The Fire You Carry
Hosted by Nole and Kevin, two active-duty Los Angeles County Firemen with over a decade of service each, this podcast explores the fire we all carry within. Join them as they interview respected men and share lessons on how to be better husbands, fathers, and leaders. Drawing from the front lines, they tackle issues like trauma, fitness, and family life, providing universal principles for any man looking to stoke his inner fire and live with purpose.
The Fire You Carry
150: Pronouns & Why Nole Doesn't Train Jiu Jitsu, But You Should.
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Kevin & Nole are back with their thoughts on how to teach their kids about topics they didn't deal with growing up, in this case, pronouns. They also get into why Nole doesn't train Jiu Jitsu but he thinks you should. Finally, they discuss how to deal with the things in life you will miss as part of the life of a first responder. Check out the links below!
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Welcome back to the Fire you Carry podcast. In today's episode, join us as we discuss things as wide-ranging as pronouns yes, those pronouns being brutally honest with people. I personally don't train Jiu-Jitsu, but I think you should and we talk about the things that you will miss when you are a firefighter or a first responder, what you should think about that and what you should do about it. Thank you for listening, Enjoy.
Speaker 1This episode is brought to you by Tip of the Spear Psychotherapy. This is our buddy, dr Mike Desena. He has been on the podcast twice. He is a certified clinician and he has his own practice that I have personally gone to and I found it to be immensely helpful in my own personal life and in my journey. Dr Mike is an incredible dude. He is a combat veteran, so we think he does know the first responder angle and he's very knowledgeable at what he does.
Speaker 1It gets to the root of the problem really quick. Dr Mike and his team of Tip of the Spear Psychotherapy have been fantastic and we want you if that is something that you're interested in, because we talk about therapy being beneficial, as for marriage and for personal reasons we definitely think you should look him up, schedule an appointment and get into it. It's into the storm Nobody wants to do this stuff, but it's always the best. Go into the storm and start handling this stuff and I think he will be better for it. So we'll put links into the show notes for all the contact information on how to get ahold of Dr Mike and his team and also links to his episodes if you're interested in listening to that.
Speaker 2We also want to give a huge shout out to FNA Credit Union. They have been really huge supporters of the FIRA program and they have been donating money specifically to help us cover the cost of feeding the guys up there. They are our biggest supporter by far and we just want to give them a shout out. We deeply appreciate their support. If you're in the firefighter community and you need any kind of financial services, even if you don't need financial services, they are worth checking out because in a lot of areas they have better rates and better products than probably where you're at now. So links to check them out will be in the show notes and we just want to say thank you again to FNA Credit.
Speaker 1Union, fna is incredible. I'm just going to say I used to be in the banking world before I was a fireman. If you go to Chase Bank, bank of America, any of those you are just a number on the wall. I think the biggest advantage of using a credit union is the personal touch. Susan Mariote and her team they have four or five people that you can call personally and we'll put links to that with their contact information. That if you had any information on a loan, if you want to get a brodozer or if you just want to have help looking at your financial future and saying how are we going to make this work. They're fantastic and that's the difference between a credit union and any other bank. So we highly suggest you check them out and thank you to the FNA team for supporting our mission. It's been incredible what you guys have done. Welcome back to the fire you carry. We are your hosts. I'm Kevin Welsh, I am Noel Lilly and today I have the man Flue. Man Flue is real, you're sick.
Speaker 1Yeah, the whole house is sick and it is fun. Have you ever seen those memes online where it's like the man Flue, it's like everyone else is like, it's all attention on the man.
Speaker 2It's devastating dude.
Speaker 1Yeah, man Flue is real. It is funny because the kids they're going through it. They missed a couple of days at school but they're sick and they're still going. And then Harmony's been sick and she just, you know, powers through. And today I'm like, don't touch me, I'm on the couch, man Flue, a man through. So I'm fighting through man Flue, if you can hear that, yeah, dude, the women of the world.
Speaker 2They have to endure whatever they get, I don't know, woman flu perhaps, and they have to still take care of the kids and take care of the house and all those things. But I just, you know, as a man, you just know they don't get sick like we do.
Speaker 1It doesn't hit them as hard.
Speaker 2It's just science and God made it that way so that they could survive and continue to take care of us and the kids. But when we get sick it's devastating. I mean, if you've never experienced it because you're not a man, I'm sorry, but it's real.
Speaker 1It's real man. I'm not saying nothing, maybe I am saying this, but she does get about nine or 10 hours of sleep, because this is she has the gift where she can fall asleep my wife within 14 seconds of saying good night. That's a gift. I don't have that. I know you have that kind of gift.
Speaker 1Maybe that's from the army, but me it's like an hour of like winding down and breathing, and even then I'll still like no TV, no blue lights in the room, the room's cold and I still can't sleep. So I do think that was it. I was at work for like 48 hours of no sleep and I came home with man flu, but it is.
Speaker 1I don't know if you've ever been sick at work. It is not a fun thing. So I'm trying to get well today because I go to work for three days and one of them's a recall in the middle at 20. So I'm anticipating a minimal sleep for three days. So we'll see how the man flu goes.
Speaker 2Godspeed, godspeed.
Speaker 1We're talking about this because we have a program, we have class seven is coming up next weekend and, if anybody, the fill day is coming up and if anybody is getting their days off, we have some open spots because of cancellations.
Speaker 1Staffing is an issue for firefighters, and so we do have some open spots. But at the program we do jujitsu because we have the Dave Tebow who is a such a high level black belt and jujitsu and he does this introductory jujitsu thing, which has been awesome, and guys go up there and it's in a non competitive format. We get to learn how to be a little bit more dangerous, or and he goes into lengthy explanations of what it's done for him in his personal life, and I think there's a lot of value there. It's one of those things, though, that no one are so foreign. It's so foreign to me. And then, obviously, we're running the program and I have learned quite a bit from Mike Kenobi and Jason Teter, who also lower belts but are practicing jujitsu, and I learned something every time. But you had a thought and I want to see if we can get into that about jujitsu.
Avoid Jiu Jitsu Training With Gun
Speaker 2Yeah, when you get exposed to these guys that are really into jujitsu, you start to feel like it's something that you should do. And if you're a man that listens to podcasts or pays attention to anything out there in the world, you know that some of the best dudes in the world today are currently involved in training jujitsu, and so it's a thing where you start to kind of feel like everybody does it and it's got all these myriad of benefits. So I found myself in a position and not a lot, but a couple of times where guys will ask me why don't you train? And it happens at the program. Because at the program there's guys training and, depending on the amount of guys, I either participate or I don't. If I do participate, I'm clearly a novice.
Speaker 2I know nothing I did, just to be totally clear, I did train jujitsu when I was in the military, but I got out of the military in 2005. So I don't remember any of it, but I had that exposure to it and then I haven't done it since. So I've been thinking about why I don't train Jiu Jitsu. It's something we've talked about in this podcast. I advocate for it, I think it's great, but I don't do it and I'm not going to start, and so I kind of thought it might be fun to talk about why, from my perspective, I don't train Jiu Jitsu. But I think you probably should.
Speaker 1Well, here's a tough thing because I have this. I do have this in the back of my head because we've had Dean Rivera on the show, who is a great fire captain, who's retired, and he didn't start until he was later in life.
Speaker 1Our own Mike Kenobi, who we've had on the show, who runs the program with us as a captain. He didn't start until later in life and there's multiple, multiple guys that start at 45, 50 years old. So I do have this thing in the back of my head that one day, when life slows down a little bit and I can carve out an hour a day, I'm going to get into it. And for me, my injuries have been so substantial the last few years I don't. So why don't you do it at?
Speaker 240 years old. Primary reason is time and family commitments and where I live, so I don't want to go deep into that, but I live far away from any gym and you know our work schedule, so it would be very difficult time-wise to do it Not impossible, but it would be a huge commitment. So that's probably the primary reason right now. Primary to that, though, is just the fact that, on a daily basis, I carry a gun. I have my concealed carry permit and I carry a gun. So, while a skill like Jiu Jitsu and going hand to hand with somebody and fighting is incredibly valuable and might be something that you have to use as a man at some point in your life, I'm in a weird position where, if I had a situation where something was going wrong or whatever, I'm actually not going to go hands on with somebody because I have a weapon. As soon as you go hand to hand with someone, if you have a weapon on your body and something goes wrong, the weapon falls out. They get a hold of it, whatever. It's just a position that you don't want to put yourself in. So my goal, if I get into some sort of altercation with somebody that wants to go hands on is going to be to diffuse the situation and get out of there. I'm not going to fight a guy physically with my hands because there's too much potential for something going wrong there.
Speaker 2What I am not saying so I didn't say this and don't hear me say it I'm not saying that the gun is my answer to every problem on the streets. That's incorrect. The gun is the last resort. I don't ever want to pull that thing out. My primary method of responding to that sort of thing is diffusing the situation and extricating myself from it Hopefully just extricating myself from it, but if I can diffuse it, great. So while I'm not saying that Jiu-Jitsu isn't valuable to me, I am saying that with my current mode of how I operate on a daily basis, it's less valuable than it might be to somebody else. Now are there times and places where I don't have a gun on? Yeah, every day I'm at work, I'm obviously not wearing a gun. So it would be useful and valuable in the context of the days when I'm at work, but that's kind of my primary thing right there. It makes sense.
Speaker 1Yeah, that makes sense. There are guys, though, like our buddy, tim Kennedy, who we've had on the show. Yeah, he's like world class in Jiu-Jitsu. Yeah, I mean, obviously he has his own school and stuff like that and he trains, but obviously that's what he knows and that's what he does, and I don't know what is he Like? One of the most dangerous men in the world. Also, he has one million rounds of ammo in his house, right, allegedly Right, and we've been with him at lunch, and he obviously has the fanny pack with a gun in it too.
Speaker 2Yes.
Speaker 1Right. So, yeah, that's interesting, because I think the first point was is your location and our schedule? Yeah, so, dave Tebowl, I'm going to steal from him, but he always says that if you're going to do Jiu-Jitsu you have to find a location close to your house. If it takes half an hour to get to a gym, you're never going to go. Right, you're never going to go, and so I think that's probably the biggest hurdle.
Speaker 1I don't have that excuse. I have like a phenomenal gym that I've been to that I started training with like less than a mile from my house, but every time I've tried to go recently it hurts so bad because of the neck injury, and so it's actually very humbling for me to not train Jiu-Jitsu, because I really want to and it's almost like it is a goal of mine to get healthy enough to go in there and train, but I'm nervous to try to do it because of the neck injury. But that actually kind of makes sense to me. I think it's wise, because if you said I don't train Jiu-Jitsu because I have a gun well, we've talked about this, dude Like your life is over. If you use that gun in a situation Right Like, you're probably going to get arrested or go to court, especially where we live. I don't know. I think the rules better than the law, oh yeah, but it seems like that would absolutely have to be the last resort, because our whole livelihood would be on the line if you did use it in self-defense.
Speaker 2Yeah, it's not something I want to do. Years ago I had a ranger buddy that came out. He's from Georgia and he's an instructor in SOC-P or the Special Operations Combatus Program. So he's one of the instructors that teaches Special Operations guys their combatus program and their combatus program has a lot of Jiu-Jitsu in it, but it also has a lot of other stuff, and so I went through his four-day course when he was out here and it was brutal and super fun and I learned a ton. A lot of what they do is they incorporate weapon retention stuff into being on the ground or being standing up and fighting with somebody. So it's more and I know law enforcement guys do that all the time too where they train how to keep their guns safe and protected if they are in a physical altercation.
Speaker 1That was the Krav Maga thing that you were doing.
Speaker 2It was at a Krav Maga school, yeah, but it actually wasn't Krav Maga training Got it.
Speaker 1It was work-technical yeah.
Speaker 2It's SOC-P, so it's its own thing. This guy does train Krav Maga. He's one of those guys too. But that was super valuable being in a situation where you have a blue gun on, so you have a fake plastic gun on and you're in a fight with somebody and your whole goal is to keep that weapon out of that guy's hands because he knows you have it and he's trying to get it. So that kind of stuff would be super valuable.
Speaker 2I have no idea where to find that. And again we're back to the excuse of distance. Where would I have to drive to go do something like that? So long-term, it's something that I do hope to get into someday because, apart from being more dangerous as a man and being able to better physically protect myself and my loved ones, we know because I believe my buddies and I've experienced it a little bit myself that there are all kinds of other benefits to training Jiu Jitsu, specifically mental benefits, obviously, health benefits. It's a crazy good workout and there's a lot of great camaraderie that goes on there, like there's just a lot of other ancillary benefits to it that I would love to take advantage of. I'm just not in a place in my life Right now where I am.
Speaker 1Yeah, I think when didn't we talk about this? I think there are some law enforcement agencies across the country that are giving Bonuses based on your level of rank in Jiu Jitsu. Yeah, that's that makes sense to me, because it's just some point in your career. Or if you work in the LA area Multiple times in your career, you're gonna get a new, a tussle and, like you, better know what to do in that tussle.
Speaker 1And I think the point of Jiu Jitsu is that it's always been the smaller person Person could be able to use leverage and locks and chokes to manhandle the other person. That's the reason why hoist Gracie, who started the UFC they they lit the Gracie family Actually chose him because he was the smallest one of the family and they chose him to go over like these Monsters in the UFC because they wanted to prove the point that Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is the the martial art. And so I do. I think you know if you were a female or a smaller in your law enforcement Doesn't have to be a female, but just in law enforcement I think it's probably a must, right even, and they have a gun on them all the time. Yeah, yeah, let's try it, but I'm thinking to myself.
Navigating Uncomfortable Questions and Parental Guidance
Speaker 1What I do see is the I See the quiet confidence of somebody who is high level in Jiu Jitsu. I think of Tebow and I think of Tim Kennedy. They have a confidence that I would not have Because they are in fights all the time in training, right Alright, I don't know if you. How do you explain that? I do see something a little different of those guys. Where they they're, they know without a shadow of doubt that if something happened, they could handle themselves in a situation.
Speaker 2Yeah, and the fun thing about that and I've even heard Tebow say this that almost guarantees that you're never gonna get into a fight, right? Because the other guy can also detect that, like you know, the quote-unquote bad guy who's out there sneaking around looking for somebody to victimize, he's not gonna victimize. The guy who's walking around with his shoulders back in his head up, who is confident, he's just not gonna do it because he knows it's not worth the fight. So it is fascinating that the more you train and that kind of stuff, the less likely it is that it's gonna happen. But that's good, that's not a bad thing. We shouldn't walk around Wanting to get in fights, right, that's not the answer.
Speaker 1No, but that was always a thing. I did have a pass that I'm not proud of, but when I was running the streets of Long Beach, I got in multiple street fights and it was the super loudmouth drunk guy who was screaming at the world that he was gonna beat everybody up. He was the first guy to get knocked out. Yeah, it goes down. He's the first dude. He's the first dude. It's that quiet, confident dude that's not saying anything. That's the one you had to worry about. That's the guy you know.
Speaker 1And I think that, obviously, that Jiu Jitsu has morphed into MMA, where most of the guys that are training jiu jitsu are also training striking, they're also training Muay Thai, they're also training wrestling, and that I'm pretty sure that those guys know how to handle themselves. Like the usc has changed everything. So, yeah, I see a lot of. And then I've watched our own friends who train Consistently and, like they said, it's that physical outlet. They're not worried about the bills or the stress.
Speaker 1When somebody's trying to choke you out. You cannot be stressed about anything else. That's, you're totally present and I've I've trained myself and I do think that it's. It's almost meditative. When you're in there, you're learning something new, your brain is firing off. You know you're trying not to get choked out, you're trying to learn and I wasn't worried about marriage or finances or work or whatever. So I think there's total value there for sure too. And and then I enjoy it when we go up. But yeah, at 44 I think it's a habit thing too, like I haven't put in the time, like T-bo has at 20 years old and developed that over time, where everything seems so hard and I like I'm so sore and so I hurt so bad every time I try it, that man, I'd have to get super healthy and maybe do some Evan Hallquist training before I even come close to going back into there. Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2All right, let's change gears here. All right, all right. Have you ever Listened to, or are you aware of, the AFI record titled? Answer that and stay fashionable.
Speaker 1Yes, I knew you sitting to AFI the other day, but it was more of the like what's that Summer, summer song? Listen to what I say.
Speaker 2Oh, is that on? I'll pull it up, but yes, murder, yes.
Speaker 1Miss murder. That's the song I was just listening to that this morning. What's that record, miss murder?
Speaker 2is what it's, not. Black sails in the sunset, that's way too old. December underground, december underground. Black sails in the sunset is a song, not an album. Yes, anyway, I don't actually want to talk about AFI, I want to talk about the title of that record.
Speaker 2I love AFI. I'll say that up front. I love those guys. But I was listening to them in the car and that record came on and that you album title has always kind of grabbed me and I started thinking about it. Answer that and stay fashionable.
Speaker 2And I thought there's a lot of things in my life that if I were to be asked a direct question about something, a current event or a cultural thing, I'm not going to be able to answer that question in a way that, if I'm honest, appeases current society or, quote unquote, the world. And so I kind of see that as it's almost like a challenge. Like what do you do in a situation where you get asked a question and you know your answer is unpopular? Now I think you should be truthful. You got to be tactical, you got to be kind about it. You don't want to just try to bury the person, but you could go the other way. You could try to answer it and, quote unquote, stay fashionable. Right, I'm going to give you a hypothetical scenario and I'm not going to give you my answer to this, but it's something that, as a dad, I was forced to think about the other day for the first time. So I thought it would be valuable for you other dads out there to also think about this.
Speaker 2My son was talking about hanging out with some new friends and he's 17. He's 17 and his sister was there and she goes. Yeah, we met so and so and they asked North what his pronouns were. And I was sitting on the couch doing something and I was like, well, I suddenly became interested Really and of course my first question was well, north, what did you say? And he's like I said what? And I said okay, and they asked again and he said I don't know. And it got kind of weird and like awkward. And then they kind of went on and talked about something else and I realized that I'm aware of this pronoun debate. Right, it's going on around us in the world. There are people that I interact with at work or otherwise that have their pronouns listed in their you know, their sign off at the end of an email or whatever.
Speaker 2Like I see it, we hear it talked about, but I've never talked about it with my kids. I've never been put in that situation where I've been asked and I'd never talked to my son about it. So he didn't have an answer because, while he was somewhat aware that that was a debate, it wasn't something that we thought about or that I'd ever, you know, as dad, given him my thoughts about. And basically, at his age, I feel like that conversation would be appropriate to have in the sense that here's what I think about it, son, here's how I would handle that.
Speaker 2Here's some other options and you know you decide, you're 17 type of thing, but this is what your dad and mom believe, but it was a conversation we hadn't had. So he got put in a situation where he doesn't know. And our family has values, we have beliefs, but there are areas where maybe I haven't shared those and some of that stuff. I feel like I've run into other situations where I assume that things are understood because I have a strong belief on something but I've never really vocalized it, and so it's not happens all the time, right yeah.
Speaker 2And so we have to be careful about that as dads, and not that you need to go around just talking about you know every, every cultural wind that's blowing. But when it comes to things like drug use, sex, pornography, anything like that, if we don't talk to our kids about that, they don't know how we feel or what we think about that stuff, and that's a challenge to me as much as it is to you guys. But that incident kind of made me think about that as a dad.
Speaker 1And let me ask you they're quite a bit older.
Speaker 2I got to be on top of that stuff.
Speaker 1Well, let me ask you this this is a whole different generation. That wasn't obviously a thing for us at 17. And I don't think it actually will be for us from here on out. Just in the world that we live in right, probably not In the circles we run in and the maybe. I don't think it will be it right. But for his generation and his 17-year-old self, is that something that he has to determine? Is like do I? Because you and I would be like what I don't subscribe to, that I don't have a. You know my name's Noel, my name's Kevin, you know what I mean. But but him, that's probably going to be on if he goes in any job or he has to use email. That'll probably be on every tagline for any corporate job. Is that something that he has to determine and you just say I never have to deal with that but you will or is that something that you think you have to guide?
Speaker 2Yeah, he will definitely have to deal with it. I've talked to other people and parents that have applied for a job or their kids signing up for college or whatever, and it is required in a lot of places for you to put that on your application. And you know that's probably less in my estimation and I don't have a full grasp on this issue, but in my estimation that's probably less important than if you get asked that in a group of friends or potential friends how you answer that Cause on an application. I mean you could literally put America F yeah as your pronouns, right and good luck with that one.
Speaker 2Yeah, well, you're probably not going to get the job, so maybe that's not a good idea, but you could put anything and you know, whatever you don't have to subscribe to it. If you have to do it to fill out the application, then you got to do it. You know, if you want the job, maybe you should go look for another job, or maybe not. Maybe that's the job you want and the job you need, and so you go get it and you do what you got to do. But yeah, in the personal context I think it is, unless something changes dramatically and swings the other way. I think that is something that is going to be required of our kids For sure To deal with and, you know, to a lot of people that's not going to be a big deal, you know.
Speaker 1Well, let's go back to answer the question and stay fashionable. Yeah, obviously that's fashionable in certain circles in the younger generation, but I've always felt like it depends if you answer the question truthfully. It depends, right, because if you have somebody close to you that say, do I look fat in this dress? Right, you have to take a tactical pause and answer the question. But is it truthful to say like I mean you, I mean you, I mean you, I mean you, I mean I just think that you have to take a tactical pause and think about your answer?
Speaker 1Most of the troubles I get into is because I vocalize my first thought, like my first thought is probably an emotional response or a right. But if I'm able to like grab that in the marriage setting or something and say, take a deep breath, you're way better at this, I'm like more of a verbal vomiter, but. But I think like, yeah, you got to answer questions, but I don't know, I don't want to answer a question that will hurt the other person. I don't like hurt their feelings. But if they asked me like, I honestly want you to tell me, without hurting my feelings, what, what do you think? Well then, obviously I'll answer the question.
Navigating Difficult Questions and Honest Feedback
Speaker 2Right, yeah, I don't know. Yeah, no, I think I get. I understand what you're getting at. It wouldn't be appropriate and this is something that I actually did pass on to my son it's not an appropriate situation to drop a bomb on that person and to try to make them feel foolish or stupid or whatever for asking or for having a belief in something like that. It is an appropriate place, if you want to be honest, to go. You know, oh man, I actually have never really thought about that before. You know, tell me more about what you mean. Like you know, buy yourself some time, find a way out. Don't answer the question type of thing. The do I look fat in this question is such a classic dude because that's just. There's no right answer, right?
Speaker 1I mean no, I can't even discuss it on the podcast without getting in trouble. Do you like it? Yes, then I think it's fantastic.
Speaker 2My thing that I tried is that I that I will commonly say and I've never been asked that question verbatim, just to be fair but similar questions and my answer is usually something along the lines of I actually think you look fantastic, but it seems to me like you're not comfortable. Ah, that outfit, so maybe you should wear something less comfortable. And that's true, like I've never been in a situation where that was a lie, but usually I kind of feel like really what you're getting at is you don't like what's going on, right, and so let's just not let's.
Speaker 1that's wise, because my wife will come to me and she'll I haven't gotten really the fat in the dress thing either but she'll say, do you like these shoes? If we're going to a wedding or something right. And I'll just say, well, the event, we're going to be on our feet for the majority of the afternoon and evening and then we're going to be dancing and stuff like that. Are they comfortable and are you? Are you cause? You know what happens? I know we've been together for 20 years. An hour in she's complaining that her shoes hurt and then she doesn't want to take them off and she doesn't want to dance barefoot, and I'm like you should have wore the other flats. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2Yeah, but then you're miserable, right.
Speaker 1So I just say, well, do you have another option? That's comfortable, cause we're going to be on our feet most of the afternoon. And then here's how I handle the shoe question.
Speaker 2We're talking about wife stuff now. We've really transitioned. Yeah, sorry, wives, I'll get a. I'll get a selection of two shoes, two different color shoes, similar types. I'll just say which one of these looks better. Initially I would always say, man, I have no idea, I don't know, but that's not. She doesn't want that. That's not helpful. I just pick and I just pick randomly. I'm just like that one. 99.9% of the time I'm wrong and it's actually the other one that looks better and that's what gets worn out. But at least I'm like on the spot with an answer. I'm like that one's better. I like that one.
Speaker 1Well, I love it, I do get this. So we we obviously have mentored quite a few um up and coming first responders right, and I get a life at least five times I've had somebody that are doing all the right things on paper. They're going back to get their their AA and fire science degree, they become an EMT, they have maybe a fire Academy. They're doing all this stuff and they starting to do oral interviews and we're starting to do the oral interview prep stuff and they're they're deep in the process but they might be 50 pounds overweight and I will take a tactical pause and be honest with them and I do feel like it's necessary for me to say you're spending all this time and putting in so much work.
Speaker 1The reality is you're overweight and you need to work on fitness. That should be your paramount thing because you could do all this work. Finally get your opportunity. You can go in the Academy and if you're out of shape and you're overweight, you'll fail the first week, and so I have been honest with that. That.
Speaker 1I think it's a man to man thing. I haven't dealt with that with women, but I have told women that I think you need to do starting strength I need. I think you should do crossfit because you're innately maybe smaller. You know physically up top, right and like, so I I do know that that could hurt their feelings, but I do feel that it's important to know that what we know, that physical fitness is a requirement for the job and if you don't have it at the start it'll be so much harder. And so I do have that point where I say this might hurt your feelings, but I'm going to be honest with you. You got to lose weight and you got to get fit. And here's step by step, what I, what I believe you should do.
Speaker 2Yeah, and that's, I think, legit. And if you can take a pause when a difficult question is asked of you and determine is it that type of question where you're actually helping the person out while you might be hurting their feelings, you're actually helping them out in the longterm. Or is it the type of question where you can hurt their feelings but there's really no, no benefit for that person? You know, if you get asked we're talking about the pronoun question if you get asked that there's really no benefit to that person for you to express that, you don't subscribe to that and you know ridiculous. Why would you? There's no benefit. So it's not really the best place to go hard. Now, like Kevin said, if someone's asking you genuinely and they really want a genuine answer, then you can have that conversation, but you still should have it in an attackful manner. But you know you can have it. But it's not the place where brutal, direct honesty right off the bat is is necessarily needed. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1I totally agree with that, because if they said what your pronouns to me I'm just thinking out loud off the cuff I'd say, well, I don't have them on. My name is Kevin. Right, I don't have them. How come you don't have them? Why don't you do this? Whatever you think, I would say well, I just I don't. And I could say if you want to go there, I just don't believe in it. I think you know whatever, right, but I.
Speaker 1But it is something you might have to think about because, let's say, we have somebody you know that wants to sponsor the podcast or sponsored the thing, and they say my pronouns are this well then, okay, I would respect that. If you want to support our mission, I would respect that and I would call you by whatever you prefer. If that makes you comfortable, and I don't have to, I don't feel I have to get into a a debate with them. It's just like if no, if you wanted to be called no zias or something, all right, no zias, it is. You know what I mean, I've called you Nulsa for 12 years, but I, you know I don't know how to explain that, but I think if that's what makes you comfortable, cool, but if I don't need to happen to date with you right now this is something going to switch gears again.
Speaker 2I kind of knew coming into this job, but nobody ever really like explained it to me and I don't think I ever thought it through as deeply as I would have liked to. It would not have changed, to be fair, my pursuit of this career being a firefighter. But for you guys out there that are listening and working to get into the fire service, I think this is something that you should know and that you should think about, and if you have a spouse in your life or a loved one in your life that you're going to bring along on this journey, you need to have this conversation with them. So recently I mentioned it on a previous episode, but I'm going to go a little bit more in depth.
Speaker 2My son, indy, is eight and he has a bike. It had training wheels on it. We don't ride it a ton because we don't have a lot of good riding spots up here and I'm at work. My family's up north in Kingsburg and my wife tells me out of the blue, indy's riding without training wheels and I'm like really, wow, like who taught him? And she's like he was out there riding with his cousin. His cousin Easton took his training wheels off and showed him how to ride. Now I'm a proud dad. That's awesome. But I can vividly remember well, vividly is not the right answer because I have a bad memory, but I do have a memory of learning to ride my bike without training wheels for the first time with my dad. I know exactly where it was, I know which car we had at the time, because it was parked on the side of the road. Like I can remember that. It's a pivotal moment. It's a right of passage, yeah, yeah, and I don't get that with Indy, because I was at work that day. Now that could have happened anyway if I had a nine to five job.
Speaker 2But the point is, as a first responder, you are going to miss a lot of stuff. You're gonna miss birthdays, you're gonna miss anniversaries, you're gonna miss holidays. You're gonna miss your kid riding his bike without training wheels for the first time. There's a big sacrifice there that's made and I think it's an honorable one and a reasonable one because of the schedule that we work. But my encouragement to you, if you're thinking about coming onto this line of work, is to know that going in and have especially if you've got a fiance, a girlfriend or a spouse. Have that conversation with them so that they're aware of that coming in and every time you're recalled on Christmas, it's not this big earth-shattering event. It will be hard. It will be difficult I know from experience but if you're on the same page and you knew that going in it can help a lot. And so that's my encouragement to you have those conversations, because you are going to miss stuff that you wouldn't miss in another job.
Speaker 1I think you're spot on.
Speaker 1I'm gonna ask you this though Ask me Because all of that is true, and I think it hurts me as a father because I want to be present for these pivotal moments.
Speaker 1I want to be, and it hurts me way more than it hurts them to be gone at these things.
Speaker 1I wonder sometimes, though, if that's by design. I know it's not perfect, but there has been instances like that where they've done a cool, amazing kid accomplishments, because I was not there and maybe I would have hindered them, or maybe I wouldn't have taken them out to the bike ride, or maybe I wouldn't have said you're not ready to take the things off yet, and they've had these cool little moments with their cousins, not because dad's there and dad knows. I'm a little bit more protective because I wasn't there, because I do think we have all we see is trauma and car accidents and danger, like there were things that they were doing in the pool that I would never let them do if I was there, because I've seen drownings, yes, right, and so then I see them backfipping off the wall into the pool and then nobody's watching, but she's like on 10,. Let me show you what I learned when my cousins were here and I'm like my initial reaction is fear, right.
Speaker 1And like but I'm like, oh, I missed that the first time. She was brave enough to jump off the wall, but she did it with her cousins too, and maybe I had to not be there if for that little accomplishment to happen.
Speaker 2I don't know. No, that's really fascinating. This whole thing happened because Easton, the cousin, rides BMX. I've mentioned that recently and Indy went up there. He was excited about that, he wanted to participate, but he rides with training wheels so he can't ride on the BMX track. So Easton's like, well, let's get your training wheels off. And he happened to have his bike with him and so that's why that happened. And you're 100% right. If it had been normal everyday life here around our house, we're not riding bikes, there's not a place to ride. So I wouldn't have done that that week. It's not like I missed the day, it only happened because Easton's riding BMX and now Indy's riding BMX and he's doing great and tearing it up. So you're right, there is an aspect of that. And, yeah, there's nothing wrong with that.
Speaker 1No, it kills me. There's been other instances like I was at work for three days so Harmony took the girls to a friend's house that has some property and they have like ATVs and stuff, oh yeah, and my youngest daughter is very timid and scared of those type of things and so I've just kind of avoided them. But then I get a video on day two of her riding at like a four-wheeler and like with a helmet on and just tearing it up and it like it hurts so bad that I wasn't there to see her overcome her fear and get on that thing. But maybe I probably would have said, oh, you just ride with dad and we'll go super slow, or maybe I probably would have changed. If I was there, I would have changed it.
Speaker 1That's interesting, yeah, so I'm becoming more open. It still kills me, but I'm becoming more open to that. Maybe they don't need the protector for some of these moments, because I'll probably all govern them because of what we see and what we do. But also I want to be there for all these things. Yeah.
Speaker 2And I'm definitely not saying that you shouldn't go be a fireman or go into some sort of first responder job because you're going to miss stuff. That's not a reason. There are literally hundreds of thousands of men and women who have done that and done it successfully with families and who have well-adjusted, great kids out there. So it's not something where it's like this is going to ruin your life.
Speaker 1You're going to be miserable, but I just do want you to have those conversations beforehand because it's helpful, wow, and it is something you're going to have to deal with if you come into this world, not only, or if you're in it already, yeah, but you're 100% right that you not only have to have that conversation beforehand, you have to have that through the different seasons of life, because we didn't have kids when I started and, yeah, that's great, she's like no problem, go do your thing, work as much as you need to Right.
Speaker 1Well, kids come in the mix and it's more of a problem, and so it's more of a problem for her and more of a problem for me. So I had to make decisions of getting off a paramedic squad to go back to the truck because it was better for her, so I could be at home more. But I think you have to constantly have those conversations as seasons change and more life. If you want to be a family man, you better talk to your wife consistently about the uniqueness of us being gone 50% of the month.
Speaker 2Yeah, I just recently had a conversation like that with my wife. You guys, if you listen to the recent episodes, you know I moved stations and I'm now at a station on an engine in a battalion where there's a lot more likelihood that I will get sent out on a brush fire, which wasn't part of my reality prior to moving here. So I had that conversation with my wife. There is a chance that if a brush fire pops and I'm in the area, I might get deployed on that. I might be gone for multiple days in a row or longer, and having that conversation up front versus hey, we're on our way to a brush fire, looks like it might be a while, and then come back home two weeks later, like you know.
Speaker 1So, yes, have those conversations. Yeah, I mean, obviously we had a good on the truck for a long time, so that wasn't an issue. But yeah, it's a new season of life, like you said, your kids are a little bit older. Maybe it's a little bit easier. I mean, you still have Indy, who's young, but maybe it's a little easier. I see guys go into those positions later in life when their kids are a little bit older, because it's not that big of a deal when they're gone for two weeks because the kids are busy and they're driving and they're doing all this stuff. So I don't know, I think it changed. I think our thing constantly changes. Our department is so large that it's probably so consistent that every time we go somewhere it's a whole new animal. But yeah, that's interesting.
Speaker 2All right, well, kevin mentioned it at the beginning of the episode. We've got a class. It's in a week. We start on Friday. You're hearing this on Monday. If you're one of the guys that listen on the first day, we've got spots. We want you to come hang out with us. Get in touch with Kevin or I and we will talk to you about how we can make that happen.
Speaker 1Dude, we'll make it happen. I just want you to go there. We are a nonprofit and so if there's anything hindering you, just let us know. This thing has been the most powerful thing for me in my personal life and I've seen guys have just profound Changes at this thing. So I want you to experience that with us and I want to get you know I think the other cooler thing.
Speaker 1I just had breakfast and Hung out with Trevor Graves, who came to the last class, and Todd Bradstreet was there, who was in a previous class. It was an amazing thing. Like these are guys that both live in my city. They work for two different fire departments that I don't work for, and yet we have this Amazing camaraderie and fellowship and friendship now that I never would have, and I know their wives and I know their kids and it's only because they came to the program and now I just making a big world seem a little bit smaller to me, and that to me, that's the coolest thing is I have these amazing friends now that I wouldn't have ever probably met, and they live in the same city.
Speaker 2Yeah, come out, come be a part of that. We want to see you guys out there. Call us, we'll make it happen.
Speaker 1This has been the fire you carry podcast.
Speaker 2Thank you guys once again for listening. We want you to follow the links in the show notes and grab and my zone heart rate monitor. We have a challenge that is coming up later on this month Next week's episode. We will be going into detail on what that is. If you order your my zone now, you will be able to get it and get on board with us in time to be a part of that challenge and track it with us Using the my zone heart rate monitor. So follow links in the show notes for that. It comes at a great discount. It's $60 off its original price. So go check that out and we will see you next week. You are quiet and the weird thing is that my mic is really hot. I don't understand what's going on.
Speaker 1Yeah and I can't do anything about it.
Speaker 2Oh Hello, well, that's not good. There we go. No, no Check check, check now you're not coming through at all. No microphone, what'd you do? Oh, check, check, check, check.
Speaker 1Check, check.
Speaker 2Hello, there you go.
Speaker 1Check, all right. Well, it is what it is. Yeah, it'll work. All right, let's go.
