"Black Canary Cry: Amplifying Black Women's Voices in Comics and Anime Cosplay"

Are you ready to hear from a comic book enthusiast who's been on the front lines of conventions and cosplay? Our intriguing guest peels back the pages of her life-long love for comics, anime, and cosplay - a journey that started with her family's history of collecting comic books. She unravels her personal experiences at conventions and grappling with race-bending characters, emphasizing the importance of respectful representation for characters of color.

We also crack open the sometimes murky world of representation for black people in the realms of comics and anime. We analyze the characters of Perry White, Jimmy Olsen, Starfire, and Naomi, asking the hard-hitting question - are they truly advancing the industry or merely ticking boxes? We don't shy away from discussing the lack of sustainability for characters of color and the potential for change through upcoming titles featuring black and indigenous characters. Tune in as we also explore how the power of social media can be harnessed to educate about the rich history of black characters in comics. Get ready to embark on a deep exploration of the world of comics and anime!

“The world isn’t perfect. But it’s there for us, doing the best it can… that’s what makes it so damn beautiful.” — Roy Mustang (Full Metal Alchemist)

Follow Christina on TikTok @drkaori
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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:28

One Well. Good afternoon everyone and welcome to the latest episode of superhero politics. We have a very special guest with us today. As always, I don't try to take over that. I turn it over to our guests and let them introduce themselves and tell them, tell you guys about who they are and the interest and we're going to get into the questions here in a minute, so I will introduce our guests. We met on tick tock her channel. Please forgive me for butchering this doctor. I'm going to turn it over to you and tell them a little bit about yourself and your history and comic books and anime.

Speaker 2: 1:33

Hi, I'm a worry. I literally just came up with that name because my favorite villain from Sailor Moon is a way from the sailors Saturn thing that was going on. I started reading comic books when I was like really little, like third grade ish, which is actually the same time that my dad started reading comics. And my dad's been collecting comic books since the 60s and I've read pretty much all of them. We've got about 6000 comics in our garage and the only reason I know that is because I used to organize them all and I would catalog everything to go in which boxes, what series was it? How many is in that series? And I just like tally them up and be like, oh, we have like 6000 conflicts. Now my dad's like why?

Speaker 1: 2:32

So what? What region of the country are you?

Speaker 2: 2:35

in. I'm currently in Nevada. I live in Vegas. We I was born in Los Angeles, raised in Tennessee and then we moved to Las Vegas a couple years ago.

Speaker 1: 2:48

So obviously, you know, the West Coast has a has a very rich history of comics and and I think you know, with movie production and a lot of things is happening out there. San Diego Comic Con is one of the biggest ones of the cons. Have you in your family ever gotten into the cons or participating in the cons? I know you're a huge cosplayer. You have, you know, some some incredible cosplay on your site and so have you guys ever gotten into the cons and what was that like, the experience like for you?

Speaker 2: 3:26

Um, I've never been to like a big one. I will be going to like my first big one this year, so it'll be Dragon Con in Atlanta. I'm going to that one. It's my first time going to like a big one. I've been wanting to go to San Diego Comic Con. I had tickets to go to San Diego Comic Con and we lost my grandmother and we were planning the funeral and I told them you know, as long as the funeral is before this date or after this date, we're good. And they put it on that date and I was like, now, why would you do that? So I had to cancel my tickets, only for them to move the dates to two months prior. And they're like, well, you were going to the thing and I was like, well, I sold the tickets. They got the tickets back now, so you know, but we're going, I'm doing that.

Speaker 2: 4:16

My first con was in Chattanooga. It was kind of it was like con Nougat, it was kind of small because Chattanooga is really not that big. It was fun though. It was a really fun experience. One of my friends who's a really big cosplayer came down there and it was fun to be around and see people who I've never thought cosplay before cosplay. We got to sit in there on some panels. There was a Disney panel we sat in on. That was really cool. We watched some people do some video games, but overall, like the experience of the con was really cool. I did have kind of like a slight issue before when I did Typhoid Mary from Marvel and it was just like, well, isn't she white? And I was like she is, but not today. So I've gone through like a lot of my friends who are really great cosplayers and we get the same thing that character isn't black and I'm like, well, you know what they are today.

Speaker 1: 5:26

Yeah, and so that's one of the things that we always want to address is, like you know there's and you do a fantastic job, folks. If you guys follow KOARY on TikTok, you will see that she does an amazing job of finding and cataloging heroes of color, like heroes and villains of color Every time, like it's so many that comes out. I like them because it reminds me of representation and stuff that we don't really speak of because it's not so prominent, and so when you do race bend a character, you get that pushback simply because black characters or characters of color haven't been that prevalent in comics or in really less so in anime. So you know, when you guys go out, is it really, is it a lot of pushback, or do you guys just hear people kind of under their breath challenging you guys on the fact that you raised bent a character?

Speaker 2: 6:29

A lot of the times it's kind of in the background because you know some people will be like oh my God, I recognize that character, you did a really good job. And then, like somebody else in that group, they'd like you know I thought that character was different race and you know they'll either tell them well, you can do whatever you want to like, as long as you're not, like you know, black-facing a character. I think that's where some people get confused because, like people there are women who love Storm, who are not black, and they feel like because they're not black, they can't cosplay. Of course you can, as long as you have the hair, the eyes, the outfit. We know who you are. It's really not that big deal.

Speaker 2: 7:10

But, like you know, if you decide that you're going to paint your face brown for some reason, you don't have to do that, just like you don't have to like shape your eyes to be a Japanese character that you saw in an anime. Like you don't have to do any of that, and so it's always like it's not really upfront until you get online, but like when they're in your face they don't want the physical consequences of what they say. So they'll be like oh my God, I love that. That is really cool. And then they'll get back later on on some anonymous page and be like oh my God, I can't believe she did that. That character's not black, so it kind of depends on, like, how bold they want to be.

Speaker 1: 7:57

Because we were just at Galaxy Con in Raleigh here in North Carolina and I saw several different iterations of Starfire. Now we've got the Anna Jop Starfire from Titans and people went nuts about that. But I saw white Starfires and I saw Black Starfires and I saw folks who literally did the orange you know Teen Titans, body paint, starfire, and so it's really. There are really no rules as long as I don't think you're disrespectful to the character. And so I think sometimes you know, if there's a black character that white people want to portray, they feel like they have to do the physical embodiment of it and not the spirit of the character. And I think this is where we get into these consequences and we get into these conflicts it's because you don't feel like you can represent the character without the color.

Speaker 2: 8:53

Make it interesting guys.

Speaker 1: 8:54

And it's really the spirit of the character that we all should be coming together around. So when you and your friends get together and you guys cosplay, like, how much of the inspiration of the original character do you take and how much dramatic license being that the character is not originally of color how much creative license do you take with it from that when you decide?

Speaker 2: 9:23

I sometimes think like it's like an even split. So my sister wants to do Jessica Rabbit, but the only thing that she's really going to do is the hair, the makeup, the dress, the gloves, because there's not too much else that you can do with that character. So I guess it just depends on which character it is, because you can do like a 50-50 split, like the exact spirit of the character and then your own little spin. So when I do a character from like a video game, ari, for example, from League of Legends, I love her, but I always choose a skin of hers. Because she has so many different skins, I always choose a skin of hers to do because then I can get a little bit more creative with it.

Speaker 2: 10:16

So like how Storm has a million of one different outfits because she is absolutely a fashion icon, I chose for her a outfit that she had it's all pink outfit, white person. She went to Mullins. I chose that because then I could get creative with the things in my closet. So it just depends on what you want to do, but it can always be 50-50, or you're going to take the idea of, oh, she wore this outfit in this universe one time and then that's the only thing that you take is the outfit, and then just the rest of it is just your own complete spin. So it's like a 90-10 split type thing when we pick ours.

Speaker 2: 11:02

We want to do the Powerpuff Girls as a group cosplay, but we found the colors and we know their personalities, so which girl goes to their personality? And then the colors and then the outfit is just us. Whatever outfit we put together, however we choose to wear hair, afro or gown, but it's just like kind of. You have to just kind of decide if you want to be the exact character or if you want to have the inspiration of the character and be yourself with whatever you put together.

Speaker 1: 11:38

I remember a couple years back in cosplay there was a big kind of steampunk thing running, Like everybody was doing versions of character and steampunk.

Speaker 2: 11:49

And it was. It was fine, yeah.

Speaker 1: 11:51

Yeah, and it never really resonated with me, but I get it.

Speaker 1: 11:55

And then you had the Batman by Gaslight come out and it was really set in that Victorian area around the steampunk and so there was kind of a push of that. But why is it so important for young women of color, and black women in particular, to really assert themselves in the world of fantasy and animation and anime? Why is it really important? Because I know we have these battles around representation and we have these battles around what we're trying to portray in terms of the fandom and accuracy and people are really on comic book accuracy, which is really just a code word for keeping it white. Why is it so important that you guys take a stand, that women take a stand and be represented in all facets of fandom and I mean I'm not just talking about in color, but also in height, in shape, in body representation, because comic books always paint a very unrealistic version view of the female body. And so why is it really important for young women of all shapes and sizes and colors to be represented in the fandom today?

Speaker 2: 13:18

It's just because we like growing up we didn't have it. So my very first anime was Akira, and then after that it was Princess Mononoke. So Princess Mononoke, that's my girl. However, there are exactly zero people of color in the movie. But I love that movie.

Speaker 2: 13:40

And when we get into, like character black characters who were represented in Dragon Ball Z with the big lips and the dark skin, and they changed Mr Coco from being black to blue at some point in time but he was like midnight dark with these super people in it. But then you get into characters from Naruto, where the only issue with the any black character that I had in Naruto wasn't even how they looked, it was how he was talking. Killer B was talking like rap lyrics, almost. So I'm like ills.

Speaker 2: 14:16

But because we get people from I think she's from Hunter Hunter, canary, where she is just absolutely amazing and then the New Castlevania coming out where we have black and indigenous vampires and that fight between the voodoo girl I think her name's gonna be Annette's and the black vampire and they have that fight going on, I'm like what the heck? And it's important, because what we were watching when we were younger was not us Like we could connect with them on a personality level, but on a looking level we can't, and so I think it's just really important that we get that push and everybody's so excited for these characters that are coming in, like Generation V for the boys, where we've got some black characters coming through with some powers and it's just like an invincible bullet. Proof is about to come in, the rag is about to come in and I'm just like I'm here for it, all of it. I'm so ready.

Speaker 1: 15:13

Yeah, and I think the biggest thing is that and I'm glad you said, mr Popo, because honestly, I grew up and I'm much older than you and I grew up in watching the 1932 match fly shirt Superman cartoons, where the Japanese people were like the Asian people, were drawn with the very slant eyes and the big teeth, and black people had the big pronounced white lips and the very dark skin with the small plaids and things, and I remember that. And even with things like Looney Tunes, when they would shoot them and blow them up, they would resemble the little nigglets, the little nigglet cart babies that they used to make in the South during slavery, and it was always this, such a negative representation of what black people look like. And so now, as we progress with the art, we should see a more physically accurate view of what we look like. I was just watching my adventures with Superman and Perry White is black and Jimmy Olsen is now a brown kid. But if you look at the hands, the way the hands are drawn like, it still has that homage to the old anime style, the way they drew black people with the very pronounced shades of things like lips and hands and stuff like that.

Speaker 1: 16:43

And so we haven't all haven't gotten there, but I can say we're definitely moving in the right direction. But it's gonna take pushes from creators like yourself to be able to inspire the artists and the writers in the room and then, hopefully, creators like yourself and myself we get in the rooms to be able to influence that. And so what do you see in terms of the direction of the industry from reaching out to creators like yourself who have this, who are able to influence what people see in terms of the representation of the characters? Have you been reached out to by anyone and said hey, you've got a clearly large following on across social media. Is there an opportunity for you to get in, to, maybe influence that? Is that something you wanna do one day?

Speaker 2: 17:33

I do. Actually, one time when I was doing Trinary, marvel's official page had, like the video, shared the video and they kind of just like kept it because Trinary is kind of like one of their new and I think she's from Iraq, I wanna say. But I haven't reached out to personally but I do have other creator friends who are with platforms a bit bigger than mine, who have been reached out to and they've kind of given their ideas and we are kind of seeing it. We're kind of seeing the try. Some people are trying a little bit too hard, like when they did the what if for Miles Morales and he was Thor and it was so bad. But then you know, they Did the one when he was Wolverine, when they did what if you were in Wolverine was great. The third one was not great. I don't know why they got that.

Speaker 1: 18:34

This. I just talked about this at on my panel at galaxy con. I literally just talked about the fact that, if I ever see like there were no black people in the room when this was discussed there couldn't have been anybody in the room because it never would have made it to the light of day If there was any black people in the room that said you guys can't put this out, like it was really that that was one of the worst, most disrespectful almost what else that I've ever seen like I. I love Miles Morales, I love Thor, both of those characters. But the idea that you would just take Thor, take Miles Morales and reduce him to some, you know, really bad hip-hop slang.

Speaker 2: 19:23

Speaking in the rap lyrics and when they did, the one who was playing sif and she came in and she was like hot wings coming in high and I was like what? And then he is me on here was graffiti and graffiti. And then when he was a biotin fade and I was like he doesn't even have hair, so why are we doing that part?

Speaker 1: 19:51

It was. Honestly it was, it was. It was disrespectful like it and I don't I don't think there's any other word I can really use to describe it was. It was like a black spoilation film from the 70s. It was like so disrespectful. But you know, and I think this is where we have to make sure that we're not Just accepting representation for representation sake, because just because there's a black or a brown face as a prominent character, does it mean it's always good and it doesn't mean that it's it's progressing or Doesn't mean that it's moving the ball forward. It could be setting us back.

Speaker 2: 20:31

Yeah, and I was almost kind of how I felt when they did, when they did do Starfire in Titans, like she here is our token black character, yeah, and then she was just she like had hooker clothes on and I was like, okay, and then they tried to erase that by making her a bit bigger and then, but then they brought in her sister and her sister was like it felt like a setback to me and I'm like so are we going to go forward or are we going to go back? What is happening? And then when they did Naomi, nobody watched Naomi. As powerful and as great as Naomi's story is, nobody watched Naomi.

Speaker 2: 21:16

Because the first five minutes of the first episode I thought I was gonna be sick. I was like this is absolute garbage and I don't understand the Vixen. Vixen should have had her own show or movie by now. They gave her a cartoon on the CW that came on at three o'clock in the morning. They want us three o'clock in the morning. If you didn't catch the three, everybody don't watch it. And I was like our truth is so bad and it's like there are so many really good characters, which is why I do the comic book characters. I was like everybody that I've ever talked to. I'm like who's your favorite black character? And it's always the same ones. It's blade, green Lantern, storm, black panther, luke Cage. And then I'm like, well, you know, there are this list of people and they're like I've never heard of them, I know.

Speaker 1: 22:03

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 22:04

I know. And this is why this is where they do that all the time. They introduce a really good one, and then they just go away.

Speaker 1: 22:12

And this is why I Really so much love your, your page, because I think the first time I really discovered your page and what caused me to follow you was you introduced Trevor Barnes. You reminded of you were talking about interracial relationships in Comics and you brought up Wonder Woman's black boyfriend and I remember that. I remember that those series of Comics and it just clipped. I was like, oh my god, trevor Barnes. I remember Like because he was from Charlotte, like he was from North Carolina, and I remember that that's what kind of remember mine to me and I was just like there's so much history where we had, you know this, this really this blip of Representation and it just got wiped away. You know, you know Batman has had interracial relationships and you know Barry Allen has had interracial relationships. There's been so many times where You've had these relationships that just didn't work out, and I mean obviously they With the, the CW flash, with Iris Allen being black now, and so it's been there but it hasn't been sustained and so like.

Speaker 1: 23:31

This is why your channel and and and folks that do what you do on social media, it's so important to the fandom is because it's the education. So we don't feel like we have to necessarily argue to race being the character. There is a rich history of our character representation in comic books. Now, hopefully going forward, we see it in anime, like you know, with with Castlevania coming up, I remember afro samurai, like all those. But I would love to see more in anime like is that something that you Want? Because the anime folks came hard? It's the cons like. They come hard at the cons, even more so than superhero Cosplayers. Is that what you're hoping for in the next you know few years that we see more of what, say, castlevania is doing in the anime world?

Speaker 2: 24:24

I do and I think Because I think a lot of people also missed out on yasuke, mainly because, I mean, the story wasn't center focused around him, like I think people wanted it to be. But if they were to get a new season, the director was like I have a yasuke focused one here. So something like yasuke, definitely something like what castlevania is about to do. Cannonbusters was not bad to me. I absolutely loved that. So like people were like hey, that shows, like how, and even when we had some Hispanic representation with sayes, monos and Tracy, just like the representation was there. But it's like it wasn't a A Japanese solo studio who did it, it was somebody here who teamed up with a Japanese studio.

Speaker 2: 25:15

So I would absolutely love for, just like straight Japanese anime to give us characters, like especially the way that they did Hunter hunter with canary, and when they did the characters from Naruto, I Loved them. They looked normal. It was just that one who it was killer bee who was talking, was driving me insane, but his design was amazing and then, of course, he was badass. So it was like I want that and hopefully, when people see how we get this black and indigenous vampires in Castlevania, that it'll push more forward and we get like the more representation. There are some, like webtoons and manga, who do have really good designs for black characters, so hopefully they come Forward with.

Speaker 1: 26:09

So what? So what are you reading now? So what? What if, if you had your, if you want to share with the folks your playlist, like, what are you reading? What are you watching now? Because you're always on point with With either the historical aspect of comics and anime or what's coming down the pipe. So what are you watching right now?

Speaker 2: 26:31

What do you? Right now I'm getting ready for a soca because a soca is about to come out. But I did find some new anime, zom 100. Of course that one's really good, relatable, because of course I would love for the zombie apocalypse to keep me from going from work. My card is one that I think is so underrated and it's not talked about at all. It has two people of color in there for sure. I don't know what the. I don't know what they are, but they're definitely of color and really, really interesting to look at. High card is a really really good anime.

Speaker 2: 27:16

And then, as far as reading, the JLA versus Godzilla and King Kong is about to come out, so I'm waiting for that. And of course, this whole wedding ceremony between Emma Frost and Tony Stark going into the fold X and then like just kind of the relationship friendship that's forming between Wanda and Storm Is getting my is like it needs more attention because I think people forget that she does have magical prowess and now that Wanda's mother Died and became the mother of all witchcraft, anybody who is connected to Wanda is now connected straight into like all the most powerful magic. So I'm like, now that she can in you her lightning magic. We have a problem here.

Speaker 1: 28:05

He is definitely a problem and the crazy thing is, I don't think, I think people Understand how powerful storm is, what nobody knows how powerful storm is. Because if you look at her, her mutant ability and the, the omega level mutant ability, people forget about the fact that she is literally a Godhead, like, like, has the goddess head and Magic, and I think people don't understand that. And now that that and I agree with you I would love to see that the relationship fleshed out, and I'm always, you know, I'm always the one that I love to see characters, especially main characters, get a boost. Like I love that, like I I don't believe in nerfing characters. I believe, if that character is supposed to be powerful, that character supposed to be powerful and like I want to see it, and so Storm getting this and and and increasing her magical ability.

Speaker 1: 29:05

I'm here, I'm definitely here for it. So, so those are some great suggestions. So when are you going to be next and where can people find you? Just give yourself a plug and then we'll. We'll wrap up for today. Um, well, like I said, at the end of the month I will be in Atlanta for Dragon.

Speaker 2: 29:26

Con and then I would be in LA in December for LA comic-con. I'm not sure if I'm gonna be there, but I'm gonna be there. I'm gonna be in LA in December for LA comic-con, but I am, of course, always on tiktok, k-wari Akari, it should still be that. And then our my nerd on the street has a Podcast that we started. We are about to be on episode three at our four-year anniversary is actually the first day of Dragon Con, on the 31st of this month. So we finally got the podcast kicked off and it's on Apple Music, spotify, google Podcast, samsung podcast, all stuff. And then we have our YouTube channel. Now we just go, we go live on tiktok and then I have like the replay on our YouTube channel, which is nerd on the street still.

Speaker 1: 30:20

So yeah, well, folks, all that will be in the show notes. You'll be able to find links To Christina and all the great stuff that she's doing. Follow her, like her channel, blow it up, guys, if you want to be educated on anime and comics, there's definitely want to follow, and so we appreciate you being here today. I know you're on the west coast so it's a little earlier. It is on the east coast, but great to talk to you. Um, just all the great stuff that we, you're doing.

Speaker 1: 30:50

I commend you for being a great example for young women who are really pushing forward in this industry. Pushing the door, kicking the door is open Representation and doing it very well. You guys are. You know, guys, you guys are inspirational. I have I have two, you know, teenage daughters who love anime and they love comic books, and you know you're a great Representation of the fact that you can do this and and do it at a high level and Be true to yourself and and the characters, and so thank you for being with us today and we really appreciate you being a guest until we're politics podcast.

Speaker 2: 31:30

Thank you for having me, it was fun.

Speaker 1: 31:32

Absolutely, like I said, go follow Christina, dr Kari. Great follow and folks remember we all have. We're all connected in this world. We're all connected in this, this fandom. It's room for everybody. No, we, we don't have to gatekeep, we don't have to push folks out. We, we can open the door and we can see some really great interpretations of this material, because it's it's fantasy, it's imagination. It's the one place where we can all come together and express ourselves Without condemnation, without, without pushback. You know, be kind to one another, continue to push forward the industry for everyone and, like I said, we always stay on superhero politics podcast. You don't have to be superhuman to be a superhuman. Until next time. This is your host, michael Holmes, and we'll see you on the next episode.

Speaker 2: 32:24

Thanks, christina, thanks, bye, bye.