Rebecca Finley steps into The Dojo this week to share her experience in corporate strategy, and the fun (yes! FUN!) in governance. We explore some of her experiences assisting organizations through transformation and continuous development.
We also spend time focused on learning more about inclusivity and the role that diversity plays. As Chair of Next Gen Men, Rebecca provides her insights on supporting and developing men to eliminate toxic masculinity and empower women. We'll also dive into the biggest influencers in our lives, and how they've taught us about equality.
Then, on The Podium, we're joined by Kristine "Christmas" Jones to dive further into our family histories as we chat about some of our most beloved decorations for the upcoming season.
Kick back beside the fireplace with some hot chocolate, click subscribe and join us for Episode 9!
The Biz Dojo - Podcast, Production & Professional Coaching
Website | Facebook | Instagram | LinkedIn | Twitter
Rebecca Finley steps into The Dojo this week to share her experience in corporate strategy, and the fun (yes! FUN!) in governance. We explore some of her experiences assisting organizations through transformation and continuous development.
We also spend time focused on learning more about inclusivity and the role that diversity plays. As Chair of Next Gen Men, Rebecca provides her insights on supporting and developing men to eliminate toxic masculinity and empower women. We'll also dive into the biggest influencers in our lives, and how they've taught us about equality.
Then, on The Podium, we're joined by Kristine "Christmas" Jones to dive further into our family histories as we chat about some of our most beloved decorations for the upcoming season.
Kick back beside the fireplace with some hot chocolate, click subscribe and join us for Episode 9!
The Biz Dojo - Podcast, Production & Professional Coaching
Website | Facebook | Instagram | LinkedIn | Twitter
This week on the board with Dr. Rebecca Finley of Finley and Associates, and chair of next gen men. We'll talk about toxic masculinity, diversity and inclusiveness, strategy and organizational transformations. The importance and fun in governance. So stick around and welcome to episode nine of The Biz Dojo.
Seth Anderson:Welcome to the dojo. This week, we've got Rebecca Finley, Rebecca, welcome, happy to have you.
Rebecca Finley:Thank you so much for having me. It's great to meet you guys.
Seth Anderson:So you're sort of the first person that we've had in the dojo who's reached out to us that wasn't sort of in our network before we got going here. So I guess that makes you a trailblazer? a trendsetter, a first of some kind. Anyway,
Rebecca Finley:I'll take those titles. They sound great.
JP Gaston:Your trophies in the mail? Yeah.
Seth Anderson:So you know, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself, you know, just in reading your LinkedIn profile, you've got a lot going on a lot of really cool things that we definitely want to get into. But you know, you're you're, you're you have your own business. You're the chair of a board. Looks like you've got something going on with race sodam in BC, and then just all kinds of stuff. So I mean, just tell us a little bit about yourself, and how you kind of got to where you are? Sure. That's
Rebecca Finley:a pretty huge open ended question. So I'll try not go on for a ton of time. I'm a management consultant that specializes in governance and strategic planning. And I work for Midland associates, which is a family business that was started by my mom about 10 years ago. And I'm also the board chair and Governance Committee, chair of next gen men, which is an organization that is dedicated to tackling toxic masculinity and kind of redefining what it means to be a man. So as both young parents yourselves, it's kind of interesting to see how that new wave of masculinity is shifting a lot, especially with dads taking on more of a leadership role within raising their kids. So I think that that's a really important conversation to have. Outside of work. I'm a salsa dancer. And so my boyfriend, my sister and I, we are quite active in the salsa community here in Calgary. And we plan quite a few socials to bring the community together before COVID was a thing. That was something that I love to do as well.
Seth Anderson:Amazing. And I mean, a couple of things, we could double click on there, but the one that jumped out to me, you mentioned the toxic masculinity and sort of that whole space. How did you get involved with that? I know, that's definitely something that jumps out on your profile is something you're very accomplished and proud of what what led you to get involved with next gen men?
Rebecca Finley:That's a really cool story, actually. So I used to run a women's mentorship group for several years, and I was very much about empowering my female friends, how do they raise their hand at the board table? How do they get heard by their management team? Or how do they ask for a raise? And I was introduced through my network to Jake stika. And this woman said, you know what you're doing with your women. There's a guy doing this for men, you have to meet him. And I was like, okay, so I met Jake, and he's an amazing figure, you should definitely have him on your show. And him and two of his best friends has started next gen men. And I talked to him. And he was actually at the point where he was putting together his very first board. And he was looking for someone with governance and strategic planning experience. And so that's how he had also wanted to connect with me, I fell in love with what he was doing. And I realized, Oh, my gosh, like as much as you can be helping women. If you're not changing the men that women are interacting with, there's no point. So like, even if you can teach a woman to have the confidence to put up a hand, but the man that's facilitating the room won't give her a chance. What good have I really done. And so what I love about next gen men is this, this new wave of feminism that's happening, and it's working more to help men upstream. And I really think that we've done a poor job at helping men and I think that especially with, as I learned more about toxic masculinity, I thought, wow, like it's bad for women and as equally bad for men in different regards. And so I've been with next gen men now as the board chair for about three and a half years. And I just love the work that the organization does. We focus on helping men, three key ways. So we do a lot of youth programming focused mainly in the Greater Toronto Area, to have an amazing Youth Program Coordinator named Jonathan, who works actively with young boys to, to break down barriers a lot through language, how do they talk to each other? How do they relate to one another? How do they have healthy relationships? How do they express their emotions because it has to start at a young age, we have to teach these boys early on what it means to be a good leader and to be a good friend and to be a good son and to be a good brother. And I love that. And then the other part that we work on a lot is through community circles. So next gen men circles are community based programs for men right across Canada. And each of the major cities we used to meet in person but now it's all online. And it's just men that come together that have a thirst to talk about interesting topics like the last one was about porn and masculinity and what does that really mean? They've talked about what does being a new father mean and taking pride To leave, so I love that. And then we also do equity leadership for corporations too. So we've worked with organizations like benevity here in Calgary to do a lot of like unconscious bias training, that kind of stuff. It's such an awesome work. I love it. I'm so like, excited to be a part of it. That's really cool.
Seth Anderson:I grew up in a house with three sisters. Obviously, my mom and a lot of grandparent or grandmas specifically, I seem to have a disproportionate number of grandmas for some reason, I don't know how it works out. But I'll be like, No, not that Grandma, I have like four different grandma's. So I've had a lot of great women influences in my life. But I think what shifted my mindset, especially in the business context, was having a daughter, and I just I see things through a totally different lens now that I never did before. And, you know, we talked about JP, when we were sort of setting up this pot, one of the things we wanted to do was provide a platform for women leaders to showcase things that they're doing, like JP and I talked about providing that platform and, and having sort of this institutional responsibility in our in our day jobs to pave a path for women to set the culture up, you know, 1015 years down the road, when when my daughter, you know, starting to get into college and into a career, whatever that might be, I don't, I don't want the same obstacles to exist. And I know a lot of work has been done over the last, you know, many years, but there's still work to be done. And I don't know, it's very cool and commend you a lot for the work you're doing there and just kind of wanted to share, one of my inspirations is definitely to create an environment for my daughter, in the workplace, in life in whatever that is productive and conducive to her success as possible.
Rebecca Finley:That's so cool that you say that, Seth? Because I actually find that a lot. why a lot of people men in particular search out next gen men in the first place is because they said what become a new Father, I have a daughter, I don't want the world to be the same place that it is now how can I even get involved in next gen men's often a great entry point for them to start learning about it. So I think that that's awesome. I'm glad that you're looking forward to helping change the world. So it's a better place for her. Oh, what
Seth Anderson:a powerful thought or statement change the world, but really, you know, one step at a time, one interaction at a time, one podcast at a time, if we can make a positive influence 100% I do think we can change the world. You mentioned sort of feminist, strong feminist beliefs. I think that's even in your in your profile and LinkedIn, what or who inspired you sort of on your journey to having that sort of center around around feminism and equal rights?
Rebecca Finley:That's a great question, too. So Seth, similar to you, I have very strong women in my family. So my grandmother, who my middle name is after Nan, she was just a woman that was just ahead of her time for sure. And so is my aunt, and then my mum. So I owe a lot to those three women in my life that never made my gender feel like it was ever a barrier. So one of your questions that I thought about was like, when did I know that I was a leader. And I was kind of always raised for my young age to always put up my hand first. And I never let being a woman stopped me from doing that, or taking on that extra work or taking on that leadership role. And I wish that we would help all women from an early age like not like to grow that confidence as quickly as possible. So it's those three women for sure, that helped me, but I think equally and I didn't really realize that more until I was involved with next gen men, my dad played just as important a role in that. And it's funny when you think about who I'm really inspired by I played a lot of baseball with boys as a younger as a young girl. And my dad never made me feel like I couldn't play because I was a girl. And I remember telling him at a young age, I think I was 10 like that I'm going to be the first woman to play in Major League Baseball, and I'm going to be the back catcher for the Atlanta Braves. And I was serious. Like, I was like, Yes, they're my team. I love them. And my dad never said like, That's such a joke, you'll never do that. He's like, okay, let's get you there. Eventually, obviously, the boys got a lot taller and stronger. And then I moved on to other things. But I think that the equal role between my parent my both my parents, then my extended family as well was very important.
Seth Anderson:That's such a cool, very specific, because like you kind of boxed yourself in there. That's like, one position 30 teams, nine positions. That's that but very cool. I mean, you know, and I think sometimes I've read something. Again, I'm gonna generalize here but it talked about young girls and you know, sort of these terms we use, like Oh, she's so bossy and you know, different stuff like that and how that can be sort of harmful and the way I look at it like I don't look at my daughter is being bossy I see the leadership skills like I said, Everyone, she's gonna be the CEO of a Fortune 500 company one day because, like, she knows how to delegate. She knows what she wants, right? Like, and to me like that's such a big thing for kids, the girls boys, whatever, like knowing what you want and how to get it and doing it in like a productive way. Like I just see so many transferable skills already bubbling up with her and I don't want to squash that I want to develop that grow that help her help her find her voice in a world and same thing for my son. I think that is you know, obviously equal It's not always easy for boys either. But you know, particularly for her, she's she's got sort of a voice and I don't want to I don't want her to ever think that she can't use it.
Rebecca Finley:What's so interesting that you say that stuff. I love everything you just said. And that's really like microaggressions, and how detrimental they really are. So language, that's a lot of what I've learned through Jake and next gen men as those simple words like bossy, like how they then actually become an archetype for a whole gender. And it's like, Why do you call a woman bossy? When a man does the same thing, and he's assertive, and it's about accountability and calling each other out on that? Or it's even like the word bitch. Like, you know, why do we say that about a woman that's just being assertive. And I think men and women have equal responsibility to stop that kind of language, because it's not productive. And it doesn't really help us fulfill the true leadership potential we have.
JP Gaston:I just always remember, you know, you guys were talking about parents. For me. I have a sister who's 10 years older than me. And she did everything like anything that she set her mind to, she did, she wanted to, you know, be on the basketball team. And she was, you know, suddenly the MVP of the basketball team. She wanted to play volleyball, she was playing volleyball, she wanted to lead a debate club, she wanted to tour the world she went on. She went on exchange to Belgium, and then she went, she got her English degree in her law degree. So I've had, I've certainly been influenced by my by my parents, but for me, you know, my, my sister was probably a little bit more of an influence just because I got to watch that happen. And so I could see what women in my life could do. How important like, I know you've got those kind of authority figures, but how important is that kind of peer or brotherly sisterly type relationship and development as well?
Rebecca Finley:That's a good question. I think with my siblings, there were also different but very trailblazers in our own way. I have a younger brother and a younger sister. And for example, my younger sister, rides motorcycles, and started doing that at age 15. And she fights fires in the summer in rural BC, which neither of those things interest me at all. I like being clean and having a shower. And she's equally as strong. And I think she's never been scared. And I, again, I think it's a product of what we grew up with. And my brother is equally very kind and gentle to women, and very much like open to all people's opinions and perspectives, which is great. I think with regards to peers, it's all about building your tribe. And I think that I've done an awesome job over the years, there was lots of bumps along the way. I've just surrounding myself with incredibly positive influences, and with women that uplift each other, and are just willing to want the others to succeed. And I think that that's made a huge difference, like not only on my mental health, but my own successes is just having those people around me to rely on
Seth Anderson:great stuff, and maybe pivoting gears just a little bit. Finley and Associates. So that's your company, as I understand it. Company, okay, well, that actually, that makes a lot of sense. So
JP Gaston:I mean, officially, officially, it's
Seth Anderson:so just in sort of reading about it a little bit, your guyses sort of niche or angle is is consulting supporting family businesses? Do I understand that? Correct,
Rebecca Finley:though? It's interesting, because what people would say I'm a management consultant, and what does that even mean? So basically, we help businesses solve problems and think about the future. And we mainly do that by working with their boards and their senior leadership team, and boards within themselves. I think that there's a huge misunderstanding in general about what a board does, and how important they really are. It's interesting, I had a call today with a friend that just finished his MBA in Europe. And I was like, Did you learn anything about governance and your degree, and he's like, not really, I'm like, that's crazy, because they're actually what control the outcome of your organization or the nonprofit or whatever you're a part of it's most likely run by a board. And so that's an area that I love. I'm very, very excited about governance and the role that diversity and inclusion has to play at that decision making table. So what we do is we as I mentioned, we normally work with them, and we do a lot of strategic planning. And so the industries we mainly touch are anything but oil and gas. My mom has never been driven by oil and gas. We've worked in all the other industries we diversified before Calgary did. So I get to work a lot with agriculture, which is so cool, because you would never think that, you know, there's a whole bunch of farmers in the milk industry and so they have a board. And so we've worked with, you know, the Alberta Milk Producers or the chicken producers and farmers are so cool, because they're such amazing business people and they have such street smarts and so it's really neat to interact with them. We work a lot in post secondary. So we've done a ton of work with Queen's University with the University of Calgary on a lot of their strategies. Most recently, we worked with their Faculty of Science. And as you know, academia is a huge area that can help diversify the economy because it really depends on who's graduating at that time with what skills and are they relevant to the workforce. And so I love that project. And then we do a lot of work to with high net worth families, not from the financial management standpoint, but From the board governance, so you'll have a family that actually has their own board, and oversees their family businesses. And they almost run like a corporation, the more sophisticated that they get. And where I really love working is with the next gen generation. And so quite often, if you're several generations into a family, they want to be as entrepreneurial as possible. And so I get to work with the younger heirs and kind of help them figure out like, Well, what do you want to do with your life? So it's kind of a big question. And one of my favorite clients is I got to work with her. She's an artist, and we developed a business plan for her together. And I love that experience, because it's just, you know, seeing what they can do with the position that they've been given is really amazing. That's a little bit of what I do.to go on and on. But the other cool thing that we specialize in is in transformations. And so we're working on a big one right now with immigrant services, Calgary. And so if you're a new immigrant landing in any province across Canada, there's no centralized location that assesses you, you kind of just are left to find your way, which is kind of crazy to think about. And so what immigrant services Calgary is proposing is to be like, the central location that all immigrants would go first in Alberta, they would be assessed. So what's your language ability? What's your employability? What else do you need in terms of settlement services? And then we would triage them out. And if this goes, Well, this will be rolled out across Canada. And that's happening right here in Calgary, and we're the team behind their board and their management helping implement that. So that's pretty phenomenal. I'm pretty good. Yeah. It's pretty cool. It's
Seth Anderson:incredible. That's very cool. That's very cool. I've, I've been on a couple boards that probably could have used your services. Make disaster. They're always they make it interesting, though, right?
JP Gaston:And it's funny, because because some people think of the management consultant to be the Bob's from office space. You walk in and you look at a bunch of files, and you go this guy, we don't know. But like, clearly, that's so much more than that.
Rebecca Finley:Yeah, it really is. I think that management consulting, like everyone thinks we live the high life, like we're always traveling business class, and it's like Wolf of Wall Street Style. It's not, it's actually, especially if you work for a smaller team. I spend a lot of my time like capacity building, which is what I love. And so it's how do you empower your clients to do well, once you leave, I think that a poor consultant is someone that kind of just latches on to you for forever. And so your end goal and what success should really look like is that your client can take over the role themselves. And the other thing that I love to do is actually be a knowledge translator. So it's all about like, hearing what someone's saying, and then creating a framework and presenting it back to them and saying, Is this what you meant? And yes or no, and then you change it together. And so I love that co creation and collaboration, because your client is the subject matter expert, but we're the subject matter expert in processes and governance and strategy. So working together, it's a pretty unstoppable combination, I think. So that's what I love. I also do a lot of PowerPoints. That's my favorite. That's my heart. Were you you're big into PowerPoint.
Unknown:It's a skill,
Seth Anderson:I do a lot less than I used to. But there's nothing better than a, you know, putting together a beautiful PowerPoint, especially if you can get the little things going. And now Yeah,
Rebecca Finley:God said, Yes, I'm all about the animations, because that's the other thing I forgot to mention is I do a lot of facilitation. So that's a lot of what my role is working with a larger group and trying to make sure that everyone's included in the discussion and moving forward, and getting to present with the work behind me on the screen. So yeah, animations are key to making good points come across,
JP Gaston:you know, it was a good one too. And for some reason, you don't get to present it. But you still go back and look at it yourself. Just know that more than once.
Rebecca Finley:Have you. There's always those few slides that you're like this took me a long time. And this looks amazing. Yeah,
JP Gaston:someone's going to appreciate it. And if that's me, that's fine. I will sit here for an hour and stare.
Seth Anderson:JP JP and I did some road shows back in the day where we used to go talk to people around the province, and we built some pretty good. JP did most of the building. I did the talking but it was we did some good stuff. We had to go back and you'd be surprised to know that Seth did most of the one one point he touched on there, Rebecca that got my interest. Calgary diversification Alberta in general, obviously, it's a pretty hot topic. It was a hot topic, pre COVID. I think it's it's an increasingly hot topic. What do you think the city should do? I mean, obviously, maybe not the city government. But as a city as a province, you're in sort of the the consulting industry, you're seeing sort of multiple different facets of what's happening. Like I do think there's a lot of great entrepreneurs, a lot of great disruptors and businesses that are happening. That was a big inspiration for us even starting this podcast to begin with. But you know, when you talk about making economic options available for for people, where do you see us going? What kind of skills do you think we're going to need in the workplace and how does that kind of come to be over the next 510 15 years?
Rebecca Finley:I think that a lot of it starts with changing the narrative. And I think that He is doing us a huge disservice when they just talk about how poor state Calgary's and all the time because there's actually a ton of huge success stories happening right now that when I tell other people about it, they're like, I've never heard of that company. And I'm like, Are you kidding me? Like, for example, simond, that just raised $54 million in their series A, which is the largest in recent albertan history, and they're located here in Calgary. And I'm like, Why is no one talking about these amazing companies, and where we're going in the future? I think, first of all, we need to change the narrative as a city, we need to be better informed as to the awesomeness that is really happening here. And we need to support those entrepreneurs as much as possible. I really think that our provincial government had done a poor job initially, with regards to its policies where they scrapped a whole bunch of stuff that then scared off investors and other companies that were thinking of moving here. I think this is where I'm very much for, like private businesses, and less government control, because I think that that didn't, didn't do anything positive can scare off, like people that wanted to invest here. I have a friend in Toronto who had thought about opening an office, but then with those changes with the regulation was like, No, just kidding, we'll stay in Toronto. So it's a missed opportunity. And it's too confusing, especially for not here on the ground. I think with regards to skills, if you've heard of the management guy, Peter Drucker, he's the forefather of modern management. So he was actually the guy that started like what management is today, as you know it, he's now passed away, but he run the he won the freedom Medal of that in the US. And what he believed is that we were entering into the knowledge era. And so what Calgary needs in terms of skills is knowledge, we need to be like helping support those new grads as much as possible computer science. And obviously, the whole tech industry is playing a huge role in our diversification. And I think that there's a lot of great progress being made. We had done some strategic planning with the Department of Computer Science. So Christian Jacobs, the head there, he's an awesome leader. And I know that they started to initiate more programming there. I think overall, though, there needs to be more collaboration amongst players and stakeholders, because everyone's doing cool things in isolation, but there's not a lot of like connection between them. And that always surprised me, like we had done a project in downtown Calgary and a lot of people that had sat on that board weren't even aware of the great things that were happening within the district. That kind of surprised man. So I wish that those organizations would talk more together. And I wish that they would coordinate better. I think that there's a lot of governance that's happening that's maybe redundant. And there's a lack of communication that's happening. I am a born and raised calgarian. So I'm one of those unicorns, there's not much, many of us left. And I just know that this city will be able to make a huge comeback. And we just have to keep being optimistic about it. And we have to keep thinking about the future and not We can't let Calgary go. It's too beautiful. The other thing too sorry to just kind of like rant a bit, but I'm so interested in development. But I again, I think that there's some amazing projects coming online like the BMO centre expansion, the whole Canada Olympic Plaza revitalization. I mean, they brought in the executive director from the Lincoln Center from New York City, like we have some big brands here some world class people that are helping to fix our city and bring us into the new economy. So I think we're on the right track. But definitely more collaboration and coordination is required.
Seth Anderson:The company you mentioned off the top, Simon, yeah. What's that all about?
Rebecca Finley:Oh, they're so cool. I feel like the number one fan I feel kind of creepy talking about though I feel like I know a lot about them without actually knowing them at all. So they're, they have two co founders Hanif and Tiffany, who just won top 40 under 40, with Daniel Delgado and Jordan. So they're in the same class as him so they're worthwhile to checkout. And their company is so cool is basically to help at risk people that are going to default on their credit cards. And how does the company support them better? Instead of sending it directly to collections? It's how do you put more humanity back into business to create like plans to help those customers that are at risk of defaulting? So I love their vision. I think it's amazing. And they're just killing it. So definitely,
JP Gaston:I think I read about them in the in the top 40 write ups, and they actually claim back significantly more than sending anyone to collections ever does.
Rebecca Finley:It's so true. It's interesting, because I think at their core, it's about humanity and business, and how do you not make it so sterile? And how do you actually connect better to your customers by being more like compassionate, which is kind of like that whole movement around leadership that way with Bernie brown and being more vulnerable? I think that that's a huge part that's been missing in our leadership for so long. We've been kind of starved if that.
JP Gaston:Yeah. And I think a lot of businesses believe that they're making the right business decision by you know, forcing this outstanding debt forward. And they don't see the human opportunity as well as the financial opportunity is being greater if they just took the time and effort to take that extra step. Now, one
Seth Anderson:of the things we've talked about a little bit, there's a lot of great entrepreneurs. JP and I've been fortunate to get to No, a few. But then there's a lot of people who have great ideas that are not able to sort of take their ideas and turn them into something real sort of that concept of an entrepreneur versus a one to printer. And in the people you work with, how do you? Where's the difference? Where's the line? How do you Where do you find the successful people that make that jump
Rebecca Finley:execution? That's it, it comes down to execution. And quite often, we're brought into organizations that are just completely succumbed to paralysis. And so they've had this strategic vision or whatever, but they just don't know where to start. And they can't even start with like step one. So then they just don't do anything. And you know, we come across boards that haven't made decisions, or really done anything meaningful in years, because they just don't know what to do, or they haven't been given a good enough roadmap, or they haven't developed a good enough roadmap. So that's really important is first of all, figuring out where you're going and why making sure that strategic direction makes sense based on data and making your decisions based on that data. I think quite often organizations just say, Well, my gut tells me this. And I think intuition does stand for a lot. But also data is really important. So it's like, you know, survey your customers find out what it is that what are their real needs? Are you segmenting even the right people, and then back up what you think your intuition is telling you what that data, I can't stress that enough. But then again, back to execution is like you have to start somewhere. And I read a book recently, and of course, I can't remember it now. But it's like, you know, if you put the pressure on yourself to go to the gym every day to run an hour on the treadmill, then it's kind of like, it's it's too much of a task to do. But if you just make the thing, it's like, you just have to show up. I think it's habits. I think that that's what the book is I'm thinking of, and just go for five minutes, 10 minutes, like that's better than doing nothing. And you're at least moving forward. But I think organizations and entrepreneurs think like, Well, I have to do an hour on the treadmill every day. So I just can't do it today. And they don't even make like those small steps forward. And so a year goes by and it's like, what meaningful impact Have you made? And they probably haven't done that much.
Seth Anderson:that resonates a lot. And I would I would venture a guess to a lot of people kind of get stuck in their own head like they that idea and it needs to be perfect. And then like when it comes to making that first step. If it's not like exactly right, then you take two steps back and then all of a sudden, you're You don't even know where you are, how do you get through your services? And then what you guys do? How do you help people get out of their own heads or out of their own ways? and make that first step?
Rebecca Finley:Oh, my gosh, this is Yeah, I love that you brought up that point, because I think that that is another huge detriment organizations is people are so scared to fail. And I think as like a society, we don't celebrate failure enough. Like if you look at American entrepreneurs, they're so gutsy compared to Canadians, like they'll just do it like you think of like Las Vegas being built in the desert, or you think of like Disneyland Disney World, like those huge companies that came out of the US, because they just didn't think they could fail. And if they did, the US government is set up. So it's easier to restart your business again, in Canada, it's not the same, like we don't have that same like it's okay to fail and restart mentality. And I think that that's where the problem initially starts. So what we try and help them to do is to shift their thinking and to think more like, fail fast and try again. So it's all about trial and error. And with every time that you fail, you're learning something and like, don't think about it as like, You're terrible. You shouldn't be in this business, it just means you need to pivot and maybe try something different. So we think about it as many experiments. So if you have a new business idea, it's better to try it out as fast as possible to see if it's going to work or not than to just like, wait for it to be like the perfect time, perfect moment. Because it's never going to be like maybe you're super lucky and launched a health care company right in the middle. And did really well, you know, but the rest of us, it's timing is never going to be totally perfect. So you just have to try and just keep going from there. I
Seth Anderson:think a cleaning company would have been a good one in the middle of COVID. Or those stickers that go on the floor. I think that's another good one. There's
JP Gaston:been a bunch of good ones antibacterial hand soap company,
Rebecca Finley:actually, I have to make a mini plug for one of my closest friends. So he actually if I think about entrepreneurs and someone else you should interview it's Taylor man. And he's the CEO of clean slate. And so they came up with their idea on the back of a napkin at Queen's University and the incubator there, and they came up with the idea of a device to sanitize your cell phone in 30 seconds or less. And they've been chugging along for the last five years and obviously COVID hit and now they've just taken off and they're doing incredible and their product is actually been rolled out at Pearson Toronto airport, as well as the Hudson's Bay right across Canada. A whole bunch of NFL teams and NHL teams have them in the US LinkedIn, Google, like they've exploded. So they're definitely someone if you think about COVID. When it's done well for entrepreneurs, they've, they've killed it, they've crushed it. So proud of them.
Seth Anderson:That's very cool. Now we're all about the shameless plugs for stuff that is cool. That was sort of the criteria. We set
JP Gaston:up entrepreneurs, make sure that we give a voice to women, make sure that we give a voice to everybody and anybody that we can and then help as many companies as possible get their name. out there that have all this stuff that as long as they're doing cool stuff that people don't hear about.
Rebecca Finley:I love that. Yeah, I definitely know a few cool people doing some pretty awesome stuff.
Seth Anderson:What so you touched on habits a little bit. We've talked about habits at length on this pod. I am a big believer in micro habits, if you will, like you start something small, digestible, you work at it for a little bit. And then you add to it. I find a lot of people, you know, they go into whatever it is whether it's weight loss, like you said, I gotta go to the gym and I got to go for an hour every day, they try to like eat the whole elephant, and then they get discouraged. And they take a step back, what habits do you have? Or do you if you've been working on this sort of help you to stay on your path for continuous growth? Do you have any, like specific habits that you're working on right now?
Rebecca Finley:I'm not sure if they're like habits, some of them might be just like character traits that I'm not sure the difference between the two of them sometimes, but the first one is positivity. Like I've just always been like a very positive person. And I think that you have to practice that. In a sense, though, when you find yourself getting more like gloomy and dark, clouded, especially the last few months have been really difficult to kind of reframe, and to think about, like, what are you really grateful for? And so I think that that's like one of the first habits that I think is so important, because it's so easy to just be like, I hate this, this sucks. And so often, when we do strategic planning with clients, they're so quick to point out what won't work. And it's like, okay, you're just whining. Like, if you're not providing a solution, you're just whining, and that's not helpful to anyone. And that's not going to help us move forward. And so I think that, that's something that I just think is totally invaluable. Like, you have to be positive.
Seth Anderson:Would you say there's a, there's a line somewhere between being positive and always I'm trying to think of the word here, like, there's being positive, which I think is 100%, like, growth, mindset, overcoming, looking for on the bright side of things, but then there's like, not wanting to see bad so much like ignoring the bad stuff. And just like, you know, being oblivious to it, like, Where's the what is like productive positivity? I guess I would say, like, how do you how do you? How do you know that you're not just ignoring bad stuff or ignoring something coming at you that could be detrimental? Because you're trying to stay positive? So I don't know if I'm explaining it, right. But I think there's a there's like a productive positivity, but also like, knowing that bad stuff is gonna happen or not not ignoring negativity, but but dealing with it in a positive way,
JP Gaston:I guess, like almost like a horse race. How do you look ahead not have your blinders on, though, know what's going on around you. But keep running that race for that finish line.
Rebecca Finley:I think it's important to have people around you that you really trust that they're going to tell you the truth. And I have about four of these in my life that I really look to my mother, my boyfriend is J stick of the executive director of next gen men, and my best friend is Savannah. And those four people keep me grounded. So I am very positive. And I always have this sense that I won't fail. I'm not sure where that comes from. But I think it's helped me get very far in a lot of regards. However, I think it's important to have those people around you that can kind of warn you of your shortcomings and where you're maybe you don't you have your blinders on. But then when you think about leadership, that's why inclusivity and diversity is so important. Because as much as I'm the board chair, and I kind of know where we need to go as an organization. I can't have people that think the exact same way as me around me, because then it's just groupthink. And then we all think super positively. And then we don't see what's bad happening. And so, I mean, that's a whole conversation within itself when you think about who you choose to put yourself on your team with. But I try and choose people that think opposite of me just so that they can alert me to what I don't see. So that that would be one of the answers I would have. The second one too, though, goes back to Peter Drucker, where he really believed that strategy means that you understand your strengths and your weaknesses, but you build your strategy based on your strengths. And so you're aware of where your shortcomings are, and you build your team up so people can fill in those shortcomings. But really where you excel is taking your strengths to the next level, because you can go from like a 70 to 100% with your strengths or you can go from a 10% to a 30% with your weaknesses like what is really the bigger payoff that way. So I'm still more of a half glass or glass half full kind of person for sure.
Seth Anderson:No, I love that I honestly I've I've joined I don't know what you want to call it. The it's almost like a religion positivity in some ways. Like if I look at the first 30 years of my life or so I was sort of programmed and wired to look at the negative side of things is very pessimistic. You know, I don't think I was always negative, but I always look for what why I would fail or Oh, we've been through that before. But when I started to make that shift and my kids were a big influence on this, I'll be honest to looking at the glass half full looking at the opportunity, giving someone or something the benefit of the doubt before writing it off. Honestly, life is just so much better. Like it's it's honestly better and whether it's in the workplace, whether it's You know, home Wherever I am, it's better because it's just more enjoyable to look at things that way.
Rebecca Finley:It's so true, like life is so cool. People are doing such cool stuff like it once you pull that back, and you kind of take a step back and you get rid of all the negativity, and you focus on, you only have so much time, and it's all done one day, and do you want to spend that whining and complaining? Or do you want to actually do something about it, and I choose to be the one that wants to do something about it and move forward. So I'm so grateful, that that you've changed your perspective, because that is what life is about.
Seth Anderson:Yeah, and I love what you said too, about surrounding yourself, I've got a pretty small circle at this point. And, and I just want to set a good example for my kids. Like, I don't want them to spend a bunch of years wandering around trying to get approval from people who, you know, don't really care, you know, if you if you have a few people that really care about you, and they're there to support you, that's all you need. Like you don't need 1000 fairweather friends and you know, they're gonna have to go through their own experiences, and I don't want to live vicariously through them or try to try to set them up. So they don't have to feel like I think some parents do that, where it's like, they helicopter their kids, and they, they don't want it like I need my kids need to feel stuff, they need to go through pain, they need to get their own coping mechanisms, all that kind of stuff. But if they can think and develop positive, positive mindset and attitude at this age, that's just gonna help them navigate all this all the negative stuff that's going to hit them once they kind of get into their adult life, at least from from wherever the way I see it.
Rebecca Finley:That's where you build that resiliency, which is so like critical to like your own success. But I love what you said though, about surrounding yourself with positive people too. And I think that that's another habit that I practice is I'm in the relationship business. So I'm I love people, and I'm always connecting with cool people. Now, I always give someone the benefit of the doubt until they prove me wrong. And at that point, what I've noticed is especially within the last two years, within my own growth is I've been much less tolerant of keeping people around that have kind of shown me who they are. And I'm kind of that the mindset where I'm like, I already have so many great people, I can't change everyone. And if this person is showing me that they're not a good influence on me, or they don't help support what I'm doing, like you're gone. I don't have time. And I wish that I could have told that to my younger self, because I think that I let too many relationships with friends go on for way too long, that weren't positive influences in my life. So cut people faster.
Seth Anderson:We talked about this a little bit with a previous guest. So we have Lauren rose, and she does coaching through Tarot and and she's got a pretty cool local business as well. And she talked to us about boundaries, and just how people generally aren't very good at setting boundaries. And it made me think a lot, you know, there's boundaries where someone sets with you and respecting those boundaries. And but I think sometimes we forget, or at least that for myself, I wasn't very good at setting boundaries with other people, like, in a lot of cases, I would go how I feel like I would go above and beyond to try and do something for someone or help someone with like almost an expectation that it would be recognized or something, and almost felt taken advantage of, in certain situations until I kind of like took a step back. And I was like, I'm not doing a very good job of like setting boundaries on my end. And I'm just sort of, you know, whatever the case might be, but do you have any thoughts on on boundaries and, and how, as people, we can do a better job or, or any tips on how you do a good job of setting boundaries, whether that be in the workplace or in life? It's
Rebecca Finley:interesting, because to answer your question, I might conflict myself a little bit because another habit that I like to practice is to try and say yes, as much as possible, because you never know what experience or what person you're going to meet as a result of that. However, at the same time, as much as I'm an extrovert, and I love to do things I've so often over done it and just burnt myself out that it's really important to learn how to say no, to have those battery boundaries and to realize that you don't have to give everyone an explanation of why you're saying no to something. And so that that's one of the key things that I've come up with that ways to learn how to say no, I think that that was something very hard for me because I to easily say yes. So that's that's one of the key ones.
JP Gaston:Yeah, I was actually as you were saying that I was actually thinking of the movie. Yes, man. Which it actually spoke to me because I'm generally a very positive person too. And it at first, it, it seemed weird to me that someone would say no, so often. So I almost didn't believe the movie for the next little bit. And then as he started saying yes to everything. I was like, Oh, yeah, that's totally me. That's what I like I would I would totally join a cult, just as a fun thing to do. And then as it kind of resolved at the end, I started thinking, you know, I probably say yes to too much. And I need to figure out how to control that. And I know that that movie probably was never intended that, you know, they weren't sitting around as writers going, man, we should make this great movie about leadership. But it did speak to me on a leadership level. And the kind of let me know that. I don't need to say yes to everything. I need to say yes, strategically to the things that I could say yes to, and I need to better understand the things that I'm about to say no to Why I'm about to say no. And maybe how I can do things differently. Maybe I don't have to say yes. But I can say, Hey, I happen to know someone who can help out.
Rebecca Finley:Yeah, I think that that's really key. And it actually goes back to expectations. The third habit I really practice. So if I say, Yes, I'm not a flake, like I will be there, whether or not I have a massive headache, unless like something really bad has happened, I kind of have put that onus on myself, I've just become one of those people that you can count on me like I will be there. And I think that we live in a society now where people are way too flaky. I think that people use the silliest excuses to get out of stuff. And so if you are going to say yes, I expect people to follow through on that. But Seth, to your earlier point, though, expectation setting is really important, especially in terms of leadership. So what you give as a leader, you're not always going to receive back. And that's definitely something that I've had to grapple with. And I, through my work and through seeing clients do well or not do well, it's sometimes hard to watch, or even through my volunteer work, too. And all you can do is you're only, you're only really in control of yourself. And you can just try and set that leadership and try and encourage others to do the same. But it's ultimately up to them. Right, though? That's a hard lesson to learn too. But expectation setting for sure.
JP Gaston:I will I will tell you as a musician, I know a lot of people who flake, oh, as soon as you tell them that you're playing a show, or everyone's gonna be there. There's not enough bar except people at the bar sometimes.
Rebecca Finley:Yeah, no, like, that's the thing too, though, like, relationship building is so key. So if you're gonna make an effort for those few people in your life, like show up for them, you know, like, don't just be like, Oh, I'm kind of tired, I'm not gonna go like, I'm very much the kind of person that will go no matter what. Because I think it's important to show up and to not be flaky.
JP Gaston:And over the last 10 years, I feel like you've probably seen a pretty significant shift, I'm going to, I'm going to make up my own word here, but a pretty significant shift in flakiness as a result of like, social media, right? Like, I just think of, you know, how much gets shared. And even, you know, for this podcast, we start sharing on social media. And we both have fairly large friends lists, and, and we're connected to a lot of people, but how many, how many people actually take the time to listen or, or share or do things with you, whatever you create, or whatever you're interested in, versus, you know, sharing that video of a cat or whatever happens to pique their interest that day? So have you have you seen that sort of shift in the workplace as well?
Rebecca Finley:Yeah, I think the flakiness thing with cell phones, it's very easy for people now to say, you know, 10 minutes before you're supposed to meet like, Oh, I can't make it something happened. Or like, Are you kidding me? Like I, you know, I planned this. And what I would say, again, as it goes back to an earlier point is I've just cut those people out of my life, like, I just don't have time for those relationships for people that won't make time for me. And I don't think that that's a true friend, if they're not willing to show up or to be interested in what you're doing, because I so much care about what they're doing. And I think it's amazing what the two of you have done, and I want to support you, however I can. And I don't think that there's enough, pay it forward, or reciprocity that happens in our society. And I don't know if it's like, we're shifted so much more being so isolationist, and we just care about ourselves that we're not willing to help each other anymore. And I find like, often strangers will promote my stuff more than maybe some of my old friends that I used to have. Like, this is wrong, like, I need better friends. And, again, I edited people out of my life. But yeah, the flakiness thing, it just makes me want to pull my hair out.
JP Gaston:Yeah, the good news is the ones who aren't gonna listen, aren't gonna hear this anyway. So to everyone who's listening right now that's on my friends list. Thank you, you're awesome. You're not one of the ones have died.
Seth Anderson:Rebecca, what what's next for you, like you've got all these exciting things, I very much take you to be someone who's looking at the future and where you're headed next, what's on the horizon for you.
Rebecca Finley:So I've started these governance workshops. And they were just a bit of a pilot pilot at the beginning of COVID, to just see how they would go. So I've spoken about governance, right across Canada, which has been super cool. And I wanted to try it online to just see what would happen. And it was really incredible how much positive response there was. And so I did a second one, and that sold out. And then I did a third one. And that sold out. And my fourth one coming up this Friday, where it's just an introduction to what is governance anyways, and why should you be a part of a board or start a board for your organization. And the reception has been so positive that I was like, okay, we need to turn this into something bigger. And so in the new year, I'm going to be launching a three part governance series that will take you through like, what is governance, why you should be part of a board to how does a board and committee work? And then so on and so forth. And my real hope is that through this governance literacy training is to then encourage more people of different diversity, diverse backgrounds to get involved with boards and committees because I think that there's a huge leadership vacuum that's happening, where we don't have great minds and people at these board tables and committee tables because they just don't know what it is and they don't think that they should They're, and then when I kind of talk to them and get them excited about it, they're like, wow, yeah, like I should apply for this board. And I was like, Yes, you should, like, we need you there to be bringing your thoughts forward. And so I'm just so excited about that. One of my sessions, it had a cohort that had participants from Spain, Toronto, Vancouver, and New Zealand, all on the same call. And so for me, that's like, my, my reach is starting to get more global. And I just, like, Look forward to seeing where this goes in the future. And my dream would be to lecture about this, like, across the world would be so awesome. And to get those people onto boards and committees,
Seth Anderson:what would your your pitch be to someone who's maybe been on a couple of boards, and like, when they hear the word board, they kind of bristle like, I don't know, if that's a path I want to go down. I do kind of remember the point that I forgot five minutes ago, I can't remember where we're talking about. But I started thinking about currency, in particularly time. And one thing through COVID, that I've learned is like time is the ultimate currency. Like, you can take away all sorts of our existential things and material and like, none of it matters. Like if you got your family, and you're safe, and you've got food and water, like time, that that's the thing. And a lot of us don't realize it maybe until it's too late. I mean, I feel like I wasted a bunch of years on frivolous ambitions, or needless material items, and really just hold time and being present and being there. And so like, if I'm going to commit to something, I want to make sure that it's for a good cause, and that it's not going to be a waste of my time. And so not saying to pitch to me specifically, but I know I'm not the only person who's maybe you know, had a board experience that wasn't the greatest. How do you? How do you get back on that train? What would you give someone advice on that friend?
Rebecca Finley:Well, first of all, you have to be the change that you want to see. Right? So if you've been on a super dysfunctional board, if you just have given like throwing up your hands and saying, Well, I'm never gonna be involved with another board, well, then it's never gonna get better. So the onus is on you, if you're really interested in certain organizations, if you're willing to do it is to be at that board table to actively promote what you're trying to accomplish for that organization. So, for example, with next gen men, when I sit at that board table, I'm thinking about, I'm actually here, because there's a boy that's nine years old, that's learning about vulnerability, and how to talk to his male friends and build better relationships. That's why I'm at this board table. And I think that people so quickly forget that connection between the stakeholder that they're serving and the board table that they become too disconnected that way. And I would say, join an organization that you're genuinely passionate about, not just something that you want to use to pad your LinkedIn, I think too many people get involved with boards or committees, but they don't really know what they're doing. And they kind of just show up, and they're on autopilot. And that's not how I run my board or my committee meetings, I'm very much about like high engagement, building capacity, learning about who it is we're actually serving. But I think a lot of boards do a disservice that way is that they just expect their members to give to them, but they're not giving back to them in terms of engaging them. You can always shadow boards, to those that like to see if it's a good fit for you or not. But it really does come down to the leadership and the tone that those people are setting. And I think the other habit to think about is like running effective meetings, that's something that like has been drilled into me. And yeah, there's nothing more that I can stand than in effective meetings and just death by meeting like the whole idea of wasting people's time. And I just think that that goes back to a lack of preparedness. And people are just too busy jumping from one thing to the next that they don't take a moment to like breathe, and really think about what they want to be talking about in that meeting. And it's just a waste of everyone's time. So I tried to be very conscious about like, is this actually impactful? And if you can end the meeting early, ended early, like don't just say, Amen, amen.
JP Gaston:And, and, and can I also say you're not, you're not giving people 15 minutes back. Because that's a thing that's come up so much over the last several years, whether, you know, in my day job or outside, when a when a meeting that I attend ends early, they say, oh, we're gonna give you back 15 minutes? No, you're just not going to take the 15 minutes that you had planned to take.
Seth Anderson:I'm at a place now where like if there's not a clear agenda, and some obvious outcome or some reason for me to attend them not going anymore, like it's death by 1000 cuts. And, like COVID there's been a lot of great collaboration, I think that has been unlocked. You know, it hasn't all been bad, but the never ending 1530 minute meetings with nothing with no agenda whatsoever. Like I can't even do it anymore. So I want to have that respect to people when I'm booking a meeting, here's at least what it's going to be about. You know, come prepared to talk about this. You know, hopefully you can give a little bit more context. Sometimes it's not possible, but like, I'm with you the death by 1000 cut meeting approaches. Yeah,
Rebecca Finley:well, two answers to that too. Have you heard of HBr is like meeting calculator. Harvard Business came up with like their own Meeting calculator where you can actually like calculate how much this meeting is costing based on like your salary.
Seth Anderson:I say that all the time, I'm like, What is the period? This is because it's got it. This is the most expensive meeting of the week, like people should start getting prizes. They're not real prizes. But like, seriously, like, Why? Why is there seven VPS and 19 directors on this call to talk about like, budgeting training, you know what I mean, like,
Rebecca Finley:but the second thing that that comes back to, though, is really about governance and strategic planning, right? Like, that is what I get to do. And that's why it's so important. And that's why governance to me is so exciting, because it's like, those meetings are ineffective, because the decisions are being made by the people that need to be in the room, they're not being driven by the strategic priorities of the organization. And so like those, that's what it really comes back to. And I don't know why people don't stress that enough, when they think about meetings and
JP Gaston:what I feel like it's because not enough people say things like governance is exciting. There are very few people out there that use those terms in the same sentence. And but it's so true. Like, that doesn't sound exciting. But when you can really master it, man, can you make a difference in your organization?
Rebecca Finley:Well, it really just comes down to who's making the decisions? And why and are they set up to succeed? Like that is really what governance is about? And are you representing the stakeholders who your organization was set up to serve in the first place? That's it? Like that? Sounds simple. But that's what it's about. And I think so often organizations forget that.
JP Gaston:And it's funny, because I bet you a lot of a lot of those organizations have people who have credentials, like so I have my PMP designation, that are trained to implement those sort of things. And the and the corporation might even expect them to implement those sorts of things as their projects, but they don't do it at the higher level to run the entire organization.
Rebecca Finley:Crazy. Yeah, it's such a missed opportunity. And I think, again, that's why like, diversity and inclusion is so important, because you might have someone that could be a really great thinker at that board table. That is maybe dissuade because they just don't understand what that board table looks like. But they could make all the difference in that meeting, right? And so it's like, we kind of just put these people in place, because you have the credentials, you must know what you're doing. But I would challenge that thinking and say quite often those people don't. And they're just kind of doing like, what they've always done, and it's not changing the results. And so it's time to think
JP Gaston:of surprisingly, it's not changing the results.
Seth Anderson:If you do it, do what you've always done, you'll get what you've always gotten. There you go. This was a absolute pleasure, Rebecca. I feel like I feel like we're definitely gonna have you on the pod again. I hope so. It's an awesome talking to both you. This was a this was great. Any anything you want to close out on, or no,
Rebecca Finley:I just think it's awesome that you two are doing this. I think it's really cool. And I first heard about you through Daniel. And so I think that he's an awesome entrepreneur too. And he's one of those success stories in Calgary that is not getting enough of a platform. And we're not talking about what him and Jordan are doing to really contribute. So I think it's really great that the two of you have taken this on, and I wish you the best of luck. And if there's anyone I can ever connect or introduce you to I'm happy to do that well
JP Gaston:in for for anyone listening. You know, if they want to get involved with something like next gen men, we do have listeners across the country, most of them, you know centered in Calgary, of course, but we do have listeners across the country and around the world, we are international. But if they want to get involved with with next gen men in some way, how can they How can they reach out and
Rebecca Finley:they can just connect with me directly. And then I can kind of help them figure out what part of the organization they want to get involved with. But hopefully it's the governance side because it's super cool.
Seth Anderson:Totally cool. Kids are
Rebecca Finley:awesome. But I mean, Jake runs a pretty awesome ship on the management team too, so I can always connect them with them too.
Seth Anderson:Perfect. Well, thanks so much for joining us. And we'll chat again soon. Have a great rest of your night, YouTube. Thanks, Rebecca. You too. This week on the podium. we're chatting Christmas ornaments.
Voiceover:The Podium
Seth Anderson:Given the season, we felt, you know, everyone's pulling their tree out. We felt festive. We felt festive, and we just did it on the weekend. And lots of memories come flooding back. Although we don't have that many old ornaments anymore. You know, we've replaced a lot of them over the last couple of years. And with my mom having a laser engraving store, we
JP Gaston:collected a few
Seth Anderson:we've collected a few. Kaitlyn sent a picture to our group chat yesterday saying here's our Christmas tree brought to you by beyond a beaten path. It's like 100 ornaments on and they're all great. They're all great. This week on the podium. We've got Christine Jones and another longtime listener first time caller friend of the show and resident Christmas Expert we felt, you know, pretty strongly that we had to bring in someone with a higher level of knowledge and enthusiasm about the Christmas season than us and Christine was the first person who came to mind
JP Gaston:we should call her Christmas Jones.
Kristine Jones:That this is a big title to live up to guys.
Seth Anderson:Hey, you know you're our Christmas expert anything Christmas related. Henceforth, we will defer to you
Kristine Jones:excluding anything in the kitchen. Truth. I have never once cooked turkey dinner in my life.
JP Gaston:I don't blame you. I didn't really do too much turkey cooking myself until I got a rotisserie because you can literally just put it out there and let it rotate for four hours and it's delicious.
Seth Anderson:I actually found it like the first time I cooked a turkey I was almost like that's it. Like, they kind of make it out of the movies like it's like this big to do but you just kind of throw it in the oven and the cooks. I don't know.
JP Gaston:Did you get feedback from people who ate your turkey? Or is that just your interpretation isn't butterball?
Seth Anderson:It was it was delicious. It was the best turkey they ever had. I've also done a bacon wrap turkey that was pretty good. Although I found the bacon. Not the best. But you know the turkey tasted good.
JP Gaston:So bacon wrapped anything can become overpoweringly bacony. And I love bacon. But I don't really want to eat a turkey sized piece.
Seth Anderson:I feel like this could be a whole thing we could easily split off into top three Christmas dinner items. However, this week we are doing the ornaments so JP What are your top three Christmas ornaments and or decorations if, if you so choose?
JP Gaston:Well. I had to dig a little bit back into my parents ornaments from the joint immediate family Christmas tree. Just because there's one that is the most ridiculous thing but it always brings back a Christmas memories for me. My sister when she was in her younger years, I forget what grade but like probably grade three, grade four, they made the you know those little you take construction paper and you make little links with it. And you just glue them together and you make like a fake garland. Well, she made one. And it was orange and black. Most of us Chris and then the memo. And then of course my my parents were meant to put it on the tree. So they've got this like perfect Christmas tree, all the great colors. And then this orange and black construction paper garland butter. And you know, they could try and put it on the back but my sister would find it and pull it back around to the front every now. And so. It was it was prominent. My second one is actually one that I got a couple of years ago. I say a couple but it was probably like a decade ago now. But it was the Snoopy tree
Seth Anderson:as as an ornament or the the decoration the actual actual tree. Okay, okay.
JP Gaston:Yeah. So it's just this little this little twig with one Christmas ball that hangs off of it. And it is leaning to the side. It's a it's a great little centerpiece on a table and everybody loves it. It looks ridiculous. But everybody who comes over laughs and has a good time. So it's a good it's a good one. And the other one is one that I found ridiculously annoying when I got it. But Declan loves it. He laughed at it last year when he was you know, four months old or so and and this year, every time we play with it, he just starts first he's a little you know, apprehensive but then he starts laughing and it's a frosty the snowman. But he's wearing like a hoodie and jeans and sneakers and a backwards hat. He's got glasses on. And he does he does like Frosty the snowman. He sings that but to the tune of ice ice baby any any dances and Declan cannot get enough of it. He just hills he'll be playing and then he'll just turn around and point at it. And go hmm Can you demo that for us? The singing and dancing or do you want me to actually get it? Yeah, no, I In either case. The answer's no, actually.
Seth Anderson:That's awesome. That is a
JP Gaston:Halloween garland Halloween, by far I recommend.
Seth Anderson:Christine, how will you Oh boy.
Unknown:So I have one Christmas item. It's a train that goes in front of my fireplace every year. But the story about this train is that my mom had the exact same one and every time I'd go to her house, it's I'm notorious for taking stuff from my mom like I walk in and I'm like I'm gonna take this from the fridge and this from the cupboard and basically everything that's hers is also mine. So I kept saying when can I have the train? When can I have the train and she loved it. So she's like, No, you are not getting this train. And then, couple years ago, she found the exact thing train at Value Village of all places. So she bought it, and she gave it to me. And so my most prized Halloween decoration is actually that train from Value Village
Seth Anderson:many many treasures to be found at Value Village if you're looking in the right next and crannies Yeah,
JP Gaston:there's something about trains at Christmas time to like there's no other time in the year where I'm like, oh trains, but then Christmas comes around and like
Unknown:yeah, baby. Yeah. Yeah, so there's that one and then I too have a lot of decorations that the kids have made. And it's really nice when we're putting up the tree and it's this family gathering and we bake cookies and they take their their diy decorations and place them on the tree. And then as soon as they go to bed, I promptly take them off the tree or move them to the back. Which doesn't really prove that I love the decorations but deep down I really do. Like they're special, but they're not picture perfect. So I don't want them on the front of the tree. It's a terrible parents terrible parents I am they must feel so unloved. I'll be paying for counseling probably the rest of their lives. And then I would say the last one. That would be a pair of figure skates that my girlfriend made for me a couple years ago and they're glittered in red glitter. Totally painted with these cute Hollies stuck out of the tops of them. And then yeah, they're hanging in the living room. So they're pretty special. She actually just a couple of weeks ago, while I was working broke into the house one day came upstairs carrying carrying skis that are painted red, and they're beautiful. And she leaned them up against the wall next to the skates. So look that those ones are pretty close up there too.
JP Gaston:It's not just a test of your security system. Or
Seth Anderson:its it's never on JP I didn't hear her come in. You're right. That's like a home loan situation just waiting to happen. Those are my Christmas decorations. What about you stuff? Awesome. Well, I unfortunately once again, JP two weeks in a row, I've failed to build a weighted matrix in which to compare all of my things on my list, Christine, one thing you'll learn is that going a little overboard on the list and then calculating. But I've got a couple. So number three on my list I'm going to go with and it's actually sort of what spurned this whole topic. And it's also three items, their little hockey jerseys. And I think they're actually like fridge magnets that I got at some point when I was younger. And there's a Joe Sakic, Patrick Wah and Paul Korea one. And I've just been hanging them on the tree since I was like, I don't know, a teenager or something and they're still around. So I always I always like seeing those ones when they come out. Number two is something that we don't actually have anymore, but something I remember from being a kid was those and W root beer bears. Yeah, when I was a kid, we had like a whole bunch of them. There's like one on a on skis and a snowboard and toboggan. And I don't think anyone has them anymore. I think I saw that maybe a W was selling them again, that always made me think of Christmas and something to think about. And then number one, I will just say every ornament that my mom has made. They've all been delightful. Last year Caden, my one of my sisters made us all matching Lammas with little Christmas hats on them in our name, those are cool. But the best one that was ever made is we were playing board games one year for Christmas. And I think it was like the Bob Ross. It's like a Pictionary style game where you have to like draw a picture and people guess what it is. And my mom's husband err and drew a picture. And it was for the word jazz hands. And the picture was just it was it was a thing of art. And my mom turned it into an ornament because I think we laughed about it for like three days straight. I will share it but that is by far the number one ornament on our tree that I get excited to put up every year.
Unknown:Those are so genuine and deep. Like I feel like when you're talking about the a and W berry you're you've got a little tear in the corner of your eye.
Seth Anderson:Yeah, apparently. I just thought of it on this topic. I hadn't thought about it in a long time. So apparently there's some recent deep meaning there. Do you guys do the Christmas pickle thing? He has ever heard of that?
Unknown:What? I do not but I do you know what it's all about? Because I actually am very curious. And I see the ornaments. We have to Google this.
Seth Anderson:Yeah. So we started doing it last year and then this year Linden was like we do the Christmas pickle. We're doing the Christmas pickle. So you like get an ornament It's a pickle and you hide it in the tree. And then the kids like try to find it whoever finds it wins and they had come up with whoever doesn't find it has to sleep without blankets for a week or something.
JP Gaston:The Christmas pickle punishment. You they've been watching too many reality shows man.
Seth Anderson:I guess I think Lenin said whoever wins gets to watch a movie with dad and whoever loses has to do something with mom or something. I don't know. But, yeah, you just get this little plastic pickle and you hide it in there. And it's green, so it kind of blends in. And we'll dive deeper into that on another episode. I don't know what it's from or the origin of the story, but
Unknown:Well, thank you because I've always wondered why I see these random pickle ornaments that are, you know, 10 bucks a pop and you're wondering why you're putting a pickle in the tree be on Christmas morning, the first person to find the pickle on the tree would receive an extra Christmas present from Santa Claus or would be said to have a good fortune.
JP Gaston:You have a choice. We'll give you the pickle or a year of good. Takes a pickle. It's a ridiculous option.
Seth Anderson:Or if you ask my kids, you just get to hang out and have a movie night with that. I mean, it's a pretty good deal.
JP Gaston:So that's a year of good fortune wrapped up into an hour and a half. And what's the movie that the kids have to watch? I
Seth Anderson:don't know. They never sit through a movie anyway. So I don't know. But
Kristine Jones:jaws
Seth Anderson:jaws? Yes. That's a Christmas movie for all. I have a feeling in your household itself. Well, I mean, I my daughter may or may not be named after the lead female character from that movie. So yeah, it's the popular popular film.
JP Gaston:still laughing about the Christmas bagel.
Seth Anderson:Okay, thanks for joining us this week and for
JP Gaston:for helping us discover what this pickle ornament debacle.
Unknown:Anytime and thank you for having me. I am your number one fan. I gotta go get myself a pickle now.