Naima Simone, Church Girl and there was so much to talk about we didn't get to a drink....

There are a few things that make an author a favorite. And what makes Naima Simone a favorite of mine - is she always understands the assignment. This is a writer who gets romance. She knows how to pay off the tropes, how to create fully alive characters and most importantly, keep the pages turning.  I've read a lot of Naima's books but nothing prepared me for Church Girl.  It's hot. Like...real hot. It has an important conversation within itself about what is holy and what is profane. It's imbedded in rich deep culture. AND she had a few surprises up her sleeve. If you love romance with serious spice that doesn't back down from big issues this is ABSOLUTELY the book for you.

She’s a preacher’s daughter, a runaway bride and now the (not quite) qualified nanny for a sexy tattoo artist with a beautiful daughter—and a dirty mouth.

What’s a bad boy to do with a woman like her?

Everything…

Aaliyah Montgomery isn’t just ditching her wedding. She’s also fleeing her suffocating small town and her family’s expectations. She’s got plans—for college, for finding herself. But landing a job in Chicago that fits her schedule isn’t easy. Good thing Von Howard is desperate to find a live-in nanny. Bad thing that he’s a gritty, grumpy, gorgeous tattoo artist carrying as much baggage as he has ink.

Von’s new hire is inexperienced and a fire hazard in the kitchen. She’s also all thick curls, thicker curves, and a distracting mix of innocence and sensuality. After the upheaval of a divorce, he just needs a nanny, not a sneaky link. Meanwhile, Aaliyah is bonding with his seven-year-old and showing an unexpected flair for tattoo art. Who could resist?

Yet deep down, Aaliyah’s still running—from her feelings and her fear of losing herself to someone else’s expectations again. Even as their pasts return to haunt them, their undeniable heat says maybe it’s time to stand and fight for a love they didn’t see coming.

Buy the book here:  https://naimasimone.com/

Find Naima here: https://www.instagram.com/naimasimoneauthor/

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Transcript

Molly Fader (00:00):

I might've been, oh, ah, shoot. Naima is here. You know, we're going to be laughing if Naima is here. Hi everybody. Welcome to Day With Authors, the podcast series where I pick a book, the author picks a drink, and we discuss both. My guest today is one of my absolute favourites, Naima Simone. She's here to talk about church girl, which is getting all kinds of accolades. And in fact, this is usually a little section where I talk about what I love about the book and why I picked it, but instead, let's just read what the New York Times had to say about it, Naima Simone (00:44):

Some blazing on my mind. So just go right ahead. Molly Fader (00:48):

Do you have this tattooed on your body yet? Next Tuesday?
(00:55)
Well, I'll read it and then I'll tell you the part that I feel like you should get tattooed on your body. Okay. Okay. I think I know. Go ahead. With such intense archetypes, what keeps the book purine along is a powerful, distinct narrative voice. Vaughn and Aaliyah and Simone's hands have a combustive and irresistible chemistry. Aaliyah's not inexperienced, a welcome choice, but nothing in her previous life has made her feel desired, treasured, pleasured, or defended. The sexual arc is less about losing her innocence and more about accepting her whole self desires and all it's positively filthy and gloriously filth positive. Naima Simone (01:36):

I was like, should I make that my tagline? Molly Fader (01:39):

Gloriously filth, Naima Simone (01:41):

Positive, glorious. It's filthy and filth, like gloriously filth positive. I'm like, you can't get better than Molly Fader (01:51):

That. No. The only thing that you can't get better than that, and it was in the New York Times. Okay, Naima Simone (01:58):

Take it back. It can get better than that. Molly Fader (02:00):

Yeah. I mean, it's one thing if you like, your friend says that, but that's the New York Times, Naima Simone (02:06):

Right? Right. It's like when your friend says, it's like, yeah, but you like me and you don't want to hurt my feelings. But the New York Times, Molly Fader (02:14):

New York Times doesn't care. Okay. I'm going to read the back cover copy because my mom likes it, but Mom, maybe skip this one. Yeah. I mean, my mom is a, she'll read a romance, but mom, this is gloriously Phil, right? She's a preacher's daughter, a runaway bride, and the not quite qualified nanny for a sexy tattoo artist with a beautiful daughter and a dirty mouth. What's a bad boy to do with a woman like her? Everything. Aaliyah Montgomery isn't just ditching her wedding. She's also fleeing her suffocating small town or her family's expectations. She's got plans for college for finding herself, but landing a job in Chicago that fits her schedule isn't easy. Good thing Vaughn Howard is desperate to find a live-in nanny. Bad thing is that he's gritty, grumpy, gorgeous tattoo artist carrying as much baggage as he has ink. Vaughn's new hire is inexperienced. Oh my gosh. We were just talking about how we need more glasses.
(03:15)
I can't see the type on my computer with these glass. This is crazy. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. That was so unprofessional to me. Vaughn's new hire is inexperienced and a fire hazard in the kitchen. She's also all thick girls, thicker curves and a distracting mix of innocence and sensuality after the upheaval of a divorce. He just needs a nanny, not a sneaky link. Meanwhile, Aaliyah is bonding with his 7-year-old and showing an unexpected flare for tattoo art who could resist yet deep down, Aaliyah's still running from her feelings and her fear of losing herself to someone else's expectations. Again, even as their past returned to haunt them, their undeniable heat says maybe it's time to stand and fight for a love they don't see coming from showing up to glowing up the characters in. And this is the part about, I didn't even realise this was a Harlequin book. Naima Simone (04:06):

I know, because number one, the cover and Oh, since I just happened to have it sitting Molly Fader (04:13):

Around, that cover is spectacular. Naima Simone (04:16):

Hands down. I've had some really great covers, but this is my top three. It's in my top three, Molly Fader (04:22):

Definitely. Yeah. And it is all about the juxtaposition of his face, his beautiful sharp features against that glass. Naima Simone (04:31):

Yeah, Molly Fader (04:33):

They did all right by you. Naima Simone (04:34):

They really did. When I first saw the drawing, because number one, I was a little scared, right? I was a little scared because What were you scared about? I mean, I've had some really wonderful, just the general in fear of, but then I've had some, I'm like sequined dress on a motorcycle with a purse. But this line took the place of desire. Yeah, a books took the place of desire, but it's not category. It's a thicker book. It's like bigger word count. If you want to take the heat level to the sky, you can. That's what they told. Sky's the limit. Make it as hot as you want to. And they didn't want millionaires. They wanted just down to earth, relatable people. It is just as different from desires you can get. But so I was a little worried about the covers, even though the covers I'd seen of other books were good. But when I saw this drawing, first of all, when they told me it was going to be illustrated, I was happy. That means that the representation will probably be spot on, but Molly Fader (05:51):

I wasn't. You have to deal with that terrible stock art. Naima Simone (05:54):

Yes. And them not looking anything like you described in the book. So that made me happy. But then when I saw the drawing and then the final cover, I was just so glad because representation matters, of course, like I said, so I was glad they're both black, but the details they got that really captured the spirit and soul of this book in the culture. I mean everything from the stained glass window that says church to his stitch braids to how soft she looks and juxtaposition to him and that embrace, they nailed it. And even a church girl title looks like a tattoo. A Molly Fader (06:38):

Tattoo. Naima Simone (06:39):

They really, really did it. Molly Fader (06:42):

His braids feeds into something. There's a lot of cartoon covers, a lot of illustrated covers, and a friend of mine says some of them, there's no soul behind their eyes. And sometimes you get one that has a soul behind their eyes and he has. There was a lot of love that went into the drawing of that character and well, I'm really glad that it happened to you. Glad. Let's talk about this New York Times, and you're also an Amazon editor's pick, which if the New York Times doesn't always move a needle, the editor's pick on Amazon will often move a needle. So you've got two amazing accolades. Can you feel the ground? No, Naima Simone (07:29):

Actually no. I am currently talking to you from cloud 17. They didn't want to give me wings. Let's not get crazy because I ain't earn them. I was gloriously filthy. I didn't earn no wings. But yeah, I'm up there. Molly Fader (07:50):

Let's talk about the gloriously filthy of it all. No, wait. Actually, another thing, one of the things that I sort of love imagining is one of these, when these things happen to authors that I know, and you are a woman who has been very busy, you are often on deadline, you have a busy house, and I'm just imagining you walking into your living room. Maybe you haven't showered in three days. You walk in to tell your family who are all watching a Marvel movie yet again or something. It's just a normal day and you're like, I'm in the New York Times. Naima Simone (08:30):

Oh yeah. Did they lose their minds for you?
(08:33)
Oh, oh my gosh. It was Sunday when I saw my, and my editor and I do not communicate on Sunday, like no, Monday through Friday, but she emailed me Sunday and told me that it was in the New York Times. It was an amazing review in the New York Times. And I was like, what? On a Sunday? The name of the book is Church Girl. I'm like, and it's through your times. Okay, how do you get more relevant than, so when I read it and I was just floored, Olivia Waite, who is an author I really respect and love, and for her to just write it was such a wonderful writeup because yes, it is filthy. He said he's a dirty talker. But the other thing she caught about it, how sex positive it is and how it's more about her claiming her voice in her path and her independence so that she caught that too. It was a wonderful review. It was great. Molly Fader (09:39):

It really was. And the filth positive of it. When I was reading this book, and I've read, I haven't read everything, but I've read a lot, and you had said something before we started to record about how this book was different. Naima Simone (09:54):

And Molly Fader (09:54):

I want you to tell me in all of the ways, because as a person who's read a lot of your work, it felt different. It felt like, and I know that this is often the most effortless seeming books are often the ones that you work the hardest at, but these two characters felt fully formed. The second they walked onto the page, they were a gift. You just woke up and you're like, oh, I got these guys. I know what I'm doing. So talk about how this book was different. Naima Simone (10:24):

It was different for me because number one, a new line, and I think even from the pitch part, it was different because I had sent in a different pitch like a laptop, what I did, and they were like, no, no, we don't want that. I mean, we like the nanny because that did have a nanny, but we don't like the rest of it. And I was like, oh, okay. Alright. So when I went back to rewrite it, I was like, well, I really don't know what they want, so I'm about to write what I like. And usually because a synopsis or I call it the long, the short synopsis is in third person, but I wrote mine, the first person. Perfect. I captured how their voices would be to me, and I just threw everything that I love in a book and in a story in it.
(11:20)
And I'm like, here, I don't know if you're going to like it, but here it is what it is. And they loved it. They loved it. So right then and there, it was different, but the story was different because number one, I've been reading a tonne for the past two years. I've been reading a tonne of urban fiction romance, and to me it is cutting edge to me. It is edgy, it is fearless, it's totally sexy. The characters just jump off the page. I mean, the women that write these books know what they're doing. So me, they have captured what we call dark romance. They have captured it and elevated it just because of the setting, the culture, the characters. It's wonderful. That's why I've been in this rabbit hole of it for two years, but I have never written a book like that. So when this new line and they told me I could take the limits off and write what I wanted with the heat level that I wanted, I wrote the hero and the story that I was reading, and it's so incredibly different for me. Everything from the dialogue, what people call African-American vernacular English, but everything from that to the characters themselves. It's like I took to me, I read a review that said I took the culture and put it right on the page, and that made me feel so good because that's what I felt like I was doing when I wrote it. I just embraced black culture. I did it and I put it on the page. And I also put experience from being a pastor's kid and being in the church.
(13:05)
And with that, I know a lot of people don't like religion or that on the page. I know they don't, but I did it. It's not, Molly Fader (13:16):

I'm a person who doesn't often like religion on the page, but when you give me some conversation and some conflict about religion and then some strip club scenes, yes, Naima Simone (13:29):

Like said, honoured our mother and father. I don't think she meant in strip clubs. No. Molly Fader (13:35):

I was like, how are you threading both of these needles? I mean, I do enjoy, I mean, the arc of her finding herself and being a very dutiful daughter and preacher's kid, and then shedding all of that and falling in with a guy who is the opposite. Yes, you're threading all of those needles with her coming to terms with does this make the strip glove of it all make me a bad person? All of those questions. So Naima Simone (14:08):

It's like, oh, I'm enjoying it too. So it's like she's constantly shedding layers and in him, he's constantly evolving from this bitter divorced man with secrets about that divorce into this person who's more vulnerable and loving because he can't help be with her.
(14:32)
And so you said it was like effortless reading. This was one of the books, and I haven't been shy about telling people that writing for the past, I think three years has been a little difficult for me because it started when my mom passed and just getting back into my love for it, writing has been a little bit difficult, but this book and the book before it, the hockey book, it flowed, it flowed so wonderfully that I was writing 9,000 words a day. What? Yes, skip. Now I don't do that. I'm like, if I get 2k, I'm like, it just flowed. I had so much fun writing it. And another worry when I first started writing it was, but I didn't, with me, I might have in the past, I might've let it help me up, but this time I was like, it's so much culture on the page from the language to the people to the setting to the issues. I didn't know if everybody will be able to relate to it. But I didn't let that concern stop me from writing a book that I wanted to write. And the pleasant, really pleasant, surprising thing about the reviews I've been getting, it's from all across the board. It's from, I even got a review from a lady in Australia who said she loved it and could relate to it even though she did have to google some of the things. But Molly Fader (16:12):

I mean, the vernacular you really went for, it's like I did and I found it. It's why anybody would read historical fiction or something like that. You just create this Naima Simone (16:26):

World. Molly Fader (16:28):

These people are living in their complete world. It was super effective to me. Naima Simone (16:32):

Yeah, I had fun. I really did. It felt like a conversation between me and my friends. That's how it was writing it. I didn't have to worry about sentence structure or anything like that. It was so natural. It flowed. And I'm excited about it. I know everybody doesn't love it, and that's okay because I know everybody cannot get maybe past the dialogue, but that's okay because more than enough people have, and that makes me feel so wonderful as a writer and a reader. Yeah, Molly Fader (17:07):

I mean all you want is the truest form of your stuff to be read by as many people as that's all you want. Naima Simone (17:15):

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Molly Fader (17:16):

I am so sorry to hear that. It's been hard for the last three years and I think that's something that a lot of writers go through. I mean, I'm deeply sorry about your mom. Thank you. But you were also, your deadlines, your schedule for many years was bonkers. Bonkers. It still is. I'm Naima Simone (17:43):

Down one. You learned nothing. I think in 25 I'm slowing down. Okay. Molly Fader (17:50):

What does that mean? What does slowing down in your world mean? Naima Simone (17:53):

I think I am only writing four books. Molly Fader (17:56):

Oh, okay. That is slower for you. Naima Simone (17:58):

Yeah, four and a half maybe. I might have a novela in there, so maybe. I think I'm only writing four and a half books, so that's slow for me. And I'm not going to lie, I'm looking forward to it because like you said, it's been for the last five or six years, it's been book after book, after Molly Fader (18:15):

Even grinding. Naima Simone (18:17):

But even right now, I'm staring down the deadline next week. Molly Fader (18:23):

Christmas. Christmas, Christmas. One of the things that I wanted to ask you about, again, this book had so many perfectly threaded needles, and I was wondering if you find when you're writing, what makes it easier to write is knowing the characters as well as you do, or if it's the tropes that you've picked. Because I have to say the tropes in this book, some books, they feel like a Christmas tree where they're just like, oh, and age gap. Oh, they're just tacking these things on. And I mean, I'm guilty of doing that even more often than not, but this felt so deeply, clearly thought out. You had to hit all the beats for a nanny romance. You had to hit all the beats for a single dad. You had to bad boy. Good girl. Did that help you or is it always just knowing the characters as well as you do Naima Simone (19:19):

For this? It was both. When I was writing that short synopsis, and I mean it was maybe like five paragraphs. That's what I mean by short synopsis. So it was really a long blurb. The story, it really started with the characters. I knew who I wanted the characters to be. They were so opposite, but so perfect for each other. And from knowing the characters, it's like the tropes just fit. And the more I started writing from her voice, I wrote her voice first. And the more I started writing, the tropes just fell into place. And then when I started writing from his point of view, again, just fell into place. So this time, because usually when I write, I start with my characters and then the tropes from their background and their backstory and their current issues fall in the line for me. But this, it was like both of them, it was together, they together. And then as I was writing the book, it's certain things like I was halfway through and I was like, oh, I want this to happen. And so I went back and I threaded that thing in. It was just great writing the book. It was fun. It was fun. Molly Fader (20:35):

I mean, those books are just hard work, but it was Naima Simone (20:36):

Fun. Molly Fader (20:38):

I mean, it's always hard work. Absolutely. I mean, that's the job you signed up for, right? It's hard work, but it's always hard work. But some books sometimes than us, Naima Simone (20:51):

I can't even express how it just flowed and how I was happy when the end, I was just happy. I was nervous what my editor was going to say. Molly Fader (21:02):

Yeah, that's fair. How was the editorial process with this? I mean, obviously they didn't want you to pull any punches on the heat or on your characters on the world that you were building. How was the editorial process? Naima Simone (21:16):

It was great. I've been working with my editor ever since I joined Harlequin. So we're talking 2018 or 19, I think, 2018 I think. So we know each other. But again, I don't think she was expecting this book from me. But she did not try to change my voice at all. She didn't try to change my characters. She loved the book. She really did. She loved the characters, she loved the humour in it, the heat in it. The only problem she had with it was finding a way to cut five or 6,000 words because I was over the word limit. I was real over the word limit. Even with this being a bigger book than desire, I was still over the word limit because I was flowing. Molly Fader (22:08):

But Naima Simone (22:09):

She's so wonderful at her job, she took, she was able to take 6,000 words from it, but it didn't feel like a different book to me. It was still good. Molly Fader (22:19):

One of the things after reading this book that I was really curious about, and again, I haven't read everything, but I've read quite a bit. And what is your approach in different books with the heat level? Because I guess my question is, do the books themselves have their own heat level that you're just like, oh, okay, these characters are hotter than other characters. Or do you go in sort of like, I know what the sex scenes of these books are going to look like? Or does it always surprise you or does it sometimes just not show up? And I guess this one is not going to be, I mean, how does it work for you? Because like you said, you are on a schedule of romance writing that is not forgiving. Naima Simone (23:07):

No, it's not. Even though I asked for it often. I mean, Molly Fader (23:13):

You did this to yourself. Naima Simone (23:15):

I did. I did. I can't complain. I did, even though I do complain, but I can't. It's not right. No, I know, I know. But for me, the characters determine the heat level they do. Now, for me, of the writer I am, I love heat. So whatever book you're going to get from me is going to have heat. I think the only book I wrote that didn't have the really high heat level that I usually have is maybe the fourth book in the Rose series. I think that's the only one. And for me it's because the story called for it. But usually I love, I want the door thrown wide open. I want all the curse words. I want all the positions. Molly Fader (24:00):

Well, it's sort of the character's growth in a lot of your books. Naima Simone (24:03):

And that's how I write sex. And that's why I say the characters determine the heat level or what all goes into the sex scene. Because to me, every character needs something that the character in the last book might not have needed for her. She needed to be liberated to feel like sex wasn't part of a dirty word. You know what I mean? Or not sinful. That's what she needed. And sex for him. He needed vulnerability, he needed intimacy. So that's what determined their sex scenes. So it's always the story. It's always the characters that Molly Fader (24:48):

Are you able to know that the way that you just sort of verbalised that was so smart and it's like you had written it down before you even started writing? Or do you do that for every book? That seems like a superpower to me. Naima Simone (25:02):

Yeah, I do. Maybe I write, God dammit, I wanted you to say no. I just came up with, I'm pretty in tune with that part. And the funny thing is sex scenes are some of the hardest scenes for me to write. They really are. Because so much goes into it. It's not just if his mouth's filthy or how many positions you can twist him in. It's the emotion, it's plot, it's what do they need, but also what the reader needs. It's so much that goes into it. For me, it's harder for me to write those sex Molly Fader (25:43):

Scenes. It really is. I feel like it's part of what, in all the ways that romance gets laughed at when you're reading, when you're reading an author who understands what those sex scenes should be, and in that author's hands, those sex scenes are transcend. Yeah, just titillation. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. You realise how impressive this genre is, and I guess what you're saying to me is that I should put a little bit more thought into, Naima Simone (26:18):

I did not say that. I think you're saying getting your shit together, Molly, I love your sex. They're always hot and intimate and just sometimes they're fun, sometimes they're so emotional that I could just feel it pouring out of you. Nailed it. I dunno what you're talking about. Molly Fader (26:38):

I just feel like my guess, my question is leading. I mostly just to talk about how hard it can be to write those scenes and to do them well. When you're under the deadlines that you're, what do you do if it's the day that you're writing those scenes and it doesn't show up, do you skip and then go back to you, yada, yada, yada. Naima Simone (27:01):

I can't tell you how many times I put insert sex scene here and continue on, especially when I'm on a deadline, because even though they're the hardest for me to write, they're the easiest. I guess this isn't going to sound right, but they're the ones that form easiest in my mind. So going back and writing them, it's the actual writing part and writing all the threads that need to go into it, that's hard for me. But knowing what that sex scene has to be and has to accomplish is not hard for me. So I can skip and then come back because it not going to be, it's not gratuitous, but I know the story so well. I know what needs to be accomplished in that scene. Molly Fader (27:44):

Do you write an order or do you skip around? In general, Naima Simone (27:48):

I'm such a linear writer and I've tried writing out of order before and I end up having to go back and edit it. So I'm chronological. Yeah. Molly Fader (28:00):

And then are you able to write more than one project at a time? Naima Simone (28:03):

No. And I've tried it and I've tried it, but it just doesn't work for Molly Fader (28:08):

Me. Yeah, yeah. You feel like I want all my brain power to go to what I'm supposed to be working on.
(28:18)
So the other thing that I want to talk about in this book, and I know we're coming up on our time, but whatever. I want to talk about Vaughn. I loved him. I mean, yes, he's extremely hot ands. He's a really compelling male character. But one of the things that I and a great dad, the dad of it all is really good. But the thing that I loved, there's this plot line with him and his ex-wife, and there's a lot of secrets that are involved in it and a lot of super hurt feelings and big emotions. He was petty and he was mean, and she was too. They were people who had hurt each other who couldn't stop hurting each other. And it felt almost uncomfortable to read because it felt so realistic. Anybody who's not just gone through something awful like that but has witnessed a loved one go through it. It was almost a little too close to the bone then. And this is not a spoiler, the way that you resolved it, you could have made the ex-wife a two-dimensional bad guy, but you decided to make them both be grown ass adults and get their shit together. I thought it was really, really beautiful how they both had to come to this moment, talk about that plot line. Naima Simone (29:53):

I think because my parents broke up when I was younger, and I remember how that made me feel. And it affects children, but it affects them in so many ways. And there were hard feelings. There were hurt feelings, and it was a few years before they could. Now, when my mother was alive, like years, they were best friends for years after that hurt part. They came past that. They were very good friends. But I remember how it felt when they first broke up. I remember their relationship and I remember how it felt when they became friends. But one thing I can say about my parents, and that's kind of what I wanted to capture here, is that even though my parents were separated, my sister and I never felt like we came from a broken home. There was no single mother or single father when it came to us. They were always on the same page, even when they weren't on the same page relationship wise. When it came to us, they put aside all that and we're the best parents for us. But I wanted to put that kind of on the page. Now with Vaughn and his ex. They were not friends At the end of it, they just said, we're going to be the best we can be. So our child does not feel like we hate each other, or they feel like they have to kind of be the mediator between us because we're the adults here. So that's kind what they came to. So that differed from my parents, but I wanted to show that they could put loving their child before hating each other
(31:42)
And show the progression of that. Because like you said, in the beginning, it was not like that. They were still very much it. I hate you stage. Molly Fader (31:53):

There's a lot of really beautiful sort of emotional moments in the book. But the scene where his daughter says to Aaliyah, I hate it when my parents fight. Why do they fight? Naima Simone (32:04):

Yeah. Why do they hate each other? Molly Fader (32:07):

Yeah. Naima Simone (32:07):

Well, Molly Fader (32:09):

It was so good Naima Simone (32:10):

Because kids are so intuitive and they're so sensitive, and even if Vaughn wouldn't say negative things about his ex in front of her, but she would to other people though, and she heard it, their daughter overheard it. But kids are so sensitive that they still can pick up on those emotions. So even if you're not arguing in front of them, they can still feel that dislike for each other and they internalise it. So that's what she was doing. And when Aaliyah told Vaughn this was going on, that was one of the things he was like, because for him, his number one goal was being the best father he could and to know that his daughter was hurting hurt him. Molly Fader (32:58):

And you could see it in the scenes between them. She could push his buttons and he'd jump a little. He'd get right up in there and he wouldn't. Anyway, that was a really exciting and surprising handling of that really situation. It could have been. She could have been two dimensional, for sure. Yeah. So when I was looking to, I read some Good reads reviews, and I read Amazon stuff. I go to Good Reads, so you don't have to. Yeah, thank you. Because we all know that's where the writer's soul goes to die. And I feel a little bit bad about reading this. What is a very positive review? Oh my God. But when did you start writing? You sell your first book 2000 Naima Simone (33:48):

2009. Well, my first book was published in 2009. I sold in the 2008. Molly Fader (33:57):

I mean, you're coming up on 20 years, 15 years. I mean, that's tremendous. Are you able to look back and go, wow, I've come a long way? Naima Simone (34:09):

Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Some of my books, I'm like, listen, don't read that one, because I'm much better now. Yeah, Molly Fader (34:18):

I mean, we all have a couple of those, but they weirdly stick around forever. People are always finding new Naima Simone (34:24):

Whatcha doing? Is this a research project? Molly Fader (34:29):

Well, it's people going back, right? I mean, I would imagine that anybody reading church Girl is going to go back and read a bunch. So anyway, I found this review that I love so much, and it says, I've been reading name of Simone books since I could sneak out and read them in middle school. Oh, are you serious? Sorry. Sorry. Naima Simone (34:57):

I'm so sorry. I'm totally flat. I want to go get a, I'm wearing Progressive Lenses, so now I feel Molly Fader (35:10):

So much open. No, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. But the positive part about that review, you remember when you were reading romance novels, you remember when you were in middle school, a 20 year career of bangers. It's not an easy thing to do, and I'm so thrilled for that reviewer who gets to read those books. Your voice and your skill and your characters have aged with her. Have grown with her. I mean, it's hilarious, but Naima Simone (35:48):

I just, I'm glad you said that because I was still hung up on middle school, but the way you said it, I'm like, oh, I feel so much better now. Yes, Molly Fader (35:56):

You should. It's an Naima Simone (35:57):

Amazing compliment. She could have said just years, not just middle school. I'm just playing. That makes me feel really great because I started reading Romance when I was in middle school. I snuck my mother's books because she used to work third shift, and my sister and I would wait until she left and go in her drawer and get all the books and read them and then put 'em back very carefully before she came home. And I was reading Joanna Lindsey, Sandra Brown, Nora Roberts Birds, all the books I probably should not have been. But the thing is, all those author Julie Garwood, all those authors that I've read, then I still read now. Oh, good. I go back and read all my Julie Garwood book, Julie Garwood books, because they're timeless to me. But those authors that I read in middle school, I still read now. So that's like a very amazing compliment. Molly Fader (37:02):

You're on a very important keeper shelf. You really are. You are. Well, you're on My keeper shelf for sure. You're all mine as well. And everybody out there, if you haven't picked up Church Girl yet, you really need to to not just for the cover, but the nuance portrayal of all the things. It is definitely by far my favourite book of yours. You really knocked it out of the park. That means a tonne. Thank you. And thank you for coming and making my day. We've been sick for two weeks. You're a ray of sunshine as you always are. Naima Simone (37:40):

I always have fun talking to you, so thank you for having me. Molly Fader (37:43):

My pleasure. Everybody out there pick up church girl, read a book. Stay safe. Thanks everybody.