S2E14 - Finding Positivity and Gratitude w/Marius Billgobenson

Subscriber-only episode

This week in The Biz Dojo, we're joined by Marius Billgobenson - musician, activist and award-winning anthropologist. 

Marius is a storyteller, through both word and music. Our conversation explores his time growing up in the Congo, and living in the forest as he experienced first hand the challenges racism and oppression. We discuss positivity, and how gratitude can change your perspective on life. We'll also chat about leadership, and get into some deep stories about Marius' path to becoming a jazz musician. 

Then on the Podium - brought to you by Beyond a Beaten Path - Seth and JP share some celebrate Earth Day (Thursday, Apr 22!) and discuss some of the changes they've made in their lives when it comes to sustainability.
 
This is an inspiring episode. Grab that cup of  Dojo Dark, and close your eyes as you listen to the stories of someone who was displaced, but found themselves. It's really an incredible journey.

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Transcript

Seth Anderson: 0:00

Welcome to The Biz Dojo with Seth and JP season two, Episode 14. Really amazing. I'm gonna say special guests this week JP,

JP Gaston: 0:10

this interview took a little longer than usual, because we paused in this speechless silence after every time he spoke because it was just so incredible the horror stories he was telling.

Seth Anderson: 0:23

Yeah, just profound, real. And you know, what I'm taking away from this is so much love. Honestly, like for everything, everything

JP Gaston: 0:34

he's been through. And we'll get into it in this episode, so I'm not going to give it away. But this, this man has been through a lot in his life. A lot more than most people ever go through in their lives, and comes out the other side. Probably the most positive person I have ever seen. Or talked to you in my life.

Seth Anderson: 0:55

Yeah, I mean, I haven't met him in person. But I've had the privilege of having two discussions with him now. And I maybe we should introduce him. At some point. We're

JP Gaston: 1:04

good at that.

Seth Anderson: 1:05

We are we're getting really good at that. So this week in the dojo, we were joined by Marius, Bill Robinson. And Marius just has this amazing story. And honestly, we only I don't even know scratching the surface does.

JP Gaston: 1:20

We looked at this justice, in anticipation of maybe scratching a little bit of it.

Seth Anderson: 1:24

Yeah. So Marius, you know, he is an accomplished jazz musician, and activist. He lives in Sweden, but he grew up in the Congo in a missionary village,

JP Gaston: 1:34

I guess it would be called a Swedish missionary village. And he's seen some stuff, he has seen some stuff he's been through some war, he has seen some things, he has lost some things along the way.

Seth Anderson: 1:48

Yeah, so we, you know, we touch on it a little bit, just get a sense of his his background and where he came from. And, you know, I've been thinking a lot lately about how many things in the universe sort of have to connect to cross paths with a person. And you just think, you know, he gets into a story a little bit and can't remember the exact context but like, hiding behind a tree to get away from bullets, and like the forest of the Congo, and now to be some years removed from that, and sitting here having a conversation with you. And I it's just over

JP Gaston: 2:25

over the internet from Sweden, you know, it's,

Seth Anderson: 2:28

it's just, it's just crazy. So it really

JP Gaston: 2:31

puts into perspective, your own life, when you're talking to someone like that, too. Like, I know, people, you know, often joke, the whole firstworldproblems joke, but it feels real. When you're talking to someone like that, and you recognize just how little in life, you have to worry about compared to some other people.

Seth Anderson: 2:50

I do think it is tough to compare one person's trauma to another's Absolutely. But you know, the the perspective that you get, you know, just from listening to Marius, but I actually think the most inspiring part is sort of twofold. One, he is taken up the cause of being an activist and a representative of the forest people in the Congo. And largely based on his experience, I think we all go through experiences and become advocates for certain things. But you know, once he finished that experience, there's nothing to say that he couldn't have just left and never looked back and gone on with his life. But he consciously chose that he was going to represent those people and fight for those people and be a voice for those people through his music through some of his activism. And he's actually been recognized by the United Nations, which is just amazing that you know, of all the choices you have coming out of a situation like that, that that's the route that he chose.

JP Gaston: 3:55

Yeah, like you said, it'd be so easy to sit in Sweden and say, I'm safe now. I need to push on with my life. And I've gotten I've gotten past the hard part. And he's just strapped me and I'm going back into help. That's not a lot of people have that. And not a lot of people can do that and still come out with the gratitude that He has for life.

Seth Anderson: 4:18

Honestly, he just, that's not the word I probably want to use. But I can't think of another one. But he's just oozing in love, like everything, from his laugh to his demeanor, to his brilliant insights, I will say, all come from a place of love and understanding and empathy and growth. And it's maybe that's it just felt like such a special and it's

JP Gaston: 4:41

all genuine, like, even like we talked for a few minutes before you came on for us to do the recording. And instantly he was interested in the guitars that he could see in the background and we had some really good conversation about that. And we'd like we dove into, you know, four or five different little things and he was just like So genuine about it and so happy to be having a conversation with me. And it made me feel great

Seth Anderson: 5:05

when we got into that a little bit like the curiosity of a foster curiosity of a child. But the look that a child gives you. What did he coined that again?

JP Gaston: 5:16

Yeah, I don't know that coined it. But he did. He did call, he did say that a young child is an angel, just because they don't. They don't have any preconceived notions, they don't have any misconceptions of the universe. They haven't made any decisions or formed any biases about anything. And so it's just everything you get from them is so natural and real.

Seth Anderson: 5:36

Yeah, that was beautiful. And I think the warmth they felt and just getting to know Marius, and almost and just like his curiosity for things, like you said, He's just asking questions. He's just so open and you don't find that you just you just do not find that everyday just that genuine openness, curiosity and warmth than in another human being.

JP Gaston: 5:55

And if you're wondering, he can do that in nine different languages. Oh,

Seth Anderson: 6:01

keeping track at home,

JP Gaston: 6:02

yeah, he can. He can do that with a number of countries around our planet.

Seth Anderson: 6:08

So they, you know, the exciting thing for him is he has a soft jazz album that's coming out this August, I actually had a chance to listen to it. I wouldn't say that there's a lot of jazz on my playlist. But I like jazz. When I was in New York last year, we went to some live jazz and that really kind of sparked something, but I love the album. It's really great. And we're actually excited. We're going to be working with Marius on a bit of a project, little podcast to go with the album so you can give him a little bit more to his story. So this is this is a little taste for everybody. Yeah, a little teaser teaser if you will. So with that. I hope you guys enjoyed as much as we did. Let's get into it. with Mary Yes. And

JP Gaston: 6:50

I think Earl is gonna love this episode too because there's another guy who just loves life and and spreads love. So let's let's use URL in the steadies to take us there.

Unknown: 7:15

Welcome to The Biz Dojo, pure your hosts, Seth Anderson, and JP Gaston.

Seth Anderson: 7:24

Welcome to The Biz Dojo this week in the dojo we have Marius, Bill Robinson. And Marius has quite quite a story to come and tell us today. So we're super excited to have you in the dojo. Marius.

Marius Billgobenson: 7:36

Yeah, thank you to have me here and I will expand all my greetings to the audience that things would be in harmony would connect to each other. actually glad to do that. Thanks.

Seth Anderson: 7:49

That's beautiful. And just tell tell the folks at home a little bit more about you. You're You're an award winning anthropologist, a fiery advocate and something of an ethno music. musicologist. That is a that is a mouthful, and a curator of cultures. And you know, with your words, your music, your life, your telling world stories that need to be heard about marginalized people, environmental issues and human rights. So, I know I know a little bit about your story, I've had the opportunity to talk to you a little bit. So really, you know, excited to dive in here. Maybe we start out, you know, you were born in the Congo and music I know, was a big part of your childhood. So maybe maybe we can just start there in terms of what was it about music and growing? You know, growing up in the Congo that spoke to you so deeply?

Unknown: 8:39

That's a good question, actually. Yeah, I think recalling through these days in the Congo, my little village was called in gumina. And Illumina was a little Swedish former missionary station in the Congo. That time the memory that our heart can have from this time was invaded by my mind, eyes, and couldn't, couldn't be marked out from from music experience growth. My home was in a cloud village filled with love around people. Just It was about 500 kilometres from the capital Brazzaville in the Congo. And after growing up in the role, times of trying to to know who I am, through, I started having an unexplainable passion of music since vas years as a child, but still, it has took time for me actually, in order to explore learning how to turn the secret of homes and inspiration into songs. That was a very, very big The size about the Congo Basin was the environment where a grown up with insect bed songs wherever, in the forest, the rain forests in the Congo actually, which connect very with a polyphonic singing of forest people sometimes referred to as a big me. So that was an environment that I was growing up, quiet in a good time I get some monitors, someone to follow someone to lean on was there in the village was as I said, I refer to it was in a Swedish missionary church, whatever. So which means that there was music as well. So my father as well was in choir choir director there in the village and greatly the missionaries gave some lessons of guitars or whatever an accordion. Actually, I started with my father's I called him in order to introduce myself to the music.

Seth Anderson: 11:01

Have you ever played the accordion? JP?

JP Gaston: 11:05

I have not. It's It is one of those instruments that I've always thought if I could get my hands on one of those i i'd love to noodle around on it. But yeah, not one that I've played is

Seth Anderson: 11:14

it can teach you There you go.

Unknown: 11:17

Maybe some, but I'm not. I'm not. I was not so so. So expect for that expect for that, I will say, but but accordion was a very sad when I found that I liked him from my, my childhood with a choir, the gospel choir around and things like that. Yeah.

Seth Anderson: 11:37

So you mentioned your dad, and the influence that he had, you know, being the director of the choir and, and obviously, you know, dads have influences on their sons and in a lot of ways, one of the things you're particularly passionate about is your activism for marginalized people, environmental issues, things of that nature. Did you get that from your dad as well? Or were there other influences that that sparked those things within you

Unknown: 12:01

know, actually, the activism side came because of my way to see what what what was happening around. I was a little child in my home in my village, there was no no for us people. The way that I saw the pressure that I saw and the discrimination I saw my people to be against the pygmy people was really hard. I was really hard and I have been repeatedly under witnessing these people would have gone went to my grandfather village seeing the happy people happy man singing in the woodlands of my world they have impacted me brilliantly with brilliant souvenir from my childhood and experience down deep accordingly my thrive over the claim on the behalf of forest people sometimes referred to as a big me here always question in my motivation of which but whether my passion of my passion for music and the culture in another way contribute to invoicing one of the world's most well known yet misunderstanding greatly stereotype traditional tribal community so so that was my own feeling my father didn't didn't eat impacted me too far away from the accordion. But however, the music Route Route and at that I call it when I when I tried to engage myself from my childhood may be influenced by guitar lessons as well but the pygmy way to chant was so amazing. When these people was performing. All the village surrounding the little village of my grandfather grandfather was coming around to listen on the under the Muna moonlight, there was listening carefully this people singing amazing polyphonic, I didn't know that, that was called polyphonic singing. I was just enjoying the way with which in which they gave our money in the world of the environment, we were universe that we live in the way to balance their their sound, their way to adapt, the way to interpret the way to, to talk to, to jam with the environment, there was living, it was amazing. So that's why, for me when I see that discrimination, I fought that these people deserve something to be heard from in the world. And that's why my engagement today I mentioned that the way I saw that big meeting I mean pressure Iran, these people, for us people, it was completely difficult because these people are. So I mean are the image immediately user of a cultural entity, resources group environment is viewed as a pet. Sustainable sustainability is maintained through a farming ritual toward the forest and giving food to Shepler. I mean, shirtless and clove is the forest was an environment and reparent they are I said, hunter gatherers and their knowledge, mean their knowledge, the system is I mean, system talent and intellectual skills remains suppressed either the rhetoric of F nor Rochelle radio shift political imaginary, and customary law, politics of culture and the power of the powerless of their own selfishness, self esteem, the permanent subordination of the forests people by neighboring Bantu assisted until today, the expansion of super delicious urban expansion of politics and connected to centralized institution is characterised by ethnic bias cover. She's that that many, many people knows about the authorities around his corruption and things like that, in their own territories remain an essential issue. For these people. For us, people don't have a notion of a property appropriately came property notion of property came from us, they don't know how to say that this is a piece of my land, they don't know how to do something to solve that land. And the forest is the forest giving, it's like giving a sense of Tu Tu, Tu, Tu, Tu, Tu illustrate some anthropologists have written about that. But it's a given forest. So when you go to a forest you are you are lucky, you can get something to eat, because of your Armani with with Gods of a forest, there's gods that govern the forest, that were really really respect, I mean, as well as we can see that the national resources distribution for political mkango support expand to expand to accommodate to conflict against a big may people be able to lead them in a very very big, marginalization, PLO, global intellectual in relation also affect the self determination of forest people. The details of a context is not covered by the for legal instrumental application and policy decision making. So which is a very, very big suggestion that we are living all the time and always centuries, that we was not able to we are not able to dissolve to solve to get any approach of over resolution. data was not that's not the key way that really led me to engage myself to to become one activist.

Seth Anderson: 18:33

When we chatted a couple of weeks ago, Marius, you mentioned, I want to say that did you spend a year in the forest? Or you spent some time in the forest? Actually, after the years? Maybe? What happened? Like how did that come to be? And I'm particularly interested in what did you learn about yourself in that experience? Because I'm, I mean, they taught you know, there's that saying, you go into the woods, a boy come out a man like, you know, what, what, what, what was it like for you? And what did you learn about yourself?

Unknown: 19:07

That was very brutal time of my life, my little life. This is such an experience that I haven't got by engaging myself in becoming activated for forest people. There was a war that started in 93, in the Congo through 2000 years. So it was a very tough time. And I was out from the country I got from South Africa, I got medicines. And in my engagement I get the medicines weren't from the church organizations will send medicine to distribute to the big people. And when I reach to the Congo back home, I heard that or there was some problem around and war started to some in some region. Where I was directed to go, happy to fly from the Capitol Brazzaville to another location, by my way, from my way to a big name people, where I was stuck by the war. And I was new in that city, which was called duality. I had a hunk out there, how will I live two miles from my, to his place. And I have all the cartoons, all the blocks of medicines that I was about to go, but there was no way to go. We were stuck there, there was no transportation, because of a war. And we were stuck and just went through all the population went through the forest in order to do it themselves. The people in guns occupied all the city. And we stay in the forest, my jungle, where I saw so I mean, terrify Terry terrible experiences. By going through that way. Wednesday, we fought that we went for the forest in the forest for two days, or three days. But this is a an experience that took us more than three months around there before the hope has been over. And then we try to force our way for those who knows the Congo is border with Gabon. And we try to force ourselves to go through Gabon, the border was actually close from Gabon. So because the soldier was deeply wanted to us to access Gabon, so we came back to the area of war, in order to try to struggle to to go to reach our own villages. But it was as well as the experience becoming more and more and more and more difficult. And until, while will will reach we made our effort, after many, many troubles at work was the time that I was living. I mean, I was about to live the way to live your life. Because this was something gangs who attacked us that took everything to us that they beat me very, very brutally. And time was really difficult to recover yourself to stand again, and keep going. But thanks to God, because in that time, we didn't have something to eat. We didn't have something to even drink, we drank everywhere, when we see a little piece of art and in religion, water from things like that. But that was not easy to, to navigate. Because the war was so strong and all the population was living in under vigilant. And while I reached into my my parents village, were in in gumina, as I referred here, I was so so, so tired. I had accumulated malaria. I mean, in the memory, we the malaria was so so so strong that way, I was about to go. And then once we was there a little bit, some days within a piece way time to leave just came as well, the war under my village, I mean that we that aren't with my parents, we have to take every little things that we gathered, from the time that there was active. So we have to lost everything. And the soldier came and the brain, I mean, burn or the other village and we have to flee again with my parents in the village. And in the forest, I will say, and our time was tough. We learn a lot. Thanks. Because for us people exist there. For us, people as touched me a lot of things, even for my malaria, things that a little medicine that we've traditional way to put medicine together. They teach me they take care of me because I was about to go, I will say that. And luckily, we succeeded that was alive. until the time that I went back to town. It was over already eight months or something like that. And my daughter was born in that condition. It was more more difficult again. And yeah, when I left them I was supposed to be told and sometimes after we I went I flee to to South South Africa, but actually the time was really really tough. And the remaining things that I have with my little work that I was doing for forest people was my bag, we have a tape cassette or whatever things like that. This is the remaining thing that I got. It was a tough, a tough time. But stories to log long. And I cannot have a time to tell all the details actually, right now. But I have to say that this is the way to say thanks, thanks to people. Thanks to people around us. Thanks to people around around me, thanks to God, thanks to everyone, and visits for the things that give me more motivation in the hope, because I saw my life finished. But when I refer myself, each single day I stay, I stand to go to work, when I refer to that time, I have thanks God, and thanks people around. I've thanked the universe because these people exist around me. That's incredible.

JP Gaston: 26:16

It totally leaves you speechless. When you when you think about, you know, even some of the stuff we talked about on this show, we commonly talk about mindset and, and, you know, focusing yourself and being able to overcome challenges. And that was a I know, a shortened version. But it was still a laundry list of challenges that you overcame, how do you? How did you keep your mindset that you mentioned God and friends and family, but you're very clearly still quite positive? How do you hold your mindset,

Unknown: 26:50

I mean, I hold my mom's head, because by going through such kind of experience, you you, you feel that you can you can do something yourself, without others around. We leave because someone else took care of us, a mother, a father, on edge, someone say that no one is keen about himself. Because all the kings are born under the arms of people. And then they died as well through their heart, that the last the last day, the mother who take care of you when you born, the doctor will take care when you are sick. But people will give you food when you you are angry that people that come down you when you are really angry. The people that take care of because there's a bit of mosquitoes, whatever, the one that share food with you, the people that gave you the way to become who you are intellectually to school things that we do, we owe that from others. And in that way, you cannot stand by yourself say that, oh, I am. I am me. Because I have all these things my by myself, everyone, every single one person did learn something from other people. There's no one who will say that I'm kidding. I was born with every single things. No, there is no one. And in that condition, the only way to do in life experience is to share love. Because you become a consequence of love. By getting things from different people you don't know even you may be you might have been forget your teacher in this class or whatever. But these people did something for you to build your identity to build who you are to give ever. So in that way, you cannot really pay. They love that Viz all these people if through your journey. You cannot pay something man with money to please people. You cannot remember every single thing. There's people who did pray even for you that you didn't know that he was praying for me. You don't know the universe, even the bad that we'll be singing with to give you more smile again. The bad is important victory that you see because you wanted to get to hide yourself under victory. Giving you protection. That's important, too. In that way. Life is celebrating the experience of love that you gained from environment gods and other people. This is why we this way, this is where I IDQ my energy of being always positive when IV conduct. Wow,

JP Gaston: 30:14

wow. Wow,

Seth Anderson: 30:19

I don't think I'll ever look at a tree the same I don't, that's such a powerful visualization. I'm with you, you know, if I think about where I am in my life, and I know JP if you want to top up, but it's really the challenges that you go through, and they don't go away, right, they're always there's always another challenge around the corner. And at some point, you know, especially as an adult, you know, as a as a child, you don't necessarily, you know, you don't necessarily have a lot of influence. But you know, at some point, you get to choose how you respond to things. And I believe, you know, you can make it as black and white as you know, you can choose positivity and love, or you can choose negativity and hate, and it comes out and every decision you make through the day, like every little thing adds up. And it's so inspiring to hear your story. I mean, I can't say that I've been through anything quite like that. But if I think of the last couple years of my life, having a positive mindset and coming from a place where you give people the benefit of the doubt, and you're open, your heart is open, and it just, it just opens up so many things in your life that you wouldn't see otherwise, like you just see things differently, like seeing the tree for shelter, when maybe you would just see it as being in the way of blocking the sun or something.

Unknown: 31:38

Yeah. And actually it uses things that we learn in life and for for for for forest people has more to teach us until today. That's why I think because before we can take, even to take a leave from before I used to do something as a medicine, they have to ask permission. Before you you kill a big game like an elephant or whatever, you still need a permission. So there's no way to make things like commercialization, to stock fix. People they eat just for today. And then they slip, there is no fridge, there's no way to stop things. Tomorrow is another day. The only thing that indigenous people do here is to seek to be in a balance, to seek to be in harmony with God that governed the weed gods that govern the forest, gods that govern the water, gods that govern the universe and things like that. This is the only thing that these people seek all the time. And by doing that, they will be singing each single night. After After dinner, they will be singing a lot. And then sometime you forget you, you ask yourself, why do these people singer sings a lot? Why do they sing a lot? They see a lot because it is a way to perform harmony and balance with God. Well, no.

JP Gaston: 33:25

This is I think this is by far the most we've been left speechless. I have a little guy. He is just he's, what 20 months now. And I like I've even started to see the world differently through his eyes. Right? Like when he yesterday we were out in the backyard. And he could hear an airplane. And just just the sound made him so happy. And as a flew overhead. He just you know, he pointed it he said plain plain plain plain. And, and if there wasn't anything in particular about it, it's just that it was there. And he was excited about it. And it was like very similar to what you were saying about the tree like he when he looks at the tree, he doesn't just see the tree in our backyard. He gets really really excited because he can say the word and because he can walk over to it. And it's funny because he he waves at everything right now to says hello mostly to inanimate objects, not people, which is kind of funny. But we will go in the backyard and he'll look at the tree and he'll say hi tree. And it made me think it's weird that adults Generally, if I were to do that, if Seth was sitting on the deck with me, and I said hi tree, he would probably think I'm a little bit insane. and wonder why I'm looking at the tree and saying hello. But why can't look Why? Why can't we do that stuff? Why can't we appreciate those things around us? Why can't we have the mindset of what my little guy has and just love everything that's around us because it's all something for us to experience. Yes,

Unknown: 35:00

yes. And for the little how old you say it

JP Gaston: 35:05

is about 20 months, but coming up on two years old.

Unknown: 35:09

We cannot call him a child, we call him an angel. Because I have a same experience, actually, when I see a child, I mean Sweden actually talking about that. People talk all the time, about racism, about discrimination about all these things about wherever, wherever. One day, I just sat on the subway. I sat somewhere. And there was a lady with an angel, what I would call like, call them angels in that age, because they are innocent. They don't know what you're talking about. They don't know what this is Ross's work. What is what is what what is. When I sat down, the baby gave me What kind? What a big smile that I haven't experienced in my life. What it beats my heart. Oh, God, What is his name? Let's say that his name is whatever. So became more friendly. And even the mother was a little bit shy, actually, to be open with me that like, dun dun, the baby. Baby is innocent victim innocent. Love yourself. You're earned you were born. You was innocent. The society built you become what you are, who you are. It's fair society that gave his gave us the avid way of of seeing things. But when you come you are innocent. Every single phase is a glory. It's a it's a brace. It's a way to celebrate. You don't know that even under a war, someone's shooting. But a tree can save you. Because he was bi just behind that tree. You don't know. You don't know how we works, how the word is governed? We don't know. So that's why I say I used to say that we are only a product of love. If we leave if we survive. It's because of love. And that was one of my songs that I hadn't I hadn't published that song yet. I wish to say it is the same smile that you gave me as a baby because this is the smile by refer to that child I saw in the subway. It is because it's a song about neighboring. We see people invest rate we see people everywhere received the challenge. I mean, there's three charts, the children stretch children, we see many people. I mean, spending time in the street, there's no no housing, homeless, whatever. And my question is why these people are in that conditions. It is the same smile that you give to that people that you see in the street. That it is the same smile that you give me gave me as when I was a baby. when a baby is born, everyone wanted to all sweet. Oh, oh, what kind of love We gave a baby when we see an innocent person coming in our lives. We sometimes don't have even the time to leave him or her. We wanted to stay and see the smile and see even the little steps that some someone is taking our life is building have a development in life is coming together. But the smiles that we get him as a 20 months or 20 days is not the same smiled when we have 40 free years. Why? Why have a smile change in our lives? Why do our human being change the smile? The smile that I give to a baby is not the same smile that I give to someone who's was 3032 or whatever. Smile differs. The smile is different. My question is to know why do smile our smile change.

Seth Anderson: 39:47

Marius is reading a quote of yours. Where you say that I'm just a little fly trying to tease elephants and I use music to passionately influence Changes in the world. Is there? What does that what does that mean? When you hear that back? I mean, you know, you're taught, you're taught, you know, you've talked a lot about life and love. And when you think about yourself and and the influence, like, here, you're making the world a better place one, one interaction at a time, even this interaction we're having right now, like, I'm filled, I know JP, I can see it on his face, I'm filled with all these, like, positive emotions that we're going to take with us on the rest of our day. And, and you get the unique opportunity, you know, through your music and what you do through your activism to influence those feelings and people, what does, what does that mean to you, when you kind of maybe just stop and think about it for a second?

Unknown: 40:47

I say that I'm a little fly, because if I, I refer to my little village, it's even not in city in the Congo. It's a far away from capitals, from big towns, whatever, representing myself, as a little fly born there in a little village, in my long way, from the Congo to Sweden, and becoming someone who are interacting with you up to them. I represent myself that I'm not someone, I'm just learning to fly. Why do I say that I provoke the elephant. I was not trained as a professional artist. I mean, the professional musician or whatever. I didn't learn that in a school. I didn't learn any music at school. But I do music. When I see people like Reese Armstrong, after the war that we know, taking a trumpet, only a trumpet going around the world, preaching, believe, trumpet sound, to build an army of people again, it's amazing to see such kind of action in the world. It's a little action. But it is essential. And it's called a little fly that provoke elephant. I mean, I represent elephant by this big people who are everything to our studio be big things and around. Compared to myself, I'm not someone that way. There's an amazing musician, trend, a musician wherever, songwriter who are most most most beautiful, I mean, happy people, where will they are more professional, that myself. So I'm just teasing people, I'm trying try, I'm trying to do music in that way. It might, my only goal is to vehicle to transmit a message. That's why I compare myself as a little fly. And by being a little fly, how can I convince elephant that that's a big deal. An elephant can even know if I'm trying to touch his ear or coming on the Elephant Elephant cannot be even feel my presence there. So that's why i'm i'm saying i say that I'm a limb fly. And I'm trying to do things, but I'm not an expert for that. But I'm trying to do things. I have a goal. My goal is just to transmit something, a little message that I have, through my experience of life, rooted in love. Yeah.

Seth Anderson: 43:32

One of the things about our show is we get the opportunity to interact with a lot of amazing people. And very diverse backgrounds. Very, very, you know, comes from all over the world. We've had guests from all over the world, from from industry, every industry she can just about think about. And, you know, obviously we we aim to inspire people who are maybe going through a rough time or maybe don't know, what is the next step they want to take in their life. And, you know, I think your story is is beyond inspiring. But when you hear the word leadership, you know that word can have a lot of I don't have negative connotations, but you know, a lot of people associate that to government or authority and, and things like that. And I think the way JP and I see it is its leadership, it happens every day. Every day, the little things you do, the positive impact you make on the world, the people you help, and, you know, I'm just curious when you hear the word leadership, what's what what does that word make you feel and do you think you're a leader?

Unknown: 44:39

Yes, I think I can be a leader but whatever leadership you're doing, when you try to, to see something in our society that that doesn't work properly, not properly but, but something that doesn't work and you try to give it to get to get your Morrow in. In order to try to, to bring about change about that, if it is the hopefully it can be changed that can help more people. But when you provide such kind of way, when you take the step to lead people to take action on something, you must become one, wherever you did that in a false way, or in a good way, the only problem will challenge with leadership is that the first thing for me are fake is that you are to be ready to do that, to God for that, to provide a vision that motivate more averse people is a key word. If you don't have a vision, don't don't dare to try to do that. being strategic aware of an environment in which you want to operate in your lane leadership, or having a deep understanding of structures, and processes that make your business, a little pills is very important here. Because if we don't have all these things together, I mean, to tell what what we call the strategic leadership here, it's really important to go from such kind of things. And if we don't know, we have to ask people around, maybe I know this, we don't we do it this way. We do it that way. But it depends of your openness. If you are you have your heart open, people will help you as well. If you feel that you are the leader, you are only you, then you will do that to you there to try to thrive, you're by yourself. But as far as you have people around you, you still will be fine. And one thing I will say in the community of forest people, again, is the egalitarian, egalitarian systems. There is no chief in these communities. Every single finger of the heart has a role to play. Every one has something to say, wherever, proven hunting, wherever for the same way, everyone has a similar thing to say. There's no system that structures if you understand the structure here, the structure here is that we use this vertical structure. But these people use the horizontal structure. Vertical is which means that you are topped with Chief Data up there. That's the chief that boasts that a president whatever. But these people is a gala. terian egalitarian system means that everyone is equal as code field that we are, because even the Bible says no one will irritate the kingdom of God. Because he did well. No one will say that I didn't do something wrong in my life, everyone went through a scene. So whatever so called sins, or something wrong the wrong way, or only way you did something. But the only way that we go to a kingdom of God is through the way that he accept us all, as equally. So egalitarian system here is really important. The system of leadership is done. Sometime you don't not like today, this man will lead tomorrow, this man will lead that they have a way to perform things in that life. Way standard things are in the army as a balance of the winds that you get with brief the water that you get something to recharge your body, then the food that you have around you, the plant that you have for recycling the oxygen, the oxygen, that you will be briefing things like that everything on things is tripped in that way with a balance. So, for me, leadership is something that we should there, more and more. But the only problem with leadership is to know the principle, how it works. If we don't know how it works, I mean, don't don't come with your dictatorial way to do to become a good leadership or whatever. Everyone will will be going from you. So I think being diplomatic and being strategic as a way in which you are called so called strategic The leadership or diplomat, diplomatic leadership, things like that. This is things that I'm going through.

JP Gaston: 50:07

So you've been recognized by the UN for your humanitarian work. Well, what was that like? And what advice would you give to someone who's looking to make that positive difference in the world,

Unknown: 50:19

I mean, to someone who wanted to bring about something positive, it's to be sure, first, to be sure how to build consensus in divided groups. This is the only keyword that that killing our society today, because there is fragmentation, conspiration, whatever things like that, this is what what kills our world. If we just said, We open our hands and arms, or take everyone as as our self, there will not be a problem. The problem that make us in fiscal vision is deepening the division of people. So building consensus in divided groups is something really good. That one would be leadership by the record, being aware of conflict conflict doesn't mean that there is this conflict all the time because it through the conflict as well will conflict so don't don't we don't we cannot take conflict as something wrong. For an eventual leaders leader, conflict might be always the all the time there. But the way is to be aware of conflict and knowing your team as well. How to develop an organization as a war as well as the growth of individuals into achievements of direct report, things like that. So it is important to get to know these things if someone was wanting to build about the positive is Love is in the center hope in the center of these things. So that's why for me it's it's a way to celebrate love. Life is a celebrate love one day you will you are you will live this this world, you will you will be living. So you did your time. What did what did this take? What is this tank that you left that?

Seth Anderson: 52:33

That's some great advice, JP, I feel like I was building an infographic in my head of Marriott, Marriott says leadership principles. So let's think we got something there. So you know, you've got some exciting stuff going on, you've got a new album that you're going to be putting out later this year, this spirit love. Maybe you want to tell us a little bit about that. And we're super excited. You know, this is this is our first, you know, time working together during this interview. But I think we've got some exciting things in the hopper to build on your story and hopefully pair it with your album. But maybe just let the listeners know a little bit about your music and what you have coming up.

Unknown: 53:17

Thanks for talking portunity this is actually an album that I've been I've been working on it if we become be released eventually 27th of August. And the title is spirit love. It's an album. And for me the spirit love, we're talking about how to infer the love again, the spirit Love is the completeness of gratitude in my heart, and exploring love in different facets of life. So in this album, we will be going through love in different facets, from love of God, to love of a girlfriend to love of my wife to love my children, whatever, or friend Iran. So we'll be going through that. And the goal here is to inviting and motivating more people that I call love spreaders for change. So the spirit of love is an album accordingly. I choose to live in that way of love and happiness. Because, as I said, By seeing myself as myself as a project of love, by seeing myself as a bone in Berlin, the country of England, in the deep in the Congo coming through here went through intensive life stones and becoming a citizen of a word and somewhere and nowhere that June has been a very, very long way. So which means that in that that album, I will as well. Share my own experience my own life. And this is actually an invitation to people to come. So the Swedish missionaries paid English courses for me in the Congo, I didn't know that today I will be speaking English with your guys in the American cultural center, they paid me the courses, my father was not able to able to afford all this effort. But it was it was the way that someone's saw you. And, oh, I have to help this man. Maybe for in the future, he couldn't be something the English that he gave me as a package as a as a spirit of love. So that's why I say that no one can stand and say that I am enough. You get something from someone. But this is the way to celebrate. For me. It is a completeness of the love that I'm celebrating in this album.

Seth Anderson: 56:01

Everything that's beautiful. I love it. Where can people find out more about you your music and all that kind of stuff?

Unknown: 56:07

Yeah, I have a I have a so called home. I mean, literally on the website, virtually, which is the government's on.com build garments on. I didn't update all the information. We accordingly to have a new album coming yet. But there's many things many other information to protect after that. as well. Facebook page, which is not really really, I'm not, I'm not good for free things. And I need people to as well and three as well. And from my page, I have a Facebook street team, which is called the motherland. And we are about trying to reaching out to 200 people there and things like that. So it's my invitation to call everyone. If we can come and we can join together we can do things together. We can explore life as we can. There's Instagram as well, which is build Robinson and Twitter, which is to build comments on

Seth Anderson: 57:14

awesome well, you know like I like I alluded to Marius, we've we've got some some fun stuff that we're gonna work on here over the next few months for folks. And hopefully this gives people a sense of of your story. And we'd love to expand on that. And it's just been an absolute pleasure having you in the dojo today. And we're really looking forward to sharing this with with our audience and, and we'll see where this all goes.

Unknown: 57:37

It's my pleasure. Thanks. and expand all the love the spirit love to everyone was getting the occasion to listen to our speech here. I mean, thank you so much for you guys. And the work that you do even for people, the way the way that you lead people in order to know better life. Thanks a lot for inviting me and, and gathering together for this program. Thank you. Thanks to Marius, Bill Robinson, for joining us today. Now stay tuned for the podium. Brought to you by beyond the beaten path visit beyond the beaten path.ca and come join the conversation on Facebook, Instagram, or The Biz dojo.com

Seth Anderson: 58:26

while JP you know feels like the second week in a row. But I don't feel like we let people down with the spirited intro.

JP Gaston: 58:35

I agree. I could listen to that. I probably will. We talked not too long ago about how we usually just listen once, maybe twice to the pod. I listened a little bit more for the edits. But this is another episode right? I'm gonna listen three four times.

Seth Anderson: 58:52

Yeah, I actually listened to last week's episode three times already. And plus I've been reading the book so yeah, some of these these last couple have been pretty special. So with that this week for the beyond the beaten path podium. Just JP and I again, we're on a bit of a roll here the two of us so we're gonna Yeah, maybe one day we'll bring back one of our guests but for now

JP Gaston: 59:15

if you like it just the two of us then send us an angry face. And if you don't like it, send us an angry face. Either one. Send us angry faces.

Seth Anderson: 59:24

So you know tying into the show with Marius and you know him being you know, something of a curator of cultures are representative of many people around the world. And it is also Earth Day. This week.

JP Gaston: 59:39

Yeah, Thursday.

Seth Anderson: 59:40

Yeah. Yeah, very exciting. I love Earth.

JP Gaston: 59:44

It's it's a nice place to visit.

Seth Anderson: 59:50

Being in it being an Earthling. positive thing to be on Earth. So we're going to do top three things about earth but That was a little big and like sand, wind. So instead, we're What are we doing? JP, I think you got it.

JP Gaston: 1:00:09

Yeah, top top three sustainable choices that that we've made. And I'm sure that we've all made lots of sustainable choices over our lives. And so I think mine are going to end up being fairly recent. But yeah, top top three sustainable choices.

Seth Anderson: 1:00:23

That a little recency bias happening with you, JP,

JP Gaston: 1:00:25

it is some recency bias. I want to be fair, I don't remember some of the, you know, decisions I made as a seven year old.

Seth Anderson: 1:00:34

I know there was only a couple of years ago for you, but for me, it's it's locked. You don't have that top of mind or sustainability chases a seven year old back in what would that have been like? 1975?

JP Gaston: 1:00:47

Yeah, I saved them. But they're on a five and a quarter inch floppy somewhere. Which by the way, would not have been a sustainable choice to put things on this

Seth Anderson: 1:01:01

map. What happened? What happened to all of those? Where are those now?

JP Gaston: 1:01:06

I don't know we we talked the other day about blockbuster, closing down all their POS systems, but then shipping them all to this one blockbuster. So just sitting in the back wiki, their current POS system to explode so they have spare parts. That's at least where the blockbuster five and a quarter.

Seth Anderson: 1:01:28

Moving right along. I guess it's my turn to go first to think that we're doing Sure. All right,

JP Gaston: 1:01:33

let's do it.

Seth Anderson: 1:01:34

So coming in hot at number three. I have written down recycling.

JP Gaston: 1:01:42

Just just generically or do you have some story there?

Seth Anderson: 1:01:46

Um, you know, it's not so much a story like I do. Like I take it pretty seriously. Like, I think we've gotten it down to like two bags of garbage a week, which for family for like, I feel like that's pretty good. We can't compost as much as we would like out here like we couldn't Calgary we do have a carburetor. So I would like to figure out how to compost food. But we have like bears and stuff out here. So I don't know that. I'd like to do more in that space. But on the recycling friend just compost

JP Gaston: 1:02:14

in your neighbor's yard that you don't have. Jim, what's this compost you're doing in your yard?

Seth Anderson: 1:02:22

That's funny. I'm pretty sure the neighbor's name is Jim. But anyway, perfect. So actually, the one thing I do think of when I say that recycling, is I just remember how much we used to not recycle a few years back when we lived in another town. I won't call that town out there wasn't really a recycling program of any kind. So I look back at like how much recycle wolves we threw away and I feel bad. Anyway. Recycling, it's good for the earth. Number two is I mean, I don't know that I did this because of the earth but it has good sustainable benefits both for my body, I think and also the earth is I stopped eating beef. So

JP Gaston: 1:03:07

let me tough. That's Did you find it tough? Or was it you know, fairly easy? No,

Seth Anderson: 1:03:13

not really. The only time I've ever struggled with it. And it's not like when I see a burger or smell a you know a nice steak on the barbecue. No, that bothers me. It's the Costco hotdogs.

JP Gaston: 1:03:28

The ballpark hotdogs would kill you if there was still baseball right now. Like I'm with you on Costco hotdogs, ballpark real ballpark hotdogs when you're at a baseball game. Like there is nothing like sitting down with a mitt full of those and gigantic Yeah,

Seth Anderson: 1:03:46

so that is a I think a pretty good sustainable choice for the earth is Caitlyn and I don't eat any beef kids eat very little hotdogs mostly.

JP Gaston: 1:03:56

I'm pretty sure beef makes up a significant portion. A not insignificant portion of global warming impacts. And in part it's because of things like water consumption. And you know, the butchery practices and all of those things have such a I'm I feel like it was like 70% of freshwater consumption actually comes from meat production, which isn't just beef, but

Seth Anderson: 1:04:28

that is you know that it takes 28 gallons of water to grow one avocado.

JP Gaston: 1:04:36

Where did you learn this?

Seth Anderson: 1:04:39

Yeah.

JP Gaston: 1:04:42

Like, of all the places of all the sources for avocado knowledge, not sure that DMX is gonna get Sorry, you were saying

Seth Anderson: 1:05:07

I was. So definitely one thing I've learned via multiple netflix documentaries. And I don't know, if you have the stats on how it doesn't sound like you do. But sustainable eating is, I think going to be a very real thing we all need to think about in the years to come. So the last thing on my list I'm probably the most conscious about is I try not to buy bottled water, I try to limit plastic purchases in general. You know, I think we even have paper straws in my house, which I

JP Gaston: 1:05:36

that's gonna be hard today, either, like, everything's plastic is plastic.

Seth Anderson: 1:05:40

So I try to recycle whatever we do buy. But like, if something has not plastic packaging, I would I would you know, it was sitting next to something with plastic packaging, I would buy them not plastic thing.

JP Gaston: 1:05:52

Yeah, I think it's a lot of it's about convenience of choice, right? Like, the choice is always there, it's always just a question of what's convenient. And a lot of times people will pay a little bit extra to have the more sustainable choice, if given the same options in the same scenario. But when you're, you know, standing at Walmart, and they have the non sustainable choice in the sustainable choice is a you know, four to six week shipping window, because they try to ship it all on one train to limit their environmental impact their choice, but it makes it a little tougher.

Seth Anderson: 1:06:24

So I was gonna say it's not very often you actually have you know, sustainable choice A and unsustainable choice be sitting next to each other. There's often a reason. But, you know, I, you know, those are Anyway, those are a few of the things that I'm trying to do to make the planet a better place. How about you?

JP Gaston: 1:06:42

Ah, nothing. I'm really banking on that space.

Seth Anderson: 1:06:51

I listened to Ilan musk on the Joe Rogan show. And he figures that we'll have humans and Mars like the next decade or less. All right, all right.

JP Gaston: 1:07:01

My plants coming coming

Seth Anderson: 1:07:03

together. All coming up, JP.

JP Gaston: 1:07:07

Everything, everything's going up millions. Now I've made a few choices. Again, recency bias. So I've made a few choices more recently, that I think a lot of people could make, and especially in and around Calgary, where I know, a good chunk of our listenership is we've had a few booms. And in those booms, we have massive

Seth Anderson: 1:07:25

goes off long way. But

JP Gaston: 1:07:27

yeah, but there's been some, you know, massive housing builds that have happened during those booms. And typically what happens during those housing booms is they use subpar products, because they're trying to get the cheapest stuff as fast as they can. And what ends up happening is you end up with a home that has really crappy insulation, or windows that just leak air. And I feel like those are the unconscious killers of the earth, you just crank your heat up a little bit more. It's not a big deal, because your house is, you know, your your house is still just 24 degrees, fine. But when it's much more what's the

Seth Anderson: 1:08:07

we were we were occurring on? 18 up in here?

JP Gaston: 1:08:10

Well, we have hoodies. So

Seth Anderson: 1:08:16

people go to my house pre COVID times, I guess. And they don't understand that we live in this icebox. But

JP Gaston: 1:08:23

you open the door and let your penguin out. No, like we replaced our windows, all all of our windows, basically. And we found out that when our house was built, they actually used a bunch of windows that were not rated for our climate. And that is true for our entire community. It's so all of the houses in this area are not eco friendly.

Seth Anderson: 1:08:49

Are you a whistleblower? Are you an eco whistleblower right now?

JP Gaston: 1:08:53

Yes, yes, I am. Alright, I don't know who the builder was because it was so long ago, but whatever. And then, the other choice we made kind of at the same time was to go with the on demand hot water. Now I will say the downside of on demand hot water is that you don't have hot water as soon as you turn on your tap. And I think a lot of people hear the on demand and they think that that means instant hot water at your tap. You usually have to wait 15 to 20 seconds for it to get too hot. the plus side is that you don't have 50 gallons of water or however big your tank is just sitting there recycling heat over and over and over again when you're not using it. So especially for I mean, we're a family of three but for a long time. It was just the two of us, especially for a smaller family like that. Our bills were cut in half our water and our gas bill for the natural gas to heat it. were cut in half. Yeah,

Seth Anderson: 1:09:54

I might have to look into this.

JP Gaston: 1:09:55

Yeah, it's I love it. It's great. It's actually it's me beds a lot nicer because you don't run out of hot water. So you just sit there and run it until your bath is full of hot water and then you have a nice warm bath that's, you know, doesn't dissipate right away. And then the third choice lines up with our coffee. So make sure you get yourself some dojo dark or some masters medium blend. Sustainable Pogs. So in the case of The Biz Dojo coffee, I'm using a reusable pod that I can just put grounds in. And when I'm not drinking, beers, dojo coffee, because I didn't have it for a long time. It's fairly recent. In my life. I switched from getting just regular pods, actually to Maxwell House because Maxwell House uses compostable pods, and fully compostable pods. They're not the ones where you have to you know, spend an hour ripping off the lid and taking the bottom off and doing all those things. Which I find just deter people from they end up just throwing in the garbage anyways. So those are

Seth Anderson: 1:11:01

those are my three is sparked something back when I lived in Calgary, I would you know, when we talked about that sustainable versus non sustainable choice. I used to go to co op, if I just had to get a few things. I mean, a because it was the closest thing to my house, but be because they had those compostable bags. I love that they get to pay for them, but I don't know.

JP Gaston: 1:11:23

Yeah, 10 cents. Well, they're 10 cents right now. I think there were five cents before. Back in the day a year ago. Yeah.

Seth Anderson: 1:11:30

I little things that I like that.

JP Gaston: 1:11:34

And those little things add up especially like you think of a co op. As an example. How many bags do you figure they go through? In a couple a month? Oh, yeah. One or two? I mean, I probably used I use reusable bags, typically. And I probably used a dozen bags from there. And we're, what? Two thirds of the way through the month right now.

Seth Anderson: 1:11:55

All right. Well, there you have it. There you have the Seth and JP sustainable choices.

JP Gaston: 1:12:02

Tell us yours. Yeah. Yours to our to our comments section on Instagram or Facebook. Or

Seth Anderson: 1:12:07

if you need a water bottle, like a like a permanent loan or like with your name on it be on the beaten path?

JP Gaston: 1:12:16

Or what's our name or Hey,

Seth Anderson: 1:12:18

we're doing a couple of coffee mugs for our good friends correspondents in the field, Derek and Wyatt with our autographs on it that I got you to sign that thing.

JP Gaston: 1:12:28

I remember that time I had you signed that piece of paper with where it said x and I wouldn't show you the rest of it at that time. Turns out that's what it was.

Seth Anderson: 1:12:39

So check them out. You ought to be.ca thanks for joining us this week and we look forward to seeing you all next week. See ya.