Megan Walker, London Abused Women’s Centre, Executive Director
“Women don’t want to be equal to their oppressors, they want to be free from oppression.” Megan Walker is the Executive Director of the London Abused Women’s Centre (LAWC) based in London, Canada. In this candid talk, Megan discusses the heartbreak and bravery of women who are abused by their partners and the societal conditioning of girls from a very young age. Megan discusses the value and impact of independence and her hope for a better future for women and girls. After 24 years at LAWC, Megan is transitioning out of her role as Executive Director and moving to a new chapter in her career. It was great to have an opportunity to hear about her plans
More on LAWC can be found here: https://www.lawc.on.ca/
More on Ford Keast can be foundhere: https://www.fordkeast.com/services/human-resource-consulting/
& for all the podcast information visit our website: https://www.career-resilience.com/
Thank you for listening.
Megan Walker, London Abused Women’s Centre, Executive Director
“Women don’t want to be equal to their oppressors, they want to be free from oppression.” Megan Walker is the Executive Director of the London Abused Women’s Centre (LAWC) based in London, Canada. In this candid talk, Megan discusses the heartbreak and bravery of women who are abused by their partners and the societal conditioning of girls from a very young age. Megan discusses the value and impact of independence and her hope for a better future for women and girls. After 24 years at LAWC, Megan is transitioning out of her role as Executive Director and moving to a new chapter in her career. It was great to have an opportunity to hear about her plans
More on LAWC can be found here: https://www.lawc.on.ca/
More on Ford Keast can be foundhere: https://www.fordkeast.com/services/human-resource-consulting/
& for all the podcast information visit our website: https://www.career-resilience.com/
Thank you for listening.
00:06 | Hello and welcome to our series Career Resilience, where we talk with people about their career path and their career journey, and maybe we can all learn from each other. My name is Jan Taylor and I'm a human resources professional in London, Ontario, Canada. I work with Ford Keast LLP and I work with my clients to help them with the outside of their business.
00:30 | We hope that you will enjoy these discussions with real people about real challenges and real working life situations. Welcome. My guest today is Megan Walker. Welcome, Megan. Thank you. I'm so pleased to be with you, Jen. So pleased to have you. And Megan, you are well known as being the leader of the London Abused Women's Center, L.A., you see, and being incredibly inspirational in our community.
01:06 | And I just want to start by thanking you for everything that you have done for four women for the center. And I'm just so honored to get to speak with you. That's lovely. Thank you. Our whole discussion today is going to be on resilience. So I'm not going to switch around and say, OK, tell me how you've been resilient, because I think our entire topic is resilience today. So so let us to start with your role.
01:36 | Can you describe your role as as executive director, so as the executive director of the London Abuse Women's Center ? My role is really to take a high level approach to the issue of ending men's violence against women. So we have some basic philosophies that the agency that the decisions we make here in London, Ontario, must have a positive impact on women around the world.
02:05 | And so we know that the issue of men's violence against women is one that is faced in every community, in every country. And so I've been blessed to be able to take a high level approach and travel to some countries where this is happening and speak with women directly. I'm certainly an advocate and advocate for change and forward moving activities.
02:35 | I am not one to remain stagnant and I certainly don't think there's any point in looking back. What I try to do is continue to look forward and try to find solutions. So I guess you could say that's who I am. I guess the other function about being an executive directors in a feminist organization particularly, is that I'm just one person.
03:03 | So one piece of this magnificent puzzle and every single staff member has a role to play in our success. And so hiring has been a really big issue for me to make sure that the individual that is offered the position will fit in well with the team. And I can tell you that almost always, in fact, if not always, we have had the most exceptional team at LOKKE where everybody contributes.
03:36 | And as a result of that, we continue to see significant growth. I am going to take you back a little bit. So we will be looking back. You were also on city council for quite a while. What was that experience like for you ? Well, that was a very frustrating experience for me. It was fairly male dominated and some fairly entrenched patriarchal views that were in council on that time.
04:07 | And I remember there were lots of issues of harassment in the workplace that were coming to my attention as a women's advocate. And I would take those concerns to the council floor to say we needed to change our policies and have a better way of addressing those issues. And I remember some council members would stand up and say, but we don't have a role to play in ending harassment in the workplace without any recognition that, in fact, that was probably one of their most important roles for the health and safety of their workplace.
04:43 | So it was tough. It was it was tough for somebody like me who pushes and doesn't let go of an issue, you know, to to try to find results. But it was an amazing experience. And I learned so much. I always said on city council I would serve two terms. At that point. They were three year terms.
05:10 | And in that two terms, I would either accomplish what I needed to accomplish or it would be better accomplished from the outside in. And I actually still maintain that my best accomplishments have come from being outside of a political system. OK, that makes sense. And, you know, I think to myself back in the day when you were on council and so on, we did not have the protections that we have now.
05:39 | I mean, there are there will always be issued, I guess, but. I look back at that time and think, you know, we didn't have any any protections or policies or places we could go other than each other to say, here's what I'm dealing with and what should I do ? Because I also have to take care of my family. I have to work. I have to do all these things, and I have to put up with things that would be deemed as harassment. And so I think we have come such a long way in that regard.
06:10 | Do you ? I completely agree. So I remember when it was about 2006 and we had a new city manager, Geoff Fielding, who was just a delight to work with, and he sat down with members of the London Coordinating Committee to end hormone abuse and heard our concerns about toxic and poisoned work environment at City Hall.
06:37 | And together we came up with a plan and the plan was to develop a mandatory training program for the city of London called I step forward to end abuse in my community, in my workplace and at home. And that program remains, although it has changed, to keep up with the times and legislation and things like that. But that was a big step forward.
07:05 | And then also just recently in the strategic plan, we came forward as a collective, as a community and advocated that ending or creating a safe workplace, creating a safe city for women and girls, be a standalone strategic area of focus. And we were successful in having that happen. So that, too, was a big accomplishment. That's a big accomplishment. And every step counts. Little or every step counts.
07:35 | You have made it your life's work to work with vulnerable women. Where did that drive and passion come from, Megan ? So I think it's come from a few places. My I am a woman with lived experience of violence, and I don't talk about the specifics of that, but I know what it feels like to be silenced. I know what it feels like to be assaulted.
08:03 | And this was a time. So it was in my early to late teens. You know, I later went on, I've been married twice. Both were great men, are great men who are very supportive. But but I, I have that feeling. And and when I was going through my own circumstances, there were virtually no supports available. And you couldn't really even talk to your parents about it because it was so out of the realm of what they ever imagined their children would experience.
08:37 | So so that stayed with me. It's always stayed with me how difficult it is for so many women just to reach out for help. And then the Montreal massacre came along and those 12 beautiful, strong women were murdered in local Polytechnique by a man who separated the the women from the men and shot these women with their whole lives ahead of them.
09:13 | And and it was, you know, and he said about hating feminists. And I had two little girls at home with me at that point. And I remember we were baking Christmas cookies and the news was on in the background or it was sort of a music station was on in the background, on the radio, and all of a sudden it stopped and cut to this horrific news coming out of Montreal. And I still I'm really chilled about it now, still thinking about it.
09:43 | I I went and picked up those little girls of mine and held them and and I was weeping. I was just I couldn't believe this, you know, and I and I was weeping, thinking about my own girls. And and I just said to myself and I said to them at the time, I'm going to commit my life to making sure that you have a better opportunity and a safer opportunity than those twelve girls that were murdered have.
10:13 | And I can remember at the time, you know, trying to join groups and fight for library services, because I knew sometimes it was the police abused women went to for refuge and and then and then it snowballed. And all these women would call me and I felt like, oh, my God, I'm not alone. In fact, I'm the one coming in at the end. So much work is being done. And and I just it working.
10:42 | With abused women is the most inspiring work I've ever done. It's the most inspiring work I could ever see doing when I watch those women and they have so much courage and resilience and they walk through those doors of ours and ask for help. It's just it's it's an amazing feeling. So.
11:13 | Can I ask why you didn't look at that situation, the horrific situation which we all remember and all reacted to and think to yourself, that was an insane person ? And leave it as that was an insane person. So that would have been an easy place to go, but I and perhaps if I hadn't already had the experiences I had had my lived experiences of violence, I might have said that.
11:45 | But I I just knew that this was not about an individual situation. This was about a situation that women and girls have been facing forever.
12:02 | And and if we were to say that this is just, you know, an insane man or he's had too much to drink or he's under a lot of stress, we minimize that this crime against women is very much directed towards women and also, in many cases directed towards a specific woman, that being the abusers' partner.
12:31 | And so, you know, he that that abuser could have been a CEO of a company and have the best relationships at his job and be so stressed. But nobody ever notices. And he could walk home and go into the grocery store and buy his groceries and have conversations with the cashiers and head home.
12:58 | But as soon as he walks through that door, if she hasn't done as he has told her to do so in the morning, whether it be wash his clothes or get his clothes from the dry cleaners or or even breathe too loudly or eat the wrong way, he will abuse her. And so this is not about men being out of control. It's about men who are very much in control.
13:24 | And I you know, when I think of the Montreal massacre, that men were so in control that he knew to separate the men from the women and he knew who to harm. And so I've always just been very aware that we are not dealing with an insane population or the I mean, they perhaps might have underlying mental health issues, but that is not the cause of their rage against women.
13:59 | So this is probably a naive question, but why does that CEO, for example, that you described, why ? Why is it OK in his mind, obviously an intelligent person who's made his way, why is it OK to walk in the door and change from that individual that everybody else saw to the individual the woman sees? So, again, it's because he's in control.
14:29 | So he's very much in control of how he wants to present himself. And then he comes home and he's very much in control of the partner he's with. So he controls her and he utilizes a number of tactics to continue to gain and maintain power and control over her. Some of those tactics include physical violence, some emotional, some financial, some a combination of all of those.
14:59 | And in worst-case scenarios, when those men feel they are losing ultimate control over that woman because she is leaving, it sometimes can result in her murder with the philosophy in his mind that if I can't have you, nobody else can.
15:20 | So these men, it's all about power and control and having a persona outside of the home where he's the fun-loving guy or maybe he's the grump, whatever it is. But he's not abusing women in his workplace. He's saving that for when he gets home to his partner. We've had women. You know, there are so many things women endure.
15:48 | This is what this is why I say women are the most resilient of all abused women. What they endure sometimes their partner takes the telephone to work with him so she cannot access anybody on the outside world. Sometimes that partner will booby trap the doors in the house. So if she walks out the door, a piece of paper will fall, for instance, and she'll be outed as leaving the home.
16:19 | Sometimes he drives his car or a tractor right up against her car, so she's not allowed to attend any appointments. And yet these women find their way. To us, they find a way to survive and they find a way to move on with their lives ultimately. And if if that is not resilience, I don't know what is to me.
16:44 | So that's they have so much resilience, you know, and all this power and control when they become parents is it escalates frequently. So there is an escalation in violence during two periods for sure when a woman is pregnant or sometimes the violence starts on the honeymoon.
17:10 | But a woman, when she becomes pregnant, can cause problems because the partner may not have had control over that happening. So he may force her to have an abortion or force her to have the child. But during that time, you commits acts of violence against her, hoping perhaps that she'll miscarry.
17:35 | And when children the difficulty with children is the abuse doesn't stop once there are children in the household and children sometimes become involved in the violence, trying to protect mommy, for instance, from daddy, and when they are hurt. Sometimes there's one member of the family who's young that sort of takes the leadership role, doesn't have to be the oldest and gathers the other children into a room and puts a chest of drawers in front of the door.
18:07 | For instance, again, they, you know, children who are exposed to violence have long term traumatic experiences as a result of that. Yeah, I wanted to talk about the fact that you're a feminist and what is your definition of feminism. So I'm a radical feminist.
18:35 | I would identify myself as a radical feminist, which means I'm really going to the root cause of the problem and trying to resolve the issue from that root. So I'm not looking at it and saying, you know, oh, we've seen an increase in, you know, women who are being abused because more and more men are drinking.
19:03 | I would say, no, that's not the situation. The root cause of male violence against women or men's violence against women is that women are oppressed as a group because of patriarchy. So we're under a patriarchal cloud. Our decisions are still not freely our own. We are prevented from doing many things that men do.
19:33 | And if we are able to break through to that and do those things that men do, we are often placed in situations where we are expected to fail. So my I am a radical feminist who believes that equality, that that women don't want to be equal to their oppressors. They want to be free from oppression.
20:02 | Something you said there, Miguel, you said set up to fail. What does that mean ? Oh, so I think sometimes oftentimes, actually, women are placed in positions where they are not provided with the supports they need to be successful. And so they the expectation is that they will fail.
20:28 | I see these situations in my office often and either be fired from where their workplaces or have to go on a leave because of the toxicity within that workplace. So, you know, what I always say about good employers is their history should show great employee success. So you want to be providing your employees with all of the tools they need to be successful.
21:00 | And too often that doesn't happen with men or with women who are trying to enter a male dominated workforce. And thereby hangs a tale in terms of a downward spiral, because I think there is still a stigma of going on a leave to recover yourself and to reset and to get some assistance and so on.
21:30 | And I think that there are still some feelings about that in terms of just couldn't cut it. Yes, absolutely. And so it's interesting. That's why I love working with a feminist organization, because for us, we, first of all recognize that when you are hearing women's experiences over and over again during the day, they cannot help but impact who you are. The vicarious trauma that you experienced can be paralyzing if it's not dealt with.
22:01 | And so it's why, as a feminist organization, we bring in professional staff to do vicarious trauma work specifically with our team. Our board of directors understands the need for increased amount of counseling available to the team so that they don't have to shut down their counseling experiences at six sessions. They can go up to a higher amount.
22:28 | We provide our team with incredible amount of benefits around massage therapy and reiki and acupuncture and all those things so that there's a menu of options you can choose from that are best for you. And our whole philosophy of this agency is that it is family first. So if you have a daughter or son that's sick or needs care or an appointment, we expect you to be with your daughter or son.
22:57 | So we will accommodate you leaving this workplace. So all of those are positives. We consider those to be very much about being in tune with who you are and taking care of yourself. And that is not what many women experience in a male-dominated workplace. Yeah, I can remember a situation where there was an employee and her daughter fell out of a tree, as kids are wont to do, and broke a few bones and was in the hospital.
23:28 | And the mom phoned in and said, you know, I can't come in. And the response was, well, are you just going to sit in the hospital and like, stare like come into work ? And, you know, because we we need you here. And you can imagine where that went. That was and you not what kind of worker you would get out of that. That's exactly it. So so I you know, we have a team at this agency that gives everything they've got towards the success of the agency.
24:03 | Every single one of us wants that. And so in return, we want them to be successful in their lives outside of the agency. And that's very important to us. I wanted to go over a quote of yours. You say we put ourselves out there to change the culture for future generations to free women from the oppression that comes with scary and threatening backlash.
24:32 | But we are a force and the backlash only makes our voices stronger. So I just like to speak to that. Or have you speak to that, Meagan, because you're talking globally there. You're not talking about the person who comes into the house and wants to be in control. You're talking globally. So what is that ? That you would have backlash to making things better ? Oh, my gosh. So it is a global issue.
25:02 | It's it's it's an issue. Feminist organizations face a. Across the world, and, you know, when I get a man that threatens to bomb our building, for instance, which has happened and he's been found guilty of doing that, that is a terrifying event in our lives. And but we will not be silenced by that.
25:32 | We come up and roar. We are like, no, we are going to go all the way through the court system, no matter how difficult it is, even if he's found not guilty, because we want him to know that he didn't win. He didn't get to us. We are stronger and we are stronger as a unit. In the same way, there is a group of men who hate women. They're called in cells for involuntarily celibate.
26:00 | And we get letters from them, as do women around the world, saying the most outrageously horrific things to us, threatening us with violence. And and we report that to the police. We will not take that and we will again rise. And we share that with others in our community and others partners we have around the world.
26:28 | So they know what we're experiencing and they come and join us as well as we do for them when it happens. So this job, I don't I can tell you I've been threatened more times in this job. I've had horrific things happen to me in this job. And, you know, even my husband has been threatened, but I'm not going to be silent.
26:56 | And and the intent of all of this is to silence my voice in the voice of other feminists. And it does not work. It's it fuels me to continue to go on and speak louder to to your point of shame. Alight. Mm hmm. It's, you know, the shite. But I'm going to tell you something. The the those who come and threaten us, well, they may feel powerful in doing that.
27:32 | They are weaklings. They are bullies. And I feel badly for them sometimes because I think, wow, is this all you have in your life is to call women and become an idiot with what you're saying about us. And, you know, I, I then think when that happens about this very community I live in in London, Ontario, where we have our shine the light on women abuse campaign and this entire community embraces it.
28:08 | And when we last year the federal government announced it had stopped funding our trafficking program, we were devastated. And it was the community of London that raised funds for us to continue that program. So when I think about that little guy in his basement writing horrible things about me, I and then I compare that to this.
28:36 | Big, tall mountain of support. I feel pretty damn lucky. Yeah, when we look at your career, what would you say are the three things in your career that you're the most proud of ?
28:57 | I think the first thing I would say is that I'm most proud of the incredible staff that I have continued to work with, I'm proud to have been I am proud of this team. And to be part of this team has been a joy for me. And I'm proud of that because I have been able to give the team a collective and individual voice.
29:27 | And so everybody has a say in how we operate. So so I'm proud of that. I'm really proud to have been able to put into place a program where all women are provided with immediate access to service. So it doesn't matter if she walks in or calls. She's given either a phone appointment or an in-person appointment to seek service immediately.
30:00 | So that is fairly does not generally happen. But we know that women walking through our doors, if they can't get service immediately, they never they may never walk through again. So we must do that. And we do do that. And again, we've been able to do that because of the generosity of our community. And I think the third thing I'm probably most proud of is the tremendous growth of the agency to a point where, you know, we serve 8000 women a year.
30:38 | This little agency now is in a position where it is serving 8000 women and girls every year. And I'm proud of that. I don't take credit for that. This is a team event. Everybody has done this together. But I'm proud that it's happened. You can be so proud that it's happened. But I just so you know, you say a thousand.
31:06 | And I think how can that how can that be a need for so many women ? Yeah, it's it's. Well, what you know, that one in four women is abused in our country, and every six days a woman is murdered. We have a this is a crisis and we actually call this and have called it for many years a pandemic. And yet we don't women are. So if this were happening to men, I believe it would be resolved within a few years.
31:37 | There would be lots of money for supports, lots of money for education to shift the culture for young children. But when it happens to women, we it's very much about tokenism. You know, you get one hundred thousand dollars here, which has to be spent in two years, and then you have to somehow find sustainability like these are things that should not happen. This is this is a serious issue.
32:07 | It's a public health crisis. And there should be appropriate funding in place so women can focus on serving those who need it rather than trying to beg for funding to serve them. You know, there's a word serious and the definition of that word, as you probably well know, is excessive love of life. Mm hmm.
32:31 | And so if a man is serious, it sort of looked down upon, and yet I have not yet found the comparable word the other way. Well, I think that, you know, what I would say is that I believe very much that the majority of men are amazing and they stand with us as allies.
32:58 | But we also know that the majority of abusers are men. And the issue is not should not be up to women. We should not be finding the solutions to end men's violence against women that should fall on the shoulders of men. But too few men are willing to stand up and take action. You know, what are some of your thoughts and things that you would say to young women who are up and coming in ?
33:31 | What is a bit of an Instagram world ? Yes, it certainly is. And so I am always so so what I my first thing I would say to young women and to girls is, remember, your value comes from who you are and not from the attention paid to you by a man or boy, because we still live. In a culture where girls believe their value comes from the attention boys give them.
34:05 | And so if I walk into a classroom, for instance, I can sometimes see in very young girls that they're wearing padded bras. These are girls in grade one and grade two. And these are things that are promoted actively online sales. It's like if you promote Nike, make Nike running shoes. Everybody wants them the same thing for girls.
34:29 | And so, you know, I'll talk to these girls and ask them how many of you are dressed in a way that you would have chosen yourself today and if you will, put up their hands. But then I will say, but for the rest of you, why is it your dress this way if this isn't how you choose to dress ? And they'll say, well, you know, Peter won't pay any attention to me if I don't dress this way or David does this.
34:57 | And so so we look at the situation then through a broader lens and we would say dressing in a certain way will make you popular with the boys. Dressing in another way will make you invisible. And there's not one young girl I've ever met that wants to be invisible. And so this is what is happening.
35:23 | You they are switching to satisfy the desires of boys. And all too often I see this. We are not doing a good enough job of getting into the schools and talking to young girls about this and talking to young boys about this so they realize they have no value, if that's what they think is valuable, if they think that it's valuable for a girl, a young girl in grade one or two to wear a bra so that she gets his attention, he's not he has no value.
35:58 | And so we're trying to really make kids understand that value is about human dignity and respect. So just just on that, I taught a child in grade one wearing a padded bra, has not gone to the mall and bought a padded bra. So where does that come from ? Well, it comes from mom or dad taking that child to the mall to get them what they want to wear.
36:28 | So it's just like all of these video games that are meant for children over the age of 18. And when they first come out, you see a lineup of dads and moms with their children who are eight and nine years old. So it's the exact same thing when children say they want things. You know, it's like Nike running shoes.
36:50 | I know women and men who cannot afford to provide their children with Nike running shoes, but the advertisements are so effective and the child is so relentless in the desire for Nike running shoes. They go and get into debt for the Nike running shoes. And it's the exact same thing. You've got marketers plugging this stuff out all the time and kids are always on their computers and it's relentless.
37:21 | And so that's this is what happens. I just want to play that out for a minute. That girl, that child in grade one, what is that girl like at twenty one or twenty eight ? What is that girl like at age 12 ? So, you know, she's still that girl looking for this for the attention of a young boy.
37:47 | And when they go to parties and they decide they're going to play games around, you know, many of the sexual games that are available for children to play, those girls will participate because they know that that is how their value will be achieved in their heads. They don't understand the value is who they are as individuals, not the attention. You know, not not because of the attention of boys and men.
38:19 | And this is why we see young girls lured often into prostitution and trafficking, into taking their clothes off online. I mean, it's just I remember when covid first hit and we started getting a lot of calls from parents who were saying to us, you know, it was very difficult because parents had to work at home as well. And the children are at home.
38:41 | And they were saying to us that their child had met a man online and she had been convinced to take her clothes off and have some sexual acts performed by herself against, you know, with herself. And those had those videos were now available for others to upload, so you might say to yourself, well, why would a young girl take her clothes off with this guy ? She doesn't even know it's all done online.
39:11 | Again, when you think your value comes from the attention of boys and men, you do what men and boys want you to do. Well, I just don't think a 12 year old is capable of doing complex things that are nothing to do with emotion or what used what was love, let's say, and relationship. Nobody's ready for that at 12.
39:39 | I just wonder, what is the impact on on boys then in terms of this world that you're that we're trying to build ? So the the impact on boys is that boys feel entitled to be able to do this. I you know, I always think of the retired persons case and I have written this picture here on my office who was a young girl with a bright future who was at a party and had been drinking and she was vomiting out the window as she was being digitally penetrated by boys who were videotaping it.
40:18 | And as she was vomiting out the window, she was saying, no, no, stop it. And none of them stopped. They continued. And so, you know, I am somebody that believes pornography has a big impact on what's going on in society today. And we know in pornography that the average age of a child will watch. It is age 10. It's free.
40:46 | So if you go on the playground and a child has a phone, you'll often see a group huddled around there watching pornography. And often they get into the porn sites and they're trapped within the sites and can't get out. So it's just relentlessly seeing this pornography. It's violent. And in pornography, when a girl says no, the message to the viewer is do it harder and do it longer.
41:17 | And so when Routier Persons was vomiting out the window, these boys had been watching pornography before the assault against her. And when she was saying no, they continued. And so where did you learn that ? You learn that by watching pornography and believing that's what women want. So how are things getting better begin ?
41:45 | Well, I, I, I'm not sure that I would say things are necessarily getting better for women and girls. I would say that there's been a big shift in our strategies to combat sexism and patriarchy.
42:09 | And so this last week, one of the largest pornography organizations around the world, my Geek, which is located in Montreal, was called before the House of Commons committee. And the reason for that was because they were posting child porn and they were posting pornography without the woman's consent. And they're going to be in big trouble.
42:39 | This is this is a criminal offence. And survivors, those impacted by this are speaking up. And that's what we need. And I think it may not happen in my lifetime, but many young women now are fighting this and, you know, they're carrying it on.
43:00 | And and I'll tell you the other thing is that when you work in this field, you you know, for me, I've always been filled with hope, because even when I hear these stories about what's happening with retired persons or Amanda Todd or others who go on to die by suicide, because it's so horrendous, the pain that they have experienced.
43:26 | Another woman walked through my door and she she just fills me with hope. You know, like for me, it's never been about a revolving door. It's about a door that opens for women after women when they meet. Yeah, OK. What's one other piece of advice you would give to young girls and young women ?
43:56 | I would say that. Fierce independence is a great strength and that they don't have to be dependent on their husband or their partner, and they shouldn't be dependent because far too often in the days gone by where women stayed at home with a wealthy husband, they ended up on their own with nothing.
44:26 | And so I say just be that fiercely independent woman that knows you can change the world. You know, if someone is listening to us right now and they're thinking, OK, you know what, I'm inspired. I want to learn something. I want to do something, what would be their first couple of steps ? Well, everybody can do something every single day so you can keep an eye out for people.
44:54 | You know, you can check in with people you know, particularly women, if you haven't heard from them for a while and let them know you're there. And if you suspect a woman is being abused, don't sort of beat around the bush. Just say, listen, I'm worried about you. Are you safe in your home ? Are you experiencing abuse ? And if she says yes, then you must believe her and say you were there to help her get service if she says no. OK, good.
45:24 | But if you ever need me, I want you to know I'm here. So so, you know, we can all do this every day in our lives because people we know who are friends or family members may be abused and we don't know it because their abusers are great actor. And so too is the woman. I would suggest when covid is lifted that those who are inspired to take action join any number of the organizations that are providing this service as a volunteer.
45:59 | It is so inspiring to see women come through the doors and it's so fulfilling and I love it when our volunteers can experience that. You know, I also feel that we need to talk about this, so we need to talk more to our children and let them know that how valuable they are.
46:25 | You know, I don't ever call children, princesses or whatever because they're not princesses. Princesses are are not real. What what they are are just fantastic young women. It's not about how they look. It's about who they are and what they have to offer. And I often say to parents, you know, it's so important to tell your child that you really believe in them and you believe they're capable of great things.
46:57 | And what can you do to help them, you know, reach that place where they feel it's too far away ? You know, I love that fiercely independent phrase that my my daughter, Emma, was a child, that some would have said she was a child that never colored inside the lines. And I remember one time that one of the teachers said, well, you know, she sort of she won't do this and she won't do that.
47:26 | And I said, I just love it. She is so fiercely independent at such a young age. Imagine what she's going to be like, you know, and she is still fiercely independent. And I just think it's such a great quality. That's wonderful. You are transitioning away from your role as executive director. How hard was it to make that decision ?
47:57 | So it wasn't really that difficult to make the decision. I actually had originally made the decision about four years ago and the board asked me to stay for a little bit longer because we were going through a great period of growth, which was fine. I was happy, too. It's not that I don't like it here. I love it here. But I know that young we've always had sort of we want to promote people from within, you know, give them opportunities. And so they said, well, when you leave, could you give a year's notice ?
48:26 | And my birthday is August thirty first. And last year on my fifty ninth birthday, I said, I am going to be retiring next August 31st on my sixtieth birthday. And so it'll be just fine. And and the decision is because I'm so interested in so many other things as I'm really involved in things around immigration issues right now for immigrants. And I'm involved in some work with the United Nations and and I'm involved with supporting.
48:59 | Organizations that are small in various parts of the world, and I really want to focus on that. So those are the next steps. So this is not a retirement. This is a transition for you. Yes. People say when you know, when you resign and you're my age, that it's retirement. But, you know, I'm only 60 and I've got lots of living left to do and lots to give.
49:26 | And I want to be able to give back to my community and others and, you know, in a volunteer capacity and or take on a short term contract or, you know, help the government in some way in a short term. And I have now four grandchildren, and that's pretty exciting in my life. And I love spending time with them. So I just want to balance everything. And I just really am looking forward to living post 60 years.
49:57 | And I think we're looking forward to having you live post 60 in the way that you have lived because you're so inspirational and you have had such a challenging career. But I can hear what you say in terms of the incredible hope that you have carried throughout. Yeah, I, I never have lost hope. I've always held onto hope.
50:23 | And when women come in and say they're hopeless, I can always help them find one thing that gives them hope, you know, and then it's like a balloon. You start blowing it up and finding more things and all of a sudden you've got this huge thing that's like, wow, I'm so hopeful about my life. And that's a pretty powerful place to be when you realize that. Is there any final words or anything that you'd like to leave us with, Megan, before we end our conversation ?
50:56 | I just feel really confident that it is, you know, future generations that will change what happens to women. I really believe that. And what I hope is that women and men and girls and boys continue to engage so that they can be leaders as they grow older and leaders in ending this horrendous atrocity against women.
51:28 | Thanks for that, Meagan. Thank you so much for chatting with me today. This has been profound for me and I think probably for our listeners and viewers as well. Thank you so, so much for giving me this time. Oh, listen, I am so grateful that you had me on your program. Thank you. I've listened to those you have. I listened to all the podcasts and you've had some pretty outstanding women.
51:56 | And I just feel gratitude that I'm part of that little club now. So thank you. You are part of that little community that I hope is growing into our listeners and viewers. Thank you so much for joining us today. Megan is an amazing woman and to be able to share her words with you is an honor for me. Thank you for joining us today. Please find us wherever you listen to your podcast. Subscribe on YouTube, all those things that that help us spread this community.
52:28 | And until we meet again. Thanks. Thank you so much.