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Directed IRA Podcast
A show dedicated to educating and informing self-directed IRA and 401(k) investors on strategies, investments, legal structures, tax rules, and pitfalls. Hosted by tax lawyers Mat Sorensen and Mark Kohler who are also co-founders of Directed IRA & Directed Trust Company (https://directedira.com) where they have provided self-directed accounts for thousands of customers. They cover and discuss Roth IRAs, solo(k)s, prohibited transactions, real estate, start-ups, notes, PPMs, PE/VC Funds, UBIT/UDFI, IRA/LLCs (aka, checkbook IRAs), and share examples and stories from their thousands of clients who have self-directed their retirement for decades.
Directed IRA Podcast
Alternative Assets in Your 401(K)
Visit altassetsummit.com to learn how to invest in Alternative Assets.
(More links down below.)
In this episode of the Directed IRA Podcast, Mark Kohler and Mat Sorensen break down a groundbreaking new executive order from President Donald Trump that could reshape the future of 401(k) investing—by opening the door to alternative assets.
For decades, Wall Street and Washington have kept most retirement savers locked into a narrow menu of stocks, bonds, mutual funds, and ETFs. This executive order flips the script, setting a national policy that every American preparing for retirement should have the option to invest in alternatives—just like the wealthiest institutions do.
Mat and Mark explain what “alternative assets” really mean in this context, from real estate and crypto to private equity, commodities, and infrastructure investments. They walk through the specific investments cited in the order, why these options have been off-limits for most 401(k) participants, and how this policy could shift the $8 trillion 401(k) industry toward more choice and freedom for everyday investors.
They also unpack the political dynamics, regulatory hurdles, and 180-day timeline for the Department of Labor and SEC to develop new guidance—while emphasizing what you can do right now. If you have an IRA or old 401(k), you can already invest in alternatives today using a self-directed account, bypassing the “check-the-box” limitations of traditional plans.
Whether you’re a corporate employee stuck with cookie-cutter 401(k) options or a self-directed investor ready to take the reins, this episode will help you understand the stakes, the timeline, and the opportunities in this unprecedented policy shift.
Chapters:
00:08 - Trump's Executive Order on Alternative Assets
02:19 - Defining Alternative Assets
02:30 - Learn How to Invest in Alternative Assets
02:48 - List of Alternative Assets - From Trump
04:19 - How the Executive Order Could Impact You
05:20 - Timeline and Political Landscape
09:07 - The Power of Self-Directed Investing
12:02 - IRAs: Invest in Alternatives Today
Directed IRA Homepage: https://directedira.com/
Directed IRA Explore (Linktree): https://linktr.ee/SelfDirectedIRA
Book a Call: https://directedira.com/appointment/
Other:
Mat Sorensen: https://matsorensen.com & https://linktr.ee/MatSorensen
KKOS: https://kkoslawyers.com
Main Street Business https://mainstreetbusiness.com
Welcome everybody to another Directed IRA podcast. My name is Mark Kohler. I'm here with the amazing Matt Sorenson and we're excited about some news. This week, donald Trump signs I don't know Executive Order 932. I don't know. I mean, this guy's on fire and now this one's one of my faves, this one's one of my favorites yeah, so we've got an exciting Executive order dealing with the 401k and alternative assets. Matt Sorensen is my amazing partner. I'm going to unpack this for us. This is a kind of a tricky thing to understand. Matt, tell us what this executive order is all about.
Speaker 2:Well, it's all about you and your retirement account and having some investment options for crying out loud Like can I invest in something besides a stock bond and a mutual fund, maybe an ETF? God, can I have maybe real estate or a private fund or crypto? Could I do that in my retirement?
Speaker 1:No, because I'm in Wall Street, I lobby for Wall Street. No, you cannot.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 2:Well, this executive order is turning the tide, baby, and this is what I love. Let me just read the policy. Okay, trump in the executive order sets the policy and says this was I was like dang. I like this. It says it is the policy of the United States that every American preparing for retirement should have access to funds that include investments in alternative assets. Man, we should put that on our website, I know, and then we'll get into the detail on how we're going to get there and all of this. But this is a big shift.
Speaker 2:Traditionally, washington DC Wall Street have been aligned in that hey, in your retirement account, just buy that ETF, just buy that mutual fund. Trust us, don't do these alternative assets that all the wealthy people do with their money. That's not good enough for you. You need to just do this. That's not good for you. Just do this over here Buy this ETF and mutual fund. So it's a big shift. So I was excited about this and we'll dive into what this means for you today and in the future and what action you can take. But huge news.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think one thing we need to lead with, too, is what is an alternative asset? I think everybody out there you know what a 401k is. That's just a part of our culture. That's very, very well understood. And the executive order defines what alternative assets he's talking about oh, okay, well, I was going to define it, but we'll let Donald Trump and the executive order define it.
Speaker 2:Huzz. A little more weight, a little more weight to it. And we have our Alternative Asset Summit, by the way, coming up. Mark and I will both be speaking at October 16th and 17th, scottsdale, arizona. You can attend virtually. But come live for all the great networking, altassetsummitcom. But come live for all the great networking, altassetsummitcom, because we're going to get into all the spectrum of alternative assets that are out there. But here's the ones that Trump specifically mentioned in the executive order real estate. Are you surprised by that one?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean that's a good one. What's funny is part of it. Matt and I are a little bit like duh. The party's been going on for how long you just showed up. But no, that's nice, all right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we got real estate Okay. Now they call it digital assets. We just like to say, in the rest of the world, crypto, okay, digital assets. And then private funds, basically private equity, private debt, private credit, those types of funds. And so there's some other things like commodities, infrastructure development investments and then risk-sharing pools. That was the ones they specifically identified. They weren't saying just these, but they were outlining these as specific ones that should be on the roadmap, something that you should be able to buy in your 401k.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I just think that a lot of times we hear in the news you and me, all of us things that go on in these executive orders and it's esoteric, it's not anything that's going to impact me in my personal life. Okay, fine, wall Street's jockeying around with the White House again figuring out the lobbyists are working on this but this is actually one that really, I think the average American doesn't realize is going to impact them in a big way. Because when you go if you're a corporate employee, I'm sure many of this will resonate with you you go to that meeting in the lunchroom and they tell you about the 401k for the year and some financial advisor comes up in the front of the room. He brought a box of donuts and he's like well, you might be high risk oriented, you might be medium risk oriented, you might be low risk oriented. Well, on the form, everybody look at your table in front of you. There's a form there and you get to check the box of what you'd like to invest in, based on your risk level.
Speaker 1:Okay, anybody have any questions, and everybody's like you have no idea what to ask. And then you're like okay, bye, and that's your investment decision opportunity. Well, that's got to change, and that's what this is all about. Is now you being able to say hell, no, I want to invest in something different, I think I can get a better return over here, and you have a choice, and so that's what this is about. But, matt, it's not going to happen overnight. What do you think the timeline on this is going to be?
Speaker 2:yeah, I love how you frame that up because this is going to matter right and there's like eight trillion dollars in 401ks. So many americans it's where their most investable section of money is and they want to have options. They don't want to just be like check the box I guess I'm medium risk, I don't know, and what did you get invested into? You don't even know. Most Americans can't even tell you the name of the ETF or mutual fund they have and what is in that? We have hundreds of thousands of dollars, just average Americans, everyday people, invested in this. So we're going to have some options here.
Speaker 2:Now here's what the executive order is doing kind of timeframe to answer that question. Specifically, the administration has taken two angles on this. One is they're saying hey, department of Labor, who oversees 401k plans? Let's make it. Let's stop all these lawsuits against people for fiduciary risk, because the whole 401k industry, from the plan administrators and the record keepers and the advisors they're all terrified to say your 401k can invest in an alternative because they don't want to get sued if that alternative goes bad.
Speaker 2:And so old kind of guidance was scaring 401k administrators from the Biden administration I don't want to be political, but other administrations. They kind of like scared administrations or I should say 401k administrators and advisors from a recommending alternates Trump administration's like we're ripping that back Endowments the wealthiest, smartest people in the world are allocating to these assets and getting better returns. Why are we holding back everyone else and saying that's not for you, not good enough for you, because you could lose money? Well, you could also make more money too. There's a other side to this. So they're going to take some of the liability and litigation risks down, which is a big issue. There's cases out there all the time on this that the foreign industry is terrified about.
Speaker 1:So that with some guidance, some regulations and stuff on the Department of Labor side, yeah, I just think all of you listening here should also realize that this executive order is about the big 401k plans that are out there. For those of you or your spouse that's in a large 401k plan with your employer, this is going to be a slow roll, but the time will come where you or your spouse in this lunchroom with the donuts, are going to have more choices, and that's what this executive order is about. But the good news is is the message this sends to the world, is the message this sends to the world, to average Americans, that this is okay. And guess what? We've already been doing this for here at Directed IRA since that's why we started this company and it's been available for 20 or 30 years, this opportunity. So if you have an old 401k or if you have an IRA, you can do this right now.
Speaker 1:So this executive order is kind of like yeah, we're already doing that, but it also is sending a message to everybody out there to let them know it's okay. That may have been browbeated or, you know, demeaned by their stockbroker investment advisor into. You're thinking you're crazy, you know and you're not. So take the lid off people. This is a chance to get going on investing what you want to invest in and feel even more confident to do so.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's, I think, kind of our punchline here is there's actually more money in IRAs. You know there's $17 trillion in IRAs. There's more money in IRAs than 401ks, and you can buy an alternative asset real estate, crypto, private fund tomorrow, like we're doing this every 10 minutes, someone's buying an alternative asset in their IRA at Directed IRA. You know, we're opening up 500, 1,000 accounts a month sometimes here of new clients coming here to invest in alternative assets, and so the 401k industry, though, has been controlled by advisors and record keeper platforms and Wall Street, if we want to just put a label on it, and they've been like, yeah, we don't want to let people do that.
Speaker 2:The tide's shifting. People are like we want to have access to this stuff, stop gatekeeping us out of here, we want to have access to this, and that's kind of Trump. He's kind of a populist, right, he's out there being like let's let people do this for crying out loud, let's give them some options. They don't have to, but let's at least give them the option. And so now we're going to see the tide start shifting a little bit for those of you in the corporate 401k, of course, to have some of these options. Now, I mentioned the Department of Labor just a second ago. The SEC has been tasked to make it more accessible for people to invest in alternative assets, so they're supposed to come out with some recommendations and guidance as well on this. So now I will say this Trump tried to do this in his last administration, but he did it at the very end of his administration and he didn't get reelected.
Speaker 2:I think, he thought he was going to get reelected and it was going to be able to finish it Well right, when Biden came in, they put the brakes on this. So I think they're going to have enough time this time, doing it early, to get this rolling down the line, so, which will be good for people. Now you might be like that's not a good idea to invest in alternatives with your 401k, and don't do it. I'm just saying let's give people a choice. Let's let them have an option besides being stuck into the same thing. So I'm excited about this, but also just know and I think this is our punchline takeaway Maybe it's our little commercial interruption here is you can do this right now with your IRA. Yeah, you can do it and it's an awesome strategy. Mark and I have been doing it ourselves for years as investors, and then we've been helping clients across the country do this. 22,000 plus accounts, 3 billion in assets growing fast because people want options.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you know it's just as we talked about the timeline of the politics behind this. It is like the twilight zone. It is so weird because the Republicans historically have tried to protect Wall Street and their interests. Like Wall Street, they're a big lobby. We've got to protect the financial institutions, interest rates, all these things that are going on in Wall Street. We're not going to fiddle with it. We'll let Wall Street do what they want.
Speaker 1:That's typically been the Republicans and Democrats are like no, we want choices, we want freedom, we want to be able to do what we want with our money. But ironically, it's just weird is that as soon as Trump wants to do it, the Democrats cannot agree. There's nothing Trump can do, that's right. So they find themselves again in this weird spot, arguing against practicality and something that historically they've always wanted. And so it's just weird and I would encourage all of you to not get caught up in the politics of this.
Speaker 1:Control your own destiny. Look at your own economy, your own goals, your own bank accounts and retirement accounts and demand the best for yourself. I don't care if the Republicans deliver it on a silver platter or the Democrats deliver it on a silver platter. Take the best choices in front of you and make the most of it, and there's no need to get caught up in the rhetoric about it. So the good news, people you control your retirement. You can invest in alternative assets right now, today, in an IRA or a solo 401k, and pretty soon those choices are going to be laid out for you in a very pragmatic way for your company 401k. And ask about it, Demand it. They're not going to move quickly on this. Trust me. Wall Street is going to go kicking and screaming into this area, or they're going to figure out ways to make money on it before they allow for it.
Speaker 2:That's what they're doing. Let's be honest. That's what they're doing. They're starting to make private funds that have alternative assets in it. You can invest in it. It owns real estate, it owns digital assets, it owns crypto and it's private equity. You know it's another version of wall street. Let's be honest.
Speaker 1:Here's what I think everybody should be worried about. Okay, wall street's going to come and say, okay, oh, you want alternative assets. Here's an alternative asset fund. No, no, no, no. I want to invest directly in my own alternative asset. Oh, here's the message asset fund no, no, no, no. I want to invest directly in my own alternative asset. Oh, here's the message. You're going to hear people oh, that's too dangerous, you will screw it up. You can't. We're protecting you from yourself. You're not smart enough to invest in something directly. Just come to alternative asset fund. Oh, you want to do real estate? Well, we've got that fund for you. Don't try and do it yourself. You'll get hurt. And you're going to hear that message. Don't believe it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think you know this isn't meant to be investment advice, of course, but, like, you're going to see funds and we have a lot of people who invest in private funds with their IRA, you know, but they're investing in the funds that they've chosen. You know, with their IRA, but they're investing in the funds that they've chosen. This doesn't have to be the big fund on Wall Street that you can't actually talk to the person operating it. So you're definitely going to see more funds offered here and for some people, that's the right investment. I'll be honest, If the person at the 401k lunchroom could get their head around someone that's running a private fund doing real estate or maybe even crypto or private equity they don't have the not everyone's the entrepreneurial type that we run into a lot the market I do in our law firm at directed that are like let me go find a deal myself. So I think there's a big group of people that are still fine in that category of let me just invest in a private fund. I'm cool with that. I don't want to go find all these deals and Wall Street serve it up to me. Whatever, At least I have options and I have that ability to do that if I don't want to be the entrepreneurial person and go find the deal, but what we're doing, of course, every day is everything.
Speaker 2:We're like open architecture. You want to buy a stock, you want to buy an ETF, you want to invest in a private fund, you want to go find your own deal. You know what I mean. Like you can do all of that right now with a self-directed IRA, which is really the. I think the. I mean that's the creme de la creme. Like that's like the world is your oyster. Grow and maximize your retirement account the best way that works for you. Without it we're not putting you in a box of. You can do this or you can do that. Like we're. Like it's open architecture. Do what you want, world's your oyster, and I think that's where people can have the most success in a retirement account.
Speaker 1:Well, the message has been sent. Hopefully the message is received. Thank you to the Trump administration to try to give us more flexibility and freedom with our retirement accounts. Let's not, whatever you do, with a gift horse in the mouth I don't know. Just don't worry about the messenger. Just enjoy the message and I am excited for all of you. Thank you for listening to our show and as for the practical steps to take, we've got our podcast history here with some incredible steps in our FAQs, and our website will be there to help you start taking action right now. So get out there, folks, invest in what you know best, matt. Any final words?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I just say get over to directediracom that's where we have all the resources, Of course. Subscribe to the podcast. Please share this with your friends and family if you found it helpful and if you're like, I don't really understand this self-directing thing and you guys saying you can do this in an IRA already, guys, we have so much content on this on our YouTube channels, on this podcast, here at our website, directediracom. You can even book a call with our team, or come see us live at the Alt Asset Summit October 16th and 17th. We'd love to see you there, but thanks everyone for tuning in. We'll be back with another incredible episode of the Directed IRA podcast next week. Until then, stay calm, self-direct on and thank you everyone for listening.
Speaker 1:A quick disclaimer and reminder this presentation does not constitute an attorney or CPA client relationship and it is always in your best interest to consult competent legal and tax professionals when conducting your own personal transactions.
Speaker 2:We also want to make sure you know this is not investment advice or financial advice. We're just trying to give you education, ideas and strategies you can take to your professionals or conduct your own research on. We'll see you next time.