Hello and welcome. Thank you for joining us here today as you join us for another podcast. We got Steve valla. With us today we're back. We've had a week away last week. And we're just trying to catch a bit of time up as we gather around the mic. Steve has got the title with us today. Thank you so much for joining us, wherever you are across the earth and all the listeners and everybody out there in the world of podcasting, thank you so much for the 1000s of downloads across this earth. And you can find us as we always say, in so many areas of the podcasting world. And today's title is are you deserving a millstone? That's a big tiles Dave, God bless my friend.
Steve:God bless you all. God bless you. All. Right, yeah, this is really a follow on from our last study of zekiel 32. Where God is dealing with false shepherds, we're still in an area of dealing with full shepherds. But now we come into another area of responsibility for individual Christians towards one another. So we're picking up 18 And verse one, we'll go through the seven, Matthew, at that time, the disciples came to Jesus saying, Who then is greatest in the kingdom of heaven. And Jesus called a little child to him, set him in the midst of them, and said, Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted, and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. Whoever receives one little child like this in mind, I received me but Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sing, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck, and he will drown in the depths of the sea. Whoa, to the world because of offenses for offenses must come. But woe to that man by whom the offense comes
Reverend Ben Cooper:deep.
Steve:Well, i just want to add a quote from Ezekiel. And it's in Ezekiel three, and it's just five verses 16 to 21. Now it came to pass at the end of seven days that the word of the Lord came to me saying, Son of man, I have made you a watchman for the house of Israel. Therefore, hear a word from my mouth and give them warning from me. When I say to the wicked, you shall surely die. And you give him no warning, no spec to warn the wicked from his wicked, why, to save his life, and that same wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require, we require it your head. Yet, if you want to wicked and he does not turn from his wicked this, nor from his wicked, ye, he shall die in his iniquity, but you have delivered your soul. And he will leave it there at verse 19. Okay, primarily because I would have to go into a theological explanation of the next two verses, but the point being is this, that within the church there are lots and lots of false doctrines. I was watching a guy today who I follow occasionally a blog called Karl gallops, and was looking at something that he prophesied, yeah, two, three years ago. And he said that we as Bible believing Christians, the number will reduce,
Reverend Ben Cooper:I agree,
Steve:is reduced by more and more and more,
Reverend Ben Cooper:and that is happening rapidly. Very rarely see that.
Steve:And so we see the rise of the Apostolic Church. And this is where the problems begin. Yeah. I want to address to people, to one church and one person, Ben Johnson and Bethel. Yeah, believe that Jesus went down to hell, and was tortured by the devil and the demons, and that he had to be born again in hell. That, as a statement by Mr. Hagen was once said, dying on the cross was insufficient. No. And Joyce Meyer, some years ago said, If you do not believe this, you cannot be saved. So, what we have is a group of people that deny the fundamental sacrifice of Christ on the cross. And they dream this up. And I think it's primarily from the area of Philippians, four Corinthians Colossians, where it talks about Jesus coming down into the lower parts, okay, but he who descends, or he who sends musty scent, and there's much debate as to what it meant by this descent into the lower parts of the earth. But we have to understand what the Jews understood. And still understand to be to this guy. Yeah, to the condition of what they term is she, yes, she Oh, is a place of the dead. Another expert, another term for the grave, not just the old in which we go in. But the place where I spread the PSAs. Now this place was divided, and he still divided into two places. One was called Abraham's bosom, or paradise. And the other one is Hades. And we know this when Jesus taught the parable, although there wasn't so I don't think it was a parable, I think it was, I think he was explaining something that was very, that was going on. When he spoke about Lazarus going down, after he died, and then a rich man going down. After he died, Lazarus went to Abraham's bosom. But the rich man went to Hades into a place of Tom Yes. It speaks about how when Jesus descended into the earth, He led captivity in his captive. Yeah, also, I think it's in Peter, it talks about how he went to preach to the spirits that were in prison. Now there are two aspects of this one, leading captivity captive, having the keys of Death, and Hell, he went down to speak, went down to rescue those who believe and believed in God, and his graciousness. And in the forthcoming Messiah, they were held captive in paradise. But Christ, now set them free, because he bore the cost of it on his body, and was able to set free all the righteous men and women that were in paradise. Yeah, those that were in Hades are still there. So paradise is empty. It's not there anymore. Abraham's bosom isn't there anymore. Indeed, Abraham is up in heaven and places with the rest of the sites. With regards to going down and preaching to the spirits in prison, if we remember in Jude, it talks about how is that, and also in Peter, how it is that God has bound certain fallen angels. And those were the ones that fall at the time of Genesis six. Because they left their first estate, and they'd had sexual congress when winning, and they had brought forth a corrupt rice. So God bound them. In what Paul what Peter causes Tartarus. That's the only place you're going to find in Scripture, that term. And that term was known by the Greeks. And Tartarus was set to be as far away from the as deep away from the Earth, as Earth was from the heavens. Right. So Christ goes down there. Yeah. And the majority of theologians that have viewed this particular section of Scripture, believed that this was the time when the fallen angels led by Satan are instructed by Satan to come and destroy the human race. Because if they could destroy the human race, yes, then a prophecy about he will bruise your hair, but you will bruise his heel. Thus Messiah coming and crushing the head of Satan could not come about Yeah. And it says that all of mankind was corrupt if you read Genesis version, except that Noah was found to be righteous, righteous. And it was through Noah that the Messianic line continued to descend. So these angels which were captured and placed in chains, and are still there waiting for their condemnation. Gee Jesus went down and preach to them and said, in so many words, you missed it. Here I am. You thought you were going to disrupt the Masonic line? I am Messiah. And you can see who I am and what I am. Yeah, so we will have added to their torment.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah. So add into the torment of their eternal suffering, yes. And they will never come out their internal chains
Steve:until there comes a time of your final judgment. Now, if we fast forward to the stupidity that people like Ben Johnson, sorry, Bill Johnson, and Joyce Meyer, and various others believe, this idea that Jesus went down into hell, and was tormented by the devil and demons. If we remember, at one point, when Jesus was going to cast out demons, they said, Have you come to torment us before our time? It also tell Jesus tells us that hell was fashioned for the devil, and the demons, only they were going to be suffering down there. So you're not going to find any demons in hell. whooping it up, you're not going to find Satan walking out, they want to say as far away from hell as anybody else.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah. Because they know, they know. Because what you said the New Testament scripture says, it'd be better if you've caught us into the pigs. That's it. So they know the torment. It's not a flag waving exercise, and all we are in charge of this, these flames around so that that is created for them. Yes. To be tortured. Yes. And tormented. Yes, that's, that's that that's it. That is not their domain is not there. Because a lot of ministers and church and artists and are over the years have made it that, that they've almost created it that they're flames that they have created when actually God created Korea or their torment for their torment. That's the end of it. That's it finished.
Steve:And so this idea that somehow Jesus went down into hell, and was tormented. Let me let me say this in the strongest language I possibly can. These people are evil. They spit in the face of Christ. They are I'm, I'm gonna use this term, and I want you to bear with it. But I want you to understand how gross it is that what they're doing. They defecate on the cross of Christ. Right? That's what they do. Because they say the cross isn't sufficient. Whereas Paul said, I came to you. And all I knew was Christ and Him crucified. The crucifixion the cross Philippians is it well Colossians looking if I remember, right, he made an open shot of them were better and grace. Yeah, nailed. He nailed everything on the cross.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And the scripture says, doesn't it? If correct me if I'm wrong? He disarmed the powers it He disarmed them. Yes. Once Yes, Christ only had to do one is everything is once he speaks once and it's finished? Yes. He, he says Let there be light. And there was he he makes a spectacle. And there was there's no ifs and buts and possibles. And you bring in an interesting point to the table, that when you see the demons coming into Christ, coming up to Christ, rather, they know who he is, and the power and the authorities, but the church has romanced it in a roundabout way that they have more power than the living Christ. When the demons actually say, we ain't worried about them, disciples. We're worried about that. We're worried about Jesus, the Jesus Jesus we are worried about we're not worried about you, Churchill over there. Well, the only
Steve:time they the only time someone really caught packet was the seven sons of Steve when the car was cast out demons in the name of Jesus whom Paul preaches, unless they will put we know Jesus, we know but who would you think you are? Who do you think you are? And that was
Reverend Ben Cooper:quite cheeky. For you. Then, Tom, done, put Jesus when Jesus we know. That's for Sadat today, isn't it?
Steve:So if we look at these people, and we look at the Johnsons, and we look at the Joyce Myers and we look at that, okay, now they preach this. And they in preaching it, yeah, affirming it, pushing it or fashioning a millstone for themselves because they are going to cause certain ones who believe in Christ to stumble. Now, Jesus will never leave his sheep will always go and find them. Yeah, must cheat. Yeah, it was all always boys. But What has caused them to wonder in the first place?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Right? Interesting point. What would cause me to wonder false teaching fleshly so they were born again, we're born again. Someone comes along and brings a message not that he's more powerful than Christ, but a message that scratches my ears. That makes me look a different way. It's quite, it's involved.
Steve:When I said that we all have responsibility. Yeah. Okay. If we go to the first letter of the Corinthians, Paul talks in there in chapter eight about how it is that there are some brothers who think we should just eat vegetables. Some brothers who think it's okay to eat meat. And then Paul goes on and says, Look, if you who are mature in Christ, are able to eat any food that you buy in the market. Doesn't matter who it's been. sacked, sacrifice you right? But you know in your heart that all food is given by God. You pray your blessing upon it, when you go away and eat it. But if a weaker brother sees you, yes, and he is conflicted in his conscience, and cannot stand as he should stand by my eating meat, I might cause him to stumble. Okay, there's that term stumble is exactly the same term that Julie Jesus uses when he talks about causing that wants to sin. And the great there is scan, Eliza right means to scandalize but in its fullness, it causes someone sin. So Paul says, if by eating meat, I might cause my brother to sin. I won't eat meat anymore. Okay, all right. Yeah. So this is where we come and we bring our responsibility. mature Christians have a responsibility to immature Christians to point out areas and problems. And it's then down to those immature Christians to either listen, or at the very least go white and pray about it and seek the Lord's understanding. Right. Joyce Meyer has just recently celebrated 40 years in the ministry. Yeah. And she had a big bonfire and worship service. And there were various people there along with one of them was Mr. Warren, Mr. Rick Warren, but also Chris Tomlin. Now Chris Tomlin, many people will know is supposed to be a Christian singer, musician, and he said how wonderful it was that he could come along to Joyce Meyer, and support her and support her ministry. Chris Tomlin by supporting our ministry supports the evil that she preaches. Okay. So he might as well just as well go along to a site in his church and say, I support the site in this church because they at least understand that Jesus died on the cross
Reverend Ben Cooper:do they do they know that they know that at least people worse than that? So we cut so you know, a conversation about agreement as well and your when you agree? So there's power in agreement isn't Yes, it when there's the green when there's an agreement, whether it's right or wrong, you are partnering with so when you partner with you're in agreement with that is a very dangerous, dangerous coin to flit
Steve:about people now who watch or listen to Chris Tomlin know him now Joyce Meyer has a domino effect has affirmed his support. Therefore, they can say, oh, Joyce Meyer, he likes her she must be worth listening to Yeah. And suddenly they start listening to the tripe that she preaches. Now the one thing about false teachers, is they won't give you falsehood. Day in and day out. I won't do it. No, they will preach what seems to be a very sound gospel, and then suddenly they slip in the poison. Yeah. And it only takes one drop of poison and a glass of water and they shall not the whole thing. Yeah, whole thing's poisoned. So Chris Tomlin by affirming Joyce Meyer, possibly could cause one of these littles little ones to sink to sin. All right, yeah. And therefore he is fit for a millstone.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So do we put that in the same categories? got blood on your hands?
Steve:Very much. So that's exactly what the exact comment in Ezekiel is. Yes, yeah. By if you don't preach, listen, man. I'm telling you what's coming if you don't talk and also that, that comment in Ezekiel is God telling his EQ about how God is going to bring a sword against the people? This isn't coming from outside. This is God, this is God saying to him, I want you to go and warn those people what I'm about to do.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So again, again, we find out self in a text word, God is warning, the devil is nowhere to be seen. So, a lot of this issue is the devil is trying to cause trouble when actually God gives the warnings and God will there is a consequence that God will bring.
Steve:I mean, the devil isn't working. Joyce Meyer and in her ministry, all right, by perpetuating the corruption of Christ being tormented in hell, yeah, okay. is perpetuated. Someone comes along and says, I affirm Joyce Meyer, therefore I affirm what she teaches, therefore, I affirm what the devil teaches.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So this is where it's really important as an individual, to test every spirit as the scripture says, Check, every teaching, check the Scripture. And almost you're, you're spending so much time by asking God show me the truthfulness. What what is this? What are you saying? Because a lot of the time in the world of church, we go on second and third, fourth, fifth, and knowledge or knowledge, is it here say yes.
Steve:And the trouble is what what the church has failed in is the sound doctrine. Yeah, they will not deal with sound doctrine. Now let's come back to Chris Tomlin. Okay. Now. He is cobbled together, I'd say, Rob, but he has cobbled together a song. Amazing Grace. Yeah. And my chains fell off. Okay. Now what this man has done, is taken him by John Newton, who has been dead for about 300 years. He's taken him by Charles Wesley, who has been dead for about 300 years and whose songs are in the public domain, for which we do not have to pay a thing. Now even Newton, and Wesley didn't charge for me anyway. So he takes these two. He joins them together. He writes a couple of verses. And then he claims to copyright copyright. Yeah. And we are supposed to pay him to sing songs that were written by sound men of God 300 years ago. So he screams Yeah, right. He steals Yes. Puts the money in his pocket. Yeah. And the people that sing it don't realize what they're doing. No. Yeah. All right. Yeah. And every time a church and we all the churches, everyone. Licenses, we
Reverend Ben Cooper:have to have my license
Steve:from that license. Yeah, now goes in Chris Tomlins pocket and enriches him. The one who is a lawyer and a thief. Okay. Yeah. So we're enriching him. So we really need to look what we license and what we allow in. Okay, so that's that one now? Yeah. On the other side, we come back to Mr. Johnson. I've banged on about him for a while. But I don't apologize. The lightest ways that they've come out with our eyes. Prophecy by you know, cards, uh, you know, you know, the, you know, the game, you
Reverend Ben Cooper:hear the game, you know, okay, yeah.
Steve:So what you do is you take, and they say, this is better done with six to eight people. You take these Uno cards, and you deal out six or eight cards. And someone turns over the card. And if it's, let's say, green, and I've turned it over, I'm now going to look to you sitting on my left or in front of me. And I'm going to say, right, Ben, I'm going to prophesy over your life about something
Reverend Ben Cooper:for you. Right? Yeah.
Steve:So I'll turn it back over, then you turn a corner I've really read so you turn sort of bloke on your left, and you say now I'm going to prophesy something in your life, about your family. Okay, again, he turns one over and it goes yellow. And he looks over at me says I'm going to prophesy something in your life about your business or the job that you do. Okay, which is damn clever since I'm retired, but the point being is always ease Okay, yeah, this is no more which updated tarot card. Yeah, it is. Yeah, we're seeing this in the Old Testament. This is not no this is not prophecy. No, this is not a movement of the Holy Spirit. Now, this is made dreaming something out of his own mind.
Reverend Ben Cooper:But it's been there from the Old Testament, isn't it? If we clearly see this Don't wait. Yes, we see this mentioned God tells us keep away from everything that is shaped in this way, shape and form. These
Steve:people believe that when they read Even the Corinthian letter about people being given gifts they can do as they please forgetting the fact that it's the Spirit of God who gives the gift that's ugly. Don't claim him. Now he gives. And if he gives prophecy Yeah, then that's wrong. God are not from me. I've got no, I've got no ability to prophesy in your life. Now I have to know anything to write a three legged donkey, you know, I mean, I'll probably get away with it.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So these prophecies that are coming out like sweets all over the place, what happens when it goes wrong? When it goes wrong? I know it was. It's always gonna go wrong. So where does the blame sit? To the one that gave me the prophecy? Or the one said, I am basically the messenger. So people will go, well, that person gave me that. So why isn't it worked? God what's happened? So straight away, your eyes go up
Steve:should do and go. And you should start asking questions. What's going on? What's going on road?
Reverend Ben Cooper:What is all this about? Remember the
Steve:other week when I told you about those young girls that were baptized? Yeah, right. Yeah. And these this girl was being baptized because she said that God had called her to lead a bunch of warrior angels to help the animals. And the gays with the microphone said I wasn't that great. Isn't it? Wonderful, lovely. So now, this man colludes with the stupidity that this young girl has swallowed. Does not reprove her. And in that, not reproof. Hey, being in a position of authority is now fit for a millstone. Yeah, all right. Whoever told the girl in the first instance that she was got it. I mean, all right. Am I being someone who dropped out? Yeah, but if someone in one of these, you know card nonsense, yes. prophesied this over. Okay, that person's fit for a millstone? Yeah. All right. Now. We take on Mr. Johnson and the whole of his church. We look at their music. And if we sit down and listen to many of their verses, they say they pretty sound is nothing wrong with them. That's okay. Yeah. Good. And then suddenly something slips in slips in. Okay. Something slips in about an atmosphere. All right, yeah. Or
Reverend Ben Cooper:lots of different
Steve:ways different stupidity goes on. But whatever, something happens, we can do this, and we can do that and so on and so forth. The child of God, who is not mature eighths of that, yeah, drinks have it, and stumbles for no fault of their own is the Johnson and his church, who have peddled this stuff? Because it is it's peddling the word, Lord, okay, have now fitted themselves for another millstone, because they've caused a child of God to stand a stumble. All right. And we still pay them money through our licenses that goes into their pocket so that they can continue to lie, and cheat, and steal and blaspheme Jesus Christ. Yeah, we become collusion, we collude with them in the movement of their false gospel, we associate ourselves with that false gospel by putting money into your pocket. Now, yeah. I won't sing Bethel songs. I will not sing songs from Hillsong. And I will not sing songs from Elevation Church. And I won't sing songs from anybody who I know is poor lawyers, and bless famous because if I stand in the middle of the congregation, as a mature man of God, and sing an immature child of God looks at me and says, Oh, he's singing it. So it must be okay. So they sing it. I call that one the stumble and I am now fit for a millstone.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yes. So what is the way forward for a so when we were if we look at immaturity in Christianity, we can see this has come for many generations. Hard how do we get out how do we as a church within the UK, how do we deal with all this stuff that is coming our way and there's going to be so much more coming out what you do
Steve:first of all, is you do what Paul did. You call out the false teachers by night, right? He said to Peter, You who Troy you before this lock turned up. You were trying to live just like that, you know, I turned up your liberty Joe. When he sent you all, and not only did he say that, and it was recorded in Acts, but he said it and he recorded it himself later on. And so we call out these people. Yeah, unashamedly. So, yeah. The other thing we do is we cut out all the songs that I write. Otherwise we end up putting money into their pocket. Yeah, right? Yes, we've got to get rid of it. We've got to cut it out. We have to teach what they, we have to explain what they teach. Yeah, then we have to explain why it's a lie, then we have to point out the fact that this law here, which they preach, he's not just merely something that they've got wrong, is eternal. It's just not an aberration. This is actually satanic. Yes, yeah. This is doctrines of demons.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And then, obviously, we've added the grave. So can we've had all the gold coming out of certain areas as teeth come in? And if they come in, and all this, there's so much that it's been around for so many years. But now we're at a point where there has to be a time when the believer has got to go, I have got to ask God to show me the way. Because I can't partner. No, you cannot go any further
Steve:reasons it carries on. All right, one of the basic reasons it carries on is because Christians insist on walking by their feelings, right? Yeah. This song makes me feel good. So I'm gonna sing it. Now I'm gonna ask this question. God knows where that song came from. He knew who wrote it. And he knows what they believe. Do you think God is gonna listen to your worship, singing their songs? Just because you sing it in the name of Jesus? Because they're singing it in the name of Jesus? Yeah, there's one of the problems we've got and have had for a long, long time. Is worship is for me. Yeah, it makes me feel good. It brings me closer to God. Yes. All of which is a load of hogwash. All right, whilst worship is an of itself, righteous and holy, and in and of itself, does bring me closer to God in as much that it changes me. I exalt honors God and exalts God. And it doesn't lead. Worship is for it's to honor God, and exalt God, and glorify God. And at the end of the day, if I benefit through my exhortation of God, that's a blessing for me. But you don't come in to get the blessing. You come in, to worship God
Reverend Ben Cooper:to praise him, yes, to lift him to worship Him.
Steve:Now, I don't know if I've, I've told this story before I might have done. But it was a guy called Jamie Buckingham. And he was the one that authored the crossing the switchblade. Oh, and which was about Nicky Cruz. And he used to go around and he would teach at various to churches and stuff like that. And he went to this little church somewhere in the back of beyond in America somewhere. And he said, There was Ito guys up front. And, you know, they like sunlight, a crack chamber pot. He said, it's absolutely horrible. He said, I'm sitting there thinking myself. This does not glorify God, and then suddenly felt the Holy Spirit will really come down heavy upon him. And he got this sense of God saying this in him shut up. I'm listening to my children worship me, has not nothing to do with how you feel. Yeah. It's got nothing to do with how great the presentation is. It's got nothing to do with any of that. It's got everything to do with whether the worship is holy. Yes. And whether the worship is worthy of God,
Reverend Ben Cooper:and it's coming from your heart to God.
Steve:The heart is deceptive, above all things. This idea of the heart for many, many years. We have to be careful what's in our heart. Oh, yeah. Yeah, true. Many people have this. I've got a heart for God, which is no more than I've got fluffy feeling. Yeah,
Reverend Ben Cooper:no, no, no, no, I'm referring to a heart after God. Yes, a date. Date, a David heart, a heart that is for scripture for God, knowing that, that I've fallen knowing that I'm in repentance, knowing that my Redeemer lives a true heart after God. Yes. That's where worship comes from Donna. Yes. Because you're exalting him. Yes.
Steve:And so we have unfortunately, the wokeness in the church is, is enormous. I live by my feelings. Yeah, it really doesn't matter. matter whether or not this music has been written by some spoon of hell, it's got Jesus's name in it, therefore it must be alright.
Reverend Ben Cooper:But we're seeing feelings are across the world at the moment they, we can see that you're, you're told that you you've got to be in contact with yourself, you're
Steve:feeling closing the observation, we've seen this all over the world, for sure me in a church now, where other world has gotten almost going the opposite direction, turn around, and about turn, a complete turn around to what the world is doing do not conform to the pattern of the world. But we can't see a lot. It's like that when Christ drew the line in the sand. There's no line anymore is there, the line has gone. The world is very, very much so influenced in a mass percentage of what we call church. And that's why we that's why the church that's why we're in this mess. We could either look at it one of two ways, either because of the influence of the world on the church, the church is diminishing, or because the the fullness of the Gentiles is due to come in. Yeah. And therefore it is reducing the world will take over the spices that are left. Yes. All right. Now, where you are left here, must guard ourselves and God, the glorifying of God, we must know that persecution will come. But that's got nothing to do with it. If we're persecuted, so be it. That's God's will. And choice. We have to align ourselves with Scripture. And we must not be afraid to say this man is a liar. This woman is a liar. What like, what like speak, is corruption. And they are not of God. They can't be of God because of what they believe and what they're saying. Yeah, what they believe and what they say, is not found in Scripture. And they are the worst kind of teachers, because they say it is in Scripture when it's not there. And I make up their own scriptures as I go along. They're the same as the Pharisees who make precepts of men, the laws of God. And so we have to look at these people. We have to look at the kind we have to look at the TD Jakes of this world. Kenneth Copeland see, the Rick Warren's who's supposed to have retirement single come out of retirement very quickly. And all these various people, that when you look at what they believe, about Christ, about his death on the cross, about who he
Reverend Ben Cooper:is, that's fundamental, should not even be questioned. what the scripture says the Scripture says, That's it.
Steve:That's it. And so therefore, I've got no problem is saying Joyce Meyer is not a Christian, because he doesn't believe what the Bible says, Kenneth Copeland isn't a Christian because he doesn't believe what the Bible says. And so I've got to look at all these people. And in the light of what they preach on what they teach. I look at this here, this plumb line, you were you were a brick, you know, yeah, like bricks in Australia. Because if you don't the walls,
Reverend Ben Cooper:got for that polar line.
Steve:That's it. So if they don't teach what's in a word I may teach drastically contrary to what's going on with this, this isn't. This isn't about the timing of the Rapture. This isn't about whether or not the gifts have ceased. This isn't about this sort of stuff. This is about the fundamental cross. Yeah, this is about the cross of Jesus Christ, and who he is, what he has done, and what he will do. But
Reverend Ben Cooper:it's very simple teaching, isn't it? It's not complicated. The scripture says one sacrifice once and for all, everything was disarmed, finished, done, completely gone. So you can't under scripture says don't add and take away.
Steve:But one of the things that you will find with any cult, and he does and that's what they are, the cults is they will seek to bring Jesus down and elevate and elevate man. Yeah. All right. Yeah. There's, I was watching one one time between some discussion between Pauline white and bloke called it can hatch or something like that. And they were talking about being born again. Okay. And they came to the conclusion that because they were born again, they were the same as Jesus name born. That they were like him in their birth. Right? That they were now sons of God. In the fullness we are sons of God is Jesus is the Son of God. Well, no, that's not true. We are adopted into the room adopted adopted in we have to be born again. He didn't know how Alright, He humbled Himself whilst he calls us brethren. Yes that's because what he chooses to do for us that's right. So this idea this little going so this is another one we are knocking out little gods here and a lot that lady oh god so I mean, it was Morris who Allah used to push with little gods now we know we're not
Reverend Ben Cooper:satisfied great
Steve:if you think you're a good guy turn son off. Yeah. All right. If you think you're a God, God stop the world from spinning. Okay, if you think you're a god, oh, no, no, what we mean is we're in a god class. What does that mean? What's that about? What's a god class? What's it God God. I went when I went to school I arithmetic class and I English class and I history class and I geography class, but God, God class. Yeah, these people are corrupt.
Reverend Ben Cooper:It's very lawyers are dangerous.
Steve:And they are fit for millstones. Yeah. And what we have to make sure is that we are not fit for.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yes, now is the day. Because
Steve:with the fullness of the gentiles coming in, yeah. God turns from the Gentiles to the Jews, and takes the natural olive branch branches. And he drafts them back in we know when Paul talks in Romans 910 11, about the Jews and our God, God is not finished with the Jews by any stretch. And we're seeing an increase of Jewish believers very steadily, very steadily, very steadily. Next effect. Some of the best teachers out there at the moment. Fantastic. Messianic Jews, yes, because they know they are being grafted back in Yeah. So there comes a point where the fullness of there are no Gentiles to come in. There comes a point when all the Gentile the fullness of the Gentiles has come in when taken away. I don't know. God knows who the last one is before he shuts the door. I don't know.
Reverend Ben Cooper:But that's coming.
Steve:But that's coming. And so as the fullness of the Gentiles, yeah, we come to that fulfillment, and the church becomes completely apostate that is the Gentile church becomes completely apostate. Because it will some of the Masonic church become apostate they're not going to be free from it. We will see an increase in true Messianic believers. Now this How long will this go on for? I don't know. I don't know. But we have to understand that we have to guard our own hearts. And I'm Am I my brother's keeper? You better I am. I am you better I am. Yes. Yeah. And I've got to speak as best I can with the understanding and the wisdom that I've got
Reverend Ben Cooper:according to the line, the word of God.
Steve:Yeah, and if i'm wrong, in that God will reprove me. Yeah. No, no doubt about that.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Correct. To show us teachers
Steve:He will do that. Yeah, he will do that. And he's done that several times. And he doesn't do it with a great big error in the back of the head. No, no, no, no, far from it. There are a number of times I've been reading and suddenly, oh, crumbs always got that wrong. I'm sorry.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah. Gently, firmly, lovingly, through His Word. Everything is through the Word.
Steve:And again, I've tested that I'm sure I've spoken about John Wycliffe. For years, Wickliffe stood against the, the teachings of Rome. He was about 200 years before looser. Englishmen translated the book, the Bible into English, but he translated it from the Latin Vulgate. And so it was one of the first actually gave Western Christianity a Bible in their own language, which the church hated. Because, Hey, hon, you can't give it to him. We're the only ones that know Latin, and we
Reverend Ben Cooper:were controlling.
Steve:But he, as he read, the Bible realized so much was coming out of Rome that was corrupt and evil and wrong. And he would speak against it, speak against it, speak against it speak about gangster. When all over the years, he still religiously went to take mess. Yeah. And then one day, one day, the Lord showed him, the corruption of the mess. And he didn't do it anymore. But God had to don't hold that against him now did a might Wickliffe strong enough until he could receive the truth. Yeah. And then once Wickliffe had received the truth, he said, Lord, forgive me. And God said, Yes, I forgive you. Now go on and tell everybody else what I think about the mess.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah, he did. It's a journey. And you learn you learn through this and you're not teachers.
Steve:God didnt hold those against him is against witness because it wasn't until a particular time in his life. God revealed this to him. And witless you forgive me, I've sinned against you. God said, I forgive you. I forgive you. And his love covered a multitude of sins because Wickliffe sinned in ignorance. Until such time as God revealed it to us, that's the same as access. We have besetting sins, and we have to deal with it. But that's another story for another time. But the point being is if we know and all, everybody out there in the sound of my voice you now know about Joyce Meyer, you now know about Bill Johnson. You know what they believe? Stop singing songs, because you're approving what they say. Yeah. All right. You're proving what I sighs
Reverend Ben Cooper:show us, Lord, show us an open our hearts. Move upon us. Show us the correct teaching. Show us your word. Guide us?
Steve:Yes, we need as the only way you can do it. You've got to do it line by line price. Yeah. And you have to spell it out. Why is TD Jakes? Not a Christian? Well, because he doesn't believe in the Trinity. Okay, and they're a very solid thing. I saw him the other day on there. Telling Oprah Winfrey, Oprah Winfrey that God had chosen Good grief. You will know in some of the things that Oprah Winfrey says about God, but that's neither in and out. Why? Why is Kenneth Copeland corrupt? Because he does not believe in the cross. Why are all these people corrupt? Not because of you see, it's not because of the teaching or money. No, that isn't the problem. It's the belief. It's not let's not worry about money. Being interested, we can look along here and we can find that God blesses this. We can find this costume. Yeah. We'll come back to you after many days. It's the fundamental beliefs the fundamental teaching, especially about the cross of Christ. Yeah, the cross has to be right. And it's the cross has not right nothing falls nothing else is correct. All the rest of it is crumbs. You might like the idea of being rich and all the rest of it and healthy and wealthy and wise. But you ain't building on a rock? No,
Reverend Ben Cooper:no, no, no, no. Interesting stuff. Interesting stuff really good. Really good. Stop making a stink making us dig deep. So we thank you Steve, for that we know 47 minutes in May God bless you wherever you are continuation of the week the week before. There we go. Praise God. Thank you Steve for what you brought to the show. Take care, loads of stuff coming out there today. Stuff to meditate on to over on ever think about discuss with your friends. God bless you in the mighty name of Jesus Christ. Have a great day. in Jesus precious name, amen.
Close:Thank you for listening to Elim church Swanleys latest podcast. You can find us on Buzzsprout Spotify, Apple Music, I Heart Radio, Google, Alexa Mixcloud, Facebook, Instagram, and YouTube.