Tech Me Seriously!
I believe we all have stories to share with one another and some of our experience could be exactly what someone else needs to unlock their potential. That's why I host this podcast. My goal is that every listener leaves with a nugget of information that could lead to transformational change.
Tech Me Seriously!
Devin C. Hughes: Leading with Gratitude – Transforming Workplace Culture from the Inside Out
In this episode of Tech Me Seriously, Sarah Tenisi, CEO of TenisiTech and host of the show, interviews Devin C. Hughes, speaker, author, and culture strategist, who’s worked with clients ranging from Disney to the Department of Defense. Known for his TED-worthy humor and no-fluff delivery, Devin helps leaders build thriving, people-first cultures where trust, retention, and performance go hand in hand.
Together, Sarah and Devin explore how gratitude, emotional intelligence, and mindset shifts can transform workplace dynamics. They dig into the practical ways leaders can promote well-being, normalize taking time off, and create meaningful connections on their teams. Drawing from positive psychology and organizational research, Devin shares tools and real-life stories that show how kindness and clarity can drive serious business outcomes.
🎧 Listen for actionable strategies on building a culture of gratitude, boosting engagement, and creating workplaces where people—and profits—grow together.
👉 Connect with Devin:
Website: www.devinchughes.com
LinkedIn: Devin C. Hughes
Company: Devin C. Hughes Enterprises, LLC
Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction to Tech Me Seriously
00:29 Meet Devin C. Hughes: Speaker, Author, and Workplace Culture Expert
01:31 The Importance of Gratitude at Work
03:06 Changing Workplace Norms and Culture
04:28 The Role of Leadership in Promoting Work-Life Balance
07:40 Devin's Journey and Passion for Workplace Culture
17:03 Embedding Wellness into Work Routines
25:31 The Importance of Celebrating Small Wins
27:38 The Power of Positive Affirmations
29:23 Assuming Positive Intent in Relationships
31:40 Creating a Culture of Connection
33:58 Addressing Workforce Engagement Challenges
36:42 The Role of Leaders in Fostering Engagement
46:21 Implementing a Gratitude Challenge
48:18 Personal Practices for Positivity
You are listening to Tech Me Seriously with Sarah Esi, CEO of ESI Tech. Candid conversations with Driven technology and business professionals who've always got something interesting to say.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Hi, I'm Sarah Nessi, the host of Tech Me Seriously, and CEO and Founder of 10 Tech an IT services firm headquartered in California. Today I'm speaking with Devin c Hughes. Devon is a captivating speaker, author, and workplace culture expert. He helps leaders at all levels drive growth and engagement by aligning workplace culture with success. His unconventional and innovative views on business and leadership have attracted international attention. Devin's approach draws from the science of positive psychology, positive organizational research, appreciative inquiry, neuroscience mindset, and mindfulness. Welcome, Devin.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Thank you so much for inviting me. I am super excited to be here.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I am too. On this podcast, I've been focusing as much on leadership and kind of workplace culture as on technology over the last few years. And, I've Talked about kindness and how to develop a culture in which people thrive. And we were gonna talk about kindness, but at the last minute I thought, let's talk about. Something else that you often talk about. And so our topic today is finding gratitude at work. Inoculating your brain against stress and anxiety. So what does that mean? What are we talking about here?
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. So a couple things that come to mind. Number one if you live on earth I think you might suggest there's a lot of heaviness going on. And so it's like my beloved mother used to say when I was a child, Sarah, can't control the weather, but you can control how you show up in it. And there's a lot of bad weather now,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:right? Just a lot of stuff. Heaviness, Gaza, Ukraine, socioeconomic, political, just stuff. But the one common denominator, again, the analogous would be how I show up. For the people that I care about. That's my family, my teams, and my, all of the above.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yep.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:said the point of that is if I can get my brain in a better place more days, I can support the people that need it. In other words, you cannot pour from an empty cup.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Right.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And so inoculate your brain is essentially, I wasn't given the tools and resources when I was a young lad. I wasn't, I didn't, you just didn't, weren't given it. But the science has caught up outta the last 35 years in attendance of positive psychology that there's a new discipline called human flourishing wellbeing. So the subtext of that,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:It feels like no one talked about any of this stuff. We're about the same generation and it feels as we move forward year to year, people are finally talking about this stuff. I don't know. It felt like there was a huge kind of upswing of talking about mindset and mindfulness and workplace culture after COVID. I don't know. Do you think that it is just changing generationally? You know, it's not punch a clock for 30 years, get a gold watch and walk away.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, I think it has. Every generation changes and I think part of it was a stigma, right? If you said that you were exhausted or burnt out or tired, you know what the, we know what, suck it up.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:That's right.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:right.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And we use that language, man up. Put your big boy pants on. And so part of that, I grew up in that era, you didn't have feelings. Who cares about your feelings?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:All right. Get to work. Yeah. Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:part part of it was that, part of it was this tribal norm that you had to pay your dues,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I. I'm totally guilty of the, put your time in. We've all been through this. Pay your dues.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. So you go to a law firm, you gotta work 80 hours, you work on Wall Street, you gotta work on 80 hours. You work in a startup, you work in a tech company. Hey, you know it's gonna be a grind here. That's what we do.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:It's gonna be a grind.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. And, and then we brag about it. Oh, Sarah, you work hard.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:me tell you. I don't even take PTO.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Okay, so I'm glad you said that because I've been socializing the conversation. I often will tell people what I'm talking about, you know, on any given week. And, um, I was talking to one of our employees about it and I said to him, you know, I'm gonna, I'm gonna be asking Devin about what can employers do to help people inoculate their brain, but also I think this is as much focused on the individual, which is kind of fun. One of the things he said to me is, I feel like there's this culture of not. Like being expected to be around, be on PTO to take our PTO, which for me is like, the business leader is tough because we have five weeks of PTO. We absolutely want people It. Right? And we, we don't, I don't think we're reminding people enough, like maybe in our monthly all hands we should be saying, Hey, we really want you to take your time off. We want you to recharge, we want you to feel good. But I feel like we do a bunch of stuff, but it doesn't land for our team. And so. I'm also kind of excited, and we're gonna get to this a, a little bit later in the podcast, but how can, how can leaders sort of ingrain that in employees? Because I feel like we're doing this stuff, but people don't feel that way.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:So the easiest way, and I,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:you the easiest way I've seen, what leaders talk about is
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:So if you're going on PTO and the VPs are going on PTO and they're sharing pictures and stories. It clearly sets the context that that's what we do around here.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, we take time off to recharge.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. We don't, we don't. There's nothing to be shameful of. I'm excited. and PTO could be a home vacation, it could be with staycation, it could be whatever. So the easy fix is just a normalized talking about it. The other one is you also have to create boundaries. Meaning you do take PTO. But I'm still checking email and still connected, right? We've been there, you, me, and others,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:my god. Yeah,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:right?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:just gonna say, I didn't take a vacation without working like legitimately. Until maybe eight years ago. I'm not even joking. Like I would, I would work while my family was asleep, and then I'd hang out with'em. It was atrocious. I'm over that.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:See that's the thing that we did. And I did the same thing. So I'd be in this like far away tropical place, getting up at four in the morning before everyone else got up. And I, and this is what I normalize, I'm just gonna get on email real quick'cause I don't want my inbox to get too much. And I'd crank out a couple hours and then a couple hours and then my family would see me and I don't want to be not present. So I close the laptop, sneak back up there maybe kind of throughout the day from the pool and then maybe before dinner. And I did that, the dance. like,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Right.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:yes, and you're not alone. We all have been there.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I guess the point of that is I, it's situational, contextual, but if you can, and if someone's taking PTO, then they're off the grid. We will find a back channel. We will find a way to fill in, but we normalize it. I want, I don't want you half in, I want you all in on the PTO with your family. But those are the kind of conversations. I think to your point, we need to normalize and be more intentional about it and then let It's okay. Yeah.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:It's okay for us to take time away. So I wanna, before we're gonna go way more into that, but I wanna, before we get there, I wanna talk about, like more about you. Like how did you become, how did this become your focus area? Your area of focus, and something that you're super passionate about?
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I, I mean, couple things. One you know, I don't know people's backstories, but I think that matters.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:up with much, My family. Neither parent went to college.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:education was my way out. Uh, I played college basketball, and so I was trying to get outta my circumstances. So I had a mindset I had to succeed because I just didn't want, I, I didn't wanna stay where I was.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:forward that, so my dad was in the military and again, so I kind of understood culture and athletics and teams. And then intuitively I figured out when I was with my people, uh, and I was in a better place, I performed better.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Like I was a better human being.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:to go, man, it's like a superpower. Like when I'm with my people, Sarah, and we're in that foxhole, it was just like a vibe. It's like I, I don't know how we're gonna figure it out, but we figure it out. And then I was in other cultures and it was like feel right, no trust, right?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:was like, okay, so I've been in good and bad. And so I went out in the workforce. I probably had 25 jobs. Literally I would just bounce around from job to job.'cause you don't know what you don't know.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:at the time that seemed like a lot, but it gave me a really good sample size on leadership styles. Cultures, people, all of the above. And then, so I landed on two industries, high tech and biotech,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Okay.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:which were, which were data-driven, fast growing cultures
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:and bounced around a little bit. Startup, big company, et cetera. And then my, my last company got, uh, acquired and then I was like in an inflection point, met fast forward I was like, what do I wanna do next? And I did a talk at a rotary club. I know this is a lot. And someone in the back came up to me and said, Hey, you're unbelievable in front of the room. Have you ever thought about writing a a book? No. And boom, it happened like that 15 years ago. And so I took the totality of all my experience and said, you know what? Workplace culture plus science plus outcomes, and that's how my career started.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I love it. I feel so I've read a couple of your books at this point,'cause I like to do my research and one of the things I feel like, I feel like you're an observer. I feel like you are a good observer. So it's definitely not by accident that you end up here.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. I mean, I, you know, no, I don't know if I've, everyone's ever said that, but I do. I try to go in spaces as not the expert as a
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yes. I mean, I don't know. I picked that up in reading. I don't know why.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, and I, and I'm just very curious about human behavior.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:my presumption always with anybody, anybody I meet is that we're all good people,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Same.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:right? And, uh, but we all have different experiences, different life stories, different triggers, different traumas, different stuff. And
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yep.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:spaces, I'm like, okay, wow. What can I learn? This is interesting. How can I connect? What do we have in common? Just looking and observing and putting that all in context. And so, yeah, I mean, I, I think so. I'm, I just am fascinated with people.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:So do you think, I mean, I'm, I'm also fascinated with the idea that this is something new that organizations care about and are talking about. Do you think you could have had this kind of job, I don't know, 25 years ago? I.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:It would've been, I would, yeah, no, probably not. It would've been too woo woo.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Exactly right. And what I think is so interesting about this is it was like, you know, I tell this story about how we lived in San Jose for 25 years and I working in high tech, same thing. I just had my head down. For all these years, and I'm telling you, COVID sort of snapped me out of it because it did, I think, allow a lot of us, and I know like people have been talking about this long before COVID certainly, but it just felt like, I don't know, like I feel like people got refocused on some of the balance. And I think that's why it's something that I'm so curious about and that I really want, like the team that I work with to feel like that their work can't be the only thing in their life. There's gotta be more,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, and so I love that. I would also put this in context. This is why I'm so passionate about the work. We spend more time at work. In the aggregate hours
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:right?
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:than we spend anywhere else. Now, you, you might have heard me say this, but you know, again, I spend a lot of time, I, I, I, this is how my mind works. You, you look at the mortality tables, most of us have 80 summers. Okay? Hopefully we have a lot more. Summers, that's not that much, and most of us, at least 40 of those are at work. Put that in context. 50% of our existence is at work, so why would I settle and lower the bar and give up 50% of my aggregate hours at a place with people that I can't be seen, heard, and valued?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yes.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:That's.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:that's new though, that people have started to draw those boundaries. And you know, it's kind of interesting when we talked about this idea that nobody takes PTO and I've worked 24 hours in a row and like those were the badges of like honor at work. And now I, I'll like coach my team, like, don't send an email after 6:00 PM. Like literally schedule to send. It's okay if you feel like you gotta tap out the emails, but don't send it until the next day. Like I just don't want, people think, and this is tough, right? We're in a services company, so it feels brave to say this, but I don't want people to think they can have our time when we should be with our families or with our hobbies or something else. Like should that feel brave?
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:no, I mean it is brave and it. It's a maverick and to some people again. So I love that because, um, and I'll touch on your other question. The core values on the website don't mean anything unless you live them. That's living them.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:bright.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:talk about all that stuff, but if you do not actually operationalize them platitudes.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I used to think that's all corporate values were because I worked at big companies and they would send everybody like those little cards that you could like tape up on your cube or in your office, and it was the corporate values. I legitimately never heard anybody manage against them, talk about them or live that saw or saw them living those values at work. So when. When I started thinking about 10 Tech and what we were gonna do in terms of core values, I kind of was like, what a joke. But the moment we figured out what our core values were gonna be, we did a whole day workshop on them and started talking about them managing with them, treating each other. The way that we talked about wanting to get treated. It got really clear. On who we wanted to work with, not and who we had on the team. And so it's so powerful if it's done right.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. Yeah. No, absolutely. And people will see through when it's not done right. And, and I don't want to skip over your question. So has it changed? And when, I think the world changes pretty quick and you know, we got four or five generations in the workforce, and some of the younger generations have more access to information than we had. So they see that there's choices and they're well educated. They don't have to settle. And if you don't create a work-life balance, again, I love you said, you know, I'm not gonna go work for the man and work 32 years and get a ham and a watch and a cake, and then the person from the fourth floor to come down who I've never said hi to me, and then clap for me on my way out. No one Anymore.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Right. And it feels like there was like this, okay, and we're gonna talk about gratitude, but it felt like there was a gratitude to have that type of stability. You know, like whenever I left a job and I really haven't left that many in my time, my dad would be so stressed out for me.'cause he worked in the same place for 30 years and he was like, what do you mean you're gonna leave a a, a well paying job? And I mean, oh my God. Don't even get me started on the reaction when I said I'm starting my own company. Because it's, it felt so scary, right? And so I think that's totally different now. Now people take mini retirements, right? Save a bunch of money and then go hang out for a few months.'cause they don't wanna get burned out.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. And again, and, and so in, in that context, like, so, how do I put it? Well, one, there's a couple different things. One, less burnout, right? But
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:of the day, however you talk about it, if I can get your folks or anybody's team in a better place emotionally, more days,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:they win.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:that's right.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:They win, so they better customer service,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:engagement, better innovation. Ask engineers if you wanna innovate and build a new product.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:If I say to you, Hey, you know, we need to build a new, you know, upgrade to this new software, you think we'd be better for negative, cynical, salty, pessimistic and cutthroat? Or we're of course, dude, they're like, of course not so intuitively they know it. So I'm just putting it, putting some, uh, some context around it and give them tools on how to operationalize it saying, it's not woo woo for woo woo's sake. That's okay. But it also is gonna drive outcomes, and collective. Yes, exactly. That's exactly right. exactly right.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:So let's talk about, okay, let's talk about this. So, when we talk about inoculating your brain against stress and anxiety, let's start with the individual first. So I'm an employee and I do like the, the focus on the individual too, because this would help them regardless of where they worked,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, so again, that's kinda what I was talking about before is that a lot of us weren't given these tools. I.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:right?
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:You wanna be happier. So, you know, it's perks, parties, food trucks, et cetera. Happiness, if you look at the research, and let's just go back to the research, happiness is a choice. Meaning that you get to choose on your mindset, how you wake up every single day.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:look for all the problems
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:challenges, or you can look for the blessings, however you frame it. Now, does that mean every day is a pep rally or RIS day's? Bu bu day? No. Some days are harder than others. But
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:certainly some tools like gratitude and if you look at the research, if we're gonna get real specific, the happiest people on the planet they have happiness habits, and I call it in my work, happiness, hygiene.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Just like you brush your teeth, you comb your hair, you do all the stuff you do well, no one, you don't schedule it. It's not on your Outlook calendar. You've been doing it for so long, it's just right. I tell
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:if you want to be in a better place and you wanna inoculate your breath, you need to have the same happiness habits. Now, I'm not suggesting it takes six hours, climb Mount Everest, run mountains. No, no, no, no. I'm talking three to 15 minutes. could you do every single day that's organic to you? They put you in a better place. Like I just, I'll give an example. I was just following some new, uh, research on music. Music's like, like candy to the brain, fires off
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yes.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Dopamine is when we win. So maybe it's you have five minute dance party or put your, your whatever. But what you do is you find micro moments every single day just to reboot and you're, you know, from tech, right? Occasionally, whatever operating system you have, occasionally you get a, you get an upgrade. Most of us who aren't doing this stuff, there's nothing wrong with you. You just need a little bit of a mindfulness upgrade. And if we just find things that you can do two to three minutes a day, gratitude, meditation, exercise, music, whatever it is and, and that's how you start to get on that path.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:You wrote about being out in the sunshine, and that one resonates with me because maybe, I don't know, three years ago. I thought about being outside more and I made it like a New Year's resolution and I read this stat and I'm, I wanna know, like I just, I think it's fun to have people guess this, but the average amount of time an American spends outside,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Oof.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I know this is mind blowing and I can't give you a source, so maybe, maybe I'm just making it up.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I, I mean, 25%.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:15 minutes a day, which is equivalent to people going back and forth from their car to a business, to a house, to whatever. And so I thought, okay, I gotta get outside every day. I gotta get out in the sunshine. And you wrote about that and I think that's a really big one. And I'm, it's kind of a pet favorite of mine, or I redundant, it's a favorite of mine. And I keep telling my kids, I want you to just go sit outside. Like go get the sun on your face. So that feels like a big one to me. An easy one and a big one.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Well, yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's also, so, and let's put it in the context of work. If you had people in an office, which a lot of people remote,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yep.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:again, you could do walking meetings,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Love that.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:You can also do walking meetings when you're remote, most people have AirPods. Hey, for this meeting, we're gonna be very intentional. You're the leader. I want everybody outside, and I want you walking as we're talking.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I love that idea. The next 10 Tech All Hands is gonna be a walking meeting.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:It's hilarious. And you, and you, you're hearing noises, but you can just, you'll watch the vibe just because people will be, this is amazing. Yeah. So we, you're multitasking all day long. Let's just walk and talk. So little things like that is what I'm talking about in terms of operationalizing some of these things. Then you're clearly telling people, we're not just talking about wellness at Tuni Tech. I care. I want you to get in your 15, 30 minutes a day. we're gonna actually embed it right into the work.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:That's the part that I was, that I was particularly interested in is how can people start embedding it for their employees, because I almost feel like it's a cycle, right? It's maybe a. Self-fulfilling prophecy because if you can do that for people at work, then maybe they start doing it for themselves. And it is this, like you said earlier, this normalization that, hey, we go on vacations and I was thinking about this, you know, we'll actually we have a thread for that, like vacation photos, but it's still not landing. People are still really stressed out. Even when I, when we're like, don't be stressed, no overtime, we have a no overtime policy and not just'cause we don't wanna spend the money on overtime, but because we don't believe. You should be doing overtime on a regular basis.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, so I get it. I mean, I, you know, I'm not close enough to the team, but, uh, different people have different, put it this way, uh, there's also a lot of stigma and, and norms about how much to share, what not to share
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:a tough one.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And then some people are like, well, you know, I'll, you know, say you go let's just say one of the people on your team goes on these amazing vacations. And I, you know, I ended up going, that's, you know, I end up going to Temecula.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:like, oh, you know what I mean? Like wow. I mean, do I really wanna show my, you know, my, all that like stuff starts, right?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Okay. That's interesting.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I've seen that we're like, well I didn't go to Costa Rica, Sarah, so, you know, my family and I, we just went to Corona Auto. So then it gets this like, kind of like this narrative, like mind's not worthy of sharing. seen that, but one way to do it again, I think on a, on a local level, right? Again, before you go wide, because I, I get a lot of leaders say this. I'm like, look, don't try to boil the ocean. Boil a pot of water on your team, your customer service team, six, seven people that you manage. How about you start sharing in the meeting? about you create space the first 10 minutes of the meeting? And you put up pictures on the slide on Zoom or teams or whatever you use and say, Hey guys, before we get started, we're gonna take a couple minutes and I just want everyone to come and share your best photo or something. But if it's not embedded into the work it tends not to happen. And that's the secret sauce. From a design thinking standpoint, just think of all the work routines that happen right now, meetings one-on-ones. Those are the things where you have to integrate it. Because that's clearly shows people, oh, this is what we do here.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:It's not just all business.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:yeah, it's just not all.'cause otherwise it just feels all transactional all the time.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:already busy and now you're asking me to do more stuff. See, I don't want you to do more stuff. I'm just asking you to do the stuff you were doing and we're gonna give a little bit of a makeover like Chip and Joanna in Waco, Texas.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Joanna.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yes. I mean, right. They don't, I mean, they just they don't burn the house down. They just get a little bit of an upgrade. And that's what, that's what I tell leaders. a little bit of an upgrade. So I don't wanna overtalk this, but I say this, how you start meetings and how you end meetings are really, really important. That's a low hanging fruit to integrate some of this stuff. Like for example, you, I never want to leave bad news. At the end of a meeting. I don't want people walking out like they got run over by an Amazon truck. Always,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:don't like talking about bad news at any of those. All staff meetings either.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:even on my team meetings though, if we're in
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:meeting and it's
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:and we're not, you know, we're gonna, this is hard and we gotta do better, but I'm gonna walk out that, you know what, we're gonna walk out excited. So again, there's just nuances like that. I think you can integrate it into the work itself that make people feel, you
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:What's a good example of how to end a meeting so that it doesn't feel heavy? I.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I mean, one easy one is, uh, for, well, that's even a, that's a different course, but like even meeting management, right? How we, because you've ever had meetings that just go on and on. So one of the things we talk about is what is it? We're really clear what the meeting is for. Are we brainstorming? Are we coming to an action? Is there a pre-read? So that's a whole meeting management, but one easy way to do that, to close out meetings is what did you learn what are you gonna do? What was the biggest takeaway? Or another one is what's your biggest, before we get outta here, and I know we talked about a lot of heavy stuff today in customer service. Hey, what's your, what was, if I had to ask you what's your, what was your biggest success story this week? What's your biggest win? Often, I don't think we talk about winning enough.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Or maybe they're not small enough wins. Do you think people think that a win has to be big?
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Usually they think it has to be big, hairy and audacious.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:give you an example. I'm watching, I was watching basketball last night. NBA playoffs are on right now. Every time anybody made a great play, they got a fist bump or a high five or a smack on the butt.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And I'm like, so you tell me guys make seven to$8 million. gets a charge, he gets a rebound. He's getting why?'cause it's a win. Winning. You know what I mean? And so I,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, it does. I mean it's, I think people talk about sports a lot because you can tell when a team has that vibe together, you can tell that they're gonna succeed. And you know, we talked about this a little bit last week, but we're big Warriors fans and they seem like they are so with each other. Doesn't matter if you're coming off the bench or if you're one of the starters, they love each other. At least that's what I see. But that is part of it, right? Is we celebrate the.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:No, I mean, that's culture with Steve Kerr, right? And it
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Oh my God.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:It starts and that's his vibe. And Steve Col, I mean, Steve Kerr from what I read, is really into the whole gratitude space and the, Just bleeds into everyone else. And so it is funny, I don't wanna talk about sports, but if I said
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:a, a group of people, do you think professional athletes play better when they feel better?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:of course.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Of course. Or how about, let's take it, let's not take, how about kids in the classroom?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Of course. And you know, the reason why I roll my eyes like that is'cause, you know, getting ready in the morning is really stressful, right? And like you have a five-year-old that doesn't wanna put on their shoes or whatever. And then, and then I was like the mom that was like yelling at her kids.'cause I had to do an hour commute and like immediately after that I would think, wow, I really set them up for success today. I. You know, and so yeah, you have to send people out into the world, you know, with a good, a good feeling, or else how are they gonna do well in the day.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. And no. I mean, this is all good stuff. I mean, this is great conference. This is stuff that I didn't know and I learned later in life. I mean, I'll give you an example. Did you know that? I mean, humans human meanings, all of us have a negativity bias mean we're born with it, which means bad is stronger than good on the brain.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And some of that is some of that. So at first people are like, what do you mean? I, well think about it. The number one job of the brain is to keep you safe. Keep you alive.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:news is a threat. So we're hard wired to always environments. We just have like, you know what I mean? Like that. And so, uh, so what does that mean for work and culture and people? If you look at the recent data, you need three positive, three positives outweigh one negative.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:That's tough.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. So yeah, it doesn't mean you walk around with a clipboard like, Hey Billy, I, I got one more today, but just think about it. If you just did your own sample research this week and looked about how many positive affirmations you've given out versus negative or neutral, and sometimes they're not even negative, Sarah, you just don't give them out at all.'cause we get busy. And so my point of it is, could we be, and it doesn't not, and I love what you said. It doesn't have to be big, hairy and audacious, just micro moments.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Sarah, I love what you said in the meeting yesterday. That was an unbelievable point and I didn't think about that. I love that. We're gonna need more of that. I want you make sure you follow up with me, that's all I'm talking about.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:little affirmations, you'll letting people know they're a big deal.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. I know, I'm like sitting here thinking, what are we doing? What do we need to do? More of that, um, idea that three positives outweigh one negative or it takes three positives to balance out the negative. That it, I'm glad to hear that that's science backed because I do feel like I always have like my guard up. Or I work on it. I'm working on it. Right. But like I remember, we do these exercises on our leadership team where we make these commitments to each other, and one of my commitments had to be, I'm going to assume positive intent. Which is weird because I feel like in my life I do, but there is this thing where this tendency to think that somebody's like not happy or isn't, you know, is mad at us or whatever. And I think that that's what you're getting at in that, that I of that idea that we're sort of just programmed that way, I feel relieved.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:No, no, I, I get it and see, I mean, we, most of us, me included, we are all hardwired based on experiences. So if someone says something or does something, our brain, just like a hard drive, spins a thousand miles an hour and defines a data point and goes, oh, that's that. And then they fill in the narrative, the gap and go, oh, you know, so, and so to your point, assuming positive intent is a really, really big one, it's, it is interesting when you talk about that, right? Because the relationship is really, really tight. We all, we kind of sort of give the person, we always kind of assume positive intent. Billy would never talk to me like that. Mary didn't mean that,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:True.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I but if I don't have enough connective tissue to the person I don't know him that well, I've never really spent much time with him, then you'll start to fill in that, that little bit of friction in the relationship. So I mean, those are the things we talk about. You know, in terms of that, and I don't wanna make sure I skip what you said before, in terms of signaling that things like gratitude and all that stuff matters. Again, you are working remotely. It's more challenging. But again, if
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yes.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:team meetings or one-on-ones, those are ripe for a makeover,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:right? So how would you integrate some of this stuff? Maybe I've had some people right now, Hey guys, before we get started here, maybe certain times of the year, more stressful, maybe then the month is stressful. Maybe there's certain points for whatever. Maybe it's a new customer, maybe you're onboarding if you're a director, manager, whatever. And you know there's inflection points where the temperature goes up. Then why wouldn't you get ahead of it and say, Hey, you know what? Let's cause a pause here. I know this is heavy. We're gonna just take five minutes and I want everybody just to, we're gonna meditate, or we're gonna do something to integrate what I'm talking about into the work. And it also sends the signals that not tone deaf to the, is what's going on.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:That sort of brought to mind, you know, it's in onboarding's, a perfect example of where things feel a little a little crazy because you are forming what you know, that, um, what's that little, that saying that people say you're. Forming, storming, norming, and performing.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:whenever you onboard either a new employee or a new company as a client, like we finally realized that, wait a minute, this is just part of that forming and storming. Phase, right? So we talk about the J curve of excitement or satisfaction.'cause usually like when people start with a new partner, like I'll use 10 Tech as an example, they're really excited. There's a lot of work that's gotta get done and not all that work is gonna be fun. So you go through that J curve of stress, whether it's a new project, and I think this applies to everyone really. And then you kind of get through that and you think, okay. Now we're norming. Right now It's all normal and we're performing. And I think that being able to say that out loud, because we've been in business a long time and I've been working in in IT service management for decades, and it was like, you never talked about that it was gonna be negative, but if you could call that out at the beginning, I feel like it's what you're saying. It's like I'm not tone deaf. I get it. So let's not, let's not worry if we go through a rough patch, it doesn't mean that we're gonna walk away from each other. It means that we're just getting there.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:See, I love that. I mean, I love that. Let's just, it is gonna, it's gonna be.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:It.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:The best, and again, I don't want to get off on these tangents, but the best people that do that are the military.'cause you put people in harm's way. So you say, look, this is gonna be heavy and it's gonna be hard there's gonna be some uncertainty, but we're built for this. We got a plan. we're gonna figure it out and we're gonna stop along the way. I think that level of candor is really important. Celebrate winning and progress is really important. Individual and aggregate progress, people can connect to that. And so again, I think that's, you know, that's part of that conversation. And then, you know, I don't want to dance around a little bit, but you talked earlier about some of the stuff going on about just the heaviness in the world. one, I mean, I look at data points about why people are struggling. Well, the, I don't know if you've seen the new Gallup data,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:but roughly according to Gallup, the state of, uh, work report, only 30% of the global workforce is engaged.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I mean, I not to get you off point, but I read an article in The Atlantic yesterday about the job market's in trouble and we're trying to figure out, it's like college isn't, isn't helping people as much as it used to, and we both have college age kids and kids that are trying to figure it out and people don't feel engaged at work and AI is potentially impacting all this. It was scary to read about that stuff. And I mean, that, that kind of puts me in this spot where I feel like, okay, I gotta just focus on the good, but then is it like, I'm just hiding my head, so what are we, what are we supposed to do in, in when that is the reality of what's going on in the world.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:In terms of engagement or AI or just all of the
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Just the engagement. I mean, like you were saying that Gallup data is pretty stark.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, so I mean, I just follow the data. I mean, you know, you could look at it certainly like, wow. Now if you look at the lion's share of that, most people are, well there's three buckets. There was engaged, not engaged and actively disengaged.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Oh yeah,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:yeah,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:disengaged. I think we've all been there, whether kind of toxic, disruptive.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:sure.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:roughly about 20% of the workforce is that 50% of the workforce is not destructive. They're just not engaged. And that doesn't mean they're not, they're just, eh. So if work starts at eight, they eight, they get off at five and they do fine, but you know, there's a lot more gas in that race car,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, like they could be engaged and having a great time potentially.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:they could be offering up new ideas and be more participatory. And some, and so, and so, a lot of the folks are just kind of tapped out. So like, I'm here, it feels very, eh, kind of min. again, so that's one data point plus loneliness is at all time highs. You talked about burnout. But when I look at why I just, again, if you, if you bear with me for a second, uh, and you talked about it, church attendance is down,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, we.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:volunteering is down. Family dinners are down. Having people over to the houses down. What do all those provide?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Connection,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Connection.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:human connection,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Plus most people are remote at work or hybrid, and I'm not anti, but we don't gather.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:right.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And so as much as it affords us on certain ways, I think we've lost a sense of community connection.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And when you do that, it feels very transactional.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:And so a leader's, I think responsibility at work is to kind of drive that meaning and connection. And actually that's kind of what I was reading this morning. Like there's this new study called the The Global Flourishing Study. And again, I, I. Just been reading the, reading The Atlantic. So you know, you guys, people can find these articles in there, but that's exactly what it said is put your close relationships with your families and friends kind of first, where possible. Don't use social media to talk to your family and friends. Like pick up the phone, go for a walk, go eat, break bread, right? Like something. Don't put technology between those relationships. And it's funny to be a tech person and be so I really, I. I really don't like social media at all. Like for the business maybe, but like for my personal life and my interactions with people, I try not to. And so it is about this lack of connection, right?
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. And so, so I get that a lot. Well, well, Devin, that's nice. I don't see people in the hallways anymore. I don't see people. Okay, great. I get it. Get people over the country, all over the West coast. I get it.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:but so what, what do you do you do check in? Do you ever check in just to check in or is it always about the work?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yep.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:checking. Hey, bill. No, no. Forget the work my man. Let's just talk.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:on? You know, I, and again, I'm a, I'm a devil in the details. Hey, last time we spoke, um, you mentioned that your daughter was was trying to get into, you know, da, da da, da. Did you get in? How's that going? These are little subtleties that again, we just take for granted. But again, you have four or five generations in the workforce. If you're not checking in, it's people signal that it doesn't matter.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Do organizations need to have like a coach like you come in to do this? Because I feel like it might, it, I think it's hard to develop organically.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I'm a little biased,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I know. I just say like, should people hire you, Devin, what's going on? That's not what I meant, but like part of me feels like it's it as a leader in a company thinking, am I even equipped? To do this or do I need, do I need support in doing this Really?
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I mean, I, I think it's yes. N like, you know, I, I think certainly you can do it. The challenge is, could you learn it? Yeah. But that would take you years and that's not
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:expertise.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:exactly. That's right.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:So you mean Well, you don't do well again, just like, I know I should eat right. And exercise. But that doesn't mean so and so a couple things. I think a coach does help like me is that one, one, I get it. I can, uh, give you bite sized chunks to transform behavior. Like I'm not the academic who comes in and gives you a bunch of Venn diagrams and
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:In the real world, I don't have time for all that. You know what I mean? Like it's I give you real world tools, real world, and these are tools that you can operationalize this week. And then figure out where we want to go. The other thing is, I think I'll just say this, Sarah Depe, you know, each team's different. You might have a sales team, different vibe, engineering team, customer service team. The different managers got a different vibe in introvert, extrovert. And I don't have a ones stop shop. I gotta meet the manager where they are, where do they want to go with the team? Do we need to put out some fires maybe? Where do we wanna be aspirationally, where do you want the team? And here's some tools around the culture to help build out what I'm talking about. And then, you know, along the way we do it in the way that bite-sized chunks, but I want'em to succeed. So, yeah.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:So if people aren't focused on helping their team sort of avoid burnout and fostering an attitude of gratitude, what's like the worst that happens? You have any horror stories you could, you could share? I.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, I mean the, the Gallup data clearly shows one that people just check out. I mean, have a lot of people burned out, stressed out. cetera. The angry, salty, negative. I mean, when I hear language, oh my God, Billy's so negative and so toxic a lot of cases. It's not that Billy's whatever he is, or married, we've just normalized it. One of the ones that I see the worst is what two things I'll say. is called performance punishment, and that's a, that's a I coin that. What that means is if Sarah, you and I are working on a team, right, and say there's a team of us of seven or eight. And you probably have seen this in your career. just assume that, um, you and I always find a way to get the work done and other people don't, and our boss really needs something to get done. Who do you think he's gonna give it to?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:We are gonna get it'cause we're amazing. Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I see that a lot. I call it
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:punishment. So you'll burn, you'll burn your high performers out Because
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:That happens a lot in it. I gotta say,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:always happens in it.'cause you'll go to your money person because you know
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:they just are so good.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:and so we burn, unintentionally we burn some of our best folks out and then they're looking to the left or right Mary's over here on ES PN or Facebook or like, why am I, right? So that's one horror story. I mean, the other one is in terms of just the level of just man that you create in a culture where people are just like. Whatever.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I know it makes me, I really don't wanna have that kind of culture. Like when you say that, I'm like, ah, I don't want that. My hair sort of lights on fire.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:think people want that to be their culture.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:No, but most people really haven't had a really hard look at what their culture is, so I, I, I have a frame or a canvas that I use. I'm not overly prescriptive. I have some, some buckets that I use. these are just buckets, like for example, psychological safety behaviors, norms, unwritten rules, how we meetings and just help people say, how do we rebuild the culture from the ground up? Just like a house. And I was kidding when I used Chip and Joanna, but it is a, some ways it's analogous,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:We're not gonna burn the house down. It's just the world's changing and what are we gonna do to just upgrade it? But to your point earlier, if the leader doesn't change their behavior, then nothing changes.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. And then, okay, so horror stories, so that, that point of you're gonna burn out your highest performers performance punishment. That's, um, that's a big takeaway for me at least. So on the other hand, if you focus on this stuff what are the success stories? I mean, I assume happier customers, happier employees, like.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, I mean I've got a success stories, but I think my mo, the one that I'm most proud about, I
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Mm-hmm.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Socioeconomically not well, you know, kind of that, you know, district where you are like, mm, no, no.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Listening to this knows. That wherever you live and you have small kids, the primary, right?
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Reason you buy or try
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yes. Yeah so this was the school district you didn't want to go to. So fast forward here, I had a very progressive superintendent said, we don't have budget, we don't have resources, we don't have affluence. I can control or influence how my staff shows up,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:That's right.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:my staff, my teachers, my paraprofessionals, my special ed. and so I say all that to tell you that they, A CT scores went up. A CT went up from 17 to 22 in less than two years,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Wow.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:suspensions went down, classroom incidents went down, fooling around on the bus went down, attendance and school went up. And the only different was culture and climate.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I know it's so powerful and I feel like people are. Still. I mean, I think, I think it's catching on like we talked about, but I think that, you know, if they, if, if everybody started thinking about how do they show up in these environments, right? With, you know, it's particularly working with children. I saw this video online and it was like this principal that was like high five and everybody, and you know, hugging people and telling, you know, just you could tell this guy was walking the halls to encourage the student body and it was like. All schools should be like that. And I thought, I thought yes. Because if you start young and you teach people about mindset and kids about mindset and kids about the choice to determine how they show up, like you could see how things like, we wouldn't even be having this conversation
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:No, we wouldn't. You're
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:just be there. Right.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, no, I mean, I mean, I, I think you're right. And, and so I mean, I tell people that bef you're the energy, the vibe you give off, the energy you bring into the room. We pick it up before you even say a word
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yep.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:and you say, well, that's not fair. Okay? It is what it is.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And so, and I, I'm, I don't, you don't need to be a Southern Baptist preacher or a motivational speaker, but pick your phone, put your phone away, say good morning. Hello, friendly, all that connected stuff to the brain. It matters'cause we are social animals and we know that, but we wanna have connection with people and just doing that more intentionally is a really big deal.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:So Devin, I feel like you've given at least me a lot to think about and I think, you know, my big takeaway is to find ways to drive connection and meaning through little things at work will help improve the team culture. And so I really appreciate you coming to chat with me about this stuff and I, I'm hoping that people get some value out of being nicer people at work.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, so I've got a challenge for you because I.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Challenges here. Okay.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:I know that I, you know, the short time I've known you, mediocrity is not part of the playbook for you.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Nope.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:You didn't come this far to come this far,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Okay.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:right? Yeah.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Okay.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:know what I mean? Like,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Now I'm nervous. Now I'm nervous.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:So we're, we're, you know, we don't, I don't wanna talk. That's like my mama used to say. Don't talk about it, be about it.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Okay.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:the challenge. want you to start a 30 day gratitude challenge with your leadership team.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I love it.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:All right. And you're gonna start, I don't know, today, tomorrow. And you're gonna give'em a little bit of context and say, Hey, you know what? We're gonna have that for the month of May.'cause, by the way, may is Mental Health Awareness Month.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:May is my favorite month, by the way, so.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:So you could frame it around mental health awareness or not, but you say, starting today for the next 30 days, I want all of us, including me, we're gonna find one thing that we're grateful for. It could be personal or professional, and then you're gonna be very intentional. And then you're gonna be, you could share it, not share it, but I want you to, again, just a signal to everybody and that's 30 different things you are grateful for in the month of May.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I love it. Okay. I'm up for that challenge. I'm up for that. I.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:then, and then when you have team meetings or one-on-ones, I want you to bring it up. Hey, by the way, it's day eight. How we doing? What's going on? It would just be interesting for you to hear people. Socializing gratitude. What they're, and it's
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:take the conversations and a place like, oh my God, I didn't even know you did that.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:And you know what you're doing to me, you're trying to, uh, what is interesting about this is'cause, you know, I've been reading about keeping a gratitude journal and that was in one of your books about really focusing on those few things a day to kind of build this. And so the challenge is helpful because now I might actually do it and actually take steps to put it in, into play. So this is exciting and I'll be sure to tell you how that works out for the team in 30 days.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah. Well, I'm, do I have time to share with you one more thing on a
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah, absolutely.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Something that I do on a personal level with my family is I have in my phone on my notes section, I have it titled, good Things Are Always Happening to Me. That's the title, and I purposely find something every day that's good. Personally,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I love that.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:just a little thing like, again, these are
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I love that. That's that good things, negative things that we were talking about, the positive and negative things and the I the re, the example that always comes to my mind is if somebody goes, oh wow, you look really nice today. And I know we're not even supposed to say that to each other anymore. You don't even believe that anymore. You're much more in your head about how you feel about yourself than you know what other people are saying to you. You gotta hear it a lot. So I like this idea that good things are happening. You keep a list of those good things.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:And what happens is see the, you'll start to scan for them after a while if you get in the habit and you'll start to just make a little bit of a note. Lastly, I'll say this, I don't even say to people anymore, and it's not anything PC about, Hey, you look really nice today. You know what I say, you look so happy today.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Nice. That's even better. That is a better way to say it.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:You know what I mean? And you'll watch people go, oh, I do. But God, you look so happy. I love it. You're making me feel good.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Everybody's always heard. This one, you look tired.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yes,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:You're like,
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:exhausted,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:wrong. Well,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:Yeah.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:How about you look a, you look happy and I love it. So either way, those are a couple things to think about. I,
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:I love it. Well, thanks so much, Devin. This has been super fun. I knew it would be
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:well, thanks for having me. I appreciate it. It went by really, really fast. It was a great conversation.
sarah_1_05-01-2025_110307:awesome. We'll do it again.
devin-hughes_1_05-01-2025_110307:All right.