In this week's episode, Carolin Vandenberg steps into the dojo to provide her experience and insights into coaching. As a Master Coach, Carolin's lessons help leaders find their internal coach, and seeks to break down the barriers that prevent us all from being better in the workplace, at home and everywhere in between.
It's November 3rd - and that also means it's a very (VERY) important day - World Sandwich Day! So, fire up your toasters, get the mayo ready and stick around to the end as we rank each of our top 3 go-to sandwiches!
The Biz Dojo - Podcast, Production & Professional Coaching
Website | Facebook | Instagram | LinkedIn | Twitter
In this week's episode, Carolin Vandenberg steps into the dojo to provide her experience and insights into coaching. As a Master Coach, Carolin's lessons help leaders find their internal coach, and seeks to break down the barriers that prevent us all from being better in the workplace, at home and everywhere in between.
It's November 3rd - and that also means it's a very (VERY) important day - World Sandwich Day! So, fire up your toasters, get the mayo ready and stick around to the end as we rank each of our top 3 go-to sandwiches!
The Biz Dojo - Podcast, Production & Professional Coaching
Website | Facebook | Instagram | LinkedIn | Twitter
Welcome to Episode Five of The Biz Dojo with Seth and JP. This week, we had a wonderful conversation with Carolyn Vandenberg master coach with integral coaching, running her own company, also CV coaching and consulting. And JP, I thought it was a really nice conversation that we have with Carolyn.
JP Gaston:Yeah, it's great to get in side the head of a person who coaches, coaches,
Seth Anderson:coaches, coaches. Yeah. And I think we talked about it a little bit in the pod, you know, a lot of times we associate a coach, especially with sports, given sort of our backgrounds and where we've come from. And I think when you get into business, it's, you know, it's, it's tough to kind of make that link to having a coach and having somebody there to kind of support you and give you some framework to some of the things that you're going to come up against in a in a corporate business setting. But you know, both you and I, we've we've been through a variety of coaching courses, and some of the stuff that Carolyn has taught us over the years has been really helpful in helping us get to where we are
JP Gaston:today. Oh, for sure. It's amazing to me how many people don't think that a coach will help or that they think they just know what to do in the business world. And you think about some of the highest level athletes out there who really do know what they're doing making millions of dollars, they have multiple coaches or even you know, musicians have singing coaches. And it's just every, every other sort of industry outside of the kind of the corporate business world or the entrepreneur business world seems to have really embraced coaching in in what they do, but for some reason there's a bit of a stigmatism sometimes around coaching in the business world.
Seth Anderson:Yeah, you know, and I think we probably came from the same place initially, you know, when we went into these coaching programs, it was kind of like, Huh, what, what is this? Like?
JP Gaston:It's why am I here?
Seth Anderson:Yeah, kind of fluffy, you know, is this really going to help me but, you know, there's things that I learned when I, when I first went through some of these courses that are still with me, and the one that I use probably on a daily basis is the positive idea, positive feedback. So really flipping your mind around a lot of us are conditioned, when we come up, we get a lot of negative feedback, negative reinforcement, I guess, you know, don't do this, don't do that. Why did you do this? Why do you do that, which can kind of put you in a place of fear versus kind of trying to do the right thing out of the gate. So for me, you know, flipping that around in my mind, and you know, being cognizant of it, and giving people positive ideas, or positive feedback, as you go through the day to day at work, it makes a huge difference. And it's totally translatable. Not just in the business setting, but in sports or parenting or whatever. Just flipping to the the positive idea positive feedback,
JP Gaston:when you're when you're supporting and coaching, someone can make a huge difference when everyone knows or talks about how important it is to listen. But how often do you actually do it and not just to other people, but to yourself to, to individuals who might be able to give you support. And in this case, to a coach to someone who's actually meant to be there to listen to what you're trying to accomplish and help you get to that end stage that you're working towards. And I think, certainly my experience, and I know we've talked a fair bit about your experience with with Carolyn as well. She, she does that so well. And it really makes you think about you know, who you are, what you're doing, why you're doing the things you're doing. And it helps you become not just a better coach in the workplace, but a better person 100%
Seth Anderson:Well, that's enough of us blabbing. Let's, let's get into it. Here's Carolyn.
Voiceover:This week, we're joined by master coach, David Burton, CV coaching and consulting. We talk about managing emotional intelligence, finding success of coaching and working with others towards a common goal. So sit back, put your earphones on. And welcome to Episode Five of The Biz Dojo.
Seth Anderson:Carolyn bannenberg. really a pleasure to have you in the dojo. You're a professional coach, Master coach at that in the business space. You have your own company. I know you work with a lot of large companies across Canada, us as well or just
Unknown:in the US. So taking companies that have us offices, so extending the work to their leaders there.
Seth Anderson:I think JP and I, well, I know I have for sure had the chance to work with you in the past. And it's been an absolute pleasure. I know we were talking about this a little bit earlier today. It's probably you know, 567 years ago, the first time we interacted in one of the coaching excellence classes and some of the the frameworks and coaching that you gave me have stuck with me, you know, over the last half decade as I've built teams and led and supported people. So I just wanted to start off by saying thank you Because it's been, you know, it's been a real pleasure working with you. And when I was coming up with the concept for this podcast, one of the things we wanted to do was get into talking about coaching and, and sort of bringing it not just from a sports lens, because I think that's where JP and I sort of default to, and we could find a lot of, you know, hockey coaches, basketball coaches from our lives and bring them on the show, which we are going to do. But, you know, from a business context, you you're, you know, I think, a leader in that space, and we're excited to have you on Well, thank
Carolin Vandenberg:you very much. And, and I think you've paid me the greatest compliment in my for me and why I became a coach. And that is that you know, the experience you had with me, and what you've learned about yourself and things you took away, you continue to put into practice. And that's the most, that's what I'm here to do. That's what I've always wanted to do is help others, be clear on who they are, what they're capable of who they want to be how they want to live, how they want to lead, and then find ways to do that, that works with them. And to start to really have them show up to be the leader, they want to be in their organization. So thank you for that.
Seth Anderson:You're most welcome that we've you know, sort of around in the pod to this point is just getting a little bit of your background. And I know I know a little bit about your story, I think it's you know, super relevant to a lot of people, you know, you get into the business world, and you have a lot of success, you know, whatever that means to you, you have the career growth, you've climbed the corporate ladder, maybe just give us a little taste of sort of where you came from, and how you ended up in this this whole coaching space
Unknown:for sure. And it's always an interesting question, because I have a marketing background, I've spent a lot of my corporate years in marketing. It's that elevator pitch, who are you tell us in 30 seconds, who you are. And I don't know about you, but I always felt the pressure to come up with the best, like, what do I say to people. And through my, I guess, my journey and how I see my growth and development, how I've ended up where I am today, it's really been a series of adventures, and no one instant has defined me, it's just a combination of paths and experiences. And so it's looking at where I've come from as a series of chapters. So I'm going to kind of give you a few chapters of my life that hopefully you'll see some connections to where I am now and where I'm going in the future. So I think what's what's always interesting for me when I say to people is I'm the oldest of four girls, with parents both from Newfoundland, my mum's a nurse, and she was a psychiatric nurse for almost 40 years. My dad was a high school teacher who eventually went into the military. And so being a military brat, we moved as a family every two to three years to different locations across Canada. Get we always return to new Finland routes. Every summer I spent months with my grandparents playing with my cousins vacationing with family and cousins. And that sense of family and connections, I think, was really important for who I am and how I've kind of lived my life as a child. I think like most kids love to play, love to watch people was an avid reader. And I would say very active and what was the defining moment for me is think about my journey was when I came to Ottawa, my dad was stationed here, and I was just starting High School, and never had really because we move so often never really had gotten into any particular sport, love to try new things and have new experiences and played a variety of different sports, but never stayed anywhere long enough to hone it as a skill or as a as an athletic endeavor. And once I came to Ottawa and got into high school, I had the benefit of having coaches who saw potential, saw what I could be capable of doing and through their coaching, really thrived and became a competitive track athlete and also a competitive basketball player played what you would what you would probably see the similar as a triple A team women's basketball team here in Ottawa called the auto rookies, and then went on to play at university. When you think about defining moments, I was, I was the first athlete at my high school to go to ofsaa, which is the Ontario Provincial championships and also the first female to go. So you know, it's things like that, that in the moment you don't necessarily think about but are quite defining moments and who you are and where you go to next. After University. I so early 20s did a solo trip for about 18 months and travelled across Europe and Turkey and Southeast Asia and Australia. And then came back and kind of settled into a career working in high tech and healthcare global organizations, mostly customer facing, so marketing, customer service and business development. And there really felt that that was the training ground for how I learn how I lead and how I chose this profession of coaching. Along the way, you know, had tremendous mentors and inspiring leaders and saw a lot of failure at times, which is also important along the journey. And then about in 2007, I left corporate world, really, because the only way I can describe it, Seth and JP was I had a calling, there was something bigger out there that I wanted to be in service to. And although at the time, I wasn't able to fully articulate it, I could feel it. And it was pulling me out of the organization. And what helped me was a coach, I was in an organization just promoted to Vice President. And as part of my promotion was given an executive coach for a year. And through the series of conversations, she gave me the space to really listen to what I wanted, get out of the noise, and, you know, expectations of their path. And, you know, success and leading teams, all of that, in an organization just sit quietly and hear what I really wanted to do. And it was through that, that helping me find the language to get clarity and conviction that I wanted to be an executive coach. And that's where I wanted to spend my life energy. And from there, it was a matter of what's my first step. Now, it's been 10 years later. And I've been working with individuals and executives, their teams and teams within organizations around leadership, how to be better teams, individuals around particular skills. And I feel like I've literally, I'm living my purpose. And I'm just so excited about what the next 10 years is going to unfold for me, and the clients that I have the privilege of working with,
Seth Anderson:there's so many things I want to double click on right now.
Unknown:I've given you a lot. And I also want to say, you know, I'm a mom, I'm a wife, I have a husband who works in high tech, you know, he has a full career, I have two boys that I'm so proud of that are 16 and 12, who play triple a competitive hockey, both of them. So I'm also living as a working mom. And like many people in the workforce, right? with families, we have aging parents, who, you know, we're now having to make sure taking care of and especially in this time of COVID, right, making sure that they're healthy, and they have what they need. And so Life is full, and it's busy. And so, you know, like many people, how do you kind of show up in your day, and do what's important to you love and support those in your life. And at the end of the day, get the rest that you need to show up and be your best the next day.
Seth Anderson:That absolutely makes sense. And I think, you know, we all wear many hats and you know, knowing kind of when to put one on and take one off and be fully present in the moment is a learned skill over time. One of the things that I sort of zoned in on was when you're talking about your childhood and sort of moving a lot and and what that brings out and I had a similar experience, not a military brat, although some people did ask me if we were because we moved around so much. And we landed in Wainwright of all places, which is a military base. However, you know, we'd landed there, because my dad was a dairy farmer. I feel like all the moving around when I was younger, it set a course for me to kind of seek stability. But it also made me very adaptable to different situations, which has come in handy very often in my professional career and just life in general as you become an adult. And I think you probably brought that up for a reason, you know that you moved around a lot and just sort of given that sense. How much did you know that help you as you've kind of gone on your journey to you know, know that. I think that you could adapt to a new surrounding or a new situation and maybe take some of that fear away when you when you come up against like a big life decision.
Unknown:Yeah. And it speaks to me of courage and resourcefulness. And I truly believe that courage and resourcefulness is learned through your experience. So you know, every two to three years, I was in a new city, having to go to a new school, make new friends, get to know my neighborhood, get involved in something, meet new people that were support, especially what you know, we lived on on military bases, especially when I was young. And so how do you make friends there? What it really gave me was the sense of, I'm okay, I can step into something that I don't know, I don't know what's going to happen. I don't know who people who the people are. But I can take the first step and connect with people and find my way and be curious about others and be open to the experience versus scared of it. That you know who who is my community of support? Who's going to help me How do I ask for help? You know, it goes back I think a lot of it goes back to my roots. My mum and dad were very, you know, kind of showed to us to have a great spirit of generosity and faith. Right? So faith in that, you know, you're never alone. You got everything you need in you to get where you need to go to figure it out to be okay. And generosity is it, you know, it's reciprocal that if you go into situations, being generous to others, and knowing that kindness matters, and with that kindness to others, you will get that back and being open to who is there. And you can learn from everybody in that spirit that my parents lived every day. And every time we move brought that to us, really allowed me to any situation to just, I'm going to be okay, I don't know what's going to happen. But if something does, then I think I'm going to be okay, I, you know, I can figure it out, I have what I need with me to ask for help to seek others, whatever it is. So it's a learned muscles, I call it. And even to this day, I can go anywhere by myself, and I just go in with the spirit of adventure. So what's going to happen? What am I going to learn? How is that going to know show me something about myself or some other people, that's always made it really fun for me. And, and that's how I've kind of approached all those situations. So
Seth Anderson:we're kind of going through that right now a little bit. Because, you know, I like to think, you know, my kids have had a very stable upbringing, maybe compared to some of the things I experienced by that age. I think in grade one alone, I went to three different schools, and it shapes you, whether you realize it at the time or not, but go into those different schools getting that different experience going from town to town to town, it does shape you in a way. And so I always thought, you know what I'm gonna have like a stable situation for my kids and not going to repeat that. But you know, that hasn't been the case. And we're uprooting Lyndon from his school. It's just me thinking a lot about, you know, what's that going to mean for him in the future? Is it the right thing to do. But I do think like, there's a fine balance between being stable in a situation, obviously, that that brings a sense of calm, a sense of some different things in that in that realm. But being able to be adaptable, I think, is a critical skill set for leaders to have. And going through some of the things of things when you're younger is who's going to help you in the long run. So that's sort of where I landed when we were kind of trying to decide whether to move or not.
Unknown:Yeah, and you think about work today. Right? Like our ability to be agile in the moment and flexible and quickly pivot to something else, there's so much stuff coming at us. And every day, could be a new decision. Every other minute, it feels like right. So every day, it absolutely and, and so our ability to just meet the moment and say, so what do I know? And what do I need to do here and be okay, that I may not have all the information I need, or I may not know exactly what the outcome is going to be. But I'm okay with that. Because I know I can deal with it, when it when it comes to me. And today, you know, I see a lot of parents really, really struggle with, you know, protecting your children, I don't want my child to feel any pain, I don't want them to experiencing anything negative. And I just feel that, you know, without those experiences, kids are not going to learn what they're capable of, they're not going to know that they take care of themselves. You know, that that emotional strength that's needed. A lot of times that, you know, I can I can do this, I can bounce back, it's not the end of the world because I you know, I didn't I didn't was I wasn't successful in this. It's it is through the experiences, we gain that. And, and, you know, we need to I truly believe we need to allow our, our children to have those experiences. That's what I love about competitive sports. I know JP you and Seth, you've both played them, I have as well, like, we can all remember that. You know, that game that just lost, we got you know, we got beat badly. Or we lost that by one point, or, you know, we lost in overtime and how that felt. Right? And then what do we do with that? Like, that's what it's about, right? How do we take that what we learned about ourselves in that moment, and come back even stronger, and apply it into the next game or the next situation. That's where we build the skills to be successful and to live a life in today's world where there's so much stuff coming at us every minute.
Seth Anderson:And I think that's a lot of what you help with what you know, and with the people that you work with is helping to bring a framework, a coaching framework that really works. And for me, it's been several years and I'm still using some of the basic concepts that that we work together on. It's stuck in my brain still is flipping feedback and ideas. So instead of giving somebody negative feedback, which may be intended to be constructive, but reframing that to be a positive idea, positive feedback, it's just so much more effective and it's not, you know, exclusive to a work setting. It can be applied across board, I've used it when I was coaching hockey, I've used it in business and I use it with my kids like it's, it's totally transferable. So I'd love for you to maybe share with us a little bit like how you work with your clients and some of the structure that you'd bring bring to help them through a variety of situations.
Unknown:I studied integral coaching, through the integral coaching school and based here in Ottawa, but it's, it's across Canada. And one of the things that connected me with integral coaching is that integral coaching is about coaching and attending to the whole person, mind, heart, and spirit. And that's how we live our lives. That's how we work in organizations. And so we need to take care of all of us to be successful. And so the philosophy around integral coaching is that, you know, in parallel, and co dependently, we want, I want the client to wake up right to who they are. So get aware of their current patterns and behaviors, and what they're doing that's working for them. And what what are they doing in certain situations that's limiting their ability to be successful? And then there's a component of growing up, which is around how do I extend or deepen my ability to do something, a skill, a competency, and also greater capacity in those moments that I needed to do something to pivot in the moment and do something different. And so as you know, as I work with my clients to wake them up and grow them, there is a there's a structure around helping my clients, one, identify what is it that they want to change what is important to them in this moment that they want coaching support around, and that's where we start. And then in that topic, we talk about what is the energy, the your body, your structure, that's helping you be successful. So for example, if you get somebody who's who says in difficult conversations, in conversations, where I feel, it's very difficult, I have a hard time saying what I need to say, I get very defensive, as I'm talking, as the other person's listening to me, I get there, I feel like I have to justify everything I'm saying. And so there's a physical component to that the person might get, you know, cross their arms, or feel very nervous and get flushed in their face, their voice might go high, or their voice gets very loud, or very, you know, kind of with a force of some sort. So that's you know, that's also got to be recognized in their head they could get very like their thoughts are very runny and and and a lot are coming in and Radek they can't think clearly, you know, in my practice, it's helping the client see all of those things as what's happening in the moment, and then having a series of practices that says, How do you want to be how, what do you want to change? And then they practice it every day. So for example, it's about getting comfortable when people don't agree with me, how do I sit and stay open? and not get defensive? and be open to hearing other people's perspective? And be curious about it? How do I ensure that I can stay calm in moments when I feel like we're not in alignment, so that I can hear what the other person is saying and give them a very practical and a bit and a very convincing point of view? You know, how do I emotionally help the other person know that even though we might not agree, I still care about their perspective and their opinion. And I want us to find a common outcome. And then in the conversations that we have, it is about coming, giving us a safe place for my clients to really be themselves that they can take off their mask, or their armor, or the expectations others have from them, their fears, things that are really getting in their way of just looking at themselves. And I mean, looking at where they may not like what they see. Because they know they're getting upset, or they know they're there. They're responding to people in a way that's not helping build relationships, the environment and the structure of integral coaching creates a safe place and a trusting place in a non judgmental place. And from that place, then they can take first steps with a lot more courage, even though it feels uncomfortable or scary. They learn to do that on their own mindsets,
JP Gaston:kind of an interesting topic. And I recall us talking to quite a length about mindset in the coaching excellence course. And we like we even started off today a little bit talking about mindset. Yeah, it's interesting to me, too, you know, the the mindset, especially through COVID. And the idea that, Oh, I can't wait for 2020 to end and to me, December 31 2020 is just an arbitrary date to change a number on a calendar. It doesn't. It doesn't necessarily mark the start or end of anything tangible in my life. So why why can't today be the end of the damage that COVID has caused me? And it makes me think, what are some of the challenging mindsets that you often face? I know that Seth mentioned, he came into the course maybe not in the right mindset and definitely left with the right mindset. I would say I was probably in a similar boat. There's Likely lots of people who, you know, as they listen to this are thinking, you know, I got this, you know, I don't need to worry about this because I'm good. I know what I'm doing. And I'm sure that like the folks that you're coaching, how they might not see how they're impacting their team or not impacting their team, it's their mindset, right? Like they, they need to recognize and change that. So what are some of the common themes that you see that that we might be able to share with people that, you know, might might start them thinking down the path of, hey, maybe this is something I need to really think about and change?
Unknown:I think the one that, especially in in organizations that are highly skilled, I'm the expert. I know, that's a huge limiting mindset. Because it closes your ability to hear other people. And you make unilateral and siloed decisions a lot of times without recognizing that it impacts others or not including others. So that's huge, right? I'm the expert. I know, there's nothing new for me to learn here. I know best. I think what I'm a mindset that I experience is, I have to be like, I can't show any emotion, I have to be strong, I have to be tough. I think, if you refer to that a little earlier, it's that, you know, if I'm if I, if I show emotion that shows weakness, or if I'm vulnerable in a situation, that's, you know, that that's I'm not a strong leader. And, you know, I go back to being able to understand, articulate, and manage your emotions with others. I mean, this, that's emotional intelligence. And to me that defines your success more so than actually your technical skills and knowledge in an organization. I think this place of I don't know, right, that they don't have a strong self sense of who they are. And so it can lead with a lot of self doubt, or hesitation. or closing down right. So hiding away, I don't know, so I'm, you know, I'm not sure what to do. So all just sit back, and maybe it'll go away. And then the other one, I think that's really prevalent is this idea of being perfect, right? I have to be perfect. And, and how that just creates this tightness in and I I kind of grew up with that. Right? Everything I do has to be perfect. And although it allowed me to work really hard and be successful, and and hit significant milestones, it also got in my way around. How do I allow my creativity and innovation to come out? How do I ask for help, right? If I'm if I think I've to perfection, that means I have to do it on my own, it has to be perfect. And a lot of times when we're in that mindset, we don't ask for help. And we all need help with things. Right? There's there's there's great energy and ideation and creativity, and laughter that comes when we bring others in and help to help us. So obviously, those are really kind of the, the, you know, three or four, five critical mindsets that get in the way of people kind of being their best or being open to change in a way that's going to allow them to be more successful.
Seth Anderson:Yeah, and you hit on something there with me, like one of my biggest fears, I think, just in general is talking in front of people. And I think it comes from a fear of being wrong or a fear of not saying the right thing. And, you know, I think back to being in high school, for example, I would maybe know the right answer, but it's just, it's like a physical pain almost to actually say it in front of people. And it's just, it's rooted in me, I don't, I don't know where it came from, or why it's there. But I but I struggle with it. Like for me to, you know, get up in front of people and say something, or be on a call or a meeting and speak up, I've come a long way for sure. You know, to the point now where you know, I can get up in front of 100 people and, and and see what I need to say or you know, I can I can get on a you know, into a meeting and I can speak up. But that's been a big hurdle for me. And you know, thinking back to sitting in that room with five people and having to do things that were totally out of my comfort zone did sort of set me on a path to be like, Hey, I was able to say what I thought or how I felt and I wasn't judged for it. And you know, maybe I can take that to the next step. So, you know, sort of reflecting on it right now but that was a big obstacle for me and becoming a leader and a coach in a
Unknown:time where do I go next? I you know, I felt this calling and I'm going to leave an organization and disappoint a whole lot of people. Right and didn't want to do that I you know, I struggled with that. And yet, you know I wasn't feeling fulfilled. And and so, you know, as a coach, we all have fears. And, and it's, it's creating a place where people can be themselves and just talk it through. And you, you say that, you know without being judged and, you know, I really care about my clients, right? I want them to be honest with themselves and talk about it. And I will care for you through that process, I'm going to tell you what it is, I'm going to be honest, you may not like it, I may make you feel uncomfortable. But everybody's been appreciative of that, because that's what in the in the moment is what was necessary that maybe what they needed to hear? Or what was important for them to to to understand. So they could they could change a behavior, or just increase their self awareness. That's really, you know, from a place of humility, right? Yeah, I, you know, I'm not making people happy, or I'm causing, you know, disruption in relationships at work, or I'm not the leader. I thought it was. Right. And we all have to face those, those truthful moments. But can we do it where we take care of each other? Right, that he that kindness, and go from a place of Okay, so so what do you want to do from here? Let's get going.
Seth Anderson:There's double click, did that come from you? Is that one of your sayings? Because I feel like it might be.
Unknown:That was from the coaching. Excellent. So this idea of double clicking and double down and I hear you know, a lot of the like, double down or peel the onion or, you know, I use I sometimes use the word unpack, right, there's so but the double click is from the coaching as
Seth Anderson:well, one of the things I wanted to double click on was, was around this, the concept you threw out there of kindness and how that associates with leadership, because I think there's, you know, at least when I was coming up as a leader, there's sort of a stigma around being a manager or, you know, a coach or whatever that you have to, you have to be tough, you have to be firm, you have to, you know, I don't know, it's an old school mentality, I think, but I think you get a lot more out of kindness and empathy, and really listening to people active listening, and working with people. But you know, not everybody's necessarily on that page. So when you look at sort of what you bring to your clients, how do you get them grounded in that, because if you've been doing it a certain way, for 2030 years, in some cases, and you've gotten the results, that way, it can be a tough switch to flip to then kind of go to the other side, and, you know, take a different approach in your leadership. So how do you help people on that path,
Unknown:a life lesson that I've had, through all of my travels, whether it be moving with my family around Canada, or you know, traveling not only on my own around the world, but I work for global organizations, and traveled all over the world as well. And what I can what I honestly, a human truth that I have is, kindness exists in all of us. We all just want to be kind to one another. And we want to receive kindness from each other. And so it's there. It's just how does it show up? How can we help others just, you know, it's for some reason, it's getting in someone's way, not necessarily coming from a place of kindness or empathy or compassion. I'm working with a client right now who, you know, when she when she's in the workplace, everything she does, she jumps in to get things done, right. It's coming from a good place, I want to help, I want to want you to be successful. But what it feels like she's taking over and what I what her team's doing doesn't matter. And yet, when she hears that we talk about, you know, what she could be shifting so that her team can feel that she cares about them? She says, Well, I do care about them. I just don't tell them that. Right. And so some of her practice she's working on is being able to sit quietly, and let others come up with ideas or acknowledge people. Yeah, what I what they appreciate about them invites them in to say, How can I help you? This is, you know, this is what I'm feeling. This is what this is why I'm at this meeting and my reason for being here. So a lot of times, no kindness can just be in showing up and saying why we're here and inviting others in to feel our kindness versus jumping in to do stuff. It's appreciating somebody else's perspective. Right? I mean, you know, it's what's recognizing, you know, how are people feeling in the meeting? How are they are they tired? Are they frustrated? Are they are they you know, feeling like things can't be done. Like what are those things that show others we that they matter and that we care about the minutes often little things So it's just being a little purposeful and thinking about how can we show kindness in our workplace? Right? It's, it's, you know, in an in virtual world, we're now we don't necessarily having human contact, how can we show up on a zoom call? And let people know we care? Right? Maybe we can invite them into our workplace. Right? So or, you know, our own our own home and say, you know, I'm we had that moment where we said, we're set up in our bedrooms, right? So having a moment there shared moment that says, Yeah, like, you know, stop stuffs tough we're trying to all make this work and, and having having a shared moment and a laugh about that, that just shows our humaneness. Right, and, and, and compassion for the situation. I think, you know, those are the things to me around kindness, that we just have to one be purposeful in how we show up and be kind to one another, and find the moments to be kind to one another. It's often just small things.
Seth Anderson:That's a, you know, you hit on the, the virtual world that we're living in, in the workplace now. And you know, me, I've always had an element of that whether, you know, for the last few years, I've I've supported people in remote areas, basically my entire corporate career. But you know, that it's different now, like, you don't have any touch points at the office, you don't have any of that water cooler talk. You know, it's tough to, you know, when you're at the office, you can kind of see if someone's having a bad day, a good day like you can, you can get a vibe from people that just, it's really hard to do, on on zoom or whatever you're using. So one of the things that I started doing, about two months ago now is something called a mental health hour. So we we do it once a week, usually, it's on like a Wednesday around lunchtime. And it's totally, totally voluntary. Anybody in my organization or anyone in our organization period is welcome to attend. And i cap it at about 10 people, just because if you start getting over 10 people, it gets tough to get a word in. And you know, it's a little too big, but usually it's about five to 10 people and it's not work doc. So it's specifically you know, we're not going to talk about the day to days and our work and you know, what's broken and what needs to be fixed, we'll we'll do that elsewhere. But this is just to talk about mental health. And I didn't know how it was gonna go. And it was kind of a risky thing to just put out there. And but it's been amazing, it's been absolutely amazing. And again, like I said, five to 10 people, different people from different parts of the organization. And it's it ranges from talking about, Hey, I like to go for a walk in the afternoon because it helps me clear my head and, and sort of discussion about different coping mechanisms that people have to get outside of their four walls, all the way down to people who've lost a loved one during this COVID period and how they're dealing with it and asking for advice or, or ideas on how they can and it's created this network that of people across Canada, who otherwise wouldn't have known each other. And when we get together weekly, it's it's just, I leave that meeting with so much energy and so excited to sort of take on the rest of my day, no matter what was happening. So I know we tend to focus on, you know, or at least a lot of the conversation with COVID is like, Oh, wait, can't wait for 2020 to be over and like all the obstacles that we have in the way of us. But I've actually found the opposite of that. And that we've created new connections, new ways of doing things opened up conversations that, you know, were not being talked about before, like mental health. And it's actually been really, really interesting to see that develop. So I just wanted to share that that was sort of one of the things we've been working on. And I think it's been pretty successful.
Unknown:Yeah. Well, you know, the reality is, there's no going back. Right, we can't undo what we've learned and experienced. Right? And so how do we go forward in a virtual world not to say that, you know, getting back to being able to socialize and be in front of one another is, is not going to happen? But it's, you know, we're going to step into a world where people may have a choice, they have a choice, if they want to work from home, or if they want to be in it go into an actual corporate office, do they want to work for an organization that has the social, you know, its purposes, it has a social agenda, versus one that's very transactional? I think we start to have choices that are different and and aligned with what what best suits us in the life that we want to lead. And it all works. Right. I think it's it's all every is going to be everybody's unique journey. And something you said Seth is around, you're bringing people together and what I love about that is think about the power of that, that through you, the people that have come out connected and without you they would never have met. Like, I think that's the power of the virtual world, that we can bring people together that would that, that you're the common denominator. And and what a what a, what a network, you know what an opportunity and to learn from one another and experience a variety of perspectives and extend, and environments and thinking and innovation in a in a way that, you know, gosh, 10 years ago just wasn't even possible. But it goes to your mindset. Right? I mean, what's been interesting for me is I am I broke my foot doing what I love running, I broke my foot on August the 12th. And it's still not healed. So I've had to basically, I'm not able to run or really do any exercise that was huge for me. But it goes to the mindset same with, with, you know, working from home. So what, what is something I can do that I can't go? I can't go back to what I did before. So what's something new I could do? And what would make it better for me? So I think if we think along that lines, what could I learn about myself through this period of having to now from an energy perspective, I can't get out and run, which has been my place to think and meditate and rejuvenate. I've had to find different ways to do that. Once it opened up for me, I have you know, I've had my boys, my husband, and my two boys really take care of me that otherwise, they never would have done because I wasn't you know, I was on crutches for six weeks, I couldn't get around my house, I couldn't lift things and walk at the same time. I couldn't drive. So, you know, if we go in with what's possible, what am I going to learn? What new things will I discover? What new connections can I make? I think that allows us to go in with a lot more hope, then grieving for what we've lost that we may never get back.
JP Gaston:Yeah, and I know that a lot of the conversations we had, we're not just about finding within ourselves the right mindset, we talked a fair bit during the course about coaching not only as a leader of other people, but coaching as a leader of your peers. I'm not going to say this too loudly in case my wife hears me but even using that positive idea of positive feedback in your daily life, right, like and I do use that when I have conversations with my wife and she's actually now using it, when she she's a teacher. So she uses it at her school with our students and with other teachers. And I think that, that, that sort of understanding your own mindset is the spark that really lets you start to get into other people's and I know one of the things that and I'm going to use the double click term because it seems to be our term today but one of the things I wanted to double click on was you had mentioned a fair bit of background in marketing. And for me, I you know, I listened to a lot of marketing podcasts I I spend some time trying to understand the psychology of people so that I can you know better interact how much of that kind of psychology of persuasion of other people and that marketing background helped you kind of get where you are today and understand the way that we need to interact with people
Unknown:I think sometimes we forget in business that businesses people and so in our in our quest to sell more products and you know, develop and get go to market with new things, ultimately, it's all about the people. Right? Who's creating How are they creating and who's purchasing it and people buy from, from companies from from others that they trust right and so if we're not creating those relationships in our business, then I don't think we're can be as successful as we want to be. Um, for me as a as somebody in marketing my customers in my relationships with my customers are so critically important. You know, I wanted them to pick up the phone and say, you know, Carolyn, this is what we're struggling with. This is what's happening for us this is why we're not buying your product but do it in a way that's collaborative. And you know, we're gonna do this together you know, we got each other's back in a sense, we can be candid and and and trust what the other saying and not come from a place of defensiveness But listen, truly listen. And I love my clients. I loved my customers and that word love in the workplace, right? Like, you know, I say that people I can just see people cringe. And yet, gosh, why can't we love our customers right? Like I go to I go see my customers, pre COVID I, you know, they all hug me, I remember being at a show and, and, you know, my my executive team and my CEO is going looking at me as all the customers are coming up and hugging me going, what are you doing? What's going on? Why is everybody hugging you? And I said, I remember saying to him, because I love them, they know I love them. Right, I care about them. And I built my relationships with them, I started you know, from the get go with that. And so I could trust what they were saying to me, and they could trust what I was saying to them. And you get, you get information that otherwise you wouldn't get, because they feel safe talking to you. Right and did the same with my team. And the people, my peers, right, and, you know, with like anything in any organization that can be those that you build really deep, intimate relationships quickly, and others that may take some time to build. But if I show up every day and say you, I really care about what you think, and I'm here, I've got your back, and I want you to be successful. You know, that's the start of building really strong relationships that allow everybody to be successful. And given the way the work is evolving, where you know, everything's being crowdsource in this concept of I'm the leader, and I have a direct team, and we will be successful, I think is going away that people are working to be successful. Now you have to work across the organization, this whole concept of agile teams and functional teams and business line teams, where we're working without authority of the people that we're working with. So how do we show up and show that, you know, you matter that I'm interested in what you have to say that I know what's important to you, that I want you to be successful, even though you have other priorities, how you spend your time on this team, you want to learn and develop an experience matters to me, and I want to make sure you get that and that you feel like you're contributing that you're you're part of it. And that you're feeling fulfilled through the process. I think you know, this whole concept of, of loving who we're working with is going to be something that I think we need to pay attention to, because I think it can be a real catalyst for how we work together going forward and how we be successful as an organization going forward. And how we show up as leaders
Seth Anderson:sort of taking that one step further, you know, you hit on the love and bringing that in into the workplace, obviously. What about fun, do you have any stories of you know, either fun team or fun leader or you know, someone that's brought some fun to this, this journey for you as you've kind of gone through it.
Unknown:My younger son, my 12 year old Thomas is one for me, right now who makes me laugh, who finds moments to, to do things in in my work or things I'm sharing at home. That just literally stops me in my tracks and laughs and it's just his own unique perspective and how he's a little, sometimes a little Cavalier, sometimes he just, you know, he's he's, he's innocent in what he thinks and, or he's just as curiosity is killing him, though, for the other day, he's, you know, Halloween is coming. And although he's not going out for Halloween, he wanted to be a pig. And so we ordered this pig costume on Amazon. And it's huge. It's as big as I am on five, seven. So when he puts it on, he blows it up. He's standing at about 5758 and it's really puffy it you know, quadruples his size. And I was talking about, you know, this idea of working with my voice and daily practice, right, doing something for 15 minutes every day, that helps you get better every day. Just something right. And so for his It was about doing some, like some push ups and sit ups, so but he put this pink costume on, and he was doing it with this pig costume on. And he said, Mom, I'm doing my practice, you know, my workout kind of thing. And he did it for 15 minutes. And I just laughed because I thought he didn't do it. It was actually harder to do it in the costume. But he did it and he had fun doing it. And it made me laugh, right. And that's a story that I can take to you know it when I'm facilitating in a program to say how do you make it fun for yourself when it feels boring or it's methodical or you know, and not feeling like you want to do it? What could you do for yourself that would make it a little bit of fun and interesting and laugh along the way. So that to me was a good a good fun lesson and I'm I can still laugh and he's still doing it.
Seth Anderson:I feel like JP probably does the same.
JP Gaston:That may or may not be true. I will neither confirm nor deny.
Seth Anderson:And towards the end here, Carolyn, what? What's that? What's next for you? Like what are you? What are you working on? What are you excited about? In the near term, what have you got kind of on the front burner with, with your coaching?
Unknown:Yeah. So, you know, I talked about the calling of being a coach. And what I've seen over the last few years is how the work environment is really shifting to teams, and not just, you know, leader and team, but really across that the cross business line teams. And so you know, I'm able to take my integral coaching to teams, but I'm also building some workshops and really wanting to do some work around how to create teams that are really going to be successful. And it's based on some research by Keith ferrazzi, a friendly green light based in San Francisco. And he uses the word co elevate, but it's really about how do we build a team where we can be candid with one another, we can be collaborative, we've got each other's back, when things get tough, we move to support one another versus return to silos. So I'm really curious about and wanting to get some, get my hands dirty, and working with a variety of different teams and helping them really become the best that they can be. I've also joined an organization called McKay CEO forms. And really, from my own personal development, wanting to, you know, how do I get to a community of executives and consultants and business owners in a way that start to challenge my thinking and give me new experiences and help me learn and grow. And so I became a co chair for for this organization in May. And I'm now chairing an executive group. And I'm hoping to do another one. And it's really a little bit like coaching except that I'm creating the space for these executives to come together and share their learning share their experiences, be be present with one another create space for them to feel like they can authentically show up and share the big issues that's that's keeping them at night, whether it's personal or business. I guess Personally, I'm just excited that my boys are being able to play hockey and hopefully, fingers crossed, I'll get to see one of them play a game. My older son is playing just unfortunately, they're not allowing parents in the arena. So he's playing which is a good thing. So we can just rely on what he's he's saying when he comes out. He's a goalie so he's got a great capacity to tell us play by play of the game because he's really watching the whole game in front of them fold. But, Miss, I'm really missing not seeing them play.
JP Gaston:goalies are the best. They are a goalie, goalie. goalie. Yeah, my oldest son is a goalie. So take that stuff.
Unknown:That I tell you. There's there's good lessons in walk in being a goalie mom that I've I've learned
JP Gaston:I've just you know, I grew up with the cardboard pads with the outfielders baseball glove as Mike Trapper and my brother rifling shots at me with a tennis ball in the driveway. And I never actually got to play hockey growing up, but I had the, you know, because he needed a goalie, I was always the goalie. And I just I quite enjoyed it. So I've just always grown up loving goalies. And finally, a couple years ago, I decided you know what this is, this is crazy. I can now play I no longer have the restrictions I had. So I can now play ice hockey, I'm going to go do it. And though I've spent the last six years playing on a handful, actually of of teams,
Unknown:my son gave me the best lesson as a goalie. As I'm sure many parents who have goalies, whether whatever sport that is in, I don't know about about any other parents. But I found myself not breathing for most of the game early when you like I just froze, I'm not breathing. So one I've learned to breathe very well. But I remember my son said to me, at one point, he was it, you know, he was in a really tough game. He was getting a lot of shots. Like he was kind of, you know, plus 50 shots in the game, which is a lot of shots in the game. And, you know, after the game, he said to me, Mom, you know, you looked like you were scared watching me play. And I got him to see that. What does that look like on my face? But then I asked him, Well, how did you know I was scared? He said, I could see that you're you have you have certain mannerisms? That that you do when I know you're scared. I thought, gosh, you know, that's what I do with my clients. I was just to be able to say like I you know, I'm human to I'm continuously learning and developing. And he said to me, Mom, I'm okay, you can stop worrying. I'm actually okay. And it was a great lesson for me that we worry a lot about others and we have to let other people just be okay. And I take that into my practice as well. My clients are going to be okay. If something happens in organization, I'm here to support them, but they'll be okay. part of the process part of the journey of learning and growing Is those moments that they have to learn they're going to be okay and be able to say I'm okay. And so it was a very, it was a it was a pivotal moment between my son and I, but a great learning moment for me as a parent and as a coach. Awesome. Well,
Seth Anderson:thanks so much for coming today, Carolyn. You know, I think it's, it's great to get some background on your story. And just, you know, chat through coaching and what it means to us and you know, that you get, it's an opportunity to thank you again for how much you've helped me on my coaching journey. So I appreciate that. gonna pivot gears a little bit now into something that we'd like to do at the end the show is now called the podium and just an opportunity to have a little bit of fun with it and do a top three top three lists so this week which happens to be November 3 and that is international is an international or national JP I can't remember Hey, it should it should really be every day should be every day. International sandwich day so our our our top three on the podium this week is going to be our top three favorite sandwiches
Voiceover:sandwich addition this is
JP Gaston:JP if you want to bat lead off today and what are your top three sandwiches there was great debate in my head to the point where I actually wrote these down in a list like you like to do so number three, cold cut trio from Mr sub. And there's a little bit of a story there there was a Mr. Sub down the street from my house when I lived in Ontario. And I used to go by that thing all the time, whether it was you know, on the way to school or on the way to work or there was a dating myself a little bit of guests, but there was a video rental store across the street that we used to frequent to rent our videos over the years and it was just always the place we ended up going. And so there's the soft spot in my heart for a Mr sub cold cut trio.
Seth Anderson:And what what what do you put on stec cold cut trio? What are your topics? Oh,
JP Gaston:that's a great question. So in addition to the three meats, let us tomato, mushroom, onion and both mayonnaise and two sub sauce because they're both delicious. I mean anything with a little fat is delicious. It's
Seth Anderson:a fully loaded sandwich and like you're licking your fingers and pre COVID times of course so licking my
JP Gaston:fingers post COVID spine it's looking other people's fingers. That's number two for me is now defunct, they have closed up shop but Avenue deli in Calgary had this chicken sandwich. It was just so delicious. And it was one of those places that was you know, true deli style they would give you chips from a bag as your side and they had this kind of older bar seating type place just over in Marta loop and Calgary here and it was so good. And I've attempted to remake it at home and I think I've gotten kind of close and so now every every couple of weeks I'll make them on the weekend for for my wife and I and we quite enjoy them still. And then number one and i i mean what is the definition of sandwich that's where we're
Seth Anderson:that's where I'll still use background ground rules like the burgers cow or well,
JP Gaston:so my definition is you know, some sort of something between two pieces of bread. Right? Right and so in this case I'm going to call a hot dog a sandwich here and that definition it's a it's a it's a horizontal sandwich because it's not stacked vertically but japa dog in Vancouver adjust you took me there when we were in yes i did and i will take everybody there who I am there with because there is something just so delightful about Jeff a dog in their in their teriyaki mayonnaise,
Seth Anderson:I'll be honest, it was okay but I know it's your your thing not to
JP Gaston:pour water on. That's fine. All three of your selections are just okay.
Seth Anderson:So that's it cold cut trio from Mr. Sub, you've got the sandwich the local Calgary sandwich and the japa dog and not the not the Montreal smoked meat which was your
JP Gaston:Yeah, I felt like I called them out last week and I don't want to keep calling out the same thing. But certainly Schwartz's deli is right up there with the Montreal smoked meat sandwich just
Seth Anderson:angling for a sponsor at this point. So
JP Gaston:maybe if Schwartz's deli is listening if you want to sponsor us by sending us sandwiches I'm to wear down.
Seth Anderson:So surprisingly, I also wrote down a list shot and welcome to the shock of everybody And this is not coordinated in any way but the number three on my list says cold cut content trio from subway however that is my restaurant of choice with the cold cut and it's been my go to sandwich there since I was a wee lad and I also like it fairly loaded with the lettuce tomato green pepper olives and then some sauce mayo and sometimes mustard depends if I'm feeling it or not but that that is my cold cut on the Italian herb and cheese bread by the way that's number two I just wrote melty
JP Gaston:is there is there any more context than that are we just get again so
Seth Anderson:i was i was i guess thinking of the components of a sandwich that I like but I just like a nice melty sandwich there's a few options there I like a nice grilled cheese perhaps with or without ham you know depending on the day tuna melt that's a good good option but really if it's got like a nice especially on like a cold day and nice and melty sandwich on like, either a sourdough or like ancient grains type bread that that's, that's my jam action is this bread at sobey is called mountain bread. That is my bread of choice for a melty sandwich. So that's number one. I'm going straight classic and JP you can come at me if you like for this one but I'm just going pb&j. I probably one pb&j every day, but even rhymed like that. And I my preference would be the dark roast peanut butter with a nice raspberry jam. So that is that is my top three sandwiches. Well as I share my top three and I also made a list. So what does that say about the three of us organized?
Unknown:I'm organized There we go. I am I feel underwhelmed by what I'm going to share because all my sandwiches are from home and and they have a little bit of a connection to my family or who I am so i'm not i'm not going to win any brownie points and getting sponsors because I'm making no relation to anything except what
JP Gaston:I create is okay you can you can send me sandwiches to
Seth Anderson:anybody listening can send a sandwiches we will not say no. Okay.
Unknown:So number three would be tuna with cumin and garlic and gherkin pickles on it for a little extra crunch on brown bread. Why that's one of my favorites is I just love that the cumin and the pickles together that crunchy, savory, you know, party in your mouth kind of thing. And also my son loves it. So it's something that when I make it, the two of us always have together so it's just always reminds me of spending time with my son. Number two, and I've been eating this sandwich since I was six years old. And I'd come home every day from school and have to at six. So this is this is so delicious, is toasted salami and mustard sandwich. Very simple, but so delicious. And every time I think about that, it just, I feel so nourished and so comfortable. And so taken care of like it's just you know, it's one of those things when you just feel like you're home. Love it. And you have to have to,
Seth Anderson:I can literally like taste that when you say
Unknown:no, you It's so simple. It's so delicious. And then I'm with you Sef PB and J except I like strawberry jam, but just a thin layer of strawberry jam. And I love peanut butter like peanut butter to me, I have peanut butter every day. If I went on the show survivor, that's what I would bring with me. Peanut Butter,
Seth Anderson:dissolve peanut butter,
Unknown:it's smooth peanut butter. And everywhere I went even on my travels, I always had peanut butter with me it because everything covered in peanut butter tastes good. So it's just it's it's something that I feel I feel I haven't had a full day until I've had a little bit of peanut butter.
Seth Anderson:But apparently my daughter you guys are soul sisters or something. Because yesterday she walked in while I was on a call, of course. And she's eating a bowl of peanut butter.
Unknown:I haven't done that. I haven't eaten a bowl of peanut butter. But you know what we've all done, we won't dip the finger in the peanut butter jar, right?
JP Gaston:She's trying to cut out the carbs of the sandwich.
Seth Anderson:Don't tell others even in our family that we've done that but we still do it. Well, this is a lot of fun, Carolyn, and yeah, you know, your people are, you know, looking for some coaching and then that kind of thing. You're online, you're on LinkedIn. Do you have a website or anything like that or just that's in in production and production? Awesome.
Unknown:But you can certainly find me on LinkedIn, on Facebook, on Instagram as well just Carolyn Vandenberg. You know what I would say to people who you know, maybe thinking about a coach or wondering about coaching is it's an experience. It's an adventure so jump in, right give me a call for me. It's About a good fit. And, and and a meaningful conversation that hopefully helps you recognize something gives you a place to explore something that's important to you. And coming away with a sense of I can do this and this person is going to be along for the journey with me. And so I welcome a conversation with anyone along those lines. It's something that I'm always excited to and always give time for people. It's what I call my heart of leadership, which I think is is you know, that's, that's what I believe in. And that's the that's the way I approach. The people I work with is, you know, bringing our heart to everything we do.
Seth Anderson:Amazing. Well, thanks again for coming on. And once you get your website up and going, let us know. We'll be happy to share that as well. I will have you on again sometime down the
JP Gaston:road for sure. I'd love it. Thanks again, gentlemen. Thanks so much. Bye
Voiceover:to Carolyn Vandenberg, for joining us today and sharing her stories of experience in the dojo next week, as we speak with broadacre, professional coach, and chair of the board of directors for the military museums foundation. It's a special Remembrance Day episode. So don't forget to subscribe and tune in to The Biz Dojo