland be"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1522.96,"endTime":1525.75,"body":"great if we could get those"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1525.75,"endTime":1531.21,"body":"gains right across the UK, and"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1525.75,"endTime":1531.21,"body":"more widely. availability. So"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1531.21,"endTime":1534.09,"body":"this is a big one, things like"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1531.21,"endTime":1534.09,"body":"drunk driving countermeasures"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1534.09,"endTime":1536.64,"body":"are really, really very"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1534.09,"endTime":1536.64,"body":"important. And then, of course,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1536.64,"endTime":1539.97,"body":"the treatment side of things,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1536.64,"endTime":1539.97,"body":"the brief interventions, or the"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1539.97,"endTime":1542.55,"body":"self help that you might get"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1539.97,"endTime":1542.55,"body":"online, that's also really very"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1542.55,"endTime":1546.3,"body":"important. And one of the other"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1542.55,"endTime":1546.3,"body":"things is, it's really very"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1546.3,"endTime":1549.57,"body":"vitally important that we don't"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1546.3,"endTime":1549.57,"body":"have the alcohol industry at the"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1549.57,"endTime":1553.2,"body":"policy table. And that remains"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1549.57,"endTime":1553.2,"body":"really important, whether we're"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1553.2,"endTime":1557.43,"body":"inside a pandemic or outside of"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1553.2,"endTime":1557.43,"body":"one. And what about trying to"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1557.43,"endTime":1561.36,"body":"encourage people to stick to the"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1557.43,"endTime":1561.36,"body":"guidelines, because net remains"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1561.36,"endTime":1564.09,"body":"a bit of a tricky issue in the"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1561.36,"endTime":1564.09,"body":"sense that people who tend to"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1564.09,"endTime":1567.27,"body":"drink above the guidelines tend"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1564.09,"endTime":1567.27,"body":"to be quite dismissive or"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1567.27,"endTime":1569.82,"body":"resistant to thinking about"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1567.27,"endTime":1569.82,"body":"them. And that's understandable"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1569.82,"endTime":1573.06,"body":"from, you know, obviously a"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1569.82,"endTime":1573.06,"body":"perspective of alcohol being"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1573.06,"endTime":1576.48,"body":"very culturally normalised"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1573.06,"endTime":1576.48,"body":"people using alcohol as a coping"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1576.48,"endTime":1580.14,"body":"mechanism. How do we try and"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1576.48,"endTime":1580.14,"body":"maybe mitigate that issue or"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1580.14,"endTime":1583.74,"body":"risk of the guidelines really"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1580.14,"endTime":1583.74,"body":"not having the kind of resonance"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1583.74,"endTime":1586.29,"body":"we maybe want from a public"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1583.74,"endTime":1586.29,"body":"health perspective, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1586.29,"endTime":1589.11,"body":"James, I think you've kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1586.29,"endTime":1589.11,"body":"hit the nail on the head there,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1589.11,"endTime":1592.38,"body":"you know, there's so much has"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1589.11,"endTime":1592.38,"body":"changed for so many people. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1592.38,"endTime":1595.8,"body":"we've got to be really open and"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1592.38,"endTime":1595.8,"body":"honest and have conversations"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1595.8,"endTime":1598.92,"body":"about our alcohol use, our"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1595.8,"endTime":1598.92,"body":"routines have been completely"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1598.92,"endTime":1601.65,"body":"abandoned, we may have gone into"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1598.92,"endTime":1601.65,"body":"work, so we wouldn't be drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1601.65,"endTime":1604.74,"body":"during the day. Or maybe we"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1601.65,"endTime":1604.74,"body":"didn't drink during weekdays."},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1604.98,"endTime":1607.92,"body":"And now our routines have"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1604.98,"endTime":1607.92,"body":"completely changed. We're stuck"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1607.92,"endTime":1610.83,"body":"at home, we're stressed out"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1607.92,"endTime":1610.83,"body":"about our jobs, or livelihoods,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1610.86,"endTime":1614.49,"body":"friends, our loved ones, some"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1610.86,"endTime":1614.49,"body":"folks have been homeschooling"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1614.49,"endTime":1617.88,"body":"for the first time, that's a big"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1614.49,"endTime":1617.88,"body":"pressure on parents, you're"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1617.88,"endTime":1621.03,"body":"bored, you're stressed, it's so"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1617.88,"endTime":1621.03,"body":"easy to open a bottle of wine"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1621.03,"endTime":1624.15,"body":"when the routine is gone. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1621.03,"endTime":1624.15,"body":"also things like our tempers are"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1624.15,"endTime":1627.36,"body":"frayed, where we're with our"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1624.15,"endTime":1627.36,"body":"partners and our families. 24,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1627.36,"endTime":1631.02,"body":"seven were cooked off and so"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1627.36,"endTime":1631.02,"body":"much is going on. Although there"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1631.02,"endTime":1633.9,"body":"has been guidance and support to"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1631.02,"endTime":1633.9,"body":"help people drink within the"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1633.9,"endTime":1637.38,"body":"guidelines before now, we have"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1633.9,"endTime":1637.38,"body":"to really respect the fact that"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1637.62,"endTime":1640.47,"body":"our opportunity to drink"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1637.62,"endTime":1640.47,"body":"particularly has changed"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1640.47,"endTime":1643.32,"body":"enormously in terms of our"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1640.47,"endTime":1643.32,"body":"social environment and our"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1643.32,"endTime":1646.59,"body":"physical environment. But as"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1643.32,"endTime":1646.59,"body":"part of the honest conversation,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1646.62,"endTime":1650.64,"body":"I feel James, I have to be"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1646.62,"endTime":1650.64,"body":"honest here and myself that, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1650.64,"endTime":1654.51,"body":"know, there came a point quite"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1650.64,"endTime":1654.51,"body":"early on in the pandemic, when I"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1654.51,"endTime":1658.02,"body":"had to have some harsh"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1654.51,"endTime":1658.02,"body":"conversations. My husband and I,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1658.02,"endTime":1660.87,"body":"we had some conversations when"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1658.02,"endTime":1660.87,"body":"we were noticed we were drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1660.87,"endTime":1663.15,"body":"during the week, which we"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1660.87,"endTime":1663.15,"body":"wouldn't do. Normally, we were"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1663.15,"endTime":1666.3,"body":"feeling the stress of extra"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1663.15,"endTime":1666.3,"body":"alcohol. And we were drinking"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1666.3,"endTime":1668.49,"body":"above the guideline. So we had"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1666.3,"endTime":1668.49,"body":"to have a word with ourselves"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1668.55,"endTime":1671.19,"body":"and to try and think about how"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1668.55,"endTime":1671.19,"body":"we could get our drinking back"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1671.19,"endTime":1675.12,"body":"in under those 14 units. So I"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1671.19,"endTime":1675.12,"body":"want to be absolutely clear to"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1675.12,"endTime":1678.36,"body":"your listeners that, you know we"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1675.12,"endTime":1678.36,"body":"do alcohol research. But"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1678.36,"endTime":1681.36,"body":"sometimes we need to look at"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1678.36,"endTime":1681.36,"body":"ourselves too, and that it's so"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1681.36,"endTime":1685.17,"body":"easy for alcohol to creep up."},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1681.36,"endTime":1685.17,"body":"And it is a stress reliever."},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1685.17,"endTime":1688.26,"body":"It's pretty instantaneous. But"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1685.17,"endTime":1688.26,"body":"of course, we do know that a"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1688.26,"endTime":1691.14,"body":"couple of days down the line."},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1688.26,"endTime":1691.14,"body":"And of course, our listeners"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1691.14,"endTime":1694.65,"body":"who've heard your last episode"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1691.14,"endTime":1694.65,"body":"will know that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1694.65,"endTime":1697.8,"body":"anxiety is one of the big things"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1694.65,"endTime":1697.8,"body":"that comes out after a hangover."},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1697.8,"endTime":1701.85,"body":"So, so many open and honest"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1697.8,"endTime":1701.85,"body":"conversations need to be had"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1701.85,"endTime":1705.3,"body":"about drinking or culture and"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1701.85,"endTime":1705.3,"body":"where it fits into our everyday"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1705.3,"endTime":1708.24,"body":"life. I totally agree. And yeah,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1705.3,"endTime":1708.24,"body":"you know, good for you for"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1708.24,"endTime":1711.72,"body":"having that that conversation is"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1708.24,"endTime":1711.72,"body":"certainly not always easy. And"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1711.72,"endTime":1716.31,"body":"what about the kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1711.72,"endTime":1716.31,"body":"psychological approach to trying"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1716.31,"endTime":1719.97,"body":"to change behaviour in the"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1716.31,"endTime":1719.97,"body":"briefing, it talks about the"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1719.97,"endTime":1722.85,"body":"Kombi model? Can you tell me a"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1719.97,"endTime":1722.85,"body":"little bit about that, please."},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1723.0,"endTime":1727.08,"body":"So the Kombi model is basically"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1723.0,"endTime":1727.08,"body":"at three different elements that"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1727.08,"endTime":1730.38,"body":"influence behaviour. So"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1727.08,"endTime":1730.38,"body":"capability is about what we know"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1730.38,"endTime":1734.04,"body":"and what we do. Opportunities"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1730.38,"endTime":1734.04,"body":"are about the people around us"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1734.04,"endTime":1737.67,"body":"and our physical environment."},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1734.04,"endTime":1737.67,"body":"And then our beliefs are what we"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1737.67,"endTime":1741.09,"body":"want maybe how we see ourselves"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1737.67,"endTime":1741.09,"body":"how we regulate our emotions,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1741.09,"endTime":1745.26,"body":"our habits, those are kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1741.09,"endTime":1745.26,"body":"motivations, we think that these"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1745.26,"endTime":1748.56,"body":"three elements influence"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1745.26,"endTime":1748.56,"body":"behaviour. So for example, if"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1748.56,"endTime":1752.16,"body":"we're thinking about COVID,"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1748.56,"endTime":1752.16,"body":"particularly, there's been a lot"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1752.16,"endTime":1755.16,"body":"of a shift around our"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1752.16,"endTime":1755.16,"body":"environment, both social and"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1755.16,"endTime":1757.71,"body":"physical. You know, if we're"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1755.16,"endTime":1757.71,"body":"thinking about changing our"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1757.71,"endTime":1761.07,"body":"alcohol, we might want to set"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1757.71,"endTime":1761.07,"body":"some boundaries around our"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1761.07,"endTime":1765.09,"body":"consumption, like substituting"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1761.07,"endTime":1765.09,"body":"lower alcohol products or no"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1765.09,"endTime":1768.87,"body":"alcohol products, during social"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1765.09,"endTime":1768.87,"body":"situations, having alcohol free"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1768.87,"endTime":1772.8,"body":"days, or planning or alcohol"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1768.87,"endTime":1772.8,"body":"consumption with these very"},{"speaker":"Dr Gillian Shorter","startTime":1772.8,"endTime":1773.97,"body":"different routines."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1774.78,"endTime":1777.63,"body":"Next, I spoke to"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1774.78,"endTime":1777.63,"body":"Martin, who contacted me after"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1777.63,"endTime":1780.84,"body":"the Adrian Charles episode about"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1777.63,"endTime":1780.84,"body":"how his drinking had changed"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1780.84,"endTime":1784.5,"body":"throughout the pandemic. So"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1780.84,"endTime":1784.5,"body":"thanks for joining me. Can you"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1784.5,"endTime":1787.44,"body":"just tell me a bit about how you"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1784.5,"endTime":1787.44,"body":"saw your kind of relationship"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":1787.44,"endTime":1789.27,"body":"with alcohol before lockdown?"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1789.36,"endTime":1792.15,"body":"Yeah, I think before"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1789.36,"endTime":1792.15,"body":"lockdown It was a case of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1792.21,"endTime":1795.09,"body":"drinking more socially because"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1792.21,"endTime":1795.09,"body":"obviously you could you could"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1795.09,"endTime":1798.78,"body":"mix with people. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1795.09,"endTime":1798.78,"body":"particularly a weekends by golf."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1798.9,"endTime":1804.93,"body":"Go to the gym, see a few people"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1798.9,"endTime":1804.93,"body":"and having a drink sociably at"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1804.93,"endTime":1809.16,"body":"weekends, I think since the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1804.93,"endTime":1809.16,"body":"pandemic has arrived, and with"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1809.16,"endTime":1812.64,"body":"the winter evenings and the kind"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1809.16,"endTime":1812.64,"body":"of you can't meet people, and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1812.64,"endTime":1815.7,"body":"you can't go anywhere, and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1812.64,"endTime":1815.7,"body":"drink, why alcohol becomes a"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1815.7,"endTime":1818.97,"body":"different perspective in your"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1815.7,"endTime":1818.97,"body":"life. And that's something that"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1819.0,"endTime":1821.82,"body":"I've I've really had to deal"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1819.0,"endTime":1821.82,"body":"with. So after kind of locked"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1821.82,"endTime":1825.45,"body":"down a saying that your kind of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1821.82,"endTime":1825.45,"body":"alcohol use crept up a bit, it"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1825.45,"endTime":1829.14,"body":"definitely did initially, on the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1825.45,"endTime":1829.14,"body":"first lockdown, it was tougher,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1829.23,"endTime":1832.56,"body":"it didn't feel like a real"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1829.23,"endTime":1832.56,"body":"lockdown, you had the sunshine"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1832.56,"endTime":1836.28,"body":"and everything else, it just"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1832.56,"endTime":1836.28,"body":"felt very different. I think"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1836.28,"endTime":1840.45,"body":"since you know, those dark"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1836.28,"endTime":1840.45,"body":"evenings, alcohol can be or have"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1840.45,"endTime":1843.78,"body":"been a bit of a Crux, in terms"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1840.45,"endTime":1843.78,"body":"of something to reward yourself"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1843.78,"endTime":1846.51,"body":"with, for getting through the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1843.78,"endTime":1846.51,"body":"day, or dealing with work"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1846.51,"endTime":1849.69,"body":"issues, or dealing with"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1846.51,"endTime":1849.69,"body":"relationship issues, and helping"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1849.69,"endTime":1853.86,"body":"you in inverted commas feel"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1849.69,"endTime":1853.86,"body":"better at the end of the day. So"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1853.89,"endTime":1856.86,"body":"in a way, the sort of summer"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1853.89,"endTime":1856.86,"body":"locked down, drinking sort of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1856.86,"endTime":1860.94,"body":"felt like just enjoying the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1856.86,"endTime":1860.94,"body":"summer, whereas now everything's"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1860.97,"endTime":1864.0,"body":"a bit more tiresome. And with"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1860.97,"endTime":1864.0,"body":"the weather and the darker"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1864.0,"endTime":1868.14,"body":"nights and stress of it all, I"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1864.0,"endTime":1868.14,"body":"felt a bit more that the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1868.14,"endTime":1871.83,"body":"drinking has become not"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1868.14,"endTime":1871.83,"body":"necessarily positive life"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1871.83,"endTime":1874.26,"body":"enhancing thing but more of a"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1871.83,"endTime":1874.26,"body":"Crux, is that what you're"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1874.26,"endTime":1877.53,"body":"saying? Yeah, but I mean,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1874.26,"endTime":1877.53,"body":"somebody like myself is very"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1877.53,"endTime":1881.13,"body":"aware of the dangers and the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1877.53,"endTime":1881.13,"body":"addictive qualities of alcohol."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1881.22,"endTime":1883.53,"body":"And something I've kind of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1881.22,"endTime":1883.53,"body":"learned to manage in this"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1883.53,"endTime":1887.34,"body":"lockdown is that I've changed my"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1883.53,"endTime":1887.34,"body":"drinking behaviour, definitely."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1887.46,"endTime":1890.43,"body":"Because I knew it was becoming a"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1887.46,"endTime":1890.43,"body":"slight, slight issue in the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1890.43,"endTime":1893.43,"body":"summer, because it was easy to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1890.43,"endTime":1893.43,"body":"have a drink at the end of the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1893.43,"endTime":1896.13,"body":"day with those beautiful"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1893.43,"endTime":1896.13,"body":"temperatures. In the lockdown"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1896.13,"endTime":1899.64,"body":"since winter, I say I've changed"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1896.13,"endTime":1899.64,"body":"my drinking behaviour. I don't"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1899.64,"endTime":1903.15,"body":"drink wine now, because that is"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1899.64,"endTime":1903.15,"body":"a very high alcohol content. And"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1903.15,"endTime":1906.24,"body":"I left me feeling tired in the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1903.15,"endTime":1906.24,"body":"morning. And I've trained I've"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1906.24,"endTime":1910.35,"body":"changed much more to just"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1906.24,"endTime":1910.35,"body":"drinking less at the weekend and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1910.35,"endTime":1913.83,"body":"changing it to beer, which"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1910.35,"endTime":1913.83,"body":"obviously is less strengthen"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1913.92,"endTime":1918.69,"body":"doesn't give me the same kind of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1913.92,"endTime":1918.69,"body":"health implications. I think the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1918.69,"endTime":1922.02,"body":"wine did you say to the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1918.69,"endTime":1922.02,"body":"frequency of your drinking maybe"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1922.02,"endTime":1925.32,"body":"crept up, but then you reflected"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1922.02,"endTime":1925.32,"body":"on that and have cut down and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1925.32,"endTime":1928.59,"body":"change from less strong drink to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1925.32,"endTime":1928.59,"body":"bear. But what was the kind of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1928.59,"endTime":1932.01,"body":"thought process as you kind of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1928.59,"endTime":1932.01,"body":"made that decision to cut down"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1932.01,"endTime":1935.25,"body":"or put those kind of strategies"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1932.01,"endTime":1935.25,"body":"in place, health and well being"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1935.25,"endTime":1939.93,"body":"to be honest. Also, I have a"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1935.25,"endTime":1939.93,"body":"partner who's a sister in the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1939.93,"endTime":1943.38,"body":"hospital who sees the effects of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1939.93,"endTime":1943.38,"body":"alcohol and you know, both from"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1943.38,"endTime":1946.86,"body":"an ad perspective and a longer"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1943.38,"endTime":1946.86,"body":"term health issues that people"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1946.86,"endTime":1950.28,"body":"have coming into hospital. So"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1946.86,"endTime":1950.28,"body":"it's always been there in the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1950.28,"endTime":1953.82,"body":"forefront of my mind. And just"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1950.28,"endTime":1953.82,"body":"basically, I needed to change my"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1953.82,"endTime":1957.84,"body":"relationship with alcohol, and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1953.82,"endTime":1957.84,"body":"make it less of a Crux, and more"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1957.84,"endTime":1961.14,"body":"of just just something"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1957.84,"endTime":1961.14,"body":"occasionally that's nice to do."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1961.41,"endTime":1964.26,"body":"And do you feel different for"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1961.41,"endTime":1964.26,"body":"that? You mentioned sort of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1964.32,"endTime":1967.05,"body":"feeling so tired in the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1964.32,"endTime":1967.05,"body":"mornings? And do you kind of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1967.05,"endTime":1970.95,"body":"have any strategies that you"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1967.05,"endTime":1970.95,"body":"have used to kind of replace it"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1970.95,"endTime":1973.77,"body":"in a way? Yeah, I think exercise"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1970.95,"endTime":1973.77,"body":"has always been important for"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1973.77,"endTime":1977.13,"body":"me, and you're watching your"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1973.77,"endTime":1977.13,"body":"weight, we all know that alcohol"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1977.13,"endTime":1981.21,"body":"is very calorific, you just"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1977.13,"endTime":1981.21,"body":"tried to change, I wouldn't say"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1981.21,"endTime":1984.09,"body":"I have a strategy. It's just,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1981.21,"endTime":1984.09,"body":"it's just learning to deal with"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1984.09,"endTime":1987.0,"body":"our column in a different way."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1984.09,"endTime":1987.0,"body":"And knowing the effects that it"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1987.0,"endTime":1990.33,"body":"has on you from a health"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1987.0,"endTime":1990.33,"body":"perspective, and just just"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1990.33,"endTime":1994.59,"body":"changing your behaviour, and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1990.33,"endTime":1994.59,"body":"making it less of a reward, as"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1994.59,"endTime":1998.7,"body":"it were. And just more of a an"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1994.59,"endTime":1998.7,"body":"occasional nice thing to do at"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1998.7,"endTime":2001.52,"body":"the weekend. Not a set not"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":1998.7,"endTime":2001.52,"body":"turning into a session drink"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2001.52,"endTime":2005.6,"body":"anymore. Yeah, I kind of like"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2001.52,"endTime":2005.6,"body":"the 5% stuff, anything below 5%"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2005.63,"endTime":2009.53,"body":"did give me that quick alcoholic"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2005.63,"endTime":2009.53,"body":"kit that I wanted. So I've kind"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2009.53,"endTime":2014.36,"body":"of I've changed now from 12 13%"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2009.53,"endTime":2014.36,"body":"wines down to beer, and less of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2014.36,"endTime":2017.81,"body":"it. And I think it makes me feel"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2014.36,"endTime":2017.81,"body":"better. Yeah, I'm in my mid 50s."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2017.84,"endTime":2022.16,"body":"Now, and I see people all around"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2017.84,"endTime":2022.16,"body":"me and in society, where alcohol"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2022.16,"endTime":2025.61,"body":"is a big issue. And I'm not"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2022.16,"endTime":2025.61,"body":"saying that I'm much better than"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2025.61,"endTime":2029.84,"body":"those people, I'm just trying to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2025.61,"endTime":2029.84,"body":"do something about it and be"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2029.87,"endTime":2033.08,"body":"much more aware of it, because"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2029.87,"endTime":2033.08,"body":"it affects you mentally,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2033.26,"endTime":2036.59,"body":"definitely, in terms of anxiety"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2033.26,"endTime":2036.59,"body":"and depression. And we for"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2036.59,"endTime":2040.13,"body":"myself, I know that if I drink"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2036.59,"endTime":2040.13,"body":"too much, I get depressed and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2040.13,"endTime":2044.18,"body":"anxious, far more. And I'm also"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2040.13,"endTime":2044.18,"body":"highly aware that from a weak"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2044.18,"endTime":2047.39,"body":"point of view, the effect it has"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2044.18,"endTime":2047.39,"body":"on you, and from a longer term"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2047.39,"endTime":2051.56,"body":"perspective, what it does to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2047.39,"endTime":2051.56,"body":"you. So it's it's just trying to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2051.56,"endTime":2054.35,"body":"balance all those things with"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2051.56,"endTime":2054.35,"body":"something that feels like it's"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2054.35,"endTime":2057.32,"body":"really good at the time"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2054.35,"endTime":2057.32,"body":"balancing it against what the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2057.32,"endTime":2059.93,"body":"longer term effects are."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2057.32,"endTime":2059.93,"body":"Absolutely. And it sounds like"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2059.93,"endTime":2063.35,"body":"you're doing doing pretty well"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2059.93,"endTime":2063.35,"body":"with that now, so do better. I"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2063.35,"endTime":2066.29,"body":"don't wanna say it was a problem"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2063.35,"endTime":2066.29,"body":"before but it was an issue. Sure"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2066.29,"endTime":2069.29,"body":"I'm doing doing better. Let's"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2066.29,"endTime":2069.29,"body":"get a place there. And"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2069.29,"endTime":2072.44,"body":"hopefully, yeah, hopefully as"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2069.29,"endTime":2072.44,"body":"the kind of weather starts to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2072.44,"endTime":2075.53,"body":"improve and are kind of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2072.44,"endTime":2075.53,"body":"situation overall starts to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2075.53,"endTime":2078.47,"body":"improve, you know, you'll kind"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2075.53,"endTime":2078.47,"body":"of maintain that balance and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2078.47,"endTime":2081.05,"body":"we'll be able to kind of you"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2078.47,"endTime":2081.05,"body":"know, use alcohol socially"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2081.05,"endTime":2084.29,"body":"rather than as a kind of Crux"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2081.05,"endTime":2084.29,"body":"and talking about ways in kind"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2084.29,"endTime":2087.53,"body":"of collectively as a nation. You"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2084.29,"endTime":2087.53,"body":"know, as we've had on with some"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2087.53,"endTime":2091.55,"body":"of our other speakers on this"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2087.53,"endTime":2091.55,"body":"episode of three the pandemic"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2091.58,"endTime":2094.16,"body":"that people have really had a"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2091.58,"endTime":2094.16,"body":"heavier drinking patterns"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2094.16,"endTime":2097.19,"body":"already that appear to be"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2094.16,"endTime":2097.19,"body":"drinking more and using it as"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2097.19,"endTime":2099.92,"body":"that using it as that kind of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2097.19,"endTime":2099.92,"body":"coping mechanism way. So"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2099.95,"endTime":2102.8,"body":"Hopefully, you know, I think"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2099.95,"endTime":2102.8,"body":"we'll be seeing some of the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2102.8,"endTime":2106.04,"body":"negative effects of increased"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2102.8,"endTime":2106.04,"body":"consumption for some time to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2106.04,"endTime":2110.0,"body":"come. But I think, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2106.04,"endTime":2110.0,"body":"definitely. And I think we also"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2110.0,"endTime":2114.59,"body":"have to all just acknowledge we"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2110.0,"endTime":2114.59,"body":"do. We, as a society, UK society"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2114.62,"endTime":2118.04,"body":"do have an issue with alcohol."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2114.62,"endTime":2118.04,"body":"And I think it's just something"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2118.04,"endTime":2122.6,"body":"that isn't spoken about enough"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2118.04,"endTime":2122.6,"body":"is people people do have a lot"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2122.6,"endTime":2125.57,"body":"of issues with alcohol. It's"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2122.6,"endTime":2125.57,"body":"just seen as this really social"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2125.78,"endTime":2128.66,"body":"thing that you can do. There's"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2125.78,"endTime":2128.66,"body":"not a problem, but we can all"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2128.66,"endTime":2131.57,"body":"see the effects of it. You know,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2128.66,"endTime":2131.57,"body":"whether young people in their"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2131.57,"endTime":2134.81,"body":"binge drinking their binge"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2131.57,"endTime":2134.81,"body":"drinking makes me sound like a"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2134.81,"endTime":2138.98,"body":"real old fogy. Because let's"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2134.81,"endTime":2138.98,"body":"face it, as well, middle class"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2138.98,"endTime":2142.34,"body":"and middle England and older"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2138.98,"endTime":2142.34,"body":"people also binge drink at the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2142.34,"endTime":2145.04,"body":"weekends, probably just with"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2142.34,"endTime":2145.04,"body":"wine. Yeah, it is an issue, an"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2145.04,"endTime":2149.09,"body":"issue that society needs to deal"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2145.04,"endTime":2149.09,"body":"with, we need to talk a lot more"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2149.09,"endTime":2151.76,"body":"about it. And I'm really"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2149.09,"endTime":2151.76,"body":"grateful for programmes like"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2151.76,"endTime":2155.0,"body":"yours, and, and someone like"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2151.76,"endTime":2155.0,"body":"Adrian Charles coming on he's"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2155.15,"endTime":2159.08,"body":"high profile and talking about"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2155.15,"endTime":2159.08,"body":"his issues with alcohol, and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2159.08,"endTime":2162.86,"body":"related with it, because I'm a"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2159.08,"endTime":2162.86,"body":"big football fan as well. And he"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2162.86,"endTime":2166.4,"body":"talks about how it affects him"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2162.86,"endTime":2166.4,"body":"socially around his football and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2166.43,"endTime":2169.76,"body":"other things. And I feel like"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2166.43,"endTime":2169.76,"body":"I'm in that category, as well,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2169.82,"endTime":2172.76,"body":"as the kind of cultural"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2169.82,"endTime":2172.76,"body":"expectancy isn't there, if you"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2172.76,"endTime":2176.27,"body":"go to the football, or if you're"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2172.76,"endTime":2176.27,"body":"kind of Aladdin with your mates,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2176.27,"endTime":2179.06,"body":"then there is that social"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2176.27,"endTime":2179.06,"body":"pressure isn't there just"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2179.42,"endTime":2182.78,"body":"implied that you that you've got"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2179.42,"endTime":2182.78,"body":"to drink and and again, as agent"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2182.78,"endTime":2185.12,"body":"Charles says, alcohol is the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2182.78,"endTime":2185.12,"body":"only drug that you have to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2185.12,"endTime":2190.37,"body":"apologise for not taking. So"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2185.12,"endTime":2190.37,"body":"yeah, I think the cultural shift"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2190.4,"endTime":2193.76,"body":"is happening. It's just, you"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2190.4,"endTime":2193.76,"body":"know, it's a slow burner. These"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2193.76,"endTime":2196.46,"body":"things don't happen overnight,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2193.76,"endTime":2196.46,"body":"as we saw with smoking, and so"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2196.46,"endTime":2199.16,"body":"on. So I think it's a work in"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2196.46,"endTime":2199.16,"body":"progress, and we're possibly"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2199.19,"endTime":2202.91,"body":"heading in the right direction,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2199.19,"endTime":2202.91,"body":"even if perhaps knock downs put"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2202.91,"endTime":2206.48,"body":"us back a bit because of the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2202.91,"endTime":2206.48,"body":"pressures on many people. But"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2206.72,"endTime":2208.91,"body":"yeah, I think I think you're"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2206.72,"endTime":2208.91,"body":"right, it's just about keeping"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2208.91,"endTime":2212.78,"body":"the conversation going. And so"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2208.91,"endTime":2212.78,"body":"that no overtime, bring, bring"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2212.78,"endTime":2215.93,"body":"the relationship back into"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2212.78,"endTime":2215.93,"body":"balance a bit more. Definitely."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2216.02,"endTime":2219.14,"body":"And it's like all relationships,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2216.02,"endTime":2219.14,"body":"there has to be that balance,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2219.2,"endTime":2222.8,"body":"and sometimes you alcohol"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2219.2,"endTime":2222.8,"body":"companies, I used to work for"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2222.8,"endTime":2227.03,"body":"one, by the way. Interesting. A"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2222.8,"endTime":2227.03,"body":"big Brewer. And, you know, they"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2227.03,"endTime":2231.08,"body":"have lots of lots of power and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2227.03,"endTime":2231.08,"body":"lots of advertising. It's seen"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2231.08,"endTime":2234.89,"body":"as we all know that alcohol is a"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2231.08,"endTime":2234.89,"body":"drug. And it's how do you deal"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2234.89,"endTime":2238.34,"body":"with that drug? And how do you"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2234.89,"endTime":2238.34,"body":"control that drug, and whether"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2238.34,"endTime":2242.3,"body":"that's the alcohol reducers"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2238.34,"endTime":2242.3,"body":"themselves, and how they market"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2242.3,"endTime":2245.36,"body":"it to us taking individual"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2242.3,"endTime":2245.36,"body":"responsibility for our own"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2245.36,"endTime":2249.44,"body":"actions? That's certainly how"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2245.36,"endTime":2249.44,"body":"the alcohol industry wants to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2249.44,"endTime":2251.54,"body":"frame it, you know, that it's an"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2249.44,"endTime":2251.54,"body":"issue of individual"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2251.54,"endTime":2255.17,"body":"responsibility, some of the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2251.54,"endTime":2255.17,"body":"people we've had on on this show"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2255.26,"endTime":2258.5,"body":"earlier. And I would argue that"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2255.26,"endTime":2258.5,"body":"that helps them avoid the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2258.5,"endTime":2261.86,"body":"legislation that might hurt"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2258.5,"endTime":2261.86,"body":"their pockets. So I think, you"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2261.86,"endTime":2265.01,"body":"know, no one disagrees with"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2261.86,"endTime":2265.01,"body":"personal responsibility. But I"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2265.01,"endTime":2268.28,"body":"think there is also a strong"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2265.01,"endTime":2268.28,"body":"case that it shouldn't just be"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2268.37,"endTime":2272.51,"body":"unlimited advertising. And there"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2268.37,"endTime":2272.51,"body":"are problems with being able to"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2272.51,"endTime":2275.93,"body":"sell alcohol really cheaply in"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2272.51,"endTime":2275.93,"body":"supermarkets around the clock."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2275.93,"endTime":2279.71,"body":"So again, as you say, it's about"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2275.93,"endTime":2279.71,"body":"that balance, what is enough or"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2279.71,"endTime":2283.82,"body":"too much, or the right amount of"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2279.71,"endTime":2283.82,"body":"advertising availability or"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2283.91,"endTime":2287.06,"body":"difficult questions, and"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2283.91,"endTime":2287.06,"body":"whichever no one necessarily"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2287.12,"endTime":2290.3,"body":"agrees. 100% on but it is about"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2287.12,"endTime":2290.3,"body":"finding that balance."},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2290.3,"endTime":2292.76,"body":"Definitely. Definitely. Well,"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2290.3,"endTime":2292.76,"body":"thanks so much for coming on the"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2292.76,"endTime":2295.22,"body":"show. That's been really"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2292.76,"endTime":2295.22,"body":"interesting. And best of luck"},{"speaker":"Martin","startTime":2295.22,"endTime":2295.91,"body":"with it. Thank you."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2297.11,"endTime":2299.96,"body":"I also spoke with"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2297.11,"endTime":2299.96,"body":"Rosie stopped drinking shortly"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2299.96,"endTime":2302.9,"body":"before the pandemic about how it"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2299.96,"endTime":2302.9,"body":"affected her."},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2302.0,"endTime":2306.23,"body":"I mean, my relationship"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2302.0,"endTime":2306.23,"body":"with alcohol prior to lockdown"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2306.23,"endTime":2310.28,"body":"was I would say it's very"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2306.23,"endTime":2310.28,"body":"unhealthy. I work in the music"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2310.28,"endTime":2314.81,"body":"industry. And prior to lockdown,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2310.28,"endTime":2314.81,"body":"I was also one of the Booker's"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2314.87,"endTime":2321.02,"body":"at a club in in London. And so"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2314.87,"endTime":2321.02,"body":"my weekends would be made up of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2321.05,"endTime":2326.9,"body":"kind of starting at say, like"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2321.05,"endTime":2326.9,"body":"8pm and finishing any anywhere"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2326.9,"endTime":2332.6,"body":"past 8am, the next day in a"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2326.9,"endTime":2332.6,"body":"club, surrounded by lots of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2332.66,"endTime":2337.49,"body":"intoxicated people. And yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2332.66,"endTime":2337.49,"body":"mean, I would drink through my"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2337.49,"endTime":2341.45,"body":"shift. And then I think the"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2337.49,"endTime":2341.45,"body":"interesting thing was the, like,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2341.45,"endTime":2345.35,"body":"whilst I was working, I never"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2341.45,"endTime":2345.35,"body":"felt very drunk. But as soon as"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2345.35,"endTime":2349.52,"body":"I finished my shift, that's when"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2345.35,"endTime":2349.52,"body":"I would kind of want to relax a"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2349.52,"endTime":2352.58,"body":"bit. And suddenly, I felt a lot"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2349.52,"endTime":2352.58,"body":"more drunk and would want to"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2352.58,"endTime":2355.64,"body":"continue that. So yeah, it"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2352.58,"endTime":2355.64,"body":"wasn't, it wasn't a healthy"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2355.64,"endTime":2359.81,"body":"relationship at all. I was also"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2355.64,"endTime":2359.81,"body":"going to the pub, most"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2359.81,"endTime":2364.37,"body":"weeknights, to kind of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2359.81,"endTime":2364.37,"body":"decompress from what I perceive"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2364.37,"endTime":2369.26,"body":"to be the stresses of the day."},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2364.37,"endTime":2369.26,"body":"So it was very much kind of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2369.32,"endTime":2373.04,"body":"crutch. And so would you say"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2369.32,"endTime":2373.04,"body":"your relationship just developed"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2373.04,"endTime":2376.28,"body":"over time and you know, because"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2373.04,"endTime":2376.28,"body":"alcohol is kind of normalised"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2376.28,"endTime":2380.12,"body":"and accessible, and lots of your"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2376.28,"endTime":2380.12,"body":"peers and friends presumably"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2380.15,"endTime":2383.27,"body":"just drink regularly that was"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2380.15,"endTime":2383.27,"body":"easy to kind of fall into and I"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2383.27,"endTime":2385.91,"body":"suppose within the music"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2383.27,"endTime":2385.91,"body":"industry as well, maybe it's"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2385.91,"endTime":2390.44,"body":"even easier to kind of get into"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2385.91,"endTime":2390.44,"body":"perhaps less than healthy ships"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2390.44,"endTime":2394.4,"body":"of alcohol. Yeah, being totally"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2390.44,"endTime":2394.4,"body":"I mean, my whole industry is"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2394.4,"endTime":2398.9,"body":"kind of based around nightlife"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2394.4,"endTime":2398.9,"body":"and in that, yeah, I mean, booze"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2398.9,"endTime":2403.28,"body":"is kind of at the fore. Part of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2398.9,"endTime":2403.28,"body":"it all and you socialise in like"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2403.28,"endTime":2407.51,"body":"pubs and clubs, which are like"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2403.28,"endTime":2407.51,"body":"the main, the selling point,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2407.54,"endTime":2413.27,"body":"apart from the music is a place"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2407.54,"endTime":2413.27,"body":"to let go. And yeah, kind of let"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2413.27,"endTime":2417.71,"body":"loose and alcohol was involved"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2413.27,"endTime":2417.71,"body":"in that. And it was very much"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2417.77,"endTime":2421.31,"body":"involved in my day to day,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2417.77,"endTime":2421.31,"body":"whether that was also like"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2421.4,"endTime":2425.69,"body":"meeting artists or other"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2421.4,"endTime":2425.69,"body":"professionals in the industry,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2425.69,"endTime":2428.27,"body":"it was all based around going"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2425.69,"endTime":2428.27,"body":"for a drink."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2429.08,"endTime":2432.2,"body":"Because I guess"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2429.08,"endTime":2432.2,"body":"the music industry is one of the"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2432.2,"endTime":2436.13,"body":"industries where you know,"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2432.2,"endTime":2436.13,"body":"because of the association with"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2436.16,"endTime":2440.3,"body":"club nights or festivals or"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2436.16,"endTime":2440.3,"body":"whatever that the use of alcohol"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2440.3,"endTime":2444.02,"body":"one kind of procedure of Hedden"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2440.3,"endTime":2444.02,"body":"ism is so entwined in the way"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2444.02,"endTime":2446.69,"body":"that it's not in other"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2444.02,"endTime":2446.69,"body":"industries on the whole."},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2446.72,"endTime":2450.95,"body":"So, yeah, I mean, it's"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2446.72,"endTime":2450.95,"body":"also after the ticket sales,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2450.95,"endTime":2453.44,"body":"it's the biggest source of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2450.95,"endTime":2453.44,"body":"income for a lot of these"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2453.44,"endTime":2457.7,"body":"places. I mean, now it's kind of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2453.44,"endTime":2457.7,"body":"changing, but the thinking to"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2457.73,"endTime":2461.45,"body":"change that approach and to"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2457.73,"endTime":2461.45,"body":"think about other ways to"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2461.48,"endTime":2465.11,"body":"provide ourselves with income,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2461.48,"endTime":2465.11,"body":"its alcohol has just been at the"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2465.11,"endTime":2468.53,"body":"forefront of all of that. And so"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2465.11,"endTime":2468.53,"body":"prior to lockdown, he actually"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2468.53,"endTime":2471.23,"body":"stopped drinking. Is that right?"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2468.53,"endTime":2471.23,"body":"Yeah, it was just before, it's"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2471.23,"endTime":2474.14,"body":"actually just coming up a year"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2471.23,"endTime":2474.14,"body":"now. So it was at the beginning"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2474.14,"endTime":2479.33,"body":"of February 2020. And it was,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2474.14,"endTime":2479.33,"body":"yeah, it was after one big"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2479.33,"endTime":2484.04,"body":"night. Things just got kind of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2479.33,"endTime":2484.04,"body":"out of hand. And it was me and"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2484.04,"endTime":2488.03,"body":"my partner decided that it was"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2484.04,"endTime":2488.03,"body":"really time to stop when he"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2488.03,"endTime":2491.06,"body":"decided to stop with that, you"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2488.03,"endTime":2491.06,"body":"know, just for a bit. Did you"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2491.06,"endTime":2494.69,"body":"have any ideas or goals in terms"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2491.06,"endTime":2494.69,"body":"of, you know, stopping"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2494.69,"endTime":2497.54,"body":"indefinitely? Or just seeing how"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2494.69,"endTime":2497.54,"body":"it would go? Yeah, I mean, I"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2497.54,"endTime":2502.28,"body":"think I think we kind of thought"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2497.54,"endTime":2502.28,"body":"six months to a year at first."},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2502.94,"endTime":2507.11,"body":"But as time went on, it's now"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2502.94,"endTime":2507.11,"body":"just, it's really changed who we"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2507.11,"endTime":2510.5,"body":"are. And we're very happy with"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2507.11,"endTime":2510.5,"body":"who we are as individuals as a"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2510.5,"endTime":2514.7,"body":"result of giving up drinking."},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2510.5,"endTime":2514.7,"body":"And, and so that just became"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2514.73,"endTime":2518.36,"body":"more of the norm. And now it's"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2514.73,"endTime":2518.36,"body":"just I don't think I'll ever"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2518.39,"endTime":2521.48,"body":"drink again, to be honest, I"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2518.39,"endTime":2521.48,"body":"don't feel the need to you know,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2521.54,"endTime":2524.57,"body":"I think that one thing that kind"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2521.54,"endTime":2524.57,"body":"of kept popping up was like, how"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2524.57,"endTime":2528.8,"body":"do you celebrate if you if"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2524.57,"endTime":2528.8,"body":"you're not drinking, and now"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2528.8,"endTime":2532.25,"body":"that we don't drink and it's not"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2528.8,"endTime":2532.25,"body":"part of our lives, like we don't"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2532.25,"endTime":2536.0,"body":"need that drink in the in our"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2532.25,"endTime":2536.0,"body":"hands to celebrate? we're much"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2536.0,"endTime":2539.18,"body":"more content that's really good."},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2536.0,"endTime":2539.18,"body":"And, you know, how do you think"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2539.18,"endTime":2543.47,"body":"lockdown affected, it didn't"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2539.18,"endTime":2543.47,"body":"make it harder or easier in any"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2543.47,"endTime":2547.4,"body":"ways. I think lockdown made it a"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2543.47,"endTime":2547.4,"body":"lot easier. To be honest. The"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2547.4,"endTime":2551.75,"body":"one thing that I really missed,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2547.4,"endTime":2551.75,"body":"like in the kind of first few"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2551.75,"endTime":2555.2,"body":"months of giving up drinking was"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2551.75,"endTime":2555.2,"body":"going to the pub, and it"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2555.2,"endTime":2558.14,"body":"definitely helped that I knew"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2555.2,"endTime":2558.14,"body":"that no one else could go to the"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2558.14,"endTime":2562.04,"body":"pub, you know, it was something"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2558.14,"endTime":2562.04,"body":"that the whole country was"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2562.07,"endTime":2565.94,"body":"missing out on. And so, you"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2562.07,"endTime":2565.94,"body":"know, it wasn't even possible to"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2565.94,"endTime":2569.18,"body":"do that. I think had we not been"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2565.94,"endTime":2569.18,"body":"in lockdown? I think that would"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2569.18,"endTime":2572.06,"body":"have been a lot harder to"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2569.18,"endTime":2572.06,"body":"interesting, because I suppose"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2572.09,"endTime":2575.78,"body":"you know, you're drinking mainly"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2572.09,"endTime":2575.78,"body":"took place in social contexts"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2575.81,"endTime":2579.11,"body":"outside the home. So you know,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2575.81,"endTime":2579.11,"body":"those are the situations where"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2579.11,"endTime":2582.17,"body":"you might have faced more"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2579.11,"endTime":2582.17,"body":"pressure or discomfort from"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2582.17,"endTime":2585.35,"body":"other people by you saying, Oh,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2582.17,"endTime":2585.35,"body":"I'm not drinking, you know,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2585.35,"endTime":2588.71,"body":"that's, that's when people can"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2585.35,"endTime":2588.71,"body":"kind of get a bit defensive. So"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2588.74,"endTime":2592.43,"body":"yeah, perhaps people are more"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2588.74,"endTime":2592.43,"body":"established home drinking"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2592.43,"endTime":2596.18,"body":"habits, perhaps finding it"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2592.43,"endTime":2596.18,"body":"harder overall, or as people"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2596.18,"endTime":2599.63,"body":"yeah, who predominantly drank"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2596.18,"endTime":2599.63,"body":"like yourself in more social"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2599.63,"endTime":2602.66,"body":"context outside of the home?"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2599.63,"endTime":2602.66,"body":"Maybe you're finding it easier"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2602.96,"endTime":2606.38,"body":"to cut back? Yeah, I would say"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2602.96,"endTime":2606.38,"body":"so. I think the other thing is,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2606.74,"endTime":2610.16,"body":"like there are so many more"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2606.74,"endTime":2610.16,"body":"places now like when locked down"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2610.19,"endTime":2614.81,"body":"East that we found that we could"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2610.19,"endTime":2614.81,"body":"go for a non alcoholic drink and"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2614.81,"endTime":2618.59,"body":"be in a social environment where"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2614.81,"endTime":2618.59,"body":"where we still feel like we're"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2618.59,"endTime":2621.98,"body":"drinking a pint, but it's not."},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2618.59,"endTime":2621.98,"body":"It's alcohol free. And that was"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2621.98,"endTime":2625.58,"body":"really that was really helpful"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2621.98,"endTime":2625.58,"body":"in those initial months. What do"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2625.58,"endTime":2628.67,"body":"you think that was about? Do you"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2625.58,"endTime":2628.67,"body":"think it was about blending in?"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2628.67,"endTime":2632.15,"body":"Or was it the quenching the sort"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2628.67,"endTime":2632.15,"body":"of thirst for an alcoholic drink"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2632.15,"endTime":2635.54,"body":"virus sort of placebo effect? Or"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2632.15,"endTime":2635.54,"body":"a bit of both? Yeah, I'd say a"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2635.54,"endTime":2640.13,"body":"bit of both. I think also just"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2635.54,"endTime":2640.13,"body":"like, I really enjoy being in"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2640.13,"endTime":2643.79,"body":"those environments, even if it's"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2640.13,"endTime":2643.79,"body":"just like with one other person,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2643.79,"endTime":2647.54,"body":"like just being in a social"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2643.79,"endTime":2647.54,"body":"environment. And yeah, the the"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2647.54,"endTime":2652.22,"body":"feeling of that drinking a pint"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2647.54,"endTime":2652.22,"body":"was really nice. And it was"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2652.22,"endTime":2655.37,"body":"something that I missed. And to"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2652.22,"endTime":2655.37,"body":"do that, yeah, it just kind of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2655.37,"endTime":2659.0,"body":"in an enjoyable atmosphere was"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2655.37,"endTime":2659.0,"body":"something that it was just"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2659.0,"endTime":2662.3,"body":"really good to be able to do"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2659.0,"endTime":2662.3,"body":"that without actually drinking"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2662.3,"endTime":2665.39,"body":"alcohol. Yeah, so would you have"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2662.3,"endTime":2665.39,"body":"a drink? Or have you ever drunk"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2665.42,"endTime":2668.87,"body":"alcohol free drinks at home"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2665.42,"endTime":2668.87,"body":"then? Yeah, we did for a while."},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2669.59,"endTime":2673.19,"body":"We found a really good delivery"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2669.59,"endTime":2673.19,"body":"service that had loads of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2673.19,"endTime":2676.16,"body":"different options. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2673.19,"endTime":2676.16,"body":"that's, that's what's been"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2676.16,"endTime":2678.8,"body":"amazing. I think in the last"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2676.16,"endTime":2678.8,"body":"couple of years is that like"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2678.83,"endTime":2684.83,"body":"alcohol free drinks have become"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2678.83,"endTime":2684.83,"body":"so much more popular. And"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2684.83,"endTime":2688.88,"body":"there's there's such a bigger"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2684.83,"endTime":2688.88,"body":"variety now. So yeah, we would"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2688.88,"endTime":2692.24,"body":"like to order in the drinks that"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2688.88,"endTime":2692.24,"body":"we liked, especially over"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2692.24,"endTime":2695.99,"body":"summer, I think, but to be"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2692.24,"endTime":2695.99,"body":"honest, recently, it's we"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2695.99,"endTime":2699.86,"body":"haven't even wanted to do that"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2695.99,"endTime":2699.86,"body":"anymore. That feeling of like of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2699.86,"endTime":2702.41,"body":"like realise that there isn't"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2699.86,"endTime":2702.41,"body":"there just hasn't it's"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2702.41,"endTime":2706.43,"body":"completely diminished. Do you"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2702.41,"endTime":2706.43,"body":"feel as just as times past that"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2706.43,"endTime":2710.39,"body":"you've, you know, those kinds of"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2706.43,"endTime":2710.39,"body":"cues or expectations that might"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2710.42,"endTime":2713.9,"body":"lead to wanting a drink have"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2710.42,"endTime":2713.9,"body":"just kind of subsided over time?"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2713.93,"endTime":2718.37,"body":"Yeah, absolutely. I think in"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2713.93,"endTime":2718.37,"body":"general, basically, my brain has"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2718.37,"endTime":2723.38,"body":"like rewired slightly. And so by"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2718.37,"endTime":2723.38,"body":"not drinking, I'm feeling less"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2723.38,"endTime":2728.21,"body":"anxious. And therefore I've"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2723.38,"endTime":2728.21,"body":"broken that cycle of like, I'm"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2728.21,"endTime":2731.18,"body":"feeling anxious, I want to"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2728.21,"endTime":2731.18,"body":"forget about my woes and"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2731.18,"endTime":2734.63,"body":"worries, and how would I do"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2731.18,"endTime":2734.63,"body":"that? I'd usually have a drink,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2734.66,"endTime":2737.84,"body":"but because I'm less anxious"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2734.66,"endTime":2737.84,"body":"now, I don't even feel the need"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2737.84,"endTime":2738.56,"body":"to do that."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2738.62,"endTime":2741.95,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2738.62,"endTime":2741.95,"body":"I think sort of virtuous cycle"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2741.98,"endTime":2745.85,"body":"is definitely a real thing in"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2741.98,"endTime":2745.85,"body":"terms of people who are drawn"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2745.85,"endTime":2749.9,"body":"maybe to the effects of alcohol"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2745.85,"endTime":2749.9,"body":"on a physiological basis, it's"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2749.9,"endTime":2752.9,"body":"often because you know, in the"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2749.9,"endTime":2752.9,"body":"moment, it will alleviate"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2752.9,"endTime":2756.44,"body":"anxiety, but further down the"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2752.9,"endTime":2756.44,"body":"line, it might or commonly will"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2756.44,"endTime":2760.1,"body":"make it worse. So yeah, when you"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2756.44,"endTime":2760.1,"body":"when you stop kind of using it"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2760.1,"endTime":2764.3,"body":"to alleviate anxiety, then yeah,"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2760.1,"endTime":2764.3,"body":"has that kind of virtuous effect"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2764.3,"endTime":2767.99,"body":"in that you might not feel so"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2764.3,"endTime":2767.99,"body":"anxious as much as a result. So"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2768.02,"endTime":2770.78,"body":"yeah, I think that marries up to"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2768.02,"endTime":2770.78,"body":"the evidence and lots of"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2770.78,"endTime":2774.29,"body":"people's experiences. So that's"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2770.78,"endTime":2774.29,"body":"great. Is there anything in"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2774.29,"endTime":2777.23,"body":"particularly you know, you've"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2774.29,"endTime":2777.23,"body":"replaced alcohol with other"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2777.23,"endTime":2780.32,"body":"than, you know, alcohol free"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2777.23,"endTime":2780.32,"body":"drinks? Do you think it will? or"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2780.32,"endTime":2783.26,"body":"certainly looking forward to the"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2780.32,"endTime":2783.26,"body":"future and hopefully, when"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2783.29,"endTime":2786.2,"body":"knockdown eases? Are there other"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2783.29,"endTime":2786.2,"body":"things that you think you might"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2786.2,"endTime":2789.17,"body":"be able to do more often, I"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2786.2,"endTime":2789.17,"body":"think we've locked down in"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2789.17,"endTime":2789.8,"body":"general,"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2789.73,"endTime":2793.091,"body":"like it's just bought"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2789.73,"endTime":2793.091,"body":"myself and bought me a lot more"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2793.154,"endTime":2797.023,"body":"like inwards and feeling a lot"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2793.154,"endTime":2797.023,"body":"more kind of focused on myself"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2797.086,"endTime":2801.145,"body":"and being at home. I play a lot"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2797.086,"endTime":2801.145,"body":"of video games now. I don't know"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2801.209,"endTime":2805.141,"body":"if that's like something that's"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2801.209,"endTime":2805.141,"body":"replaced there. I don't really"},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2805.204,"endTime":2809.2,"body":"know. I mean, I'm not sure."},{"speaker":"Rosy","startTime":2805.204,"endTime":2809.2,"body":"Well, thanks so much talking to me."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2809.18,"endTime":2811.04,"body":"That's that's a"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2809.18,"endTime":2811.04,"body":"really interesting insight. And"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2811.04,"endTime":2814.07,"body":"I'm really glad that you're kind"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2811.04,"endTime":2814.07,"body":"of reaping the rewards of"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2814.46,"endTime":2818.18,"body":"kicking the booze. Thank you."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2814.46,"endTime":2818.18,"body":"Next, I spoke to Darren Lee, a"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2818.18,"endTime":2820.79,"body":"counsellor at a national"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2818.18,"endTime":2820.79,"body":"addiction service and trainee"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2820.79,"endTime":2823.67,"body":"psychologist. Darren is"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2820.79,"endTime":2823.67,"body":"currently researching the"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2823.67,"endTime":2827.15,"body":"experience of people previously"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2823.67,"endTime":2827.15,"body":"engaged in face to face recovery"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2827.15,"endTime":2829.76,"body":"groups and have switched to"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2827.15,"endTime":2829.76,"body":"their online equivalent during"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2829.76,"endTime":2833.93,"body":"the covid 19 pandemic. So thanks"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2829.76,"endTime":2833.93,"body":"so much, Darren, for joining me,"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2833.96,"endTime":2836.93,"body":"can you tell me a bit about your"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2833.96,"endTime":2836.93,"body":"research and any key themes that"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2836.93,"endTime":2840.23,"body":"are emerging in terms of the"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2836.93,"endTime":2840.23,"body":"effect of the pandemic on people"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2840.23,"endTime":2843.23,"body":"who did use face to face"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2840.23,"endTime":2843.23,"body":"recovery groups, but are now"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2843.26,"endTime":2845.12,"body":"using kind of the online"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":2843.26,"endTime":2845.12,"body":"equivalent."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2845.6,"endTime":2848.03,"body":"So having done a"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2845.6,"endTime":2848.03,"body":"literature review of a certain"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2848.03,"endTime":2851.33,"body":"things, I always expected to see"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2848.03,"endTime":2851.33,"body":"like group members talking about"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2851.33,"endTime":2855.2,"body":"shared identity, connectedness"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2851.33,"endTime":2855.2,"body":"that they feel in the group, you"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2855.2,"endTime":2859.61,"body":"know, meeting people, so"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2855.2,"endTime":2859.61,"body":"meeting, Pro, abstinent sort of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2859.61,"endTime":2862.79,"body":"social network. So I mean,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2859.61,"endTime":2862.79,"body":"what's been coming through just"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2862.79,"endTime":2866.09,"body":"from sort of transcribing"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2862.79,"endTime":2866.09,"body":"interviews, actually, is that"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2866.15,"endTime":2869.87,"body":"online groups, I mean, to my"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2866.15,"endTime":2869.87,"body":"surprise, have been really the"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2869.9,"endTime":2872.78,"body":"favourable to lots of group"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2869.9,"endTime":2872.78,"body":"members. And I mean, with some"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2872.78,"endTime":2875.09,"body":"clients, they've been talking"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2872.78,"endTime":2875.09,"body":"about how accessible they are."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2875.18,"endTime":2878.78,"body":"So rather than having to go to a"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2875.18,"endTime":2878.78,"body":"sheduled group, which might be"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2878.81,"endTime":2880.97,"body":"they might have one or two"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2878.81,"endTime":2880.97,"body":"groups a week, because of the"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2880.97,"endTime":2884.51,"body":"ubiquity of them. I mean, at any"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2880.97,"endTime":2884.51,"body":"given moment, there is a peer"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2884.51,"endTime":2888.08,"body":"support group going on. So I"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2884.51,"endTime":2888.08,"body":"mean, for some people, they"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2888.08,"endTime":2891.35,"body":"might be attending a group at"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2888.08,"endTime":2891.35,"body":"one end of the globe in the"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2891.35,"endTime":2895.7,"body":"morning, and then still"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2891.35,"endTime":2895.7,"body":"attending groups in the evening"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2895.7,"endTime":2897.74,"body":"at the opposite end of the"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2895.7,"endTime":2897.74,"body":"globe. So that's really"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2897.74,"endTime":2900.29,"body":"important, because it gives that"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2897.74,"endTime":2900.29,"body":"sort of accessibility. But I"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2900.29,"endTime":2904.22,"body":"mean, it's more than that,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2900.29,"endTime":2904.22,"body":"because it shows group members"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2904.25,"endTime":2907.7,"body":"that their sense of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2904.25,"endTime":2907.7,"body":"connectedness transcends the"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2907.7,"endTime":2910.28,"body":"connectedness they have with"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2907.7,"endTime":2910.28,"body":"people sitting in a circle. So"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2910.28,"endTime":2912.65,"body":"they're the same as people who"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2910.28,"endTime":2912.65,"body":"might be the opposite end of the"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2912.65,"endTime":2915.5,"body":"planet. And I think that sends a"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2912.65,"endTime":2915.5,"body":"really powerful message to them."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2915.56,"endTime":2919.4,"body":"So online groups have been"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2915.56,"endTime":2919.4,"body":"really, really important for"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2919.4,"endTime":2922.85,"body":"people during the pandemic. I"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2919.4,"endTime":2922.85,"body":"think there are some interesting"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2922.85,"endTime":2926.24,"body":"differences in terms of face to"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2922.85,"endTime":2926.24,"body":"face groups and online groups."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2926.45,"endTime":2929.9,"body":"And some of them are obvious,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2926.45,"endTime":2929.9,"body":"and some less so I think endings"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2929.9,"endTime":2932.15,"body":"have have come up as being"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2929.9,"endTime":2932.15,"body":"really interesting, because at"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2932.15,"endTime":2934.7,"body":"the end of the face to face"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2932.15,"endTime":2934.7,"body":"group, there's almost kind of a"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2935.0,"endTime":2938.27,"body":"process of having a chat with"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2935.0,"endTime":2938.27,"body":"other group members potentially,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2938.27,"endTime":2941.06,"body":"and and the group members have a"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2938.27,"endTime":2941.06,"body":"chance to process some really"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2941.06,"endTime":2943.58,"body":"important material they've been"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2941.06,"endTime":2943.58,"body":"talking about. But obviously,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2943.58,"endTime":2946.64,"body":"with an online group, you click"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2943.58,"endTime":2946.64,"body":"end meeting, and it's very, very"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2946.64,"endTime":2949.85,"body":"abrupt. And I think that is"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2946.64,"endTime":2949.85,"body":"perhaps one of the challenges"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2949.88,"endTime":2953.69,"body":"that group members might have"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2949.88,"endTime":2953.69,"body":"been experiencing, certainly for"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2953.69,"endTime":2956.45,"body":"the people I've spoken to. I"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2953.69,"endTime":2956.45,"body":"think in some ways, I think we"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2956.45,"endTime":2959.24,"body":"could all probably relate to"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2956.45,"endTime":2959.24,"body":"that, you know, ending kind of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2959.24,"endTime":2962.27,"body":"online meetings can sometimes"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2959.24,"endTime":2962.27,"body":"just be a bit awkward and"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2962.27,"endTime":2966.68,"body":"abrupt, as you say. But have you"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2962.27,"endTime":2966.68,"body":"had any sense of people that do"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2966.71,"endTime":2970.22,"body":"maybe feel that there's"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2966.71,"endTime":2970.22,"body":"something face to face group"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2970.25,"endTime":2973.73,"body":"does offer and that people miss"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2970.25,"endTime":2973.73,"body":"at all, and that they'll"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2973.73,"endTime":2978.2,"body":"continue to go or want to go"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2973.73,"endTime":2978.2,"body":"back to for those other reasons?"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2978.23,"endTime":2980.87,"body":"Sure. I mean, that's certainly"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2978.23,"endTime":2980.87,"body":"been coming through, and I mean,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2980.9,"endTime":2983.45,"body":"off the participants I've spoken"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2980.9,"endTime":2983.45,"body":"to and with qualitative data,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2983.45,"endTime":2985.64,"body":"you do want to use very small"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2983.45,"endTime":2985.64,"body":"samples, but still you get this"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2985.64,"endTime":2987.98,"body":"really rich data. And what"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2985.64,"endTime":2987.98,"body":"people have been talking about"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2988.01,"endTime":2990.65,"body":"is that there's a sort of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2988.01,"endTime":2990.65,"body":"intimacy and emotional"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2990.65,"endTime":2995.15,"body":"connection that's difficult to"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2990.65,"endTime":2995.15,"body":"replicate. So the knowing that"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2995.15,"endTime":2997.88,"body":"you're the same as other people"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2995.15,"endTime":2997.88,"body":"really comes across because you"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2997.88,"endTime":3000.49,"body":"might have 50 people in an"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":2997.88,"endTime":3000.49,"body":"online group and You're all"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3000.49,"endTime":3004.24,"body":"nodding and, and thinking and"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3000.49,"endTime":3004.24,"body":"saying the same sorts of things."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3004.51,"endTime":3007.96,"body":"But that kind of the richness of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3004.51,"endTime":3007.96,"body":"that emotional experience is"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3007.96,"endTime":3011.62,"body":"very difficult to replicate. And"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3007.96,"endTime":3011.62,"body":"what I'm finding, as one of the"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3011.62,"endTime":3014.14,"body":"sort of most homogenous"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3011.62,"endTime":3014.14,"body":"findings, you know, everyone's"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3014.14,"endTime":3016.57,"body":"saying the same thing is that"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3014.14,"endTime":3016.57,"body":"they actually hope in the long"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3016.57,"endTime":3021.25,"body":"term when the madness of the"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3016.57,"endTime":3021.25,"body":"pandemic actually passes is that"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3021.4,"endTime":3026.8,"body":"one of the positive legacies of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3021.4,"endTime":3026.8,"body":"the pandemic will be that online"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3026.8,"endTime":3030.07,"body":"groups can carry on not to"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3026.8,"endTime":3030.07,"body":"replace face to face groups, but"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3030.07,"endTime":3033.25,"body":"to work in conjunction with"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3030.07,"endTime":3033.25,"body":"them. So that way, they could"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3033.25,"endTime":3037.69,"body":"have that sort of intimacy and"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3033.25,"endTime":3037.69,"body":"emotional connection of being in"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3037.69,"endTime":3040.96,"body":"a room with someone and really"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3037.69,"endTime":3040.96,"body":"being able to empathise on that"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3040.96,"endTime":3044.05,"body":"level that we can, as we're"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3040.96,"endTime":3044.05,"body":"designed to do with people face"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3044.05,"endTime":3048.55,"body":"to face. But also, they can have"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3044.05,"endTime":3048.55,"body":"that accessibility of the online"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3048.55,"endTime":3052.84,"body":"groups. So it could kind of be a"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3048.55,"endTime":3052.84,"body":"win win situation. I mean, most"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3052.84,"endTime":3054.94,"body":"of us have suffered in a"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3052.84,"endTime":3054.94,"body":"pandemic. And this, this might"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3054.94,"endTime":3058.78,"body":"be the sort of silver lining to"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3054.94,"endTime":3058.78,"body":"the terrible clouds that we've"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3058.78,"endTime":3061.87,"body":"all been under. Again, it kind"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3058.78,"endTime":3061.87,"body":"of mirrors some of the things"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3061.87,"endTime":3065.08,"body":"that are going on more broadly,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3061.87,"endTime":3065.08,"body":"both in terms of maybe no"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3065.08,"endTime":3069.31,"body":"treatment services as kind of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3065.08,"endTime":3069.31,"body":"opportunities or potential for"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3069.67,"endTime":3073.96,"body":"digital online mediated"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3069.67,"endTime":3073.96,"body":"approaches to help and support"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3073.96,"endTime":3076.93,"body":"but we don't want it to replace"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3073.96,"endTime":3076.93,"body":"traditional treatment services."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3076.96,"endTime":3079.69,"body":"And similarly, you know, things"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3076.96,"endTime":3079.69,"body":"with like home working, I think"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3079.69,"endTime":3083.11,"body":"a lot of people have benefited"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3079.69,"endTime":3083.11,"body":"and seen positive to that. But"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3083.11,"endTime":3085.78,"body":"at the same time, I don't want"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3083.11,"endTime":3085.78,"body":"it to replace their kind of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3085.78,"endTime":3089.59,"body":"office and face to face contact."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3085.78,"endTime":3089.59,"body":"So it's the kind of different"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3089.62,"endTime":3092.8,"body":"ways in which they might slot in"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3089.62,"endTime":3092.8,"body":"and have pros and cons. And,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3093.04,"endTime":3095.98,"body":"yeah, so more sort of client"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3093.04,"endTime":3095.98,"body":"choice? And do you have any"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3095.98,"endTime":3099.82,"body":"final thoughts in terms of kind"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3095.98,"endTime":3099.82,"body":"of the sort of future landscape"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3099.82,"endTime":3103.84,"body":"I suppose of online based"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3099.82,"endTime":3103.84,"body":"recovery or mutual aid meetings?"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3103.84,"endTime":3107.17,"body":"I suppose it, you know, it could"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3103.84,"endTime":3107.17,"body":"be another kind of way of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3107.17,"endTime":3110.89,"body":"removing barriers, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3107.17,"endTime":3110.89,"body":"think going for the first time"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3110.89,"endTime":3115.24,"body":"to a face to face group meeting"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3110.89,"endTime":3115.24,"body":"could be quite intimidating or"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3115.24,"endTime":3118.81,"body":"scary for a lot of people what"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3115.24,"endTime":3118.81,"body":"obviously, stigma etc. Maybe"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3118.84,"endTime":3121.96,"body":"online kind of removes that"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3118.84,"endTime":3121.96,"body":"barrier a bit for some Yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3121.96,"endTime":3124.75,"body":"suppose. Because it gives people"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3121.96,"endTime":3124.75,"body":"the choice of a if they want to"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3124.75,"endTime":3127.33,"body":"attend the meetings, there were"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3124.75,"endTime":3127.33,"body":"so many meetings, but also how"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3127.33,"endTime":3129.67,"body":"involved they are, whether they"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3127.33,"endTime":3129.67,"body":"have their camera on whether"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3129.7,"endTime":3132.13,"body":"they have their camera off. So"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3129.7,"endTime":3132.13,"body":"there's that much sort of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3132.13,"endTime":3135.37,"body":"greater choice, I suppose one"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3132.13,"endTime":3135.37,"body":"thing that on a sort of more"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3135.43,"endTime":3138.16,"body":"systemic level we need to think"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3135.43,"endTime":3138.16,"body":"about is making sure that people"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3138.16,"endTime":3141.4,"body":"have the technology, we were"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3138.16,"endTime":3141.4,"body":"seeing the same thing in schools"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3141.4,"endTime":3143.95,"body":"where, you know, children are"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3141.4,"endTime":3143.95,"body":"being homeschooled, and they"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3143.95,"endTime":3146.5,"body":"don't necessarily have laptops."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3143.95,"endTime":3146.5,"body":"So I mean, there's there's one"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3146.5,"endTime":3148.99,"body":"point that I wanted to make"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3146.5,"endTime":3148.99,"body":"about that actually, I something"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3148.99,"endTime":3151.12,"body":"that didn't occur to me. But if"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3148.99,"endTime":3151.12,"body":"someone's attending one of these"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3151.12,"endTime":3154.21,"body":"groups on their phone, it really"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3151.12,"endTime":3154.21,"body":"isn't like a group meeting."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3154.57,"endTime":3157.96,"body":"Because you can't see more than"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3154.57,"endTime":3157.96,"body":"one face at a time. It's like a"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3158.2,"endTime":3161.35,"body":"video call with an individual."},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3158.2,"endTime":3161.35,"body":"And I think that the power of"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3161.35,"endTime":3165.52,"body":"groups is the connectedness that"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3161.35,"endTime":3165.52,"body":"comes with it. Like all of these"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3165.52,"endTime":3168.19,"body":"people, we have a shared story,"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3165.52,"endTime":3168.19,"body":"shared narrative, and when"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3168.19,"endTime":3170.56,"body":"you're having a single video"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3168.19,"endTime":3170.56,"body":"call, I think you really lose"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3170.56,"endTime":3174.04,"body":"that. So I suppose I think it's"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3170.56,"endTime":3174.04,"body":"a fantastic thing that online"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3174.04,"endTime":3177.1,"body":"groups could and I think should"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3174.04,"endTime":3177.1,"body":"be widely available post"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3177.1,"endTime":3179.23,"body":"pandemic, but we're gonna need"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3177.1,"endTime":3179.23,"body":"to make sure that people have"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3179.23,"endTime":3181.69,"body":"the technology to access them"},{"speaker":"Daren Lee","startTime":3179.23,"endTime":3181.69,"body":"back to say D and V."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3181.69,"endTime":3183.52,"body":"Back to Sadie and"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3181.69,"endTime":3183.52,"body":"Habib at the Institute of"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3183.52,"endTime":3186.52,"body":"alcohol studies has some"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3183.52,"endTime":3186.52,"body":"reflections on where next"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3187.36,"endTime":3188.98,"body":"Definitely,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3187.36,"endTime":3188.98,"body":"there's some good news. Some"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3188.98,"endTime":3191.35,"body":"people have cut down on their"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3188.98,"endTime":3191.35,"body":"drinking, some people have"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3191.35,"endTime":3195.55,"body":"stopped how long that carries on"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3191.35,"endTime":3195.55,"body":"for that remains to be seen. But"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3195.58,"endTime":3198.58,"body":"it's the people who are having"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3195.58,"endTime":3198.58,"body":"health facing challenges and"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3198.58,"endTime":3201.76,"body":"who's drinking has increased"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3198.58,"endTime":3201.76,"body":"that need our attention, either"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3201.76,"endTime":3205.39,"body":"now or in the future. And that's"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3201.76,"endTime":3205.39,"body":"what we're trying to do with"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3205.39,"endTime":3208.57,"body":"some of our work, I suppose"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3205.39,"endTime":3208.57,"body":"continuing to advocate for those"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3208.57,"endTime":3211.81,"body":"key policies that we know that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3208.57,"endTime":3211.81,"body":"are effective, that I'm really"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3211.81,"endTime":3215.02,"body":"being utilised in terms of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3211.81,"endTime":3215.02,"body":"pricing, availability, and"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3215.02,"endTime":3219.16,"body":"marketing, but also the need to"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3215.02,"endTime":3219.16,"body":"be able to provide support"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3219.16,"endTime":3223.15,"body":"services to individuals and"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3219.16,"endTime":3223.15,"body":"families who have really"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3223.15,"endTime":3227.2,"body":"experienced alcohol problems and"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3223.15,"endTime":3227.2,"body":"other very interlinked arms is"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3227.2,"endTime":3230.41,"body":"going to be more imperative than"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3227.2,"endTime":3230.41,"body":"ever. Yeah, the Royal College of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3230.41,"endTime":3233.77,"body":"psychiatrists are worried that"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3230.41,"endTime":3233.77,"body":"there's going to be a big surge"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3233.8,"endTime":3237.43,"body":"in post pandemic demand for our"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3233.8,"endTime":3237.43,"body":"code treatment, because people"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3237.43,"endTime":3240.82,"body":"are not seeking help at the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3237.43,"endTime":3240.82,"body":"moment. And the services are so"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3240.82,"endTime":3244.51,"body":"stretched at the moment and have"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3240.82,"endTime":3244.51,"body":"been for years, and they're not"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3244.51,"endTime":3246.97,"body":"going to be able to cope if"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3244.51,"endTime":3246.97,"body":"there's a big increase in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3246.97,"endTime":3248.83,"body":"demand. So what's going to"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3246.97,"endTime":3248.83,"body":"happen there?"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3249.31,"endTime":3251.41,"body":"absolutely, and"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3249.31,"endTime":3251.41,"body":"we've seen negative effects of"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3251.41,"endTime":3255.64,"body":"austerity for 10 years now, when"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3251.41,"endTime":3255.64,"body":"abroad reflection, I think a lot"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3255.64,"endTime":3259.06,"body":"of people are thinking about in"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3255.64,"endTime":3259.06,"body":"terms of post pandemic is, you"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3259.06,"endTime":3262.09,"body":"know, not to kind of run a"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3259.06,"endTime":3262.09,"body":"system that's operating at the"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3262.09,"endTime":3264.58,"body":"sort of bare minimum that you"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3262.09,"endTime":3264.58,"body":"know, you really want to be able"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3264.58,"endTime":3268.57,"body":"to be ready for increased demand"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3264.58,"endTime":3268.57,"body":"and really just feel for for"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3268.57,"endTime":3270.85,"body":"people at the frontline of all"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3268.57,"endTime":3270.85,"body":"of this."},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3271.06,"endTime":3274.3,"body":"You mentioned"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3271.06,"endTime":3274.3,"body":"pricing. And I think one"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3274.33,"endTime":3278.62,"body":"immediate concrete thing that"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3274.33,"endTime":3278.62,"body":"could be done is to raise the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3278.62,"endTime":3283.84,"body":"price of alcohol duty. And I"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3278.62,"endTime":3283.84,"body":"think still, you need to raise"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3283.87,"endTime":3288.01,"body":"taxes in that area, to at least"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3283.87,"endTime":3288.01,"body":"have something to fund this"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3288.04,"endTime":3291.94,"body":"potential rise in people who are"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3288.04,"endTime":3291.94,"body":"going to need alcohol treatment,"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3291.94,"endTime":3296.17,"body":"sad was saying post pandemic. So"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3291.94,"endTime":3296.17,"body":"I think it'd be very important"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3296.17,"endTime":3300.79,"body":"to for the Chancellor to raise"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3296.17,"endTime":3300.79,"body":"alcohol duties and In the long"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3300.79,"endTime":3304.66,"body":"run minimum unit pricing would"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3300.79,"endTime":3304.66,"body":"be a really good measure to"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3304.81,"endTime":3307.9,"body":"perhaps in trying to rebuild the"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3304.81,"endTime":3307.9,"body":"portrayed find some kind of"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3307.9,"endTime":3311.11,"body":"pricing parity with"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3307.9,"endTime":3311.11,"body":"supermarkets. A lot of these"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3311.11,"endTime":3313.96,"body":"measures their policies to"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3311.11,"endTime":3313.96,"body":"increase prices, whether it's"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3313.96,"endTime":3317.32,"body":"minimum pricing or raising"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3313.96,"endTime":3317.32,"body":"alcohol duty action on"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3317.35,"endTime":3320.53,"body":"marketing, having better"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3317.35,"endTime":3320.53,"body":"restrictions or reducing"},{"speaker":"Habib Kadiri","startTime":3320.53,"endTime":3321.88,"body":"availability of alcohol."},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3321.91,"endTime":3324.34,"body":"A lot of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3321.91,"endTime":3324.34,"body":"these things don't have to have"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3324.34,"endTime":3326.92,"body":"a negative impact on the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3324.34,"endTime":3326.92,"body":"hospitality trade. Some of them"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3326.95,"endTime":3329.62,"body":"like minimum pricing can"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3326.95,"endTime":3329.62,"body":"actually help pubs. So it"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3329.62,"endTime":3333.55,"body":"doesn't have to be that action"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3329.62,"endTime":3333.55,"body":"on alcohol harm, hurts the"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3333.55,"endTime":3338.14,"body":"hospitality industry is a"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3333.55,"endTime":3338.14,"body":"widening gap between prices in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3338.14,"endTime":3342.04,"body":"pubs and supermarkets has has"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3338.14,"endTime":3342.04,"body":"been that driver of harmful"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3342.04,"endTime":3345.37,"body":"consumption although it's very"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3342.04,"endTime":3345.37,"body":"hard to prove cause and effect."},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3345.37,"endTime":3348.73,"body":"I think it just makes sense in"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3345.37,"endTime":3348.73,"body":"so many ways. So I'm in favour"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3348.73,"endTime":3352.09,"body":"of kind of, as Habib says,"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3348.73,"endTime":3352.09,"body":"parity, trying to close the gap"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3352.09,"endTime":3355.72,"body":"in prices and encourage"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3352.09,"endTime":3355.72,"body":"consumption in more regulated"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3355.72,"endTime":3359.86,"body":"safer spaces and not to have"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3355.72,"endTime":3359.86,"body":"such a kind of financial"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3359.86,"endTime":3363.34,"body":"incentive to drink off trade"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3359.86,"endTime":3363.34,"body":"where as we've discussed, you"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3363.34,"endTime":3366.31,"body":"know, harms can be kind of"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3363.34,"endTime":3366.31,"body":"exacerbated, you know, just"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3366.31,"endTime":3369.13,"body":"summarising, it's just such a"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3366.31,"endTime":3369.13,"body":"complex picture and we'll be"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3369.13,"endTime":3372.46,"body":"trying to unpick it for years to"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3369.13,"endTime":3372.46,"body":"come. But certainly there's some"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3372.46,"endTime":3376.18,"body":"real causes for concern but some"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3372.46,"endTime":3376.18,"body":"opportunities that we can"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3376.21,"endTime":3380.11,"body":"capitalise on in terms of kind"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3376.21,"endTime":3380.11,"body":"of policy and maybe more to help"},{"speaker":"Dr Sadie Boniface","startTime":3380.11,"endTime":3380.98,"body":"reach out to people."},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3383.28,"endTime":3385.08,"body":"Thanks for"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3383.28,"endTime":3385.08,"body":"listening to this episode of the"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3385.08,"endTime":3388.5,"body":"alcohol problem podcast. You can"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3385.08,"endTime":3388.5,"body":"find us on Twitter and"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3388.5,"endTime":3393.09,"body":"Instagram, at alcohol podcast,"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3388.5,"endTime":3393.09,"body":"so please feel free to follow us"},{"speaker":"James Morris","startTime":3393.12,"endTime":3394.23,"body":"or get in touch there."}]}