{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":0.049,"endTime":2.719,"body":"Hello everyone, and welcome"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":0.049,"endTime":2.719,"body":"to this edition of Built environment"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":2.719,"endTime":4.489,"body":"Matters, the Bryden Wood podcast."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":4.729,"endTime":7.954,"body":"I'm Adam Jordan, Asia-Pacific"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":4.729,"endTime":7.954,"body":"Lead for Bryden Wood, and heading"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":7.954,"endTime":10.961,"body":"up Bryden Wood's new office in"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":7.954,"endTime":10.961,"body":"Australia, newly launched this year."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":11.564,"endTime":14.967,"body":"This month we're very pleased to be"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":11.564,"endTime":14.967,"body":"joined by Martin Fenn, Director of"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":14.967,"endTime":19.077,"body":"integration at PT Blink, a Sydney"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":14.967,"endTime":19.077,"body":"based Construction Technology company"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":19.077,"endTime":21.237,"body":"operating in both Australia and the US."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":21.537,"endTime":25.396,"body":"He is also  THEC lead for the Chartered"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":21.537,"endTime":25.396,"body":"Institute of Building, Oceania."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":25.893,"endTime":28.503,"body":"Martin's role is to help his"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":25.893,"endTime":28.503,"body":"clients innovate their developments,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":28.593,"endTime":32.373,"body":"expand local supply chains, and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":28.593,"endTime":32.373,"body":"optimize value by enhancing both"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":32.403,"endTime":34.323,"body":"offsite and onsite processes."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":34.863,"endTime":38.193,"body":"With a background in carpentry and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":34.863,"endTime":38.193,"body":"joinery, Martin has over 20 years"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":38.193,"endTime":42.273,"body":"experience in the construction industry"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":38.193,"endTime":42.273,"body":"in the UK, New Zealand and Australia."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":42.723,"endTime":46.143,"body":"Experienced in leading innovative"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":42.723,"endTime":46.143,"body":"projects using a variety of offsite"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":46.143,"endTime":50.193,"body":"typologies, Martin is also a"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":46.143,"endTime":50.193,"body":"passionate advocate of sustainability."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":50.559,"endTime":55.522,"body":"Martin has recently returned from a trip"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":50.559,"endTime":55.522,"body":"to the UK where he visited  facilities"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":55.732,"endTime":59.392,"body":"and attended conferences to see what new"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":55.732,"endTime":59.392,"body":"ideas could be brought back to Australia."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":59.632,"endTime":60.622,"body":"Thanks for joining us Martin."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":61.22,"endTime":61.79,"body":"Thank you Adam."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":63.23,"endTime":65.96,"body":"And we also have a"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":63.23,"endTime":65.96,"body":"double bill this month, which is very"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":65.96,"endTime":69.35,"body":"exciting because we're also joined"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":65.96,"endTime":69.35,"body":"by Simon McCarthy, our Principal"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":69.35,"endTime":71.051,"body":"Structural Engineer for Bryden Wood."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":71.1,"endTime":73.86,"body":"Newly joined our Australian"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":71.1,"endTime":73.86,"body":"office and based in Melbourne."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":74.07,"endTime":76.646,"body":"Commenced working at Bryden"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":74.07,"endTime":76.646,"body":"Wood at the beginning of August."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":76.651,"endTime":80.786,"body":"Simon has over 25 years experience"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":76.651,"endTime":80.786,"body":"specialising in the design of low to"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":80.786,"endTime":84.596,"body":"medium rise buildings in the residential,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":80.786,"endTime":84.596,"body":"commercial, health, educational,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":84.596,"endTime":86.516,"body":"industrial, and defense sectors."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":86.996,"endTime":90.206,"body":"Simon has developed a specialty in"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":86.996,"endTime":90.206,"body":"the design of multi-story permanent"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":90.206,"endTime":94.826,"body":"modular buildings using DfMA, lean"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":90.206,"endTime":94.826,"body":"and offsite construction techniques."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":95.096,"endTime":98.696,"body":"He has been engaged as a technical advisor"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":95.096,"endTime":98.696,"body":"on several government initiatives for"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":98.696,"endTime":102.446,"body":"the implementation of Modern Methods"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":98.696,"endTime":102.446,"body":"of Construction, and contributed to the"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":102.446,"endTime":106.526,"body":"recently released offsite construction"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":102.446,"endTime":106.526,"body":"guide by the Office of Projects, Victoria."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":106.916,"endTime":111.356,"body":"Simon also delivered a presentation on"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":106.916,"endTime":111.356,"body":"digital engineering platform design at the"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":111.356,"endTime":115.626,"body":"prefabAUS Conference in Brisbane earlier"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":111.356,"endTime":115.626,"body":"this month on behalf of Bryden Wood."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":116.226,"endTime":116.966,"body":"Welcome Simon."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":116.981,"endTime":117.971,"body":"Thanks for joining us."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":118.555,"endTime":118.765,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":119.69,"endTime":123.35,"body":"So for this month's podcast,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":119.69,"endTime":123.35,"body":"I'm really keen to discuss the current"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":123.35,"endTime":125.48,"body":"state of MMC adoption in Australia."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":125.66,"endTime":129.56,"body":"At Bryden Wood, we've been leading"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":125.66,"endTime":129.56,"body":"this trend in the UK for quite a"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":129.56,"endTime":133.578,"body":"long time, and here in Australia"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":129.56,"endTime":133.578,"body":"it's a new, exciting market for us."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":133.578,"endTime":137.479,"body":"But there's certainly a lot of"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":133.578,"endTime":137.479,"body":"progress that's been made in MMC and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":137.484,"endTime":138.978,"body":"DfMA adoption over the last years."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":139.588,"endTime":141.838,"body":"So we've made a lot of progress"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":139.588,"endTime":141.838,"body":"in Australia, but there's"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":141.838,"endTime":142.978,"body":"probably a long way to go."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":142.978,"endTime":144.658,"body":"What can we do to accelerate it?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":144.928,"endTime":147.778,"body":"How can we best apply some of"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":144.928,"endTime":147.778,"body":"the lessons from overseas and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":147.778,"endTime":149.168,"body":"particularly from the UK experience."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":150.076,"endTime":153.166,"body":"Martin, as I said before, you've"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":150.076,"endTime":153.166,"body":"recently returned from the UK."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":153.646,"endTime":155.774,"body":"What's your impression of"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":153.646,"endTime":155.774,"body":"the state of play over there?"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":156.164,"endTime":157.323,"body":"Very impressed Adam."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":157.583,"endTime":159.711,"body":"I went to the Offsite Expo."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":159.771,"endTime":164.854,"body":"I visited a few offsite manufacturing"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":159.771,"endTime":164.854,"body":"facilities in both England and Scotland"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":164.86,"endTime":168.64,"body":"and look, I suppose overall I was"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":164.86,"endTime":168.64,"body":"very impressed with the amount of"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":168.645,"endTime":170.63,"body":"collaboration that I saw over there."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":170.633,"endTime":175.998,"body":"There's very much more of a structured"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":170.633,"endTime":175.998,"body":"and cohesive approach to the delivery of"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":175.998,"endTime":177.958,"body":"Modern Methods of Construction over there."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":177.985,"endTime":182.285,"body":"Not only is Modern Methods of Construction"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":177.985,"endTime":182.285,"body":"separated into various categories,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":182.286,"endTime":187.366,"body":"rather than just given a generic offsite"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":182.286,"endTime":187.366,"body":"construction title, there just seems a"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":187.366,"endTime":190.396,"body":"more innovative approach to construction."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":190.431,"endTime":197.148,"body":"It feels like, there's the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":190.431,"endTime":197.148,"body":"evolutionary change towards MMC has"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":197.148,"endTime":203.568,"body":"certainly taken place, and I feel"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":197.148,"endTime":203.568,"body":"it's moved on from just pure MMC."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":203.568,"endTime":205.128,"body":"It's now people."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":205.158,"endTime":212.868,"body":"The hot topic is decarbonisation using"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":205.158,"endTime":212.868,"body":"MMC to address net zero carbon targets."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":212.877,"endTime":217.828,"body":"Address skill shortages,  address"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":212.877,"endTime":217.828,"body":"the evolution from artisan trades"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":217.828,"endTime":219.738,"body":"into manufacturing operatives."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":220.068,"endTime":225.258,"body":"It was certainly eyeopening to see"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":220.068,"endTime":225.258,"body":"how much more advanced the industry"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":225.263,"endTime":227.028,"body":"is than over here in Australia."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":227.851,"endTime":231.481,"body":"So, what's the driver"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":227.851,"endTime":231.481,"body":"for that fundamental difference"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":231.481,"endTime":235.798,"body":"do you think the UK has different"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":231.481,"endTime":235.798,"body":"drivers or the productivity gap"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":235.798,"endTime":237.628,"body":"is more severe than in Australia?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":237.628,"endTime":241.618,"body":"Or do you think maybe the government"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":237.628,"endTime":241.618,"body":"is just being much more proactive"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":241.678,"endTime":243.296,"body":"at supporting these initiatives?"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":243.296,"endTime":245.066,"body":"I think it's"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":243.296,"endTime":245.066,"body":"a combination of things."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":245.113,"endTime":250.964,"body":"I definitely saw very much a proactive"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":245.113,"endTime":250.964,"body":"government there who were embracing MMC,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":251.114,"endTime":257.024,"body":"setting targets, setting delivery targets"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":251.114,"endTime":257.024,"body":"for developments with set percentages"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":257.024,"endTime":262.773,"body":"or set pre-manufactured values,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":257.024,"endTime":262.773,"body":"but also, you know, potentially the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":262.773,"endTime":268.39,"body":"geography of the UK assists with offsite"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":262.773,"endTime":268.39,"body":"construction with the advancement of that."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":268.449,"endTime":272.319,"body":"It's a very small country, you"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":268.449,"endTime":272.319,"body":"know, something like 32 times"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":272.319,"endTime":276.242,"body":"smaller than Australia with a"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":272.319,"endTime":276.242,"body":"significantly larger population."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":276.632,"endTime":280.932,"body":"So perhaps it's condensed"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":276.632,"endTime":280.932,"body":"more into a smaller area."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":280.992,"endTime":282.471,"body":"There's also the weather to consider."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":282.531,"endTime":287.951,"body":"You know, it's much, up until recently,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":282.531,"endTime":287.951,"body":"a much wetter, colder environment,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":288.864,"endTime":293.304,"body":"you know, one, one interesting facts"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":288.864,"endTime":293.304,"body":"I learned about in Scotland is there's"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":293.304,"endTime":297.384,"body":"actually only two months of the year"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":293.304,"endTime":297.384,"body":"where you could really lay blocks."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":297.394,"endTime":301.894,"body":"So there's been a, a move as a"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":297.394,"endTime":301.894,"body":"result of the weather more towards"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":302.018,"endTime":303.758,"body":"timber construction, for example."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":304.146,"endTime":308.52,"body":"So perhaps the combination of,  you"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":304.146,"endTime":308.52,"body":"know, a proactive government whether"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":308.52,"endTime":313.18,"body":"geography has sort of advanced offsite"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":308.52,"endTime":313.18,"body":"construction and the uptake of it."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":313.185,"endTime":316.995,"body":"And perhaps, you know, it's locality"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":313.185,"endTime":316.995,"body":"close to Europe, for example,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":316.995,"endTime":319.815,"body":"where there is, you know, in other"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":316.995,"endTime":319.815,"body":"countries there's a widespread"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":320.395,"endTime":321.585,"body":"adoption of offsite construction."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":322.37,"endTime":326.262,"body":"There's a great mindset"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":322.37,"endTime":326.262,"body":"in the UK that Australia is this"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":326.309,"endTime":329.519,"body":"paradise of perfect weather, but"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":326.309,"endTime":329.519,"body":"it's not always true, actually."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":329.519,"endTime":332.109,"body":"I think we have more and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":329.519,"endTime":332.109,"body":"more extreme weather events."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":332.109,"endTime":335.289,"body":"We have bush fires, we have heat,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":332.109,"endTime":335.289,"body":"we've had flooding in New South"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":335.289,"endTime":340.119,"body":"Wales quite a lot, and El Niño or  La"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":335.289,"endTime":340.119,"body":"Niña continuing year after year."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":340.404,"endTime":341.634,"body":"What do you think, Simon?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":341.714,"endTime":345.474,"body":"Are lost time impacts due to weather"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":341.714,"endTime":345.474,"body":"events a big deal in Australia"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":345.744,"endTime":349.234,"body":"and does DfMA or MMC have an"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":345.744,"endTime":349.234,"body":"opportunity  to alleviate that?"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":350.224,"endTime":351.2,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":351.207,"endTime":355.263,"body":"There's a presentation I saw last month"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":351.207,"endTime":355.263,"body":"where it was revealed in the first"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":355.263,"endTime":359.217,"body":"six months of this year in Sydney,"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":355.263,"endTime":359.217,"body":"which would actually be our biggest"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":359.217,"endTime":361.017,"body":"economy that there was 70 rain days."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":361.437,"endTime":365.457,"body":"So if you, you've got approximately"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":361.437,"endTime":365.457,"body":"180 work days in the six"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":365.457,"endTime":368.307,"body":"months, you've got 70 rain days."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":368.527,"endTime":372.601,"body":"That's over a third of the work days"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":368.527,"endTime":372.601,"body":"for lost due rain in, in the one state."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":373.141,"endTime":376.831,"body":"So there's definitely an opportunity"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":373.141,"endTime":376.831,"body":"there for offsite construction to"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":377.221,"endTime":380.244,"body":"reap back some of that time that"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":377.221,"endTime":380.244,"body":"could be done in the factory."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":380.604,"endTime":384.084,"body":"Obviously there's some earthworks"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":380.604,"endTime":384.084,"body":"that can't be stalled, but there's no"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":384.084,"endTime":387.81,"body":"reason why parts of the building that"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":384.084,"endTime":387.81,"body":"can be manufactured offsite, be done"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":387.81,"endTime":392.04,"body":"at the same time as the earthworks are"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":387.81,"endTime":392.04,"body":"being done or being stored due to rain."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":392.11,"endTime":397.388,"body":"So the, the uptake in offsite construction"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":392.11,"endTime":397.388,"body":"is definitely something that more and"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":397.393,"endTime":401.069,"body":"more builders need to look at, not just"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":397.393,"endTime":401.069,"body":"in New South Wales, but you're right"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":401.074,"endTime":404.649,"body":"in Victoria we've had some big issues"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":401.074,"endTime":404.649,"body":"with the bush fires and extreme heat."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":404.737,"endTime":406.151,"body":"And the same in Queensland as well."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":406.818,"endTime":410.328,"body":"So you've had a long"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":406.818,"endTime":410.328,"body":"experience, Simon, in Australia"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":410.328,"endTime":413.838,"body":"and the industry, and particularly"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":410.328,"endTime":413.838,"body":"working with Victorian government."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":414.048,"endTime":417.268,"body":"Martin's talked a bit about"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":414.048,"endTime":417.268,"body":"the UK government context."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":417.268,"endTime":420.804,"body":"Do you think the Australian governments"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":417.268,"endTime":420.804,"body":"are doing what they should be doing"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":420.804,"endTime":424.171,"body":"to support MMC adoption, or do you"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":420.804,"endTime":424.171,"body":"think they could be doing more."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":424.756,"endTime":425.474,"body":"I do."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":425.478,"endTime":430.008,"body":"The big advantage that they have in"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":425.478,"endTime":430.008,"body":"the UK is a central government and"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":430.038,"endTime":433.218,"body":"that means that there's a lot less"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":430.038,"endTime":433.218,"body":"coordination that needs to happen."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":433.668,"endTime":436.518,"body":"So what we're finding in"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":433.668,"endTime":436.518,"body":"Australia at the moment is that"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":436.818,"endTime":438.678,"body":"Victoria is going one direction."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":438.858,"endTime":440.778,"body":"New South Wales is going one direction."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":441.163,"endTime":446.113,"body":"They're both talking about DfMA or MMC,"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":441.163,"endTime":446.113,"body":"but they're both taking a different"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":446.113,"endTime":450.283,"body":"approach and don't seem to be really"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":446.113,"endTime":450.283,"body":"talking to each other or sharing that"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":450.283,"endTime":451.663,"body":"knowledge between the two of them."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":452.173,"endTime":455.923,"body":"There is a lot of interest in what's"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":452.173,"endTime":455.923,"body":"happening in the UK and Europe,"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":455.926,"endTime":457.755,"body":"parts of Asia and of course America."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":457.79,"endTime":459.614,"body":"Victoria appears to be leading the way."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":460.119,"endTime":464.439,"body":"So about five years ago, they had a"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":460.119,"endTime":464.439,"body":"permanent modular skill building program,"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":464.859,"endTime":468.774,"body":"which was a hundred permanent modular"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":464.859,"endTime":468.774,"body":"skill buildings,  and that increased"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":468.864,"endTime":473.972,"body":"the, the number of offsite fabricators"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":468.864,"endTime":473.972,"body":"who specialized in this area  from about"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":473.972,"endTime":476.289,"body":"four or five to 16 in those four years."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":476.419,"endTime":480.559,"body":"And just recently the, the Victorian"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":476.419,"endTime":480.559,"body":"government has released their offsite"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":480.559,"endTime":484.819,"body":"construction guideline for a lot of"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":480.559,"endTime":484.819,"body":"their departments and developers,"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":484.819,"endTime":487.99,"body":"if they wish, to start utilising"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":484.819,"endTime":487.99,"body":"the knowledge that is already there."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":488.324,"endTime":490.483,"body":"In New South Wales, school's"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":488.324,"endTime":490.483,"body":"infrastructure appear to"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":490.483,"endTime":491.623,"body":"be leading the way as well."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":491.96,"endTime":494.99,"body":"They've done a comprehensive study"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":491.96,"endTime":494.99,"body":"over the last couple of years"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":495.08,"endTime":498.288,"body":"leading with their own DfMA design"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":495.08,"endTime":498.288,"body":"guideline for their schools."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":498.288,"endTime":501.796,"body":"That seems to be developing beyond"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":498.288,"endTime":501.796,"body":"the volumetric and kit of parts"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":501.796,"endTime":505.664,"body":"and towards an integrated approach"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":501.796,"endTime":505.664,"body":"and platform based approach."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":505.676,"endTime":509.666,"body":"It's still in the early days, but the"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":505.676,"endTime":509.666,"body":"progress in the interest in Modern Methods"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":509.666,"endTime":511.436,"body":"of Construction is definitely there."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":512.616,"endTime":516.32,"body":"And just recently Queensland as"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":512.616,"endTime":516.32,"body":"well with their homes in Queensland."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":516.323,"endTime":520.207,"body":"There's been a recent expression of"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":516.323,"endTime":520.207,"body":"interest released to find out how"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":520.212,"endTime":524.21,"body":"they can utilize the market to to"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":520.212,"endTime":524.21,"body":"get Modern Methods of Construction"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":524.269,"endTime":527.334,"body":"as an approach towards building"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":524.269,"endTime":527.334,"body":"more affordable and social housing."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":527.607,"endTime":529.409,"body":"You mentioned"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":527.607,"endTime":529.409,"body":"platform approaches there."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":529.409,"endTime":530.939,"body":"I'll just touch on that briefly."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":530.939,"endTime":535.799,"body":"And in the UK, P-DfMA or a platform"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":530.939,"endTime":535.799,"body":"approach to DfMA is a hot topic, and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":535.799,"endTime":538.889,"body":"it's something that Bryden Wood have"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":535.799,"endTime":538.889,"body":"been very close to the development of the"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":538.894,"endTime":543.953,"body":"theory and in practice with The Forge  in"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":538.894,"endTime":543.953,"body":"Southbank commercial project with Landsec."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":543.969,"endTime":551.278,"body":"Platform approach to DfMA goes beyond"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":543.969,"endTime":551.278,"body":"individual project based pre-fabrication,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":551.278,"endTime":554.766,"body":"and starts to look more at whole"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":551.278,"endTime":554.766,"body":"frameworks of projects or even"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":554.766,"endTime":560.142,"body":"multi-sector application of standardised"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":554.766,"endTime":560.142,"body":"components across schools and hospitals"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":560.142,"endTime":564.241,"body":"and prisons  and all sorts of different"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":560.142,"endTime":564.241,"body":"types of projects to deliver much greater"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":564.241,"endTime":568.532,"body":"economy of scale and much greater benefits"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":564.241,"endTime":568.532,"body":"to both the public and private sectors."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":569.792,"endTime":574.562,"body":"Martin, did you see much evidence"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":569.792,"endTime":574.562,"body":"of a platform approach to DfMA being"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":574.562,"endTime":577.742,"body":"more widely adopted or embraced in"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":574.562,"endTime":577.742,"body":"the UK while you were over there?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":577.742,"endTime":581.722,"body":"And how does the platform design"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":577.742,"endTime":581.722,"body":"philosophy particularly align"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":581.722,"endTime":583.652,"body":"with you in your role at PTBlink?"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":585.112,"endTime":588.328,"body":"Yeah, look so with PT"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":585.112,"endTime":588.328,"body":"Blink, you know, the way we create"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":588.328,"endTime":592.468,"body":"buildings is through a component"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":588.328,"endTime":592.468,"body":"based platform delivery model."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":592.663,"endTime":597.106,"body":"In the UK, I certainly saw the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":592.663,"endTime":597.106,"body":"appetite for a platform delivery, it"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":597.106,"endTime":601.466,"body":"was definitely a hot topic at some"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":597.106,"endTime":601.466,"body":"of the conferences that I went to."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":601.485,"endTime":603.67,"body":"There were a lot of"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":601.485,"endTime":603.67,"body":"people talking about it."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":603.722,"endTime":609.559,"body":"Look, I met, for example, with  Easi"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":603.722,"endTime":609.559,"body":"Space who were part of the, the Forge"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":609.859,"endTime":612.022,"body":"and went to see their, their factory."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":612.383,"endTime":613.733,"body":"Really impressive stuff."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":614.497,"endTime":618.787,"body":"Whether it's through my work with PT"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":614.497,"endTime":618.787,"body":"Blink or what I saw in the UK, and"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":618.847,"endTime":622.459,"body":"you know, what I've learned through"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":618.847,"endTime":622.459,"body":"attending the various webinars on the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":622.489,"endTime":627.38,"body":"platform rule book is that  a component"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":622.489,"endTime":627.38,"body":"based platform approach is certainly a"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":627.38,"endTime":632.36,"body":"way to help engage the SMEs, to engage"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":627.38,"endTime":632.36,"body":"the full market local manufacturing."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":632.72,"endTime":636.08,"body":"You know, we, we will"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":632.72,"endTime":636.08,"body":"certainly see smaller companies"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":636.44,"endTime":638.31,"body":"rise, the rise of startups."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":638.786,"endTime":643.016,"body":"Because really they can do a repeat"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":638.786,"endTime":643.016,"body":"component and that component can be"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":643.256,"endTime":648.866,"body":"a small part of the build, but it"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":643.256,"endTime":648.866,"body":"enables those smaller manufacturers"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":648.871,"endTime":653.88,"body":"to get engaged into the supply chain"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":648.871,"endTime":653.88,"body":"rather than just a few big players"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":653.88,"endTime":658.17,"body":"producing, you know, 60% of the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":653.88,"endTime":658.17,"body":"building, whatever they can produce,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":658.17,"endTime":660.323,"body":"a small percentage of the building."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":660.649,"endTime":666.339,"body":"So in terms of a sort of"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":660.649,"endTime":666.339,"body":"socioeconomical advantages, I feel that."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":666.603,"endTime":669.98,"body":"It's been that component based"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":666.603,"endTime":669.98,"body":"platform delivery model has certainly"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":669.98,"endTime":676.798,"body":"been recognised by government, by"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":669.98,"endTime":676.798,"body":"industry as engaging the whole supply"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":676.798,"endTime":678.598,"body":"chain into this delivery model."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":678.932,"endTime":685.293,"body":"So yeah, it, it was great to see how,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":678.932,"endTime":685.293,"body":"I suppose, advanced the mindset in the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":685.293,"endTime":690.23,"body":"UK of that form of delivery whereas,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":685.293,"endTime":690.23,"body":"as Simon touched on,  we are seeing"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":690.35,"endTime":694.32,"body":"some state governments and all that"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":690.35,"endTime":694.32,"body":"recognise it, but it's still very,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":694.32,"endTime":696.26,"body":"very, very early stages over here."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":697.663,"endTime":698.943,"body":"Thanks Martin."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":699.034,"endTime":704.347,"body":"You mentioned Easi Space and some smaller"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":699.034,"endTime":704.347,"body":"SMEs and innovation and kind of fostering"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":704.347,"endTime":708.735,"body":"that innovative thinking among fabricators"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":704.347,"endTime":708.735,"body":"and smaller suppliers is really a driver"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":708.735,"endTime":713.935,"body":"for change and improvement in, in MMC"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":708.735,"endTime":713.935,"body":"and we've definitely seen that in the UK."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":714.43,"endTime":718.42,"body":"Do you think that the construction"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":714.43,"endTime":718.42,"body":"ecosystem in Australia is"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":718.42,"endTime":719.95,"body":"really set up to support that?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":719.95,"endTime":721.36,"body":"Is it set up in the right way?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":721.36,"endTime":724.36,"body":"Do we have the right blend"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":721.36,"endTime":724.36,"body":"of SMEs and main contractors?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":724.41,"endTime":726.843,"body":"Or do you think that there needs"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":724.41,"endTime":726.843,"body":"to be a shift in the way that"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":726.843,"endTime":728.613,"body":"we treat construction projects?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":728.618,"endTime":731.553,"body":"It would be good to get both of your"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":728.618,"endTime":731.553,"body":"views on this, maybe starting with Martin."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":732.501,"endTime":732.801,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":732.801,"endTime":737.833,"body":"I think at the moment the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":732.801,"endTime":737.833,"body":"supply chain is quite immature."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":737.856,"endTime":741.829,"body":"You know, we're seeing a lot of"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":737.856,"endTime":741.829,"body":"the offsite construction projects"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":741.834,"endTime":744.709,"body":"or the, the projects delivered"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":741.834,"endTime":744.709,"body":"through offsite construction."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":744.732,"endTime":746.463,"body":"A lot of them have been volumetric."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":746.553,"endTime":750.393,"body":"We are seeing a shift towards more"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":746.553,"endTime":750.393,"body":"panelised  as well, and a kit of"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":750.393,"endTime":757.767,"body":"parts but I think that evolution from"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":750.393,"endTime":757.767,"body":"volumetric modules to components and"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":757.767,"endTime":763.977,"body":"components supplied by a variety of"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":757.767,"endTime":763.977,"body":"suppliers, not just one supplier."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":764.024,"endTime":769.077,"body":"Is certainly evolving over here, but"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":764.024,"endTime":769.077,"body":"it's nowhere near advanced  as the UK."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":769.133,"endTime":772.165,"body":"We kind of need a shift"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":769.133,"endTime":772.165,"body":"in mindset as well."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":772.165,"endTime":772.709,"body":"I feel."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":774.224,"endTime":779.308,"body":"The smaller companies aren't set up so"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":774.224,"endTime":779.308,"body":"well to deliver through this methodology."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":779.308,"endTime":783.341,"body":"We've also gotta look at procurement,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":779.308,"endTime":783.341,"body":"a lot of the typical DNC design"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":783.341,"endTime":788.823,"body":"and construct contracts don't"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":783.341,"endTime":788.823,"body":"necessarily enable the SMEs to deliver"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":788.823,"endTime":790.383,"body":"through this sort of methodology."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":790.653,"endTime":793.287,"body":"You know particularly when you"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":790.653,"endTime":793.287,"body":"look at payment for offsite"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":793.287,"endTime":794.317,"body":"materials and the like."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":794.322,"endTime":798.767,"body":"So in order to enable the platform"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":794.322,"endTime":798.767,"body":"approach, there needs to be a"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":798.767,"endTime":803.147,"body":"holistic change in the way we"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":798.767,"endTime":803.147,"body":"deliver construction projects."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":803.417,"endTime":807.077,"body":"So from, I suppose, a"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":803.417,"endTime":807.077,"body":"mindset using smaller."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":807.992,"endTime":812.01,"body":"Multiple smaller suppliers as"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":807.992,"endTime":812.01,"body":"well as the procurement as well"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":812.01,"endTime":815.43,"body":"through, you know, different"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":812.01,"endTime":815.43,"body":"contracting methodologies as well."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":816.367,"endTime":819.661,"body":"You've also got the,"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":816.367,"endTime":819.661,"body":"the Construction Innovation Hub  which"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":819.721,"endTime":824.77,"body":"was a collaboration between builders,"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":819.721,"endTime":824.77,"body":"designers integrators, you, you name it."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":824.83,"endTime":827.68,"body":"And it had everyone from tier"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":824.83,"endTime":827.68,"body":"four to tier one builders."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":828.04,"endTime":831.986,"body":"It had small architectural firms,"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":828.04,"endTime":831.986,"body":"large architectural firms, small"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":831.986,"endTime":835.286,"body":"engineering firms, large engineering"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":831.986,"endTime":835.286,"body":"firms, and everyone felt heard."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":835.796,"endTime":838.286,"body":"And the result of that"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":835.796,"endTime":838.286,"body":"are, are two main reports."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":838.346,"endTime":841.796,"body":"One of them is the Value Toolkit"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":838.346,"endTime":841.796,"body":"in how to Design to Value."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":842.636,"endTime":845.386,"body":"And the other one is"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":842.636,"endTime":845.386,"body":"the Platform Rulebook."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":845.966,"endTime":849.086,"body":"So when people say what is a"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":845.966,"endTime":849.086,"body":"platform, it actually shows you"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":849.086,"endTime":852.956,"body":"what a platform is intended to do"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":849.086,"endTime":852.956,"body":"and how to actually incorporate"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":852.956,"endTime":854.456,"body":"that during the design process."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":854.816,"endTime":857.786,"body":"And we need something like"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":854.816,"endTime":857.786,"body":"that in Australia that the"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":857.846,"endTime":859.376,"body":"platform system will work here."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":859.636,"endTime":862.946,"body":"It it really will and it will get"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":859.636,"endTime":862.946,"body":"rid of a lot of the stigma that"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":862.946,"endTime":864.506,"body":"comes with offsite construction."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":864.741,"endTime":865.984,"body":"What is a kit of parts?"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":866.033,"endTime":870.083,"body":"Modular only means you can go to a modular"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":866.033,"endTime":870.083,"body":"fabricator that's not right anymore."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":870.203,"endTime":874.819,"body":"The platform system brings everyone into"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":870.203,"endTime":874.819,"body":"play and increases that supply chain."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":874.819,"endTime":876.401,"body":"Exactly what Martin is talking about."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":876.853,"endTime":880.783,"body":"It's that ability that everyone has"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":876.853,"endTime":880.783,"body":"been heard, looking how's is it done?"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":881.383,"endTime":882.613,"body":"It 's right there for you."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":884.353,"endTime":884.623,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":884.623,"endTime":888.008,"body":"So on that further to your point,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":884.623,"endTime":888.008,"body":"Simon, the, the Platform Rulebook"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":888.078,"endTime":893.158,"body":"is great because it outlines the key"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":888.078,"endTime":893.158,"body":"principles, the rules, et cetera,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":893.158,"endTime":896.323,"body":"that enable a, a platform delivery."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":896.323,"endTime":899.683,"body":"And then, you know, with the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":896.323,"endTime":899.683,"body":"va, the value toolkit I think"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":899.683,"endTime":903.823,"body":"is a great document because, you"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":899.683,"endTime":903.823,"body":"know, it, it helps define value."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":904.153,"endTime":908.738,"body":"I think the construction industry"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":904.153,"endTime":908.738,"body":"has been stuck in this time warp"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":909.18,"endTime":913.857,"body":"of lowest price, maximum risk"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":909.18,"endTime":913.857,"body":"transfer being  the awarded tender."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":914.037,"endTime":918.203,"body":"And, you know, the Value Toolkit"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":914.037,"endTime":918.203,"body":"assists with defining value."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":918.233,"endTime":923.017,"body":"And I think  that's critical because"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":918.233,"endTime":923.017,"body":"one project in one area will have a"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":923.067,"endTime":928.012,"body":"different definition of value to want to"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":923.067,"endTime":928.012,"body":"a different project in a different area."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":928.405,"endTime":930.715,"body":"So I think you, you're dead right there."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":930.985,"endTime":935.875,"body":"I think other countries need to sort"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":930.985,"endTime":935.875,"body":"of emulate the UK with the Construction"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":935.88,"endTime":939.971,"body":"Innovation Hub  with  documents"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":935.88,"endTime":939.971,"body":"like the Value Toolkit, the Platform"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":939.971,"endTime":942.182,"body":"Rulebook to help guide industry."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":942.232,"endTime":944.872,"body":"With the, the value"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":942.232,"endTime":944.872,"body":"toolkit, it goes to show that both"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":944.872,"endTime":948.502,"body":"in the UK and Australia, one thing"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":944.872,"endTime":948.502,"body":"we have in common is that we're not"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":948.502,"endTime":950.692,"body":"building enough, especially homes."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":950.812,"endTime":953.41,"body":"You know, we we're both on a rush"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":950.812,"endTime":953.41,"body":"to build hospitals but we're also"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":953.68,"endTime":955.87,"body":"both way behind on building homes."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":956.241,"endTime":960.2,"body":"And with that shift in mind shift, we need"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":956.241,"endTime":960.2,"body":"everyone to appreciate that if you miss"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":960.2,"endTime":962.11,"body":"out on this job, you can win the next."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":962.675,"endTime":965.195,"body":"You're going to win a"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":962.675,"endTime":965.195,"body":"project down the track."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":965.555,"endTime":969.455,"body":"And the way to do that is to build"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":965.555,"endTime":969.455,"body":"in value, value from the very start"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":969.845,"endTime":972.775,"body":"all the way through to construction"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":969.845,"endTime":972.775,"body":"with good quality construction,"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":972.775,"endTime":973.615,"body":"right through to the end."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":974.065,"endTime":975.235,"body":"Remove those defects."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":975.655,"endTime":978.415,"body":"And that's exactly what the New South"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":975.655,"endTime":978.415,"body":"Wales Building Commissioner is doing"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":978.42,"endTime":982.66,"body":"now, monitoring that, giving the"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":978.42,"endTime":982.66,"body":"builders and the designers a star"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":982.66,"endTime":986.95,"body":"rating so that the public have access"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":982.66,"endTime":986.95,"body":"to this and can see that quality"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":986.95,"endTime":990.17,"body":"and value start right from the very"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":986.95,"endTime":990.17,"body":"beginning of the building process."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":991.47,"endTime":994.62,"body":"It's interesting in"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":991.47,"endTime":994.62,"body":"my experience, and I'm sure in"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":994.95,"endTime":998.76,"body":"in, in your guys day to day job as"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":994.95,"endTime":998.76,"body":"well, we often get asked questions."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":999.57,"endTime":1001.01,"body":"What is a kit of parts?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1001.01,"endTime":1002.39,"body":"I think you said before, Simon."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1002.39,"endTime":1003.29,"body":"What is a part?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1003.35,"endTime":1004.64,"body":"What is DfMA?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1004.85,"endTime":1005.797,"body":"Why would I do it?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1005.827,"endTime":1006.877,"body":"What's in it for me?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1007.177,"endTime":1010.597,"body":"Do you think there really is an"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1007.177,"endTime":1010.597,"body":"understanding in Australia of what"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1010.597,"endTime":1016.177,"body":"these terms mean and what value looks"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1010.597,"endTime":1016.177,"body":"like and the drivers for change?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1016.897,"endTime":1019.797,"body":"Or do you think that  there's a"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1016.897,"endTime":1019.797,"body":"knowledge gap in the market there."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1020.477,"endTime":1020.757,"body":"No, no."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1020.777,"endTime":1025.467,"body":"There, there's a big knowledge gap and"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1020.777,"endTime":1025.467,"body":"the whole industry, especially the big"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1025.467,"endTime":1029.7,"body":"governing bodies like Engineers Australia"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1025.467,"endTime":1029.7,"body":"and the Australian Institute of Architects"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1029.76,"endTime":1034.65,"body":"have a lot to do to educate their"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1029.76,"endTime":1034.65,"body":"designers on what those actually mean."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1035.19,"endTime":1038.32,"body":"Because from the design process that"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1035.19,"endTime":1038.32,"body":"gets passed onto the builders and the"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1038.32,"endTime":1041.72,"body":"builders also need to get educated"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1038.32,"endTime":1041.72,"body":"into what platform and kit of parts."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1041.75,"endTime":1044.114,"body":"And, and panelisation actually means."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1044.6,"endTime":1048.26,"body":"The Australian Institute of Architects"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1044.6,"endTime":1048.26,"body":"had a feedback study last year, the"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1048.26,"endTime":1053.953,"body":"end of last year, where around about"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1048.26,"endTime":1053.953,"body":"43% of their clients are requesting"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1054.313,"endTime":1058.453,"body":"more information on Modern Methods of"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1054.313,"endTime":1058.453,"body":"Construction because they've heard about"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1058.453,"endTime":1062.443,"body":"it, they don't understand themselves"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1058.453,"endTime":1062.443,"body":"what it is, but they do understand"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1062.683,"endTime":1066.221,"body":"that it means better end result for"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1062.683,"endTime":1066.221,"body":"them and better return on investment."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1066.354,"endTime":1068.164,"body":"And what do you"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1066.354,"endTime":1068.164,"body":"think the benefits actually are?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1068.164,"endTime":1071.404,"body":"We've talked a little bit about"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1068.164,"endTime":1071.404,"body":"productivity and the productivity gap."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1071.404,"endTime":1075.724,"body":"We've talked about sustainability and,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1071.404,"endTime":1075.724,"body":"and decarbonisation, which is increasingly"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1075.724,"endTime":1078.584,"body":"a hot topic in Australia as well."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1078.596,"endTime":1084.253,"body":"I think issues like obviously cost savings"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1078.596,"endTime":1084.253,"body":"are there to be had and, and speed of"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1084.253,"endTime":1086.758,"body":"delivery on site is, there to be had."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1086.819,"endTime":1090.003,"body":"What about safety and designing"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1086.819,"endTime":1090.003,"body":"for safety and planning better?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1090.03,"endTime":1091.772,"body":"Health and safety in construction."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1091.772,"endTime":1094.872,"body":"What about the wellbeing of"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1091.772,"endTime":1094.872,"body":"construction site operatives?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1094.886,"endTime":1097.201,"body":"What about what about other efficiencies?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1097.206,"endTime":1100.941,"body":"Do you, do you think there's a common"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1097.206,"endTime":1100.941,"body":"understanding of the full scope of"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1100.941,"endTime":1103.131,"body":"benefits that are available, martin?"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1103.776,"endTime":1103.986,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1103.986,"endTime":1105.624,"body":"Look you touched on safety."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1105.724,"endTime":1108.149,"body":"That's a, a good one and a big one."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1108.149,"endTime":1111.519,"body":"In construction, in undercover"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1108.149,"endTime":1111.519,"body":"construction, construction and"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1111.519,"endTime":1117.189,"body":"shared factory construction is"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1111.519,"endTime":1117.189,"body":"typically much safer, but we're"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1117.189,"endTime":1120.759,"body":"also, seeing innovation, take hold."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1120.759,"endTime":1124.891,"body":"Like I was really impressed"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1120.759,"endTime":1124.891,"body":"to see the Offsite Expo."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1124.951,"endTime":1128.371,"body":"You'll see some of the floor"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1124.951,"endTime":1128.371,"body":"cassettes by a company called Kiss"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1128.371,"endTime":1133.741,"body":"House, and they'd pre-installed"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1128.371,"endTime":1133.741,"body":"edge protection in the factory."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1133.741,"endTime":1138.151,"body":"So they'd thought about safety"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1133.741,"endTime":1138.151,"body":"before they'd even even got to sites."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1140.041,"endTime":1144.165,"body":"Now the other thing I'd like to"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1140.041,"endTime":1144.165,"body":"add about safety is  wellbeing"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1144.285,"endTime":1145.987,"body":"and suicide in construction."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1145.988,"endTime":1150.726,"body":"You know, we are seeing in countries"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1145.988,"endTime":1150.726,"body":"like the UK, you know, things"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1150.731,"endTime":1154.686,"body":"like a worker a day being lost."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1154.686,"endTime":1157.926,"body":"You know, in Australia I think"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1154.686,"endTime":1157.926,"body":"it's every other day a construction"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1157.926,"endTime":1159.936,"body":"worker's lost through suicide."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1160.416,"endTime":1165.567,"body":"And you know, some of the statistics"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1160.416,"endTime":1165.567,"body":"that exist are eye watering with"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1166.047,"endTime":1171.743,"body":"like your 53% more likely to die"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1166.047,"endTime":1171.743,"body":"through suicide at a construction"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1171.743,"endTime":1173.303,"body":"worker than any other industry."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1173.903,"endTime":1179.832,"body":"And you know, it, it's really the,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1173.903,"endTime":1179.832,"body":"the embedded issues with our industry."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1179.882,"endTime":1182.252,"body":"We're seeing that it,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1179.882,"endTime":1182.252,"body":"you know, it's high risk."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1182.552,"endTime":1187.502,"body":"It's typically long working hours,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1182.552,"endTime":1187.502,"body":"people working in, in, you know,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1187.502,"endTime":1189.032,"body":"different parts of the country."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1189.542,"endTime":1194.042,"body":"And through offsite construction,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1189.542,"endTime":1194.042,"body":"we're seeing wellbeing being addressed,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1194.762,"endTime":1199.285,"body":"you know factory workers going to the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1194.762,"endTime":1199.285,"body":"same factory day in, day out, having"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1199.285,"endTime":1203.575,"body":"a set routine, a set work schedule,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1199.285,"endTime":1203.575,"body":"not having to work interstate, not"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1203.575,"endTime":1205.345,"body":"having to travel long distances."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1205.409,"endTime":1208.662,"body":"But we're also seeing that that"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1205.409,"endTime":1208.662,"body":"shift in procurement, you know,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1208.992,"endTime":1213.972,"body":"typically construction is , is a"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1208.992,"endTime":1213.972,"body":"male dominated industry associated"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1213.972,"endTime":1216.192,"body":"with a very, very adversarial."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1217.082,"endTime":1217.692,"body":"Contracting model."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1218.082,"endTime":1222.552,"body":"And we're seeing, you know, with"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1218.082,"endTime":1222.552,"body":"through MMC that that contracting model"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1222.552,"endTime":1225.082,"body":"is evolving to be less adversarial."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1225.086,"endTime":1229.007,"body":"We're seeing contracting models that"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1225.086,"endTime":1229.007,"body":"engage the supply chain much earlier."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1229.227,"endTime":1231.952,"body":"Martin, these wellbeing"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1229.227,"endTime":1231.952,"body":"issues that you raise are really critical."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1231.952,"endTime":1234.948,"body":"I think every life saved,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1231.952,"endTime":1234.948,"body":"every life improved in"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1234.948,"endTime":1236.598,"body":"construction is really important."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1236.603,"endTime":1239.418,"body":"It's all, it's almost the most"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1236.603,"endTime":1239.418,"body":"important issue that there is."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1239.479,"endTime":1243.449,"body":"You mentioned KISS House  with the"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1239.479,"endTime":1243.449,"body":"built-in edge protection for us in"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1243.449,"endTime":1246.649,"body":"Bryden Wood, we are  very happy to have"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1243.449,"endTime":1246.649,"body":"been a part of that project and that"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1246.649,"endTime":1249.124,"body":"was a very digitally driven project."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1249.184,"endTime":1253.414,"body":"So we were able to design those"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1249.184,"endTime":1253.414,"body":"DfMA components and from a very"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1253.414,"endTime":1256.714,"body":"early stage, think about the method"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1253.414,"endTime":1256.714,"body":"statement and think about how that edge"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1256.714,"endTime":1258.514,"body":"protection needed to be incorporated."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1258.514,"endTime":1262.826,"body":"I know PT Blink is also a digital"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1258.514,"endTime":1262.826,"body":"technology company, so across"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1262.831,"endTime":1265.886,"body":"the whole industry we're seeing"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1262.831,"endTime":1265.886,"body":"a lot of overlap between MMC and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1265.886,"endTime":1268.016,"body":"DfMA adoption and digitization."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1268.151,"endTime":1272.651,"body":"The knowledge and the advanced kind"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1268.151,"endTime":1272.651,"body":"of planning that you can get out of"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1272.651,"endTime":1277.407,"body":"digital really lends itself to thinking"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1272.651,"endTime":1277.407,"body":"about construction methodology earlier"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1277.407,"endTime":1279.597,"body":"on and how value can be improved."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1279.665,"endTime":1283.227,"body":"Do you think that there is a link"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1279.665,"endTime":1283.227,"body":"between digital and DfMA, Martin,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1283.227,"endTime":1286.077,"body":"and do you think this is an"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1283.227,"endTime":1286.077,"body":"opportunity maybe  for Australia"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1286.077,"endTime":1287.783,"body":"to take a few giant steps forward?"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1288.584,"endTime":1290.024,"body":"Yeah, definitely massive."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1290.14,"endTime":1297.78,"body":"Look for me, I've come from a trade base"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1290.14,"endTime":1297.78,"body":"and now I'm into a technology space."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1298.58,"endTime":1303.26,"body":"I believe the, the one of the biggest"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1298.58,"endTime":1303.26,"body":"advantages we are gonna see through"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1303.26,"endTime":1309.56,"body":"this transformation into the digital"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1303.26,"endTime":1309.56,"body":"world is that reduction in human error."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1309.89,"endTime":1314.24,"body":"I think the construction industry has"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1309.89,"endTime":1314.24,"body":"been plagued and will be continued"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1314.24,"endTime":1315.75,"body":"to be plagued with human error."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1316.349,"endTime":1321.119,"body":"I think as well, collaboration, you"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1316.349,"endTime":1321.119,"body":"know, to have one platform that everyone"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1321.299,"endTime":1324.039,"body":"inputs into, takes data from as well."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1324.061,"endTime":1328.961,"body":"And we're definitely seeing, you know,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1324.061,"endTime":1328.961,"body":"Australia is advancing with digitisation."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1328.981,"endTime":1330.08,"body":"We're certainly seeing that."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1330.085,"endTime":1334.375,"body":"And the other thing I'd like to say is"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1330.085,"endTime":1334.375,"body":"through digitisation is touching on,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1334.525,"endTime":1339.02,"body":"you know, what the safety point that we,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1334.525,"endTime":1339.02,"body":"we've all talked about, you know, One"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1339.02,"endTime":1343.43,"body":"thing I've seen on projects is, you know,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1339.02,"endTime":1343.43,"body":"that handrail, that edge protection and"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1343.43,"endTime":1350.12,"body":"all that never existed until we sat down"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1343.43,"endTime":1350.12,"body":"with the entire team, the entire project"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1350.12,"endTime":1352.58,"body":"team and someone in the corner piped up."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1353.12,"endTime":1355.55,"body":"When we are going through the simulation,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1353.12,"endTime":1355.55,"body":"we're going through the model."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1355.55,"endTime":1358.42,"body":"Someone in the corner piping"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1355.55,"endTime":1358.42,"body":"up, Hey guys, you realise we"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1358.42,"endTime":1359.87,"body":"need to connect onto something?"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1359.87,"endTime":1363.97,"body":"Or how are you gonna stop us falling"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1359.87,"endTime":1363.97,"body":"when we are putting this together and"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1364.03,"endTime":1369.4,"body":"then, Edge protection or that handrail"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1364.03,"endTime":1369.4,"body":"being designed in before we've built it."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1369.79,"endTime":1373.27,"body":"And that handrail or edge"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1369.79,"endTime":1373.27,"body":"protection hasn't had to be"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1373.27,"endTime":1375.43,"body":"installed due to someone falling."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1375.76,"endTime":1376.33,"body":"Do you know what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1376.33,"endTime":1380.935,"body":"So just those few items alone"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1376.33,"endTime":1380.935,"body":"add significant advantages to the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1380.94,"endTime":1383.935,"body":"way we're gonna be building and"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1380.94,"endTime":1383.935,"body":"the like now and in the future."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1384.355,"endTime":1388.045,"body":"So, you know, I could talk for"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1384.355,"endTime":1388.045,"body":"hours about digitisation,  I think"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1388.045,"endTime":1392.127,"body":"we can definitely other countries"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1388.045,"endTime":1392.127,"body":"where they've embraced digitization"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1393.897,"endTime":1395.823,"body":"to improve construction delivery."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1397.893,"endTime":1402.333,"body":"I mean, it's clear that in,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1397.893,"endTime":1402.333,"body":"in Australia, we're making great progress"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1402.333,"endTime":1407.103,"body":"and every day, every month, every year is,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1402.333,"endTime":1407.103,"body":"is some new exciting stuff and some new"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1407.103,"endTime":1410.793,"body":"exciting opportunities coming out of the"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1407.103,"endTime":1410.793,"body":"conversation is changing very fast, but"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1410.793,"endTime":1412.323,"body":"it's also clear we've got a lot of way to."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1412.334,"endTime":1414.414,"body":"And maybe things need to speed up."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1414.417,"endTime":1416.607,"body":"Maybe things need to improve even faster."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1417.057,"endTime":1418.617,"body":"What do you think, Simon?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1418.617,"endTime":1420.357,"body":"What, what's the catalyst for change?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1420.357,"endTime":1425.907,"body":"Should government policy be changing"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1420.357,"endTime":1425.907,"body":"to, to fast track this adoption?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1427.217,"endTime":1430.806,"body":"I, I think government policy is already"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1427.217,"endTime":1430.806,"body":"there and the two biggest states,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1430.986,"endTime":1435.396,"body":"Survey Victoria has already released"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1430.986,"endTime":1435.396,"body":"their Victorian digital asset strategy."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1435.465,"endTime":1437.715,"body":"I know New South Wales"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1435.465,"endTime":1437.715,"body":"have done a similar thing."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1439.35,"endTime":1442.854,"body":"Sydney is actually building its"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1439.35,"endTime":1442.854,"body":"second major international airport."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1443.334,"endTime":1446.454,"body":"And the township that's being"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1443.334,"endTime":1446.454,"body":"built with that airport is going,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1446.454,"endTime":1447.954,"body":"apparently going to be a digital twin."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1448.524,"endTime":1450.172,"body":"So that's certainly in"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1448.524,"endTime":1450.172,"body":"the right direction."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1450.2,"endTime":1455.254,"body":"So I think the, the main holding"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1450.2,"endTime":1455.254,"body":"back is designers actually seeing the"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1455.254,"endTime":1460.444,"body":"investment in doing that and building"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1455.254,"endTime":1460.444,"body":"owners seeing the investment in allowing"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1460.444,"endTime":1466.808,"body":"for their buildings to be modeled in 3D"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1460.444,"endTime":1466.808,"body":"in high quality high l o D type models"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1466.928,"endTime":1473.468,"body":"and utilizing 3D 4D for the program,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1466.928,"endTime":1473.468,"body":"5D for the cost all the way through"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1473.468,"endTime":1477.988,"body":"to using that digital twin, monitoring"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1473.468,"endTime":1477.988,"body":"the building over the whole life cycle."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1479.097,"endTime":1484.076,"body":"So it really comes down to the private"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1479.097,"endTime":1484.076,"body":"sector as well as the government industry,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1484.076,"endTime":1488.126,"body":"seeing the opportunities and maybe"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1484.076,"endTime":1488.126,"body":"starting to lead the charge and also down"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1488.126,"endTime":1492.506,"body":"to clients, I guess, demanding it and,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1488.126,"endTime":1492.506,"body":"and maybe demanding better service and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1492.511,"endTime":1495.056,"body":"better value from, from the industry."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1495.356,"endTime":1500.921,"body":"Martin, in your role also as the"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1495.356,"endTime":1500.921,"body":"Oceania MMC chair as CIO B do you"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1500.921,"endTime":1503.936,"body":"think that industry bodies like"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1500.921,"endTime":1503.936,"body":"the CIOB have a role to play?"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1504.816,"endTime":1509.526,"body":"Yeah, certainly I"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1504.816,"endTime":1509.526,"body":"think by sharing knowledge, by"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1509.628,"endTime":1514.458,"body":"assisting governments with policy,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1509.628,"endTime":1514.458,"body":"with assisting with legislation."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1514.968,"endTime":1518.837,"body":"But one of the things, you know, we,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1514.968,"endTime":1518.837,"body":"we've discussed before is, you know,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1518.837,"endTime":1524.052,"body":"really helping to educate those entering"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1518.837,"endTime":1524.052,"body":"the market , you know, students,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1524.052,"endTime":1525.642,"body":"for example, in the universities."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1525.642,"endTime":1530.682,"body":"Because if we, if we look towards"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1525.642,"endTime":1530.682,"body":"those towards the students,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1531.042,"endTime":1533.832,"body":"those students eventually will"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1531.042,"endTime":1533.832,"body":"be the leaders of industry."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1533.862,"endTime":1538.482,"body":"So if we can start them off on the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1533.862,"endTime":1538.482,"body":"right footing, educating them, sharing"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1538.482,"endTime":1542.167,"body":"the knowledge, that's about I think"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1538.482,"endTime":1542.167,"body":"they can really help improve, you"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1542.167,"endTime":1545.917,"body":"know, the construction industry for"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1542.167,"endTime":1545.917,"body":"the now, but also for the future."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1546.569,"endTime":1550.349,"body":"Sharing knowledge and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1546.569,"endTime":1550.349,"body":"collaborating is such a laudable goal."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1550.466,"endTime":1554.494,"body":"And openness and transparency"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1550.466,"endTime":1554.494,"body":"I think is really important to"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1554.502,"endTime":1557.387,"body":"facilitating this fast track adoption."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1557.459,"endTime":1559.999,"body":"Simon, do you think Australian"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1557.459,"endTime":1559.999,"body":"companies are holding IP to"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1559.999,"endTime":1560.639,"body":"personal interests they're just."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1562.684,"endTime":1564.034,"body":"They are, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1564.108,"endTime":1567.846,"body":"But there, there's also studies"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1564.108,"endTime":1567.846,"body":"that are coming out to show that"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1567.85,"endTime":1572.32,"body":"parametric and generic modeling, both"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1567.85,"endTime":1572.32,"body":"in Australia and the UK is increased."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1573.475,"endTime":1577.191,"body":"The knowledge of it, the capability of it"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1573.475,"endTime":1577.191,"body":"and the knowledge sharing of it is getting"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1577.191,"endTime":1580.431,"body":"better and better, but it's only very"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1577.191,"endTime":1580.431,"body":"recent that that's actually happening."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1580.489,"endTime":1581.771,"body":"We have an aging workforce."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1582.251,"endTime":1584.561,"body":"We don't have enough students"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1582.251,"endTime":1584.561,"body":"coming through universities"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1584.561,"endTime":1586.481,"body":"and TAFE colleges to train up."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1586.549,"endTime":1591.421,"body":"Martin's absolutely spot on about training"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1586.549,"endTime":1591.421,"body":"those students in the junior professionals"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1591.488,"endTime":1593.15,"body":"type skill them ready for the future."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1593.69,"endTime":1595.954,"body":"And I, I think the"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1593.69,"endTime":1595.954,"body":"smarter that we actually."},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1596.684,"endTime":1600.202,"body":"Working, design and construction"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1596.684,"endTime":1600.202,"body":"we're not gonna be lagging behind with"},{"speaker":"Simon McCarthy","startTime":1600.202,"endTime":1601.509,"body":"more and more people going homeless."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1603.149,"endTime":1605.949,"body":"One last question for Martin."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1606.002,"endTime":1609.842,"body":"Do you think that the federal government"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1606.002,"endTime":1609.842,"body":"should be doing more in Australia?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1609.847,"endTime":1614.031,"body":"We've heard quite a lot tonight"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1609.847,"endTime":1614.031,"body":"about the states and we are a very"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1614.031,"endTime":1618.103,"body":"a state based country, but do you"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1614.031,"endTime":1618.103,"body":"think we need more federal leadership?"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1618.133,"endTime":1620.983,"body":"Do you think something like a"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1618.133,"endTime":1620.983,"body":"National Construction innovation hub"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1620.983,"endTime":1622.423,"body":"in Australia would be a good idea?"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1624.278,"endTime":1626.969,"body":"I think it would"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1624.278,"endTime":1626.969,"body":"definitely to have some, some"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1626.969,"endTime":1628.589,"body":"sort of central government lead."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1629.039,"endTime":1632.501,"body":"But look, let's face it, let's face"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1629.039,"endTime":1632.501,"body":"reality for that to happen to break"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1632.501,"endTime":1634.661,"body":"through all the various states."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1635.441,"endTime":1640.571,"body":"It may be a, a huge task for that to"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1635.441,"endTime":1640.571,"body":"happen, certainly in the short term."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1640.961,"endTime":1645.763,"body":"So it may be that we have certain"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1640.961,"endTime":1645.763,"body":"states, Leading by example and the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1645.763,"endTime":1650.203,"body":"other states following the lead,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1645.763,"endTime":1650.203,"body":"and certainly that collaboration and"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1650.203,"endTime":1652.299,"body":"knowledge share across the states."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1652.299,"endTime":1658.424,"body":"Could in the short term, fulfill"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1652.299,"endTime":1658.424,"body":"what  a centralised federal, state"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1658.424,"endTime":1660.584,"body":"construction innovation hub would fulfill."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1660.584,"endTime":1664.584,"body":"But you know, as Simon said earlier,"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1660.584,"endTime":1664.584,"body":"certainly in the UK there isn't that"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1664.584,"endTime":1669.714,"body":"separation of the states as there"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1664.584,"endTime":1669.714,"body":"is here and also in, in the us."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1670.104,"endTime":1673.956,"body":"So, Yeah, maybe it's putting"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1670.104,"endTime":1673.956,"body":"the competition out there"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1674.226,"endTime":1675.526,"body":"with the various states."},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1675.526,"endTime":1678.838,"body":"So one, one state can lead the"},{"speaker":"Martin Fenn","startTime":1675.526,"endTime":1678.838,"body":"charge and the others will follow."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1680.138,"endTime":1682.148,"body":"we just keep"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1680.138,"endTime":1682.148,"body":"circling back to this."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1682.458,"endTime":1686.771,"body":"Same comment of collaboration and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1682.458,"endTime":1686.771,"body":"knowledge sharing between states between"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1686.771,"endTime":1691.121,"body":"countries, between the UK and Australia,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1686.771,"endTime":1691.121,"body":"for example, between companies and the"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1691.181,"endTime":1696.701,"body":"private sector and with the public sector"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1691.181,"endTime":1696.701,"body":"and with universities, with students, and"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1696.706,"endTime":1700.841,"body":"with research partners and with everybody"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1696.706,"endTime":1700.841,"body":"in the construction industry sharing more,"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1700.841,"endTime":1702.341,"body":"I think it's a vision we can all get."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1702.693,"endTime":1703.893,"body":"Thanks for sharing, guys."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1703.893,"endTime":1705.723,"body":"It's been a really great discussion."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1705.753,"endTime":1709.434,"body":"I think there's been a lot of interesting"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1705.753,"endTime":1709.434,"body":"insights, and I hope everyone listening"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1709.439,"endTime":1711.994,"body":"in found that as interesting as I did."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1712.017,"endTime":1713.667,"body":"Thank you Martin, and thank you Simon."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1714.777,"endTime":1714.957,"body":"Pleasure."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1715.887,"endTime":1716.397,"body":"Thanks guys."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1716.947,"endTime":1717.747,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1717.752,"endTime":1720.867,"body":"Thank you to all the listeners"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1717.752,"endTime":1720.867,"body":"for listening, and please join"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1720.867,"endTime":1723.447,"body":"us again for the next edition"},{"speaker":"Adam Jordan","startTime":1720.867,"endTime":1723.447,"body":"of Built Environment Matters."}]}