Scientology Outside of the Church Podcast
Did you know Scientology the Subject and The Church of Scientology are two completely different things? Find out why and what the difference is and how it can help you. Topics range from Independent Scientology, solving life's problems, past lives, secret government, metaphysical, Para-Scientology, UFOS/UAPS, ghost hunting, spirituality, and a lot more! Come check us out!
Scientology Outside of the Church Podcast
SE11EP27 - Independent Scientology - Body Conditions Holding You Back
What's truly holding you back from spiritual freedom? The answer might be simpler—and more profound—than you think. Your body, that remarkable organic machine you navigate life through, is often the primary resistor in your spiritual circuit.
In this illuminating discussion, we dive deep into the thetan-mind-body relationship and reveal why physical conditions create such significant barriers to spiritual progress. We explore how the body functions as the symptomatic display board for what's happening with your spirit and mind, showing objective results from subjective causes.
When you experience pain, your body is communicating that something's not right—but the real source often isn't physical at all. The fascinating truth is that most physical discomfort is amplified by 90-95% due to spiritual attention and agreement. That headache, back pain, or mysterious "zorch" pain might actually be a postulate you made long ago, playing out through your physical form.
We share powerful personal examples of how seemingly mysterious physical conditions—from persistent migraines triggered by office telephones to summer colds that conveniently appear to avoid unwanted activities—stemmed from mental considerations rather than physical causes. These stories demonstrate how auditing and assists can identify and resolve the actual sources of discomfort, often providing immediate relief.
The path forward requires more communication, not less. By increasing communication with your body, environment, and self, you can identify and change harmful agreements that manifest physically. Whether through auditing, assists, or conscious awareness, the technology exists to break free from these limitations.
Remember, you are "the alpha and the omega" of your own experience. By taking responsibility for your relationship with your body and addressing the spiritual roots of physical conditions, you can experience greater freedom in every aspect of your life. The way out truly is the way through—are you ready to push past your body's resistance and reclaim your spiritual power?
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Hi everybody and welcome back to another Scientology Outside of the Church podcast. It is Friday, September 5th Year of Our Lord, 2025. I'm here with Quentin and Arthur and we are going to do. This is sort of a second one, but not a second one, entitled why your Body Is Holding you Back, and we're going to go over the fate and mind body part, but just the body part, because the body is the resistor, if you will, in the equation of the thetan mind-body.
Speaker 1:If your body is having difficulties which can be psychosomatic or caused by a thetan and their mind-slash-reactive mind, the thetan being the analytical mind. For those who don't know what the analytical mind is, it is you, the thetan, the spirit, the being. And we're going to get into some of the topics that the body holds a person back from getting in session, holds them back from getting on in life and how to handle those things. This one was brought up by Quentin, so I'm going to give him the lead and I'll jump in on things from a technical aspect, like we do, and I'm sure Artie will have some things as well. Artie likes talking about the body.
Speaker 2:Yes, you know, I think I think this is such an important conversation because obviously, anybody bumping around here on planet Earth in any effective way of working with the body and so you know, listening to this, and even as independent Scientologists, you know whether you're in session or out of session, whether you're driving down the road, whether you're dealing with your family, whether you're trying to make love to your boo, anything that you're kind of doing you're working with a body and what is it that's going on there that could be holding you back?
Speaker 2:What is it that's keeping you in these stuck flows, in these pains, psychosomatic things that's turning on, which we're going to go into in a little bit. But like, what is it that is so messed up about this body situation and why is it so important that we handle it as independent Scientologists in order to go free as a being? So I think this is really important and I wanted us to kind of dive into it, namely, if we talk about psychosomatic illness, jonathan, why is that? Why was that, I'll say, when LRH was coining all this and pinning Dianetics and Scientology? Why was psychosomatic illness such a big focus of this technology?
Speaker 1:Well, dianetics handles the body, Scientology addresses the thetan, and then you have the cross between the two where at some point you have the composite case that first comes up on milestone one. The milestone one lectures, as they're dubbed now, currently, uh, which is the first foray into the composite case, and you have a cacophony, if you will, or copying, going on from the composite case over into the body that you are the thetan in charge of. And so when you go, I have a pain in my zorch which is a made-up term for a made-up body part so that it doesn't stimulate anybody coined by lrhRH. You have a pain in your zorge. Well, guess what, if you're standing in a mock auditorium as the thetan in charge and you are there in front of Wembley Stadium with 500,000 other parts of the composite case, they all say what did he say? Oh, we'll put our attention on that. And so you have this doubling down, or 500,000 doubling down on what's going on with the body, and so you have this agreement, and that causes a tremendous amount of problems for the being who resides.
Speaker 1:Somewhat, as LRH says, the body is a sliver in the thetan, the thetan isn't a sliver in the body. You have a lot of things that can go on when things get re-stimulated. So re-stimulation is the primary factor for body problems and the key in all of this is are you well rested, are you well fed, are you well slept, are you well mineral and vitamin fulfilled? Because all of these things can pull in mass, mental mass, on the body and anything that causes an issue in the body. Like LRH says and this is fundamental to this podcast he says the definition of a silly optimist is someone who thinks that they're going to feel perfectly fine every day in a meat body. That's a silly optimist His words, not mine. So you have to take that into consideration because the body is a carbon oxygen engine that requires food, sleep, water, temperature, food, sleep, uh, water, temperature, pressure and appropriate pressure. The body is a very, very sensitive 50 but 52 54 sensor array and it can only reside within a certain temperature band of about 20 25 degrees, depending on your size of body, uh, depending on the amount of oxygen in the air, depending on where you're at as far as your elevation. The higher the elevation, the thinner the air. If you live in LA and you're on the third floor of a building, well, you might not be able to breathe as well because of all of the contamination in the air. These are all factors that re-stimulate a body. But food, drink, sleep, water are primary factors there.
Speaker 1:Because when you don't have those things in, lrh calls these out-body rudiments, and these body rudiments are key for you to be able to be sessionable, and these body rudiments are key for you to be able to be sessionable. To you know, to the degree that you're sessionable is to the degree that you're able to function on any given day properly. That means going to work, spending time with your family, your boo, as Quentin said, whatever, because what happens is is that when you're not well-fed, slept, rested, vitaminized, mineralized, the body tends to get re-stimulated. And then the mass comes in.
Speaker 1:And on an e-meter, just as an example though you don't walk around your everyday world on an e-meter you'll see that the tone arm rises. And the tone arm is an index of the amount of resistance, the amount of mass that's present there, on the case, in this electrical energy field that is part of and surrounds the body. And this mass comes in because of, well, the body's not feeling great and and that restimulates the composite case and you put your attention on your Zorge. And then the next thing your tone arm is four or five, which is really really high, and should be between two and three. So you have to make sure that the body is well-fed, well-rested, doesn't get too much radiation, all that stuff. So it's very, very important. And then that that also comes into what's re-stimulated might need assists, which is something else we're going to talk about in this podcast.
Speaker 2:So sorry to steal it away from you, but that's sort of the big picture of the whole thing, yeah, and I think that that that really does kind of open up the door for a lot, of, a lot of ways that we look at it as independent Scientologists. Because for me, and this is how I kind of understood it when LRH was even breaking down and discovering more and more about Dianetics, it was because of body conditions, psychosomatic illnesses, things that were precipitated, and that these pains, things that were precipitated, and that these pains and stuff that were lingering, right and like, why does this keep lingering? Why do these pains keep turning on? Why does this stuff keep happening to me, in that I keep feeling this stuff that it could have been a pain that happened years ago, right Decades ago, and yet it still affects a person, right.
Speaker 2:And so when we know how to go in, how to spot, even with the somatic somatic being what the body right body right, right, even with the somatic, the pain that's going to turn on, we, we can spot exactly what caused that, really clear it out and deal with it. And in scientology we call it as is it right exact time, place, form and event to, as is something. It makes it vanish, and one can get relief right. One can get relief from these pains, pains and psychosomatic illnesses and somatics just by doing what is available to us as independent Scientologists. And so I think this is such an important conversation, because how many of us are walking around life with pains and zorches wherever, wherever, wherever zorches be zorching, and so, and so we walk around and we're dealing with this stuff.
Speaker 2:You know, I've been, I've been working out um more recently and I be feeling it and I'm like something. I don't like the way it, I don't like the way it feels. But you know, these things keep turning on and I want to deal with it because it is something that when you are in pain, it can be debilitating, and any of you who are listening to this know when you're in pain it can stop you. I don't care what you're talking about. What you're dealing with, okay, what you're trying to do. You're in the middle of trying to get it on with your boo. We talked about it a minute ago and then that pain in that leg kick you. That pain, that pain, that leg kick you that you can't even. Man, we're gonna have to stop yeah, and it's.
Speaker 1:It's important to note, and and this is a distinction that that should be made to our listeners, both new and old alike, is that any psychosomatic illness that is turning on in the body is a direct result of some engram, secondary or lock that is keyed in at that moment. Now, to define a key in and a key out in a dianetic sense, in a Scientology sense, something that is keyed in means that a mass is present and is restimulated and there's charge going on there, apparently, and when I say apparently, I mean in present time. That is the apparency, though there really is no time and space or distance. Therefore, it is there because the thetan, the composite case, both are putting it there and what the body does. When you're mocking up this mass in that body location, the body says, hey, something's not right. The body is a hindrance, but it's also a fantastic organic machine and it has this way of saying, hey, something's not right.
Speaker 1:That hey, something's not right is what we call pain. There's a ridge there, there's something going on, there's a mass that's being created and the body is saying this isn't right, this shouldn't be here, I should be running normally Because, if you think about it, if there wasn't any pain, you wouldn't live very long in a meat body, because the pain is danger, Will Robinson, danger. You need to do something about this. You have a thorn in your finger. If you didn't have that pain, it could get a lot worse and you wouldn't know about it.
Speaker 1:So the body says right, infections and all this stuff. So the body's saying, hey, you need to attend to this right now. You put your attention on it, the composite case goes hey, you need to attend to this right now. You put your attention on it, the composite case goes oh my God. And then all of a sudden it's 10 times worse. I'll give you an extreme example of this. As far as on a newer Dynetics for OTs, you can handle the composite case on OT5 through OT7, new OT7, new, on all that new 4, new 5, and 7. 6 is a course to audit 7, so we won't include that. You can handle all of that adverse attention that's being put there from the OT case and you can have a severe body problem with no pain. Have a severe body problem with no pain, because isn't that isn't?
Speaker 2:that interesting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and this is something severe body problem with no pain. Okay, you can have a severe body problem with no pain because the, the pain is being caused by the case, the, the OT case, almost exclusively, almost exclusively, which means that and Thayton gets what they put their attention on. That applies to the body as well. Without the OT case being there, you don't have this amplification of what the body is doing. The body. It's not nearly as bad at all by over 90%, 95%. It's not nearly as bad when the OT case is handled, but it all comes down to out-body rudiments and so you can key these things out.
Speaker 1:A key out is where the mass goes out. It's gone away from your space. That's what the grades do in Scientology and in Scientology auditing. Because you're making the mass go out, you're not erasing it, you're making the mass go out away from the body so that the body is like oh, that thorn, it isn't in my hand. Right now. I feel so much better, whether it's a problem, an ARC break, help over its withholds, whatever, any one of those things. Those are key outs.
Speaker 1:Now a key in when your body hurts okay, when you're tired, you're hungry, you're sleepy, you're malnourished, malvitaminized, mineralized, your body gets keyed in, okay. So what you're trying to do is you're trying, if you get the body with this body, rudiments and you're at least at zero, whereas if you're not, the body needs sleep, it needs food, it needs water, whatever, and drugs do the same thing. When you take drugs, they key you out. That's why and this is an interesting point to the OT case is that what you're doing is you're keying these masses out where the attention has been put onto it by you, in the composite case, and that's why people take drugs and they wow, this drug makes me feel better.
Speaker 1:That's because the mass keyed out, okay. When it keys back in and harder, the mass comes back in, more mass comes back in. That's been re-stimulated by the drugs. So that's a key in a key out. And erasure in Dianetics is well. You handled the engram, the incident of pain or unconsciousness or the loss or a reminder of a loss, or a pain and unconsciousness. It's gone.
Speaker 1:Now what you're doing with a cyst, which we mentioned earlier in the podcast? Whatever's going on with the body, there's an out communication. Whatever's going on with the body, there's an out communication. So what you're doing with an assist is you're keying the body out by doing the, for example, the touch assist Feel my finger, thank you, right. And then you go to the opposite side of the body Feel my finger, thank you. And this can go on for 20 minutes, half an hour, an hour, two hours.
Speaker 1:But what you're doing is you're getting the Thetan back in communication with the body because of these ridges, these opposing forces that are causing energy flows to get stopped, and that's where pain persists. It's gone out of the body part or location has gone out of communication, and so energy power builds up there and so the body is saying ouch, and so getting it back in, calm, keys that area out to where now the person feels better about whatever is going on. And it takes as long as it takes, but I mean the potential of a touch assist on its own is nothing short of miraculous. Go go exterior, leave the body. You know all kinds of stuff yeah, and we've done a podcast.
Speaker 2:we've done a podcast on the power of the healing assist in independent scientology. Um and I I spoke about stories where, just like real life stories where open wounds closed up right before my eyes, just doing a touch assist, how pains turned off, back, backs reshaped my best friend has scoliosis and just doing the nervous assist on my best friend with scoliosis brought considerable relief. So all of these things are definitely real remedies. Healing assists are definitely real remedies that can help a person to experience considerable relief, if not total erasure of a pain that could be going on. But ultimately and I think what Jonathan was talking about earlier is that when you're getting auditing, okay, and whether it be book one, dianetics Auditing and any of you guys who have not experienced Dianetics Auditing for me it was a game changer for a lot of psychosomatic things that was happening with me, which we'll go into in a few. But if you haven't gotten Dianetics auditing, definitely get that and we can help you with that. But if you're getting Scientology auditing and you're sitting down and you're on the cans and the and spotting things that you would not think have to do with these pains and you could just be sitting there and not even doing anything with your leg or your zorch Sorry, link with your zorch and all of a sudden your zorch starts zorching and it's like a somatic turns on and it's like why is that associated with something over here? And you, you just don't know. You just don't know. And and the reason why auditing works is because you, as a being, your natural state is freedom from these conditions. Right, your natural state as a being is vitality and creativity and power and the ability to be, do and have that which you desire, and so anything that's holding you back and the reason why we call this, you know why your body, these body conditions that are holding you back, is because you really want to be free. Right, you really want as a being, as a thetan, you really want to be free and you want to not be limited to these body conditions.
Speaker 2:I think one of the things that makes independent Scientology so, so miraculous, if you will, is that in the modern era, era E-R-A, in modern era, we have a technology that allows a person to be free. I think LRH says the body does not live without the spirit, and so if you're in a position where you can experience life that's not limited by the body. Okay, you can experience livingness that is not limited by the body's doingnesses, whatever the body doing. Wouldn't that be wonderful? Wouldn't it be wonderful to live an experienced life exterior? I'm trying to, I'm trying not to say too much, but would it be nice to live an experienced life exterior to just the body now I I want to involve arie in this a little bit to a degree that he of sensors and it has as its means to do that, communication and everything.
Speaker 1:Everything has to do with communication as a two-way flow. As a two-way flow and in Arthur doing his Pro TR's clay table and the chapter on communication in Dianetics 55, arthur, did you have any realizations about communication in the body and how these things work for you while you were doing those clay demos?
Speaker 3:That's a big question, but yes, because that's a lot of questions all rolled into one. Ultimately, I think the thing after doing the clay demos, after completing it, there was a sense of relief because it took a lot of effort and, what's interesting, since stopping doing the clay demos around that particular assignment, because I had to demonstrate all aspects of the communication cycle. But that was also including communication with your environment, not just verbal communication like we're doing now. You know you've got to have your Theta in, you've got to have ARC in, you've got to be able to be present where you are and who you're with, regardless of your environment. And that's tricky to do. But then when you break it down in such a way through clay demonstrations, it brings more logic into it. And so well, it brings more mass into it. Sorry, I'll more mass into it, sorry, I'll take that back. Not so much logic, but you get to see it now.
Speaker 3:The tricky part is now your body has to work with these changes and and it's like it's no different to working on muscle. You know, it takes time for that muscle to grow. It takes time for that muscle to heal. It takes time for that muscle to grow. It takes time for that muscle to heal. It takes time for that muscle to get used to its new environment, especially if you're doing, say, weight training or just any kind of new exercise, really.
Speaker 3:And so it's a similar effect where, now that I've completed that, I've had somatics turn on. You know I'm a bit fluey at the moment. I feel weaker in my body to some degree. There's a lot of things that have turned on, that are coming out of my body, because some somatics as well aren't just physical pains, it's also things coming out of you, especially if you've discovered you've, uh, discovered what the somatic is. In a sense, you know it still requires its healing, the time to heal, and it might come out through the lungs, through the mouth, through your nose, through your bum, through sleep, through many different ways. Um, sometimes you might even may not even get a, an effect. It's just, it's just done, um, and I think, in my case, moving forward after doing that, because now we're doing the trs as well and putting that into practice as well and that's bringing a whole different kind of mass into the theory.
Speaker 3:You know what I mean, right and so now we're actually doing the work right and and it's.
Speaker 1:It's interesting to see that there are side effects from just doing trs and that's why lrh says that you know the you can't do any other auditing while you're doing the TRs the communication drill because it is a form.
Speaker 3:I can say why.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's a form of auditing itself and it can be very restimulative. There's a couple of times when I've been watching you guys do the TRs and stuff like that, I could see that you were like you said you were feeling fluey and everything. And yesterday you were saying, well, like you said, you were feeling fluey and everything, and yesterday you were saying you know, maybe we shouldn't do TRS today.
Speaker 3:And I said we should do TRS. I didn't say that.
Speaker 1:I just said that in person. I just threw him under the bus. Thank you very much, because you know whatever.
Speaker 1:It's real, whatever turned it on will turn it off, and this is something that we're dealing with, where you're doing a communication drill with a body to another body, a phaeton and phaeton's connected to those bodies, and then the body shows these, these, uh, symptomatic sides of these things that we're sussing out in communication, and while you guys are doing the drill, you you're saying well, I, like quentin was saying you know, I talk with my head and my shoulders. And and, uh, your, your partner was saying you know, why do you? What was it he said? Why do you always talk with your head and your shoulders? Why do you move around so much?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I like this.
Speaker 2:When I do videos, I use my hand, I'm very expressive and stuff. Anybody, anybody who knows me knows and that was like a thing Like why? Why just sit there and communicate?
Speaker 3:This is from a which is harder to do than people think it is. It's a lot harder to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, and I think I think Jonathan is spot on when he says, like this is a, this is a real thing in that now. Now we're just talking about right now for those of you who are listening we're just talking about using communication, trs, right, which is basically TR stands for training routines. I don't know if we said that already, but TR stands for training routines how to get a person to communicate effectively, right, and just sitting there, communicating with another being in a certain way can turn on somatics in the body in a certain way can turn on somatics in the body. Now, think about this in every other area of your life. Think about it in school, going to school, and oh, I don't feel like going to school today, I'm not feeling well, and you try to get out of school and you turn on a service facsimile or something like that. Think about it in life and going to work and trying to be productive, and you're feeling a little bit defeated, didn't get enough rest because you're burning the midnight oil and now you're under the weather for a week and a half and you get taken out because something turns on. This affects everything and I want you to understand why this is so important and why I believe LRH started with looking at the body using the mind, what the mind is doing to the body with its genetics, and why psychosomatic illness is talked about so much throughout independent Scientology because people are always dealing with it and don't even know it half the time. They just think it's normal.
Speaker 2:I'm sitting here looking at this lecture. It's from the St Hill Special Briefing Course on a campaign to handle psychosomatic ills. That's the name of the lecture Campaign to handle psychosomatic ills. It comes from July 28,. The name of the lecture Campaign to Handle Psychosomatic Illness. It comes from July 28th, 1964. And he says here he said now he's talking about doctors, talking about medical doctors. He said now, his route then is a physical address to the situation from the beginning to the end. So when you speak of illness, how does this register to a medical doctor to whom you are speaking? You say illness and you say healing. You say these two words and the medical doctor at once, instantly and at once, translates it into physical address. That's his basis of understanding.
Speaker 2:Well, let's give the bloke some credit for this. Most of them those certainly that have had experience are not trying to hold the public front and trying to shake down the government for the whole bunch of shekels just to waste time. They know they are up against it when it hits the word psychosomatic. Now, psychosomatic is the most abused, misunderstood, turned upside down term that anybody ever aired to have anything to do with. Psychosomatic means what? The psyche, the psyche experiencing, or in pain, the psyche suffering. I think this is so good because LRH talks about when you see these psychosomatic ills turn on in your body. It really is the psyche suffering. The body is just a result, the body is just a symptom.
Speaker 1:That's right. This is interesting Symptomatic side, that's right.
Speaker 2:Yes, but when you're talking to your medical doctors and you know, give credit to that bloke but when you're talking about the medical doctors, his or her physical address is the only experience. They have to address it. So they'll give you medications, they'll give you a surgery, they'll give you a stint, they'll put something up in there to lock it in or whatever, whatever. But if it's something that keeps turning on, we don't know where it's coming. They call it asymptomatic or they call it what's it called? Autogenetic, autogenetic disease, right?
Speaker 1:Don't laugh at that and that comes back to and this is the larger arc of this podcast is we were talking about Artie and what he's experiencing on his Pro TRS course. As an example, artie said to me you know, I think I've got the flu, I'm feeling flu-y and I immediately thought, okay, what's he doing? Okay, he's doing TRs, all right, that's where this is coming from, because he's outside of Australia, I believe that Just saying.
Speaker 1:And that's why I'm talking about this to you, so that the listeners get this, and to validate what Quentin says is that, okay, this thing is going on while it's your zorch. This is what's happening. And if we got the body rudiments in and Arthur's getting enough sleep and he's well fed and he's well rested and he's in a decent environment, which which he's been wrestling with in Malaysia to try and find someplace that was a little bit more naturistic as opposed to concrete jungle, and you know that that may, may have a factor in it. But I mean, if you've got those body rudiments in and then you're doing something else, whether it's you're on course and you're on pro-TRs and you're doing TRs, or you're just going on in life and you've got something going on the point is is that if something is going on, the body is the symptomatic side of the thetan, as Quentin mentioned, the psyche, the I, the thetan in charge, and you can't ask for whom the bell tolls. The bell tolls for thee, because what's happening is you're seeing an objective result in the body from something that is part of the being, something that they're creating, that is is, is in the way. So if you have something going on and you're feeling fluey okay in in arthur's situation it was.
Speaker 1:It was almost a a perfect example of that that he's running through these communication drills and the even larger arc, his communication is being gotten in as to the difficulties that he's running into in his current time track in life and we're running these things out. What turned it on will turn it off, and the same thing applies to a PC that you're auditing in session. Is the way out, is the way through. We're running this process. Whatever turns on in the middle of this process is because that process is working and that's going to show up in the body.
Speaker 3:Go ahead, arthur and I think also from from my experience, um, running through this as well is there's an element of reality that's showing me where my communication has been out, and I think people tend to forget as well, like when you make such changes, you still have to live life and life will show you those changes. It's not like you get a feel-good moment and that's it. As you're going into life, these things start to present themselves, and because it's not, for me, it's not just the flu. It was like I had disruptions finding somewhere to stay. I had disruptions, just mistakes that cost me money, and all that kind of stuff, like a lot has occurred pretty much all at once.
Speaker 3:So not only physical, um somatics, but then also actual things happening in in my world as well, um, which is really interesting, and they're all communication based, and so now it's like okay, how do I make these things work, knowing what I know? And in order to get through that stuff as well, you've got to apply these things as well, because just doing the course isn't enough, so to speak. You still have to apply these things. You know, you hear it all the time If you apply the tech, if you apply the tech and I think it's at this point as well where a lot of people will blow um without, you know, trusting that if you see it through, it's gonna I'm gonna get the results I want.
Speaker 3:Like anything, you know, the moment you start a project, um, quite often if it gets a little tough, it might go back on the shelf for a while and it always always be incomplete. And these processes are the same. You still have to see them through to get the results, you know. So, even though right now I'd rather just stay at home and watch a movie, you know I'm here. I'm here presenting myself, pushing through. You know, after we do the podcast, we're going to be doing more trs. You know we're just going to keep persisting with this until it's done, because I know once it's done, my external world will also change, because now I've managed to break through those barriers in my internal world.
Speaker 3:Right and subjective versus objective, objective being the physical universe, subjective being in your universe or an internal or the agreed upon universe that you and quentin are doing these, these communication drills with that's right, and as much as I'd love to be victim, so to speak, and then just blame and then sit on my hands, it can't happen that way, but and I don't say that as a joke, because a lot of us do take that position initially- yeah yeah, that's right, and that's the danger zone as well, and and starting such, a, such a process, you've got to see it through.
Speaker 3:Um, you have to see it through. And and it's funny because there's a little part of me inside that says that you know my physical, somatic saying oh, forget this. Yeah, yeah, can I just sleep and eat and do nothing? Um. But then the other part of me is like no, you have to do this, you have to see this through. If you want things to change in your world, then you have to change them. It's really that simple.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the world is not going to change just because I'm uncomfortable. You know like today there was a storm with lightning everywhere. You know the the universe didn't say oh, maybe I'm making them a little uncomfortable, I'll just make it a little more gentle you know, it said no, here I am.
Speaker 3:You know lightning bolts, thunder strikes, winds, weather um, and I think that's a reality that we tend to dismiss as well. The true nature of things does not discriminate on how you're feeling about something at all. It really doesn't care um at all. It really doesn't care um, right.
Speaker 1:So anybody happening for wanting to do this, do it, yeah. Well, yeah, and they're my reasons. Right, you can. You can agree with it. You can disagree with it and say, oh well, the weather's crappy out today. I've got to drive half a half an hour to get to quentin to do these drills.
Speaker 3:Uh, we'll put it off till tomorrow and yeah, which means what the somatic's gonna sit around for longer, right, and if anything the somatic might win at that stage, you know I'll be existing with that somatic for a long, long time, as opposed to doing a little bit of uncomfortable hard work now, reducing that time by an incredible amount right so if not permanently yeah, and so you're disagreeing with the physical universe.
Speaker 1:Go ahead, quentin. I can see you want to say yeah, and isn't that?
Speaker 2:thank you for that, arthur, because isn't that a microcosm of the macrocosm that is independent Scientology, like a little bit of push through, persistence, fighting your own demons and fighting your own stuff in order to get through it, so that this never has to be an issue ever again?
Speaker 3:I think it's so good because because- only that I can spread my somatic to other people as well, boy oh boy just saying just saying yeah, you know, like Malaysia's a beautiful place right and while I'm going through this, I'm in a country, I'm in a different location on this. On that, you know, I might go back home. If I'm going through this, I'm in a country, I'm in a different location on this, I'm that you know. I might go back home if I don't resolve this somatic and be like don't go to malaysia, it's a, it's a, it's a rubbish country. I hated every minute of it, you know, and I'll spread my somatic through my words I love malaysia, but yeah, but I'm just saying as an example.
Speaker 3:Like as an example, like the way semantics work. They don't discriminate, because I don't know what the somatic actually is at this stage.
Speaker 2:All I know is.
Speaker 3:I'm getting a somatic from a process. And that somatic could be from the womb pre-womb. It could be anywhere on my time track. It could have been last week.
Speaker 2:And because anything equals anything equals anything, a equals A equals A. Because of that viewpoint it could make it so that you think that this was the problem, when it's not the problem. The problem. I had a PC that would get these killer migraines and I talked about this in the last podcast, but I think it bears repeating. I had a PC who would get these killer migraines and as we were in session, we were going over and over and over with Dianetics, we were going over and over and over what was going on with this person and their headaches and all that stuff like this or whatever.
Speaker 2:And he spotted for himself that it was the telephone back in his office. The telephone is on the receiver, the landline telephones, and it was the telephone because his sister called him at work. He picks up the telephone and says know, this is Mike or whatever his name was, and she screams in the phone mama's dead, mama's dead. And she screams in the phone this and it boom. It hit him like a ton of bricks. He started getting migraines and he had been in this job for many, many years 20, some odd years and like clockwork he's sitting at his desk at work and he would just start getting these migraines and he would like, oh my god, and he would have to call in to work and get off work and do all this stuff or whatever. And immediately, once he spotted that lock, immediately he got relief. He cracks up laughing, having right. He cracks up laughing, having a kefal about how stupid it was that his sister calls him and says mama's dead and doing all this stuff, and all because he was getting these migraines, all because of this telephone.
Speaker 2:And now he's back, he's at his job, has no problems, right, because it was something that you think it's.
Speaker 2:Oh, I need to drink more water, I need to exercise more, I need to do this, I need to do that, and that's all wonderful and well and good. And of course he was popping pain pills or whatever for the headaches. But, and of course he was popping, you know, pain pills or whatever for the headaches. But I'm saying all this to say is that what you think it is, it's probably not OK, and so, and because anything goes, anything goes or anything, you get into a situation where this means this, means this means this, and it probably is not the issue at all. And I think that this is so important as independent Scientologists being able to really go in and help you spot what's hurting you, help you spot what's ailing you and where it really comes from and giving you assists, giving you auditing and giving you things that you really need. And in this case, even TRs are doing the communication drills so that you can start to live life better without all the stuff impinging upon you as a being because the body wants to feel a certain way.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's funny how you said that as well, because that kind of goes back to what I was saying before about becoming like a victim. Because that kind of goes back to what I was saying before about becoming like a victim because you'll blame. Your poor logical mind is trying to make sense of why you're feeling the way you're feeling and it just simply cannot. I mean, with guidance it can, but when you're trying to work things out, quite often you never find the actual onion, so to speak. And it's like, even from my experience here like I've had so many multiple experiences and I could be take the attitude of it was because of this person, it was because of that situation, it was because it was because it was because. But there's only one factor missing in all of those and that factor is me. I was in all those situations. They weren't in the situations. I was in those situations. Right, you see what I'm saying?
Speaker 3:yeah, there's only one common factor, and and that was me right and and and the.
Speaker 1:the point is is is the body, is the subject or, excuse me, the objective? The body is the objective object that you have. And when you start seeing things on the body where, okay, I'm feeling fluish, I'm doing communication drills and things are turning on, you either agree with it or you disagree with it. And you go okay, well, I'm feeling fluid and you go okay, well, I'm feeling fluid, why, why?
Speaker 2:are you like I can?
Speaker 1:hear my cat calling me as you're saying this because if you agree with it and you go, oh well, I'm a victim. I agree with the fact that I'm a victim. I agree with the fact that I'm feeling fluish and I'm doing communication drugs, okay, then you're done for. Because it's complexity and confronting, right, what am I not?
Speaker 3:100%. If I leave this open, I've achieved nothing. Right Like zero.
Speaker 1:That's right. The way out is the way through, and that's that's. That's how I was trained at flag when I did the communications, the protears course, the communications course is you know, the way out is, the way through is is you're you're directing the person's attention towards something they don't want to look at for what it is, and we have to keep going. We have to keep going until that is keyed out or it is erased, to the point to where now you have this ability that you didn't have before, but the body is showing the symptomatic side of it. You're turning on flu, fluish symptoms. You know mama is dead, oh my God. Grief, shame, blame, blame, regret, apathy all this stuff is is the symptomatic side that is showing up in the body, because your agreement is as such and I hope this.
Speaker 3:And now you're shaking that cage. Yeah, I always say it like um, like. It's almost like another character that lives inside of you, and now it's been exposed and so it will do whatever in its power to prevent you from removing it.
Speaker 3:It'll lie to you, it'll hurt you, it'll cheat you or to do so many things like a whole other personality that's existed completely fine, you know, for so long it's, it's put you into so many situations. Now, all of a sudden, you're starting to reveal it and it's got its own survival mechanism as well, and its survival mechanism will be uh, let's make him sick. Let's make him sick. Let's make him sick. That'll stop him from going.
Speaker 1:Let's put some obstacles in his way, that will stop him from getting there right, and so that's the thing is that if you agree with it and you go, oh well, it's the flu. Where are you? Yeah, where are you? You're, you're? You're two steps forward and three steps back, whereas, well, okay, what was it that I was doing? Oh, okay, I was doing these communication drills and this stuff turned on. In other words, where were you last doing? Good, okay, well, I've now started to confront something that I didn't want to confront and the body said boom smack. Now there's this. It's misdirection. Yeah, don't, don't fall for it. Right, it's a trick. It is a trick. Yeah, don't go into agreement with it. That, okay, so you're looking at this um confirmation bias in a reverse form. Oh, I'm sick. I need to stop. That's the last thing you need to do.
Speaker 3:You need to push on because, it's interesting um as well, like just completely a little off as far as, like, somatic talk goes, like it's quite a thing in, uh, spirituality now as well, and what I find really interesting about that is you know this through scientology, um, through the work of lrh, independent scientology, um, this work has been observed. Techniques have been designed to resolve these things, um, like there's every no stone. No stone has been unturned in understanding somatic behavior through independent scientology, and there's a lot of modalities out there that claim to do these kinds of things as well. Um, but this technology has been around for a long time.
Speaker 3:What a chicken is that, yeah, and because there's so many, so many people will take a piece of it right and just not recognize the depth that Scientology actually went through to resolve these conditions in people and still does, right, you know, and nothing's changed.
Speaker 3:You know, it's the same, it's the same, it's the same technique 70 years, yeah, um, and it's only now that people are starting to be kept, become aware of somatic behaviors, and even just using the word somatics, um is, is actually becoming a thing when you know you go back so long ago.
Speaker 2:Well, it was already there right already there and well, yeah, it's really interesting a part of what I wanted to even talk about here was also like that is any of this and, jonathan, you might be able to answer this question too but is any of this that we're talking about right now in the province of faith healing? Because obviously that concept of that idea has been around for eons, right?
Speaker 2:or centuries, where it's like you know, you know, I believe, I believe, hallelujah, I believe, and you can now walk, you know, after having a leg of all your life or something or whatever. Um, it is right.
Speaker 3:Right is any of this in the province?
Speaker 2:of faith healing or is it something else? Is it something that is, uh, trackable, measurable, you know, readable or whatever, where you can actually see how a person's pain, or whatever that somatic turns on, you can see it like, is that? Is that? Is this different than faith healing?
Speaker 1:well, I mean to be anticlimactic, no, but the reason why it, why it isn't any different, is because you look at earth-based religions. Okay, I'm going to assign cause to somebody else, the big man in the sky with the gray beard and you're going to say, well, the Lord works in mysterious ways. Say, well, the Lord works in mysterious ways. He will show me what it is that I need to do Now. You can disagree or you can agree with it. That's totally fine, and self-determinism is paramount. It's the most important thing. What's true for you is true for you. You can say, okay, the Lord meant this to happen. And you can agree. Keyword parentheses, bold, 24-point font, underlined and italicized. You can agree with that and that's true for you. But the thing is is who is the source of this? What is the source of this? At the end of the day, you are the alpha and you are the omega oh, come on, come on, you are the beginning and the end, the first and the last Right.
Speaker 2:And so this is really interesting because LRH says, in the same lecture I mentioned earlier, he says that you can even go back here and find the point where the fellow made the postulate to have the illness. See, you can do all kinds of wild things on this side of it, not just on the, and there's no help to the medical doctor, like, like the medical doctor does what the medical doctor does and nobody's throwing medical doctors, you know, to the, to the crocodiles. But but when you can you work from this side of it, per lrh, and you can go back and you can actually find the point where the fellow made the postulates even have the illness. Right, there is a truth, and I'm emphasizing that word. There is a truth that comes along with helping a person understand why their body conditions are holding them back. And I'm speaking from personal experience, where I go back and I've gone back and I found where I said to myself this is what I'm going to experience, and it shows up later, later, later, later, over and over and over again.
Speaker 2:And I'd be like damn, I literally I kid you not I literally used to get summer flus or summer colds. You guys have heard of these. Right, it was like summer colds, not in the winter, where most people think you get these stifles or whatever. I used to get these summer colds and I used to say to myself no-transcript. And so I didn't want to go outside and play football with my brothers and them. And so because I didn't like, I didn't want to go outside and play football it's so stupid and so I didn't want to go, I didn't want to go outside and play football. So I decided that I get summer colds and, like clockwork, every july, every j July, I would get these damn colds and it would take me out for about a week because I didn't want to go outside and play football solution to a problem right it's like kids getting sick before they go to school.
Speaker 3:Right, have you been sick and you've been. You thought to yourself, you know what, it'll be, okay, it'll be okay. And then it gets worse. And then you make an appointment with a doctor and you rock up to the doctors for your appointment and all of a sudden you feel fine. You feel better now, right.
Speaker 2:I swear it was there before Right.
Speaker 1:Who made the decision that then manifested itself on the body, whether it was arty's fluish feelings because he was having to look at something that he needed to confront nothing to do with me.
Speaker 1:It was my external environment thank you I mean, that typifies it, that typifies it right there is this, this resist, resist, resist that which you resist. Yeah, you become because of your agreement to your own. And and to go back to, uh, you know, the alpha and the omega, everything, everything that happens to you, you cause, and I'm sorry that sounds like the most terrible tasting thing you've ever wanted to hear, but it's true. And then that shows up on the body.
Speaker 2:Yep, my mother almost took herself out just with that, what you just said. But this was back in 19,. I'm sorry, this was back in 2007. My mother calls me. I'm living in Atlanta, georgia.
Speaker 2:My mother calls me and she says she had to get rushed to the emergency room and I was like, wait, what happened? And she said she started having pain in her chest and pain in her arm. You know the whole thing and, like Art just said, when they arm, you know the whole thing. And, like Art just said, when they got to the hospital she was fine and so the doctors checked her out, wanted to make sure everything was fine, and they ran whatever CGI's or MRI's or whatever whatever, and they couldn't find any blockages, they couldn't find any issues and so they just chalked it up to like a you know, maybe it was heartburn or whatever. And I'm sitting on the phone with her and I said, mom, how old are you now? Because you know, obviously age might be a consideration in that heart stuff I said, mom, how old are you now?
Speaker 2:And she said I'm 54. I said, ok. I said how old was granddad when he died of a heart attack? She said he was 56. And I said how old are you? She said I'm 54. And I said how old was granddad? She said 56.
Speaker 1:And then she just cracked up laughing right, right, because that's that life continuum thing. You know, that's that life.
Speaker 2:Good, now I'm supposed I'm supposed to act like my dad and that's that's all there is to it, because you agreed because you agree that, that, that, that, that, uh, but people in my family get this, people in my family get that, they have these issues or whatever, whatever. And now she's 70 something years old, doing just fine, no heart issues, no, nothing, ain't nothing going on right, and so it's.
Speaker 3:You got to understand that you can cause these things, and you cause them inadvertently and it's interesting as well because, taking that a step further, like how many people actually are sick and then they go get so many tests, so many, um, you know, they spend time in hospitals to have zero results showing some kind of ailment, nothing, yet they're so convinced that they're they're ill.
Speaker 1:Yeah like that's such a common thing right, I need, I need to take this medication to key this out, so that I don't have to look at it that I'm actually causing it myself. Yeah, think about that.
Speaker 2:And so now we have an understanding at least of why and how the body and these body conditions are holding you back. And per art, um, would you say how you say art? Just push through it like just do it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, like, and and the statement is so true. Um, actually I two things. You know, the only way out is through Like. That is such a powerful statement and it's much bigger than even just us discussing it actually is, because to see it through is not a small task, you know. It's starting a cycle and actually completing it. But also, towards the end of my clay demos, in chapter seven, right at the end, ron Hubbard's discussing the curious question of more communication or less communication, and this really stood out for me because his final outcome for his decision was more communication is the only way. Outcome for his decision was more communication is the only way.
Speaker 3:Now, if you've got ailments and you're communicating less and less and less and just accepting the ailments, then you're not communicating, are you? Whereas if you start communicating more with your ailments, then something's going to happen. Your ailment may communicate back, so to speak. You know, and then you can. You can discover these areas in your body, but more communication is the key, which means you know, more communication in my situation would include communicate communicating with you, john, communicating with you, quinton, communicating with my way here, communicating in time, communicating and being present, um, communicating, doing the trs. You know communication, more communication, more communication, the less communication.
Speaker 3:The more your ailments, the more your ailments then you're only going to go backwards yeah, and so that statement was really powerful everything. Yes, you got to communicate the assist as well. Even if you're doing scientology assists, they require communication in order to to do them the touch assist.
Speaker 2:the touch assist restores communication with the body. The nerve assist, uh, is about communication of the nerves, how the, how the nerves and and energy flows to the body and stuff like that. The contact assist gets you back into communication with the nerves, how the nerves and energy flows to the body and stuff like that. The contact assist gets you back into communication with the physical environment and the locational, which is like a type of assist as well. The locational gets the spirit in present time and being able to be aware of their environment, observe their environment, to alleviate mental overwhelm, and so people having panic attacks, people having anxiety, people having all this stuff whatever, you can literally pull yourself out of these things by working with communication. So when you said it, lrh concluded that more communication is better.
Speaker 1:That's true, it's true and every assist works from that perspective yeah, you're just trying to get the person back into communication with their environment in the physical universe. As far as, objectively or subjectively, that then is not now, then is not now. Yeah, you know whether it's look around here and find something that doesn't remind you of blank, I say it's for the loss of a loved one.
Speaker 1:Right, and that's the thing. Is that then is not now Get into communication with your environment. You're here and you're now. This is what is going on right now, on right now.
Speaker 1:So all of these things tie together, whether they're objective processes that are trying to get you back into present time, where you're not reviving something that happened in the past that makes you feel bad, that keys you in, makes the mass pull in and you feel much more solid and massy, or keys it out so that it's not affecting you, so that you can see the trees for the forest and you can make forward progress. That's the point of this podcast is take a look at this and go okay, the way out is the way through. Whatever turned it on will turn it off. And so getting auditing and looking at these things and disagreeing with past agreements that you've made because whatever it is that you're experiencing right now is only because you decided that you needed to experience that, whether it was wrong or it was right or somewhere in between, auditing will help you look at that and go okay, I made a wrong decision and I'm operating off of that.
Speaker 1:I'm living the life of ma and pa. My daddy died at 90. I'm going to die at 60 or 62 or whatever. You don't have to do that. You're the alpha, you're the omega, it's all up to you and the way out is the way through, but you have to be able to look at it. I mean, that's what you're getting out of this right Artie.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and it's pretty full on because, as you're going through it and your world is happening, you can't help but think the work you've been doing definitely attributes to it. Um, because it's actually making me realize how communicating more is. Is the option? Um, because the a small example, um, I was, I was stuck on on somewhere to stay and then I just got something cheap just to give me a bit of time, and I decided and this is how crazy it is I decided to stay in a room that was moldy, it was run down, it was this and that, and I was okay with it. For some odd reason, but I wasn't okay with it. And then I come over to quinton's and I'm like, oh, I've got this real shitty place. And he's like, well, did you do something about it? I'm like no, and it's like no communication. You know, no communication. All I had to do was communicate to get myself put into a better room, to do this, to be more comfortable, but instead I chose uncomfortability over a decision I made. Isn't that crazy?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it happens.
Speaker 3:It's crazy.
Speaker 2:And we think we're being polite or we think we're being, you know, just going with the flow. We say stuff like that or whatever, but what we're really doing is that we're even if, for that moment, we're kind of lessening our own power and putting ourself in a position where the environment gets to win versus I get to create an environment that works for me right and and I think, and I think that that probably is the most uh, godlike or godly, holy way of what is it?
Speaker 2:Outflow is holier than inflow. I think that's the holier way of living, where you get to express or outflow that which you are. And if you're a sane, loving, neat and tidy, healthy individual and I know you are you're very healthy, you're a very healthy guy. You play pickleball, you'll be doing, you'll be running around, walking out in nature and stuff. I don't do none of that, but it's like you're a very healthy person, and then you go into an environment that doesn't reflect who you are and you say, well, I'll just deal with it. No, yeah, not on my watch, right? What did you agree with?
Speaker 3:crazy, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, a lot of things, yeah man.
Speaker 2:So this is this is where we are and what I love about this and I love that with fact that we can have this on this podcast and talk about it and that you guys get to sit here and talk to us about it, because it's like this is life and we live in it and we're figuring it out and we're doing the stuff that we got to do to make it go right, and we get to share these experiences with you to show this is real stuff, like we're as independent Scientologists. We don't live in ivory towers. You know what I'm saying. As independent Scientologists, we don't live in ivory towers. You know what I'm saying. We are living here in the life, in the trenches, doing things that everybody has to go through, and yet we're doing it with the technology and a knowingness that can help us through it every step of the way if we apply it, and that's what I love about this.
Speaker 1:Right. It takes persistence to go the distance.
Speaker 2:That's a.
Speaker 1:T-shirt yeah, yeah, yeah the way out is the way through, and who are you agreeing with?
Speaker 1:If you're agreeing with yourself, what are you agreeing to?
Speaker 1:And that's what we'll put as the end cap on the whole podcast and this shows up in the body. So make sure you eat right, drink right, sleep right all that stuff and take a look at what it is that you're agreeing to and who are you agreeing with, and you can disagree and change things if you want, and a lot of that has to do with changing your mind by getting auditing and getting the information that you need to have in order to evaluate situations with yourself and others across your eight dynamics or the College of Independent Scientology. And get in touch with us and we'll get you a theta meter and interview you and get you rolling on all the things that you need to do to be do and have and agree to the things that you want to agree to, as opposed to the things that you are agreeing to. So for Quentin, myself and Arthur, get in communication with yourself, get in communication with us and change. And Arthur, Get in communication with yourself, Get in communication with us and change your agreements, Namaste, and we love you. Bye-bye.
Speaker 2:Peace, bye-bye, thank you, thank you. Thanks for watching.