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The Everyday Trainer Podcast
The Everyday Trainer Podcast
How Play, Community, And Clarity Transform Dog Training ft. Oscar Mora
Fear doesn’t mean stop; it usually means go. Meg sits down with trainer and coach Oscar Mora to trace the real path from a steady aerospace paycheck to a ranch built for teaching, trialing, and building a club where honest feedback and consistent reps change both dogs and handlers. We talk about the moment his wife said “it’s time,” the practical signs he watched before quitting, and how discomfort became a compass for growth rather than a reason to freeze.
From there we dive into the craft. Oscar breaks down why pet skills and sport skills speak the same language—clean markers, fair criteria, and rewards that match the dog in front of you. He lays out how to get into sport without weekly decoy access by focusing on obedience, neutrality, and structured play. We explore off-breeds in sport, what a Corso can teach a handler about patience and pressure, and how finishing something with the dog you have often builds more skill than endlessly chasing a “perfect” prospect.
Puppy selection gets specific: confidence over defensiveness, love of chase, possession, and full grips. For dogs with too much gas, he explains how to install breaks early so the dog can think under conflict—like clearing a jump with a toy screaming from behind. We get candid about social media pressure, why trainers should serve clients instead of peers, and how a culture of private, constructive critique grows people faster than public takedowns. Most importantly, we show how play isn’t just fun; it’s a system for building engagement, solving reactivity, and turning stress into skills that hold up in real life.
Stick around for details on Oscar’s upcoming course, a free newsletter that translates training videos into step-by-step takeaways, and a two-day play workshop on February 21–22 in Upland designed for pet owners and aspiring sport handlers alike. If this conversation helps you, subscribe, share with a friend, and leave a quick review—then tell us the one skill you’re training this week.
To sign up for Oscar's upcoming workshops, check out his website here.
Visit us on the website here to see what we've got going on and how you can join our pack of good dogs and owners.
Hello, hello, and welcome back to the Everyday Trainer Podcast. My name is Meg, and I am a dog trainer. Today I'm joined by the one and only Oscar Mora. We're gonna answer all of the questions you guys submitted, talk about his upcoming workshops, courses, and what he looks for in hiring dog trainers. You know the drill. Grab yourself a tasty drink and meet us back here. Hello, Oscar.
SPEAKER_03:What is going on?
SPEAKER_01:Welcome.
SPEAKER_03:Thanks for having me. Nice to be back over here.
SPEAKER_01:Back in your old facility. On the last episode that we did, we were actually talking about that the first time I was out here. I was like, When you get rid of this facility, let me know. I know.
SPEAKER_03:I thought you didn't want it because uh you guys I was I let you guys know and nobody said anything. And then like a day before I turned the key in, I was like, oh I know.
SPEAKER_01:Roel told me he's like, Yeah, this is Oscar's last week in the facility. And I was like, No, I need it. Yeah, he actually the landlord actually almost had somebody else rent it out.
SPEAKER_03:Really? He already had somebody lined up.
SPEAKER_01:He already had somebody lined up, and he's like, Yeah, because you're Oscar's person. I was like, Oh thank God. Yeah, these cool people.
SPEAKER_03:Ah, we got lucky. This is a cool space.
SPEAKER_01:It worked out. So where are you at now?
SPEAKER_03:Uh I got a place in Ontario, California. It's only about 15 minutes from here, right? Yeah, super nice property. Yeah, so uh we're building that out, and hopefully we could uh do more events over there.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, what's the plan for that?
SPEAKER_03:Honestly, uh I would love to create uh some have a school for trainers and you know build that out and you know, welcome people there and yeah, where they could learn and just get better training dogs.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it's a cool setup because you have your house in the front, and then you I feel like your property is very long. It goes far back. Uh there's like horse things there before. So you have like some nice separation between like your personal life and work, but you don't have to go very far for work.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, no, it works. I mean, I used to run uh my board and train stuff now out of my house, and it was uh literally like like what I have as uh my where I have my dogs now, that was like my whole property before.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And I would have like 25 dogs. So at your old house? At my old house, yeah. Oh my god. It was hard. It was it was not easy, but somehow we made it work, and then um, and I this was always kind of one of the dreams, you know, of having a property that I could just walk out, train my dog, go back in. So it's worked out, it's nice. Yeah, it's it. I mean, it it's expensive, but it's nice.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So give us, I know we kind of talked last time you were on the podcast. That was a couple years ago. We talked about how you got into sports. Give us a little debrief of who Oscar is and kind of how you got into this.
SPEAKER_03:Um, just a regular dude, you know, had a regular job, was in a band, and uh, and then the band was kind of coming to an end, and I wanted to get a dog. I've always loved dogs since I was a kid, but I could never have them because of uh where I grew up, no space. And so when I was ready to leave the band, I was like, all right, I think I'm gonna have some time. I have a job now, I can afford this dog, and that's what happened. I got my first dog, and I I was a little afraid that it could turn into something that I couldn't handle. And so I was like, I'm gonna learn about dog training and you know, watching Caesar Milan and uh driving by the freeway by by where the old uh the Carson field is at. I yeah, I saw them training dogs there, and I stopped by and the rest was history.
SPEAKER_01:How old were you?
SPEAKER_03:I was uh 25, probably 25. That way, just a fluke drove by the right place, the right time.
SPEAKER_01:So who was the dog?
SPEAKER_03:The my first dog. Yeah, her name was Legia. It was a it was a Connie Corso, and I put a deposit on her, and then uh after, you know, I was I started learning. I went to a dog show and I saw a bunch of Connie Corsos and I was like, holy shit, they're huge. I didn't I didn't realize how big they were. Uh and I was I got I started getting panic attacks. I didn't even know what he signed up for. I called the breeder, I was like, hey man, like you could just keep my deposit, like keep the money, like I don't care. And he was like, nah, man, like I I think you really want this and you should take it. And you know, I was like, all right, so I made it happen. And it was like one of those um, I was going transitioning from like uh, you know, you're growing up and you're gonna go from uh you know, you live with your parents into not living with your parents, and so there's like this whole transition, and and so I started getting like panic, I was I was getting like panic attacks. I was sleep, I was working night shifts, I wasn't sleeping a lot, and so everything was just in my head that I wasn't gonna be able to handle this dog, but you know, uh God's good. And he he was like, you know what, I'm gonna make this happen because he had a greater plan for my life, and I feel that he made that happen.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I feel like when I have moments like that where I'm starting to get really anxious about doing something, I'm like, you know what, never mind. I I almost like that's a sign to do it even more. Yeah, like getting this facility set up, I was very nervous about it. I was like, oh my gosh, no, yeah, I'm not gonna do it. Like it, it's it's not for us, like it's too much. Like, this is a big overhead payment for us. We're just, you know, we're fine. And I was like, no, this is gonna be such a good thing to do.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, very much like dogs, you know. Sometimes you give into the fear and you don't know what's on the other side just because you're so afraid of it. But if you could just get past that, it's like great things happen after that, you know, and it's always been like that for me. Yeah. Um, you know, every leaving my job, I was making, you know, it wasn't great. Now looking back, it wasn't great money, but to me at the time, I had insurance, you know, just all the things that they tell you you need when you when you're a kid, like, hey, you're gonna need a uh a job that pays you pretty good, where you can pay your bills, you work overtime, and you that's how you save your money. And you know, you have insurance that you don't have to pay on out of out of pocket, like those are all great things that you have. And I remember my mom telling me, like, you don't know how lucky you are to have this job and this and that. And uh I was miserable there, and leaving that job was super uh stressful, but you know what it was for me when um my my wife was like the one like hey, like I think it's time. I was like, say less. If I was like, if you're behind me on this, then I could do it, you know. And that's what happened.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Did you guys have kids at that time?
SPEAKER_03:Uh we we had Alison, yeah, at that time. She's 13 now, so she was she was a baby. And um yeah, I mean I started uh elevated 2016 and I left my job in 2018. So I was two years in when she was like, hey, I think it's I think it's time.
SPEAKER_01:How did you know that you were ready to leave your job? That's like a question that I get a lot from people.
SPEAKER_03:I I think that um, well, before that I I remember meeting like you know, trainers and they're like, Don't leave your job, you don't know. Um for me, like all the signs were there. Uh I was making, if not the same, more than what you know, uh what I was making at my regular job.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And um, when I had my kid, I was able to take some time off, and that kind of gave me a taste of like what it was gonna be like. And so, you know, that's kind of how it went by and and I I don't know if I I think I've said this story before. I don't know, maybe it's the first time I say it, but I also um I I met this uh what is it like a what do you call them? Shrink, a therapist. Yeah, anyways, I met with I was I was talking to this therapist once, or she was doing like some sort of family therapy, and uh she was also kind of like a she's kind of not a medium, but you know, a little psychic sprinkled in there, yeah, yeah, for sure. And and she asked me, she was like, uh, what do you do for work? Well, the way this all happened, like it's a longer story, but I don't I'm gonna cut it short. She was like, What do you do for work? And I was like, Oh, I work at an aerospace company. She's like, No, that's not what you do for work, you do something else. Uh and I told her, I was like, Oh, I'm getting into training dogs, you know, at the at the time I was barely starting. And she was like, All the signs are there. Like, you know, God has opened up doors for you and you know, has shown you that, you know, your your gift, and why aren't you taking it? Like, are you like what more do you need, you know? Yeah, and that kind of put like this, you know, this thing in there that I was like, oh yeah, like this is it. Yeah, you know, and then uh and then when my wife told me, she was like, I think it's time, like, you know, because obviously it's a marriage, so you know, we both have a say in this.
SPEAKER_01:You can't just quit your job and be like, hey, just quit my job.
SPEAKER_03:Nah, it doesn't work like that, and we have a kid. So uh when when all these things, I mean everything just kind of came together, and I was like, you know what, it's time to do it, you know. And and even then, like, you know, again, I was super afraid of getting this this ranch, you know. Uh my my mortgage before was$1,500. Yeah. You know, I was living good. If I if I'm gonna be quite honest, like, you know, I was pretty much training my dogs for fun and you know, working with clients here and there, but uh I become very I became very complacent. Uh and it it was I was losing my like my my love for it, you know, because I was so complacent that it was it was just not fun anymore. Uh now that I got this ranch, you know, yeah, my mortgage probably, you know, a lot more, way more. But um now it's giving me a sense of like, yeah, man, I'm back on I'm back on the grind, like back doing what I love doing and building. And so yeah, I'm excited.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it's a nice little push.
SPEAKER_03:For sure. You gotta get uncomfortable. You gotta get comfortable with getting uncomfortable.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And I have seen that from you because we've been out here for a little over a year now, and so we got to kind of see that transition. And now you have a club that you have.
SPEAKER_03:Yep.
SPEAKER_01:And tell us about that and how that's going.
SPEAKER_03:I mean, well, we were all training together, right, with Shane and Celine. I I truly like I I I enjoy it. I enjoyed hanging out and everything. Uh, but when I had uh when I got this ranch, um, I just felt like okay, I need to I need to shift a little bit into like building not just the business, but like, you know, building other people. Yeah. And uh, and I feel like this was a perfect opportunity for me to, you know, build something that's not only gonna be able to help me with the ranch, but I could help other people with their with whatever they're working on, you know, whether they want to be sport dog trainers and just you know, title their dogs, or if they want to be dog trainers and grow from it. So and for me, one of the most uh one of the things I've enjoyed the most is just like the questions that come after, you know, like hey man, when like when you were going through this, like how did you do it, or what did you feel? And one thing I come to realize we're all going through this almost the same story, right? Like we're all scared of moving forward and growing. Um and you need somebody sometimes that has gone through it to be like, hey, like trust me, you want to do this, get uncomfortable, do it. You got it, you know. Uh even even when you're feeling like you're not a very good trainer, dude, like do it. Trust me, you're better than 99.9% of the people out there that are doing it. Why are you so down on yourself? Like, do it, you know. Uh so yeah, I think that's that's been super uh cool and watching them all grow is has been great.
SPEAKER_01:They have grown so much because we will see them every now and then, like in Thomas classes. Like it's been what three months that you've been doing the club?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, three months.
SPEAKER_01:Huge improvements from when they first started to where they're at now.
SPEAKER_03:Yep. I mean, the most exciting is seeing them get motivated about it. I think that's I mean, that's to me that that's where it's at, you know. And then yeah, like some of the dogs that you know were afraid of their own shadow before now are like completely different dogs, and you're like, holy crap, like if you're just consistent and you know, you put in the work, like things really change.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I also think the community that you've built with them is really cool. Yeah, because they're all like friends, and we were kind of joking, like now you have this club of like all these dog girlies, and they're like on the swing, and like it's just it's funny to see you in that setting. But honestly, I feel like it's like, and I'm just speaking from my view, but it seems like you've grown a lot in coaching them, yeah, because I feel like they're a bit different than you know, training with like Toma or Shane or Josue, like any of those people. You're taking this these group of it's just made Oscar softer, yeah, but not in a bad way.
SPEAKER_03:I think I've always been pretty soft, uh, to a certain point. Like I told him last last week, I said, hey guys, uh, we're entering like you know, the end of uh month three, and uh I think this is the time where I start like yelling a little bit more and getting into you guys. And and really it comes down to like for me at least, when I see some potential, I get frustrated that you don't see that potential or that you don't do things to help better your uh, you know what is it, your um situation. Yeah, you know, because for example, if somebody wants to title their dog, but you don't know the routine, you have not read the rules, you had you don't even know what you're training for. It's like and it's frustrating because I'm like, you're putting all this, you're putting money, you're you're paying me to be here. It's not like you're here for free. Uh take advantage and like you know, so you can grow. So, you know, though that to me, that's where it my frustrations sometimes come from, you know. Yeah, it's like I see talent and I'm like, yo, like you can do this if you just get your shit together.
SPEAKER_01:But that's why you're so good at building people, you push people, like you Tomo wouldn't have trialed if you weren't like, nah, you can trial. He's like, No, I can't, you know.
SPEAKER_00:I I wasn't ready, and you know, you need someone in your corner that will support you and 100%. Going back to you committing to be a dog trainer or getting the bigger house, like yeah, you have a life partner that supports you, and that's huge. Yep, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I mean that that for me that I mean not many people know my wife, she kind of stays in the in the back, but she knows about everything, and and yeah, I mean, I definitely she's she's the one that kind of you know pushes me and stuff to do different things or to not do certain things that maybe I'm too eager to do, and she's like, look, keeps you in check. Yeah, but uh going back to um like even Toma, you know, I I saw something in Toma and I was like, hey man, like you don't have to be the most talented. Like if people come and hang with you and they get one thing out of whatever you're teaching them and they enjoy and they leave happy and motivated, to me, that's it's worth it. You know what I'm saying? And uh and sometimes we're just so hard on ourselves as trainers of like oh like you know, especially seeing like a social media, like, oh man, do I even know what I'm doing?
SPEAKER_01:I still feel that way.
SPEAKER_03:I didn't know what I was doing, uh, you know, looking back, and right now I sometimes still don't feel like I know what I'm doing, you know. Um, because whenever I I enter a situation, last week I entered a you know, I I had a client, it was a Chihuahua mix, and you know, I really don't train a lot of pets anymore like I used to. Um, and they're like, Oh, he's having reactivity issues. And I went to this trainer, and you know, I went to three trainers. This this last one wanted me to put a prong on, and I'm like, this dog does not need a prong. Like, I nice tiny little dog, yeah. So and I showed them how what the dog could do if the dog was super motivated, and what the dog could do just having a everyday life and putting a slip leash on them and working with them, like you know what I'm saying? Because there's those two areas, like just because you have a a pet dog doesn't mean you're gonna train him like a sport dog, and because you have you have a sport dog, you have to also train him like a pet dog, and so I have this mix of both things. But going back to this client, I was like, man, like I still I really enjoyed watching them uh work this dog. And after being like, dude, we've had three trainers, and we could not express how much more information we got in this one session with you compared to all three of them. And to me, I'm like, man, like sometimes I just need to go back to what I really enjoyed, and that's what I really enjoyed, you know? Yeah, sometimes we gotta go back to that.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Meg says that all the time. Like, you feel like kind of out of touch, and then you do a board and train, you're like, all right.
SPEAKER_01:I'm like, I'm good.
SPEAKER_00:Yep, yep, yep.
SPEAKER_01:You know, but if you're not in it all the time or if you're not doing lessons with people, like when I took a couple months off of board and trains and like doing lessons, and I was like, What am I doing with my life? Like, I don't even know. I remember I don't know anything.
SPEAKER_03:I think I met you around that time when you were going through all that stuff.
SPEAKER_01:I was very burnt out, yeah, for sure. But I had my business in Florida and it was like kind of what you had before, where we had 20 to 30 dogs at the house all the time, and I constantly had trainers in and out, and I was trying to take a break, but I wasn't able to take a break. I wasn't able to step away, which is why we ended up like coming out here. And so that was kind of my break. But I mean, there was a period where I didn't even want to do dog training anymore because I was just that burnt out from it, you know.
SPEAKER_03:I I've been there, and you know, for me it was like uh what what what got me into this? Like what what really motivated me, or you know, what did I enjoy the most? And I just even if I go back to doing a little bit of that, I I fall back in love with it. And and ultimately another thing is just having the right people around you. I can't the uh your circle of influence is so important. I feel like some people they don't pay attention to the signs that are there. Uh I know I didn't with certain people and and how much certain people can bring you down at times. Uh so having a really good group of motivated people, like that's one of the reasons like like Shane or you know Celine, like I enjoyed hanging out. Like I see everybody doing you. I, you know, Tom, I I see you guys moving forward and you know trying to do something, and and that to me is motivating, and that's why I enjoyed hanging out. I enjoyed hanging out with you guys, you know. And I feel like as dog trainers, we have to surround ourselves with people like that, like people that are gonna motivate you to want to do something that don't see you as a threat. A lot of people see other people as threats, and honestly, it's like it brings you down instead of lifting you up as a as a human. Uh, and I think that, you know, as a trainer for anybody out there listening, if you're a young trainer, like make sure you surround your people, uh surround yourself with good people, you know, it's so important.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I think it's a lot easier said than done because I definitely did not have that much of a community in Florida, and I was craving that. Like I had Minka, and I think Minka is not like the best sport dog in the world, but I think if I had better, like a better community, I would be able to take her a lot further than I have been able to. And now with Muffin, like I'm actually able to do that because I learned so much from you and Shane, and not even just like learning from you. It's like you guys are training your dogs every day. Yep. And if I show up at club and haven't trained my dog all week, you're like, oh my gosh, like this is horrible. You know, so it's motivating to see you guys like always hustling because we have to too.
SPEAKER_03:And and I'll I'll keep, I mean, like for me, like my people, like I'll keep them accountable. I'll be like, hey, uh, how many sessions did you do on this thing that we worked? A nun, I'll be like, don't talk to me right now. Like, get away from me, you know? Yeah. I I just yeah, I just feel like, you know, again, there's so much uh, you know, talent uh that if you guys just got down to doing the work, you'd be you'd be good, you know?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. No, I remember when I first got here and I was training with you in Minka and you were like, you don't even care. And I was like, oh but I didn't.
SPEAKER_00:It was true. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I didn't, you know, and you kind of like called me out on that, and I was like, oh shit, like he's right. You know, it's it's unfair for you to waste your time teaching me things when I'm not putting in the effort or you know, trying to learn on my own.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I mean, if I'm gonna be honest, like to me, it's very motivating when I see. Somebody that wants to learn. Like when Shane first started coming out with me, uh, you know, he he messaged me a bunch before and yeah, I just kind of, you know, brushed them off a little bit. And then once I saw, like, okay, like this dude's actually like he's into it. He he really wants to learn, I was like, all right, cool. And it was fun training with him and building his dog because I knew that he was taking it in, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. Um, so I I enjoy working with people, people like that, you know. And that's why for me, like the club, it's like, you know, as much as I would love to do a free club, like this is a paid membership, and I know that if they pay, they're gonna put in the work. And I told them, I said, it's gonna be a three-month commitment, at least. If you cannot commit to three months, don't even sign up. Like, we're good. And I have a long waiting list of people that are ready to come in and take your spot, you know. Uh don't that to me, that's why if you pay, you're gonna have to commit to it. And if you don't, you lost something. Like you, you're you're not gonna get your money back, you know. And at least for me, it keeps me very motivated to be like, nah, they're pay their hard hard-earned money, like I'm gonna give them my all. Not just on Mondays, but like if they send me video throughout the week or if they have any questions throughout the week, it could be about anything, you know, not even dog stuff. I I try to help out, you know what I'm saying? So yeah, to me, that's why uh I I did that club too. Yeah, those are your people.
SPEAKER_00:Like you built like a really nice small group, like good community. Yeah, man.
SPEAKER_03:I I I've I've enjoyed them. And uh yeah, so now I'm gonna open up another day on Thursdays. So for because I have a big list of people waiting to come in, and I'm like, instead of doing private lessons, I'd rather just I think I feel like this is my calling a little bit to helping other people create something, you know. Um, I started from nothing, so I feel like, and and to just be where I'm at right now, where I get to enjoy this life, I'm like, dude, this is what I want to do. I want to pour into other people that could build their businesses and their life, like kind of what you're doing with people.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, I love that. And you've built a lot of like outside of this program that you're running, you've built a lot of really solid dog trainers.
SPEAKER_03:I'd I'd like to believe that the people that have hung out with me have taken something, and I'm super proud of uh, you know, Chris Sykes, Christian, you know, the people that have worked with me and have gone on to start, you know, their their own thing. Um super proud of them. Uh even the ones that don't even talk to me anymore, uh, you know, they could they could say whatever they want, but I see it. And uh, you know, I'm happy that they got something from me. You know, whatever what whatever it is, I'm I'm glad that I could share that with them.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. What are you looking for in somebody? Like, what do you see when you're like, yes, this person has what it takes and they're gonna be a good dog trainer? Like, what are you looking for? Not just when you're looking to hire somebody, but like work with somebody.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Um, I mean, now I I'm a little older, so I could spot certain things a little faster. Um, I like hanging out with good people. Like I I truly I I enjoy hanging out with people that care about other people, care about other dogs, uh, but care about other people more first and foremost. Um, I feel like uh sometimes people get into it and they, you know, they say they they care about dogs, they don't really care about people, but I care about people that care about people because I feel that that is the you know, that is the foundation that is gonna get them to want to get better and move forward and learn more. So when it comes to training, I think that's number one.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Um it definitely really shows like obviously, like Meg going back to you like not caring about training Minka. I think a part of that, like first and foremost, is like, yeah, you're a phenomenal dog trainer and you taught us a lot, but like you're fun to hang around. Yeah. And that made a big difference. Because like in Florida, like, yeah, we would go to training, but like honestly, I went to a couple of the IGB clubs and they they were not pleasant to be with.
SPEAKER_03:And and I could be an asshole sometimes, but it it definitely, you know, uh, like I'll like even with with you, Toma. I don't know if I've done it yet, but if I if I came, you know, came at you a certain way, I would later I'll try to reach out and be like, hey, just know it came from like a good place. It wasn't from because I'm being an asshole and like trying to make you look bad in front of people or nothing like that. Like I try to make it in a funny, you know, way, but sometimes I'm being serious.
SPEAKER_00:But uh yeah, but I mean I I can be a bit but like you said, like you're stern, but it's because you care and you see the potential, right? That's different.
SPEAKER_01:When you don't say anything or like, oh no, Oscar doesn't care, you know.
SPEAKER_00:But that's very different from just like not being like a genuinely like nice person.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and you know it, and it came from uh, you know, initially, you know, you meet people and you go through experiences, and you know, I I went through experiences where I wouldn't say it was jealousy because the people had were way ahead of me, you know, but I got treated certain ways in certain places that I was like, uh damn, like I don't like I didn't I didn't think that, you know, I was like, I didn't think that was ever gonna happen, kind of thing. Like we were kind of close and you know, experiences happened and and uh I got kind of pushed away or whatever, and I'm like, oh shit. So um now whenever I feel a certain way about somebody, I I it was a it was a great experience because now I get to check myself and be like, you were once in this situation and you had people feel towards you a certain way. So make sure you get get on check, you know, check your attitude, check your ego, check everything. Um, because you know, uh that's you don't want you don't want this person to view you how you view the person that treated you a certain way. You know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_02:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:Um, and you know, it like again, I it's my circle right now, or you know, even with uh Christian, you know, he used to work with me, and then uh Lucy.
SPEAKER_01:He's all tangled out of here.
SPEAKER_03:He's all rubbing up against the couch and um but uh for example, um, you know, Christian or or even Chris, you know, they start growing and you start uh going, well, why are why are these people training with so-and-so uh with with them and not with me when you know I feel like they learn from me, type bullshit. Like that's all bullshit created in your head that you create in your head, you know, it it doesn't matter, you know what I'm saying? Like they didn't learn everything from you, they learned it other things from other places, not just from you. Uh check yourself, you know, and and and I love that I had those experiences early on because now I could go back and do that and still pour into them, even though they're doing their own thing. I could still pour into them because I know that when they get to a certain age, they're gonna look back and be like, oh, Oscar was a mentor. He was not somebody who just you know used, you know, whatever he could from us and then left us and that was it, you know. So yeah, I think it's super important uh, you know, that I had those uh those things happen to me because now I could check myself.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. What are some mistakes that you see people are making when they're trying to kind of come up in this industry?
SPEAKER_03:That's a great question. Um I would say number one is uh they focus a lot on uh how other people are viewing them, you know, like the people that don't even care about them. You know, when when it happened to me, you know, uh when I was uh first starting, I had people, I you know, I wanted uh I wanted trainers to view me as somebody that knew what they were doing and I didn't know what I was doing. And I think that that's gonna be one of the biggest roadblocks. Like know who your audience is, know who you're selling to or who you're trying to get as a client instead of like I try to I'm trying to look good for this trainer. I want other trainer. Yeah, like they don't care about you, they're not gonna pay you. So why are you why are you trying to look like look good for your client that's paying you to train their dog? Like make sure you're the best you can be for them and for their dog.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. People get really like, especially dog trainers, get really hung up on what everybody else is doing for other dog trainers and even create content for other dog trainers and all of this stuff. And I always tell like my virtual shadow students you're not creating content for other dog trainers. You're creating content for your client. And you need to focus on that person and always keep that person in mind of who is the client that I'm serving and think about conversations that you've had with somebody, tips that you told them in a training session, and that's the content that you're making. Don't worry about what everybody else is doing.
SPEAKER_03:Yep.
SPEAKER_01:Because that's not who's gonna pay your bills, honestly.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I'm trying to I try to check myself like who, all right, who am I trying to uh to motivate?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:It's you know, or who am I trying to get as a client? It's not, it usually isn't the PSA 3 competitor that's already there that I haven't been there as a PSA 3 competitor. I I've done other sports, but I haven't done PSA three. So why am I trying to appeal to this person? You know, I want to appeal to the person that has the Connie Corso that has some potential, and they don't realize that there's this potential in there. Or this person that wants to create something, uh, you know, create a future for themselves in the dog industry. I've done it. I can help them there. You know what I'm saying? So that to me, those are the things that as a trainer, we make the biggest mistakes of going, oh no, this doesn't look good. I'm not gonna post this. Well, it doesn't look good for who because 99.9% of the people out there, they're gonna think that's great. You know, they wish their dog was doing the things that your dog is doing. Yeah, you're not, you know, if I see it, I'm I might go, oh, that's cool, you know. Like it's I now get more motivated by like trainers that I feel like they're kind of new, they're not super talented, but they're out there putting out content that are that is helping people. To me, that I go, dude, like I'll send DMs to like new trainers being like, keep doing what you're doing, like whatever you're doing, like keep doing what you're doing. Like, I I love the content you're putting out. Make like stick with it, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Um, I I that's that's what I think is uh people need to focus on.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, the industry needs more of that because I remember when I first got Minka, I didn't I had no idea what I was doing with a melon wall. Like I had golden retrievers and I had a shepherd at the time, but I didn't really know anything about sport. I was just watching videos on YouTube and dog trainers courses, and every single day I would show up and post my training session with Minka. It was just something I was like, I'm training her every day. I might as well post it. And I started getting all of this hate from the trainers, from trainers and from the sport community. And it made me hate it. Like I hated recording my sessions. I I was in my head constantly thinking, oh my gosh, I know what they're gonna say. You know, my timing is off and they're gonna ask me why I don't have this tool on. And I stopped posting it. I just completely stopped posting all of my sport training because it really brought me down. And that's something that I also try to do is when people are posting that stuff and just putting themselves out there to be like, yeah, keep going, you know, because it sucks. It sucks when you're trying to learn something and everybody who's been, you know, doing it for 10 plus years is like, why are you doing this? And it's like, okay, well, obviously.
SPEAKER_03:Your marker was wrong.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I'm trying to I'm trying to learn here, you know, and I'm just sharing the the content with you guys. But I never got that from my pet clients, you know, or people who are looking to hire me as a dog trainer, they're not looking at it going, well, why did you decide to use a slip lead instead of a prong collar on that Malinois? They're like, wow, your dog like spins into heel. That's so cool. Yep, you know. So I do think that it's really important that new dog trainers focus on that and less of impressing each other.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and and if you're out there listening and you you're three years in the game, four years in the game, don't be that person. You know, don't be that person that is uh looks at other people and just is just judging on how they're doing it wrong and how it can be better. If you're gonna like me, if I if I ever feel like something could be done better, I'm for sure not gonna leave it in a comment. I'm gonna DM you, especially if you're my friend, I'll call you, I'll be like, hey, why did you do this? Or you know, what do you think about this? And I'll be like, This is my opinion on it. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, because we're not gonna agree on everything, but there's there's ways of of doing things uh where you're not gonna put somebody else down. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Uh and and I'm not trying to act like this saint here, like I've never done that. I've talked mad shit before. You know, I'm a human, I'm a human, and I and I've been there and I've and I've talked especially. That's why I say like three or four or five year, where you feel like you know it, like you know what you're doing. Because the longer you're there, the longer you'd be like, oh man, like I don't really know that much. You know what I'm saying? I still have that where I don't really know that much. But when for whatever reason, when you're in this three-year, four-year mark and you're training with somebody that has it going on or whatever, you feel like they are, you know, God walking on water, and uh you're gonna, you know, you feel like you already know everything and you start judging all these other people because they're not doing it the way that you're doing it. Like, check yourself, you know what I'm saying? Like it just know that your words have uh power and that you could be killing somebody else's uh, you know, you could be dimming somebody else's light, and you don't know the damage that you're doing there sometimes. So yeah, check yourself.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. What advice would you give to people who maybe aren't just looking to become dog trainers but are looking to get into sport?
SPEAKER_03:So if if you're looking to get into sport, obviously follow me. Uh follow my content. Uh join the community. You know, make sure you subscribe. Yeah, join the community. I have a course coming out, and I'll just play. Um, I would say uh look for people that are motivating in whatever area the sport you want to play in. Uh find people around you that are that are doing it. You know, one good thing about LA is we have a pretty good culture of like dog trainers. And I'd like to, you know, take some credit because I feel like all the people that have worked with me have really good like you know vibes around them. Like you're gonna be able to come learn, train, and you're gonna leave leaving happy, you know, whether it be Chris Sykes, whether it be Shane, Christian, Toma now doing his thing, you know, you guys like I feel like we've created like this little nice community here in LA. But if you don't have that out in the middle of nowhere, um, which most people don't, I would say uh if you could find a club or if you can't, then online communities are great. You know what I'm saying? Um I have I have people that come here from Arizona, from Texas, you know, even though it, you know, like Texas, she'll probably, you know, message me, you know, a couple times a month, sending me video review and whatnot. Like sometimes you just don't have the resources, you know. Uh, but if you can get out into a club once once a once a month, better than nothing, you know. Also, if you can create it, like if you could start it, you might not have a decoy, but you might be able to gather some people around and fly somebody in to help you guys out. You guys could create this community yourselves and start from there.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And I think something that I thought I thought I needed to do bite work all the time in the beginning. And so I was kind of in this mentality, especially with Minka, I didn't really have a good helper where I was at. And he would come in from like overseas like once every three months. And so I was like, Oh, well, I can't do anything because I don't have a a helper every week. But so much of sport, especially PSA, is obedience.
SPEAKER_03:A lot of it is, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And I feel like most people need help with obedience.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and I mean it depends on the dog too, you know. Some dogs, some some dogs have it going on and they're gonna freaking bite no matter what. Uh, those need a lot of obedience, and then you have other dogs that need to be built a little bit and need a little bit different things. So every dog is different, but yeah.
SPEAKER_00:I I got access to more decoys now than ever before, and dog hardly gets any bites.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, we never do we never do bites.
SPEAKER_00:But I guess like going back to your point is there's a lot you could do without a decoy, just like neutrality-wise, with like a sleeve on the floor. Oh, yeah. And now more than ever, there's like all this information paid.
SPEAKER_01:So many courses, so many communities.
SPEAKER_00:It's available.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I when I was starting, I had Michael Ellis uh Learberg videos, and uh, and that was pretty much it. Uh, you know, little by little we started getting a little content here and there online, but for the most part, it was Mike. Like I I, you know, I grew up with dogs on Michael Ellis stuff, you know. Yeah, and I mean those videos are great. They're still great, you know. Back back then and and today is still great.
SPEAKER_00:But now you you you can choose, you got a whole roster of people that produce content, and you can choose who teaches you for sure.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and I think it's also important to take advice from people whose dogs you like.
SPEAKER_03:Yep. You know, I agree.
SPEAKER_01:That's one thing about you. Your dogs look very nice. They're all right. You're doing the things.
SPEAKER_03:They're all right. I've done it for a little bit, you know.
SPEAKER_00:Oscar's humble.
SPEAKER_03:His dogs are. I've done it for a little bit. Um, I had like my honestly, like the the Corso stuff to me is like it was challenging, you know, doing it with the Corso. Luckily, I had Larry uh Hansen helping me and you know, pumping me up. And I had a club at the time that was helping me out. And uh, but yeah, it was tough with a corso.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, talk about that. Talk about the difference with you know, doing sport with an off-breed versus Malinois.
SPEAKER_03:Well, what one good thing, uh, you know, and most people will tell you, like, be realistic, like know what you're know what you have. And to a certain extent, I agree. I was uh unrealistic about what my dog could do, and we hit some goals. They weren't the goals that we wanted to hit, but we hit some goals. So it's okay to dream big and not hit and miss by a little bit, you know. But if I feel like uh, you know, when you go in with a dog like that, that's fine. Like, you know, you you might not, you know, work with somebody that will keep you motivated enough that you want to keep working. The dog's gonna get better, you know. It's gonna you might not get to this high level of sport, but you're gonna get to this point where you're like, holy crap, I didn't think we were gonna get here. You know what I mean? And that's what happened to me with the Corso. That it was like, I was like, I'm gonna be have the first Corso that does French ring three, Mondial Ring three, IGP three, and you know, triple crown, and and I still don't even have that with a Malinwa. Yeah, but you know, at least I got I was the first one to have a Mondio Ring one Connie Corso in the US. That's you know, it was that was pretty big.
SPEAKER_01:That's very impressive.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so you know what I'm saying, and uh, and so to me it was but uh but it really started because I really had uh love for the breed. I really loved the breed that I was so if you have a passion uh you know because of the breed, I think it's good that you pour into it. And then later on, once you because my I feel like my skills definitely were got better because I was working with this dog and I learned so much with this dog. Uh the things that I learned are things that you know I preach now, you know, like the dog pushing you to work instead of you begging the dog to work because I felt I needed to beg the dog to work because he wasn't a Malin Wall. But in reality, I just hindered his progression by trying to help him so much that I didn't let him push me, you know, to want to work. And so those little things are the things that you know have made me a way better uh trainer and handler.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Do you feel that sometimes people get hung up on having the perfect dog or like washing dogs too often?
SPEAKER_03:Um, I I feel like uh I mean that that's gonna happen uh especially like for me. I s I now I I get like I I choose dogs, like I go, okay. This is my personal dog. This is gonna be my sport dog. Um, and I'm known for washing dogs. But one thing I can tell you is that uh most of the dogs that I wash go on to do really good things.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:In sport or just like really good house dogs, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Um, I love training puppies. I have a passion for it. Uh for people if you're just learning, I feel like it's one of those things that if you don't wash the dog, you're gonna see this potential that could that that happens with the work that you put in to the dog. You know what I'm saying? What do you mean? Like, for example, if Toma would have given up on his dog because of the issues that he had, it wouldn't have made him the trainer that he is today. Yeah, he's become uh a much better trainer, maybe more patient trainer, maybe more um, you know, there's there's a lot of things that you could become by working with a dog that has a lot of issues or issues that you need to overcome. It just makes you that much better because you're gonna add that many more tools to your toolbox. Oh, I've seen that before, I'm gonna work it this way. Oh, I've seen this before, I'm gonna work it this way. Uh, because not every dog is gonna get worked exactly the same. And when you have a dog like a corso where you're like, oh man, I can't do like the force, the force fetch thing is not working with this dog like it worked with this dog because this dog's super sensitive and handler sensitive. I'm gonna have to uh do a motivational, more motivational retrieve with this dog, you know, and maybe I could input a little bit of uh pressure here, but the dog needs to be in this state of mind before I could add pressure. I can't add pressure when the dog is in low drive. I gotta bring him up so high so I could add pressure so that so that there's a balance. So there's a lot of things that you can work and train and learn from a dog that like that. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, that makes sense.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, for sure. I also feel like uh I I see this with Muffin. She's you know a backyard bred dog. She wasn't bred for sport necessarily. So I can't really skip steps with her, you know. But because I don't skip steps with her, when I see somebody else who's working on similar things, I can go back. Oh, I did that step. So you need to start right here. Whereas if I had a dog that I could skip steps, I don't know the steps, the steps that I necessarily skipped, and I can't help people work through those, you know.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and I think that uh I mean, there's there's just so many ways of getting one thing done. And I mean, as easy as like the focus heel. Like I used to do the touchpad thing, and I might go back and do it again at some point. The last three dogs, I haven't done it. Yeah, you know, uh that's just I mean, that's just how I yeah, how I'm I'm learning or whatever. But there's gonna be a dog that's gonna come that it's not working with the method that I'm using right now, and I'm gonna go go back to the touchpad, work on re-rend awareness. You know what I mean? Yeah, so there's a lot of things that you know because you've done that in the past, because I've done it in the past. It's a step that like you know you can always go back to with any dog, and sometimes I'll go back and I and or or I'll I'll start doing something and I'll be like, I used to do this. Why did I stop doing this before? You know what I mean? Like, why did I stop doing this? Like this worked really good for me. Why did I stop doing it? Because I have been doing it, like I'm in that OG status, about to get to that unk status. And so, like, there's a lot of things that I've done where I can go back and uh and you know, you could, yeah, you sometimes you forget that you did certain things, you know? Yeah, but that's why I love working dogs. So when you talk about washing dogs, I feel like uh it's fine if you're in it for the love of the sport or whatever, but I see a problem when people are washing dogs and because they want this high-level dog, but they've never even done it with any dog. Yeah, it's like nah, learn with that one that you have right now, and then once you've done something with that dog, go ahead and get your prospect for high high-level sport. But most people think they already know when they haven't even gotten a dog to level one.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah. I mean, you can relate to that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it's super valid. I think, like you said, washing a dog would get bad stigma from like a lot of people who just wash dogs but they haven't accomplished anything. Like, first and foremost, like better yourself as a trainer, and then maybe then you can make that decision.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, or like, or or or yeah, I mean, I used I want a dog that I could take to the world championship. It's like, bro, you haven't even done it at the club level. Like, what are you talking about, bro?
SPEAKER_00:Literally, yeah, and and there'll be people that wash several dogs and they've never accomplished anything.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, or they'll they'll judge a dog a certain way, and you know, they'll be like, This dog is this and that and this and that, and it's like, nah, bro, your skill is just not there. You know, I I hate to break it to you because some of these dogs will go on to do great things with somebody else that poured into them, you know. Some if you don't pour into the dog, you always think it's greener on the other side, but somehow this dog ends up with somebody and they end up doing great things.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and you you can have a dog that um quote unquote doesn't have the best genetics and gaslight them into believing that they're like an amazing dog. For sure. And on the flip side, a dog like mine that maybe redirects a little bit, you can still work through that.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so yeah, and luckily, I mean, luckily the dog that you got ended up with you, and you're a nice guy, because uh some people would have would have not been able to deal with that type of stuff. You know what I'm saying? For sure. Um, so I I definitely think that uh, you know, I think that dogs end up in our hands for a certain reason, and uh instead of avoiding the growth that you can get from that dog, uh, you know, just go go through with it.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, or we we were even talking because Thomas looking to get another sport dog, you're kind of having the conversation of, you know, take your time and be picky with your next dog, you know. And we were talking about this yesterday. You're not really in a rush. You have hawk, you're learning with hawk, you're getting the reps in. Everything that you learn with hawk, you're gonna be able to take and use with your next dog. Yep. There's no rush. Like you get to be picky about the next dog, and you also kind of know what to look for.
SPEAKER_03:At least you think you know, you know what I'm saying? We think we think we know, but it's freaking hard. But yeah, I I definitely uh I feel like you know, you already got your your pet, your your dog that you, you know, you learned with and everything. Yeah, you can be picky on the next one, you know. Yeah, you could look at certain things that you enjoy that you like and be like, all right, this is the one I'm gonna take. Don't go to uh uh judge a litter that the first opportunity. Yeah, yeah. Or you know, or somebody's giving you a free dog and all of a sudden you think that they're hooking you up. It's like, nah, bro, like it might not be the dog for you. Toma and I went last week to go look at a litter and it was not good.
SPEAKER_01:That's what I'm saying. Okay, so this leads us into our next question, which what qualities are you looking for when it comes to selecting a working dog?
SPEAKER_03:Uh I first and foremost enjoy a dog that is uh confident, doesn't care, doesn't get bothered by much. Uh then after that, I want a dog that loves to chase, that has a lot of prey, and loves to bite. I mean, good grips. I think grips are genetic.
SPEAKER_01:And do you know right away now?
SPEAKER_03:Like as a big thing.
SPEAKER_01:Like with your experience, like when you see a dog, you're like, uh, okay.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Yes, I I could see a dog now and be like, this dude has it going on, you know?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Uh right away. Or or right away I could see little quirks that I don't like. You know, I I I am not a big fan of a dog that you know gets real defensive, barking at everything and hackles up and all that. I hate that. A little bit of insecurity. Yeah, I I hate that. Um, I I want a dog that's super confident, you know. Like when I saw Galan, I worked them the first couple sessions, I was like, this dude got it going on, you know. Yeah, it's just and he makes it easy, it's almost like cheating. I mean, I'll if I'm gonna be honest with you, like, yeah, I've learned a lot and I know how to train a dog, but when you get a dog like that, it's just it's almost like cheating, it just happens so easy.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:So so you said confidence, uh not defensive, a lot of prey.
SPEAKER_03:Yep, and possessive loves to bite and hold and just carry.
SPEAKER_00:I I thought, like with Hawk, I saw a dog with tons of drive. My previous shepherd didn't have as much drive, but you don't necessarily want too much drive either.
SPEAKER_03:Well, I think that when you have a dog like that and it has so much gas, you know that it's gonna require some breaks. Yes, and you'd rather put that earlier than later. Uh so you now that I've been through it and I know the dogs, I go, okay, uh, this dog is gonna require um for me to create some stability very early on. You know, I mean we have a puppy right now that Logan and I, he's my my new apprentice that we're working, and right away I told him, I said, hey man, like stability with this dog is gonna be huge. He's so frantic in certain things that you need to create stability. Uh, that's another thing that once you know certain dogs, certain lines, you go, you know, uh, I'll give you a quick example. There was a dog that I used to own. Um, and when I got this dog, he's a Malinwa puppy, K and PV lines, and kind of slow maturing, and I was like, I don't like this dude. Like, like he's just not giving me like that nice snappiness that I like from a puppy. Uh, and then all of a sudden he turned out my uh my friend Jessica owns him. He turned out to be this freaking monster of a dog, like amped up, you know. And you're like, Yeah, I should have not tried to build more drive with this dog, I should have just kept him nice, calm, collected, the way that he was as a puppy instead of trying to build up his drive. Uh, because I now I feel too much. I now I see what he turned into. And not just him, but the some of the other dogs in the litter. And so when you start seeing things like that, and you see the dad, you see the mom, and you go, Oh, that's what it could turn into. Oh shoot. Let me uh, you know, it's super important to go back and look at that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_01:Some people have the mentality that they don't want to put any sort of control on dogs under like a year old.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, uh, I mean, that's that's like a I it's I think it's like one of those things that it's gotten passed on for uh you know for years and years and years that just because so and so said it and like that's Bible, like that's what it is or whatever. And yeah, and I think that you know, there's that rules are not always like that, you know. Uh I feel like for me at least with with Galan, I knew what his dad was, and when I saw him, and I knew what the mom was. So when I saw him, I said, no, okay, if I another thing too is like just because you put structure and rules to a dog doesn't mean that I'm gonna be beating my dog. Yeah, it doesn't mean that I'm gonna be teaching it in a way that suppresses the dog, it's just gonna teach him more skills. If I'm teaching him to, hey, you can't I have food in my hand, you can't be biting my hand. Yeah, and I pay him when he backs away, and he learns that when I have a closed fist, he backs away. Like that, I'm not killing his drive. I'm I'm uh how can I say it? I'm guiding everything, you know what I'm saying? I'm shaping everything, teaching him. Yeah, I'm teaching him. Literally though, because like in drive, like Hawk's thoughts go out the door, you know. It's a different dog. I mean, it it could be as easy as uh yesterday I was working the jump with Galan. And then I I send him to a uh place, right? And then I throw a toy that's out there uh by him, and the jump is on this side. He's thinking about the toy, so when he's gonna jump, when I send him to jump, he crashes the jump, right? And I can go, no, like he's being an asshole. He doesn't, you know, he he knows what he's supposed to be. No, he's not even thinking about the jump, he's thinking about that toy back there. So it's a skill that I have to teach him. Like, hey, even though that toy is there, you have to focus on this jump. So how do you do it? Well, maybe I break it down a little bit, maybe I lower the jump so he focuses and he gets paid and he learns that, oh, when I clear this, is how we get so there's a lot of things that you're gonna do with your training, uh, where you're gonna switch up and you're gonna have to also be, how can I say it, uh have some, not not not empathy, like uh, you know, uh give some grace to your dog, you know, being like, hey, like I know that you didn't want to hit this thing, but you weren't even thinking because you want that ball so bad. So now that you know, when you have a Malin Wall, that's why those are the hard things that you have to work through. And where you teach them skills of like, hey, you have to work away from this ball when you know, and still do what I'm asking you to do over here on this side, even though you, you know, that's over there. So I think that's the fun part for me, you know. And they're like, uh, you know, I corrected him when he hit the jump. I'm like, no, and they're like, Oh, he he uh he he jumped too early. I'm like, well, he jumped too early because he's he's his brain is not thinking, and it's unvol it's involuntary. It's not like he's like, I'm gonna be an asshole and crash this jump, you know? For sure. So, anyways, I don't even know what the question was, but yeah.
SPEAKER_00:We're talking about puppy selection. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And like putting control on them. The reason why I brought that up is something that I really like about your training is you hold your dogs to very high standards. I think part of that is because you have the skill and you're able to, but people kind of treat their dogs like they're dumb. Right. And I have a friend who got a mal the same time that I got muffin, and I have put a lot of control on muffin since a very early age because I see her and I know that I need to put control on her. And she's like nine months now, and I do. I have a lot of control on her, but I learned that from you and Shane. And even I don't do that much bitework with her because I don't need to. Like most of what I do with her is neutrality.
SPEAKER_02:Yep.
SPEAKER_01:And my friend hasn't put any skills or control on her mal, and it's very similar to Muffin. Yeah. And seeing the difference, but she's in the camp of, you know, the people that she works with are like, just flat collar your dog, like let them be unhinged, like no control, no obedience until at least after a year. And I'm like, oh my gosh, that's that's gotta be so much harder for you when you do start to try to put control on, or you know, the dog is just biting at her arms and biting everywhere but the tug. And I'm like, hey, this is gonna be a problem if you don't address this now. You know, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I I feel like if the dog has gotten uh, you know, that that this is why I disagree with stuff like that. It's because later on you end up having to be harder on the dog because they've gotten rewarded for certain behaviors for so much that all of a sudden you're trying to switch the script and they're like, yo, and and and and and not every trainer, there's some trainers that know how to, you know, work with the dog. They could do that for a year and work with the dog and teach them the right way. So, you know, not the same rules apply. But from what I have seen is that there's more conflict. The way I see it is if I have a if I have two young kids that are being raised to be boxers, one of them you just let them be crazy, let them be out in the street, you know, fighting all the time, or one of them you teach them discipline, you teach them the skills, you teach them how to throw a jab, you teach them how to the footwork, you teach them every to me, he's gonna get to competition a lot faster than the other dog. You know what I'm I mean, than the other kid. You know what I'm saying? So to me, but that's kind of how I how I relate it. You know, now this is considering that the that the the the kid has the genetic for this thing. The dog has the genetic to do this work. You know what I'm saying? I'm not gonna out my dog and teach my dog all kinds of boundaries when when it's when it's Ezra and he's a corso. I know that it's different. I know that the the path to success with him is gonna be different. I don't even want to do bite work with him right now because I know that it's gonna be different. He works differently than my Malin Wall. You know, I want him to be a little more serious. I'm gonna teach him differently. So and and it's experience too, you know. Now that I I know what I have, I know what I want. Like in the heel, mate with uh with my Malin Wall, I want way more precision. With him, I just want the right attitude. I want him to just be excited to want to work, and then I can mold that, you know. So every dog is different, every dog's gonna teach you something different, and that's why we don't just get rid of dogs.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. No, muffin, muffin is gonna teach me a lot.
SPEAKER_03:Muffin is gonna teach you how to like uh not be so, oh my dog's good. Oh, he's a golden retriever that I have here laying down. Uh Muffin is Muffin's gonna teach you that because Muffin definitely, especially after those two sessions that we did with the muzzle, is gonna be a little more serious. And so I think that uh, you know, with every dog comes new challenges, and I think that she's gonna give you some challenges with certain things, but the way you're going and with the people that you have on your side, I think you'll be all right.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Oh, muffin. Thank God she's little. I don't know. I could never have a big mouth.
SPEAKER_03:You see her try to bite my lip?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Like imagine if she was big, I wouldn't be able to hold her back. Yeah, I know.
SPEAKER_03:And then I corrected her. I go, no, she just looks at me like nah, bruh. I don't care. I don't care. Try again.
SPEAKER_01:Um, okay. What do you find is the most rewarding part of dog training?
SPEAKER_03:The most rewarding part of dog training is I like watching people win. I mean, that's just when it comes like when I see, like I said, when I like people that are that aren't able to do something with their dog, and all of a sudden the dog's doing it and how happy they are and excited they are, like, to me that's everything, you know. And it comes back to the initial well when I first started taking people on, not as a client, but just to try to help people in dog training. I've said this story before. I think we said it on the last one, you know, the lady that had some uh she she was kind of handicapped and uh she couldn't she could never take her big corso out. And I remember we got to the park and my dumb ass was like, cut them loose, and cut them loose with my dogs. But they all got along and they all started, you know, playing and everything. And I turned back and she's over there bawling her eyes out because she had never seen her dog with other dogs. And to me, I was like, that's it right there. Like, yeah, it brought it brought like these feelings of like, oh, this is it right here, you know. Uh, and I chased that, you know. I I try to chase that a little bit, especially when it comes to like uh pet dog stuff, uh people that have not been able to do something with their dog, and all and if we can get something make something happen, I I like that.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah. Well, tell us what you've got going on and how the people can learn from you.
SPEAKER_03:Um, we have a course coming out uh soon, probably early January. Uh we already have everything all built out, ready to go. Uh that's more like I had Galan, Moses, and Guapo, and I kind of showed the process of like a puppy, a young dog, and then my older dog. Uh I shot that with the help of my friend Robert Cabral. He was like asking me questions and we kind of did it together.
SPEAKER_01:Nice.
SPEAKER_03:Uh and so uh that's gonna be coming out. Uh, I'm excited for that.
SPEAKER_01:Who's that for?
SPEAKER_03:Uh so that's for people, I mean, everybody really that wants to do more with their dogs than just you know the basic pet obedience. This is more like competition type stuff. Uh, but I think that anybody could follow it. Uh and whatever breed you have, you can, you know, you can learn something from it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Uh it's not super, uh, how can I say super broken down where it's gonna be super difficult? It's pretty easy. I try to, you know, the way I did it was more like um, I don't know all this fancy dog trainer talk. Like I don't have all these, you know, all these fancy terms, and this is pretty basic, but I feel like it's so basic that it's gonna be easy for everybody to follow. Yes. You know, so I'm excited for that. Uh I have a newsletter that just came out. I just launched that. Uh so you guys can go to my page, check it out, and sign up for that. I have I'm surprised at how good some of this content is coming out uh from for this newsletter because it's somebody helping me do it, but all they're doing is taking my videos and dissecting them and turning them into like uh You're like, Oh my gosh, who said this?
SPEAKER_01:This is good. It was really good.
SPEAKER_03:And then the the charts and everything. And I'm like, yeah, that's it. I'm like, that like it looks great. Like, who does this? It's probably AI or something. But you know, and this person's charging me for now. It's like, but uh, you know, they're they're putting in the work. But uh, yeah, but yeah, I think that again, when I read it, I go, I wish I had this when I was starting off. And I'm giving this for free, so I'm really excited for that. So if you guys check out my page, you'll get that. And then um what else? What else? What else?
SPEAKER_01:Workshop February.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I'm excited for that. Yeah. Um, it's gonna be a play, just so many things could be solved by teaching your dog how to play. It's such a big thing in my program. Uh, it's not my system, I think that anybody everybody knows, but just we learn the most when we're playing.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:As humans, and no different to dogs, you know. When you're playing soccer and you know you're learning, there's there's just no other way to learn than when you're playing. And so uh I'm excited because I've had dogs that were not engaged and didn't care about playing, and all of a sudden they're just crazy for it, you know. Uh, and I would love to show people some of the things that you can do to better your play with your dog. It goes way more than just you having a play session, it just goes into your everyday life, your obedience, how much your obedience could get better, your engagement with your dog, where now they care about you more than they care about everything else that's going on away from them. Uh so yeah, I'm excited. February 22nd.
SPEAKER_01:21st and 22nd.
SPEAKER_03:21st and 22nd here in Upland. Um, so yeah, I'm excited. And thank you for helping me put it all together. And of course, yeah, and she's gonna get me an order so that we could have some charts or something. Be a little organized, be a little organized.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I will say something that I have learned from you is as dog trainers, we're all kind of spewing the marker words and timing and all of this, but you break it down and you are very precise about your communication. And me and Toma have become a million times better dog trainers just from working with you and learning how you train. And that's what I think people are gonna get the biggest takeaway from. Yep, is actually seeing how we take these concepts that we're all just regurgitating from other dog trainers and actually put it into our training in a way that we know the behaviors that we're marking. Yep. You know, something that I see all the time is just yesing and not knowing what you're yesing or not like not even knowing the behavior that you're trying to mark. You know, we all know what a marker word is, but like let's actually put that into practice. So yeah, I think it'll be really cool for people to see how you do that.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think in any relationship, communication is super important and it's no different with our dogs. Yeah. I think that communicating with our dogs the correct way uh is only gonna, you know, better everything that you do with your dog. Yeah. Uh, you know, and it not just marker words, but touch, you know, the way you play with your dog. What does he, you know, when you push him a certain way, what does that mean? You know, uh, because you every dog is different and it is our job to figure out what that dog enjoys. And so, yeah, I think that, you know, I think that it's gonna be very enlightening to some people of how much they can do through play. Because another thing is, you know, if your dog wants to go play, but you're trying to shove food down their throat, like it doesn't fulfill the same needs.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:But if you even with food learn how to play, now you're fulfilling something different. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. And so I think that uh I think, yeah, I think it's gonna be fun. I think it's gonna be a lot of fun, and we're gonna I'm looking forward to it.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and that one is open to everybody, pet parents, dog owners, people who are looking to getting to sport, pretty much anybody can benefit from play.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I just uh you know, now I'm you know, I post my mouths a lot and everything, but I initially started with dogs that did not have it going on like that, you know. And and so I, you know, anybody that's out there that has a you have a shelter dog, you know, and you want to do something more with it, you can do it. You know, if you have a uh you can have a a dog that you know just you feel like is not, you know, doesn't have the genetic makeup, I guarantee it that we could bring something out of that dog. If you have a shy dog, yeah, you might not be able to notice change in two days or whatever, but if you learn how to play with this dog in the next month, it's gonna be a completely different dog, you know. So uh yeah, play changes everything.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and it helps you work through reactivity and everything, insecurity. I mean, the most common question that I get is how do I build an insecure dog? How do I build confidence in a dog? Play.
SPEAKER_03:Play. Yeah, I and I'll I'll give one uh, you know, I have had dogs that Galan, Galan wasn't very fond of people, just like he wasn't a dog that you could just pet. And I saw that early on. And through playing with him and learning how to play with him and keeping him on leash and having other people play with him and letting him win, all of a sudden I could just walk him out in front of everybody and he doesn't care about people. He'll take their tug, want them to pay uh, you know, pet him, play with him. But it all came through play. Yeah, it wasn't it didn't come through somebody feeding him food, it came through play.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, super powerful. Well, thank you so much, Oscar. We will post all of the details to his seminar in the show notes. Is there anything else you want to add?
SPEAKER_03:Um, stay motivated, enjoy your dog, and uh have a blessed uh rest of the week.
SPEAKER_01:Have a blessed rest of the week. All right, God bless you guys. Thank you so much for being here. Thanks, Meg.
SPEAKER_03:Thanks, Toma.
SPEAKER_01:We'll see you all next week. Peace.