Lauren Evans, Casket Case and the second cheapest red wine at the store...

The premise of this book made me gasp. Made me read far into the night. Nora is dating Garrett. Garrett works for death. Clever, right? But there's more... Garrett is middle-management for death. There's a company structure and he's working his way up the ladder. This, of course, is totally a secret.  He says his job is logistics and that makes sense. 

Nora is grieving the loss of her family while taking on the family business A Casket Store. Yep. In small town Alabama.  So, it's quirky. It's romantic. It's got a third act love triangle.  But it's also a quiet book about grief. And what happens when we die. 

Did I mention quirky? Grab the second cheapest bottle of wine in your cupboard (because Nora is sad, but she's not THAT sad) and listen to a fantastic conversation about rewriting a book, finding an agent, the ideas that keep you up at night and building a business model for death. 

Nora thought she was finished with Rabbittown, Alabama, for good. But an unexpected tragedy turned her life upside down, and she’s found herself back in her tiny hometown running the family casket business.

There aren’t exactly a lot of prospects for a single woman in her thirties in a place like Rabbittown. Until Nora Clanton’s ordinary, casket-selling day is interrupted by a handsome stranger wandering into her shop and asking for directions—as well as a date.

Garrett Bishop seems like the ideal guy. He’s thoughtful, he’s kind, and he has a lucrative job as a logistics coordinator, for which he seems to have a passion. She’s not totally sure what “logistics” entails, but she knows it means long hours, lots of travel, and urgent calls in the middle of the night.

When a few of Rabbittown’s residents suddenly pass away—a heart attack here, a car crash there—and Garrett is spotted at the scenes of, well, all of the deaths, his frustratingly vague job description starts to become increasingly . . . suspicious. What is it that Garrett actually does for a living?

He’s a logistics coordinator for Death.

When Nora discovers the truth, she is unable to reconcile the wonderful man she knows with the unthinkably cruel job he loves. Will she ever be able to understand how he can do what he does, or will she have to lay her best chance at love to rest?

Casket Case is the heartfelt story of a small-town girl who feels surrounded by death—literally and figuratively. This clever, endearing, and romantic debut explores how love and loss are forever intertwined . . . but death might not be as scary as it seems.

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Transcript

Molly Fader (00:02):

Molly Fader (00:30):

Hello everybody. Welcome to Day Drinking with Authors, the podcast series where I pick a book, the author picks a drink, and we discuss both. Today I'm really excited to welcome debut author Lauren Evans to talk about her constantly surprising. You can't even really call it a rom-com. It was never what I expected. It was like this nuanced and sad exploration of grief, a story about a woman returning to the small town she grew up in. That really resonated with me because I grew up in a small town and for a second at the end, it was a really highly convincing love triangle that I didn't quite know who I was recruiting for. And in all of that package, it's a story about a woman who falls in love with a man who works for death, which is exactly as compelling as you think it is. I'm going to read the back cover copy for my mom.
(01:29)
Nora thought she was finished with Rabbit Town, Alabama for good, but an unexpected tragedy turned her life upside down, and she's found herself back in her tiny hometown running the family casket business. There aren't exactly a lot of prospects for a single woman in her thirties in a place like Rabbit Town until Nora Clan's ordinary casket selling day is interrupted by a handsome stranger wandering into her shop and asking for directions as well as a date. Garrett Bishop seems like the ideal guy. He's thoughtful. He's kind, and he has a lucrative job as a logistics coordinator for which he seems to have a passion. She's not totally sure what logistics entails, but she knows it means long hours, lots of travel and urgent calls in the middle of the night when a few of rabbit town's residents suddenly pass away a heart attack Here, a car crash there, and Garrett is spotted at the scenes of, well, all of the deaths.
(02:18)
His frustratingly vague job description starts to become increasingly suspicious. What is it that Garrett actually does for a living? He's a logistics coordinator for death. When Nora discovers the truth, she's unable to reconcile the wonderful man she knows with the Unthinkably cruel job he loves. Will she ever be able to understand how he can do what he does or will she have to lay her best chance at Love to Rest? Casket case is the heartfelt story of a small town girl who feels surrounded by death, literally and figuratively. This clever, endearing and romantic debut explores how love and loss are forever intertwined, but death might not be as scary as it seems. And that is a totally accurate description of the book, but at the same time, there was so much going on in this book, Lauren, there really was. Thank you so much for joining me to talk about this book. This is going to be one of those interviews where I just sort of say fan girly things, and I'm going to ask you to formulate them into questions and then answer. Lauren Evans (03:25):

Are you ready for that? I'm excited to be here. Molly Fader (03:27):

Great. So Lauren, tell us what we're drinking today. Lauren Evans (03:30):

Oh, we are drinking the second least expensive red wine from the grocery store, as Nora does very often in casket case. Molly Fader (03:38):

Yeah, the second least expensive. It's such a relatable thing and a very Lauren thing. Who wants to, Lauren was such an interesting character to me. First of all, let's talk about the idea that the returning back to Rabbit Town. Is Rabbit Town a real place? Lauren Evans (04:00):

Yeah, actually it's not real in the way that I wrote it. It's basically a blinking light. There's a general store. I just borrowed the name and kind of created my own town. But yes, rabbit Town is close to where I grew up, so I went to high school maybe five minutes from there, Molly Fader (04:19):

And it was the perfect thing for a girl who never thought she'd be coming back to her hometown, had dreams elsewhere, but her beloved parents had died, and she comes back to sort of run this family casket business, which is, I'm from a really small town where there were two funeral homes, but we didn't have a casket business that was so specific and heartbreaking at the same time. How did you settle on casket store? Lauren Evans (04:56):

Well, it actually started with a woman falling in love with somebody who works for death, and I had to find what kind of person would even entertain it or who is somebody who, if someone says they work for death, she's willing to listen to questions or listen to the answers to the questions instead of running away immediately. Most of us would. So I actually saw, there is, I think it's called Magic City Casket Company in Birmingham, Alabama, and I just drove past it when I was writing the book, and I was like, what? And I just thought to myself, oh, that sounds really cool. And then I was like, actually, that is somebody who would work or would talk to someone working for death. So yeah, so Nora just became, I thought, who would run something like that? And I'm like, oh, it's probably a family business. And then it just spun out from there. Molly Fader (05:54):

It had real six feet under energy at some points too about it. So the idea of a woman falling in love with a guy who works for death, that's an idea that wakes you up in the middle of the night and goes, you go, oh, that's a book. Lauren Evans (06:11):

Yeah, it started as a joke about my own love life. Oh Lord. Yeah. At the time I was making some questionable choices, and a friend had asked me something about, are you seeing someone this weekend? And I was like, well, the angel of death, I hope I can't keep doing this. And then I was like, wait, is that something? That might be something. So yeah, that's honestly where it started, and that was maybe two or three years before I even started writing it. It just kind of stayed in my head until I started it. Molly Fader (06:43):

I mean, one of the things that I really liked about it, I mean I liked so much about it, but was the angel of death. And you do sort of talk about religion once they sort of have a conversation about who he is and what he does. But his angel of deafness is actually just sort of couched in middle management. It's a big company. Talk about coming up with that world with that idea. Lauren Evans (07:10):

Yeah, I think so. Dating the Angel of Death could have been a very interesting fantasy type book. The first image I remember having of it is sort of the grim reaper at your door, and that isn't really what I write. So I kept thinking of, well, what could it mean to work for death? What that is sort of the same vein as Santa Claus, where it happens everywhere all at once. How would that work? So it would have to be a huge company. It'd have to be, all these people would have to be in the know. And so it just sort of started forming from there. I think it was also during all the supply chain issues that we were having. And I was like, what does that even mean? What does logistics even, what are we talking about? I do Lauren Evans (07:55):

Love that in the book. They're like, what do you do? And he's logistics and everyone's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, logistics. Lauren Evans (08:02):

That is a thing way of just making fun of that, I guess. Making fun of, I mean, I've watched the Office and Parks and Rec and all those sort of workplace comedies too, so I think that's probably in there also. Molly Fader (08:13):

Yeah, once it sort of comes out and they have this conversation and I feel like one of the things that really, she's upset and she's confused and she has very specific feelings about death having just lost her parents, but one of the things that stops her and attracts is how benign it is. Well, who's your boss? And where's your boss? And where are you? One of the minor conflicts between them is he will eventually work his way up and move up to the next ladder, and the next ladder is in North Dakota. It's so benign that you can see her getting lost in that sort of thing. And I wondered, as you were writing it, did you get lost in it? Was it kind of a hard thing to, did you have to build a giant world and then just sort of piece it in little bits by bits? Lauren Evans (09:11):

Yeah, basically. I mean, I kept thinking this would just be so huge, this whole idea of a corporation that big. And also it would have to somehow be from the beginning of time as we're moving forward, maybe in getting more industrialised and stuff, it would change. So I definitely had those thoughts of, okay, I need to start where I think it would've started maybe, and kind of in my head, go through all of this, I dunno, getting to where it could be today. It was very big. I tried to just keep it to the people we were talking about. Of course, him and his boss, and he really doesn't know much above that, and you would assume there's a board of directors or something, but Molly Fader (10:04):

I think there is that line. She's like, well, who is the board of directors? He is like, who do you think it is? And I was like, who do we think? But again, it's so weird. It was such a smart decision to make it mundane, to make it this. Everybody knows this guy. Everybody knows a guy in charge of a logistics and nobody really knows what he does, but he shows up, he's a good time at the party, and the dates were romantic and you could feel them really falling for each other. And he was clearly kind of healing something that was happening with her. Talk about a little bit about how you had to create, how you created Nora because she was a great lead character. So how did she sort of come together? Was she fully formed or you've been working on this book for a while or thinking about it for a while? Lauren Evans (10:58):

Yeah, she wasn't fully formed. I actually wrote the first draught of the book and first person, and it was the most depressing thing I've ever read in my life. So I went back and changed the whole thing. So for any writers out there do not do that, that literally took years. Molly Fader (11:16):

I mean, it's hard. You're writing a book about grief, it's hard to keep that light and you mission accomplished. I'd imagine that in first person. It's a lot of, Lauren Evans (11:27):

Yeah, but I will say that was helpful to build her and just running from her perspective, this is what is happening, this is how I'm feeling. And I think at the time I was also dealing with my own depression and anxiety and stuff, and I think a lot of that found its way onto the page a bit. But I think I knew her specifically as in a person who is different from me and these things that she would do, these things that she wouldn't do, beliefs she might have and stuff like that. But I think also we have natural similarities for growing up in the same place and being of similar ages at the time. And so I kind of drew off all of that. I guess Molly Fader (12:12):

As a person who suffers or lives with depression and anxiety, at some point in writing a book about grief, were you like, what the fuck have I done? Lauren Evans (12:22):

Yes, constantly actually. Yeah. I mean, it took me maybe five years to write it and then it being published, and it's been almost six months, I guess, since it came out. But it's just a lot of death. And oddly enough, writing the book was without me meaning to. It was kind of me figuring out how I feel about death and sorting through all those giant thoughts. And I think that kind has helped me be able to keep talking about it, is like, well, I kind of sorted it out. It happens every day all the time to all of us. So I kind of just have to get over it. Lauren Evans (13:08):

I mean, I loved the idea of the way that Garrett saw his job was so comforting to me, and it's exactly what you would want. This is a logistics thing. It's somebody moving from one place to another place, and there are things that need to be handled, and it's nice to have a nice guy or a nice person there to sort of help you through. But the conversations about it, when my husband's mother died, when my kids were little, and you start to have those conversations and suddenly I was like, we had not thought about it. We had not had a conversation about what are we going to say to our kids? Lauren Evans (13:54):

Oh gosh, yeah, Molly Fader (13:55):

Right. It's bedtime. And Mick, my son, his name is Mick, is suddenly like, well, where is Gemma? I mean, you're so flat footed in the moment of that conversation that I was suddenly explaining reincarnation to him. And I was like, and so I imagine the process of writing these things down creates a world that you're just comfortable with at this point that you're comforted by. Lauren Evans (14:25):

And also, as people started reading it, I would get a lot of even friends and family with very specific, I mean, pushback is a strong word, but they would be like, well, what about a car accident? Well, what about somebody who dies this way? What about suicide? What about, and I would be like, well, there's someone with them. There's someone with them. And we would kind of have the conversation. I'm like, and by the way, this is fiction. I'm making this up. Molly Fader (15:00):

I'm listening to you right now. And I'm like, no, wait, I love this. Of course, Sue. Yes. I mean, it is does create a world you really do want to believe. Lauren Evans (15:09):

Yeah, and it's also interesting. I mean, these people knew it was fiction. They know me. They're literally asking me on text messages, and it's like, I can see that you are trying to figure this out, and I don't know, but I will answer your questions in this world. That's all I can really do. But maybe you have more questions, Molly Fader (15:28):

Right? You're going to have to go talk to someone a little bit more qualified than me, a fiction author. Exactly. And this is your debut novel, and for those of you who are listening, this book actually came to me. We share the same agent. Sweet, lovely. Sophie Cud from the book group. Can you talk to us about what was the process from having the idea to getting published? Lauren Evans (15:57):

Yeah, so I worked full-time through Molly Fader (16:00):

Those five years. Lauren Evans (16:04):

So I was writing here and there as I could and maybe put it down for a couple months and come back to it just as, I mean, my job was really busy at the time, so I get, well, first I wrote it in first person, so then I had to spend two years rewriting it in third person. Molly Fader (16:22):

When you wrote it in first person and then decided to change it, was that just by virtue of you reading it and being like, oh, no. Or had you sent it out to friends to read and family to read and them being like, oh, no. Lauren Evans (16:34):

Yeah, I sent it to my friend Sarah. She's usually my first reader of everything. And I knew as soon as I hit send, I had gone back to look at it and I was like, this needs to be third person. So then when she finished reading it, I was like, this has to be third person, doesn't it? She's like, yeah, I hate to tell you that, but it kind of does. So a little of her gut feeling, I guess Molly Fader (16:56):

It is remarkable what hitting send the clarity that hitting send will give you. It's just like the confusion is over, oh, what a mistake you've made. Okay, so then you're rewriting it. Lauren Evans (17:10):

Yeah. So then I did a big rewrite, and then Garrett was sort of the last person to come to me. He was in the story, but he was just very flat. So I think adding in his chapters and stuff was kind of probably the last steps. I started querying the lovely process. Everyone loves of sending out things into the void and maybe someone will answer. And Sophie answered. So she was actually my last, I was like, I'm going to send this last query and then I'm done because I have to go write something else. This is miserable. I mean, I'd seen a tonne, and you never know. They don't get back to you. They get back to you six months later, it's just up in the air. But yeah, the last one was to Sophie, and she answered immediately and was like, I'd love to read it. So it went pretty fast from there once we met each other. Molly Fader (18:05):

That's incredible. So you had already done a fairly substantial bit of rewriting. Was there more rewriting with Sophie before it went out? Lauren Evans (18:14):

Yes. Yeah, she and I did a couple rounds. She actually is responsible for the epilogue. Every time people are like, I'm sobbing. I'm like, well, talk to my agent. That's her fault, but Molly Fader (18:28):

We're not going to give anything away. But the twist at the end of this book, Lauren Evans (18:35):

Gosh, Molly Fader (18:36):

It's a good one. It's a really good one. Lauren Evans (18:38):

That was from working with Sophie definitely. And us just talking out loud of, I mean, I don't want to spoil anything but talking out loud and talking around it, and I Molly Fader (18:49):

Had, what if, just asking what if? And just giving the moment of giving the readers that gasp moment when you've missed it, when you hit it, when you don't have it. Yes, that is accurate. Yeah, it's a great moment. A really good moment. Lauren Evans (19:12):

Yeah. So we did a quick revision and went out on submission, and that happened very quickly. Luckily also, yeah, my editor essentially wanted it immediately. So she was the second person I talked to, I guess the second editor I met with. And she really got it. And better than that, she immediately pinpointed the areas I knew were problems, the areas that I've been writing and writing and writing, and I just couldn't. And she'd be like, I think we can make this stronger. I'm like, please God, make this stronger. I would love to do that. So that's kind of how I knew she was the one to work with. Molly Fader (19:52):

So if you look back at the book, is there anything that is the same from what you originally started other than this girl's dating death, a logistics coordinator for death? Lauren Evans (20:06):

Interesting question. Yeah, I think that's pretty much the only thing. All the characters except Johnny all existed probably in the beginning. He came out of nowhere and ruined my story almost. So. Molly Fader (20:28):

Well, let's talk about the Johnny of it all. So Johnny runs a funeral home that they're kind of rivals if there's a gym, bro, he's like a funeral bro. He's just very bro about it all. He's just a dude who really, if the loved Nora and Garrett break up, Nora has a hard time understanding what Garrett does. Her feelings about death are very black and white. She hasn't come to the epiphany that this is a kind thing that Garrett is doing. And she goes to this conference with Johnny who starts to really shine in a really problematic way Lauren Evans (21:17):

As the author, A really Molly Fader (21:18):

Problematic way. Yeah. So talk about writing that and keeping the story on the rails, because there was a part of that that I was reading where I was like, she should probably be with Johnny. Lauren Evans (21:35):

Honestly, the whole, they go to a conference together, and that whole thing came about of, well, honestly, I just find conferences hilarious. I go to them for my job and they're just so silly and funny. But to me personally, so that was an opportunity for me to make fun of them in a book. But I think with Johnny, I was like, she needs somebody to talk to who's not her grandpa. She needs her age around her age to talk about this breakup or to talk about where she is. So I was like, who can she talk to? And I had kind of introduced him early on as just a rival kind of. And so I was like, oh, she can talk to him. And then immediately there's banter and flirting just coming out of me. And it was kind of like a reprieve from the serious stuff that she'd been dealing with. And then there's this funny guy who clearly likes her. I mean, the death stuff is still there. They both work in that business, but it's the way he makes fun of it and all of that. Molly Fader (22:37):

Yeah, the dark humour of it, the gallows humour that he kind, yeah. Speaker 3 (22:41):

Yeah. I mean, it just flowed out of me. I had so much fun writing it, but I text one of my friends and was like, I don't know how this book ends anymore. I don't know what she does. And I think I ended up, I mean, you kind of just have to work it out. I feel like I kind of worked it out in my head of like, okay, well what if she's with Johnny? What does this look like? And then what if she's with Garrett, what does this look like? And what would make the most sense for her? I don't know. I tried to keep it straight. No, Molly Fader (23:16):

I mean her sort of coming to grips with her grief and moving on to the next part of her life, you obviously made the right choice. The book is about falling in love with a logistics coordinator for death. It's not about falling in love with Johnny Fall. All that said, I'd kind of like to know a little bit more about Johnny. Lauren Evans (23:39):

I know he's a fun guy, and it's funny, he's kind of divisive. My parents read the book when I guess maybe it had galley copies or something, and they were like, we hate Johnny. And I was like, oh, that is strong. And my sister's like, maybe she should give him a chance. So I feel like divisive guy, but he would probably like that description. Molly Fader (24:00):

It is, I find one of the real hard spots for writers when a character comes out of the blue like that, you spend the whole book trying to make real this one character. And then here's this secondary character just fully formed all the spark, three dimensional, just irritating. Where were you when I was writing this guy? Yeah, exactly. So Lauren Evans (24:32):

Problematic. I guess that's part of the fun question mark of writing. Molly Fader (24:39):

It is. So you work full-time when and how do you get writing done? Lauren Evans (24:46):

Oh gosh, great question. Molly Fader (24:49):

I have no answer for this. Lauren Evans (24:50):

Who knows? I lately have been getting up before work and writing. That's not my go-to, but I'm kind of in hurry up mode to finish a draught at the moment. So I'm riding whenever I have a spare moment. But I would say usually I'm better at binge riding. And so I'm like, let me take a weekend. Or I do my own writer's retreat, take two nights in an Airbnb very close to where I live. And I kind of have a process at this point for knocking out a lot of riding in one go just because, I mean, I don't know. I feel like working full-time when I get home, I don't have that. I don't have the energy. A lot of where riders have that, they're like, okay, now I'm done with that. I can shift and do this. My brain doesn't do that. Molly Fader (25:40):

Right. Lauren Evans (25:42):

Yeah. I feel like I shut off at eight o'clock. So Lauren Evans (25:45):

There's no after work writing for sure. Speaker 3 (25:48):

No, Molly Fader (25:49):

And I do think there's something to be said for having all that time with the story ruminating. You're thinking all the time. It's subconscious, it's when you're walking, it's all those things. It's working so that when you do finally sit down to write binge, you can get a whole bunch of words done. Lauren Evans (26:13):

And I feel like I need that too. I think of it in my head. I don't even know if it still does this. Back in the day on YouTube when you wanted to watch a video and it would be buffering. Sometimes I feel like when I'm writing I hit that point and I need to wait and let it come to me somehow and then come back. So it is helpful that way, I guess to take some time in between so that three or four days later when I'm in the shower, I'm like, oh, that's what I should do. Molly Fader (26:38):

That's why I'm having problems because I went the wrong direction. And my instinct is always just like, today's a great example. I've got to get back to work on a book. But I woke up, we were having this interview, there's a couple of other to-do lists, but I was just like, there's this thing, there's something I can't. And my first instinct is just Molly, sit down and write. Just do the thing that you're supposed to do, but there's a reason why it's not quite right. And learning to listen to that is half the battle, I feel like. Lauren Evans (27:16):

Yeah, that's so true. Sometimes it really is just like button, see as they say. But I don't think, for me in the creative process of it, that's really not always helpful for me to just be cranking stuff out that later I'm like, this is really garbage. I need to take all of this away. Now Molly Fader (27:34):

It's supposed to be in third person. Exactly. So what are you working on? Can we ask what's happening? Is it about Johnny? Speaker 3 (27:42):

No, it is not. It is separate. I am still working on the first draught, so it's still kind of coming together. It is set in Alabama. It is another romcom, and it sort of has a similar flavour, I guess, to casket case where there's kind of just an extra element perhaps that may or may not exist in the world. So it is not as sad as death. So that is anyone who wasn't sure. I have another one coming, coming. Molly Fader (28:18):

You've already written the death book, so you don't need to. Yeah, you can move on. Was the title yours? Lauren Evans (28:26):

Yeah. Get Lauren. Molly Fader (28:28):

Oh, it's so good. Lauren Evans (28:30):

Oh, it's funny. I, it was like one of those dumb jokes you make to yourself and then other people are like, this is a good title. I'm like, is it though? I dunno. But yeah, they kept it, so Molly Fader (28:44):

That's good. It is a great title and it's clever and I feel like it does most of the heavy lifting for the romcom at all, which is not an easy thing. It's a really difficult needle to thread. Lauren Evans (28:55):

Yeah, it is. I think back to querying, trying to situate what this book is, and it's like three different genres. Who knows what it is. Lauren Evans (29:06):

I'm glad that you found Sophie. I'm glad that you found someone who could champion it, who saw the literal magic and the book magic in it. Lauren Evans (29:17):

Yeah, me too. And when I saw her bio and she was southern, I was like, this just feels like I have to query her before I quit doing all of this. So that ended up being perfect too when we were editing it together and we both were kind of in the same world of all of that small town that exists. Molly Fader (29:35):

Yeah, I am not southern, but I'm from a small town outside of Chicago, and it really, the girl returning it really resonated with me. That was another sort of sweet, bittersweet part of the book. And another big question she had to answer was that where she should be? Lauren Evans (29:56):

Yeah. I feel like there's a life both ways. And that's kind of something, it's like you're saying, I'm from a small town too, and I no longer live there, and it's kind of like I could go back there and I'm sure have a happy life with everybody there. And that's my family. I love them very much versus the life I have now. It's just a completely different thing. Molly Fader (30:18):

It is. Yeah. I think about it. I think about it so much about how I'd have a Lauren Evans (30:22):

Yard. Oh yeah, Lauren Evans (30:26):

All Speaker 3 (30:27):

The land. Lauren Evans (30:27):

I would've so much land. So much land. So much land. Oh my gosh. Well, Lauren, thank you so much for coming by to chat with us and to drink the second worst, the middle of the road, second least expensive bottle of red wine. I can't wait to see what you do next. It's going to be really fun. Lauren Evans (30:52):

Yeah, this was fun. Thank you for having me. Molly Fader (30:54):

Thank you, Lauren. To everybody out there go pick up casket case and a cheap bottle of wine, but not too cheap. Have a good day. Bye Molly Fader (31:02): 

Day drinking with.