The Wadeoutthere Fly Fishing Podcast
The Wadeoutthere Fly Fishing Podcast
WOT 153: Lessons from a Salt Water Metal Artist and Tarpon Fiend with Ashley Weber
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In this episode we WadeOutThere with Ashley Weber from Florida’s East Coast. Ashley grew up fishing in the Indian River Lagoon system along the “space coast” of Florida where she developed a deep connection with the ocean and salt water fish.
When Ashley attended art school she told her professors she wanted to paint fish and stay in Florida. She started transitioning from painting to metal art her senior year when she decided she wanted to create a metal tarpon for herself, after tarpon brought her to fly fishing. She quickly fell in love with the metal art medium, and it wasn’t long after school that her art became her full time work, and was paying for her many saltwater fly fishing adventures.
We discuss Ashley’s pursuit of metal art from beginner to accomplished artist, conservation efforts in the Indian River Lagoon System, and some of the lessons Ashley has learned following her dreams in art and saltwater fly fishing.
To learn about Ashley and her art visit:
Ashley Weber Art.com
Or follow her on Instagram at:
@ashleyweberart
You can inquire about purchasing art or commissioning a piece of metal art by emailing Ashley at:
ashleyweberart@gmail.com
If you want more information on some of the topics we discussed try reading these blog posts from Wadeoutthere:
READ: WADEOUTTHERE | A Fly Fishing Mentor
READ: WADEOUTTHERE | The Fish Are Always Biting - Mindset
For more fly fishing stories, lessons learned, and artwork check out my blog and online gallery at Wadeoutthere.com
Sign up for Jason's free email newsletter (WadeOutThere Wednesday) at WadeOutThere.com/Wednesday
In this episode, we wait out there with Ashley Weber from Florida's east coast. Ashley grew up fishing in the Indian River lagoon system along the space coast of Florida, where she developed a deep connection with the ocean and saltwater fish. When Ashley attended art school, she told her professors she wanted to paint fish and stay in Florida. She started transitioning from painting to metal art her senior year when she decided she wanted to create a metal tarpon for herself, after tarpon had brought her to fly fishing. She quickly fell in love with the metal art medium, and it wasn't long after school that her art became her full-time work and was paying for her many saltwater fly fishing adventures. We discuss Ashley's pursuit of metal art from beginner to accomplished artist, conservation efforts in the Indian River Lagoon system, and some of the lessons Ashley has learned following her dreams in art and saltwater fly fishing. Welcome to the Wade Out There Fly Fishing Podcast. I'm your host, Jason Shefchuk. At Wade Out There, we believe fly fishing is special, but not elite, and that anyone can become a great fly fisher if they are willing to go, learn, and teach. Join me as I talk with other fly fishermen and women about their unique journeys into fly fishing, the rivers they fish, and the tactics and philosophies they practice. For those who can never leave the river in their hearts, this podcast is dedicated to helping you make the memories that keep us all coming back to Wade Out There. Welcome, Ashley. Thanks for being on the Wade Out There podcast.
SPEAKER_04Hi, thank you so much for having me.
JasonYeah. I'm super pumped to talk to you today. I'm gonna be honest just right out the gate. Like the main reason is your art. I love your art, and we're gonna talk a lot about your art, but it's it's beautiful, it's creative, it's imaginative, and it's super fishy. And you're also a a great fly fisher as well. And so um I'm I'm pumped to talk to you about some of the saltwater stuff that it looks like I don't know, maybe has that inspired you a little bit in your art? Uh I mean, uh there those are the types of subjects that you do.
SPEAKER_05Absolutely. Um it's all been interwoven since the beginning. Um, you know, I I started art really young, but um I also was fishing on the water with my dad and my family growing up. So I when I, you know, started finding my path, I was it was definitely both together. It was never the one before the other. It was just always both.
JasonYeah. That's fa it's fascinating to me to see people that have kind of meshed these two passions into a career or a job or or something that you kind of have made up out of nothing. You know, you like you don't go to monster.com and say, metalworking artist, fly fishing travel person. You know, like it's not it's not you don't get that very often.
SPEAKER_05Yes, and um when I was, you know, when I was graduating, I went to art school. Um, and when I was graduating art school, I, you know, there was a lot of people that were taking more corporate jobs. I, you know, I was talking with a few, a few of my professors were very fishy, and um I worked really closely with them, and I just kept telling them, you know, I I don't really want to do any I was painting at that point, but I was saying, you know, I don't I don't really want to paint anything but fish, and I I don't ever want to leave Florida, so I don't think I can take I don't think I can take any of these jobs. And they were like, well, it's gonna be really scary at the beginning, but then you're you might find your path and then be able to really make it work for yourself, and thankfully I've been able to. So I'm grateful every day.
JasonYeah, that's awesome.
SPEAKER_05That worked out.
JasonWell, Florida's an awesome place. And so why fish? Why did it I mean, is it because you were so passionate about fly fishing? It was just natural, or is there something about working with fish, or it just kind of you found that niche and it was popular, or you liked it, or what was it that kind of said, yep, it's fish, that's what I want to do. Like when you tell your professors, like, how does it where does that come from?
SPEAKER_05So um I grew up along the Indian River Lagoon system here um in like the space coast of Florida, um, which is like the halfway up the east coast of Florida, if you're not familiar. And so I I grew up on the water. We had like a little 15-foot like pro-line skiff when I was growing up, and you know, we didn't really we didn't fly fish. Um I, you know, not very many people here fly fished when I was growing up. We, you know, we'd drift grass flats with shrimp and popping corks and catch redfish and black drum and you know, like little snappers and things, trout, um, sea trout, you know. I it wasn't really until about five, I guess it's been six or seven years now, um, that I picked up a fly rod. I, you know, I was oh I've always been saltwater flats fishing since I was young um and offshore here and there. But it was about you know, six or seven years ago I was going down to the keys a lot and starting to flats fish down there. And um it was, you know, I I started fly fishing because of tarpon. I just, you know, I was realizing, you know, I I was I went out with a few people, um, a few guides down in Big Pine a couple times and were was seeing these big tarpon on the flats. And um, and you know, I always loved sight fishing, and and then I was just realizing that there's like just much a much deeper connection when you're fly fishing, I feel like, for those fish um than using a s a spin rod. So that's that's the reason. Tarpon were the reason that I picked up a fly rod.
JasonTarpon. Okay, so we have tarpon to thank for the fly fishing experience. And when you're a kid, I mean you can fly fish around there now too, but you you said that really you're you're trying to get down to the keys to fly fish, or you're going on trips because I notice you're going I mean, you're catching trout in the mountains, you're going to Europe, you're going other places as well. Is is your home turf now? Like, it's kind of ironic that you know that's those were your home waters for so long, and then now you've got to be.
SPEAKER_05I grew up I grew up in a really fishy area, and I still fish here um some, and I I you know I need I need to make more. It's just this year I've just been um the last two years I've really just been completely consumed with with traveling um as much as I can. I've been the more you're enveloped into this fly fishing community, the more you realize how many cool things there are to do and how many cool places it can take you. So I've you know, just I keep saying yes to trips. And I actually, you know, I I I actually like I told my friend the other day on the phone, I was like, I'm I I'm looking at my fall schedule and I'm like, I really need to like cut back on a few of these. There's no way I can do all of these stuff. I like when people in the moment invite me somewhere, I'm like, let's do it, and then I start to write it down, and I'm like, I can't do three trips in one month, you know? So um I need to try to to try to narrow it down a little bit, actually. But um this time of the year, I you know, I'm four or five hours from the keys. And, you know, whenever I've got, you know, I've I've developed friendships with some people down there um over the years. Whenever they've got like last minute cancellations or like half days after, you know, the morning that they fish, um, you know, I'll jump down there to ch chase those tarpon like as as much as I can. Um I fish the ladies' tarpon fly um tournament at Isla Maraudha. Um so it's been that's a good goal for me um right now because it's like it makes me really practice and you know I'm always practicing my casting up here and getting down there as much as I can to get ready for that tournament as well.
JasonSo the goal is to go to the tournament or the goal is to win the tournament?
SPEAKER_05I am I'm a newbie in the tournament. You know, there's I'm I you know I'm still learning. You know, it's I'm only five or seven years into this sport, you know. Some of these ladies are fishing the tournament have been fishing it since before I was born.
JasonSo you just want to the goal is just to get to it. Just to go is that the get in it?
SPEAKER_05I want to put a few fish on the board.
JasonAll right. It's okay to want to win. I mean, it's okay to have a good rookie season.
SPEAKER_05I would love to win, but I've you know, I've I think I've got a while before I'm to that skill point. We'll we'll see. I mean, you could get lucky and get into a hatch or something, but um, you know, I'm not I'm not completely dialed. You know, there's there's error, you know, there's error that I try to improve on, but then there's error that comes with years of experience as well. I'm, you know, trying to cut back on my error every time I go down there, but I you know, we'll see.
JasonWas there a particular trip that stands out in the beginning that really got you that you could say, uh, if that was the trip that I really that was where fly fishing, I mean I know it's probably tarpon, but was there something that you're like, this is it?
SPEAKER_05Oh, absolutely. Yeah, there was there was definitely one significant time where it turned for me. I was going down um pretty frequently, and I was fishing for redfish and trout up here um with my fly rod for a year or so, and and I went down and I was flat fishing, and I was I really wanted to catch bone fish. So I had caught one bone fish and then I went out with another friend, I think one trip later, um Gabe Nyblad, he's out of Big Pine Key. So we were we were out, we were out um out back in the Gulf in Big Pine, and we were looking for bone fish, and then he was like, I think there's a few tarpon around, like still it was it was in August, so it was like after season, you know, after primetime season, but there's still fish around, and we're out back, and and I've got you know, I had a bone fish rot out, and he was like, All right, Ashley, I'm seeing a lot of fish. Like, we're he's like, You're probably not ready for this, but we're gonna we're we're gonna go for it anyways. And we, you know, he had me switch to an 11 weight, and you know, next thing you know, like I, you know, I've never casted at these fish before. And we've he's like, All right, I've got three 70-pound fish coming at us, you know, like perfect shot, you know, it's flat calm day, and I could see him perfectly, you know, and he was like, just you know, just try to get it 10 to 15 feet in front of them, you know.
JasonAnd they're coming straight at you.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, so because they're moving fast towards us, so he's like, Don't, don't overshoot, you know. So um, so I get it, I get it in there, and like I strip twice, and all three of them go after it. The one I hooked one, and he's like, I, you know, I've never hooked one, I've never cleared the line. I I don't even, I've never even had a lesson. He's like, All right, like, you know, you know, just keep stripping, keep stripping, don't lift your rod up, you know. So I I didn't, you know, I didn't do the trout set thing that a lot of people do. I kept my line down, I have my rod tipped down and um fish got hooked, you know, to I was trying to stay calm and we got my line cleared, and he's like, All right, you cleared the line, like he's it, you know, he's on the reel, you're good to go, you know. So we he's talking me through. I'm just trying to listen to everything he's telling me. And um, we ended up getting the fish all the way to the leader, which is which if you you said you have not been turbofishing, but that's that's a that's you know, that doesn't happen the first time. Um, so we ended up getting this fish all the way to the leader, and he's like, So you're ruined now.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_05So um, so that was, and then we ended up catching a bone fish that day, and then I had a permit follow. So that was like a killer first experience. So I almost almost slammed. Um, so after that, I was just completely mesmerized. I mean, I I I didn't care about anything else. Like that was that was all I cared about doing was getting down there as often as I could. You know, I sleep on people's couches. I, you know, had like a permanent like blanket pillow set in my car, just like ready to go at any moment that anybody could take me.
JasonSo this trip kind of cements Tarpon and the Florida Keys and that relationship with you. And I want to ask you more about that specifically and fishing down there and such, but I also am wondering, you know, is that trip or is there is there a kind of timeline to where your art takes a turn to where you now are working on pieces that are more tarpon or something like that?
SPEAKER_05When I first started m making metal work, um, the reason that I started, you know, I was I went to art school, um, I went to Ringland College of Art and Design over in Sarasota, and I was painting, you know, I'm I was an illustration major, so I was um I was already painting fish, um, and my I was working on my senior thesis project, and I had one elective class, and I really wanted to take this metalworking class, and the only reason I wanted to take it was because I wanted to make myself a metal tarpon. That was, you know, it was you don't get very many electives, and I just I saw it and I was like, I just want to make one for myself. So I I was obsessed with tarpon um a lot earlier than I even started fly fishing. So that was probably five years before that. So when I took this class, like that was the goal, and then it it ended up being a lot more than that, clearly. Ended up being my entire career. So I, you know, once I started fly fishing though, down in the keys for the tarpon, like I I started to really um what you know, when you're there's there's nothing wrong with spin fishing. I still spin fish quite a bit, you know. I love it. I just, you know, I love the I like just love getting tight, you know, and I love, you know, I love saltwater fishing. And sometimes there's certain situations that, you know, that really work better spin fishing. When you start fly fishing for those fish, it's just such a more intimate experience. You're you're like just so much more connected with them. When you're you start to really study their patterns, you start to really see them in the water, you see them eat, you see how you're feeding them, you know, you you're noticing what they're eating, their patterns, like the everything about them. So the you know, the main thing is their movement, you know, like you you're you're fighting these fish like sometimes so close to the boat, and you're you're watching them jump and you know, all the acrobatics so close to the boat. And I I feel like the movement, like when I started fly fishing for tarpon, that's when I did it definitely changed my artwork with them because before it was more static, and then I was like, these fish really need to be captured moving.
JasonYeah, that's some of the pieces that I really enjoy the most, is like all the water and splashing and and but I do I do like me a giant whale shark metal piece too. That thing was pretty awesome.
SPEAKER_05Thank you. I um, you know, I worked on that for so long. I I I just really I I rarely take time to make pieces that uh that aren't orders, you know, that aren't custom orders. And I I worked on that for two years. I spent so much time on it, and um, it hasn't sold yet. It's um it's I have a high higher price tag on it because it's you know it it took me two years.
JasonTwo years, yeah.
SPEAKER_05So um I've had a couple offers, but yeah, it's eight feet, so it's it's pretty it's large. I yeah, I had a couple offers to private homes, and I I really, I really want to see it go to a public space. Uh so I I would really love for it to go to a restaurant or a hotel or I mean an aquarium or you know, just any I I spent so I put so much love into that piece that I would I would really love for it. I if if the right family came along, yes, I don't know, but I would I I really would love to see it go to a private space. So I've been a little picky about where that that whale shark is going home to.
JasonWell, I just noticed that one as being somewhat unique because like you said, it was it's it's a very large piece and um it's beautiful. But uh like I was saying, like some of the other pieces you have are a lot of movement, a lot of the splashing and kind of the fighting of fish, and you you would say that that kind of when you started fighting the fish is when that kind of transitioned in your art a little bit?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I I think that over the last couple years, and I also I also didn't realize that it was in my skill set, you know. Like when I was developing my process at the beginning, I you know, like, like you said with the career path, there's not like a tutorial of how to do this, you know. Like when I was first starting out, you know, there wasn't like a, you know, you do this step by step, you know, there wasn't like a you do this, then you do this, then you do this. There was a lot of experimentation, you know. There was at first I wasn't sure how I was gonna get the you know the internal lines to show, you know, to show up. Like I I was in school and my I had heard of this one artist using this etching technique with these chemicals. So, you know, I I spent three weeks in school doing this like science experiment with these chemicals and um and wearing all these masks and trying to get this etching to happen, and then that didn't work, and then and then I was like, well, maybe I'll just cut the internal lines, but it took a lot of time practicing to be able to even cut that small, and then you know, with the coloring, you know, it was like, well, how do I get colors on here? Do I do I paint it? I I didn't really like that look, and then you know, we she's like, Well, I think you could heat it up and do that, use that to get the color, you know. And at first I was only getting blues, blues and silvers, and then I, after, you know, honing in and realizing like, okay, the propane torch isn't working, let's move to the oxygen acetylene torch, and that's gonna give me more, you know, more oomph in the in the torch, and then I can kind of work with the coloring a little more. So it was it's all been very, you know, I don't I didn't think I had it in my skill set at the beginning to be able to do the moving pieces, you know. I I you know I was just trying to figure out how to to get my process dialed for a couple years there, and then once I did that, I was like, okay, well maybe I can start expanding it.
JasonYeah, I I want to stick with this. I want to stick with your art and uh talk a little bit more about the process. And uh everything you just said is fascinating to me. Like the fact that you're you get the the metal, are you starting with just like a plain sheet of metal and then go from there and start cutting it?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, but it's just it's just rolled stainless steel. Um so I usually start with like four foot by eight foot pieces. The reason I picked that size is just because it's the biggest size that can fit in my enclosed trailer to bring it to my shop. And I mean, just everything about this process has been a learning experience. My teacher that I had in school was fantastic. I basically had, you know, there was only two of us in the class, and I had her, you know, a couple times a week for four hours. Um so I had her for all year, and so I had her one-on-one, and she's this awesome lady that has, you know, she does big stainless sculptures and like 20, 30, 40 feet tall. Um, some of her sculptures have gone, you know, um all over Europe. She she's just this badass older lady that um I just looked up to so much and she was so fun to work with, and she was, you know, she just taught me that like everything's gonna be a learning experience, you know. Like I wasn't everybody always thinks that I'm handy, just like um in general, and it's pretty funny because it's like I'm just weld stuff together and like build things. I've learned how to do things as I go. Um, so it's it's not like I was just handy out the get-go. Like I I've just learned how to do things to to be able to get effects that I want to do, you know. Like there's just little things that pop up all the time, you know, like when my plasma cutter's not working, I have to figure out where to go get that fixed, or my air compressor needed to be installed, and I was watching YouTube tutorials and figuring out how to install that um in my shop by myself, you know, or like just trying to, you know, just every day, just getting the sheet of steel up onto the table is a struggle for me. I've taken little videos of myself before because it's just so funny. Like every day I'm just trying to figure out how to get this piece of steel up onto the table by myself. Like I'll I'll get it propped up and I'll put my fan there and hold it there, and I get up on the table and I pull it up onto the table. There's like constant little, you know, learning experiences.
JasonWas it hard to let go of painting? Because like that was sounds like that was the main thing, and then yeah, it was collective, and then I don't know, not that maybe you've let go of it completely, but this is your new main medium, I would say, right?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I um so I was I was painting all throughout, you know, my illustration I was a ma illustration major. So I was mixed media, mostly um open acrylics, and I was struggling my senior year because or my junior year really. I started to struggle because I was, you know, we were getting ready for our senior thesis projects, and I was, you know, really decided that I wanted to freelance when I got out of school, which is scary.
JasonThat's that's what you're talking about earlier versus go into some of the things.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, versus a you know, more corporate job. And I um, you know, I was talking to some of my professors that freelance, and they were saying, you know, like the first couple years are gonna be scary, but then you're gonna get to a point if you keep at it where you're gonna it's you know, your your peers are gonna be start out at a much higher baseline salary than you will. He's like, but you could get to the point where you start to skyrocket and set your own you know prices and have your own clients and um and you'll be more flexible.
JasonSo Because you're making something that's unique, that's completely not replicable, like it's not a corporate, it's not a standard, it's a totally unique, awesome thing, right? It's not it's why it's more valuable, right?
SPEAKER_05Thank you. Yes, I mean it's a definitely a developed skill set. Like I said, there was no how-to. So I was painting and um I was starting to get together my senior thesis, and I was getting worried because I was spending like 40 hours to 50 hours on like these eight by ten paintings, and I was like, how am I gonna do this for as a career and make money? Like I'm never going to. I was getting worried, and I was expressing those concerns with my professors, and they were like, Well, you're either gonna have to find like a style that's really niche, or you're gonna have to get quicker, you know, like there's not really many options. Um, so I was trying to speed up my paintings and they were getting a little sloppy, and then I was getting worried, and then my when I started the metal work, I um I just like really, really fell in love with it right off the bat. You know, I was I love being hands-on and I liked like working at nighttime in the studio by myself with like the sparks and like it was a little scary at first, but then like once I got comfortable with the sparks and the flames, I f it was just like really, really fascinating and really um satisfying watching just watching the process is fun. So, you know, once I started getting comfortable with the machines and with the just the gear you have to wear to do it, you know. Like getting comfortable with I remember like the first couple times I was doing it, I had like, you know, the face mask and the goggles and the, you know, headphones and the gloves and the overalls, and you like just don't feel comfortable. Like just getting like comfortable with the gear and everything was very was a, you know, a little bit of a struggle. But then once I started, I loved it. And I had a really awesome professor that I was working with on my senior thesis project, and I I told him that I really loved it. And I was supposed to do six paintings for my my my senior project, and I ended up doing three, and then convincing him to let me do three metal pieces as well, even though it wasn't in the illustration background. So they were really flexible with me. Um I got a little bit of pushback, but I won. Um, so I, you know, I made three pieces, and then right when I graduated, I took a part-time job as an environmental surveyor, which was interesting. I'd basically be either on my hands and knees counting gopher tortoises on properties that we're gonna be built up on or counting manatees at the end of a canal somewhere. So I did that for about a month and a half, and I started working on, you know, I, you know, I had built up a little bit of an Instagram following, and um, I was posting the metalwork I was doing in a friend that I grew up with, um, her dad owns a construction company here locally, and then they work on stuff for NASA and SpaceX. And he brought me in and was like, hey, we've been seeing your metalworking you're doing, like right when I graduated, and um said, if you want to come work in my shop and learn from my guys, and I think it'd be a lot safer for you, and you don't have your materials yet, you know, your machines yet. Like, and so that was like the biggest grace, the biggest blessing I feel like was when he offered that. I mean, that was just the night one of the nicest things anybody's ever done for me. It was so nice to be able to work with professionals and say, you know, know the safety of things. You know, there's a couple scary instances where I lit something on fire and it scared scared me bad. And they had like a whole team of people there to be able to teach me what was going on.
JasonUm fire.
SPEAKER_05Who's this girl in the back corner lighting stuff on fire?
JasonAshley turns around like, actually, once you're comfortable with the sparks and the flames, it's not that bad. Like you should all just calm down.
SPEAKER_05I know. I still have I still have instances that are scary. So um when I but I once I started I started posting the the metal work and I mean I just right away I started getting orders. I you know, I just decided to to go all in about a month and a half in after graduating. I just I quit the environmental surveyor job and just went all in. And it has worked out for me so far. I'm seven years full time. So about about seven years um full time.
JasonCongratulations. That is thank you. That is like not uh that's a big deal. That's a really big deal.
SPEAKER_05Uh thank you. It's you know, it's I think the first like four or five years, it was just uphill, uphill, uphill, uphill, and then and it, you know, I was thankful, fortunate, and then the you know, when was it 20 2020 sometime in the middle of 2021, 2022, I had a little lull, you know, for the first time. You know, it was right when, you know, all the price, you know, inflation spiked.
SPEAKER_01I had two months where I didn't have a single order come in and it's well people are like maybe I don't want to buy a giant metal fish.
SPEAKER_05We don't know what's happening, right? So um that was that was really scary. That was the first time in you know, in six years of starting that it was it just came to a complete halt for two months and it scared me. I was like, I have all my eggs in one basket, you know, like I have no previous, I've never had a real job. I've you know, um, so that really scared me. And I, you know, I figured it out though, you know, like I have a mortgage, single girl with a mortgage, you know. So I've I I started, you know, I downloaded Uber Eats and I I drove Uber Eats for a couple weeks and I started marketing other things. I started making some things, putting them up for sale, and thankfully it turned around. Um, and it has it's been going up since then. So it's just those two months that were scary, but now I've now I've I know that I can do it. You know, I'm I'm a hard worker, so I feel like if if things happened, I'd always figure it out. But it it was definitely the first time and the only time that's happened, so it was it was a wake-up call for me for sure.
JasonYeah. Well, I mean, I don't wanna I'm I don't wanna throw shade on like corporate jobs. Like I think there's good value to be doing jobs and work and and people do what they like and stuff, but I want to call attention to the fact too that you could be in one of those jobs that one of your peers was in and that that 2021, 2020 that that time frame comes along, and you could be just as easily out of a job. You know what I mean? So what's riskier, you know, like is they're both there's no you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_05There's no There's plus and minuses to both, you know? Like you're yeah, you could be more you could have more security and more benefits and but how secure is that's my point.
JasonLike maybe it's not that secure. Um you have to be a little bit of a lunatic to take that big of a risk, but well, it's good that you I mean, I I think it's very cool too that you that at the age, you know, out of school that you saw that opportunity and you're like, I mean, really, what's the worst that can happen? Like, it doesn't work out, right?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I have really strong, great parents. I have a great family. My family, you know, my mom and dad are uh my mom and dad are gymnastics coaches. Um my mom was, you know, like a really high-level gymnast. They, my mom and dad have just worked really hard my whole life to do like to to pursue their like what they're passionate about and uh to to you know to run their own business. So I I was, you know, I grew up around, you know, running your own business. You know, they were always taking risks. You know, they were just very always so supportive of me. I mean, I couldn't have I just couldn't have asked for a more supportive family. I mean, my mom just my mom is my biggest fan. Like she she was just always just, you know, she just go for it, you know, like just do it. Like, you know, like it was always it was always about like chasing what you love to do instead of like chasing a more like m monetary job. Like it was always always like do what you want to do.
JasonWell, it sounds like you got good advice from your art teachers too, and telling you about it. Absolutely. It's not a it's not a binary decision. It's it you know, you can do this and this could happen, or you could do this and this could happen. I mean, it's not like you're you're not doomed if you try this other path, right? There's just other good things that can come from it. I also think it's cool that your art school I I mean that's the kind of thing that I would hope that an art school does. This art student and they're they have this other passion, and let's let's let them let's let them go. I mean, they gave you that opportunity with that class to kind of find your own thing.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, they do a great that school, I mean, they have a n 90% hiring rate once you graduate.
JasonThat's awesome.
SPEAKER_05So, you know, they they you know, they really do a good job of teaching you the business side of things as well, which is so important as an artist. You know, there's so many people that have raw talent, but then you have to know how to make money, you know. You have to figure out what shortcuts you can cut in certain places to be able to speed up your time so that you're actually, you know, like with my my metal work, as soon as I start doing it, I realized like, okay, this is gonna be a five-step process, and then I'm done with it. I can't I can't work on this for 40 hours.
JasonWell, that's something I was gonna ask you about also. So if you said you were talking about your paintings taking, you said 40 and 50 hours on these smaller paintings. Tiny paintings. Yeah, so I want to ask, why do you think that was? And why do you is that one of the things? I mean, was it because I'm an artist too, and I've work on paintings, and I get to a point where I'm like, dude, you need to wrap it up.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, you need to wrap it up. You need to wrap it up, yeah. Because you can over you can overwork and rework and rework a painting to death. There's no stopping. Like with the metal, I've found that you know, there's when you cut, like if you cut through something, you messed up, you have to start over, you know, like with the cutting process, and then once, and then you grind it, polish it, there's no erasing. There's no erasing, there's no backwards moving. You have to be accurate though the first time, and then if you make a mistake, you're kind of screwed. You just gotta start over. There's no, there's there's no like reworking it. So it's kind of forced me to. I think you can relate to this, like when you're painting, you you're just constantly making so many little decisions as you're going with what paint stroke and what color. And I think that when I was starting out, you know, like I wasn't as confident and I was not, you know, I couldn't make those decisions as quickly. Like you you you gotta develop that trust in yourself, you know, how to make these marks. And I think that once I started with the um the metal, it it kind of forced me to to make those decisions and then stick to them because there wasn't any going back. So I think that was a huge part getting, you know, getting quicker and developing a process.
JasonYeah, for sure. And like you said, trust yourself, and that's something that I struggle with sometimes. It's hard to get past that where it's like, okay, is this good or is this good enough? And does it have to how good does it have to be, especially for me in the beginning? So I'm still learning a lot about art, and I feel like reps are more important than perfection. Like I'd rather paint a hundred paintings that are good that it like get better a little bit. Like maybe they start off crappy and then they just get better and better and better, but that's more valuable to me than one awesome masterpiece that is just knocked it out of the park, but then you know, how much did I learn from that one piece? And I'm not saying I want to put out bad work, I'm just saying you gotta like for me, I feel like I need numbers of things to do, and I wonder if that's something that appeals to you about the metalwork.
SPEAKER_05A hundred I mean, absolutely. My teachers always said that when we were, you know, in school, like there's you're gonna you're gonna make a hundred crappy paintings before you you make a good one. You know, and when I was in school, there was just so we did so many drawings and paintings each every week. I mean, like I just like I I find like portfolios full of like 400 paintings sometimes still. Like there's just you know, like you you have to get the bad reps out, you know, and and learn. It's the only way you're gonna learn. So um absolutely. I mean, I that was my when I first went into that class, we had to propose a project and I made the tarpon and then we proposed a project, and I wanted to make this like giant chandelier and with all these fish. And my teacher was like, Okay, that's really ambitious. Um, let's just let's just have you like cut out like as many fish as you can, just so that you get familiar with the the the torch, you know? So um, so for like six months, sh I just she just had me cut out as many fish as I could. So I had I I cut out every fish that lives in the Gulf.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_05For the first six months, just um learning and so there yeah, and then none of them are good, you know? None of the none of those first ones were good. So yeah, that's that that is the same as what you were saying, which is getting the reps out of the way.
JasonYeah, well, they're definitely good now. So let's talk a little bit. Yeah, of course. All right, Ashley, I want to switch gears a little bit and go back to your home water of where you were fishing, and can you talk a little bit about why that fishery is special to you and some of the efforts you've been working on recently to kind of help uh preserve that area?
SPEAKER_05Absolutely. So um I grew up um along the Indian River Lagoon, and I mean we've just seen it, it's just a steady decline ever since, you know, basically ever since I've been fishing it. And it's been, you know, there's a lot of people here that are really fired up about it, really upset about it. You know, there's a lot of a lot of restoration quote unquote efforts going on right now, but nobody has been really, you know, I after I realized what was happening with our lagoon and started immersing myself more in the community here and you know, learning from different scientists and guides and people that are on the water every day here, you know, and just learning about what's going on, you know, I realized, you know, I you know trust the the words of the people that have been working on it for a long time that nobody is has been targeting the problem really at the source. So we have a lot of efforts going on that are putting oysters or um things into the river that that look good on, you know, they look good on paper, but our main problem right now is the nutrient loading and the runoff and the stormwater and the um the you know septic sewage and you know, a lot of the pollution that's entering the lagoon at the source. So myself and uh Captain Billy Rotney and uh Benny Blanco and my dear friend um Dr. Hannah Herrero with the University of Tennessee and a whole board of just dedicated, passionate guides, anglers, scientists locally. Um, we've started this Lagoon Waterman Alliance and we have been working for the last two years on dialing in our organization, getting all set up, and we are really going to start to to bring it out into the community this year. Um, we're gonna have our first big event um open to the public in July at Hells Bay Boatworks in Titusville. And we're gonna do a stakeholder workshop, you know, get some citizen science going and just kind of really explain to everybody what's what we've been working on and what's going on. But the the main goal of our organization is that we're going to start to try and target, you know, the pollution and the you know the nutrient loading at the source of the problem. So we we want to focus on directing funding towards towards these efforts to you know update wastewater treatment plants, to convert septic to sewage and to stop stop the pollution from entering the lagoon at all in the first place. You know, I think that the the restoration efforts that are going on right now, I think they'd be great down the line, but it just doesn't make sense to put all of our funding into things that are still going to be affected by the water quality if you haven't fixed the water the reason that we have the water quality that we do at the at the source. I always tell people, like, I, you know, I'm an artist, an angler. I I, you know, I'm not a scientist. I didn't know what was going on. I knew that there was a problem, but I knew people that knew more about it. And when when you see something wrong with your community and your water, I think that it's important to educate yourself, just take it upon yourself and start to talk to people and figure out what's going on and how you can help and what needs to be fixed. I, you know, I didn't I didn't know when I first started, I just knew that I cared and that I, you know, and and one thing that stuck with me, I kept hearing it with, you know, with the Captains for Clean Water team and people, you know, it's just that nobody knows the water as well as the people that are out there every day, and nobody cares about it as much, and nobody's gonna fight for it as hard as those people will. I think that what I'm trying to bring is passion um and trying to show that you you can you can get involved and you can figure it out, even if you don't come from a science background per se.
JasonYeah, I think that's great. Do you still fish there much? I think you said um Not as much.
SPEAKER_05I I I wish I got out more, and I'm trying to get out more this month and this summer. It's it's not that I don't love fishing hair, I do love fishing hair. I've just been I've just been saying yes to too many trips. So you can't you can't do it all.
JasonAre you fishing on those trips when you go when you go on those?
SPEAKER_05Absolutely. Absolutely. Um usually the trips are revolved around the fishing.
JasonYeah, yeah. What species of fish are in the lagoon that that you target typically?
SPEAKER_05So the mosquito lagoon is part of the Indian River Lagoon. You know, it's fame and most famous for redfish, but we have a v we have one of the most diverse ecosystems in the country. Um, so we have we're we're very fortunate. I mean, we have redfish, snook, tarpon, trout, black drum. So we have we have all we have so many species here. Um, and it's such a it's such a special place.
JasonWell, I think that's really cool that you've found something in your local community that's important that you care about from your childhood and you want to see restored and and doing well, and that you're doing something about it. So we'll link to that in the show notes for people, the Lagoon Watersman Alliance, and they can find out more about it.
SPEAKER_05Thank you so much.
JasonI want to talk to you more about Tarpon and the Keys. Why is that a special fishery for you and why do you make it such a effort to go down there? But how how often do you get down there? I mean, it's not a test, but I was just like, how often do you head down there?
SPEAKER_05So from about January until July, I start to I mean, just every every time that anybody has any kind of cancellations or days that I can get down there, I jump down at like just very spontaneously. Um I I mean I think I've gotten down there six or seven times since January. And then I'm gonna be down there three more times until mid-July.
SPEAKER_00Nice.
SPEAKER_05So it's you know, it's only it's a quick drive for me, and um I just love that fishery so much. It's it's so visual and it's my favorite. It's my favorite thing to do.
JasonEven more than art, what's what takes precedence?
SPEAKER_05Um, I think I think that the fishing inspires the art.
JasonFair enough. That's a good answer. Do you remember a time when you're fly fishing for Tarpon where you had a light bulb moment where you kind of like, oh, this makes sense. I I now, you know, something that really helped you progress in that arena.
SPEAKER_05I think I just think it's a constant learning experience, and that's why I love it. I mean, there's no mastery, you know, it's it's not I I just I like the challenge. There's always something more to learn. I'm I'm far from being being being great, you know. I'm I'm learning and I I just I want to learn everything that I can about those fish and about how to feed them. And I just I love any little bit of knowledge that I can pick up from all of the guides and um anglers that are so great. And it's you know, it's it's really just it's a collection of some of the best fishermen and guides, I think, in the world. It's such a challenging fishery. It's it's so hard. And it's you know, I I heard somebody say like we're not doing it because it's easy, we're doing it because it's hard, you know? And it's it's a it's a challenge, and um, and I'm just I'm grateful to be able to learn from them.
JasonWhat's been like some of the more valuable resources that you've leaned on while you're learning this information and trying to improve and progress and deal with this challenging fishery?
SPEAKER_05Just the the guides. The guides are um they spend, you know, they've dedicated their entire lives to figuring out those fish in that fishery, and they they work so hard. It's such a difficult environment to work in um every day this time of the year. And um it's you know, every every guide that I go out with, you can you learn from them and you you know you can talk to them about why they think certain fish are doing this and why they're doing other things, and um it's it's it's just the guide the guides I that makes a lot of sense.
JasonYeah, I think that for me especially the saltwater fly fishing is kind of a different like I feel like going after trout in the mountains, it's maybe a little bit more um I don't know. I I'm not saying that a guide isn't valuable in that case either, but I feel like if I go down to the salt, I'll be so out of sorts that that's almost like a prereq for me. At least to like learn to begin with, and then uh take it from there maybe a little bit more of my own. I I don't know if you've experienced any of that, but I think that it's definitely on the on the menu.
SPEAKER_05I just I think that a lot of people coming from um freshwater to salt, there's a reputation that I think that the saltwater guides are really hard and um really tough on people. And um there's you know, there's a lot of different guiding styles and techniques, but I think that part of the reason that they're hard on you is you know, I I I grew up with coaches as parents, so I like to think of myself as very coachable. I've you know, I can take critique well, and I, you know, you have to just always know that like they want it more than you do most of the time. And I think that when they're hard on you, it comes from a place of love. It comes from, you know, them wanting to them wanting you to do well. And I think that a lot of people get, you know, a little bit out of sorts when somebody's being hard on them, and it's it's it's an adjustment, I think, coming from fresh to s to salt, a big adjustment because it's everything's way quicker paced. A lot. Of times there's not a gentle way to put things when it has to be said in two seconds, um, and you have to make you know, so I think that it can frazzle a lot of people, and I think that the quicker you can learn to like find peace in the chaos and be able to like really connect with what somebody's saying to you and be able to not only process that information, but then to act on it very quickly. I think that that connection is where you'll find success, more success once you can learn to find that peace in the chaos.
JasonPeace in the chaos. I like it. If you could only fish down there two days of the year, when would you go and how would you fish it?
SPEAKER_05That's really tricky. Um I you know, everybody everybody loves the oceanside fish, and I do as well. But I I really do like to fish out back as well. More probably more. Um I I just I like it a little bit early season and a little bit after season just because it's not as many people out on the water, but that's not because it's better or worse. It's just because I I like when there's you know, when you're not fighting, you know, other boats to get to spots and things. It's it's nice when you're more about it's not just about the fish. It's you know, uh if I picked days, it would not just be about when it's gonna be red hot, it would be when I'm gonna, you know, find the most peace out there.
JasonThat's what I'm asking. I'm not asking for like when's the best time to go. I'm wondering when do you like to go and how do you like a fish?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I like like February and August a lot just because it's before and after the rush.
JasonYeah, no, that's fair. I mean, I I I I definitely relate to that. That's I mean, it's like I really enjoy fishing in the fall when it starts to get cold, uh, and late winter because it's just not as crowded on the river, you know. And uh those are some of my favorite times to go. But I do like a good summer day as well, uh for sure. But depends on where you go, that can get kind of crowded. Can you talk about any like just a handful of like some of the techniques that you've picked up while you've been going down for tarpon or some of the you've mentioned doing things quickly, are there other things that have really helped you kind of progress in that specific fly fishing environment?
SPEAKER_05Uh getting comfortable and being able to see fish, um, first of all, you know, being able to see those fish is is difficult um at the beginning, you know, and being able to not only just see them, but like just being able to I mean it's it sounds so basic when you say it out loud, but just getting it getting it exactly where it needs to be, you know, and accounting for the way that the the water's moving and the how fast they're moving and figuring out the angles. One of my my friends, it's a guy down there, Breck Rico, he he says you you need them to see it with both eyeballs, you know. Like you even if you get it there, you know, sometimes somebody will say, You got it there, and I'm like, Well, I didn't get it there. I know that I didn't get it there as well as it could have been present. Like maybe they saw it, but it could have been presented better.
SPEAKER_00Right. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05I think that once you start to hone in and dial in on all the really all the details, like the really, really specific details, it was it was definitely a big turning point for me when I started to, you know, you have a string of tarpon that are coming in. I I used to always just try to get it in front of the whole string, you know, and you're like, they all saw it. But that's very, very far from what's going on. Once you start to realize that you're like trying to feed a specific fish and being able to watch your fly and see what it's doing, and see, you know, like okay, I'm gonna focus on the second or like or I'm gonna focus on the fourth fish in the string. So once you start to account for, okay, I needed they're coming this fast from this direction, I need to go at this angle, and I need to focus on that one specific fish, and you need to focus on how the fly is swinging into it, swinging into it or away from it with the current, and how quickly to move it when they're coming, and how to keep it steady. You know, I I do a two-hand retrieve with rod under my arm. And once once you start to really figure out how to watch them, how to actually feed them, I think that that's when you start to to make more connections in your mind and start to try and figure it out.
JasonThat makes sense. That makes a lot of sense. Like you're being more specific, and you can't really do that unless you can see the fish. Like if you and see the fish and see your fly. Yeah, you've got to be able to visualize what needs to happen, and part of that equation is the fish.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, like when I get up on the bow, like you know, it's you know, you gotta make sure all I mean it's like I said, it's it sounds so basic. Like, so when you start saying a lot, but you have to really focus on all the details. Like you have to make sure there's no knots in your line that could, you know, get get stuck when you're clearing line out once you hook a fish. And and sometimes that in itself can be a feat because you know they're you're shot after shot after shot and you aren't getting your line stacked properly, or you're, you know, just all the little details are like I think what makes somebody great. It's when you when like when you go out with people that are really great, there's times when somebody will be like, well, that fish just wasn't eating, or that fish just wasn't doing, you know, didn't see the fly, or didn't, and I'm like, okay, but the people that are really great are gonna make that happen still.
JasonI think about that all the time.
SPEAKER_05There's always room for improvement. It's like when somebody says, like, oh, that fish just like wasn't eating or that fish wasn't happy, I'm like, okay, but somebody like Kat, you know, do you know Kat is down in the keys? She's she just was the first female to ever win a permit tournament. You know, it's people like that, that people that I've like looked up to, like people like Kat or Meredith McCord, or I'm like, okay, but they would have made it happen.
JasonYeah, I think about that quite a bit.
SPEAKER_05When somebody says, like, yeah, you know, they just were I'm like, uh, I think I could have done better.
JasonYeah, no, I think about that a lot. I think about like, especially if I have a bad day fishing, or you know, if I don't have, you know, I don't catch many fish or I'm missing hook sets or something, you can say like, oh, the fish weren't biting, but there's probably somebody that could have come out here on the river and caught some fish today. You know, like uh, and at least maybe that's true, maybe it's not, but I like to look at it that way, not because I like to beat myself up, but because I it makes me continue to problem solve. It makes me keep thinking, like, well, if I had tried this or if I had tried that, or you know, I didn't do this, or there's it's like almost a hopeful kind of thing. If you like you talk about some of these anglers that have these skill sets that have more time on the water and more experience, you know, that it's not because they've just been blessed by the tarping. Oh, no, they're putting in the time to catch more fish.
SPEAKER_05They're putting in the time. Like you said, the reps, like with the paintings, you know, it's it's days on the water. You can do everything you can to practice your cast and to get quicker and to get better and to get honed in the details, but I'm still only five, five, six, seven years into this. Like it's just days on the water, it's time.
JasonYeah, yeah. Alright, well, I want to start wrapping it up, Ashley, but I know that you go on trips a lot and um these fishing trips. Can you give me maybe one of your maybe favorite or maybe uh a trip that you went on that you learned kind of the most that you could take back to your fly fishing for tarpon kind of world that has transferred?
SPEAKER_05Absolutely. My my favorite trip that I've gone on so far is to Los Locos, um, out in Magdalena Bay, um in Baja. That's you know, stripe fishing uh fly fishing for striped marlin. You know, there's a whole bunch of other species out there. I mean, there's there's so many species and Mahi, roosterfish, tuna, you name it. Those boys that run that lodge, they have it so dialed and they are dear friends, and I I just there's nothing like that fishery. I mean, I I I'm going back this year. I plan to go back every year if I can. Um, I I mean that fishery is just it's so visual, it's so cool. It's there's so much life on that ocean. I mean, it's it's the most insane experience. I I don't I don't know if there's I mean, obviously, you know, everybody has say tails on their bucket list. I mean, I hope to get there one day. It's out of my price range right now, but I don't know if there's a more visual experience out there. I mean, these Marlin are just they're just crushing bait balls. I mean, they're they're free jumping out of the water, they're five feet from the boat. Like, it's just an insane, insane experience.
JasonDid you feel that any of that transferred back? Like you you pick up any uh tricks.
SPEAKER_05Absolutely, just fighting big fish. Um endurance. Um fighting big fish. I mean, it's you feed them differently um than you do with tarpon. Just you s you stick them differently, you know, like with the tarpon, you you're hooking a fish and then you're let you're getting you're coming tight and then you're letting them clear line out. And with the marlin, like you come tight and then you just have to hold them there for a while. Like they they head shake and they swim backwards. So, you know, the first couple shots I had at them and I when I hooked them, I was clearing my line out like tarp like you would for tarpon, and they were like, no, you've got to hold them there for a little bit until they stop head shaking, you know. So you feed them differently, um, or you hook them differently, but we're not really fishing for those bigger tarpon during that time of the year. So that's that's definitely a huge advantage being able to hook and fight 70 to 100 pound fish on off-season still.
JasonRight, keeps you in the game.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, just just learning how to fight a big fish in in the off-season is is great. I think that definitely translates back.
JasonYeah, it definitely sounds like a a cool fishery. And I like I said earlier, I'm just fascinated by saltwater. And my listeners know that I've said this many times, but uh I I gotta get out there and experience some of this stuff that you're talking about because uh A, it's fun, and B, I really think that it'll help it helps you progress as a fly fisher overall. Absolutely. Not just in saltwater, but everything else. So I appreciate you sharing those stories, though. That's super cool. Okay, Ashley, before I ask you my last question, how can people find out more about you, see more of your artwork, and um anything you have up on the horizon that you're excited about that you want to share?
SPEAKER_04Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me.
SPEAKER_05You can find me um on Instagram. My um my handle is Ashley WeberArt, and I have a a shop website, and then I also have my gallery website, and both are linked in my bio on the Instagram. And if you, you know, I I mostly work custom to order, so um I usually give people four to six week turnaround time depending on how large the piece. So if you're interested in um ordering a custom piece, then um you can reach out to me either on messages or on email, is probably most reliable. It's just ashleyweberart at gmail.com. And I think that's have some fun summer plans. I'm gonna be out in Baja fishing for roosterfish with Jeff Fezco, and then I'm gonna be in Alaska, and I think I'm also gonna do Ishglac and um be back out in May this I'll be back out in Magday this winter. So I've got I've got a lot of trips coming up on the horizon.
JasonSo well, you weren't lying earlier when you said that. I mean you're selling all this selling all this art to pay for your fly fishing. Uh so nothing wrong with that. I think it's really cool, and I think that is you know, I it's inspiring, I think, for me as an artist and just in general to see somebody who is followed their passion, has has had some success, and now is able to kind of live a life doing what she loves, you know, both professionally and personally. So like I said earlier, congratulations. I think it's really cool.
SPEAKER_05Thank you so much. I'm grateful every day. You know, I've put everything into it, so it's it's very rewarding work, like you said earlier.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
JasonLast question. Ready?
SPEAKER_05Yes.
JasonIf you could go back to when you first started fly fishing and give yourself two pieces of advice. One more tactical, one more philosophical. What would you tell yourself to help you progress as a fly fisher?
SPEAKER_05Um, more tactical, man. I would have gotten prescription sunglasses right at the very beginning. Um, I was working with sunglasses that didn't have my prescription in them for a lot of years, and um this year I, you know, I got my prescription glasses put into my costas, and it has changed my life. I can see fish from so much farther away. Um, I didn't think it would make that big of a difference, but it did. Um so getting the right pair of sunglasses is a huge, huge help tactically.
JasonOh, that's good.
SPEAKER_05And man, I don't know. I just I I feel like everything that I've done has led me to the point where I am. So it's I don't think I would change anything. I like love how I love how everything has progressed. And I I you know, there's definitely been mistakes made, but I probably wouldn't have learned from them. And um I'm so so happy. I couldn't be happier with where my life is at right now, so I just I don't know if I would I don't know if I'd go back and change anything. I think I'd let myself figure it out.
JasonNot like um, so that's a good answer. That's a good answer, but I don't mean like a uh I don't mean like a regret, not like something that you would change or a regret.
SPEAKER_05Oh, okay, okay, okay, yeah.
JasonPhilosophically, if you could go back and tell yourself like I don't know, one example would be like slow down or take the time to enjoy friends, or you know, like that type of a thing that maybe would have helped you progress as a flyfisher or helped you your experience, but certainly not regrets.
SPEAKER_05Hmm. That's a big one. Um I guess this might be more tactical again as well, but I think that something else that has clicked for me is you know, you you're sharing the bow with people, and I think that sometimes you're sharing the bow with people. And I think that when I first started, I was really just always focused on getting back up on the bow. And I think that watching whether they're better than you, worse than you, just watching the other person that's on the bow and that you're fishing with when you're not fishing, instead of just it's kind of like when they tell you to listen in conversation more than just wait until your turn to talk again. I think that at the beginning I was always just focused on getting back up on the bow and getting more bow time. And I think that this year it kind of started to click for me where I was like, I can learn a lot from the other person that's fishing with me, whether they're better or they're worse. You can see things that they're doing that you could either improve on or that you can say, like, oh, I think I do that, and that that's working out well for me, or you know, there's just different things you can observe when you're not on the bow.
JasonI think that's a really good answer, and I appreciate you sharing both those answers. And I certainly enjoyed talking with you today. Ashley, thank you so much for taking the time to be on the show. It's been a pleasure talking to you.
SPEAKER_05Thanks for having me.
JasonOh, yeah, I learned a ton, and uh, it's been fascinating talking to you about your art and your passion for tarpon and saltwater fly fishing, and uh I wish you all the best. I'm excited for you moving forward. Um I I can't wait to see what else you have coming down the pipe, and I'm excited for people to see your art. So thanks again for being on the show.
SPEAKER_04Absolutely, thank you so much for having me.
JasonThanks for listening to the Wade Out There Fly Fishing Podcast. You can learn more about some of the topics we discussed in today's episode show notes. For more fly fishing ideas, stories, and artwork, check out my blog and online gallery at waitouthair.com. If you want to make Wade Out There a part of your own fly fishing journey, please subscribe and share. Until next time, Wade Out There.