Scientology Outside of the Church Podcast
Did you know Scientology the Subject and The Church of Scientology are two completely different things? Find out why and what the difference is and how it can help you. Topics range from Independent Scientology, solving life's problems, past lives, secret government, metaphysical, Para-Scientology, UFOS/UAPS, ghost hunting, spirituality, and a lot more! Come check us out!
Scientology Outside of the Church Podcast
SE11EP33 - Independent Scientology - The Clairs
Ever had that eerie feeling of knowing something without knowing how you knew it? That uncanny moment when you anticipate the phone ringing seconds before it happens? These aren't coincidences or flights of fancy—they're glimpses of your natural psychic abilities, known in Scientology as "the Claires."
This episode dives deep into four fundamental psychic capacities: clairvoyance (clear seeing), clairaudience (clear hearing), clairsentience (clear feeling), and claircognizance (clear knowing). We explore how these abilities represent our spiritual birthright rather than supernatural gifts for a chosen few. Through personal stories—like sensing a stranger's dark intentions in a Miami nightclub or perceiving a woman's tragic story before she shared it—we demonstrate how these perceptions naturally manifest when we're open to them.
The secret to developing these abilities isn't learning something new—it's remembering what you already possess. Independent Scientology processes help remove the barriers of self-invalidation and evaluation that have caused you to suppress your natural spiritual capacities. As L. Ron Hubbard explains, "Certainty is the degree of willingness to accept the awareness of a truth." When you trust your first intuitive thought without second-guessing, you're operating from the clear knowing that is your natural state.
We explore how KRC (Knowledge, Responsibility, Control) equals power when developing spiritual abilities. By gaining knowledge about your innate capabilities, taking responsibility for them, and learning to control them effectively, your power as a spiritual being increases. Moving up "the bridge" helps you become stronger and more able by removing the self-imposed limitations that restrict your perception.
Ready to stop compromising with your own reality? Listen now and discover how to unlock the psychic abilities you've always had but forgotten how to use. Your path to spiritual certainty starts with trusting what you already know.
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Hi and welcome to another Scientology Outside of the Church podcast. This is Wednesday, september 17th 2025. I'm here with Quentin and Arthur, our co-hosts, and we want to introduce you to the Clares Meet the Clares's starring Eddie Murphy. So we're going to jump right into this and get going. Have you ever just known something without knowing how you knew it? That's to our listeners, so I'm sure everybody's experienced that. Oh, the phone's going to ring. And then the phone rings and you're like I don't know, are you you?
Speaker 1:you you hear something differently than what somebody says and you go. I know that's what they meant, but they said something different. You're like that's weird. Well, these are the Claire's and LRH mentions a lot of these throughout the advanced clinical courses, both American and Australian, and the UK, the London lectures. But we're going to go over all of these from sort of a OT ability standpoint and things that we've experienced and talk about each one.
Speaker 2:So it actually was Art's idea.
Speaker 1:I was like okay, sorry, artie.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was Art's idea, but yeah, I think that it's a really, really great idea because, obviously, as we bump around in the material universe trying to live and move and find our way, is it easier to do things based on, uh, trial and error or is it easier to do things, kind of, with the level of clarity and knowingness, and that things then therefore tend to happen faster, move easier, uh, go, go right for you because you're operating with this level of clarity right. And I think the clairs, uh, particularly uh, we're going to dive into clairvoyance, which is like clear seeing, clairaudience, which is clear, audio or clear hearing. Clairsentience, which is clear, feeling, and then claircognizance, which is clear, knowing, essence, which is clear, knowing, and so, kind of working from these angles, we get to actually go through life seeing before we see it, hearing and being aware of perceptively before we actually hear it from communications and other things, feeling it intuitively and then also knowing. Just, you know that, you know that, you know that, you know ain't that something.
Speaker 2:so I think, I think, I think helping others kind of develop their own abilities and mastery of the force, um I think, is really good as independent Scientologists, that's what we do so.
Speaker 3:I'll just quickly say like the way the Claire is spelled is C-L-A-I-R, which actually means clear or bright from old French. So when you throw in the cognoscence and the other parts of the Claire's, you know to be able to see something or know something clear or brightly, which I think is interesting. Because then when we look at Scientology, going through the processes to become clear, which I think is a little interesting just as an observation.
Speaker 1:It is because, even though it's not being used in the same sense, it's being used in the same sense. It's being used in the same sense Clear. Seeing A prime example of this and this is a non-confidential one. I wish I could share the confidential ones. But one of the things that I experienced as an auditor once, and then multiple times after that, is in dating and locating something for the PC.
Speaker 1:Once I did my, I finished OT seven and and I did had done Excalibur at that time as well I was in in session with the PC and we were dating and locating a particular incident and right as I started doing the date locate of, you know what the year was and you have to date it down to the second. I knew the, I just knew it. It was just there and he gave it to me and I about fell out of my chair. I kept my TRs in but I about fell out of my chair that I just I knew what it was and I wrote it down and he gave me the same date down to the second. And I've had that happen several, several times since then and that's, that's just an example of you don't even really get.
Speaker 1:I mean at the first time it was wow, it wasn't. How did I know? It was just that I knew, I knew this as a, as a very micro example of this type of a thing. So it's a little bit of a. One could say it's an, it's an OT phenomena. You know, other people haven't, haven't done their OT levels, and just because there's no label there doesn't mean that a person doesn't have OT abilities. And that's something that I would like to make clear on this is that that's right.
Speaker 1:You know, all the OT levels do is they vastly improve upon your abilities, and LRA says that every OT has their own abilities. We all have different abilities, areas that we excel at and, I guess, dating knowing these particular things. But it also has to do with ARC. So that's just a quick, short example of what can happen as an OT auditor in session and how the clairs apply.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it definitely, it definitely hits. And so for those of you who are intuitively or should I say innately, who innately kind of have these abilities turned on for yourself and you're able to rock with them or work with them, which is in my case it feels like this happens to me all the time. This happens to me, and I could be at the grocery store. I remember one time I was in Books A Million and this woman comes up to me. I think I told this story before in an earlier podcast some years ago. But this woman comes up to me at a bookstore and we're just looking at the books and we just kind of started chatting about some of the books that we were seeing and she said I just want to tell you about my story, is that okay? And I said sure.
Speaker 2:So she started talking to me and she told me about her husband passing away and I said, okay, stop for a second, talk to me about why I'm seeing your legs.
Speaker 2:And I looked at her and as I'm looking at her, her legs started getting really almost like very noodley, like noodley, and then there was this dark, like smoke, around her legs and I said tell me about why I'm seeing your legs looking all like noodley, and I'm waving my hands trying to give her a visual of what I'm seeing.
Speaker 2:And she was like my husband was out fishing and, from what they gathered, he was fishing and the fish pulled, he slipped in the boat, his legs went under something and broke both of his legs and then he fell in and he passed away with broken legs under you know from the thing, and I was able to perceive her legs looking like all weird and bent, just looking at her body, um, standing there in the bookstore, and so this kind of stuff to me happens all the time, yeah, and it's been this way since I was a kid, and so for any of you who are listening to this podcast and you know what I'm talking about, this is the kind of stuff that can be opened up for you and made better and we'll talk about that in a minute and why it works can be made better with independent Scientology, because what happens is you actually become more innately.
Speaker 2:You I want you to get this and your, your, your innate abilities are heightened and improved upon with auditing, and so that's why, when I started studying brief another story where, uh, I was walking it was right before thanksgiving of 2014, I was walking into a dollar tree next to a walmart in georgia and I saw this.
Speaker 1:We were looking for glasses for the thanksgiving meal and as I walked in there I didn't see it, but I saw it. There was this black mass that looked sort of like uh but quentin, you're the, you're the marvel guy? What's the name of the one that shapeshifts? The black one with the teeth?
Speaker 1:marvel oh, venom, venom, yeah, it was like, yeah, yeah it was like venom, but it was there, yeah, but I didn't see it with my eyes. I saw as as a being and I was like, oh god, look at that thing on the floor to myself. And as soon as I said that, it was like this big glop of tar and it was just and it went to my knee and so I had to apply my OT, class nine auditor training and handled it immediately. But I was immediately aware of that and the store was filled with this stuff, different beings, but you couldn't see them. But you could see them if you had that Claire in it. And, using the data on the class nine course, I immediately dispatched it and it was fine.
Speaker 1:But it was really amazing to me how you become aware of these things and you have to be able and you'd be better at this than I would, Clinton but I mean in explaining it but you have to be open to it and not invalidate the knowingness. That's right, Because if you do, then you're doing yourself a disservice, this ability. You have to go. Okay, yeah, with great power comes great responsibility. It's sort of like that. You can't go. Nah, that's Because then you're harming yourself, at least on the short term, because you're invalidating your own abilities, which kind of brings us to the deep dive.
Speaker 3:Because, similar to both of you guys as well, like even in my story, I could spot things on people and, like you said, john, not necessarily with my physical eyes, although sometimes, depending in certain states and where I am in life, it either amplifies or it lessens. So if I've got some stuff going on in my life, it seems to lessen, but then, as I'm running a lot smoother, it seems to enhance. The knowing is a lot clearer, like the clear is a lot stronger when my environment is in a better position. But also, I think people really dismiss the ability of the imagination aspect, because in our mind's eye is our imagination and it's in that imagination that these things come and go. And I think not only is it a matter of being open to these possibilities, but I think it's also trusting that what you're already perceiving is actually a perception.
Speaker 3:It's not an imagination, um, in the everyday sense, where it's not make believe, because that imagination inverted commas comes from somewhere or from something um, and I think people, I think just the way we're taught in general, we're already taught that we're powerless in the sense of that's just your imagination, you're making that up. But I think if people start realizing it's not actually made up and there's actually a lot more to it. You know, how does somebody write a great novel that's so fresh? That's right. Where does that come from? How does completely fresh it's a fantasy. It's come from something somewhere inside the person's own individual being. And then when you bring the clairs into it as well, is it imagination, is it a fairy tale, or is it? Maybe you just don't trust yourself enough to believe your own mind?
Speaker 2:yeah, yeah, I totally agree with you, arthur, because, yeah, because, when you really think about it, your mind, you, as a being, are using all your resources at your faculty, right at your at your disposal, and you're using all your resources at your faculty right At your disposal, and you're using all your resources, all your faculties, everything that you can pull from or work with in order to communicate and live and move and have your be and do everything you got to do in the universe, right? And so why wouldn't you work with the tool of an imagination in order to perceive things more, or should I say, perceive things that are less real to the physical eye? Right, the physical eye? Think about that, even a human, our eye, only sees a certain spectrum of light Too dark, and you can't see nothing Too dark and you can't see nothing Too bright and you can't see nothing, right? So there's a certain spectrum of light that you can actually work with with human eyes, okay, so then close your eyes.
Speaker 2:You know what do you see, you know, and what's doing the looking If your eyes are closed? What's doing the looking? It's you, as thetan. You're looking and you're able to perceive of these things, and so I think this is really important. You know, lrh talks about knowingness all throughout Scientology and this knowingness and he speaks, he says this word knowingness and it is it kind of encapsulates the fullness of what it means to know something right? It's the fullness of it and there's, as a thing, you have a potential knowingness right that even you as a physical body or your physical body cannot necessarily get because of, you know, attenuation yeah, we, we did a uh a podcast a while back about um confirmation bias.
Speaker 1:You remember that one, quentin, yes, and that that is something that with the clairs you, you have to step away from that confirmation bias of, well, I'm not seeing it, I'm not perceiving it. With the body, it's sort of like okay, well, if I can perceive it with these perceptions that the body has, then it must exist and that's the thing that you have to. How should I say you have to acknowledge it and go okay, yeah, that's fine, but you know what you know. But I say you have to acknowledge it and go okay, yeah, that's fine, but you know what you know. And you need to go with your first knowingness and not invalidate what it is that you really know, as I mentioned earlier. Because if you do that and you just stick with that line of action, you'll find that it happens more and more and more.
Speaker 1:I mean, I'm sure that's what you guys have seen as well. Is you just? Okay? I'm going to go with this. I don't need to have this thing in the physical universe that says it exists, because a lot of the things don't exist in the physical universe now or in in the future. It's, it's. It's just a completely different universe, and that's that's the theta universe.
Speaker 2:That's right, you know. Lrh talks about barriers and as we're opening up these abilities and the clairs get turned on in you doing independent Scientology and the work that you do, he talks about barriers, says something which an individual cannot communicate beyond. A barrier. Something which an individual cannot communicate beyond. Number two is space, energy, matter and time. Each is only a barrier to knowingness. A barrier is a barrier only in that it impedes knowingness.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:This is huge.
Speaker 2:And so when a person is running into barriers in their life, all they're running into is something that impedes knowingness and that they cannot communicate beyond, and therefore it's a barrier to them, right?
Speaker 2:And so when you're trying to perceive of something, when you're trying to get some clarity or some answers in your life, and you're trying to perceive of something, when you're trying to get some clarity or some answers in your life, and you're running into these barriers, this is something that is there that impedes your knowingness. It's not something that is immovable and cannot be torn down, or, you know, this thing is so huge for me as a being, and so therefore, it's like boom, I can't get beyond this. No, and a barrier is just something that is impeding your knowingness and something that a thetan cannot communicate beyond. And so, therefore, by being able to remove those barriers, by being able to get those things out of your way, you actually strengthen knowingness. Is clear cognizance. This is to be clear, cognizant to, to, to, to clear knowing, and so you strengthen your knowingness by removing barriers right and those, those two minor, two primary barriers to yourself.
Speaker 1:On the first dynamic is as a being in validation and evaluation, you know what you know that's right.
Speaker 3:Even, um, even just going through some of the processes, um, it really amplifies these things as well. Like I remember just doing some auditing, and the more auditing I did, the clearer my percepts became, the more comfortable I became with it. My internal imagery became clearer and clearer and in some cases, just so real. I was there, like literally there, which I find really interesting, because once you trust that, just by going through some of the processing through independent scientology, just through getting auditing, the clarity that starts to emerge in your experience during these processes. You can't deny it and and I think the cool thing about that is is because you can't deny it and it's actually happening to you, you're like, oh my god, this is real, this is real and you start to doubt your mind a lot less, um, even just from doing processes, that's right, it doesn't take much to change you know abilities.
Speaker 1:Usually it's just sort of dusting them off and and and. The funny thing is, and and this is another thing that I've seen happen with myself and with other people, and I'm sure you guys have too is you go grab, you're looking for for something on a particular subject and you grab an lrh book or a technical volume or whatever, and you set it down and and the book opens and there it is how many times does that happen?
Speaker 1:I've had it happen with five. What the hell I mean? Does this, guys, happen to you? Yeah, it happens to me all the time. I don't know that, that type of a thing, and you just you sort to. You know, it's that trust, the process thing, whether it's you know, see, hear. And when we say feel, we don't necessarily mean feel as in physically, feel it can be, but feel also goes towards you're leaning in a particular direction, maybe in an emotional direction, positive emotional direction. That, uh then leads to a no, and well, let's go. I feel like I'd be in here. Boom, the book opens and there it is, and you had no idea where it was in the book and it's right in front of you. So that's, that's a, that's one that is a, a uh, you in the universe. But I've seen that happen dozens and dozens and dozens of times.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and when LRH talks about in the code of honor, about never compromise with your own reality.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:And it's like. It's like when you, when you know something and you perceive something in your own universe, with yourself, with whatever's going on you with the blob me, me with the wobbly legs, you know whatever else like is going on when you perceive something, never compromise with your own reality, that you actually maintain your own honor and integrity. When you recognize that it's there, it's something, I got it, you deal with it accordingly. So it's something I got it and you and you deal with it accordingly.
Speaker 3:so it makes you better for it what were you gonna say, because sometimes I think the body, um, I was just gonna say I think it's interesting because, um, there are so many practices to confirm your mind, um, like, for example, using a pendulum, or you know, in the bible they used to throw lots, or use ruins or tarot cards, these kinds of things. And what's interesting about that is the body. You're actually using the body as a vehicle to tell you the truth. And what I find funny about that is is the body itself already knows the truth, but it's the mind and the way we perceive our own mind that turns it into a bit of a. It turns on.
Speaker 3:It's a truth you can't ignore, and I find it funny how we've struggled really hard to match our minds with our bodies to become clear. I just find it kind of ironic. The body knows the truth, it always does, it doesn't lie, can't lie. And then, when it comes to the clairs, like the abilities are already there but our mind gets in the way of really believing them or opening that door, understanding it, trusting it um, it's, it's such an ironic thing, I think yeah it.
Speaker 1:It's one of those things where and this is how I describe new OT5 and the Excalibur level is the fate and mind body and the body is the symptomatic side. This is where things bubble up out into the surface, out into the open, in the physical universe. And you have these people and I get a jiggle in my leg. I know something's gonna happen. I mean, you know you, you see that stuff all the time where you know it's uh, you know it's like uh, going to a, a mystic or something like that, and they're and they've always got that via that shows up in the body.
Speaker 1:And that's that confirmation bias that when this happens and it happens a lot and when you're looking at somebody that hasn't had auditing and they start getting auditing, especially, you know they get through their grades and they get on newer Dianetics, that type of a thing you see the symptomatic side fade away. You don't have to have that confirmation bias because if anemometer is spinning, it's windy outside, you don't need to know it's windy outside with the anemometer, you just know it's windy outside, you don't have to look. That's what we're talking about. There is is that these are claire's go ahead yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:And and lrh in the definition of certainty I'm again tech dictionary certainty is the degree of willingness to accept the awareness of, and as is this the degree of willingness to accept the awareness of a truth, right, and then number two is knowledge itself. Is certainty? Knowledge is not data, knowingness is certainty. Get this. And so when you're able to step into your knowingness, you step into it with certainty. There is certainty, it says here, knowingness, knowing one knows, is a state of being. That's what certainty is knowing one knows.
Speaker 2:And so when you're perceiving something, when you're, uh, this is so, let me tell you why, why this is important. It's not just important, we just talking about this because it's all spooky and it's all wonderful, and oh powers, you superpowers. When you talk about being OT and when you're talking about even running the OT levels, and when you're talking about working from an OT perspective in life, there's a certainty that one has to have in order to be able to move in this right. There's a level of certainty that you have to be able to have when it, when it comes to taking motion or taking action in your life, if you're going to do it right. And so ot is knowingness, it's a certainty, and that's what we're talking about here being able to know that you know yeah, trusting your own mind, trusting that the things you're getting, uh uh, something more than just a fantasy yeah, well, certainty is everything, and lrh talks about that a lot, and that that goes to uh, you know what?
Speaker 1:what is called tone 40 in independent scientology is that it's just, this is, this is how it is, and that is. That is what these clairs basically are, is. There is no doubt, no reservation. It is 100 of 100 and just, and that's that, and and that's that's. The only thing dividing a being from their abilities is their certainty isn't quite in yet really.
Speaker 3:And then there's the question as well where, um, you know, people go to say psychics, people that that proclaim that they can do these things as an example. What I find interesting about that is is what is it that the psychic, too, can do that your average person cannot, like you know, to become psychic or to have these clear abilities? Does that mean you're chosen? Does that mean you're special? Does that mean God put his hand on your shoulder and said go out there and teach them all like is? Are these abnormal things, or are they completely normal and we all born within our beings with these abilities?
Speaker 1:Well, I don't even know if I would go as far as to say born. I think that they're just innate abilities that we have decided we need to shut off in order to play a game. That's just my humble opinion, based off of what I've experienced as well. If I can do that, I don't have it. I don't have, I don't have a game anymore. I geez, if I know what my neighbor is going to do before they do it. Well, yeah, that doesn't sound like a lot of fun.
Speaker 3:I rather not know well, sometimes I think to myself like, imagine if you knew everything right. That's a lot of data to process for anyone being. You know, if you're in a room with a hundred people and you can read minds, man, that'd drive you crazy, it would drive you absolutely crazy. Wait, say that again if you like. If you're in a room with, say, a hundred people and you could read read minds like, can you imagine the insanity that could bring you?
Speaker 2:oh yeah, like that's a lot of data.
Speaker 3:Yeah, oh, you know a mall with just random people with their random problems and loves and hates and wants and, uh, aberrations, present time problems, oh man, like what a nightmare well no, listen, true story true story.
Speaker 1:Lrh uh and I've probably mentioned this in the podcast before lrh developed a process back in the early 50s to to pick up on other people's thoughts and and it was it created such arc breaks that he had to create a process to to cancel it out, because people were so upset at what other people were thinking about them. They were appalled at the thoughts that they were having about them and other people how funny is that hey, so you know it's uh, be careful what you wish for type of a thing.
Speaker 1:but that that loops back to you know, knowledge, responsibility, control equals power, krc and being able to accept and understand what it is that you are aware of and what you do with it. Because sometimes, when people have great responsibilities and they're not ready for them, it can be really devastating to them, because it's like having a magic wand and you turned your wife into a zebra or something like that.
Speaker 2:Or having the Midas touch and you touch your lover and turn them into a lump of gold. You know a?
Speaker 1:block of gold.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you got to be careful with it. A block, yeah, yeah, yeah, you got to be careful with it. When I was in um, when I was in miami, I went down to a club in miami and my friends are having a wonderful time. I don't drink, but they were drinking and um, and so I'm standing back against the wall. And so my back against the wall, and between me and the bar there was a whole bunch of people, so I'm against the wall. The bar is maybe about five, maybe eight feet away from me and people are walking through this little narrow corridor between the wall and the bar and this guy is holding this girl's hand and he's walking out toward the the front of the bar and he brushes up against me with his left shoulder and it brushes up against my chest, and so I kind of pull my head back a little bit and I'm like, oh you know. And then I'm through and as soon as he touched me, all of this data just started flooding in.
Speaker 2:All this data started flooding in and I got exactly what his intentions were with that girl for the night and, trust me, it wasn't nice and it wasn't pretty OK, and and I saw that he had put something in her drink. He had, like, you know, like a, like a roof, you know, yeah, yeah, like a roof, yeah, yeah, and he had put something in her drink. And so, after I kind of came back to present time, uh, and what was going on in the moment I, I went looking for him and he had already made his way toward and out the front door. And it is definitely uh real that when a person has these abilities that are open and clear to him and stuff or her, that's a lot what you say art, it's a very disinterulating, it is yeah, with a history, and I just started crying. I'm in the bar, everybody having a good time, and I just break down crying and I was like I gotta go, I gotta get out of here get out of here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't want to know, I don't want to know, I don't want to know, and that's that's the basis for all of these different Claire's is we're talking about in this podcast is is that at some point in time you've said I don't, I don't, I don't want to know this, and at that point these things were attenuated and you can rehabilitate these things by trusting the process, not evaluating, not invalidating. Auditing helps open that those flows back up. We all have them. Different abilities takes a lot of confront, like we were talking about before the podcast. It takes a lot of confront to be able to be there and be comfortable when you're picking up these, these sorts of things, from whatever source it is.
Speaker 1:A lot of the stuff has been going on well within the last few weeks, let alone the last year or two. I I knew it was going to happen. Uh, back before we had the whole COVID dramatization, I knew that that was what was going to be going down at that time and you just have to look at it and go okay, these are the plans I need to make. I have to put this stuff out in front of this and put this create out there. I really have to start pushing AOGP, have to do more podcasts, all this jazz, and that takes a lot of confront, Because if you know something, you can't be. The adverse effect of it and that's an interesting point that we need to look at and go into on the podcast is, if you go in that direction, you can take a path that is different than the path you might've chosen otherwise.
Speaker 1:Before listening to this podcast and just saying, okay, I have these abilities, I accept them. I am, to that degree, an operating thetan, whether I have a certificate for it or not. I need to listen to myself. It's not, you know, it's not this. I have this angel that follows me around.
Speaker 1:Because if you're doing that, you might as well be saying well, god works in mysterious ways and I'm sure that he will resolve everything. Because you're putting it on a via, you're the one, you're the one that knows, you're the one that feels, you're the one that understands this. And once you do that, these abilities start to come back to you, because you're taking responsibility for them instead of shoving them off on your guardian angel, your wingman angel or some man in the sky or whatever. So you have to acknowledge that and accept that you have these abilities and go with that. Your first knowingness, the first thing that comes up always. Do not invalidate it, do not evaluate it, just let it in, because you're and that's even a misnomer, almost yeah, that's even a misnomer is just be like you said in the last podcast, just just be, go ahead, guys.
Speaker 3:No, and just let it be what you just said is and it's interesting what you just said as well around um, your first thought. And so, working with a lot of people, one-on-one, around um them, starting to trust their abilities, I've realized the first thought that comes in, which can be really hard to catch at times, is 90, if not 100, the truth. The very first message, if not 100% the truth, the very first message that comes through is the truth. But then anything after that is aberration, lies. And I want to make another point as well on something. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 3:An example I give people is let's say, you want to start a new diet and part of that diet is to stop eating chocolate, for example. But you go into a supermarket and there's chocolate everywhere. So you've woken up and you've made this solid decision Okay, today I'm going to stop eating chocolate and everything's fine. But then you go to the grocery store and there's chocolates everywhere and the first thing you say to yourself is I'm not going to buy chocolate, but maybe we could start tomorrow. How about we just have a small one today and all of a sudden, bang, it's gone. Your intuition and your own knowing all of a sudden has been overridden by something else, whether it's a body aberration or whatever it is, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 3:And another point I really like from what you said there as well, john, is how a lot of people will say my guides told me this, you know. Oh, my spirit guides told me, um, I shouldn't be friends with you because you know you've got a bad attitude. And it's just like come on, who's in control here, you or something else? Are you a puppet to another being or are you the being you know? And do people use those things as scapegoats? Oh, my guide said I shouldn't do that. My guide said I should go get a new job. Oh, my guide said he's cheating on me or whatever. Um, and I find that those kinds of phrases is really interesting um, I'm not a fan of them, but I find those kinds of things super interesting when people talk that way.
Speaker 2:Arthur or Quentin go ahead yeah, and, and when we allow ourselves just to be who we are and be in our operation of that, it becomes more and more simple. I think I'll use the word simple. It just happens more simply and therefore it's less overwhelming. One of of the things that, on the Protears course with Art and I, we're realizing that when you allow this thing to become almost a natural communication flow and it just kind of flows out and you're doing it in a new unit of time each time, it's like yeah, and Art would even say it like you can feel it lighter, you can feel it getting easier in your system. And so I think you said it right, jonathan just be and just let it be in that this is what's here, this is what's coming up, and you're able to be there and be comfortable, no matter what is going on, no matter the, the bull baiting, no matter the, whatever the is happening in your environment, you're able to be there and be able to be comfortable in it. And there's a power to that. I don't know what else to call it. You know there's a power to it.
Speaker 2:I love how you said krc. Uh, um, knowledge, responsibility and control is power. So think about that. You have these abilities, but if it's out of control, right, you feel you feel powerless, right? Or you feel less powerful. If, if you don't have, if you have something but you don't really know what it is. But I know something you don't have any power yet. And so, with independent Scientology, you're increasing your KRC, your knowledge, your responsibility and control of all your dynamics all that you are and therefore you become more powerful as a being.
Speaker 3:This is what we're talking about right and and this is and it's interesting what you were saying on the proteas side of it as well, um, but for us to get to that stage, how much commitment has it had to take, how much practice has it has it had to take? How much of both of us showing up to learn these things has it taken? You know, it's not like we woke up, read the data and all of a sudden these things just appeared. We had to commit to it, we had to train for it, we had to practice for it. We had to break through so many of our own barriers in order to get to the other side of knowing this process, which very soon we're not far from finishing, but very soon that's going to be applicable in so many areas of our life, whereas a couple of weeks ago it wasn't.
Speaker 1:Right, right. And then it's interesting to note that we were talking about. You know, you just need to be. And then KRC, and KRC, knowledge, responsibility and control is power. Well, the definition of power is the ability to hold a position in space, parallel range, because you are a terminal. If you cannot hold that position in space, you are not being, and so, therefore, if you have these abilities, which this podcast is about, or you don't, you're not being there.
Speaker 1:And it isn't difficult to be there if you, your trs, are in because you're, you're being there, you're being comfortable, and when you're comfortable, you're certain and you're being there, you're being comfortable, and when you're comfortable, you're certain and you're being there and your certainty is there and you don't even question whatever it is that you become aware of. You hear, you see, you just know, and that's it. Because you're comfortable in your own space, because you're holding a position in space, matter, energy, space and time with a body. But as a thetan, it gets even easier because you don't identify with the body, because you're being the terminal that is visible in the physical universe as a body. So when you're doing TRs, you're addressing the being, but it manifests objectively in the body. So being there has everything to do with knowing there, so to speak, or hearing, or feeling, or whatever and and in the uh tech dictionary.
Speaker 2:So guess this. Lrh talks about being knowing calls right, knowing calls. And let's first of all clear the word knowingness. So we talked about knowingness. Lrh talks about being knowing cause right, knowing cause, and let's first of all clear the word knowingness. So we talked about knowingness from the perspective of understanding and knowledge and stuff like that. But he says this knowingness is being certainness. Knowingness is number one being certainness. It's a capability for truth, it is not data. So knowingness is not data. Knowingness is a cape, a capability for truth. And then, number three, knowingness.
Speaker 2:Knowingness would be self-determined knowledge. Isn't that interesting. Knowingness is self-determined knowledge. And so, regardless of the environment, regardless of society, regardless of all this other stuff out here that I think you said at the what do you call those things with the spinny wind thing and confirmation bias regardless of any confirmation bias that might have to show up, knowing is just self-determined knowledge. I know I am knowing this right. Knowledge, he said. By knowledge we mean assured belief, that which is known, information, instruction, enlightenment, learning, practical skill. By knowledge we mean data factors and whatever can be thought about or perceived, and so knowledge is anything that can be thought about or perceived and knowing.
Speaker 3:This is self-determined knowledge I think um, an easy example would be going to school learning to become an accountant and then actually being an accountant. You're walking, you're talking. You're not even thinking about your study anymore.
Speaker 1:You're actually now being the study yeah, there's a drill, an e-meter drill I forget which one it is uh where you have to tell the coach when the needle reads and you, you do it on a gradient and you're looking to right, to the left in your peripheral vision and then you're supposed to put it to the side of the person's head. Well, and they're like, wait, what? Oh, you know, it's like luke skywalker how can I see the, the drone with the blast shield on? And obi-wan kenobi says in the lounge in the millennium, falcon, you know, because he said you know. And then they do it. They're like how did I do that? And that is like such a low level, but a perfect example of cut the crap.
Speaker 1:Get your considerations that are senior to the physical universe in line. You know when this needle is reading, even though you can't see the dial. As an example, all of these little drills. You see this with Tibetan monks and these different areas of religion and things like that. It's everywhere.
Speaker 1:It's just that you've bought into these inabilities that are not your inabilities. You have innate abilities. You've just chosen to disregard them, and that's the point that we're trying to make is that this isn't a fru fruies, you know, unicorns, rainbow, peace, love, flowers and beads podcast. This is factual stuff, right? You, you it can. You can do this as soon as you get off of the podcast. It's just a matter of you being certain about it. It's a flip of a switch in the theta universe. Just boom, okay, and I, I expect. I expect to see people posting in the comments on youtube I this and this happened. That's that's our goal for this podcast, because you can do it. It's just a matter of changing your mind and that's all auditing does. Is it just changes your mind about things? Because a thetan says well, I'm dumb, well, guess what? You're dumb.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You're aware or you're unaware, or you're slightly intelligent or you're less intelligent. These are all decisions. The only thing that's holding you back is yourself.
Speaker 3:That's the ultimate point on these, these clairs, so to speak and the cool thing about independent scientology is, um, because a lot of people exactly what you said. They're around, you know, you are what you think. It can be so difficult to change what you think, um, because you're not aware of why you even think such things. Um, some things, sure, we can change, but there's a lot of deeper stuff that that you can't. But then when you go through processing, um, those things will turn off. You know there are ways to turn those things off, but it does require a level of commitment to remove those, that negative thinking, so to speak. You know, and then start applying more positive thinking, or more definite thinking, as opposed to random thinking.
Speaker 1:Right, right.
Speaker 3:Certainty.
Speaker 1:Yeah, certainty is 100%. Yeah, hold my beer, I got this, yeah, and then that's all it is. And and being there, and being comfortable, and being in present time, at strong interest or above, like I keep telling these guys on their TRS, you know is is is when you get there and you're able to hold that love, that tone level, that level of ARC at a minimum all the time, okay With yourself and with other people, all of a sudden everything starts to change for you and now these abilities start opening up because you're being there and you're being comfortable, you're calm, you don't have any anxiety and it's sort of like you just get an incoming email in the Theta universe and you're like, oh well, that's how this is Okay. Oh okay, I've done this already. I just need to let the physical universe's comlack catch up to it. I've done this. That's literally how you should be postulating. It's already done, it's already there. Somebody says say a postulate, you know, make a postulate from my father. And I always, I always type done.
Speaker 2:Done.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because it's not. You don't sit there, just light, feather touch, it's done.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's why. That's why you know, worrying.
Speaker 2:Worrying to me is you kind of compromising with your own reality right Because you say you want something, whether it be money or a relationship or health or whatever. You say you want something and then you go in worrying about it, which is, to me, going into compromising with your own reality. It's like but what if this doesn't happen? And what if that doesn't happen? And what if I can't do? And what if I can't do? And what if I can't have? And what if I can't be? And it's like you're going into this spiral of compromise, compromise, compromise, versus saying I know that, I know that, I know that I know and being able to move into that.
Speaker 2:The thing I love about working up the bridge. Going up the bridge is that, at every point, and whether you think it's important or not, at every point, going up the bridge is making you a stronger, a better, a more able being. And so, whether it's just sitting here running TRs and communication drills which is what Art and I have been doing whether it's doing the purif in order to get the drugs and stuff out of your system so that you can actually think clearly and be there right, whether it's going up and doing some of the other upper levels, the grades and the whole bit, all these things are designed to make you a stronger, a better, a more able being. And then you get a more able being, and then you get to the ot levels, and then you get to be that, and you get to be that even at a gradient better. Right, it's like, oh, I can do that too. Oh, I can do that too. Oh, that's, yeah, that's me. Do you go?
Speaker 1:right, and it's important to note that that nobody's giving you anything back that you didn't already possess. This is something that you already have innately, and you need to need to understand that, and the only but only person that's ever convinced you otherwise is yourself. We're just helping you remind yourself that you have this ability, these powers, so to speak, and it's not a matter of what you can do in the physical universe. The physical universe is the last thing to manifest, the last thing to manifest. Everything else comes before that. Beingness is primary and knowingness. Everything else comes before that. Beingness is primary and knowingness. And when you start to pick up these things, accept them, acknowledge them and go, take a win on the fact that, hey, there we go, and you get better at it and you're like, okay, yeah, now I. And after a while you stop invalidating it, suppressing it, and then all of a sudden, you notice the physical universe responds much quicker. There isn't this delay Sometimes it's six weeks in something, but that delay isn't necessarily the physical universe.
Speaker 2:It's you not trusting yourself.
Speaker 1:So in closing do we have any closing statements from our panel.
Speaker 3:Actually, there's one thing I just want to throw in, Because before we started this discussion, we were talking about empathy and people struggling with empathy and a statement that you made, Quentin. You know their TRs are out. Talk to us a little bit about that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, when you're we kind of touched on it earlier. When we talk about you talked about being in this big crowd of people and you know, getting all this, receiving all these signals or whatever yeah, it's like you have to make sure your TRs are in, and when you're able to be there and be comfortable, when you're able to get your communications across which is just the impelling of an idea, really, you impale an idea across a distance. That's communication. You're able to do that effectively when your TRs are in. And so, again, I say, all these things going up the bridge is there to help you be a better being.
Speaker 2:And so, yeah, if you have these abilities and they seem out of control for you and, trust me, a lot of people who reach out to us are very gifted people. A lot of people who reach out to us are very able people, and yet there's these parts of their life that seem to be out of control, apparently, and so what we're here to do is help you put all that in perspective, pull it all under your own self-determinism so you can then live. Are they in order to do that effectively?
Speaker 1:can. Can you give that again? You dropped out.
Speaker 2:You guys can hear me.
Speaker 1:No, it dropped out. I can hear you.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay. Well, yes, have your TRs in so that you can be a better being and communicate effectively across a distance of space and time.
Speaker 1:Right, that's what it comes down to is, if you're being there and you're being comfortable and the end phenomena of pro-TRs which, yes, it's the end phenomena of the course, but the end phenomena is being able to handle any social situation, no matter how rough, with communication alone. Okay, that's also with yourself. Think about that for a second. You have communications with yourself and being there and being comfortable is being there and being comfortable with your own abilities, and that's a social situation. It's flow zero. You do yourself and the Scientology flows. And if you can do that, you'll find that things go much smoother because you are your own captain, you are your own master of your fate and you yourself, your soul, your fate. You are you. You are a fate and you don't own one. That's all you've got to do is just be in strong interest about things and be able to accept communication from others and from yourself and from your own abilities. That's how you got in this situation in the first place. You didn't want to confront that. You were an able, being Plain and simple. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yes, and please don't go around owning Thetans.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, don't go around. Never ends well, never. So for Arthur and Quentin and myself, we hope you've enjoyed this podcast and it gets you to not think. We don't want you to think about this podcast. We want you to know about you. You to think about this podcast. We want you to know about you. Take it that way and listen to it again. If you have to, just know, don't think, just know and you've got it. Namaste and we love you, thank you. Thanks for watching.