Prepare to blast off into a realm of shadow and light, truth and theory, with the ever-insightful Victoria Fraser, whose voice rings familiar from "I Like Your Dress" and soon will charm the board game world with "Borgame Bitch." Amidst a cosmic swirl of Cuban rum and raspberry sour beer, we navigate the labyrinth of the Apollo 11 moon landing conspiracy theories. Victoria, with her unique blend of podcasting prowess and film savvy, offers a fresh lens through which to scrutinize the whispers of deceit that have clung to mankind's giant leap for over fifty years.
As we orbit around the monumental achievement of Apollo 11, we dissect the mathematical probabilities of keeping a hoax of such magnitude under wraps. The conversation is a journey through the stars and back in time as we revisit the Cold War's space race, the remarkable 400,000 individuals behind the mission, and the swirling vortex of cultural impacts that have kept conspiracy theorists' minds ablaze. Victoria cleverly juxtaposes the intricacies of film production with the alleged involvement of cinematic legend Stanley Kubrick, untangling the threads of fact and fiction with the skill of a seasoned storyteller.
Our lunar sojourn culminates in a dance with the shadows, where we parse the clues and Easter eggs that believers in the conspiracy point to as proof of the moon landing's fabrication. From CIA whispers to the Watergate scandal, and a detour through Kubrick's "The Shining," we journey through the psychological and sociological impact of the moon landing. Victoria's grounded insights remind us to revel in the art of questioning, to sip thoughtfully from the well of history, and to embrace the relentless human quest for truth. Join us for a podcast episode that traverses the cosmos of curiosity and brings us back to Earth more enriched for the voyage.
Prepare to blast off into a realm of shadow and light, truth and theory, with the ever-insightful Victoria Fraser, whose voice rings familiar from "I Like Your Dress" and soon will charm the board game world with "Borgame Bitch." Amidst a cosmic swirl of Cuban rum and raspberry sour beer, we navigate the labyrinth of the Apollo 11 moon landing conspiracy theories. Victoria, with her unique blend of podcasting prowess and film savvy, offers a fresh lens through which to scrutinize the whispers of deceit that have clung to mankind's giant leap for over fifty years.
As we orbit around the monumental achievement of Apollo 11, we dissect the mathematical probabilities of keeping a hoax of such magnitude under wraps. The conversation is a journey through the stars and back in time as we revisit the Cold War's space race, the remarkable 400,000 individuals behind the mission, and the swirling vortex of cultural impacts that have kept conspiracy theorists' minds ablaze. Victoria cleverly juxtaposes the intricacies of film production with the alleged involvement of cinematic legend Stanley Kubrick, untangling the threads of fact and fiction with the skill of a seasoned storyteller.
Our lunar sojourn culminates in a dance with the shadows, where we parse the clues and Easter eggs that believers in the conspiracy point to as proof of the moon landing's fabrication. From CIA whispers to the Watergate scandal, and a detour through Kubrick's "The Shining," we journey through the psychological and sociological impact of the moon landing. Victoria's grounded insights remind us to revel in the art of questioning, to sip thoughtfully from the well of history, and to embrace the relentless human quest for truth. Join us for a podcast episode that traverses the cosmos of curiosity and brings us back to Earth more enriched for the voyage.
Welcome to Drunkins' Fork Seat.
Speaker 1:Welcome back to another episode of Drunkins' Fork Seats podcast. Tonight's guest is Victoria Fraser. How you doing tonight?
Speaker 2:Hello, I'm lovely. How are you?
Speaker 1:I'm doing very well. Tell my listeners a little about yourself.
Speaker 2:So my name is Victoria. I am a freelance writer and podcast writer, so I worked on shows, doing their show notes or editing as an audio editor Behind the scenes kind of work as well, social media promotion All that fun stuff. I started my own podcast with a friend of mine about two years ago called I Like your Dress. I'm just kind of loosely involved with that now, just producing it, no longer a host on the show, launching a new show called Borgame Bitch. So if you like Borgames, that'll be one that will be in existence in hopefully a couple weeks. And yes, so I have some experience sort of professionally, and it's also just like an interest that I love. So in my spare time I try and reach out to other podcasts to collaborate and do fun shit like this. So I'm excited to see what we get into today.
Speaker 1:Very cool, very excited to have you. So how big into conspiracies are you?
Speaker 2:So I just moved, but I used to live with the two very big fans. They believe everything. Well, they believe in anything. I believe in a lot less of them, so we had some very interesting conversations while I was living. Them Shout out to Shannon and Vanessa. They're probably gonna be like I don't know if I'll send this folks. They're gonna disagree with me. I let them though, but yeah, they were really into conspiracies, so I learned a lot. Also, just in my own curiosity, I exposed to them, and they've really this year especially with the election and stuff gotten off the rails a little bit. But yeah, I find it very interesting and I enjoy the entertainment value, though I don't believe in many of them.
Speaker 1:Okay, do you keep an open mind though?
Speaker 2:Oh for sure. Yeah, I'll take. If I hear it, I will look into it. And then I like do the research myself, because I don't trust all of my stuff. The first source is always like, depending on where it is. But I like to look into it. I don't just like badmouth it right away, unless it is just completely off the wall where you're like okay, come on, Depending on the thing. Yeah, the earth is definitely round.
Speaker 1:I feel like that's 1400 conspiracy theories.
Speaker 2:Come on, let's get with the program.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, no, like some I believe, some I don't believe. I'm definitely keeping open mind, do my research and shit like that. So as long as you keep an open mind to it, oh yeah as long as you're not like insulting it, you can't just use your phone.
Speaker 2:Oh, they're so entertaining. I really always like the really weird ones that are just ridiculous. My mom's really into sci-fi so I grew up watching lots of Star Trek and like Star Wars and all these dirty things. So my mom's really into sci-fi movies and sci-fi books and she goes on YouTube and will watch some of these. Go down the rabbit hole. She doesn't believe in it I've, but she will tell me sometimes. Did you hear this one thing that I heard about the moon being a giant spaceship? And I'm like mom, that's ridiculous. And she's like, no, it's so entertaining. So I really think a lot of them should be sci-fi authors, like the ones that are really really good at it. I really wish that they would put that scale into something more interesting.
Speaker 1:Oh well, it really could, because there's there are a lot of crazy conspiracies out there Beautifully outlandish Anyway. Anyway. So so what are we drinking tonight?
Speaker 2:I got some Cuban rum for myself. The little shot. Nice Of myself, like my like. Okay, yeah, no Cuban rum that I've been saving for a special occasion, and I think discussing conspiracies is pretty special.
Speaker 1:Perfect, perfect, and my shot tonight is Southern comfort whiskey, so cheers.
Speaker 2:Cheers, cheers, cheers, very nice.
Speaker 1:I'll wash it down with some beer.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:What beer are you drinking?
Speaker 2:This one is called moon juice by moon underwater. It's a raspberry sour. I really did the sour beers I used to work yeah Right, I used to work for the bar. I used to work for the bar in the summer and and I I work for the bar in the summer, I've worked for a couple of hours Are like so common now. They were so hard to find until like a couple of years ago. Um, and there's a couple of breweries in Vancouver. We have a really, really good beer scene. It's happened and that is a plan. Um, anyways, um, I used to work in like as a bartender and like the beer scene as well. Um, anyway, sour ale from, uh, the brewery that I've never actually heard of, so I'm trying it out and it's pretty good.
Speaker 1:It's from Victoria, so it must be a new one. Yeah, very nice. Yeah, few, but they're harder to find. But I love anything sour, so, like anything sour flavored I love, and I'm super into the sour beers I try to. We have a brewing company in Royal Oak in Michigan called Rope Brewing and they have a caramel apple sour beer.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, that sounds fantastic, it's phenomenal, it was amazing. I need to get that shipped up here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, probably one of the best beers I've had, but they have a few other sour beers too, but yeah, I love sour beers oh my God, a caramel apple, sour though that's like.
Speaker 2:I mean even just caramel apple ale, like anything that sounds great. There's a brewery in Vancouver called Storm actually live really close to it now, storm brewing. If you're into like the weird kind of adventurous type beers, like it could be a hit or a miss because it's like so weird flavor wise, they're like a good brewery for that Like, as you said, they have an apple pie ale, so kind of similar, not a sour, but it's a bit too sweet for me now. But when I was like sort of a good transitional one, because people who hate beer they're like, oh, this just tastes like beer. I'm like, no, it tastes like apple pie and beer, fantastic. So yeah, that kind of stuff is like my favorite.
Speaker 1:That sounds really good actually. Oh, definitely, definitely enjoy that. All right, you ready to jump into this conspiracy?
Speaker 2:We do. I mean, we could talk about beer forever, but I guess we should do that.
Speaker 1:Maybe I'll start a podcast about beer and have you on as a guest.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, I would love it. I would love to hear it there. All right, what's conspiracy? What's happening?
Speaker 1:So tonight's conspiracy, the moon landing, did it happen? Was it faked Hollywood, you know, who knows?
Speaker 2:How much do you know?
Speaker 1:about the moon landing.
Speaker 2:I've done some reading on it. I feel like you're probably going to know a lot more than me. I may or may not. I know about it and I have had discussions with my roommates of it. We really did do it for various reasons, which I'm sure we had into. But I'm very curious about more of the evidence against it. I know a little bit of those and obviously because I researched that to figure it out. But yeah, it's very interesting. It's kind of like it keeps coming back. It's one that just won't die. Even though lots of very famous science, you sort of tried to bunk it, it just didn't want to die.
Speaker 1:That's true and a lot of it has. The way I sit on it right now is I'm in the middle. I could see that we actually did land on the moon, but then I could see that our government would want us to believe that we landed on the moon when we really didn't. So I'm torn. I'll save my final opinions till the end of the show.
Speaker 2:We'll look at the first.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm torn about it. So tell me what you know about the mission to the moon. Do you know much about?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was the astronauts landing the moon. I should know their names. I know there's Buzz Aldrin, and forget the. I do know I knew I'm strong. Wow, that is totally the one I know way more about than the other guy.
Speaker 1:He's the more famous of the two. He is the more famous one.
Speaker 2:Why did my friends mix those ones up? I don't know. I totally forgot.
Speaker 1:There was a third.
Speaker 2:I think there was, except he didn't.
Speaker 1:I can't really remember his name. I probably should have written it down.
Speaker 2:Oh, oh well.
Speaker 1:No one's going to know anyways.
Speaker 2:It'll be fine, you got.
Speaker 1:Buzz and Neil and that's about. That's all you really need to know.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 2:But, yeah, they put a flag. They brought back a whole lot of space rocks, little footprints and, because of the way the moon works, a lot of those footprints are still there, which is I'll get into that later on. But yeah, so we went to the moon. There was a lot of Science is really interesting because it was the 60s, right, the science was really old. It's like the science of a calculator or something, the technology that we had but that we accomplished from it. It's so impressive and some of the female mathematicians and physicists that worked on it are so fucking badass. It's phenomenal to think about it, which I think part of that because the technology we have is so not as good as now, for example. That's why I think we all have further stoke, doubts and questions about it.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, and if I remember correctly, they said over 400,000 people worked on this mission.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, it was insane.
Speaker 1:It was like a lot. Yeah, so that's one reason why people think that it actually happened, because they're like how are you going to keep 400,000 people?
Speaker 2:silent? Yeah, no, exactly, but at the same time, the US government.
Speaker 1:They're some shady people.
Speaker 2:So I mean, I believe they could figure it out.
Speaker 2:Or a way to shut up 400,000 people. I mean, yeah, maybe Do you know about the equation that Dr David Grimes did? I don't. Oh, okay, this is an addition one.
Speaker 2:This is actually a place to a lot of conspiracy theories, but he basically he's from, he's a big deal. He made a mathematical equation and he took different variables and basically mathed out, like okay, if this many people are involved in this thing, this is how many years it'll take before it breaks down and is exposed to the world. Essentially, there was three different variables or something that he used to come up with this equation and he applied it to the moon lighting. Having applied it to that, with 400,000 people, his mathematical equation would have broken down to like three and a half, like four years, like excuse me very quickly, with how many people involved?
Speaker 2:Someone listed something, and I mean on that same note of like all the people involved, the people who have questioned it, and like the ones who spread the whole like it didn't happen. It's a hoax. None of them ever worked for NASA, which is kind of like if everyone from NASA is still in agreeance, it just kind of speaks to it still have, you know, making sense that it would have happened like anyway, yeah, that equation. I have to say more, but there's a mathematical equation on experience theories that's really interesting yeah.
Speaker 1:That is interesting. I'll have to look more into that. Yeah, I mean it's hard to believe that 400,000 people not one of them came forward that we know of.
Speaker 1:True, I mean, someone could have came forward, but I mean. But yeah, like you said, we had the mission to the moon. They actually launched on July 16th. Apollo 11, launched July 16th. They didn't land on the moon until July 20th, so they were in open space for a couple of days. Yeah, it was actually, but it was JFK who initially got the ball rolling on this mission back in 1961.
Speaker 2:They didn't launch until 1969.
Speaker 1:So a couple of years later, but the sole mission was basically to launch a national goal to land on the moon and then return back to Earth.
Speaker 2:Pickle space race.
Speaker 1:Pretty much just to beat Soviet. Take it to Russia. Yeah, it's like hey they sent a dog.
Speaker 2:We're going to send people.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's a. I feel like we we battle with the Russians a lot back then. I mean, I mean the moon with the aliens and then hockey. Really the Russians, I guess they are going to hockey. I think you'd be battling with the Canadians though.
Speaker 2:No, do you ever see the miracle? But hockey is our sport. I guess actually one of the best players on the Vancouver Canucks was like this giant Russian man.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I'm from Michigan, so we have our red wings. Nice, we're one of the original six. That's fair, that's true.
Speaker 2:Good point. Actually, I didn't see the red wings movie, but I didn't, I didn't. I haven't seen miracle.
Speaker 1:We beat the Soviets in the Olympics.
Speaker 2:Wow, I should know that. Yeah, big movie, but anyway.
Speaker 1:I'm a bad Canadian. I don't know anything about hockey. No, you're all right. I grew up mostly in the South, so hockey wasn't really big.
Speaker 2:Right Down there.
Speaker 1:So I mean, but yeah, so, like I mean, it was basically a race to beat the Soviets to the moon and according to some, that we actually did and according to some we didn't. So we'll definitely get into those conspiracies. Do you know where the first, like the origins of the conspiracy came from?
Speaker 2:I was yeah, I remember reading about different, different sort of movies and stuff that kind of went out in like uh documentaries to question it. And then there was um Bill Casing.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:The guy who made published a bunch of things himself and was, like it doesn't happen. Look at all these gritty things that I have, all these pictures and blah, blah, blah. He seemed to be the one major source, I think, at the start, and then a whole bunch of other things since then, obviously.
Speaker 1:Yeah, bill, he was a former US Navy officer, got hired by a company called Rocketdyne if I'm pronouncing that right, something like that Rocketdyne. Uh, he had no previous background in rockets or anything, but they hired him to in this company and uh, yeah and uh, he didn't need to have a degree.
Speaker 1:Right, it was just like hey, I'm a former US officer, give me the job, you get the job. Pretty pretty simple. But um, yeah, he worked on, he worked for Rocketdyne and they were the ones who actually um worked on the engines Saturn V engines, their F1 engines and that's the engine that was actually used in Apollo 11. Oh, that makes sense, so he worked for the company who produced them, the engines.
Speaker 1:Right, it's not for NASA but like loosely involved, right, but he is the. He is like the original conspiracy theorist for this moon landing, saying we didn't actually land on it and he, he wrote a book called we Didn't Go to the Moon, or something like that ever.
Speaker 1:Wow, he named it really well yeah uh, his book was called We've Never, we Never Went to the Moon. Uh, the 30 billion dollar swindle, or something like that. Uh, so yeah, he claims that. Um, he basically claims that it would have been easier for the United States to fake the moon landing than to actually go to the moon. But I mean, yeah, I could see that, but at the same time, I mean for us to fake that, I mean you gotta, you gotta get the actual rockets. That, because the rockets were launched right, I mean it was televised.
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, yeah, no kidding, yeah, I didn't even think about that. But exactly if they, it's a lot of effort to fake, like fake that because right, yeah, and you'd be spending so much money just to do it and then not actually.
Speaker 1:Right, I mean like, like he said, it was like a 30 billion dollar swindle. But I mean, I just feel like for like all the blueprints you'd have to go through for this, and like to actually get the rockets and yeah, you're right actually shoot them into space.
Speaker 2:Of course I always forget. There's always such a like the very premise of the courtesy, always kind of like you, you think at the very beginning you're like wait, we all agree on this point, which is that we sent a bunch of rockets out and we launched those. We have the footage and like people saw it tons, people saw it over their eyes, like they did that. So then why is it so outlandish that they then actually made it to the moon?
Speaker 1:Exactly um, I don't know uh, breaks down pretty quickly. To be honest, there's only really one reason why I think that we possibly did not go to the moon. But I'll save that one for last.
Speaker 2:I'm excited.
Speaker 2:Because I feel like, because every conspiracy you can basically debunk and it has been debunked, so yeah, so it's it's hard to tell, but um, yeah, I mean just just the breakdown of it all it yeah, yeah, the like the premise of all the stuff that they didn't do already, like like the scientists and the math that they did and all of like that they bought the rockets from the company that he worked for as well. Like you think he would understand that. That just in a sense like why would America spend that money to just not actually do it right and then, I think, to spend more money. I mean, I work as well. This is actually related, hilariously.
Speaker 2:I work part-time in film. It's like my other kind of job. Um, I just do pay work, so I do production assistant, boring things, um, but it is expensive to like movies cost a lot and all that equipment and all the photography stuff also cost a ton of money, um, and like having people organized to do that and whatnot, um, and also like they talk a lot like yeah, the other thing is like if the, if NASA didn't spill the secret, the film crew that worked on the conspiracy film totally would have told everyone like right, I'd be telling everyone everything about that if I was on that film set anyway.
Speaker 1:I mean I'm pretty sure, like that big of a secret the they make you sign yeah and saying you're not gonna speak, and like, and it's it's rumored that like they threatened to go after your family, if you like. It's the US government, I mean, it's true they're sketchy ass they, they are and uh, I mean, and that that's a whole conspiracy in itself is like how much the government actually like pays attention to you and like watches you, but um, yeah, we all have like a little FBI guy on our computer, right?
Speaker 1:well, yeah, because did I?
Speaker 2:saw.
Speaker 1:I saw the movie Snowden about Eric Snowden and he yeah, he basically Gave away all the military, the US secrets, that they watch us through our cameras.
Speaker 2:So yeah, it's just really easy to hack into those things, apparently that is true, but um yeah, our government's a little little tricky little kooky.
Speaker 1:Yeah, all right, so jumping into the conspiracies of it. One of the one of the major conspiracies is the stars.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've seen the photos the photos of the stars.
Speaker 1:Can you debunk this?
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I did actually read about that one. Basically, the idea is that there's no stars in the pictures. That means they Didn't. They made it so that there wouldn't be stars, so that they could wouldn't have to sort of prove to scientists that it on On. But what's the word I forgot? Can I swear? I don't know. I always forget to ask, of course. Okay, thanks, fucking god.
Speaker 1:I Should have told you in the beginning.
Speaker 2:We're drinking. I mean, if we're drinking.
Speaker 2:I get probably fucking swear. Of course, thank um, no, it's perfect. Um, oh god, my brain got distracted to have me through all the stars, okay, okay. So the reason behind not having stars is that if they had stars, then they would then be able to To debunk it and say, hey, this is fake, because astronomers could say those aren't the right stars. They would look like this that is the theory on why there's no stars.
Speaker 2:The actual reason why there's no stars, if you know how cameras work is shutter speed and you know when you take a picture, the moon is bright, the astronauts are bright, they're all white, right, I take pictures all the time where, like, I'm completely up because I'm like super white, in my background just dark and black, and I'm not even in space like. So that's just a simple camera explanation and a lot of people, I think, pretty agree on that and I have some experience photography, so I wear that. My mom was a photographer. I know a lot of friends in film who've told me some more things of the whole lighting stuff. Like it makes sense that there's no stars in the background when you actually think about. Try taking a picture of the stars with your phone. I try taking a picture of the moon with my phone and I can't even do it. Like it sucks.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because the, the, the human eye just focuses in on like one thing, like, like, like you say, if you take a, take yourself on outside, take a picture of, like someone with the stars in the background. You're not gonna really get the stars because the the eyes focusing on just the one Subject, so like it doesn't contrast to, yes, the stars.
Speaker 2:I mean it's much so you think same in space. Oh well, like the light sources in those photos you have the sun, obviously right. The moon itself is very reflective because it's all white. The astronauts and even the earth does reflect some light over onto the moon. So there's so much light coming into that shot from so many angles, of course the stars are gonna get washed out and not appear right, so make sense to me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel like that conspiracy is easily debunked. Um, if you just have basic camera knowledge, it's really not hard to to figure out why you're not seeing the stars. Yeah but I mean, but I mean some people, just I don't know it gets stuck on it. Yeah, but no that. That one's for for me easily debunked and yeah. I know why that it's not the second conspiracy is the flag the American flag.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, excuse me, oh, I drank beer and burping already.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the waving flag a classic, so clearly there's no gravity on Moon.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there'd be no wind either right.
Speaker 1:So like you plant the flag, it would just Basically not move. Have you, have you seen any of the footage of them putting the flag in?
Speaker 2:Gosh, yeah, like a very long time ago I saw some pictures from now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so like so with the pictures you can see like it. The flag looks wavy. Yeah and even when you're watching the, the the video footage they have of it you can see the flag moving. What people don't like out I don't know why they're not Understanding is when the flags moving. Yeah, it's when they're trying to plan it and he's moving it. He's moving it back and forth.
Speaker 2:He's, he's wiggling it.
Speaker 1:Oops, there, obviously, when you do that, the flag, the flags are gonna move. They also inserted a Horizontal pole, yeah, in the top, because they wanted to make it stand and because, yeah, kind of stupid for just.
Speaker 2:A sad floppy flag. That would be disappointing right.
Speaker 1:So they, they did insert the the horizontal pole and they said they, they said they accidentally bent the pole but, it actually kind of turned out in their favor, because when they bent it it didn't make it look wavy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it also looks so looks better.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I think there's good.
Speaker 2:Oh no, I just say there's also the fact that like it wouldn't be in folded up in like a drawer, right? Well, wherever it was folded up and stored on the ship shuttle on the way there, it's like whenever you have clothes, or especially like, depending on the type of fabric, that just retains the wrinkles and shit. You know right, that's also probably why it's like a little bit cakey, right.
Speaker 1:Right, but but when you're watching the footage to and after that, after they stop messing with it and just leave the flag alone, it doesn't, it's, it's not moving. Yeah so like when you're actually watching the videos of after the flag is like just like, sat there by itself and not Don't messing with it. Yeah, flag isn't moving. So I mean that holds up to the whole. No gravity, it shouldn't be moving.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's no wind. There's no reason for it to be wiggling around that much, if at all.
Speaker 1:They people just hold on to the fact that it was moving at one point, but they're not understanding that they were moving it back and forth to try to jam it down. Service right. So I mean again for me easily debunked.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I agree with that. It's like thank for think it's pretty obvious that they were wiggling it.
Speaker 1:To me it's common sense. I don't know if common sense stuff yeah, I don't even know what.
Speaker 2:What kind of scientists would you get to be like? Can you tell us whether the wiggle makes sense or not? Right?
Speaker 1:Conspiracy theorists are crazy.
Speaker 2:I mean, yeah, I mean we don't need entertainment though. So like they still contribute to society by giving us that.
Speaker 1:Exactly, that's how I have the show.
Speaker 2:If I do, I wouldn't have.
Speaker 1:There you go, thank you, thank you, crazy conspiracy theorists Yay, some people say. Some people would think I'm a conspiracy theorist myself. Um, yeah. I guess I put myself on a fine.
Speaker 2:Mom, I mean, there's totally just viable things. But like we talked before, I have understood about the ones. I believe, like I think that there are things that happen that are sketchy, you know, like hey, come on, this is obvious. But like they're substantial, they're Substantiated, evident, then it's no longer that much of a conspiracy, right? Anyways, the two, it can get misconstrued easily.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes okay, so I mean depends on how you look at it. Really, the only other conspiracy about it would be the shadows and yeah. People were saying, like the shadows don't add up to how they are and that there's like, there's like light, like the lot, the higher Up lights, like on a film set, that are shining down. But um, as I was doing my research for it, I came across an episode of the show myth.
Speaker 2:Oh, hell yeah.
Speaker 1:They actually did the, the moon landing with the, because, um, with the picture I believe it's is it new that's climbing back up into the space?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think it's one of them.
Speaker 1:I forget who it's either buzzer, neil.
Speaker 2:Yeah that would be the case. The other will name them Charles Everlust oh, my god, you know this is gonna bother me. I'm gonna just gonna. Who is the third astronaut? I got a lot of man.
Speaker 1:His first or last name started with the sea Michael Collins. Collins, I was gonna say.
Speaker 2:Collins yeah, that's just so generic. I was never gonna remember that.
Speaker 1:I was gonna say Collins, but my, my brother's last name is Collins, so I was yeah. Shit, I was right. You were always his first name, though, michael Michael.
Speaker 1:It was close it's very close to Charles, just spelled a little different. So so, yeah, yeah, so it was either buzzer, buzzer, neil, yeah, but there's. But where the Space shuttle is with the shadows, people claim that you wouldn't be able to see him climbing, like he would be blacked out, like in a picture, that there would be no light on him. So people are saying that the only reason there's light on them is because of, like the film sets. But with when mythbusters did it, they, they did a complete replica of the space shuttle, the astronaut and the can't like they, their camera, and they completely blacked it out. And Just from the reflection from the Sun to the moon is enough that it actually would catch, yeah, the astronauts. So I mean they, they easily debunked, yeah as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I mean good old mythbusters, right? I love Adam Savage's YouTube channel.
Speaker 1:Don't think I've ever watched his YouTube channel.
Speaker 2:Oh, he's got a great YouTube channel. I it's always really long videos where he makes things, like it's making things. And then I'm like, oh, I'll just watch this, it won't be very long, and it's like an hour long video of him making a watering can for his wife or something. But just great, adorable, and like other more interesting things like props and stuff. And then I've spent like half an hour or like an hour watching it. I'm like shoot and it did do something. I don't know anyway.
Speaker 1:Maybe I'll check it out but, I, mean Um, yeah, I mean that just if you know anything about the Sun and the moon and like the reflection. From the Sun to the moon. I mean it's easily another easily debunked.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a lot of the photography.
Speaker 1:Things tend to tend to easily be explainable right, and there was another one where Neil Armstrong took a picture of Buzz Aldrin and you can see in his, in the face of the, the helmet. You can see Neil Armstrong's reflection, but in the top corner of it. Yeah people claim that that's a camera like a on a film set. Right, and when you're looking at the picture it does kind of resemble a Camera, so I can kind of see Right coming from, but at the same time they I mean also.
Speaker 2:There's just so many random tech things there. Right it's like that's how they got there. A lot of man-made things would be there. That makes sense. That could look similar.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I'll kind of I'll say I'm in the middle on that one, just because, just because the the the fade little object in the top corner of his helmet Kind of does look like a camera.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so.
Speaker 1:I'll say I'm 50 50 on that one there, there. But I mean the other ones. Yeah, they're all easily yeah.
Speaker 1:Yes, easy toast and uh in another one is one of the the rocks that they have a picture of, the moon rocks. You can see like a little sea in it, like that's kind of like carved in it, right, and it's well. It's well known in Hollywood that, like when they they mark their props, they'll either number it or put like a letter on it. Hmm, you know the cut. Just so people are saying, like that that rock was a prop. But when you look at the original photos, yeah, the rock, the sea, isn't there. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's only in the, Like the copied photos, where you can see the sea, oh, which then it would probably be like a copy or like it was probably done For some other reason right, and uh, I make sense.
Speaker 1:I believe if I remember correctly, it was NASA who said it that uh like with the original film, something could have been like smudged or hit on it to make it look like that. But when you look at the, but when you look at the original photos, the sea isn't there.
Speaker 2:So I mean so again the debunked by the fact that their pictures without it right, but then again those could have been Photoshopped to be removed. It everything is fake.
Speaker 1:So so I'll say I'm 50, 50 on that one too 50, 50 on the sea. Interesting. Just trying to level out the playing field here.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm, I see we're working our way towards something.
Speaker 1:Yes, so but I mean those are, those are like the main Conspiracy theories of why people think, but I mean the majority of them are easily debunked. Yeah, if you just have common sense.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean basic film knowledge. Right either one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but yeah, like I said just, it really comes down to common sense and if you think about it like the stars in the flag and yeah, I mean it's all, it's all proven, it's all been debunked. So I mean not much to to argue with there. Yeah, what I will say with the picture of the in the helmet, and yeah, little object that could be. And then who knows what's world with the pictures of the, the moon rock.
Speaker 2:So yeah, that's fair.
Speaker 1:They're ambiguous right, yeah, so it comes down to your opinion on what it is, but um, but I will tell you why I think the moon landing could have been faked. Oh, my god, tell me so do you know who the director, stanley Krubert, is?
Speaker 2:Of course I do, yeah, yeah, I'm aware I've seen 2001, the space, obviously okay and like the shining and the shining, yeah, yeah, yeah full metal jacket.
Speaker 1:I'm great director fantastic. I kind of know job himself. Yeah, he was kind of crazy himself, but all good artists Right, but nonetheless phenomenal director. Do you know the conspiracies with him and the moon landing?
Speaker 2:I heard yeah, I loosely was aware that the theory of Of uh, just that he was involved in it because he's a very famous director at the time and he made 2001, space odyssey, um in in a similar time frame.
Speaker 2:So sort of that in itself is proof that, hey, we were able to make this the convincing sci-fi stuff like, and like films, actually being able to do a lot of things back back Longer ago than you realize, like if you go back to really early films from like 1920s German films, like Metropolis, a really interesting sci-fi film, where it is crazy that it was because it modern Um, obviously there's things that aren't modern, oh, anyways, that's just tiny sets. They made sets with skyscrapers and they kind of predicted the future in a way that it ended up going Um, but yeah, so we've always kind of had a lot of ability to make sci-fi things that are convincing Um, despite not having the technology yet. Yeah, so I think that that that's what I was aware of, just that he. The theory is that he is the director that worked on the nine oh, I'm not sorry. No, oh, my god, sorry. Oh, next to my conspiracies, he's the one who worked on the um Moon landing hoax video. Essentially right.
Speaker 1:9-11 is one of my favorite conspiracy.
Speaker 2:Oh god, I don't even want to go into that one If I plan on doing that on an episode.
Speaker 1:But when I do, I know that's I'm gonna have to break that up into like a three episode. Oh, probably ordeal because I I could talk on 9-11 for hours. Yeah but anyways, getting back to the moon landing before I go to the hoax of 9-11, uh, uh. Another thing with the Stanley Kubrick in uh In his 2001 space odyssey is the backgrounds. People Claim that the backgrounds are so from the movie were used in Fakie the moon landing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so like the like, the like. The sets of it are kind of the same. Um, I haven't really looked too far into it. I have seen the movie but it's been many, many years In a hot minute for me too, so I'd actually I'd have to actually go, go back and watch that and then watch the videos of the moon landing.
Speaker 2:I mean, I feel like that argument, though, is still like hey, these rocks look like other rocks, like, sir, have you seen rocks? They tend to look like other rocks. Tushae, I don't know what to tell you.
Speaker 1:What I think. It's a little more detailed than that. Just like the rocks, looks like the rocks, I think when they like take pictures of the movie and pictures from the moon landing and they overlap them.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:They're very similar, but I mean that could be. But at the same time they could also have taken the pictures from the moon landing as inspiration or something like that Right, I mean. So I'll sit 50-50 on that one too, because it could go either way. Yeah, but um but, yeah, it's uh. Apparently Stanley Kubrick was approached to fake the moon landing. They wanted him to do it. He originally said no.
Speaker 1:He told them he didn't want anything to do with it, which I don't blame him, I mean yeah if I was back then, if I was approached to be like hey, we want you to direct our fake moon landing so we can tell the world that we beat the Soviets to the moon, I would be like now, I'm good.
Speaker 2:That's political propaganda.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm like I'll stick with my, my real movie. No, thank you, sir. Yeah, yeah, but uh, yeah, it's rumored, say rumored that he originally said no, and then they I forgot the names of the people, um, yeah, I forgot the names of who they said approached them. But people in our government approached him and uh told them that they're like hey, all we really need is for you to leave the keys to the, to the set, right, and we'll take care of everything, and then Monday morning everything will be back to normal. He eventually caved and said I'll do it, but, like, after Monday, I want nothing to do with any of you ever again, right? So in it's rumored that it wasn't even in Hollywood how a lot of people think that it was. They went to shit. I should have written it down.
Speaker 2:Story of my life.
Speaker 1:But I thought I could remember it. But with a drinking podcast you forget some shit.
Speaker 2:Makes things a little more difficult, doesn't it?
Speaker 1:I want to say in Paris.
Speaker 2:It's like where they shot it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it was an MGM studio, but it wasn't MGM over here, it was MGM in, I don't see, maybe Paris. Do you know if there's an MGM studio in Paris?
Speaker 2:Oh gosh, you know. I do work in film, but I don't have a clue at all, especially back then, like I don't know right seems weird, seems like an odd play. I mean, I don't know, paris is like an epicenter for a lot of things. It's possible, um, yeah, yeah, I'm not sure.
Speaker 1:Anyways, anyways, it was in a different country and it was at an MGM studio in one of these countries. And the actors who played, like Buzz and Neil because Charles, charles- that's me, michael.
Speaker 2:We know that now.
Speaker 1:Michael Collins.
Speaker 2:Or Michael Collins, forgotten from history.
Speaker 1:Exactly, um, anyways, but they got CIA agents to actually play the actors in it, in the, in the in the moon landing. So, so the people that you're seeing in the, according to the conspiracy what this?
Speaker 2:is ridiculous.
Speaker 1:I know. So, according to the conspiracy theory that Stanley Kubic filmed the the moon landing Okay, it wasn't actually Neil and Buzz Aldrin that you're seeing in those photos. It's CIA agents who they use as the actors to film this. But at the same time, as we mentioned earlier in the episode, we shot off.
Speaker 2:Apollo 11.
Speaker 1:Yeah we sent something up there.
Speaker 2:It sent something and then something came back. That also happened.
Speaker 1:And there's. There's pictures of like in in the spacecraft or not. Spacecraft, space shuttle, spacecraft sounds like it's fucking aliens. So the space shuttle. There's pictures of like Buzz Aldrin and Neil Armstrong and the shuttle in space. So, regardless of if you think the conspiracy is fake or not, those motherfuckers were up in space.
Speaker 2:They made it to space, so that's cool so they're still astronauts, right, but that's the other thing. Like we have the International Space Station, like we've been going to space itself for a while, why is the moon so much more unbelievable? Also, russia and China and everyone else agrees with us that we sent astronauts to the moon and that we landed on it, but us being if I was American, I'm Canadian, but whatever you know, like the fact that America, china and Russia agree on something that alone should tell you that it happened, right, why?
Speaker 1:are they?
Speaker 2:been losing the space race. They don't want to say that.
Speaker 1:Right, but at the same time say you're watching it back live in 1969. Would you not just believe that it was happening?
Speaker 2:Oh, you think we done fooled them Like we fooled them as well.
Speaker 1:We could have.
Speaker 2:Oh my god.
Speaker 1:Say you're sitting in front of your TV in 1969.
Speaker 2:July 20th?
Speaker 1:Yeah, would you be sitting there being like, oh, like I'm watching them literally live on the moon, or would you be thinking like, no, these fuckers faked it.
Speaker 2:I mean I was a woman, so or I am a woman so if I was in 1969, I would have no rights. I would just be like cooking and tuning for my husband. That's true I wouldn't even be able to have a credit card. Can you believe that?
Speaker 1:Alright alright, so say, as you're like vacuuming, you're looking over the shoulder of your husband. I'm just like, what would you, what would your opinions be on it?
Speaker 2:My lovely housewife opinions would be like damn, they made it to the moon, hell yeah.
Speaker 1:Right, you wouldn't question it. And then you got like you got China and Russia over here like throwing shit in their rooms. They're like fuck, they beat us. Like now, what do we do? We got to beat them in hockey there you go, not China, I mean, I don't know, that'd be weird, that would be strange. That would be strange.
Speaker 2:Did they even have a hockey team.
Speaker 1:I don't maybe the Jamaicans had a pop sliding team.
Speaker 2:That's true. Oh my gosh, that's like how the Olympics Australia had. Like an ice skater who won something only because all the other ice like like a speed skater or something and Australia is like not known for having good winter sports and he won because everyone else failed and like wiped out and it's. The picture of him winning the Olympics is fantastic. Anyway, segue, I'll have to look at that. I'll find the picture and send it to you. It's funny, it's great, but other countries are good at sports that they're not supposed to be good at.
Speaker 1:Right, it really is. It makes it so much more interesting. But um, anyways, I'll find uh went kind of off board there we did. I forgot where we were even at.
Speaker 2:Somewhere in the moon landing. We were talking about Kubrick and how CAA, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah it's the CAA agent.
Speaker 1:So yeah, it's it. So like if the conspiracy is real and we never went to the moon. The famous photos that you're seeing of Buzz Aldrin and Neil Armstrong on the moon are actually two CAA's who no one knows us, because I don't. I think the AIA agents get fake names.
Speaker 2:Oh, I guess, see, that's so sad. If I was that CAA agent, I'd be like hell. Fuck Buzz Aldrin, neil Armstrong and the third guy like I did this like those are the two people you'd expect to instantly out the conspiracy and be like no, no, no, no, he's taking credit for my work. I was in that's me in the picture. I went to the fake moon like shut up.
Speaker 1:Right, like, especially like, maybe on my death bed.
Speaker 2:Maybe we're only you know, because this, this is like 60 years ago now. That is it. Yeah, 60 years ago, the moon landing, almost like almost no, not 60, 50, 50 years ago. That didn't happen. So, like you know, 51, 51 years. So in like 10, 20 years, we could, we could get the real answer on somebody's death bed.
Speaker 1:Right depending on how old the CAA agents were, because I mean 51 years plus, say they were in their 20s.
Speaker 2:No, they'd be at least in their 30s. They wouldn't hire a CAA. Then they'd be like 80 something.
Speaker 1:I mean still possible that they're alive, but I mean at the same time, true, I may have to dig more into that and see if I can find out, if I can get, yeah, I'm curious about this, like because the CAA agents playing the like, why would it?
Speaker 2:you just have Buzz Aldrin and him in on it and Neil Armstrong would just be like, why do you need to hire someone else to then fake them? Like you know, that's also the the stages and the level of complexity that you have to get to justify these things also just starts to make no sense. You know, right Now you're getting more people involved who did not work in NASA, so now the number's going higher up. This is even more absurd. Like right, it's just goofy, it's just goofy.
Speaker 1:Like we mentioned earlier, there's so much more that they would have had to like go into detail with. Oh yeah, totally Just to like I don't know. I feel like if, if we're gonna say we're gonna go to the moon like fucking go for it and shoot your shot, and if you miss it, we miss it, yeah, like, don't fake it. But at the same time, when all this was going on, it wasn't like the wake of like the um, do you know? The Watergate scandal?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, oh god of course With Nixon. Yeah.
Speaker 1:It wasn't the mist of all that so that that is another reason why people think that we may have like faked, it is because we needed. We needed that for us to like distract everything from Watergate and to actually like put us on the map for being the first ones on the moon.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you already like have evidence of the government's doing sketchy stuff, so like, if the government's doing that, the possibility that them are also convincing.
Speaker 1:It's very plausible, yes, so I mean there, there is that theory on it. If you will, um, so yeah, I could see it, but but like we were saying, I just, I just feel like there's too much that we well US, yeah, like the director he's like an artist, right, he's like a film person.
Speaker 2:I don't trust that. You know, artists can just do and say shit, like you know right. I wouldn't trust him because, like he has his own motives, because if he says that he did the moon landing, that's also tons of free press for him, you know, true, but he also has his own ulterior motives, exactly, and like I mentioned earlier, the government, like, is known to like, make you sign these contracts and being like hey, you do the mention it like we'll come after you, your family, what not?
Speaker 1:but did you ever see the moon? Then we'll get into more of why I think it could have been faked is did you see the movie the Shining?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, yeah, I love the Shining Jack Nicholson great film minus the sexist parts. But you know that was the time right. Here's the 80s. It was the 80s.
Speaker 1:Woman didn't exist yet but did you ever catch on to any of the? There's theories that Kubrick threw out shots of like faking the moon landing in that movie oh really, he had like Easter eggs in the little.
Speaker 2:Oh, I have not heard this at all.
Speaker 1:Yes, no, I'm gonna tell you all of them.
Speaker 2:Oh my god, teach me.
Speaker 1:At least the ones that I know of. There could be more so there's the scene in the movie where the little boys playing in on the ground with the fire trucks and the cars and all that yeah, you know what scene I'm talking about yeah, I watched it actually not too long.
Speaker 1:Yeah, coincidentally, that's good, that's good. So you know the patterns that are on the floor, on the carpet. Those patterns are very, very, very similar to the patterns of the NASA launch pad Gas. Yeah, so if you look at a picture of the NASA launch pads and you look at a picture of the carpet, they are very similar.
Speaker 2:Interesting. Well, you know the thing about patterns they're completely unique and not like anything else.
Speaker 1:Right. Also, do you remember what the little boy was wearing? A little space shirt that said Apollo 11 on it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that is kind of funny.
Speaker 1:Right, so he is wearing an Apollo 11 sweatshirt.
Speaker 2:Boys like space, though this is also potential coincidence.
Speaker 1:True, but for people to like rumor that Kubrick was the one who directed the fake moon landing and for him to, I mean.
Speaker 2:Interesting. I don't know. I wish I knew. I like I'm only still just started my film stuff, so I'm curious about how much like wardrobe, because every like movies have so many different departments and so many different involved.
Speaker 2:Like the director does have a big say, but I'd be curious, like, like people want to attribute the director when, like that's like wardrobe or you know, set deck or as other groups and areas in the film, maybe like helping make a call, which, again, the director is the main person in charge of everything, but like not, not it, depending on the director, it might not be as nitty gritty and like detail focus as you, as you would think.
Speaker 2:Like I worked on a Netflix show a while ago and it was we were shooting at a motel and I don't do set deck or anything like that. That's the person who designs the background or designs, sets up like the scene, right, the stuff that they're gonna be working filming at, like the background, and they, they I was clearing out this like grungy old hotel that they're gonna be filming in this room, and so I was taking out all of the shitty furniture and they're gonna bring their own furniture. They didn't bring all of their own furniture. They only had like a couple of pieces that were missing. So I picked the side tables that got to be in the shot and I picked the ugliest, ugliest ones, because that's what they needed, because it was like a shitty motel. So I kind of got to pick the side tables in this shot in this tv show that's on Netflix, which is so exciting to me, but like super mundane, so like that shirt could have easily come out real quick what show is it.
Speaker 2:Um, it's called another life on Netflix and they just started they just finished filming season two. It's like a side by show. I'll have to check it out yeah, I'm like a PA on it. I don't know if I can say that, but I'll check, I'll check it out, it's fine, yeah, no, I've done a couple.
Speaker 2:I've written some other things too, anyways, um, anyways, yeah, the point is like anyone at some point could have been like oh my kid, like the actor fits this sweater and this is the sweater we have, and like the space isn't popular at the time, you know, whatever. Like it could have been a half decided decision as opposed to like a deliberate clue, you know, I mean right, I get what you're saying, but at the same time, for sure, stanley Krueger was a perfectionist.
Speaker 1:He was, it's well. It's well known that he was a perfectionist. So if you think about him being a perfectionist on his sets, I mean to have the Apollo 11 sweatshirt in there and everything that's, that's what is there?
Speaker 2:a third clue is it just the flooring and the sweater? Is there more?
Speaker 1:there's more it's okay there is more. So did you ever read? Did you read the Shining the Book?
Speaker 2:there was a book oh yeah, it's a Stephen King novel, isn't it? Yes, I have not actually read it, unfortunately. I've read a lot of his work, but that's one of the books I still haven't read.
Speaker 1:Yeah, alright so in the book the um the room number that they go to in the book is uh number 217.
Speaker 2:Okay in the movie 237 it is 237.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, in the room in in the movie he changes it to 237. Do you know like? No, say your conspiracy theorist and believe it was fake and that's Stanley Krueger filmed it? Do you know why he would use 237? I don't know why because the distance from the earth to the moon is 237 000 uh miles, maybe I don't know what if it's kilometers?
Speaker 2:it can't be kilometers.
Speaker 1:You're american, yeah, that's true, so yeah, it can't be feet or kilometers um it's miles but it's from, so, from from the earth to the moon, is 237 000 miles suspicious. So that's another nod in there. And then there's there's two more that I know of.
Speaker 2:Okay, or no, three no, three more, three more clues. So we've got the flooring, the sweater, the rib number two, two more.
Speaker 1:Okay, so you know the scene where they're. They're in like the food pantry or whatever yes yeah, in one shot of it, behind Jack Nicholson, you can see uh boxes of the drink tang. Do you know what I'm talking about?
Speaker 2:um, yeah, orange drink. It's like the powder stuff yeah yeah, super popular back then, there's like tons of culture, references about it well, do you know what the commercials referenced it to?
Speaker 1:they do?
Speaker 2:it was the drink of the astronauts oh, yes, yes, that's why it was the popular, wasn't it?
Speaker 1:it was. It was what astronauts drink while they were in space so that's another nod as to Stanley Krueger threw in there. They say, if then the last one is in the same scene, you can see coca-cola boxes, okay and the number on it start is like 39 yeah the number of the launch pad that launched Apollo 11 was 39 so I mean so these conspiracy clues? Are to do. There is one more. There is one more, but you finished what you were saying.
Speaker 2:I was gonna say they're gonna do largely with numbers, and then I was gonna go on to it think about numbers.
Speaker 1:But yeah, you, you finished your last clue and then I'll tell you so the last clue is the scene where the little boy comes out of the room and he's talking with his mom, the. The sweatshirt is torn and he has scratches on his neck and he can't speak. It's rude to believe that that was Stanley Krueger.
Speaker 2:It's not to him not being able to tell anybody about him filming the fake movement that he was silenced the kid being injured with the kid having the scratches on his neck and not being able to talk see, okay, so that's more of like an artistic interpretation, yes, as opposed to like the numbers that directly correlate with a thing, right?
Speaker 1:that was kind of was thrown in there as an ad with that.
Speaker 2:But oh right, I'm right.
Speaker 1:All right, okay, I could see it right, but it's his little nod is to saying that he was silenced about coming out about the moon landing, so okay, so those are the little the subtle clues within the shining that came out the year like a decade after.
Speaker 2:That was like Kubrick's essential confession to saying look, I did the moon landing. Yes, yeah, basically nice. Um, well, I, I, uh. I think those are very interesting, entertaining ideas, um, but they are also mostly based on numbers, which is sort of a thing that just kind of happens a lot, coincidentally. Um, I remember it was like at some point in my high school I had a teacher have us read a thing about Lincoln and Kennedy. Do you know about their assassinations and all the ridiculous things they have in common?
Speaker 2:I cannot wait to do a ridiculous a ridiculous number of things and you're just like what the fuck? I don't even get it. But all of them are just quints, like strange numbery coincidences. So, um, I was gonna go into that a little bit of like, you know, like the number of letters, like the years, a whole bunch of number thing.
Speaker 1:I mean other things. They all add up. Yeah, some of them were other other coincidences.
Speaker 2:They're just like about their children or about um their assistants.
Speaker 1:Even they're wise, like yeah, like Lincoln's assistant's last name was Kennedy and Kennedy's assistant's last name was, uh, lincoln yes, totally, and you're just like oh, my goodness, this is crazy.
Speaker 2:You're like people, that's just a name. It is crazy. People reuse names a lot, so that's actually not as strange as, like my family, we've been using the same names like forever. Like I named after my uncle, victor, who's named after some other person named Victor, victor, who's named after whoever like, whatever, um, that that's just a thing that humans have to say. You know, a cultural thing we tend to do. So I would like to say that's kind of not that weird, especially with like generic white names like that, um, but no offense to generic white people, I am one, um, but but yeah, like, when you get to numbers, we're like oh, there's seven. Like, like numerology is kind of like, you know it's interesting, but all these different things are. It's just strange. Coincidence is that can happen number wise, like the room being the same miles from the earth. Like it is definitely strange that there's a lot of them. I think the shirt and the flooring are interesting, um, if Kubrick had a say in those which I could see him be involved in.
Speaker 1:Um and any other things, perfectionist. I feel like. I feel like he had to say in everything that happened in that film just like any other film. He did yeah, so I mean it's entertaining at the same time. Why change the? Why change the number, though? What's wrong? With number what's wrong with 217?
Speaker 2:that could have been the number in the hotel that they were shooting. In that you're just like, okay, pick this one because it has a good angle that we're shooting. You know there's also. There's also a scene in that movie where like, oh my god, there's like a furry scene in the movie. It's super weird. There's like a rat, there's an rabbit costume, like about to go down on this other person. You're like what the fuck is happening and there's no explanation. It's super weird. Yeah, that happens in the movie and I remember watching it. I mean like, huh, did that? Did furries exist back then? Apparently they did.
Speaker 1:Um, anyway, maybe that's an odd that. Maybe that's an odd to it too. We just don't know it the furry is clues.
Speaker 2:The furry suit is an astronaut suit and this is all just evidence that cubic made the fucking nine. Uh, let's do it again. Fucking moon landing hoax maybe, maybe.
Speaker 1:Buzz altered and you know, armstrong were freaks 100% they were.
Speaker 2:They're super freaks. His name's Armstrong. You can't be kinkier than that, and buzz.
Speaker 1:That's not even his real name, I think is. I think his first name was Edward, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:I think it's Edward.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, like why go by buzz?
Speaker 2:it's just just super sketchy. I don't trust them.
Speaker 1:I don't either, because have have you ever seen the video of a buzz Aldrin being like like attacked by some guy saying like oh you never went to the moon. He punched some guy Aldrin swung on him yeah, with like a bible looking, yeah, 80 years old or something like that, and fucking swinging on someone like I mean, if someone questioned my greatest accomplishment, I'd be pretty pissed off.
Speaker 1:I get that at the same. I understand that, but at the same time, like, have you ever heard like people only over? People react to like what they think. Like like, if you're being accused of something and like it actually happened, but and you know it happened, but the other person doesn't you usually just brush it off and just like whatever. But like people lash out, like when you're being called out on something that never happened, that you claimed happened, you react different.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the whole psychology, that's interesting I don't know. Yeah yeah, I don't know when we come to like the psychology behavior and predicting, lying and things like that. It's actually difficult Also have a degree in psychology.
Speaker 1:Right Extra side fact about me I do it all.
Speaker 2:I know everything I don't. But but like, if we took I remember taking, like we actually took lie detector tests in class to try and, like you know, see how well they worked Totally they do not work well at all and it was it was really good fun. But yeah, like, even behavior cues of like oh, this person reacts this way, Like humans are just so different in the ways they react to things so it's kind of hard to say like, oh, he punched him. That means he's lying. Like not really, it could just be punched him because he was pissed off.
Speaker 1:I get that too, yeah, so I mean so I don't know, interesting. But, yeah, the whole thing with like Stanley Kruegerick and the shining and like the knots to the moon landing and all that, that's kind of like the main reason of why why, with my open mindness to everything, yeah, I believe that maybe it was faked.
Speaker 2:Right, you think it's possible. So you like, hey, what's it like it's statistically, what percent? Like it's a 10% it faked, or like 50%, or like 80% was fake. Like how, what degree of things are you I?
Speaker 1:have more numbers.
Speaker 2:I just want to know.
Speaker 1:I don't. It's hard to say because? Because, like we mentioned earlier everything, we debunked basically everything, all the major ones, yeah, yes, but at the same time, like Kubrick, and his silly clues. Maybe it's just me wanting to believe that. Yes, we f***ing fake to this thing. F***ing fool the Soviets, china, the US, canada.
Speaker 2:You got me, you got us Canada, the Canadians, f***ing fools. We got everybody. We've been suckered.
Speaker 1:God damn it Exactly. I don't know, that's so funny.
Speaker 2:That's tough Interesting, I see I do with my open mindness. I will give things a percent in my brain of, like, how likely is this to be possible? Like I think we previously before the show, like other conspiracies that I really. I mean I think we're entertaining, like reptilians, for example. Like I, like I think reptilians are very entertaining because they're just, it's just a goofy idea. Again, as many of them are, I give it like a 1% chance that it's possible or like probably like a 0.0001%. Like you know, I will say that I'll give it like the lowest possible. And like moon landing, I'll give it like I would give this one a higher percent if it could have been faked, just because, like I don't know maybe, but like still it would be like a 2% chance for me that it didn't happen. Just because, like we literally sent something, like we had a rocket launch Deans came back like mathematically this would have broken down very quickly.
Speaker 2:All the photography things would be bugged and the shining Kubrick stuff is just so he said. She said like not really substantial evidence and kind of coincidental, and also like the number of things that happen at the same time is like you know that carpeting matching the tile right, maybe that was just a design that was common around that era. Tons of things like that can kind of be a coincidence and not really mean a lot, and coincidences are just so much more common than we like think that they are and it's really interesting and I think I don't blame people for wanting to believe in them. Like, if you take twins that are separated at birth and then reunite them, we end up finding so many strange things that they have in common that are like not things you would think that would be genetic.
Speaker 2:For example this is from my psychology background there was these two twins who were separated this like these two men and then they were reconnected. They had wives with the same first name, like Marie or something, or Mary, they had the same favorite beer, I go a whole bunch of silly things that you're like this is crazy, but like they grew up like a couple of pounds apart from each other. So probably just that was a cultural norm. This is the most common beer, this is the most common name, like blah blah, blah. Right, these are things that can easily be coincident, that just happen, right? So that's why, like the hinting things with the Kubrick film entertaining, and I do think that because it's him involved and it's possible, I would be curious if he kept it up in other films, like if it went more evidence for it, because, like, a couple clues is one thing, but yeah, very interesting.
Speaker 1:But yeah, I'm gonna have to go watch Full Metal Jacket and see if I can see any clues. Find more evidence.
Speaker 2:He's been doing it forever.
Speaker 1:I guess if we had to put numbers on it, I'm gonna call it 6040 that the Moon landing actually happened.
Speaker 2:Okay, so 40% possibility of it being fake.
Speaker 1:Yes, just because we have there's more proof that it actually happened than I believe that it happened.
Speaker 2:Okay, so you're gonna go and leave the amount of evidence?
Speaker 1:Yeah because, like I said, we basically debunked everything we mentioned about what happened up in space and on them, as opposed to me just thinking Stanley Kubrick's a fucking genius and the Shining, which Shining's probably one of the best movies ever made. I'm a big movie guy, so Nice, like the Shining. The Shining because, yeah, like you said, it's definitely a classic. But I guess a part of me just wants to hold on to the hope that Stanley Kubrick's like, look you fucks, I was part of this. I need y'all to see this. So I'm throwing it into this class. This movie that's gonna be a fucking classmate, because he obviously knew it was gonna be probably one of the greatest movies ever made.
Speaker 2:I mean, he was basing out of Stephen King book, and Stephen King is, you know, stephen King Exactly. Oh, that alone makes it a success.
Speaker 1:But, but I know, should I stick with the 6040? Should I change the difference?
Speaker 2:I feel like I've ruined it for you, except just like man to present, because, sorry, I just tell you before the show, I don't believe in these things, I just entertain them you did, you did, and that's that's kind of the reason why I wanted.
Speaker 1:I wanted you more on the show too, Because most of my other episodes I think I have like nine episodes out.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Most of my episodes I don't have anyone who really like. Just like Disagrees with me. Entertains the not not disagreed with me, but entertains the thought that conspiracy theories are just fucking funny and out there.
Speaker 2:I think you need to look at like the actual, like evidence of it and I think that once you've done that, you can make a proper conclusion. And I've done, and it says, like you've done that too, like you looked at it and you'd be like okay, this is the one piece that I can't figure out and that's why I'm on the fence and that's justifiable. I don't find that piece convincing, so I don't find it's ways mean anyways, especially because, like we have tons of rocks we've taken from the moon, we have like no one in NASA itself has been any of the conspiracy like whistleblowers. There's the guy who, who you know, made the first attempt to dissuade us from believing that it happened, had not, you know, it sounded like he was making like a clickbait book, like a clickbait article of like Ooh, like you know, and and just like we had the footage, like we have so many different things that it just like we went to the moon, you know, and I also just find it also the other thing I, I have a degree in psychology, so like I am very a lot of good friends who are educated and who are scientists or like PhDs, like very well educated, and I trust those kinds of people a lot because, like they spent decades or not decades well, some of them decades but like they spent years their life like, working on whatever thing they're working on, and like I, I feel like when we give too much credit to these kind of things, we are doing a little bit of a disservice and, and you know, kind of insulting people like Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin and all of these NASA scientists like you know that worked on those projects and that, like, put their livelihoods and spent their lives dedicated to science and to making us land on the moon.
Speaker 2:Like that is so fucking cool and like have you seen the photo of the woman who helped make some of the mathematical equations to get to the moon? Oh my God, this is an iconic historical photo and it's so amazing because so many of the photos at the time when we get went to the moon of NASA. It's just like rooms full of men and that's fine. Men have been in charge of history forever. But to see a photo where a woman who is just so admirable and like made this amazing accomplishment besides, they're standing beside this huge stack of paper is so cool, right, and I don't know.
Speaker 2:I really respect those people and the hard work that they put in. So I also come from it from that perspective of being. These ideas are funny and they're entertaining. But once we've looked into it and we've made a decision, you know I'm going to side with the scientists and I'm going to side with the people who put a lot of work into that. Otherwise they're going to punch me in the face. Just kidding, they might not, but you know I really, I just my heart goes out to them and I feel a little bad because I, like, I think they're funny and I can laugh at them. But you know, a lot of people do really care and they put a lot of effort into that and I want to make sure that that accomplishment that humanity did still gets its time and those people get the recognition that they deserve.
Speaker 1:No, I agree with you 100% because, like with this conspiracy, obviously saying it was real and say it actually happened, what people only look at are Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin, and that they landed on the moon. They don't look at the people behind this, like the 400,000. 400,000. That were behind the scenes, who actually made this happen. All Buzz Aldrin and Neil Armstrong did was fucking get their laser in the fucking space shuttle, shot up into the space, jumped out and landed on the moon.
Speaker 2:Like good job, sir. You peed in like zero gravity, Woohoo.
Speaker 1:Right, like who got them there? Like I feel like they don't get the recognition and I've actually been to because Neil Armstrong's from Ohio. Oh, cool. I've actually been to the Neil Armstrong Museum in.
Speaker 1:Ohio. I've driven down and I actually just went down to me and my wife took our son down to Tennessee. I'm from Tennessee originally and we actually stopped at the gas station to fill up. That's across from the Neil Armstrong Museum. But years ago before that, I've actually been to that museum and it's a very cool museum and if you would have asked me years ago I'd straight up would have said it was fucking fake.
Speaker 2:Oh really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure. Like I'll admit it, like I just like I don't know.
Speaker 2:I've always been into conspiracy theories.
Speaker 1:I've been loved. That's and that's the main reason I've started this show is just because I do. I do love conspiracy. I don't, but I don't consider myself one of those crazy conspiracy theories, because I do keep an open mind. Conspiracy To me, conspiracy theories don't. They just like. They hear one thing and they're like that's it, that's what's happened. They don't. They don't really do the research. Right and especially with this one. Like how like people are. Like oh, there's no stars in the picture. The flag was moving.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:What not. And that's easily debunked because like, like go outside, take a, like go outside where there's stars everywhere. Take a fucking picture on your phone of another person, because your phone focuses on that one object, so everything in the background is basically obsolete.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like I'm, it's just common sense, but, um, yeah, yeah, I think my trouble is like just so many conspiracy stuff and like conspiracy theorists and like, um, the you know people and sorts of places that it gets spread are just highly questionable and they have their own ulterior motives. And my issue with like a lot of these conspiracy theories is, like you're like I'm like okay, like look at that person and what their goal is with that and why they're spreading it. Like come on, you know they're usually also like, hey, look at the conspiracy. Also, I have this like cryptocurrency I'm trying to sell you. I'm like, okay, dude, like you just think I'm gullible.
Speaker 1:Right, I don't trust you Anyway. And in another reason why I want to believe that the Moonland Eagle was real because, besides Bill Casey, who was the original guy, who was like we never went to the fucking you know who the people were that came out saying that it was fake.
Speaker 2:No I don't.
Speaker 1:It was like it was like the president, like the founder, or the president, or some shit like that of the flat earthers.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, of course, of course, of course it is. Why don't you even?
Speaker 1:To me like I don't. I don't know if I'll ever do an episode on flat earth.
Speaker 2:I mean. I mean I have to now.
Speaker 1:I'll find someone who. I'll find someone who definitely believes that the earth is flat. I'll fucking ruin their day, their night, their life, and just that it wasn't. It's the earth's not flat.
Speaker 2:And like we figured this out a good long time ago.
Speaker 1:Pictures from the moon, of the earth and it's round.
Speaker 2:My favorite, like flatter thing is that there was this person who took a picture, like a screenshot of, like a video game where the horizon was flat because it was a video game, but it was a realistic one.
Speaker 1:There's probably Minecraft.
Speaker 2:Maybe I don't even remember which game it was. My son plays it.
Speaker 1:There you go. They took a screenshot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they took a flat screenshot and they like they cut out the parts of the screenshot, like so it was just the horizon, so it looked like a real picture, not like no video game thing. Like overlaze, right, they posted this picture. This was a person who was kind of trolling them. He posted this picture to a group of flat earthers and said hey look, the horizon is fake, it's real. Sorry, it's flat. And then it was a fake photo but he pretended it was real. All of the flat earthers were like, oh my God, it's evidence. And then like it was like dude, this was a video game.
Speaker 1:I guarantee you the video game was mine. I play with my son. Yeah, he has me build houses with them and stuff like that. And it is flat when you, when you do your new thing, and then, because you can even like, fly up into the sky and overlook, it's all flat.
Speaker 2:So really there is a flat earth. We can support the theory that there is a flat earth, but it's in Minecraft and not in our own reality.
Speaker 1:Exactly, you just debunked everything on that. I'm here to provide a service for everyone, Well yes, it was the flat earthers who mainly came out about the moon landing being fake.
Speaker 2:You don't want to be associated with them.
Speaker 1:No, not at all, and that's what kind of makes me think that I was like all right. We really fucking are now the moon Because I don't. I don't want to be, I don't want to be put out there with the flat earthers Because, like and if any of my listeners are flat earthers, fucking email me, get a hold of me.
Speaker 2:Well, we can hash this out on the Napa, send him a very strongly worded email. Guy swearing is okay. I found that out the hard way.
Speaker 1:Yes, you're drinking and like shit happens. So, but yeah, like I don't know, I just I like to hold on to the hope that Stanley Crubic was just like you know. I mean, I like to entertain the idea.
Speaker 2:Yeah, of course, I gave it a 2% entertainment value of like it's possible, Like if it, if it happened, I'd be like, well, I was 98% wrong and that's okay, you know.
Speaker 1:I mean to be just the wrong I get, but I don't know. I don't know if the power of me thinking Stanley Crubic really did it.
Speaker 2:He just really likes it.
Speaker 1:I do. He was a great fucking director.
Speaker 2:But just like one hip to have had done like that, we made the greatest thing of all time. If he had done that, he would be so right. Like it's like you want to believe it, for like the entertainment value and the fact that it would be cool.
Speaker 1:Because yeah because, if you think about it, if Stanley Crubic really did direct the fake moon landing, that would easily make him the greatest director of all time and there are great directors out there. You got like John Carpenter because I'm a big Halloween fan. I love the Halloween franchise. That's my favorite franchise. You got Scorsese fucking who did Titanic.
Speaker 2:Oh God, oh, my God oh my God.
Speaker 1:What is his?
Speaker 2:name Cameron, something Cameron. Yeah, oh my God dammit I hate what happens, something Cameron. I will blame the alcohol.
Speaker 1:I do blame the alcohol, but yeah, you got Cameron Like. These are great movie directors. But if it ever came out that Stanley Crubic did like fake the moon landing and directed it easily non-debatable, the greatest director of all time. He was a genius when he came to release his movies. Our friend I guess part of me just wants to get the movie buff in me, just wants to hold on to hope that we really did fucking fake it, just to kick Russia in their ass and just be like we fucking beat them.
Speaker 2:Well, the good news is, you did launch a big old racket.
Speaker 1:That's true, you did go to Space, buzz.
Speaker 2:Something went to space. We can applaud that to all the space adventures.
Speaker 1:But I also read somewhere that this year, in 2020, there was supposed to be like another, like moon race or something between, like China, oh, interesting. But I think COVID put a big gap to that, which actually my next episode after this one is conspiracies of COVID-19.
Speaker 2:Oh, there's a lot of them. That'll be a long episode. Good luck, exactly.
Speaker 1:But I do have to ask you before we go, okay, since you kind of got like the moon landing in 9-11, mixed up a little bit.
Speaker 2:I did a little, didn't I you?
Speaker 1:did. Where do you stand on that, especially coming from a Canadian?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Not being part of, like the US, I mean not really I have, I have to know, like where do you, where do you know?
Speaker 2:um, I have not researched it enough. Actually, specifically, I know bits and pieces here and there that are interesting, but I've been like what? Huh, so I do. I do want to look into it more, but I haven't researched it, so I don't know if I could say an opinion, but I would. Um, actually we didn't even talk about this, but there's a parse money principle.
Speaker 2:I don't know if you know about that. It's just a type of philosophy where if you have two explanations and one is that like vastly more, like simple, it's the other more complicated or convoluted you should go with the simpler explanation. Typically, that's the proof and also more likely just because there's lots of play right, and so I would just, by default, go with that kind of parse money principle being 9-11 happened because some, you know, assholes stole some planes and crashed them into towers and big ol terrorist attack, because that's what is the main story on that. That's what really, I think everyone believes. I don't know what the conspiracy is about, like what the specific, like the specific things that they have questions are. So I don't know what they aren't what I would need to say. I don't have an opinion, I haven't researched enough. I only have the main stream belief, because I haven't actually looked into that one, just because it seemed I don't know, I haven't looked into it. I can't say fair enough uh, you're.
Speaker 1:I get what you're saying you're pretty straightforward with it. I mean, you see, you see what the what's in the history books and yeah, like that. Um, I mean I was. It happened in 2001 right. I was 11.
Speaker 2:I was 11 yeah, I was like five. No, it was six, six, so I don't really remember it I.
Speaker 1:I wasn't sure how old you were and I didn't want to be like so I would. I wasn't gonna be like so how old you are? Because I know, I know never ask a woman her age and her weight there you go. I wasn't gonna ask you how old you were. But I mean that just kind of answered it.
Speaker 1:But you're welcome yeah, like I was, I was 11 when it happened. So, at at the age of 11, I wasn't really into conspiracies, probably not. I was 11 years old. I was worried about like playing basketball. Like I'm gonna win win my next basketball game.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's, that's where my mindset was, and I believe that it was terrorists who did it, because that's what the news was telling me yeah but as I got older and I got into conspiracy, I started doing a lot of research and, uh, 9-11 is probably like my favorite conspiracies ever. I've done a lot of research on 9-11 and I have a lot of. I have a lot of beliefs. Yeah, what really happened that day? Just from my research, should I tell you my beliefs on it? Do you want to know?
Speaker 2:I mean, yeah, sure, why not?
Speaker 1:I'm curious, I have no idea all right, and if my listeners hear this, no big deal, because I will do a. I am gonna do an episode on 9-11 yeah.
Speaker 2:I 180,000 percent believe our government was behind like all of it, or just like a yes of it, every single one, every single was there a war for them to benefit, to go to, I guess yes yeah, so that it would be like considered a false flag operation yeah, and I will tell you real quick, just because do happen, so I do give that much credit.
Speaker 1:I'll tell you just because I will do an episode and I'll elaborate give me a sneak peek, why not? The reason we were behind 9-11 is because president, our president, was bush at the time. Classic him, though, george Bush. Yes, he needed a reason to go to war with um wreck sit down, sit down so I'm saying right, right even though you know been lying Osama been lying to credit for 9-11 yeah but it's a well-known fact that Osama been lying and was a CIA informant but then why did they kill him?
Speaker 1:to kill him. But bush needed a reason to go to war because Saddam Hussein tried to kill George HW Bush when he wasn't off. So our whole reason to go to war with Osama been lying was really to go to war with Saddam Hussein. Because who did we kill first? Saddam Hussein yeah we killed.
Speaker 1:We went after Saddam. We didn't go after been lining at first. They they claimed that we did and we just couldn't find them. The reason we couldn't find him is because he was a CIA informant. After 9-11 happened, the UR US government sent planes to get Osama been lying and his wife and kids out of the country. Why would we do that if he just fucking bombed our country? It doesn't make sense. It's kind of weird. Yes, we needed a reason to go to war and that was our reason?
Speaker 2:yeah, I mean. So what a false black operation is which has you? The US has done many times, and these are experts to see that I do believe in, because they just have straight up happened and we have evidence. There's no question, right? Um?
Speaker 1:there's 9-11 yeah, sounds like 9-11 could fall into that no for sure.
Speaker 2:It sounds similar to those. There was one with Mexico, there's been plenty. You just Google false legs operations you have like huh, the US is not good. Well, the US, american government, like military, does some bad shit our government's not good like the, the people and citizens yeah, your people, I mean some of us are good, some are bad, some are good, some are bad.
Speaker 2:That's just how people go. But but yeah, your government, especially military, is like guys, guys, what you doing, and like some of the cops, just like you know anyways, right, um, anyway, false legs, like the ones I've read about, I mean they do kill people as like, hey, these people killed our people, we're gonna kill them, kill them back right and I for an eye, which is not how the saying should go, but, um, the, the idea that they killed a thousand people is just a lot, but I mean that is possible. Um, because this, like more recent false flag operations that seem to have happened, are more targeting things where no one was harmed, but like product or ships, you know, kind of things that were not no human lives were as as much involved. Um, recent ones. But um, gosh man, that's terrible, killing a thousand of your own people and like ruin, like destroying two very iconic buildings. Terrible, more than a thousand, more than a thousand. How many people wait?
Speaker 1:way more than a thousand oh, I can't remember how? I don't. I don't have a correct number, but it was.
Speaker 2:It was just the other way.
Speaker 1:It was definitely a lot because you had the two planes that hit each tower. Okay you had the you had the plane that hit the pentagon, which there's so much with the pentagon, too, that I could get into. That doesn't make sense yeah but you had that plane. And then you had the plane that the passengers try to hijack back from the hijackers that crash in Pennsylvania man, there was a lot of planes and I realized, yeah, yeah, it was four planes total, but that's not including all the first responders, like the police officers, the firefighters, of course, who responded to 9-11, who lost their lives.
Speaker 2:Yeah, way more than a thousand there was like some famous actor that was a firefighter like he used, and then he also, on 9-11, was like pulling people out of the rubble. Yes, he was like you know, steve Buscemi. Yeah, he like straight up saved people and it's just like can you imagine being like I don't know, some crazy shit happens, and then you would think you had died. You'd be like I've died and I'm dead now, or this is a dream and I'm in a coma, like Steve Buscemi is just saving me from a pile of rubble.
Speaker 1:This makes no sense right yeah no, no, like I said, I know, I know so much about this conspiracy and I don't have to do it. I'm that'll be a good episode. I'm sure it'll be like a. It has to be like a three or four part show yeah, you gotta break it down yeah, for sure, but I'm for each plane exactly.
Speaker 2:But anyways, getting back to our conspiracy theory, the moon landing, um just I, we've mentioned it, but your your final take on it um conclusions, final conclusions I believe that you know um the good old astronauts Neil Armstrong, buzz Aldrin and Michael Collins, because we can't forget about him, even though we did make Charles also not as Charles, this episode featuring Charles, I like my brain goes to like Brooklyn 99, which is totally irrelevant, right, um, you know, but but yes, so given you know those three people and the 400 000 other scientists involved, like different names, but there's a lot of there's so many of them cool scientists.
Speaker 2:I'm like some badass female physicists and mathematicians that you should also respect and look up if you don't know. Um, anyways, those 400 000 people and those astronauts um successfully got humanity to the moon and we, you know, left our mark. There's plenty of moon rocks that we have. There's plenty of pictures of the footprints and the stuff we left behind. Um, a lot of it just kind of makes sense and, again, like the footage that we actually did watch rockets and so like, why would we spend that much money just to fake it in the end? Um, though, again, the cupric idea is very entertaining and I that is the one thing that I think is leaves the door open on it. Um, and the one thing, that loophole that's difficult to sort of close um, but overall, I would say they did a good job and they did it. We landed on the moon. That's my personal opinion on the matter.
Speaker 1:Okay, very interesting and uh, and going back into it, apollo 11 was obviously the first, first one on the moon but, if I remember correctly, we've had five successful Apollo missions yeah, something like that to the moon. So what's to say? All the rocks that we have from the moon aren't from like Apollo 12 and beyond yeah you know.
Speaker 1:So I mean, I mean we do have, we do have the, the original photos of like the moon rocks from Apollo 11 and all that. But, like we mentioned earlier, those could have been like doctor I don't know what they call, yeah, doctor, back in the 60s, 60s, early 70s, they could have been doctored. They could have not been doctored, who knows but what's to say? They weren't from like Apollo 12 or I don't know. If it just goes up in numbers, is it like 1515?
Speaker 1:sure, sure, let's say yes yes, but what's to say that they weren't from the other missions. So I don't know just if, for my mind kind of makes the possibility. The possibility would be that the first one was fake, but the later ones were not correct, because what if we, what if we didn't have the technology in 69 but in the later 70s we did? Because I think I think in the later 70s is when Apollo 12 landed. It was either the 70s or the 80s, I'm not.
Speaker 1:I'm not 100% sure I'd have to do more more research into Apollo 12, but what's to say that we didn't have the technology, if years later, to actually put us on the move right? And so I, I don't know. Um, like I said, we debunked a lot of this shit earlier than the whole Stanley Tribune thing with me. I don't know if I had to give my final assessment on it.
Speaker 1:Part of me wants to say 50-50, but a part of me wants to say 60-40 that we landed yeah um, I don't know, I get, I guess right now, just going off the facts of what we've talked about on the this episode, that 60-40, that we actually did land on the moon.
Speaker 2:So I'll land it on the moon, people, yes so.
Speaker 1:I'll give it, I'll give it to Buzz and I'll give it to to Neil and Charles, aka Michael cheers to our three favorite astronauts cheers right two favorite and one extra yeah yeah, so, uh, so I, yeah, I guess I would go with that. We actually did land on the moon. So this conspiracy this is probably the first conspiracy actually that I go with that we act like it wasn't actually conspiracy no way, yeah, that's because all my other ones like, uh, especially like the reptilian people, I believe they're out there, I believe we do.
Speaker 1:I saw. I saw the video of Justin Bieber when his eyes changed. I don't know did you see the video?
Speaker 2:you don't know, but I. The trouble with modern conspiracies is that everything can so easily be CGI, photoshop, whatever that I like, that's true, I have great difficulty like this, the moon landing and stuff like that it's all so it's like easier to kind of like it's more straightforward yeah, it's more straightforward, it's like modern stuff like that.
Speaker 2:I'm like, oh, there's like so easy to just fake something and be like, ooh, look at this thing, that this video, and you're like, well, that's like that's just a video on the internet that could be anything right you know, I don't know but but no, this, this is I. If but then it was a Canadian.
Speaker 1:So I'm curious like Justin Bieber is a reptilian so let's say after, after, after we end this, go to YouTube and type in Justin Bieber, reptilian or his it was.
Speaker 1:It was one of his arrests. When he's in his jumpsuit and it's like take, it's showing him and there's a video of him and you can see him just like dead, dead face just staring, and then his eyes you see it in his eyes they like flip and then they come back to normal. It's really fucking weird. I don't know, because he is Canadian too he is a Canadian, he is not a great.
Speaker 2:Canadian. Oh no, I don't, no, yeah he's my cousin, he's my cousin. We're super related you never know you never know. It's like everlevines, canadian, and like I like had friends who were American and like other friends who'd be like do you know everlevine? Because, like they think Canada is so much smaller than it is, like we're a small country theories with everlevine yeah, she's apparently dead, or? No she has a doppelganger, that well she no, she died.
Speaker 1:And then they replaced her with someone because she made. She was making money at the time and they didn't want to lose out on them. I have heard that whole, another whole, other episode other one. Yeah, maybe I can, maybe I can have you back and we'll talk about everlevine bring on the Canadian to talk about Canadians right every conspiracy theory that comes out of Canada. I'll have you back.
Speaker 2:Fantastic, I'll have to just make my own so that I'm guaranteed to say hi, right, that's funny all right, victoria, it's been good episode, been fun to talk to you.
Speaker 1:I hope that, like I know, you came into this believing you're like a hundred percent that we land like US landed on the moon. But I hope with the little 40 percent of you swayed me a little.
Speaker 2:I've been curious. I'm like the cubric thing I give is the one thing I did not see in my research. That, you know, makes me question some things. Um, I, it didn't sway me a lot, but I do. It is entertaining. That is the one piece of evidence that I can see why you would be on the fence but it it swayed you enough to make you think a little bit oh for sure, my brain's okay, my gears are rolling all right.
Speaker 1:Well, I did my job, because this is, this is my, my side job. So like, yeah, a little bit to to open your mind a little bit more to thinking that it could have been fake, but, as as me and you both stand, we think that the US made it to them which is a fun thought.
Speaker 2:Like that's the most optimistic thinking. It's like, hey, we actually did it. Like fuck, yeah, let me I say we is, if I'm American, but I'm not okay, today we count you as American.
Speaker 1:I'm an honorary American, thank you, yes, yes, it's okay, like my country better yeah yeah, our country is shit right now with the election and, oh my god, everything every like we used to be the best country in the world. No offense to canga.
Speaker 2:I've been to Canada one time oh yeah and that's just um Windsor oh, that's not even anything remotely exciting, but okay.
Speaker 1:I'm only like an hour away because I mean that.
Speaker 2:Okay, that makes sense, because the bridge to Detroit.
Speaker 1:Detroit connects to Windsor with the bridge. I see that makes sense then you're you're in uh oh, I'm way.
Speaker 2:I'm like BC, so I'm far west coast. Yeah, so you're close to Seattle yes, in, uh, yeah, seattle.
Speaker 1:But yeah, you're like on the other side and I'm like way of that, but um, yeah, like I'm still torn about this one.
Speaker 2:I feel like I broke you.
Speaker 1:I'm so sorry a little bit, a little bit, but you should read the mathematical equation about this series theory.
Speaker 2:It's very interesting.
Speaker 1:I will, actually I'm I will actually look into that, because now I'm very curious oh yeah.
Speaker 2:No, that's one of my favorites anyway yeah, as I stand, I get.
Speaker 1:I guess we landed on the moon.
Speaker 2:I guess we did.
Speaker 1:He says part of me still hopes that crew brick was a fucking mastermind and just faked everything you can still agree.
Speaker 2:He's a master, mastermind and it's fantastic films.
Speaker 1:Tushae, he, he did so. One one of the best directors, but uh, anyways, thank you again for coming on tonight. Uh loved having you on. Tell my followers where they can find you on social media.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, totally, um, it's been a joy. Thanks for having me. Um, you can follow me at drunk ukulele on twitter. That is my username. I have never changed it to be more professional. I don't know if I ever want to, because it's just hilarious. I don't like that name so don't change it perfect.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, drunk ukulele on twitter is my twitter handle. Um, uh, you, mostly I'm just good at my website, which is victoriafrazorca, so Fraser, fraser and, uh, you can find me from there. I again the writer, I'm a pie gas editor, so I have a little lot of skills that I use. That's kind of my job. For anyone looking for anything like that or just wanting to have a fun twitter friend who posts silly things, that's also what I do all right, perfect.
Speaker 1:Uh, thanks again for coming on tonight. Uh, my followers you can find me on facebook at uh drunk conspiracy podcast discussion group, instagram drunk conspiracy podcast. Um, again, thanks for coming on and uh, it's been a pleasure. I had a good, good conversation. You kind of uh kind of pushed me more into the believing that we, we land on the moon you're welcome.
Speaker 2:I'm happy to be Canadian, not even an American. No, there you go. We're just so darn nice up here. You know that's true.
Speaker 1:I'm so sorry my poor, horrible nice niceness is rubbing up on you you're fine, but uh again, victoria, thank you for coming on and, uh, hopefully we can have you on in the future. Thanks so much. All right, have a good night, I guess.